How the Phillies can fix Alec Bohm

00:00:05
Speaker 1: Hi, this is Paul Hamilt swapping to the Philly Show.

00:00:09
Speaker 2: Alec Boom on the bench. Don Manningley said, a little day for Alec Bohm. He also called it a reset. We could call it a mental break, clearing him the mind a benching Rubin Tomorrow Junior, Jim Salisbury toddsle like it's the Philly Show. It's Friday, May eighth, twenty twenty six. Hope everybody is doing just dandy on this Friday morning. Philly's lost on Thursday night they got smoked by the A's to close out that series. They won the first two. One thing that jumped out, of course, like I just said at the top, there is that Alec Bohm was not in the lineup Wednesday night. Jim Rubin, Don Mattingly pinch hit for Alec Bohm in the seventh inning, and my colleague at MLB dot Com went back and looked Paul Casella. It was the first time in Alec Bohm's career that he had been ben hit pinch hit for in a game excluding injuries or blowouts. And then of course Thursday he doesn't play. So do we think that this becus could help? Is one game enough would you have him back out there in the lineup on Friday night. What do you got, Jim Jim Well.

00:01:29
Speaker 3: I think the move was warranted, both the pinch hitting decision and the decision to sit him on Thursday night. The guy has not produced. You're there to win ball games. Put somebody in there who can produce. He's had a good, long run here and he's not digging himself out of this, so try other options. I actually talked about this the other day. We think we compared it to that Jimmy Rollins when he sat years ago in Toronto for an entire weekend. I would give him a few days off and play SOSA, let him clear his head. Like the firing of Rob Thompson was a shock to the clubhouses system, and I think ultimately manifested itself in sharper play by the players, who I would add that the players that got Rob Thompson fired. I don't think it was Rob Thompson's fault, but anyway, maybe this could be a shock to Alec Bohm's system. He's too good for this, too good for what we've been seeing, and something has to happen. So I think a benching, whatever you want to call. It is a managerial strategy, and I think it was well warranted. We'll see what happens over the weekend.

00:02:34
Speaker 1: Totally agree with you, Jim, on every single point you just made. And I would also point out that there have been some of the most talented and the most confident players in the game, including a guy like Jimmy Rollins who was sat for three days. And I think it was three days. I think Charlie Manuel said, you know what, sit here by the bench with me, will chat, let's talk baseball, Let's just enjoy watching our guys play, and uh and and and let's reset. Pat Burrell I think went through it a couple of times, even I think during the Larry Boa era. Perhaps I just feel like there are times when players need to go shit and relax and get the albatross off their back, particularly for Alec who has gone through some personal stuff as well. No idea what's going on in his heart and his head and his soul. Regarding some of the personal stuff that's going on which can affect anybody's play. You know, there's there's so many different things that that have happened over certain people's careers. Doc Halliday had to get sent down to a ball to get revamped after struggling at the major league level for you know, a year or so, whatever it was. There's all types of things that that that have happened over the course of careers. Mickey piac bouncing around all over the place. He's ready to play in the series against the Phillies, he was a number one pick, got traded and released, and traded and released, and I mean there's all types of stuff going on. I just feel like Alec Bohm needs a reset. I think it's at least two days and maybe three and then and then go from there.

