NFL Media Summit with Kyle Brandt & Ian Rapoport

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Speaker 1: Be around the NFL podcast us more stacked than the a f C West from the beaches of southern California. It's around the NFL up Dan Jansas on a patio filled with some heroes, Greg Rosenthal, Mark Sessler, And here we are at the two thousand to NFL Media Summit from the low Santa Monica Hotel and Mark, you got that glow, You got that glow I'm in. I'm in a place that I simply enjoy at this point because we are under large umbrellas that shade us. A nice ocean breeze crosses our face. I'm watching grown adults on swing sets down on the beach right by the ocean. Um. The only thing missing is the fact that we're working versus at a in a leisure setting right now. Well, they're they're on the rings. They are not messing around. There's some high level gymnastics going on. Uh. As he said, not southern just just southern California. It's Santa Monica. This is my hometown now and I guess it's not my home, but it's nine years long. Um, and it's nice to have a home game. If I may be personal with you, gentlemen, for a moment um. I, as you know, native of New York, and when I was nineteen years old, I joined my uncle Stu and aunt Carrie and their children. Um, they invited me to a California trip. I had never been out to California before, so I got on the plane. Had really never been anywhere, um at that point in my life. So we got on the plane, came over here, stayed at this very hotel and too and it looks very similar as it did in right down to the the grasp patch right in front of the beach right behind us, right now where I remember playing whiffleball with Mike and Eric. Uh. And that started kind of a lifelong fascination in like a romance that I had for southern California. And I think it played a role in me eventually coming out here. I just have a kind of a romantic viewpoint of California as an East Coaster and it kind of started right here on that trip. Did you discover love? Did I discover love? I would say, no, you're nine. I was nineteen. Would not have been a prime, prime territory to have an adventure. Uh, yeah, it took me. I was never the guy and I ended up in a very good spot with a great woman, uh Emily. But when I was younger, it took me longer to figure out how to do those things. Um. And that meant also, like, you know, if you're the guy going on a trip to California, did you have a whirlwind romance while you're out there? No, that wasn't me as a team you were playing wiffleball were also I have had trips like that at that age. I'm I was when I first got out. I feel like that's that's the logical feeling. My first time out here wasn't until I was like for college internship or internship between college years, and it was like, I can't imagine coming out here and not thinking, oh my god, they let people live here, come come live here. Why wouldn't you think that's the weather? And just fell I just again, as someone from the other side of the country, just like people, I just like the vibe out here. And I still feel that way. I'm not I'm not a jaded California first time I came to California on not similar to yours because I was not put up in a hotel. I left Grand Central Station in New York City on a greyhound bus. Back then you could get a one dollar trip round trip to anywhere in the country. So I went to San Francisco. We got snowed in, um all highways snowed in and Cheyenne, Wyoming and had to stay in a hotel with all these greyhound people for three days. Then made it to San Francisco, but I had to pick my mom up um at Katona station and new outside of New York two days later. Three days later, so I had to get right back on the greyhound bus and go back. So I was in San Francisco for about seven hours. Oh my god, it's like the most insane story I've ever heard. Did you have any romance with any of the greyhounders? Actually there was, um, a woman who had a child, but she was like a single mom. But we wrote letters to each other for a couple of years after that, we wrote letters to each other. Um. All right, there you go, the little love letter to California. And here we are. Great show coming up today. We have guests Galore. Kyle Brandt, Emmy Award winning host of Good Morning Football, will join us in a bit also and listen. This is something that. I feel like we've been building towards and I'm a little nervous about how how it was going to play out. I was, but it's like we had to get rap Sheet and Greg together, preferably with microphones on. I mean by we building towards it, you're saying, I, Dan Hansas was building towards this wouldn't have happened. This was you and your l men. This is you bringing it together for the good of the podcast. Well, I think I like our friendship. It's beyond the just um content. No, it's beyond it's beyond content. I knew we needed to get the boys to gather mark and fireworks are expected. I think that, uh, when it's listened to, people will realize, against what Greg just said, that you had a higher purpose and uh, you know it's it's a must listen. It's a trench in combo alright, So you know, don't I know, now you're really interested how it goes, but don't fast forward. We got a lot of other things to get to, starting with any takeaways guys from the NFL Media summit. It does you know we used to uh we've been to about five or six of these things at least by now. Um, why don't we start here because it's always fun. Chris Westling rest in peace, good good man. Chris Westling. Um, he used to document the corporate jargon that was uttered at these events, and just a quick like idea of what it is. It's everyone that is on camera on Mike, that works