Best of the Bus: Connor Stalions Reveals Art Of Sign Stealing + Details In The Michigan Manifesto

00:00:00
Speaker 1: All right, we rolling okay, Yeah, yeah, he gets a drill, he knows the drill. Get it close to the mouth, don't be scared. Yeah, uh a little bit.

00:00:09
Speaker 2: We were talking Connor stillience, let's give a round plus Conor science on the bus. Michigan man. We were talking before about a little little football, a little everything. But let me give you my thought of who you are. Okay, and we can we can go from there because I want to get in your Michigan fandom to start. Every major program has a top five percent of fans that are true psychos when it comes to their program. Ohio State has it, Michigan has it, Alabama, Georgia, all these Nebraska all of them have these crazy, these crazy fans that live and die with their program. You are one of the five percent that actually made a difference in their program besides cheering on Saturdays. Is that Is that a fair way to put you?

00:00:57
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess you take a lot of pride in that.

00:01:01
Speaker 3: I guess would I just love Michigan?

00:01:04
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, absolutely.

00:01:05
Speaker 2: And that wasn't me saying crazy as like a shah or anything like that. It's just like all these big programs have these guys that like love, love Michigan, love Nebraska, like love all those things, and every one of those fans think to themselves, how can I help the school become better?

00:01:22
Speaker 1: Right?

00:01:23
Speaker 2: And you literally had the traits and the abilities with your military background and your ability to break down all of these things that you watch in your documentary that you truly were able to help a team. Yeah, you gotta feel amazing.

00:01:36
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't remember exactly what game it was, but I remember the first time walking into the Big House through section fourteen a season tickets row row eighty three, see twenty six and twenty seven, walking in probably three four years old, just kind of told myself like yeah, I'll I'll be down there one day, no way, and just kind of figured out with that and stay mine.

00:02:01
Speaker 1: I'm so excited that you're on because again, like I, we got to play, We got to play at our schools, and there comes a time for everybody where that you have to retire, whether it's in middle school, high school, college, NFL, whoever. If you get to play a long time, that's awesome. But you understanding and figuring out like okay, I wasn't able to make it at this D one level how can I carve out my own path a different route, And I feel like you're somebody who's been able to accomplish that.

00:02:28
Speaker 3: Yep.

00:02:29
Speaker 1: Is that fair to say?

00:02:30
Speaker 3: Yeah? I mean that's why you know, everyone goes to the nail, Okay, I mean to serve their country. But everyone, you know, everyone has a different reason. And I just kind of well, every major successful head coach, legendary head coach you're talking like Bud Wilkinson in Oklahoma, Osbourne, John Wooden, Greg Popovich, Coach k Woody, Hayes, bo Schen Beckler all had one thing in counting served in the military four to five years at least, So okay, they got to be onto something right, right. So and this is going through your brain, Well, well yeah, this is early high school. I mean I always knew I wanted to coach at Michigan, and then when it came time to you know, okay, what exactly is the route? You know, I applied to me. I applied to two schools, Michigan and the Naval Academy, got accepted the Michigan, got waitlisted at the Naval Academy. So in my mind, like okay, whatever, going to Michigan and then got the call, and it was actually about two weeks before last day of school senior year. I get a call Annapolis, Maryland. Ope, I mean, I'm in the middle of class. Well I better answer this one. So I answer it and said, whoever it is the missions in the Naval Academy, do you have a minute. I'm in the middle of class. So I'm like, uh, let me call you back. So I call him back and so, oh, you've been accepted. So they actually they said, but we need a response right now because we've got to let the people behind you know. So in my mind I just went back to all those coaches and I'm like, well, I guess I gotta do it. And so I said, all right, yep, I'm in. And then I called my parents and they work at the They teach at the middle school right down the road. So they, oh, come over, let's talk about it. So I get there and they're like, so what are you thinking. I'm like, oh, I already told them yeah, no true. And then just went from there.

00:04:36
Speaker 1: And you when did you decide you wanted to be like a head coach was like, you're.

00:04:41
Speaker 3: You're three years old.

00:04:44
Speaker 1: You didn't even care to play you're like I want.

00:04:45
Speaker 3: To be you know, Yeah I played. I played, but like I always so senior year, my dad's the eighth grade it was the eighth grade football coach. Uh his record against our rivals was like twenty one zero to one his career and uh yeah yeah, so I mean I'm still waiting for them to build a statue at scripts middle school. But so my senior year, I didn't play. I just played. I always played basketball. And then I helped coach eighth grade football with him kind of like as de facto defensive coordinator. Yeah, and you know, just kind of went from there and that was my first actual experience like truly coaching, and then student coach at the Naval Academy. Yeah, what was the action?

00:05:36
Speaker 1: Sorry, so go ahead.

00:05:36
Speaker 2: I was just to say. And then the documentary you kind of you said you go into the coach's office and you're like, hey, I want to do this, and like all right, cool, go down, you're you're in. Was it that simple as far as being having a student coach?

00:05:46
Speaker 3: So I got my foot in the door doing uh just video you know, like the you know, film and practice and all that games. And so that was freshman year and then spring going into sophomore year, I mean, I was always at the football facilities, and the director of Football Apps just asked, you know, hey, you're here all the time. You want to you want to come upstairs and help out. So for about a week or two I was helping out with operations. And then I mean, I was like eighteenth at the time, didn't know any better. I just walked right into the head coach's office. So, hey, coach Niam He hey Connor. I didn't even know he knew my name. Yeah, and he's awesome, one of the best people I've ever met. And I go, hey, coach, could I a student coach? And he think he stands up, he thinks about it, and he goes up follow me, brings me right into Coach Shasper, the offensive coordinator's office, and said, hey, coach, here's your new student coach. Oh.

00:06:48
Speaker 1: Thanks, that's it, and then just ran with it from the.

00:06:52
Speaker 3: Random any responsibility I had just treated it in my mind like I'm the head coach of Michigan right. Like it's like a psychology, you know, psychological thing where you know, you know, it's vision, like you when you visualize, you are what you're trying to be. Then you convince your brain that you are right, and then all your habits are like that. So everything I did, I mean, the first thing I did at Michigan, you know, kind of skipping ahead here, but the first thing, the first assignment I had at Michigan was doing a wind report special teams. Every stadium, you know, every stadium we play in, we need a wind report. Yeah, I say, okay, do you have like a templative one. It's yeah, I don't know, I don't know where we would. I've seen one before, but you know, just kind of, you know, start it and then I'll kind of redirect you if it's, you know, not what we're thinking. So all right, So I just became like a weatherman for a month. You're thinking of five days, probably about five days. And I give him this like eighteen page packet and it had like every kickoff, where it landed, and what the wind was that day, and every stadium and they played in that year, and I think they were like, what the heck is this?

00:08:05
Speaker 2: Like what have we got here?

00:08:07
Speaker 1: He's like, I'm gonna be the best goddamn weather man they've ever seen it, ever say, And.

00:08:10
Speaker 3: Then it was the next task, whatever it was. You know, just I'm going to be the best at whatever it is.

00:08:15
Speaker 2: There's the epitome of giving one hundred and at all times.

00:08:19
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely. When when did it start to like you're at the Naval Academy. When did you start to like, how did you create your first opportunity outside of the Naval Academy.

00:08:30
Speaker 3: So sophomore year, spring break, I go to I go back home to Michigan and Coach Arba just got the job and they're doing this coaches clinic and Coach Parchers at the time was the recruiting coordinator, so he ran the clinic and I went with some of my high school coaches and my dad. I think, like Mike Martz or someone big was speaking, so all eyes are on him.

00:08:58
Speaker 1: And Mike Mike Martin, he's like the he was like a head coach for the Rams.

00:09:04
Speaker 3: Yeah, so he was speaking, all eyes are on him. But I'm just trying to get my foot in the door. So I go down and talk to Coach Partridge and basically it was like, you know, hey, I'm here for a week. This was like Friday night or Saturday morning, like spring break just started, right, So you get the next nine days or whatever. And so I go and introduce myself and tell him, Hey, I'm here on spring break. I'm here for the week. I'd love to help out, you know, told him my name dropped a couple of people that I knew. He knew at Navies as a student coach with them, and you know, he probably thought, one, why the heck are you and ann Arbor on spring break? Yeah, and then too, you know, Military Naval Academy student coaching. Okay, we'll find something for you to do. And yeah, I just ran with it from there. And I think the wind report was that off season that was like the first in my mind, big project I had or whatever. And is there was there?

00:09:54
Speaker 1: Something? Was there? Something too? Leaving after your sophomore year, you know what I mean, because you're obviously taking a you're taking a chance going and diving into this next opportunity with Michigan.

00:10:03
Speaker 3: Well, I was doing both. So I was. I was a student at Navy. I did my four years at the Naval CAPA, and then my fifth year I was a temporary assigned duty. It's like a grad assistant with the football team because I don't have a post grad school, right so I student coach. So I wasn't at every single Michigan game. Yeah, during my four years at Navy, because I was at every Navy game. Okay, we had a bye week or spring break or in the summer and I had time to go home or whatever. That's when I would help out. And then when I got so I graduated in seventeen, go to you know, so now I'm a Marine Corps officer, do maybe five or six months as like a GA with the Navy football team, and then I go do my Marine Corps training and thing gas station in California. At that point when I'm no longer with Navy football, that's when I was then flying back and forth helping out Michigan. And then I was at pretty much every game. So that started in like twenty eighteen, and.

00:11:02
Speaker 2: You were helping the coaching staff. Yeah during that time as well.

00:11:05
Speaker 3: So it started when I was at Camp La June in North Carolina for a few months training and then stationed in California. So you know, they kind of touched down in the documentary. I would when I was in California, I would live, well, I started, I started sleeping on my couch and I rented out all the rooms in my house to make money and you know, save money to fly back and forth and all that. And and then I realized, well, I lived like fifty five minutes north of Camp Pendleton, So why am I driving back and forth just to sleep on my couch. I'm just going to sleep in my car. So I slept at the I five South rest stop right outside Camp Pendleton every day for like two years.

00:11:56
Speaker 1: No shit, yep, every day to.

00:11:59
Speaker 3: Save two hours, like an hour driving north, an hour driving south.

00:12:02
Speaker 1: That's gas, that's everything.

00:12:04
Speaker 3: You're saving money, you're saving time. So that's two more hours of watching film.

00:12:10
Speaker 1: Dude, I love it. It's like, yeah, it makes sense. But at the same time, very very few people are willing to sacrifice, right, And it's also.

00:12:18
Speaker 2: Like people like, oh, he was a such a big fan of Michigan, like anybody who like wants to be successful, Like, these are the kind of sacrifices you should make in the beginning of the game, Yeah, to get these things going. Yeah, so you're flying, you're flying back and forth.

00:12:29
Speaker 3: I'm flying back and forth. So yeah, say I get back from ann Arbor wherever we're playing, and so yeah, Sunday night, get back Lax, drive down, pick up my laundry which I put in over the weekend, and then drive down, stay at the rest up, wake up, you know, five am, whatever, workout on base, work, work ends, I'm watching film, go to the rest, stop sleep, do the same thing for you know, four day and then Friday after work, drive up to my house in Orange County, do my laundry, drive up to Lax. Fly to take the Red Eyes was always so twenty twenty, twenty nineteen, and twenty twenty one because COVID, you know, I couldn't go to games. So twenty nineteen and twenty twenty one, every single game was off, no sleep, no shit, yeap took the Red Eye land wherever we are. It's like sometimes, you know, we'd be playing like Illinois, so I'd have to fly into Indianapolis, rent a car, drive over to Illinois, drive back, and then I would hit the Kansas City Chiefs game on my way back to my boy. Frank was his first Chiefs and so Frank Clark, Yeah, so my So at twenty nineteen, we lost Alabama and the Citrus Bowl, and the season ends and I'm already kind of going to Chiefs games whenever it's convenient. I'm on my flight back, and so Michigan football is done now for the season, and so I'm thinking, like, well, what do I do with myself right outside the Marine Corps? What do I do? So I just started breaking down film for Frank and interesting, Yeah.

00:14:14
Speaker 2: Twenty nineteen, you got the right before two teams that played in the AC Championship that there.