00:04:23
Speaker 2: I agree with both of you guys. I mean, this is an historic struggle. This is an historic struggle. This isn't just a slump. Alec Bohm through the Phillies first thirty seven games. Last night was the thirty eighth, But through the team's first thirty seven games, I don't think these numbers have changed months much After one game. Alec Bohm has a four to thirty three OPS that's the fourth lowest in Phillies' history through thirty seven games. Now, the names above him are a little surprising, but then when you think about it, really surprising yeah, really surprising Chase. Chase Sutley actually has the lowest of four eighteen ops and twenty fifteen. Now, Chase Sutley was a shell of his former self by twenty fifteen. His knees had gotten a hold of him and kind of sapped his career by that point. Larry Boa for twenty nine ops in nineteen seventy, that was his rookie season. Granny Hamner four thirty ops in nineteen fifty six. Granny Hamner, Great Philly. Not a great career wise offensive player. But there you have Alec Bohm who is in the prime, should be in the prime of his career, entering his free agent year, you know, with all the personal stuff going on, and it's just not happening. And Jim you mentioned the Jimmy Ruben. You mentioned Jimmy Rollins, But Jim you mentioned it on the show the other day, and so I, Jim, I didn't credit you in the moment, but I did use that example to Don Maddingly. He said, yeah, I'm just giving him a little day. I said, well, you know, many years ago, Jimmy Rounds was in a really brutal slump and he got benched like three consecutive days. Is that is that something that you would consider doing? And he said, yeah, if I thought it was going to help him, we would. So I said, well could it would it? And he said anything's a possibility, right, But today we just wanted to get him, get him a reset day. So I don't know, we'll see. Maybe maybe he just says, you know, one day's plenty. Don did tell Alec today, I guess, or maybe it was last night before he left the ballpark, he said to him, listen, don't come on the field before the game. Try not to do any hitting, try not to do any infield work. Just just just chill out. Just chill out. And it was noticeable, it was noticeable yesterday before before we knew that. I was like, we had gotten the lineup and he was not on the field. And I've never not seen Alec Bohm on the field taken in field and batting practice with with the fellas. But here's another quote for Don Manningly. If you're watching us on YouTube, you can read the whole thing, but I just wanted to point out one little part on this. This is Don Manningly expressing his faith and Alec Bohm. He said, I believe that until the day I'm not on this earth, that he's going to hit. We're going to need him to be himself. He's going to get a lot of big hits for us. You guys are going to forget what happened in May when he's hitting down the stretch and driving in runs.

00:07:31
Speaker 3: So you know, I remember well when Jimmy sat those three days in Toronto, and you talk about getting away from it clear in your mind. You know, I remember talking to Jimmy after it happened because he got going and he said he sat in the batting cage for three days and ate garlic fries. You can look it up. I mean, just but that's kind of emblematic of just kind of clearing your mind. I think that's an important element in this. But I also think there's an important get tough element and the and the messages this ain't good enough, you're too good for this. So I think it's a good move, and it's if it extends through the weekend. I am absolutely fine with it.

00:08:17
Speaker 1: Same here, and uh, you know we've beaten it down now.

00:08:20
Speaker 2: But you know, again, you.

00:08:22
Speaker 1: Think another example, Brandon marsh goes down basically in a rehab last year was oh for April, Oh for April. Since then, he's been one of the best players in baseball. Imagine that. I mean, that's a that's another example of somebody just sort of needing a reset and and a sort of a paradigm shift in your praying and your and your heart and your head. Baseball is very heavy game, man, and uh and hopefully he can get back to where he needs to be because he's one of the better hitters in the game. And I mean as far as just using field and making contact, I mean, this guy, this guy's got skill set that's pretty damned advanced.

00:09:04
Speaker 2: We're going to talk in a bit about some of the internal options that the and maybe external options if if for some reason, this thing does not get turned around. But first Ruben wants to tell us what's happening at Parks Casino.

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00:10:46
Speaker 2: All right, we're back. Don't forget. We are inching up on YouTube subscriptions. If you're watching this on YouTube, please support the show. Oh we appreciate the support. And you can always always as well. You can go to the Philly Showshop dot com up your Phillies shown swag. It's very cool.

00:11:05
Speaker 3: I can't believe Ambrosi is still around. I remember I was.

00:11:11
Speaker 1: Baby.

00:11:20
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00:11:23
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00:11:32
Speaker 3: O'donald Michael McDonald.

00:11:33
Speaker 1: Come on, he wrote almost every one of those.

00:11:37
Speaker 2: Pregame at the ballpark Citizens Bank Park. The DJ there has a like a Michael McDonald yacht rock remix that I might have to go over and ask him for that. Very good, it's very good. All right, So let's let's get back to Alec Bohm. One more, one more conversation on Alec Bohm, because this is a big deal. I mean, he did open this. I mean for so many reasons. They're trying to win a world series. He opened the season as a cleanup pitter. The end of the season without a cleanup hitter, it's been a big problem. So if Alec Bohm comes back, obviously great for the Phillies. If not, if he continues to struggle, you know, there's not a lot of options, guys. You know, I was thinking about some of the options internally. Of course you have ed Mundos so but I and you guys can tell me if I'm wrong or disagree with me. Of course, he doesn't seem to be a full time solution for me. Ed Mundo Sos has always been best in those short spurts. Is is kind of a super utility guy. You look at Triple A right now. The third baseman who's taking down the most innings with the Iron Pigs is Carter Kaboom, former top prospect for the Nationals. He's batting three seventeen, two homers, ten RBIs eight twenty four ops with the Pigs, but in his big league career he's hit two hundred and five to ninety seven ops and five hundred and sixteen career played appearances. Otto Kemp has played a lot of third base in his minor league career of course, he struggled mightily with the Phillies, got sent down last month. He's beat in two sixty seven two homers, fifteen RBIs and an eight sixteen ops. And I did want to mention this because in an ideal world, Aiden Miller would be healthy and playing out a lot of shortstop and third base for the Iron Pigs. But a couple of weeks ago he had started to take ground balls and was doing rotational exercises gearing up towards swinging a bat again. Well, he is no longer taking ground balls, he's no longer doing any baseball activities. You might call that a setback. I might call that a setback.