on shows. Everyone's invited to this hotel for two days, and it's a series of speeches, seminars, uh, you know, breakout groups. Um, so it's middle management unloading a year's worth of meetings they've been to on us also, but right, and then upper management, I mean, okay, upper managed. It's the highest levels of management. And then there's also a lot of producers in and people behind the scenes to who are here who work on the shows where shadowy League figures step out of the shadows just for forty eight hours in June. And as a footnote, I adore the upper management figures people. Anyway, where's some corporate jargon? Okay, well my favorite this wasn't a corporate jargon. But I just thought, um that Operation Hoya was very intriguing because it was truly, uh, a company's secret plan, which may maybe I shouldn't say it, but I don't think that gives away anything. And I just love that. The the the company's secret plan was named Operation Hoya. But for more more corporate speak, in a lot of inflection, point, a lot of point um. There was a lot of when you have success, we have success, different variations of that. Emerging avenues. Emerging avenues was a good these are I think at some point these people view themselves um and again I adore them as creative types, so they find new ways of language to describe very mundane business tactics. We were we were in the A side session learning like best practices for social media. They had you know, people from Instagram and stuff, uh, and they were talking about, um, two fact and I was like, I was, I was thinking in my head two facts and that's just two factor the authentication. But you can't say a two factor you just go two factors total. You gotta say you gotta save that second half half of a second of say two factor and go to factors. And by the way, if I have to use a all time famous corporate jargon I learned here for the first time, I'm going to open up the kimono here and share with you power user I had. I don't know what it means, but it's a good one. We were separated into breakout groups too, so we didn't all have the same exact experience. I think they weren't um in any cases thrilling experiences, but they were differently all right. That's the best part of the of the summit is this. Those side groups we'll talk about maybe we'll talk about that later. Some are better than others. I heard this over and over. Um explosion of content, mm hmm, yeah, explosion. Actually, that's I think an evolution of fire hose of content. Yeah, well, it sounds even like a little bit less more. That's similar to what fire hose would come after the explore. That's similar to scalable content. There was a lot of scalable. You want the content to be scalable, alright, anything else. I liked when they would talk about and I'm not sure I totally understand this one, but it was uh they would say things that we would take on a lot of friction, which just hits me a different way. But they were talking about like, Okay, we're gonna enter into the marketplace, and there's certain aspects here that's gonna take on a lot of friction. Well that just sounds flu right, That's that's how I sort of took it. But it was a lot of It was a lot. You are sometimes known to create friction. The one of my favorite moments was at the very end of the seminar second day where you rose your hand during a like a town hall conversation with the highest of upper management and shared what I thought was a fair opinion about something to do with the event, and uh, the head top dog, the shadowiest of the shadowy league figures, responded, I could not disagree with you more. That was funny. And this was part two because there was a minor irritation from the high up execut towards Greg. Two days in a grow and this is Greg is a good parents. So he left to transport his children to summer camp. Greg right, okay, so summer camps. So yesterday he left without causing any No one seemed to know because it's like he could be getting up to getting glass of water. This time. It came right while this high up executive was, you know, getting land based with tough questions and as Gregg's sort of dismissively got up and rolled out of the room. Hyper stinky came from executive towards Gregg. So then this this, this, this lie encounter happened later about a couple. So it's just another figure. Greg just has so many people that he It's one of your great skills. Greg. Also the point that you made, and it's too esoteric for the audience to care about, and we should keep it a little bit behind the kimono. But Greg's point that he made after the top official on stage disagreed with Greg. Sitting directly behind me, Michael Irvine, who was either much of much of the seminar either sleeping or talking on a cell phone, and the low volume um he was just saying, as the answer is being given, shooting down Greg's point. He was going, yep, ye, that would never work. This is here's the thing. Though, I had many people come up to me and appreciate what I said, because I was speaking to a lot of reporter right now, I get it, But I'm saying, Mike, Michael was in the minority among the talent and producers that were there, because all I was voicing was a frustration with this event in particular, and how he could do a better job with it in the future and as a company. And it was the exact same thing that literally every not every not literally every, but many other people were all talking about throughout the weekend. And I heard a lot of people after, and I heard one of the top executives come up after and almost was Apologeck and he's like, I tried to push that same same idea and it got shut down, and he talked to himself