00:14:22
Speaker 3: Were two teams that played in the FC Championship that year.

00:14:25
Speaker 2: And Frank, first off, that's we're doing good so far.

00:14:31
Speaker 1: He texted me, He's like, have this clip ready because I got a fun story with Taylor for this.

00:14:35
Speaker 2: That's the fun story that who You're like, Yeah, You're like, Frank Clark, hold on, Bill back, let's break this. We're gonna if we're gonna do this, let's break.

00:14:44
Speaker 1: That now one up, time out? Can he say?

00:14:46
Speaker 3: What his? You got this? You got okay?

00:14:48
Speaker 2: I want to point out that Frank told me at the b of game I'm gonna get a sack on you. Right now, it's the fourth quarter of a minute twenty, we're down by eleven. He has not had a sack. I don't think he's even had a pressure. So maybe scouting port wasn't that great. But we'll get into this anyway. Hate with the half spin. We see it, We handle it. Now, I want you to pause it. No, no, keep going now, okay, that is nine yards from the line of scrimmage. We gotta step up. We gotta step up. We gotta step up, right right, boys, you gotta step up in the pocket. Now Chris Jones can't step up, So go ahead.

00:15:28
Speaker 1: What was your scotter? So I'm breaking down film. I want to hear the.

00:15:31
Speaker 3: Breaking and it was not as detailed for on you as it was the next game in the Super Bowl, But like for example here here is it was very you know, I only I took one day, right, I'm still a Marine corps.

00:15:49
Speaker 2: Is that skinny important on the Titans?

00:15:52
Speaker 3: Or is that that one's on the Titans? The next one slide right? That is the Super Bowl? That was way more detailed, And that was like that was really dialed for that one. I just watched filing. You know, I got the what's the NFL game pass? Right?

00:16:08
Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, the premium twenty two?

00:16:10
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, this is your this is your work I do for Frank. Yeah. So so and that's how I met Frank's agent.

00:16:19
Speaker 1: When Tannehill kills her audibles, if he's under center, thirteen runs to one pass, he's if he's in gun kills or audibles seven pass to one run.

00:16:29
Speaker 3: Yeah, Connor.

00:16:32
Speaker 2: The screen. Yeah, text that to me, Connor, that is wild. So you you're doing this.

00:16:40
Speaker 3: The super Bowl one? So so like I I didn't get into details on your hand placement or foot placement or anything like that, but for the Super Bowl I did. And so I'm up in the nosebleeds at the Super Bowl and I every single play and calling run past to myself out, they're about the wrong, They're about the past, and you're you're from section you know, fifty two or whatever it was. Yeah, and you were.

00:17:06
Speaker 1: Right.

00:17:07
Speaker 3: Oh in the Super Bowl every play, Yeah, you could, you could tell off the off their hand place. I mean, did you did you see?

00:17:13
Speaker 1: Yeah?

00:17:13
Speaker 3: Let me let me uh look at this one. Who they played in that Super Bowl San France, Sam So it was uh Joe Staley and Michael Glinchy And like you can zoom in on that one. It was one hundred percent get tells. It was one hundred percent tells.

00:17:33
Speaker 2: Foot out ninety pass foot in a hundred percent run Michael Glinchy three point stance fourteen and sixteen run foot in, five out of five on foot out one all right, pass fifty percent past three point stance. It's dude, this is terrifying.

00:17:54
Speaker 1: It's amazing.

00:17:55
Speaker 2: This is hand together, two out of three pass No way. What was he pull up? Frank Frank Clark's stat line.

00:18:03
Speaker 3: So let me let me say this before. I mean, I already know this. The only person in the history of football to have the game winning or game ceiling sack in every single playoff game from Divisional round to Super Bowl is Frank Clark.

00:18:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is the coverage sack.

00:18:24
Speaker 3: I mean he's got the clutch gene.

00:18:27
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean he got paid.

00:18:29
Speaker 3: He's a he's a he's a dude.

00:18:33
Speaker 1: Joe Staley. When he's in a three point stance, five out of six were run. If his hands are apart, fifteen out of sixteen were a run hands together, it was passed. I mean that's yeah, because a details where everybody kind of finds our edge within the game. Obviously, if you're a genetic specimen to go with it, it makes it that much more difficult.

00:18:50
Speaker 2: Dob Okay, So twenty nineteen. Where is the Michigan Manifesto at this point?

00:18:54
Speaker 1: Okay, is it alive?

00:18:55
Speaker 3: Yeah?

00:18:56
Speaker 1: He so take me. Even last year when when everything was happening, I was like, hey, there's a manifesto like matter.

00:19:05
Speaker 2: I'm sure he knows exactly who talks about him the entire He's got a manifesto on people that yes.

00:19:14
Speaker 3: Uh no, I know exactly how that how that leaked. I know exactly who leaked it. I'm not I'm not gonna say who. But when I when I saw and here's here's how I know. Because the article said something about six hundred page Michigan Manifesto. Six hundred pages that was in like twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen.

00:19:32
Speaker 1: How big is be?

00:19:33
Speaker 3: Thousands by?

00:19:34
Speaker 2: Now? Do you have it in like a hard hard copy?

00:19:38
Speaker 3: So that's that's the thing, like an old Testament book. So I have the I have the original like how it started. So this this is what happened. So okay, go to the Naval Academy and you know I always go back to those legendary head coaches, right, they all have that that one thing in common military. Right, So my freshman year, I'm like, wow, you know this is I'm going to learn a lot, a lot, and I need to have a place to organize everything I learned. I can't let one little thing slip by. And you know a lot of people when they take notes, they take notes whatever, and then it just they just stack notes, and how do you know where to reference? You know, Oh, I remember that one thing I read in that book? What what was that book?

00:20:28
Speaker 1: It was about?

00:20:29
Speaker 3: Uh? You know, it was about hiring and firing personnel? What book was it? And then you go through all your notes and it takes you, you know, two weeks before you find the quote or whatever it was that that you're trying to think of, Right, So I used the military, the way that the military organizes everything as like my foundation for how I'm going to organize my notes. And it started off as a binder and then and that got too big, and then I needed something electronically, so it went to a Microsoft word document. And then I realized, well, I need to be able to capture any thought or any idea at any time. I can only do a word document if I have my specific laptop. So then it translated to a Google doc, so now I can do it for my phone from anywhere. I can do it from right now. You give me a great quote, pull out my phone, type it in. It's in the manifesto. I know exactly where it is. So any you have, you could right now mention any thought, any concept of anything, all the way from leadership to the x's and o's of the game to you know, equipment at anything, and I'll be able to a quote or pull something. If you had like, hey, what are your thoughts on you know, firing personnel. Well, I have probably fifteen to twenty page there's a notes on that, and I know exactly where it is, and it's super organized. It's just notes.

00:22:04
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's notes, but it goes into a Google doc. And then later in the documentary you talk about signs and all that. When did the manifesto evolve into seeing these signs and being.

00:22:14
Speaker 3: Able to break down You're talking about just deciphering signals in a game.

00:22:18
Speaker 2: Right, it is a manifesto, a part of that or these two That was just my That was my first task at Navy.

00:22:24
Speaker 1: So your first major task was.

00:22:26
Speaker 3: With the naval kate maybe football. So you know, I'm student coaching now and we're a week from game day and I'm like, wait, wait, what do I do on game day? Right? And this this applies to me at Michigan too, and I started helping out, so like, really, in twenty nineteen to twenty twenty one, there's no job description for me because I'm not an employee, right, I'm just volunteering. I'm a volunteer student coach at Navy. And then I was a volunteer assistant in Michigan, So there's no job description. Why would you have a job description for a role that you don't even have? And then you know, I just kind of get my foot in the door and work my way in. So at both places it started. It started a Navy I just say, so what do I do on game day? And I forget who it was, but one of the coaches said, well, I don't know, let me look into it. But I remember last year we had a guy he just graduated, who tried deciphering signals, you know, opponent signals in game and I knew nothing about it. You know, I never did that in high school. I don't know, Okay, Okay. So I went in with a blank sheet of paper, a clipboard, and a pen. And our first game is Ohio State, and just started. You know that that was the birth And they talked about in the documentary one of my favorite quotes the yeah, I said, well, I gotta be I am one of the dumber people at the Naval Academy. I mean I was like the last person get accepted pretty much, right. Uh, And I strugg I mean it's very very difficult, very difficult. But I'm like, well, these are eighteen nineteen twenty year old kids in Columbus, like I gotta be able to if they if they know there's signals, I can figure out their signals.

00:24:13
Speaker 2: So it's a personal challenge.

00:24:14
Speaker 3: Oh, it was like a yeah, and it's Ohio States, right, you know how long?

00:24:19
Speaker 2: How how long in that game did you start to thine drives? Three drives?

00:24:23
Speaker 3: Yep?

00:24:24
Speaker 2: Okay, can you break that down for me a little bit.

00:24:26
Speaker 3: I mean I don't remember, you know, I don't remember exactly right, you know the play.

00:24:30
Speaker 2: I think they ran it like memory.

00:24:36
Speaker 3: It's been a lot of games since then. But I just remember, you know, both sides of the ball, whatever I could get, and I just remember getting their offensive signals pretty early and just not knowing what to do with the information. So I would just yell it out. And because you know, there wasn't like a structure, No one knew who I was. Right, I'm two weeks into being a student coach, Like they're not. They don't know who I am. Like the OC knew who I was, but he's up in the booth, and like the director of football ops knew who I was. That was pretty much it in the players. But so I'm just yelling like power Left, power Left, you know who's this? It'd be power left and the next player, you know whatever it was, and it's you know, you just gotta have a kN act for it. But it's it's not rocket science, it's signals.

00:25:32
Speaker 1: But still you're you're in such a spot to where again you don't have like a job title, you don't have a description, like you're in such a militant law of attraction success like I'm going to provide as much value as I possibly can so that way they can't ignore me. Yes, and then you when when's the when's this? When is the point to where it starts to turn to where you're now becoming a valuable asset that they're leaning on just in your just in your own role. You know what I mean, it's like, Okay, you're doing the weather, then you're getting whatever. The next thing is either one either one.

00:26:07
Speaker 2: They maybe maybe ever recognize you for like, hey, this guy's really picking up signals, he's understanding this really gives us an edge.

00:26:13
Speaker 3: Well, well yeah, because they had a breakdown, right Yeah, it's it's it's you know what I say this too, Like even at Michigan this last year before I was suspended, UH, signals was like ten to fifteen percent of my job, you know what I mean, Like, it's that's just one responsibility that I did. H You're still you know, breaking down film, getting formation tendencies, you know, stuff like stuff like that, right Frank, Yeah, And I mean there's a I'm gonna skip ahead right now. It's on my mind. The best team to ever protect their signals was East Carolina last year, first game, and they I'm not going to get into details on exactly what they did to protect because I don't want to out them. Right now, they're probably still using it because it's pretty legit. But it took me two and a half quarters to figure out which signaler was live. That's the longest it's ever taken me.

00:27:17
Speaker 1: Really, Yep.

00:27:18
Speaker 3: And it was week one, so it's brand new signals, right, So I pretty much go into the blank Street paper and I had a good idea of how to tell who's live, but they like flipped it from the year before. And I also did one of the formation breakdowns for our defense, so I knew, for example, every time it's two by two four removed, so no tight end in the core, and their only run out of that formation was quarterback draw. And I'm fast forward, like the fourth quarter right now, we're up thirty to nothing, and I'm watching there. I now know who's live, and I see him signal the two by two formation, and then I see one signal. It was like alpha with his hand. And usually, I mean, you guys understand play calls, right.

00:28:13
Speaker 1: Like soord association.

00:28:15
Speaker 3: So if there's a formation and then one word, chances are it's not a pass, right because you have a pass pass protection and then the concept yeah right, And like.

00:28:26
Speaker 1: If a huddle breaks really quickly, you're like, okay, it's probably run here. But if the quarterbacks in there looking around anywhere else, You're like, all.