00:13:42
Speaker 3: I would call it a serious back issue.

00:13:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is a serious, serious back issue. Others will say that just a very very conservative approach to his back. We don't want to mess this kid up. He's our future, so we're just taking things extra extra slowly. But and that's great if that's what they it is, that's great. But like I said, in another world, he's hitting three hundred and triple A right now, and you're going, well, maybe you're pushing He's yeah, yeah, go ahead.

00:14:18
Speaker 1: So so backs are really tricky and there. It's something that you I mean, it could be a long term issue. And I'm not going to set too many alarm fires, uh fire alarms off right now, but the reality of it is, if it is in fact a serious back issue, whether it's disc spinal, whatever the case may be, it can be a bit of a long term thing. I'm sure that they're doing. I have a lot of faith in the medical people with the Phillies organizations, one of their best assets as an organization. But i mean, listen, whether they're being conservative, whether it's a real issue or a combination of both, it's it's a problem because it gets getting on the field and not playing and not developing, and that is a problem. You obviously care about the kid. You hope that his health is long term he's fine, but it does cause an issue for the Phillies and and it creates a level of lack of depth where they thought they had some.

00:15:18
Speaker 3: Yeah, so there's an important variable here. His defense. You know, you mentioned he's not a strong defender. Staff who likes to get some ground balls. It's it's a team that's built on pitching. I think the defense is very important when you talk about alternatives. So in the short term. To me, it's gotta be gott to be so so rub When you guys were when you were running the Phillies, would you ever have a conversation about how do you remedy this? And wouldever come up that maybe he goes on the I L with you know, wrisked rosteritis and take a break and then you rehab them in triple A and then you try to start fresh on June twentieth. I don't know.

00:16:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, this in this day and age, I mean, you can utilize a whole bunch of people, you know, processes as far as the I L is concerned, and one of them can be your mental state of mind, right, your mental and your I mean an emotional state of mind. I mean there's other people who have had these sort of issues. And listen to Guy's going through a tough time with his parents. I mean, there's no it's been documented. It's a public issue, and that can wear on you to the point where you emotionally cannot perform at your job. And so that's a possibility. I think it would be kicked around. I don't know if it's to that point. I'm not in those conversations I don't know these all the ins and outs of what's what's going on, but there is a little bit of leeway with regard to that because I think people are much more conscious of the fact that, you know, emotions do play on your overall health. So is that a possible ability. Yes, I don't know if they're at that point, but I think that at the very least, giving him the reset, you know, chilling out for a few days and then see how he bounces back as a is a good start.

00:17:13
Speaker 3: And short of all that, I mean, I think Dave Dombrowski's and Tenna has to be up for infield help, either a second basement or a third baseman. You can move Stott over the third if you had to, if the second came along, But I think that's still down the road a little bit. You know, this is a test of alex Alec Bohm's mental toughness. Can he can he dig himself out of this? And I'm still in that stage where after a little break, I think he gets that opportunity for a little bit longer.