to not be worried. But but this made me more worried. If he hadn't said anything. He's like, just making sure you're okay. Though I liked there was one very talented female reporter that texted me what during Greg's fraucus? Justice for Greg, so I you did have support inside the um, but God's wrong with me that I'm Once you realize you're the person that keeps getting into confrontations with people at work, and some that's something to look You have to look at what's the problem you are. You're potentially the B line. But I had another prominent podcaster at this company during Greg's confrontation text me two words odd fight because it was and since I brought up my I didn't say who it was. You want to hear one more Michael Irv because he's the best of these. And I gotta give Michael Irvan credit. The man is a three time super Bowl champion. He's a legit, like one of the more well known sports personalities in America. He's at this event both days, every minute. Okay, I'm not saying he's totally plugged in. He's sitting directly behind me. And it's just that's that's true of all the time talent. And he's so he's so famous, he could be totally checked out, but sometimes all of a sudden, he's super checked in. And at one point they were showing a like a chart that was plotting like the traditional TV usage trends, and and and then why do we need that? The guests and the and the speaker was like this is really amazing, and then out of nowhere, Urvan, who I thought was sleeping, goes, yes it is. Wait, he's paying attention to the usage chart. I think he probably had like he was. He was just like the same way on this show with sound bites towards a certain person, they're just maybe Michael Irvan sound bites that he'd pressed play on to make people think he was he had a marked SoundBite. You could just play it at will. I have plenty, just pick one one just for fun. Oh yeah, I'm with myself. Also we get that mark, we get there, so you will be Urban would be a weird would be high on my list of players or other on air personalities that I would take in a draft of the breakout room. So we get divided into three different breakout rooms, and then we go into a bunch of different sessions. And I've learned over over these years and we've done these. We've done a lot of these. Now that that's to me, that's the best part of the couple of days because that's where some tough questions are being asked, where uh, some upper management's feet really get put to the fire. Um. Urban would be high on my list just for like the comedy of it. He would maybe be fun in those I had a great We had a great room, Like I had a lot of people that I would draft high, Like who would you be your first draft pick? If if you're taking people for those if I wanted like hard hitting questions, anything anything, give me Jim Trotter interesting, I enjoyed Mike Garifolo as always. But I my, we had Steve Smith in the room and Kurt Warner, and I was sitting next Steve Smith and Court Warner. I was kind of like fanning out a little bit, to be honest. It's just like these guys are still basically in the locker room sometimes in these sessions, and they speak their mind and Kurt Warner takes like the quarterback encouraging quarterback leadership role. But then Steve Smith does the Steve Smith thing. He'll go on a ten minute ran that totally takes the speaker and dissembles them. We're hoping. Yeah, Steve said always very nice to the to us around the NFL show. Get familiar with him. We spoke with him. He he, like many of the players, get very early flights, maybe even before the whole thing's over. And he was out of here, but he said he's gonna be in l a quite a bit this fall and then it will be coming on the show working on that. We'll justin handled reaching out to Steve Smith. Yeah, and then you have to record those conversations. Um Claibron would be very high on my list of the side bringing up. Just one quick note. Claibron was sitting next to who are you guys sitting next dude during the summer. I was next to Jeremiah not Jeremiah was next to Cynthia and m J D. I was next to Taylor Bishatti Uh and Ian Rappaport who never showed up on day one in the seat but he was here today. Wow. I was next to D'Angelo Hall and then Mark Ross, the former Giants. So Claibann is next to Michael Irvin and I I wish Claiborn was here because I got to talk to him about this. By the end of the second day, every time Irvin would say something and laugh uproariously, he would like lean back and like make eye contact with Claibon and then claiban By the end of it, he was like the Ed McMann to Johnny Carson, like Claiborn was like, ah, you are correct sir, and they were just having a great time together. We did that. I enjoyed that. That is amazing. Claibon, who I basically stole his question when when I was annoying the executive just things that he had been talking about but had the worst take of all time and used. It made me happy that even the one of the great takesmen of our time, Claibann, could have bad takes, which was that there are as many men's small items of clothing at stores as men's large and extra large. And I was just saying, you don't know the plight of the small man, like if you legitimately think that, And he fought hard on this, and I was just like, this is this is nowhere near He's wrong because large extra large and then you're searing like in most men as small as me, they almost don't want to admit it, so they're wearing mediums but they're too big, and it's like it's not a good fit. Inside your world, it's different. This is why you gotta outfit yourself. When I make that trip to Tokyo. Judy Batista, by the way, a great person. In those rooms, we