00:28:32
Speaker 3: Right, he's tagging receivers and all that. And then also a lot of runs still have some tags to it, right, so only one word. I'm thinking drawer screen, so and then this all goes on. This goes on in my head in like a second, right, So I see the two by two like doubles formation, whatever you want to call it, and then I see one signal. I'm thinking that's got to be drawers. I would think it was second in I think it was like second and five and it was two minutes, so but in my mind, I'm like, this isn't really a draw situation. But then I also remembered twenty nineteen Penn State, same signal was their quarterback draw and that's the only time I've ever seen that signal, and I remember the breakdown. I did quarterback draw out of that formation, so I think you can see it because coach Mentor was the interim head coach that game, and they happen to be showing him and I'm like behind him, I'm like, I think this is draw, and so we're yelling draw, draw, draw, which is one of the worst feelings when you say I think it's something and then everyone yeah. I'm like, oh god, this better be yeah, you better hit yeah, And it was a draw, but they I mean, they still converted it first down. But it's just like, that's how many things have to go into it, right, Like, it's not just like look at the signal. It's not this like black and white thing. A lot of times I'm kinda yeah, I think this is what it is. And you know, so kind of how it works on game day is in my mind, I have a threshold where if I am not ninety five percent certain, I'm not saying a word and I got to take a step back for this. All that makes sense. So in college football, all right, we're gonna get into some really good details here.

00:30:21
Speaker 1: Let's go. I'm so excited.

00:30:22
Speaker 3: So college football, the culture has always been to go up tempo ever since the mid two thousands. Right, you don't see many teams at huddle. NFL the culture is obviously to huddle. And I'm gonna kind of mix last year to present day now because of the whole new Quarterback COM's rule, and everyone assumes that, oh, signaling is over. Signaling is picked up now. And to understand that, you have to understand the history of signals. You know, just how works, and the reason signals exist is because of up tempo. It's not because there's no quarterback comes. It's because offenses like to go up tempo. Right. I have not watched a disclaimer, I have not watched Ole Miss in Tennessee all that much this year, but I would assume they're still going up tempo. I don't see a world in which all these teams that are like snapping the ball with thirty seconds up in the play clock are huddling all because they have coach to quarterback comes now. So they're going up tempo, which forces the defense to signal. Right, you can't huddle as a defense if the offense is spread out right, they'll just snap and throw it over your head if you're in a huddle. So signaling will always exist as much as offensive coordinators want it to want it to exist. And signals stealing has been more prevalent with offenses stealing defensive signals. So going back to twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen with Michigan, our defense was getting our signal stolen left and right, teams like Ohio State, Penn State, Indiana, so on, pretty much the whole, the whole big tent. Probably Nebraska, Yeah, probably, I mean, yeah, you're you're not You're not wrong.

00:32:19
Speaker 1: Because it's everyone sim simplicity.

00:32:22
Speaker 3: That's like Iowa and Michigan State is everyone else State wasn't stealing. I don't think so, because they were the worst of protecting.

00:32:29
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was just going to say, for simplicity, for you to say that about Michigan State, you're saying that the worst of protecting.

00:32:35
Speaker 3: If you are bad at protecting, you're probably not stealing. Right Like if you if you're good with stealing, you know what it takes to protect. So the teams that were really good at protecting you, well you can also look they got a guy just like me. Right, they just they didn't the media didn't go crazy about their guys, right, But everyone has a guy.

00:32:58
Speaker 2: Everyone has a Connor. Yeah, some things have multiple Connors, Oh a lot. We'll definitely get into that. Let's keep let's keep breaking. That is obviously a huge thing.

00:33:06
Speaker 3: So we're getting our signal stolen left and right.

00:33:10
Speaker 1: And that's because of the tempo you guys are facing. And it's just simply.

00:33:13
Speaker 3: Because you know, and just football in general, right, Like whether it's covering up issues as a play caller or personnel issues, whatever it is, you can always utilize and manipulate tempo to give you an advantage right to regain that advantage, right, And a lot of times, especially in a world where everyone's signaling, you can even force the defense to signal before you signal. Maybe not force, right, because at the end of the day, if you know what's going on, it's it's just a cat and mouse game. You just wait until they signal and just calling out on their bluff.

00:33:51
Speaker 1: And just to your defense too, like if a being a defender, if an offense is tempoing you, the coordinator will kind of tell you before the game, Hey, if they start tempoing us, there'll only be like two or three halls that they go to correct. So you're almost understanding the tendency before it happens.

00:34:03
Speaker 3: But also, uh, you know they can tempo and then hard count m right, so just to get whatever you're in. Maybe you showed blitz or maybe you showed your safety shell, or you showed too high, whatever it is, right, they you know, they get to the line quick and they get you to kind of tell real quick, and then they call their play and they expose it. Right. They oh they cover four, let's call cover four beater. Oh, hey, they're bringing the nickel, they're dropping the buck. Let's let's throw a slant, you know, to the slot right away. Yeah, whatever it is. And so yeah, that was happening to us. And so in twenty twenty one, the big change was So when coach McDonald got the job, he asked, he said, hey, you know, he's new, he's been in the NFL, coming back to college and he goes, hey, you know, what's how do we protect our signals? And I told him, I said, well, it's a cat and mouse game. You got to think of it like it's red light green light. If if if I'm watching them signal and I am not talking, that means they have not signaled, So don't signal, because then we're the mouse. You just have to wait for them to begin signaling. So, you know, and it's not the sexy thing everyone wants to hear, but ninety nine times out of one hundred, they already know what they're calling no matter what. They just want to have the green light to call it so their signal doesn't get stolen. Right, So usually in game, I'm I'm looking, I'm looking, I'm looking, and if I say, like, hey, trips, why flex? You know the formation maybe I say, like why across to trips? Why flex? Which here's usual signals for like why across? Like why across trips? Why?

00:35:48
Speaker 1: Yeah?

00:35:49
Speaker 2: You know, like.

00:35:50
Speaker 3: It's anyone could could see that and just say this is this is what the formation is. Usually he's calling the play just like that, right, So it's not like it's not like the coordinator was waiting for like, hey, is it going to be a run? Is it going to be a pass? Is? It's more like these Mike McDonald is a very successful college football coach and now NFL head coach, Right, Jesse Mentor, is what are the Chargers are giving up the fewest points in the NFL? Right?

00:36:18
Speaker 1: Yeah?

00:36:18
Speaker 3: Right, So these guys get paid to do what they do. They're not listening, They're not like calling their defense waiting for me. I'm just a green light to basically tell then, hey, you have permission to signal without getting stolen. And that that is kind of where it picked up in twenty one, where we were now no longer the mouse. It was all even playing field essentially, and what teams will do though, like Ohio State and I got a whole we might I got a whole breakdown on every single play from twenty eighteen to present day Michigan Ohio State.

00:36:57
Speaker 2: Yeah, now, from twenty eighteen to present day, a whole breakdown of Ohio States.

00:37:03
Speaker 3: When when Ohio State's on offense and we're on defense, and I category I watched every play on film and I categorized it, who's the mouse, who's the cat? And then sometimes it's just neutral the wash yut yep, and here we go. So in twenty eighteen, Ohio State was the cat every play because they're they're picking us apart signal wise, right, and yeah, they're running mess every time we're in cover one, they're running meshrail every time we're blitz in. They happened being max protection. Take a shot every time we're in zone, they run the ball, right, I mean, it's not a coincidence. I'm watching them. They have their me in, you know, Ryan Daysier, and we signal, they talk. I see it, we talk, but we signaled first, so we're the mouse, right, and and then so that happened in twenty eighteen twenty nineteen, so they were the cat every play those two games. They averaged eight eight point one five yards per play in twenty eighteen and eight Yards were playing twenty nineteen and they had fifteen touchdowns in those two games. Okay, twenty one they were it was a stalemate seventy two times. Okay, so that's like they're signaling, and then we start to signal right after they start to signal. Okay, they were the cat three times. And here's how I categorized them being the cat when they had a play called. So it starts off as a stalemate, and then Ryan Day gets CJ. Stroud's attention last second because he sees what we're in. Maybe they got our signal, maybe they see our show, whatever it is, and they changed the play right before the snap. Okay, that's them being the cat, so our signals they spoke last yep, and then they were the mouse every time they hard counted that game. Here's why. In twenty eighteen and twenty nineteen, every time they hard counted and then looked at the sideline, we already had our signal called and we never changed it. So I mean they they.

00:39:16
Speaker 2: Exposed right right right, so they know the zone.

00:39:19
Speaker 3: Man twenty twenty one, I know their hard count signal, so I know when they're going to hard count, so we don't have to show a blitzer or whatnot. They stole our they stole the wrong signal because we would change our call.

00:39:34
Speaker 2: And do you know who Ryan days Connor Stallions is.

00:39:38
Speaker 3: Yeah, but I'm not gonna out of here.

00:39:39
Speaker 2: Yeah you should as you should have.

00:39:40
Speaker 1: But we know he's there.

00:39:42
Speaker 3: Yeah.

00:39:42
Speaker 1: Is he good at his job?

00:39:43
Speaker 3: Yes, very Yeah. So when they were the mouse, actually i'll start with when they're the cat. When they were the cat, so they they changed the play late three times, they averaged nine point three yards per play. When it was a stalemate, they averaged five point three yards per play. They did score three touchdowns. It's seventy two plays, so that's the majority of the game. Right. When they were the mouse, they only averaged four yards per play six times, and usually.

00:40:09
Speaker 2: There were seventy two total plays or they were.

00:40:11
Speaker 3: Seventy there the stalemate, so it was eighty one total plays.

00:40:15
Speaker 1: Gotcha.

00:40:16
Speaker 3: And yeah, you see, when they're the cat, they averaged the most yards per play all the way down. When they're the mouse, it's they're not they're not doing much. So their first the twenty eighteen and twenty nineteen they hard counted forty times. You can go back and watch the film, they hard counted forty times twenty twenty one six because it wasn't working right, because they couldn't steal our signal when they hard counted, because we just basically played this cat and mouse game with them and didn't allow them to to be the mouse or to be the cat every time.

00:40:49
Speaker 2: When you're explaining this cat and mouse game to the coaches, how receptive were they to, Hey, you got.

00:40:54
Speaker 3: A very Mike McDonald is amazing.

00:40:57
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:40:57
Speaker 3: I mean he's one of the smartest people I've been around, and elite coach. Right. He also empowered everyone. He's a great leader and he would listen. So, I mean, it couldn't have been any better having him there. He was. It was huge.

00:41:19
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's huge.

00:41:20
Speaker 3: Is so basically he just you know, hey, I'm the DC. I want to call the plays and focus on that. I don't want to get my signal stolen. Can you help me? Yeah, just you know, wait till it's a green light. Okay, thanks.

00:41:34
Speaker 1: Outside of the signal stuff, what situations were you in charge of breaking down?

00:41:39
Speaker 3: Well, in twenty one I was still in the Marine Corps.

00:41:41
Speaker 1: Okay, so I was That's when.

00:41:42
Speaker 3: I was flying back and forth. So I mean I just showed up on game day and helped out twenty two when I get hired, you know, recruiting and then recruiting signals and and then involved into helping out with the linebackers. Okay, nice formation breakdowns.

00:42:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I'm so fascinated, Like this is incredible.

00:42:06
Speaker 3: Yeah, And if you want me to keep going this Ohio State thing. They weren't the cat one play in twenty twenty two in Columbus, and they averaged six yards per play, and then when they stole the wrong signal because they hard counted, uh, they averaged five yards per play. They scored one touchdown each in those situations. But it's funny. There's a there's a video someone sent me of It's like me by coach Minter twenty twenty two in Columbus and some guy like is doing this breakdown. Sam, I'm saying, run right, run right?

00:42:41
Speaker 1: Oh you talk about where all even players just ran. Do we have that clip that.

00:42:47
Speaker 3: It wasn't even like, First of all, I'm saying Nike, because that's what we called an opponent's hard count Nike. And you can see the Nike board go up behind me. We have a board in Nike basically tom on our you know, safeties like don't show a shell. They're trying to steal our signal right now, right, and be ready for us to change the call. So if they look, we're going to change our call to make make sure they stole the wrong.

00:43:10
Speaker 1: This is the clip what we're talking about right here.

00:43:12
Speaker 3: No, that was after one of their herd counts. You see heart counts right there.

00:43:20
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then Nike signed behind it.