00:17:50
Speaker 2: Todd, Yeah, I was wondering if you know, if they could option him, you know, if if you I should say this if they approached him at some point this continue to drag on. Would they approach him about an option? Now? This is not he's he's got five years of service time, so he has the right to say I'm not going to the minor leagues, if you know. So, that would be an interesting conversation if it got to that point. Now, the way I would frame it if I was the Philadelphia Phillies and you know, says two weeks from now, three weeks from now, You're like, we got to say, would you would you go down to Triple A for a few weeks? And he said, if he would say no, I would try to frame it as this, you're not helping the team, and you're not helping yourself, and you need to think about yourself if you don't want to think about the team right now. And I'm not saying he would say this, I'm just hypothetically, of course, you got to think about yourself. You're a free agent after this season, and every day that this goes on a little bit longer, you're costing yourself maybe a multi year contract. You're costing yourself an extra one hundred thousand dollars every single day that this thing drags on. So go down there. Look, look what your buddy, your your best friend, and the team. Brandon Marsh did rubin. You mentioned him earlier. Look what he did last season. He was on the injured list, of course, but look what Look look look at how that turned him around a little bit and saved his season. You could save yourself, you could save the team. You'll come back, You'll be great. Don manningly said it. You know everybody's gonna forget about this. You're gonna be hitting the balls into the gap in September winning as games and this is going to be an awesome ending for you. So just go out and do it.

00:19:28
Speaker 1: So I think this is this is absolutely something that that I would have in this situation, have a discussion with the player and bring in the agent, bring in, you know, even a family member, maybe even bring in Brandon Marsh into the conversation in some way, shape or form, depending on my relationship with those players at the time. And yeah, I think it's a very valid one. I think it's something that, you know, makes a lot of sense. I don't know that it will be something that happens, and I'm not sure if they're at that point yet, but it's certainly something to consider and as a GM, if I were a GM, that's something that I would consider.

00:20:11
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00:21:41
Speaker 2: Andrew Painter on Thursday night against the day's twelve one loss. It was ugly at least it got over quickly. Three and two thirds innings, seven hits, eight runs, eight earned runs, three walks, two strikeouts, three home runs, all three home runs in the first two two innings, all three home runs regardless, two strike fastballs. And Andrew Painter is Now, let's see, I have his numbers here somewhere, Andrew Painters. Yeah, he's one in four with a six point eight nine ERA and seven appearances, six starts, seven starts for all intents and purposes. He came into that one game after the couple innings because of the migraine. But you see some of his numbers there and this is the things that really jumped out at us, and we talked. We talked with Don manningly about this on Thursday night. We talked to Andrew Painter of course about it on Thursday night. His fastball. He's not getting any swing and miss on his fastball, and they're really and teams are really hitting his fastball good three forty eight that was entering last night, it's now jumped up the three fifty eight. Opponents banning three fifty eight off of Andrew Painter's two seam and four seam fastball. And he is getting a whiff rate of nine point four percent that swings and misses guys on all swings on those pitch. And that is one hundred and eighteen th out of one hundred and twenty four pitchers that have had gotten at least one hundred swings during the season. So he's got a good he's got a This is not, you know, ninety two miles an hour fastball. This is a fastball that can touch ninety eight. It averages a little bit over ninety six, and so just something to kind of, you know, and and Andrew talked about this after the game. I don't know if you guys saw what Andrew said. He said that, yeah, because I asked him, you know, you surprised your fastball is getting hit hard, and he basically said, well, you know, looking back on it, I feel like they had a pretty good plan. If if it was hard, if it was inside, it was hard, and they knew it was a fastball, And if it was a way, they knew it was something soft. So that says, like, you know, I'm getting a little be a little bit too predictable. But he also talked about the shape of his his fastballs too. He thought that it's been getting better, but there hasn't been a lot of movement as you would expect in his four seam and two seemed fastballs. So he's had some things to work on and he's got some things to do. You know. Cole Hamil's had a rough stretch at the beginning of his career. Andrew Painter's going through it. But I love his attitude. I love how he talks about and frames it after the game. He seems to be handling about it as well as any as any rookie could handle it.

00:24:18
Speaker 3: Well, there's two guys on your staff who are having their fastball get hit hard. Know those fastball has been hit hard, and I know it's a different kind of fastball. This kid's more power. It's a head scratcher. It's a growing pain. I was not at the game on Thursday night, but I watched it. There are times from that center field angle where it doesn't look like he generates a just times it doesn't generate a great push off the rubber. I wonder if there's something there that they can maybe address to try to improve his extension to get it on hitters quicker, because it seems like they're getting a good look at it. So maybe I mean Caleb Cotham's we've had him on the podcast. He's a very very smart guy and they dig into this stuff scientifically and it's way above my pay grade. But I just wonder if there's a little more pushed there, a little more extension there that would help it get on top of hitters quicker, because I think it was Rooker. I mean, he cleared out that inside fastball like it was on a tee and hit it ten like and hit a ten rows up and that was a pretty firm fastball. So you know, you look at this kid six foot seven, Zach Wheeler's like six five four, Zach's got better extension. I wonder if there's a tweak there. I guess you'd call that a mechanical tweak that might be able to get it on the hitter quicker. And that's all I got.