had a great room. Willie becomes a different Willie mcguinnis, and um, you get you get a real Willie, a little different than a t a Willie. Willie was amazing. Colleen Wolf will just throw in one singer would just be like, hey, would you consider having women on the NFL draft coverage next year and just see the executive faces belt off at that question. The blood drained from the faces. That's important. You want to add value in these rooms. It's cool though, I think. Uh, I hope this is interesting to the listeners. Maybe. Then again, it's it's the middle of June. So how many how many comments did you make Dan during the breakout sessions? Uh? I said two words. Yeah. I decided that anything I would say would probably only decrease my merit in the room because it was again it was high up executives that weren't even sure why I was there potentially, right, I like to throw in one or two. And I moved on from my annual how are you going to monetize podcasts question? Because we're on the right track that that's gotten more respect um and I do. Before we move on, I just want to give a shout at this someone we've mentioned on this show before, Ali bon Puri had a moment. Uh. He he is our writing editor and a lot of the people who were in front of the lectern and had a microphone. Uh didn't really deliver and it was a tough first morning, I would say, just saying it was kind of I don't think that's necessarily fair because it's task. It's boring, though, and Ali came up there and was universally regarded as the best speaker of the entire process and got a rousing ovation. I mean it was it was something, and it did something very smart because he came up right away he lowered the microphy A very tall individual for him, he lowered the microphone like half a foot. Acknowledge that that was emasculating. Um then basically said I don't do speeches, so I've written it. And then he just perfectly read this amazingly thing with the sea and then you kind of coming from the heart. That was good watching him. Going back to fourteen, I just wanted to maybe we are now reaching the point where the listeners don't care. But I didn't wanted him greg, because you do find yourself often in conflict. If there are things to take away from a bump party in that spot, like how to get your point across without not wanting people to smack you on the side of the head, Well that's a different setting making like a speech, and I've definitely had some bad ones of those two. So what if you could leave to a rousing. I've had good ones, bad ones. We're gonna stick a pin in this because I know we got to settle something for Greg a little later in the show. But do we want to do you want to get caught up on any news or do we want to get right to it? I let me spin through real quick the news and then let's get to it. We're gonna do some o t a round up on Monday, I think, so do you want to do it as quickly as real quick? I just want to Uh, this is a At one point, there was a conversation about the NFL brother fraternity and there was a term old head that's thrown around for the guys that are, you know, out of the league for an extended period of time, and the younger guys look at the older former players as old heads when they come with critical takes about how the game's not the way it used to be. But that's going on forever. So as Gerald mccoyo came to guests speak about NFL players inter acting with the media, and he clarified that an old head as if you played before the year two thousand. Because Ladani and Thomlinson asked like who's an old head and like LT is fine, but Kurt Warner, Michael Irvin LT came in right around two thousand h I mean he's on the fringe, but you wouldn't define him that way. LT, by the way, is a guy and maybe because of his jet ties and my favorite jet game ever against the Pats in two thousand eleven, he was a prominent player. He's a guy that I kind of still get like a guy that we work with that I get a little like starstruck, LT, urban Um, Kurt Warner, Steve Smith in a way. I want to get to know Steve Smith. That's why I love to have him on the show because he's just such an interesting, thoughtful, outspoken I think the interest in a friendship would be equal from his standpoint. One of West's favorite players. I'm not talking about friendship. Well, no, I'm saying I was speaking with him, I sensed actually like him and Kyleen are are a good buddy. So that's a good sign of of a of a man and uh maybe West's all time favorite player. Over the course of our podcast with Steve, time for news and notes presented by up Work, where you can build the team that will build your business. Learn more from up work dot com. All right, here we go a couple of things, couple of things, and you know, jump in if you care, and if you don't, I'm gonna keep moving. Make a Fitzpatrick signs a four year extension. He becomes the highest paid safety in NFL history, thirty six million guaranteed at signing. Terry McLaurin, this is something kind of interesting. He's sitting out mandatory minicamp with the commanders. Ron Rivera says the deal will get done. Speaking of Ron Rivera, did you know that he had a copy of the First Amendment Freedom of Speech? Uh, sitting on his desk, and he said that he's read it over and over again when deciding what to do about Jack del Rio, who made the comments on Twitter. I believe it was or in the press friends, Uh, talking about all sorts of nonsense. And he said, before he decided to find Jack del Rio, who, by the way, he has since deleted his social media, he read it over and over again, the First Amendment. I just don't know what's going on. Watching the commanders do things um in their own way. I