00:43:22
Speaker 3: We had the Nike sign right, But there's a different one where like some guy does this breakdown and like he's trying to like read my lips and he says, he's saying, run right, run right, that's what he's saying. I'm saying, but I'm saying Nike, Nike. And by the way, the run was to the left, because it's from the defense's perspective, right, Like, I'm not gonna say it's a run of the right when they run it to our left. But yes, so I say Nike, and then you can see them hard count. Look, they just stole whatever we just signaled and then changed video.

00:43:56
Speaker 1: In the group chat.

00:43:58
Speaker 2: Yeah, we'll pull that up for sure, because there's you see so many of these clips and videos of you and you're saying something to somebody and everyone wants to freak out.

00:44:06
Speaker 3: Over it out. But while I'm actually protecting our signals. That's the whole point of what I was saying. I'm telling our coordinator, they are hard counting, call a play. You don't want to call because they're gonna they're trying to steal our signal.

00:44:22
Speaker 2: So this is the clip right here. Yeah, they're saying Nike, Nike.

00:44:26
Speaker 3: Yeah, you can see me say twin, why Twin why Nike? And there goes the Nike board. You saw it go up. Yeah, and you see Ohio State hard count. So now they're all looking at the sideline. Now they're signaling, and then we call our other play. So they just stole the wrong signal and it goes for no yards.

00:44:48
Speaker 1: Everybody they're feasting breakdown the U. There's just tight end screen.

00:44:54
Speaker 3: Ah.

00:44:54
Speaker 1: Yeah, I want to say the Houston text heat stover. Yeah, And he said essentially like it's a formation we've never done it out of, we've never ran this play out of, And he was beside himself on figuring out how you guys need that. Yeah, insane, incredible awareness by the defense and understanding that it was a screened.

00:45:21
Speaker 2: Guys just in the film room.

00:45:24
Speaker 3: Uh so, I don't remember what formation it was out of.

00:45:29
Speaker 2: But can we pull that clip up before you explain it?

00:45:32
Speaker 3: Yeah?

00:45:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, just scroll up.

00:45:35
Speaker 4: That one right there.

00:45:41
Speaker 1: Do they show the play?

00:45:42
Speaker 3: No, they don't. We could. We could pull it up.

00:45:47
Speaker 1: Yeah, see yeah, try to. Yeah, I'm thinking about it.

00:45:52
Speaker 3: I had to be first half, first quarter because they're going the same direction around the twenty five thirty yard line somewhere in there. Who was right in front of us?

00:46:08
Speaker 1: It was into the boundary in front of you.

00:46:10
Speaker 2: Yes, correct, we're getting to. You called this play that they had not run before, but you were able to decipher it. Is this one of your top five calls?

00:46:19
Speaker 3: Is this like? Is this like a top fired? Though? It backfired?

00:46:22
Speaker 1: They get c J.

00:46:23
Speaker 3: Stroud turned around and everyone was right there, and he scrambled and got it first down or at least got significant yards. Frank's facetiming me right now.

00:46:31
Speaker 1: Twenty two He answer it, dude.

00:46:38
Speaker 2: Frank was a war daddy at Michigan.

00:46:40
Speaker 3: Frank, we're on the bus right now.

00:46:44
Speaker 1: Frank, what's baby?

00:46:48
Speaker 2: What are you doing?

00:46:52
Speaker 1: What are you going to take house for?

00:46:53
Speaker 2: What you doing.

00:46:59
Speaker 1: That's awesome.

00:47:00
Speaker 2: Well, I hope you're doing well, brother.

00:47:04
Speaker 3: Yeh jump after yeah, say all that's funny. I already gave him the shout out.

00:47:12
Speaker 2: Yeah, no doubt.

00:47:15
Speaker 3: That tight end screen. Yes whatever the formation said. You know, here's the thing. They Ohio State had like eight signalers eight signalers all year something like that, and everyone signals the formation. Mistake number one, Like, I don't need to know who's live to see what the formation is, right, anyone can see that.

00:47:37
Speaker 2: Uh.

00:47:38
Speaker 3: Mistake number two. They never changed who their live signaler was the entire season.

00:47:44
Speaker 2: So I guess their condor stallions. Isn't that good? Then?

00:47:48
Speaker 3: Apparently not as good.

00:47:49
Speaker 1: They didn't do it. They didn't do no self scouting correct.

00:47:55
Speaker 3: So so, and here's here's the bottom line of you know, how how can you be so good in game? I just realized this is the clip right here? Yep, that's it? Slot why? Why? So? I think they motioned into slot y why?

00:48:14
Speaker 2: And then also that's a cup block. You see a cup by the pressure it's penalty.

00:48:27
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's the signal signal for the slot YY formation. And and then the guy who was live the entire season signaled why delay. Am I supposed to see that and be like, oh, I don't know what this.

00:48:48
Speaker 1: Is, right right?

00:48:49
Speaker 2: Right?

00:48:49
Speaker 1: So you call it out?

00:48:50
Speaker 3: I said, I think this has got to be a why delay screen?

00:48:54
Speaker 2: God. So we talked about Ohio State having their own Connor stallions. How many of the power now Power four conferences have.

00:49:05
Speaker 3: I mean, it's it's got to be eighty to ninety. But like the Big Ten before, well, I'm sure USC does, I'm sure Washington probably does.

00:49:17
Speaker 1: Has.

00:49:17
Speaker 3: The only two teams that, to my understanding, did not were Iowa and Michigan State in the Big Ten. Nebraska when we played them last year, this is like what two games before I got suspended. They first of all, they huddled almost every play. We're going to go game by game. Last year, ECU new you know, new signals because it's game one, and they're the best at protecting. So we're we're up thirty to nothing. Before I even started figuring out what was going on. Next game was what UNLV They had one signaler, so that was easy. Game three, Bowling Green, they were okay protecting. I figured them out pretty early. Game four, Rutgers, they huddled every single play. They're they're really good at getting signals. So again, you're really good, Like, you know, we huddled.

00:50:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, Nebraska handled business.

00:50:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, we handled business.

00:50:20
Speaker 2: So there, they're very good at protecting their players.

00:50:22
Speaker 3: Very good because they're they're good at getting signals.

00:50:25
Speaker 2: So they did you figure them out at all?

00:50:28
Speaker 3: Well, like I know their guy. Yeah, so we both First of all, Michigan offense, we don't. We don't. We never really steal signals. We we huddle more than anyone in the country, I think besides Air Force maybe or whoever one of the service academies. But you don't see Michigan go up temple all too much. But yeah, we huddled every play, and they huddled every play. And then after the game I talked to their guy and we just kind of that was the ultimate stalemate.

00:50:54
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, And did you know him personally before the game.

00:51:00
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh yeah yeah. And then right after the game, all right, right back to you know, whatever you need help with, you know, let me know, I'll give you what I got, and he gives me what he's got, you know, And that happens every Sunday, right.

00:51:11
Speaker 2: So every Sunday you essentially talk to the team you just played their guy.

00:51:15
Speaker 3: Well, anyone a lot of a lot of coaches do that too. It's like, right, I'm sure the head coaches exchanged information with and not even just the team you just played, like, you know, okay, what Michigan's got Illinois coming up? And Illinois already played Nebraska, so I could call Nebraska's guy and be like, hey, what you got in Illinois? Who do you play next? I'll give you what I got on so and so. Right, that happens all the time. And that's not just signals, that's decordinators. You know, hey, what plays did you like? What what did you see? You know all that. So yeah, after that Rutgers game, it was right back to all right, we're friends now. We knew that was going to happen. No signals at all the entire game. And then the next game was Nebraska and they did not signal until like their third drive of the game. We were already up fourteen nothing before their first signal.

00:52:08
Speaker 1: Right, they had the third and one pick.

00:52:10
Speaker 3: But the funniest thing was, you know, most teams have boards that either sometimes it means formation, sometimes it tells you which signaler is live. It could mean many different things. Nebraska's boards told you which signaller was live and they had these quadrants and pictures in each quadrant, and most of the pictures I'm sure it didn't mean anything, but one of the boards they had had my high school logo on it.

00:52:35
Speaker 1: No ship nice, so they knew it.

00:52:38
Speaker 3: Was pretty funny. We all know, we all know who each other are, so that was probably just a funny.

00:52:43
Speaker 1: Like, yeah, look at any other intel with Nebraska.

00:52:51
Speaker 3: No, who they play next week?

00:52:55
Speaker 1: We it's a bye week.

00:52:55
Speaker 3: But then Indiana, Indiana, that's a good game.

00:52:58
Speaker 1: Yeah, where is it at Indiana?

00:53:01
Speaker 2: What kind of what kind of information can you give us in Indiana?

00:53:04
Speaker 3: Uh, give me a week.

00:53:06
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, wait for your next go back to the JMU stuff. Yeah, yep, with who is it signetti?

00:53:13
Speaker 3: Oh he's really good.

00:53:17
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:53:17
Speaker 3: And then the next game after Rutgers last years, Minnesota they huddled every play and.

00:53:21
Speaker 2: Then you guys body bag.

00:53:23
Speaker 3: And then and then Indiana, Uh they were decent at protecting their signals. And then and then I wasn't there.

00:53:32
Speaker 2: Did Michigan have a signal steeler before you?

00:53:35
Speaker 3: No?

00:53:35
Speaker 1: So that again there.

00:53:36
Speaker 3: When I went from Navy to there, like once I was in the Marine Corps. Uh, it was twenty eighteen was the start of it? I it was maybe week four five, I think Actually the last game I was not the last game I was in the stands for. May have been Michigan Nebraska in like twenty eighteen. Maybe it was Northwestern, I don't remember who it was. It was one of those two teams. Yeah, and then after that, I'm on the field, you know, because I asked, well, I was there for a two week kind of limbo period between training and being stationed in California, and so I asked like, Hey, what can I do on game day? And they're like, I don't know. What do you think? I said, well, I mean I did this a Navy. I'm gonna try that. And they're, yeah, sure, I don't think we have anyone doing that, and just ran with it. I don't. I don't know about that.

00:54:29
Speaker 2: Well, let me ask the question, because did anyone from South Carolina get signs from you to steal from Tennessee and Georgia.

00:54:37
Speaker 3: I don't know anyone at South Carolina. Now Here's what I'll say. There's this whole like a giant circle of the intel guys right that know each other, right, and you're usually one or two phone calls away from anyone you want, right, Like if I if we played we played Georgia in twenty one in the Orange Bowl, and I got a hold of a couple SEC teams that were playing Big ten teams in their bowl game, and so I'd give them what I had on them, and they give me what they had on Georgia. Also, this was my favorite. So trading happens all the time. Right, twenty twenty one, we lose the Michigan State Kenneth Walker a great.

00:55:27
Speaker 2: Game, played fantastic YEP, and we needed some help.

00:55:31
Speaker 3: Right, they had to lose twice and we had to Michigan State had to lose twice, and then that would have resulted in having a three way tie, or no, we would have beaten Ohio State and then it would just been us in Ohio State because then Michigan State would not have been in that three way tie. And they lost to Purdue, and then I think it was the next week they played Ohio State the week before we played Ohio State, and so we needed Ohio State to win. So I gave Michigan State signals to a buddy of mine and said, hey, I changed all the logos. It looked I made it look like it came from a different school that I don't. I don't want to give Ohio State something from Michigan. Right, they might not use it, who knows, but we need Ohio State to win, and I know they steal a crap out of defensive signals. So here you go. So I made it. I gave it to a buddy who may have given it to a buddy who then gave it to Ohio State.

00:56:26
Speaker 2: And say, that's a game of telephone.

00:56:28
Speaker 3: Yep, I got this from so and so, you know, name your school university. And yeah, so they got I'm sure they probably already had them, but it just confirmed everything. But yeah, and then they won like sixty to nothing, and that's.

00:56:44
Speaker 2: All you needed.

00:56:44
Speaker 1: Yep.

00:56:46
Speaker 2: Does in this in this world of trading, does anybody ever trade their own schools information?

00:56:54
Speaker 3: I have no idea. That'd be crazy, but.

00:56:58
Speaker 1: You never know, right because I'm assuming like trade their own schools information.

00:57:03
Speaker 2: Right, Like I'm assuming not everybody was as massive a fan of the school they worked for like you were. So I know that, you know, just like corrupt politicians.