00:25:51
Speaker 1: I think that's great stuff, Jim, And you probably should have been a scalp for me because you I think you picked up on a lot of things in this in this area because he's not driving the ball down, he's not creating the angle that you would think a six foot seven pitcher would create, and he's not creating the life on the fastball in the in the strike zone. You know, I talk a lot about I don't know if I've talked about it on this podcast, but I talk about the lightness of a fastball compared to the heaviness of a fastball, and there's a difference. You can throw one hundred miles an hour, but if it's a light fastball. In other words, I guess it has to do with spin rate. But you can feel it off the bat like it's it has action to it, like it hurts your barrel, or if you just mishit it it hurts because it's heavy. If it's light, then I mean there's not a lot of life to it, not a lot of finish to his pitches right now, and it looks like they're, you know, beating them to the spot and the ball's coming off the bat like really hard. So you talked about the Rooker fastball.

00:26:53
Speaker 3: That pitch was about two.

00:26:54
Speaker 1: Balls inside and he got to it very, very easily, and it was ninety seven miles an hour. There's a ton of stuff to unpack. He did say that it's fastball command that's a problem, which is true. It is also extension and life in the zone with his fastball as well. So there's some mechanical issues that need to be worked out to try to create a little bit more deception, because that's what it's all about, creating deception. The thing that I really loved about his postgame interview is that he was very open and honest about it. And I like to read faces. I love this guy's face. He was pissed off yesterday, but he was not succumbing. It was not like he was scared. He just is upset and not happy about his performance. And he's the kind of kid that I think handles things really well, and that's a plus because it's very easy to get into your head and to put yourself in a position where you're just not able to come back from it. And I don't think this kid is there at all. I love this makeup up, I love the way he's handling this. And listen, everybody has to go through these struggles. This is the major leagues, and these are major league hitters. And even though he's highly touted, he's still a young player learning how to make the adjustments that are necessary to be a performer at the major league level. So hats off to the kid because he's handling things well. I hope he gets it, gets it going again so that they don't have to send him out and get rebamped, because at some point, if this continues, they may very well have to do that.

00:28:32
Speaker 2: Well. Don Manningly gave him the option after the third inning. Middle of the third inning, he Don Manningly said, he went up to Andrew Painter said, hey, listen, man, it's kind of been kind of a rough one. If you want to cash out here was fine, we'll go to the bullpen. And Andrews said, no, I want to I want to finish. I want to keep going if I can, I would like to keep going. And he's said afterward, he told Don Manningly that because he feels like he needs to learn from these things and he thinks that it'll help him grow down the road. So Don Don Manningly was asked afterward, how much do you think this is gonna are what positives do you take out of it? And he said, well, I think the positive is how he responded to this. He wanted to do so. I mean, this is not a guy's.

00:29:17
Speaker 3: Like, yeah, maybe I should.

00:29:19
Speaker 2: I'm not really feeling it today. I'm not really today.

00:29:23
Speaker 3: I can hear Bob McClure in my head and Rubin, we have a lot of respect for Bob mccluy. Very practical man, pitched twenty years in the big leagues, great experience, great feel for the psyche of players and the psyche of people. Really smart man. And he always would say, you know that top one percent, there's no breaking period. But you know, the Mike Trouts of the world, they're often running at the get go. But the majority, vast majority major League Baseball players, it takes a little break in time. It takes a little time to believe you belong and believe you can. You can do it. So I look at a lot of this as a growing pain. The raw ingredients are exceptional.

00:30:08
Speaker 2: I agree, well, well, said Philly Show guys. Well, Phillies, real quick open up a three game series this on Friday Night against the Rockies. Friday Night six forty Chase Dollander versus Jesu Sozardo. Saturday Kyle Freeland against Aaron Nola. Sunday one thirty five Mother's Day. Don't forget It's Mother's Day. To Sugano against Christopher Sanchez. The Philly Show will be back next week.

00:30:37
Speaker 3: Smell your Lata bars, Smell you Jimmy.

00:30:40
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