feel like there's a lot going on. They started to take command? In your opinion, where are we at at the level command of what just they started? Are they getting ready to maybe, as we all know, decided to really go ahead and start to take command. Where are we at? What's the percentage? Would you say, zero to one hundred? Like one d full command? Zero is you don't even know what command is? Okay, oh this lower than that, but yeah, that's it's low, it's ron Rivera said. He also had the second did you just start talking without your signature drop? You know? That's I feel like it's been established by this point. You're doing great? You right? Um? He said. He also had the Second Amendment printed out on his desk to read over and over again for whatever. First of all, it's not that complicated. Read the first five words. You're you're pretty much good on on the first Amendment? Can you read both of the amendments at the end of the show? Sure? Just kidding, um, all right, Terry McLaurin is a really good player, and they should get a deal done with them. But I just don't, you know, you don't know what's going on that organization. And they've said since like a week into the off season, it was the top priorities. DK Metcalf also skipped their camp last week. There's Rodney Hudson was won for Arizona. There's a decent amount of players skipping. And remember Carson Wentz is there now, and as you know, as you just heard, uh, you know you wanted him to be working with the star wide receiver of the team. I'd also want to sign a contract before you spend a year with Carson Wentz. M Let's that's not provoking very good Mark, That's that's a great point, Mark, Thank, I was legitimately saying it was a great point. Mark thinks we were making fun of point when I say something that actually provokes your thought that it must be verbalized like it's such a rare occurrence, so condescending it just stops the entire room. Good point. That's a good that That actually was a good point, too, much better than the point DJ texted to then odd fight. You know I think odd Fight was on points. That's a fair That's a fair Jerick McKinnon back to the Chiefs on a one year deal. So watch out, Clyde Edwards Hilaire, there are no more free passes for you, Bud. They got rid of Daryl Williams too. Some moments for them. Colts fourth year safety Carry Willis announces his retirement to go into the ministry. Kind of a cool move, go to God, young man. I mean, it's absolutely something that takes a lot of integrity and belief in what you're doing and and a surprise to the cults. He's only been in the league three years and he's been a starter the whole time and was going to be a starter this year. They have Julian Blackman coming off a big injury too, So h has some real world recussions for the app slutely and that was news and notes presented by up work where you can build a team that will build your business learn more upwork dot com. That was like, that was the closest we've ever had to like a throwaway news segment, just like a quick here's another corporate speak that um that it would not that new segment would not qualify. Did you guys hear that the live games that that they're gonna put on the new NFL Plus is the hero content, Which I don't know, that's kind of our thing. We are the hero content, well not unless we that is something we should probably trade not in their eyes potentially, right, And now they kept saying that like we're just gonna we're gonna focus on the hero content, and I'm just sitting there being like, we're right here, I'm here. It does remind me that it's been a while. I'm a little disappointed since I got a tweet like, how dare you refer to yourselves as heroes when the real heroes are out there on the battle field texting your First and Second Amendment rights? Alright? That is that is the stance. It's been a while. I'm just saying it's been a little bit since I got that tweet. Uh. And okay, before we talk with Kyle Brandt, let's share an update the Dalton Scale, which anybody who checked out that episode, thank you very much. We all. Patrick Clayban included the Ed McMahon to Michael Irvin's Johnny Carson. I wish I had seen all that they're doing. The laugh it was the handshakes and it was like awesome. I was like, wow, look at you do not want to be in the front row for this. Colleen had the worst possible seat, front row middle. I was front row, and you miss a lot so the four of us um with Patrick talk Dalton scale who was the new Prime Meridian. We each nominated a player and then we put it to a vote and justin we got over five thousand votes on read it and Instagram. You want to share the results? Yes, So Kirk Cousins was the run way winner with that was Mars. That was Mark's nomination. Just don't believe it. I understand why. I think the public believes that. I know, but the public is often wrong. And this did not incorporate the hundreds, literally hundreds of comments received on Twitter and Instagram with people just like spouting off their choice. They probably voted though too. They may have, but they a lot of people also took issue with like one or two names on the list where it's like just chill out, you know, like if you don't worry about the list. It wasn't really about the list, Like Patrick Mahomes is behind Josh Allen or whatever, don't worry about that. That's not what this exercise was about. God forbid. They lack context. As Claiban explained on the last episode, lists yeah uh, and his nomination, Ryan Tannehill came in second point five percent. That Winston, who Gregg nominated eleven point three percent. Like, I'm going to take third as a victory because you guys all dismissed it so much