00:57:12
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm sure I wouldn't put it past certain people.

00:57:16
Speaker 1: I'm gonna throw one out there, go ahead. Lineberry coach got fired last year, yeah, or he resigned and then when Obama fired No, that.

00:57:23
Speaker 3: Was that was two years ago coaching.

00:57:25
Speaker 2: No, No, that was that was last year last year.

00:57:28
Speaker 3: No, but he so it was at the end of twenty twenty two. He wasn't at Michigan during the twenty three season.

00:57:35
Speaker 1: Wasn't somebody at Michigan during last year? Not during the season, and their computer kind of got found grenade the computer and then they went to Alabama.

00:57:45
Speaker 3: That you're you're mixing stories right now.

00:57:47
Speaker 2: Okay, can you help differentiate the stories?

00:57:50
Speaker 1: Would that George.

00:57:51
Speaker 3: Hilo as a linebacker coach in twenty twenty two? He was not at Michigan in twenty three and then was hired by Obama before our game, But he was like eleven months removed or whatever got you. I don't quote man exactly right.

00:58:05
Speaker 2: And you you assumed the reason why he was hired by Alabama right before?

00:58:10
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, why wouldn't you have hired him earlier in the year, right?

00:58:13
Speaker 2: Because Alabama was trying to cheat? I'll say it.

00:58:17
Speaker 1: I mean it's just like in the NFL if somebody like, yeah, if I were to be playing for Washington, I get cut and the Eagles bring me in right away and they want to just know.

00:58:26
Speaker 2: Like you're you're squealing like a pig.

00:58:30
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, when I when I when I came to the Titans, I was in the offensive room with Lafleur and then breaking down the Washington breaking down Washington defense, how we played cover one and how we did things in the red zone, how we played triangle when it was three by one, like all that stuff. You want to win. I mean, at the end of the day, you want to win.

00:58:49
Speaker 2: I want to keep breaking down this this crazy underground world of trading different teams information. When did you become aware of this?

00:58:58
Speaker 5: Uh, eighteen eighteen is when you found out there's a navy.

00:59:02
Speaker 3: Yeah. I never no one ever really talked to me from other season Na, yeah, leaving it.

00:59:11
Speaker 1: I want help.

00:59:11
Speaker 2: We're good.

00:59:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, I appreciate you. I just got killed.

00:59:16
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, yes, still shiit twenty eighteen.

00:59:24
Speaker 3: It was after the after the regular season. I think it was after that I got a call someone asking for some stuff on some certain teams. Yeah, and that's when I was like, wait, what what teams?

00:59:38
Speaker 2: What teams were calling about?

00:59:39
Speaker 3: What teams again, I shouldn't read anyone, Okay.

00:59:42
Speaker 1: I have a question in your opinion subjective of course, What are the best hidden cameras on the market? Is it Sony Cannon? Are there some glasses out there?

00:59:57
Speaker 3: I am not in a hidden camera business. I don't need hitting cameras.

01:00:03
Speaker 1: We're gonna take a quick moment and interrupt this episode this football season, don't walk around with helmet hair like a total rookie. You've been in the game long enough to know that how you wear your hair matters, and just because your team's mascot is a wolverine doesn't mean you should look like one. Up top, keep your head in the game and go to sport Clips. They are pro stylists that have mastered the x's and o's of men's hair, so you can get a tight fade well kicking back and watch us and fade routes on TV. They'll have a perfectly crafted game plan to make you look your best, no halftime adjustments needed. Remember the difference between an okay cut and a great cut is called sport clips. It is a game changer. Back to this episode, tea.

01:00:40
Speaker 2: Breaks have been taken by Connor and by will I had this protein bar and let me give a shameless shoutout real quick, dude to alpha alpha ten?

01:00:47
Speaker 1: Is that what it is? Alpha ten? No free shoutouts.

01:00:50
Speaker 2: However, this is like a mom and pop shop type thing to get off a nation Chelsea very delicious, sticks to your teeth, coats the.

01:00:55
Speaker 1: Throat, coats the throat.

01:01:01
Speaker 2: So there's been so much obviously the landscape of college football and how you do play calling has changed so much, and a lot of it has to do with what happened last year with Michigan and everything like that. That you are piny fingers at you.

01:01:14
Speaker 3: I don't think anything is people. People didn't people in football didn't change much. Yeah, it's just the media perception.

01:01:24
Speaker 2: So because now they're going to the comp times, so is it much more difficult to steal?

01:01:29
Speaker 3: So now it's actually signal seeling is happening more now. So remember I explained the whole you know, how how it evolved, how it works, and the difference between the NFL and college it's just because of the tempo. I mean, shoot, NFL teams still signals some not all the time, but like if they ever want to go tempo, they signal.

01:01:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, go temple.

01:01:51
Speaker 2: You gotta signal.

01:01:53
Speaker 3: Sometimes it's the coach to the quarterback and then the quarterback signals to the receivers and tells everyone in the core. Or some teams have signalers on the sideline that are ready to signal anytime they want to go tempo. That's the league though. College now that new helmet communications. It's not a rule, right, it's not a mandate, it's just a feature. It's a tool. So now coaches can talk to the quarterbacks. That doesn't mean they have to signal or or that doesn't mean they have to huddle or that they want to huddle. So what's happening now, and this isn't for everyone, but a lot of teams are doing this. Is now they are continuing to go up tempo and they are stealing the defensive signal and now they can just talk to the quarterback up until fifteen seconds and tell them exactly what's coming. So, hey, they're blitzing the nickel, they're dropping the boundary in, throw the slant to the slot. Whatever it is. Now you can do that. There's already you know, I'm not going to say who. It's not a Big ten school, but there's already been a team that has had bluetooth to the quarterback for years.

01:03:04
Speaker 1: No shit, really, I guess.

01:03:07
Speaker 3: I'm not even I'm not gonna tell you if you're cold. It's just not in the big ten.

01:03:12
Speaker 1: It's a big time team.

01:03:14
Speaker 3: It's a powerful, powerful power five what do you want to call it? Time?

01:03:17
Speaker 2: Yeah, is irrelevant?

01:03:19
Speaker 3: So like why you know the officials aren't going to check to see if there's bluetooth because in ninety nine percent of people's minds, you would only have bluetooth to huddle up, when in reality, you have bluetooth to tell the QB what the defensive signal is. Now that's happening a lot. So it's I mean, it's funny. I've I've gotten phone calls from teams asking if I still have so and so signals and whatnot? Really uh, And I'm not even you know, technically in it right now, technically technically uh. And then I mean, shoot, I have gone to every Michigan game and everyone we played his signal.

01:04:01
Speaker 2: Really on offense, and you are you're still sitting Minnesota did not, they didn't last, but everyone else sitting in the stands and you can see the signal color, and so you essentially know what's happening.

01:04:12
Speaker 3: Uh. You know, when I'm at the Michigan games, now, I'm just there to enjoy it. When I know, I'm obviously aware enough to see, oh they're signaling. And for example, like USC when we played USC, you know it's the Lincoln Riley offense. It's the same as his brother Garrett Riley when he was at TCU and now Clemson. I was even remembering some of the stuff like, oh, wait, isn't this this is just all go special and it was right. You know, they're not they're not changing their signals. Maybe a few, but like Texas, they they signaled every single play the whole game. And you know, again it's or we're definitely at a disadvantage now because we don't have our signal guy and everyone else has theirs. So you know, it goes back to that cat cat mouse game.

01:05:02
Speaker 2: So you've not become the mouse in every situation.

01:05:05
Speaker 3: Uh yeah, unless you make sure you signal second. So and there we didn't make sure we're doing that if or not.

01:05:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, what do you see out of Michigan this year? Issue? I mean, outside of not having a quarterback, well, you.

01:05:21
Speaker 3: Have fifteen guys or whatever that we lost the league, right, Like, that's not easy? Yeah, okay, and then you lose your strength coach, your entire defensive staff. You know, you're obviously your head coach. It's it's gonna be a step back, you know, it's not it's not that easy to maintain success when you when when that happens. Yeah, I think. Uh, I watched your video yesterday. You know, I'm still optimistic, too good. And I told you not to watch. I told nobody to watch. Correct.

01:06:00
Speaker 2: I was just putting for people just to.

01:06:02
Speaker 3: Have correct I heard someone else watching it stole that, ye, And uh, you know I think, well won the bye week couldn't come in any better time. Well timed bye week. There's a lot of parody in college football this year, a lot. Yeah. That must be a product of nil and the portal in full effect now. But you know, other than Texas, and I mean, I guess Ohio State that they beat they did beat Iowa. But has anyone else looked really good every single week? Right?

01:06:42
Speaker 1: In your opinion, you feel like because you were on that side of it, you were also in recruiting. Do you feel like Michigan is doing what they need to do in the whole portal game with the nil and everything else.

01:06:51
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think the issue at the portal that a lot of people are voicing their opinions now and they're upset about you know, why did we not get someone at this position in that position? Well, the portal was closed by the time. Like, something's got to happen in college football because if you make the playoffs, you are screwed for the portal for the following season because the portal time frame is while you're prepping for the playoffs, So your players aren't announcing if they're leaving or not. So how do you recruit a guy and convince him to come to Michigan when that guy, for all he knows, like, well, so and so isn't leaving, And how do you tell him, Oh, he is going to leave? But then what if he doesn't leave? You know, And that's not that's not on a kid either, Like like JJ for example, you can't expect him to make an announcement during the playoffs about if he's going to go to the league. Right, He's not thinking about that, right, He's just in the moment, and that's that's who he is. Right, and that's also who he should be for the team in that moment. But he's not. Yeah, I mean maybe there's backdoor conversations with his family, but he's not going to make some announcement saying, you know, hey, I'm gonna leave after this game. So that's an issue the timing of everything because then it's like, you know, are they students or are they athletes? Because the semester starting in January is really what why the portal from my understanding, why the portal closes at that time and then it just opens up for a couple of days. But everyone that you would want.

01:08:27
Speaker 2: Is all the all the best players are gone. Now you're getting the tier two, two or three guys.

01:08:35
Speaker 3: So you know, Sharon is definitely the man for the job. He is an elite leader. Everyone loves him, great dude loves football. Like I remember, you know, if it's.

01:08:49
Speaker 1: One a m.

01:08:51
Speaker 3: And you're on your grind watching film, whatever you're doing, and you go to the bathroom or you go get water whatever and come back, and he was always one of the like three people that were there that late.

01:09:03
Speaker 2: Still yes, still about it, all about it. So I mean it seems like we're gonna they're gonna have a chance to do the portal this year not making the playoffs. If they don't make the playoffs, correct, we'll have time, Correct, we'll be able to reload for next year, is what you're saying. Correct Now, is anybody sitting in the seat you were sitting in last year at Michigan Now they don't have that anymore?

01:09:26
Speaker 3: With the signals? Yeah, not to my knowledge.

01:09:29
Speaker 1: What else outside of signals? Obviously you're known for being the signal master, but I think everyone understands that, Like signal stealing is like you're trying to gain whatever advantage you can. Like every every locker room, every meeting I've been in, you're trying to break down whether it's coaches copy or TV copies. You got somebody up there giving a presentation on signals. Whether whatever you do with it is ultimately up to you, depends on how much information you can retain. But what else outside of the spectrum of signals? Was kind of like your bread and butter? Was it like two minute drills or situations in there?