that at least I was ahead of one of you guys and Matt Ryan only nine point five percent. And I think people took just thought he was too good, took issue with the fact that he doesn't reflect Andy Dalton as much because he had such a high peak and now he's coming down, whereas Dalton was kind of steady average. I think it's a fundamental disconnect with the exercises about because I'm not saying that Matt Ryan was anything like Andy Dalton. He was. He was a all Pro, he was an m v P, should have won a Super Bowl. But I'm only talking about the here and now, so I'm not factoring anything else than who Matt Ryan is now. I could see, though, I could see why people struggle because I think part of it is Andy Dalton. But I also think people think Matt Ryan's too good still, and he Andy Dalton was the Dalton scale his entire career. Matt Ryan was an m VP candidate four years ago. I mean was he was a fantastic player, that went to a Super Bowl, so it kind of defied I think if you're just looking at the the tabulations numbers, especially with this particular player. But I get hung up on the last two seasons. Cark Cousins is having touchdowns, okay, interceptions, and it's like that's the that's the primary, but he's also the picture of frustration in a way that we can't quite you know. I can be swayed on some things in the way that the listeners voted and the way Mark put the case, and the more that I thought about it, he does embody the Dalton scale in some way. And the more I thought about it, there's more good quarterbacks now, I think then back then. So maybe that's a little part of the Dalton scale to that. Yes, Cousins has those great numbers, but where did you end up ranking him? Like fourteen fifteen that's where Dalton used to be back in the day, and like, uh, it's hard, you're now, absolutely, but the bar is sort of higher of what the middle is of where you need a new guy, And um, I think the listeners kind of convinced me that Cousins makes total sense right now and he's gonna ease into that for the next few years possible. I stand by it. I think give me a year or two. Cousins has to come down a little bit, But I stand by Jamis Cousins the most James. I don't know about the Jamis one. You're just high on Jamis for some reason. You always have been. I don't think that's that high. The point is it's right in the middle. You need a new one if you've got. If we had to meet in the middle, I think Tannehill was a place we were willing to go. He came in second. Ye. I think we were willing to go there as a group. All the men in the NFL to lift up by choice, you can. You often go back to Jameis Winston. Why I'm not lifting him up, but he has uh some nice quarterbacking skills. That's when he's on the field. Right in the minute. All right, let's take a break, and when we get back, one of my favorite people in NFL media, Mr Kyle Brand. All right, time to welcome a great man, a champion in the realm of sports media. I mean, the man has a trophy and it is a Sports Emmy for his work with the rest of the team at Good Morning Football All Now, he rejoins us on the Around the NFL podcast, What's Up, Kyle Brand, Hello, my friends, thrilled to be here, especially specifically here geographically where we're sitting right now. This is like when like the Brady Bunch goes to Hawaii, you know, like they do those special episodes, Remember the Sievers went to Hawaii wants and growing pains, And this is the heroes go to go to California on the beach. You look great, I feel great. You feel like a natural here. I don't think we've ever done a podcast with you in person, unless I'm just like misremembering. But you have a big shoes to fill because you know your co host Pete Treger was here last year. I believe it was the last time we did it in person, and he awkwardly held a microphone wrapped up with a towel. We still the hot, burning sun, so we're not in a nice shaded area, and then we have the Pacific Ocean over our beautiful here at the low Santa Monica Um resort or hotel. Is it a resort, doesn't matter, Kyle uh. When Treger was here, Mark awkwardly asked Treeger who we respected the most, and then Treeger gave an honest answer and said, Greg highly did you have any rational awer? Everyone was a little surprised by it. There was no irony to it, um and he did have a rational I think he basically just explained that Greg and Gregg's football passed allowed that respect to be greater than what he felt for. At the same time, like in that there was a very easy non answer to give there he chose to give the answer. Now we settled that beef with him. Now there's another one to settle. Uh. Do you remember when you were down under for a project you were working on. A massive NFL fan, also fan of your show g M F B A t N approached you. He was an actor and you told the whole story and television and then uh, when you referenced our show what happened, I'm nervous and this is how you described it, Dan Gregg, all the guys and you need to know and I know you and Mark know each other professionally, it's more than personally at this stage that that's something that's stuck with Mark for easily for me for a loop because it's not It's not as if it's such a large ensemble that it would be hard to remember the other guy. Um, but it it does. It sticks with me still. But I am a person who believes in ironing out these things. And I really feel nothing but good feelings for you. You You didn't you don't think you felt? Well? How did I say it? And all the guys just like, oh yeah, e t n Dan, Greg, guys, let's hear it again, just in case, Dan Greg, all the guys, Damn, that's a tough beat. It really. I feel like the second you were teeing it up, Dan, I knew where this was going. It was only a matter of which name did I leave out. You know, I'm gonna immediately relate a couple of Super Bowls ago, when it was Bucks versus Chiefs, Burlison was doing the thing where he was interviewing like Brady and Mahomes and like before the game, and Brady at the end made this nice comments like he nay, I love the show that you guys do. I love you know you and Peter and Kay like just a great show. And so I relate and I empathize and like, I just I took that one right between the eyes from Brady. You just had to take it from me in Australia, probably like hung over something, but I still apologize. I accept your apology, and it's what I like about this is that I've now had a minor rift with two members of Good Morning Football and had then we solved it and got out of it too. Well. You know what, there's only two left, so you got the full set, guys, that's it. You have the complete box set. And I'd like to be a mediator on efforting right now here at the low Santa Monica to get Greg Rosenthal and Ian Rappaport together to work out some differences they're dealing with right now. But I feel like this one is squashed and we're good, so we can What differences do you guys have that you're the same person, Like, there's an amazing that that was more problematic than anything that you said about Mark Um, But we awkwardly started to bridge that gap at a premixer that award that Dan and Mark were too big to even show up to lost. Oh yeah, that's a fun premixer too. You guys missed out, you know, we here were two days and before we get I have a couple of questions, Kyle. We don't have a lot of time, and we're in the middle of this talent summit and we were told we're making you work at break everyone else wants to do. If he wasn't, if he was at the lunch right now, and Kyle, tell me, if I'm wrong, you would be subjected to a lot of awkward small talk with a bunch of people like me personally. This this makes it even better because now I don't have to do things like that that make me uncause maybe Kyle, you're more an extrovert, perhaps, but they're all over. If I was not here, I'd be sitting here and having Scott Hanson asked me how my kids are, which I respect Scott, it's really nice, but like here we're making some contents. So, oh, Scott, who tried to cut us in line today? When you know that very nice, Let's let's let a lot of beefs. It was not the buffet line was they're giving as suits this year, I think in this contract and now they're like, this is not going to trump up a ton of sympathy with the listeners, but we're getting very expensive free suits from the suits were scheduled for eight fifty, right and Greg right on time. Mark not your typical was roll in like with your aviators on a Hansen, rolls in close to eighty and he tries to get in front of us and Greg, to your credit, you gave it to him a little bit, did you. I was just saying, you are not cutting in front of us, and maybe it gave it to him a little too much. Like I was like, if you were as if you were a little less condescending when you came in here trying to then maybe we would have allowed. I must tell you one nice thing he did because we're you know, I'm wearing a sports code down as Dan. We had to take this one off to get fitted by a very elegant clothing person and Scott Scott nicely hung up this jacket I'm wearing on a hanger and smoothed it out. So he's not a total He's a very nice man. But he tried to say like he had some appointment or something like that. I was like, no way, are you. We're all here for the same thing like we would have been there ten Scott said he's taking a flight um out of the country. And he has all of our episodes queued up for the flight, which if it's true, Wow, and he's gonna get to this and then we're gonna have beef with Scott. But let's let's get back. So Kyle again, congratulations on the Emmy. I introduced you as a champion. Do you when you won? When you're at the event and they announced good Morning Football, and this was kind of like you weren't the Susan Lucci now the category if anyone gets that reference, but for many years that was the territory of P T I I believe. Uh So when you guys finally get over the hump and win it, do you feel like you won the Super Bowl? And away? It was through Yeah, listen that you go to the Sports Emmys and people call him the Sports Emmy is sort of to separate them from the real Emmy's, and people say it's political and it's it's overdone, and they that that that, and I don't care. It was awesome. We we got a big gass trophy. And if you know the actual Emmy trophy, it is ridiculously over the top. It is like an angel holding up the earth. It's so opulent. It's there's no subtlety to Emmy Trophy. So I got that and you get nominated, Like all right, so it's it's p t I just like Seminal program. We all grew up watching Sports Center, Dan Patrick, Rich Eyes and and it was Bamani Jones up there, who Beamanti has just characteristically kind of underspoken, it's what he does. And so he just pulls out and said, good morning football, and I lost. I lost my mind, Peter, and I actually screamed in the audience. H We're sitting right behind Mike Tarico, who would go on to win for like Best Host or something really prestigious. It was unbelievably cool, and like I just I remember having like, um, if we lose again, which we this would be our third time, not like have a cool losing face. Like sometimes these guys go crazy. I remember when Burt Reynolds lost for Boogie Nights. He lost to Robin Williams and he was clearly piste off. The most famous one is Bill Murray for lost in translation, like had this terribly like a sour face because he