01:09:59
Speaker 3: Yeah? I mean, you know, one of the beauties at Michigan, Coach Harbaugh hired a great staff to recruit great players, and he just empowered his staff. So there was a lot of overlap between. Like, you know, it wasn't like if I, on paper, I'm a recruiting guy, I wasn't only doing recruiting right, or or if you're a defensive analyst, you're not only breaking down third down or people helping each other out a lot, filling in gaps when needed. But during the season it was, you know, a little bit of recruiting mostly. You know, I was in every defensive staff meeting. You know, you're game planning, I'm breaking down film prepping linebacker meetings for coach Partridge, So you know, because it's it's a race, right like every The thing that people don't realize is every I know you guys realize it, but from Sunday warning to kick off on Saturday, it's literally who can prepare faster than their opponent. And you know, the linebacker coach, for example, should not be the guy that is going in and finding the specific clips for the meeting. He's the one coaching the clips you are going through, Like, so I would go through the film and pick out, you know, what he wanted for the linebacker meeting, for example, stuff like that, and also breaking down opponents. So like I was mentioning that formation tendency stuff like that, you know, because every so like you know, Monday for the linebackers might be you know, first and second down, what do they do on first and second down? Tuesdays may be you know, short yardage, goal line. Wednesdays might be third and long whatever it is, however you break that down. And so I would prepare the meetings for the backers, you know, every day, and then you know, the signal stuff because that was again you know, it was just a portion of the job. Is something I just did anytime I didn't have, like I had some free time to Okay, we're done prepping for linebacker meetings practices in an hour. I'm gonna I'm gonna crank out an hour of this and then I try to finish that by Tuesdays usually Wednesday, and then give myself two days to memorize everything, memorize my sheet, you know, feel comfortable with it, and you know the tough part. It's this goes for everyone though, right because again, you play your opponent and then you're done. So for me, it was play your opponent. I'm not I'm not kidding. Maybe, with the exception of like Ohio State and Michigan State, I might remember a few, but an hour after the game, I could not tell you a single signal that I just remembered for that game, because it's onto whoever, right, Like I don't care being a president possible, yes, So, and usually I would try to get a couple of days ahead, so like if I fit, let's just say, uh, you know, let's say I were there now and we're playing Illinois in a couple of weeks after the bye and then who's after them, Michigan State. Yeah, so I would try to finish Illinois. Well, pretend there's no bye week. Pretend we're in Illinois week right now. I would try to finish them by Tuesday, maybe Wednesday at the latest, and then by Thursday morning. It's like two separate mind frames where one I am calmly memorizing my sheet for the Illinois game and also getting ahead with Michigan State so I can finish them by the following Tuesday, because I always want to give myself a couple of days to as I'm sure everyone does, you know, for everything they do, whether it be coordinating a play calling or coaching your position or being an actual player, like you want to at least have. You don't want to be like racing all the way up until kickoff and your mind's going a thousand different directions. So that is kind of how I scheduled everything for myself.

01:14:03
Speaker 2: When you so like during the week, you say like, yeah, like in the league, it would be like Wednesday would be like first and second down, Thursday would be all third down, Yeah then yeah, then the red zone and stuff like that. But we'd have assistant coaches like Mike Sullivan would always break down in front the entire offense. These are the blitzes these teams do. Did you ever get to sit in front of the entire defense?

01:14:24
Speaker 3: And no, because I was an analyst, and up until this year, UH, analysts could not do like on field, you know, could not instruct players or anything like that. You could only assist the coaches. So I would prepare like I would help coach Partridge for example, you know if he had short yardage goal line, I would help him prepare the clips for that and the organization right meeting.

01:14:52
Speaker 1: Yeah, are there were there a couple of defensive players that gravitated towards all the information and knowledge you had of the exces, and I mean the guys that understand it in the dah.

01:15:05
Speaker 3: A lot of the players, I mean, even like Mikey Sanders still is uh. I mean I've I've learned some of the defense from him, you know, like some of these you know, these guys are really smart, great leaders. He's Mike He's probably the best non military leader I've ever been around. Really, yes, he is. Uh, He's that guy. I mean, you know, he started as a receiver and then yeah, flashbacks he had that nice catch, that diving catch in Lincoln, Nebraska that night game as a receiver and then the very next year changes to nickel and he's our starting nickel and one of the best Nickels in the country. Just like that. But I mean he's a guy that he led by example and he was not afraid to check anyone. But I mean I was close with a lot of the players because it's like a brotherhood. You know, I was what like twenty seven years old, twenty years old at the time, and they're anywhere from eighteen to twenty three, So I'm closer in age to them than they are to the coach like the full time coaches. So yeah, I was pretty close with the majority of the team. It truly was like a family atmosphere where I mean everyone got along with everyone, And that goes back to coach Harbaugh hiring a great staff and that great staff recruiting just the right people.

01:16:30
Speaker 2: I know, we're getting kind of close to that hour thirty mark right now. I had a question about EXOS, and I heard a rumor that there was pirrating videos going on from EXOS, the film company that was actually pirrating, taking Michigan's practice film and giving it to other Big Ten teams. Do you have any knowledge of that at all.

01:16:53
Speaker 1: I don't know what.

01:16:55
Speaker 3: Exo's role would be or allegedly and that is allegedly. Yeah, well most most teams, yeah, have have Exos. There's dv sport too. All I'll say is I have seen other Big Ten schools signals. I'm talking the original signal film that was fit like a ga doing the signals in the quarterback room right like the players would have on catapult to study. I've seen other teams signals of that that. The people who showed me that claim they got it from Ohio State.

01:17:37
Speaker 1: Oh.

01:17:39
Speaker 3: Interesting, I've seen that with my own eyes. So people that have the play calls, like Ohio State, for example, may have traded that to someone for a different teams signals or whatnot, and that someone may have may have shown me, dude, you better be careful because look at what they got.

01:18:01
Speaker 2: And I'm like, they made you aware of correct, yes, and that's probably illegal, right, I'm not a lawyer.

01:18:14
Speaker 1: I have a question your manifesto. What what was the foundation of it? Like for you philosophy wise, like, how did you start building out the manifesto? Obviously from military background you talked about the coaches in the past, but you yourself putting this thing together? What foundation was it built off of.

01:18:31
Speaker 3: The best way to explain that is it's organized how I would organize a football program, which is very military like in like a chain of command like a staff org chart, you know, or usually in groups of three, where like you have the head coach and headquarters, and then under them you have the football staff, the operations staff, and so on. Within the football staff. That would be like anything related to football itself. So I grew break that into three different categories. Personnel, so scouting, recruiting, the actual x's and O so often Stephen special teams, and then player performance, which is strain, the conditioning, you know, trainers and stuff like that. Nutrition, and then each of those has a broken down subcategory. So if you gave me a thought on like, hey, I saw this really good thing that such and such a school was doing with their nutrition program, I would just go boom boom, boom boom. There's a nutrition section, and I got all my organized notes and I'd put it in there. And if you were asked, if you were to ask me, how would you run your how would the logistics work for your operations department? Give me five seconds, I'll show you boom boom boom, and then there's all my notes on that. And that's kind of you know, it's just it's a really good book, Getting Things Done by David Allen. It's about how in order to actually apply something that you learn or see, or whether it be a quote or you know, something from a book, something from a movie, something from a conversation, you have to first be able to capture it, so write it down. Then you have to take that captured thought and be able to organize it. That's like my organized notes. The Michigan Manifesto and then you have to be able to reference it though. So that's why that's the beauty of If you're super organized, then I can always go back to that. Like, for example, if I read a book on leadership, for example, there might be a quote about something that's not necessarily specifically you know, leadership. It might be about there could be a football, some football quote or something, and you got to be able to every time I read a book, I read the book, take all my notes, and then I go through the book again and everything I highlighted or underlined or wrote, I put that where it belongs in the manifesto, so then I can reference it without having to remember what book was that from. It was a quote about football, but it was in a leadership book. Like no, I just go to the football section and there's the quote.

01:21:35
Speaker 2: I couldn't dream to be this organized.

01:21:38
Speaker 1: I could not.

01:21:39
Speaker 3: And the beauty of it too, I can talk about that. You know, probably never give away the Michigan Manifesto, but I can talk about it and no one will be able to duplicate it because I'm already fifteen years ahead. Right, How like good Luck?

01:21:55
Speaker 1: How did it develop over the years from the organization.

01:22:02
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, And it's a Google doc now, And you say, like, how many pages is it? I can't give you an exact exact number because I found this out the hard way. A Google doc can't go over a thousand pages, so it's multiple Google docs.

01:22:18
Speaker 1: No shit, dude, yeah, God.

01:22:21
Speaker 2: How often do you go back and read and be like, Okay, this is different now, this is different now. Nutrition, for instance, if you take something five years ago someone said about.

01:22:28
Speaker 3: Nutrition, it's just it's ongoing. It's ongoing, and I usually I try to visit it at least weekly, try to daily. But you know, like if you know I've been traveling last few days, I haven't you know, I haven't been on it. But what I do, Like, so at the Michigan Washington game. During the game, I have my notes up, not the actual Google docs, but just my notes app and I'm just taking notes on everything I see, Like, oh, I was at the Seahawks game Sunday too. You know, anytime I'm at a game or watching a game and I see a play I like or you know, situation like you know, this is bad flashbacks. But twenty eleven fourth and inches in East Lansing and we weren to playfake And you know, I just remembered that yesterday watching the I think the Seahawks Giants game, thinking, like, you know, fourth and inches. If I'm ever a coordinator, I don't want to call player the quarterbacks back is to the defense and fourth and inches unless he's given the ball. But it's just so risky. But like so anyway, you know, that just triggered that thought from twenty eleven. So I write that down in my notes, and then tonight when I get back, I will put that exactly where it belongs to the manifesto. So then whenever I'm a coordinator, I already have that in the fourth and short section to always reference and remind myself.

01:23:50
Speaker 1: Your memory is shaky. Yeah, are you sure that wasn't you at Central Imasure.

01:23:55
Speaker 2: The manifesto? Did you give the name manifesto? Yeah?

01:24:00
Speaker 3: So that was It was just like my notes, And I think it was during COVID when people didn't know if football was going to be happening or not. And a couple buddies of mine and I had these zooms just talking ball stand fresh in football, and uh, I remember kind of introducing it to one of them, and he's like, this is like a manifesto, and so we just kind of jokingly called it the Michigan Manifesto and then, uh, you know, obviously the media ran with it. Dave ran with it, and I guess I now have to call it the Michigan Manifesto if.

01:24:38
Speaker 2: You've got to. Whenever you've decided, like I'm done doing the manifesto, you need to print that out hard copy and then just frame it somewhere, just a book.

01:24:45
Speaker 3: But there's never an end to the Michigan Manifesto.

01:24:50
Speaker 2: That was a dumb statement.

01:24:51
Speaker 3: And you win a National champions there's already a section in there. You know. This is like a sabanism, right, like where.

01:24:56
Speaker 1: You can start doing like encyclopedias. You gotta have like a volume one.

01:24:59
Speaker 3: Yeah, I already have nine volumes, do you?

01:25:03
Speaker 1: He said, I already have nine? Boy?

01:25:05
Speaker 2: Are you just doing AI up here? From so she's just been popping up different AI AI pictures that he's decided to make.

01:25:12
Speaker 3: I mean you saw you saw the recruiting the scouting map in the documentary, Yeah.

01:25:18
Speaker 1: Did you see that?

01:25:19
Speaker 2: So it's a it's a map of the United States and it's where every single draft pick, right.

01:25:24
Speaker 3: Every draft pick. So basically what I did was, again, I can say this because well, you know, you could probably hire some AI or you can do whatever now and probably catch you up on this. But it's just the concept. This is just one of you know, hundreds of concepts in the manifesto where you know, people always talk about states, like what's the best state for recruiting? Is it Georgia, is it Florida, is it Texas? Is it California? And I just kind of realized, why are we talking about states? It's literally something that Lewis and Clark drew back in the eighteen hundreds. Why would you recruit based on some state boundaries that were drawn a couple hundred years ago. So what I did was I plotted every single draft pick. I took the Google map layer like off where you couldn't even tell where you were, and I just plotted everyone, and then I just drew my own little regions around where the mass people were and just kind of went from there, because like you know, when people say Florida is great, well it's mostly Fort Lauderdale, Miami. Right when people say California, it's mostly LA and the Bay Area Texas mainly Dallas, Houston. Yes, there are certain states like Georgia and Texas where it is more spread out. But I just kind of figured, you know why, and it's my position too. Now, I'm not going to give away which positions in which sub regions are worth recruiting more than others, but yeah, there's definitely like certain regions are hotbeds for certain positions.

01:26:58
Speaker 2: So what's the best state for recruiter? What's the best region?

01:27:03
Speaker 3: Region? Miami?

01:27:05
Speaker 2: Miami is the best region. How's Arizona? How does Arizona hold up?

01:27:10
Speaker 3: I mean, if you weren't there, then it wouldn't be as great.

01:27:16
Speaker 2: That is exactly how I wanted you to answer that. I didn't know that's how I wanted you to answer, but that's what I needed.

01:27:21
Speaker 3: But you know, I think Georgia is probably the best state where if you just close your eyes and put your finger anywhere on the on the state of Georgia, you're closed to a player that's been drafted.

01:27:33
Speaker 2: I like that. Yeah, it's extremely informative.

01:27:38
Speaker 1: I've loved every minute of this.

01:27:40
Speaker 2: We got a couple of sections, we got twisted question and then tier talk. I think we have multiple tier talks one that we're just gonna give to you. But the twisted question, I don't think that was necessary.

01:27:53
Speaker 6: All right, This twisted question comes from Greg Hohenstein at Greg Hoe forty eight.

01:28:00
Speaker 1: Graham shout out, Greg hoe forty eight.

01:28:02
Speaker 6: Your best Big ten super team versus your best SEC super team? Who's on it? And who is winning?

01:28:10
Speaker 1: Man? I could be the wrong person ask here because I can't. It's not like I can sit here and think of all the players, like just throw in, you know one of the nineties Nebraska teams. I think you're gonna be pretty good.

01:28:21
Speaker 3: But is that a Big ten team? Though they are now? Yeah, but they weren't Big ten, right, they weren't Big ten?

01:28:26
Speaker 1: Then?

01:28:27
Speaker 2: All right, so let's start a quarterback who's representing the Big ten.

01:28:30
Speaker 3: We're completely creating our team from scratch. We're not saying, like Georgia twenty one.

01:28:34
Speaker 6: Your creat your like picking players.

01:28:36
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's gonna be tough.

01:28:37
Speaker 2: Yeah's that's a that's a very long winded twisted question.

01:28:41
Speaker 3: Can we we just gotta go like the best O line, the best receiver corps? Maybe?

01:28:46
Speaker 1: Okay, let's just start with you big ten? All right, Big ten quarterback? I mean or Tom, you're using one of the Michigan ones recently.

01:28:54
Speaker 3: Yeah, line yeah twenty two Michigan GP twenty twenty two, Michigan on line twenty three. Man, they didn't technically didn't win. We we didn't win the Joe Morroward last year, but that was probably because they just felt back because we won it twice in a row.

01:29:10
Speaker 2: First time we ever want it twice in a row.

01:29:12
Speaker 1: But that I would say that, I could say that line.

01:29:16
Speaker 3: Are we working on this together?

01:29:18
Speaker 1: Yeah, we have to.

01:29:19
Speaker 2: There's no way the three of us are gonna do.

01:29:20
Speaker 3: Uh. So we'll say that a line. I hate saying this, but it's gotta be one of the Ohio State Receiving Corps recently.

01:29:26
Speaker 2: No, yeah, with old Mormon Harrison Jr.

01:29:29
Speaker 3: I mean, dude, well, if you're gonna pick them, then you gotta pick Michigan's dbs though.

01:29:34
Speaker 1: Yeah.

01:29:35
Speaker 2: Right, So we're just a hot state in Michigan so far. So what's that CJ. Stroud might be?

01:29:45
Speaker 3: But this is all time, I do you know? I respect CJ. Good guy. He didn't beat Michigan.

01:29:55
Speaker 1: Though he didn't beat Michigan.

01:29:57
Speaker 2: Couldn't beat Michigan.

01:30:00
Speaker 3: Let me see you, J t Barrett. Yeah, they had three, they had Dwayne. All three of those guys right back, back to back.

01:30:10
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is way harder than I expected it to be.

01:30:13
Speaker 3: Troy Smith to you wanna.

01:30:15
Speaker 2: Put Kittle at tight end? Pepe grab the you can do the SEC team.

01:30:23
Speaker 3: Are they keeping track of this? You got you gotta have Joe Burrow. No, I don't know Cam Newton though his twenty ten season. Yeah, superman, Johnny.

01:30:34
Speaker 1: You guys do the SEC.

01:30:35
Speaker 2: We'll do the Big ten all time.

01:30:44
Speaker 1: Yeah, the number one greatest running back of all time and the Big Ten. I'm looking at Archie Griffin Ohio State. Yeah, that's big, that's big for the Big Ten.

01:30:56
Speaker 2: Okay, so we'll take him. We'll take and let me look at Uh. I'll do I'm gonna do linebackers.

01:31:09
Speaker 1: Oh, I'm almost assuming like again.

01:31:13
Speaker 3: And is this is this while they were in college?

01:31:15
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, maybe we just do a defense because for linebackers, you you can always pick like a like a Pensi squad. Yeah yeah, when they had uh, but.

01:31:26
Speaker 2: You probably want Arrington. Yeah, Michigan defense.

01:31:30
Speaker 3: If you're going full defense, yeah, if you're going full defense, I mean.

01:31:36
Speaker 2: Hay allottle bit yesh This is a way harder question than I wanted to. Yeah, shree Pass, is there a backup question? It's just too much, just too much brain power.

01:31:55
Speaker 1: We might have to all look at of all time best players.

01:32:01
Speaker 2: Ulton Mescoulton Mescos were the first players I met at Michigan and they made like the Ray guy, you got way too much playing time, Ray guy. Dude, he that uh that door was first made in twenty two and nine. He walked out and they're like, oh, it's big enough to wear a punter can and then first without warming up at the top. It was like the most deflating the Alcala Field House.

01:32:29
Speaker 3: Where we're talking to Mumford real quick.

01:32:31
Speaker 2: Yeah, we talk Mumford. Well, we'll wait till these boys we they find out that we're punny on this. So Mumford, I.

01:32:37
Speaker 1: Mean you got Charles Woodson.

01:32:38
Speaker 2: Yeah, what they can I as I'm kind of just over the question, honest, Yeah, yeah, this is little. Then entire episode is like, let's just figure out the best all time conference teams.

01:32:51
Speaker 1: I actually have a question for him about Mumford. No, no, no, no, Mumford, go ahead, stick on Mumford because.

01:32:57
Speaker 3: A question I won't forget about Mumford. You keep that picture. I'm not gonna forget.

01:33:02
Speaker 1: Give me three coaches you feel like you've learned the most from in real time now, like with the people you were inspired by and everything.

01:33:10
Speaker 2: Yes, Yeah, guys, we punted on this question, twisted question.

01:33:22
Speaker 1: Three coaches, three coaches he's learned the most from. Yeah, three coaches he's learned the most from. That's added the that's added value to the manifesto, big value.

01:33:36
Speaker 3: That's actually, yeah, that's that's probably the best way to Yeah, to ask that too. M hm. Kenny amount to Lolo Navy, head coach now at San Josis say winning as head coach football history, Chris Partridge, and I got two in mine. For this third spot, it's either Jay Harbor or Mike McDonald. And ironically all of those guys are in Seattle. I'd say Jay, I've spent more time around Jay.

01:34:19
Speaker 2: Those are the three that the manifesto the most.

01:34:22
Speaker 3: Yeah, just from observing them and and asking them questions and picking their brains.

01:34:27
Speaker 1: How many coaches knew you had this manifesto going? Uh not like manifesto? Like, Yeah, I think I.

01:34:33
Speaker 3: Think a lot of people just kind of knew. I was very organized and had a bunch of notes and pulled out ideas.

01:34:41
Speaker 1: Was any coach like curious, like, hey, have you been logging everything? Like, let's see this organization.

01:34:47
Speaker 3: I think every coach has their own system of notes, right, yeah, maybe not as organized, but I don't think people really think about it as much because they just kind of write down their note now, you know, once they realized, wait, maybe they're interviewing for a next job up or whatever and they need to organize everything. It's that's why I go back to like vision, the concept of vision itself, like when you picture yourself as that, you just start from the beginning like that. So you just organize everything as if you're the head coach and then you're ready for anything.

01:35:20
Speaker 2: I love it too, man, should we do to your talk? And then I have one final question.

01:35:26
Speaker 3: We gotta get a skip.

01:35:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, talk about so the boys just they got themselves.

01:35:31
Speaker 3: Our first game in a long long time.

01:35:33
Speaker 2: Let's give a shout out to Monthford and we say.

01:35:35
Speaker 3: A long long.

01:35:39
Speaker 1: Like, let's check it on conversiding that you just took an ass whoop in like sixty.

01:35:41
Speaker 3: Yeah. We also play like cast Tech and cas like the school in Detroit.

01:35:46
Speaker 2: Okay, Mounthford, you say it has been a long long time since you guys got a.

01:35:50
Speaker 3: W I think they won one game last year, none of the year before, and two the year before that, something like that. So you it's been rough.

01:36:00
Speaker 2: So you resign from Michigan and Momford calls up and says, please, for the love of God, do something for us.

01:36:05
Speaker 1: That is that how it happened.

01:36:07
Speaker 3: I know the head coach, and he asked if I wanted to be to DC. And then it's kind of all we only have like four coaches.

01:36:13
Speaker 1: So and you're thinking yourself, what a challenge, no doubt?

01:36:17
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you see the fucking doubt. What how has the defense gotten better since you've gotten there?

01:36:24
Speaker 3: Uh yeah, we all kind of coach everything. So I'm coaching all sides of the ball. Yeah yeah, and uh, for example, we have two offensive linemen in the entire program, no ship too, yep, So.

01:36:47
Speaker 2: Well, you have two players that play offensive line in the entire program.

01:36:50
Speaker 3: We have two true offensive linemen. So like our tight end, Norman Adams.

01:36:57
Speaker 1: Shout out.

01:36:57
Speaker 3: Shout outs to Norman could be a very recruitable tight end, had had to take one for the team and he's our left tackle. It gets better, guys, it gets better.

01:37:09
Speaker 2: Lane Johnson happened him are so last week.

01:37:14
Speaker 3: Every day it's like playing Tetris with the depth chart, and our starting slot had to be our right guard. In the game, we won.

01:37:23
Speaker 1: The right guard.

01:37:24
Speaker 3: Ye stepped up, Nate shout out to Nate, played right guard, got the dub. We ran the ball every play except one.

01:37:33
Speaker 1: All right, So you know it comes with its own challenges.

01:37:35
Speaker 3: There's a lot of challenges, a lot of challenges, and you know it's really turned into uh, guys taking sacrifices, right, Like, hey, what you know, some guys wake up one day thinking they're going to be the slot receiver getting some carries, and then they find themselves starting as the right guard.

01:37:56
Speaker 2: In the trenches.

01:37:57
Speaker 3: In the trenches.

01:37:58
Speaker 1: Crazy. You enjoyed about the high school level?

01:38:01
Speaker 2: How easy this sign sort of steal?

01:38:03
Speaker 3: No, there hasn't been a single sign. Oh we because so we we Right, obviously we have some challenges. We have two offensive linemen. I mean I could stop right there. So you got to be able to manipulate tempo right to your advantage. So and I can talk about this. I mean, no one's gonna have an answer for it. So you know, we with two offensive linemen, what do you do? Well, we do a lot of uh, I don't even know what you want to call. It's not even tackle over, it's like everyone over.

01:38:38
Speaker 1: So you just take the two offensive line, like, hey, you're gonna play on the left side.

01:38:41
Speaker 3: No, no, Like the center is the last guy on the line and everyone else is over there. But you can't just line up like that that. You can't just give them fifteen seconds to adjust. So we we use like five or six different tempos where you know, one of them is a speed break huddle. So we'll speed break to overloading one side and snapping the ball and three seconds. Like you're not gonna be able to adjust to that in three seconds, Well, speed break into like pods where we have just the center and quarterback, five guys over there, four guys over there. If you don't match your numbers, we're snapping it and getting it out. And we scored. We got a seventy five yard touchdown last week on that in the refs through a flag for twelve minute on the field, and I told her I got to stay on the field, stand in the fountain, yell at the ref count them. What do you mean twelve on the field, and they count them and then they go and have this meeting for like ten minutes, Like what are they talking about. There's eleven on the field. There's been eleven on the field, and then all of a sudden they change it from twelve on the field to five in the backfield.

01:39:38
Speaker 1: They're like, look, we're worried right now. How do we get out of this?

01:39:40
Speaker 2: Michigan State fans they.

01:39:42
Speaker 3: Saw you, and they're like, probably probably got it.

01:39:45
Speaker 2: We got to make sure this guy doesn't have success anywhere now.

01:39:47
Speaker 3: Yeah, but no, so we you know, we utilize tempo to our advantage, and then we'll go fast. You know, we'll go fast tempo and run a play real quick, and then we'll just go regular old tempo, take our time. Everything's on a wristband. They look at it when they get lined up, they run it, and then we'll go fast a game. But will hard count get them to jump first down? So we you know, it's like we had like a ten minute drive. We didn't even score half ended, but like, hey, last defense is not even being on the field. Uh, drive didn't even score with the half ended. It's so funny to the boys.

01:40:22
Speaker 1: What's your record right now?

01:40:23
Speaker 3: Uh, we're one to know starting this last week, let's go.

01:40:28
Speaker 2: Clos are one and oh.

01:40:30
Speaker 3: We've got three games left and we we actually could squeak into the playoffs if we win these last league. Well we're Division three, so we actually.

01:40:39
Speaker 1: Just beat a Division one team big time. Okay, Right, gotta get the kids.

01:40:44
Speaker 2: We gotta get kids eligible, we gotta get kids ready, we gotta get kids to buy into the program.

01:40:48
Speaker 3: Yes, and it is, you know, and I don't blame them. It's been tough, right, it's a it's a big culture shock. And uh when you are first three games were against like three juggernauts, and when they haven't won in a long time, you know, you know, you don't say this, but you kind of go in. You know, it's like it's like being a Max school playing uh, you know, Alabama or whatever, and you know you're you're you're prepping like crazy, but you know you're not shocked if you don't win, right, Yeah, And then week four, Week five, it was way more winnable games. We were in them, and it's just like we just got to get that win to help with the buy in and now that we got it, these.

01:41:33
Speaker 2: Guys are brought in, right, he's got to get another one against Southeastern.

01:41:37
Speaker 3: Big game on the road.

01:41:38
Speaker 1: Everybody show up.

01:41:42
Speaker 2: How is the student section from Mumford? Damn is Chandler Park Academy?

01:41:52
Speaker 3: They they that's homecoming. Yeah, I don't think that's a road game. No, it's supposed to be a home game.

01:41:57
Speaker 2: Okay, right now, the way up, that is wrong, I think so a.

01:42:01
Speaker 3: Lot of a lot of these scores are wrong too. By the way, there's one thirty to nothing. Renaissance scored three times. How do you get thirty points in three scores? Or maybe it was four scores in safety that they had four touchdowns.

01:42:12
Speaker 1: But we were hilarious.

01:42:13
Speaker 3: We were four for four on two conversion.

01:42:15
Speaker 2: I mean, cast Tech is like my freshman year.

01:42:19
Speaker 1: There was like that, Dan.

01:42:20
Speaker 3: Lewis, Yeah, that whole Yeah, that was like, whoever are.

01:42:24
Speaker 1: You guys scoreless up until the last week.

01:42:26
Speaker 3: We scored in the first game.

01:42:27
Speaker 2: Okay, but a shout up Momford, dude, shout up Mumford. That's awesome. That's all time. I'll get this last question and then we can go to your talk and then we'll close shop here. So there's obviously a lot of things that you are alleged doing legally illegally with that, well, nothing illegal you're allegedly people are saying.

01:42:48
Speaker 3: And bylaws, right, nothing against the constitution.

01:42:52
Speaker 2: Right, nothing is the contition. So there's a lot of things that people are saying that you did. Who else in the Bag ten are you aware of are doing the same things you're being accused of doing.

01:43:06
Speaker 3: I'm not there, so I don't wanna. I don't want to say exactly this is what this team's doing, this is what that team's doing. But there's a lot of Big ten teams. Who are you know at that level? It's Ohio State, Rutgers, I believe, Penn State, Uh, Indiana's really good. Those those are probably the top four in the Big ten. Who are We're all on the same level?

01:43:36
Speaker 2: Yeah, what is uh, just for Will Compton's sake, where is Nebraska their rank in the category?

01:43:44
Speaker 3: I'd say they're they're how many tiers are we talking here? Like if if you if you just say five tiers, they're probably tier two, tier three. They're not bad, they're they're good at protecting. So they got to know at least something.

01:43:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, Yeah, that's good. Yeah, and you're around that tier tier two, tier three.

01:44:04
Speaker 2: Yeah, in your time obviously we I we've already figured out that you know who hot of States Connor Stallions is. Did you ever trade information with them?

01:44:12
Speaker 3: Again, the only time was not directly. I gave something to give to someone, to give to someone to give to him to help him. Did they ever get that wins so you have them to help them?

01:44:24
Speaker 1: Did they?

01:44:27
Speaker 2: Did they ever approach Did anybody from Holose state of approached you about future teams or anything like that? Or was it kind of like we just don't talk to each other?

01:44:34
Speaker 3: No?

01:44:35
Speaker 2: Zero percent? Yeah, and Ohio State had the OG signals from somebody.

01:44:44
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean they they definitely were utilizing Stolen's signals well before we were. Definitely. So you're a where that goes back to the twenty eighteen twenty nine.

01:44:55
Speaker 1: You're aware of Dave Portnoy and his champagne bottles?

01:44:59
Speaker 3: What about him?

01:44:59
Speaker 1: Are you aware of them?

01:45:01
Speaker 2: So Dave has all of his biggest enemies in the world, he has champagne bottles, and when then they fall, he opens that champagne bottle and he drinks it.

01:45:09
Speaker 1: Who would be your number one champagne bottle.

01:45:12
Speaker 2: Team, life, person, anybody.

01:45:17
Speaker 3: It's gotta be ryandah, you know, yeah, it's your champagne.

01:45:20
Speaker 2: But that's your champagne bottle.

01:45:22
Speaker 1: I will tell you this. You're so bagrady to pop one open. You're just waiting for the dominoes to fall.

01:45:26
Speaker 2: We were in Columbus for a spring tour last year, right it would be Ryan Day.

01:45:31
Speaker 3: Yeah.

01:45:32
Speaker 2: Who would be your next champagne bottle?

01:45:36
Speaker 1: Yeah, because I've Ohio states, like that's your is moral and only number one? Yeah, who'd be your second champagne bottle?

01:45:43
Speaker 2: Person or team or let's say person, let's do person.

01:45:51
Speaker 3: That's gotta be up there, that would make things easier. I mean, I'm not a Michigan state and that's not a person. But I got nothing against uh Jonathan Smith. He's their new head coach. Yeah, I mean it was Mel Tucker before that was Mark D'Antonio.

01:46:18
Speaker 2: Antonio was a dog.

01:46:19
Speaker 1: He did a great job.

01:46:20
Speaker 3: I respect him.

01:46:21
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm not a fan. I will tell you this, I hate Michigan State more little House state.

01:46:27
Speaker 3: I'm right there with you. When you grow up in the state of Michigan, you're surrounded by spartan buck guys. So like nationally the game, right, obviously that's the game, and you prepare for that game all year, no doubt. But like when it comes down to like this is personal Michigan state for.

01:46:48
Speaker 2: The state title. Yeah, all right, Tier talk, so tear talk is I'll explain it to you. So we go through our top three talk. Okay, you've seen it. So you're gonna start with your tier three, then go to your here two than your tier one. Our tier talk today is best spies, not best spies or best spice, best spies. So I'm ready to go.

01:47:12
Speaker 1: Do we have a god teer? Do you want to say on three? One, two three?

01:47:19
Speaker 2: Okay, Connor Stallions will be our god teer. So Connor is our god tier spy. I'm ready to mm hmm character yeah, yeah, So I'll go first. My Tier three is going to be Sterling Archer from the show Archer. I think he's an alcoholic, but he always finds a way to get the job done. I think that show is incredibly well done. I I I just I love the show. He is a fantastic spy. My Tier two is going to be Jason Bourne. Jay there's been a argument on this bus for a long time. Who is it who would win to fight Jason Bourne or John Wick? My after what rewatching the Jason Bournes, It's clear as day. This guy just stays one step ahead of everybody. Now would be very interesting to see based on how technology is advanced as his movies came out, they're no longer doing flip phones, if you would be able to keep the pace. But he's my tier two and my tier one. Who would have been my god tier given that everybody else felt the same way as going to be James Bond. I think James Bond is the OG. I love the fact that every ten years or so they just recycle the storylines, new new James Bond.

01:48:37
Speaker 1: Everything.

01:48:38
Speaker 2: It is just it's all fucking time. It's all time. So that is my tier. Talk boys in the back buss you.

01:48:49
Speaker 4: Sneaky, all hyphenated, Get some rest, Pam, you look tired.

01:48:59
Speaker 5: Decent, fuck you Jack, technical, military, solid, k.

01:49:17
Speaker 2: You need one one more.

01:49:23
Speaker 3: I'm also trying to think of my three at the same time. Elite.

01:49:34
Speaker 2: Okay, all right, well yeah we we got there.

01:49:37
Speaker 3: I mean because I mean two two of my three are on there.

01:49:40
Speaker 1: There you go.

01:49:42
Speaker 2: I see Sterling archer that.

01:49:45
Speaker 1: Show. Mmm.

01:49:50
Speaker 3: Mi.

01:49:50
Speaker 1: Tier three is going to be Kim Possible, globally fighting crime do what seems like she's got a great personality. My tier two is going to be Harry Hart the Kingsman, special agent mentor to Gary Eggsy Unwin, and my tier one Sneaky. It's going to be the scout piece. In the board game Stratigo. You're able to manipulate this piece around and when it gets exposed, it's ultimately like you're you're trying to smoke out other pieces on the board. And I love Stratigo growing up, one on one just a chess match where you're trying to protect your flag kind of like capture the flag. You can place bombs around it and there then there are ranks from like one all the way to maybe ten, maybe eight. But then there's a scout piece I can kind of move around, maneuver around that you want to smoke out, and uh, I'm gonna go with the scout piece.

01:50:49
Speaker 2: Hyphenated front runner front runner.

01:50:52
Speaker 5: Almost dun dun dunnan, hyphenated first half, t.

01:51:04
Speaker 1: Hyph NATed lost me nerd whatever, bitches, bitches.

01:51:16
Speaker 3: Interesting, thank you, Yeah, you're up. I'm gonna go. Number three, Spy Kids, Okay, I was checking them out. Yeah, you know, it's one of the it's gotta be the first spy movie I've ever watched. Number two, I gotta go with James Bond and number one Born Like Born, You like Born over Wick.

01:51:54
Speaker 2: Yes, that's all I need to hear. Gay m hm oh yeah, Inspector gadget. It's a good one. It's a good one.

01:52:06
Speaker 3: There's a lot out there, though, there is well, the best ones you can't talk about, correct, Yeah, they museum, No.

01:52:15
Speaker 1: We did.

01:52:15
Speaker 3: I have been in the spy Museum. Well played, and thanks for coming.

01:52:23
Speaker 1: My one word.

01:52:25
Speaker 4: Manifesto detailed, pro calculative, classic.

01:52:39
Speaker 6: Classics hyphenated all business.

01:52:45
Speaker 1: Boy, this give a D plus.

01:52:50
Speaker 2: Really contacted you Friday. You're here on Monday. I really appreciate you coming in the insight everything it has been literally swept the nation, all the things that happened to come out of that manifesto of yours. We appreciate you taking the time to sit down with us.

01:53:03
Speaker 1: Yes, sir, and this is your first like long form interview since all of it, right, besides the document.

01:53:07
Speaker 3: Documentary, besides my nine hour master interview for the documentary.

01:53:11
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, man, thank you. This was I enjoyed every minute I would have I would have enjoyed being in the trenches with you and playing for you. I would have loved every fucking minute of it. Well yes, their coach, Yeah I need But also I know you want to give me the ball.

01:53:29
Speaker 3: Well maybe we can pull the guard and hand it off to him, no doubt. Southeastern watch out, South Eastern watch out.

01:53:35
Speaker 2: All right, boys, Big hugs, Tandy Kisses. Please subscribe to rate five stars and thank you so much for everything. Talk to you soon.

01:53:41
Speaker 1: Hey, that was incredible.

01:53:42
Speaker 3: Awesome.

01:53:43
Speaker 1: That was incredible.