lost, and I'm like, just have a cool face, you know, like just be like yeah, you know, sometimes they are too happy, like it it's a little too much, like they go crazy for the person now and then it's too much. We we've been in similar situations though, Kyle, we know that feeling. Um When the two thousand thirteen Stitcher Awards Best New Podcast was stolen by our producer after she had it delivered directly to her house after she had already left the company, that was like a similar type of vibe that we felt. That was not a unique because we got the experience of winning and losing at the same time. I mean, we we grieved together as a group through that, and but it's still stings. I can tell its stings, and you know what does haven't won anything since it's fine you will maybe for this episode we got the sweet vindication. My biggest takeaway from the Emmy is that finally, once we cut the dead wood of Nate Burlison, we were able to win. So like two nominations with Nate no wins, Nate leaves immediate win and so I don't think that's a I don't think that's a coincidence. And we're a quarter of the way to egots Me and Stragor the Tony is going to be next. There you go. Now I want to play another thing here. Of course, Kyle stole the draft with his ramp up and pop up speech about the Buffalo Bills. Here's a little portion of it. In my hands. I hold the most important pick. Look this entire round, because this pick is the only pick who will win the Super Bowl in his rookie year. And Kyle, Now, it did cross my mind. And again we sung your praises on the show when this happened, because it was really fun and well done, and the ramp up to get to the location just masterfully played, sir. But I did think to myself when you took the bite of the chicken wing at the very end, if that got caught in the gullet and you went down and you didn't come back up. We've talked about this, Greg with other things, that what would be the appropriate amount of time that would pass before people would kind of be able to make fun of how Kyle we lost? Kyle? Oh that is it for him? Yeah? If I died on stage right, that choking on a chicken wing is part of the Bill's bit. You know what I say, William Wallace, every man dies, not every man really lives. You know, if that's how I'm gonna go, I'll go down in my zubas on stage. It's fine, right, So that's like the Saturday. That's Saturday, right, or that was Friday, that was Friday nights, second Monday nights. Total axis. That's given enough time, like c block, just have a little fun. That feels appropriate, right, Willie and and car just chopping it up a little bit. We've also we've alten asked if we were, you know, go down in a plane crash. Yeah, what what block of total access would we even be? Would they mention that? Would it just would it be the crawl underneath? Maybe? Would it? Would it be mentioned in the block? I think? But if you if you died announcing uh Baylor linebacker to Rolle Bernard, like that's how you went down? I believe national story it is. I want segments done on it. I want Good Morning Football to do in or out Kyle's death. Did we like it? How did you play? I want to do a breakdown. I want to do it. Peter can do angry deaths in my homage with a with a with a scepter, I please make fun of me if that ever happens like J. J. Reddick, is, you know, making fun of stephen A for being insensitive about it the whole thing. It would be amazing now, and let's talk about it. Because you do what you guys do for g MFB. We go through the off season, but we don't do five days a week. We don't do three hour shows like you guys do. And I'm curious because you're a Chicago guy, um, and yet you've you've kind of gravitated towards the Bills. How did that happen? First of all? Is that just from kind of falling for the team as as part of the NFL network machine? Or Um? Where did how did you become a Bills guy? How did that just organically? Like we you talk so much about the teams for so many shows and for so many hours. It was a couple of years ago, and I just like, I started getting worked up and I was hyping the Bills and I liked them, and I was teeing into all those people not believing in them. And so you do some sort of rant and then people online like it and they're like, do another one, and then they win and then then the tea was like will you do one officially for us, and I said sure, and so everyone's like, everyone will be like, dude, like I had no idea you were from Buffalo, and like, not only am I not from Buffalo, I have never been to Buffalo in my life. I've never visited the city at the time. And then he's just kind of snowballs. And so now people like, oh, so you're a Bills fan. I'm not a Bills fan. I'm not. I don't care if they lose. I'm an enthusiast for the team. I'm not a Bears fan either. That you guys can just like divide that right as people in the media, like you like certain teams, sure, but like it's not like you're an eight year old with the hot dog in the stands and you're gonna cry if they lose, and they are they are like that. I don't know. I agree. I think that's a fun and healthy way to work in the NFL too, Like I think West had that as well. It's how the team of the Around the NFL podcast first came up, as like we really like that two thousand and thirteen Panthers team or I don't remember which it was, it was one of the cat It was one of the Cam Newton teams, and we sort of like organically, you wait and see which team is kind of you know, floating your boat that season, and then you jump on board and you have four Also were five of those. Because you like football and they're attracted to you, and you're gonna be at work sunny. It makes that Sunday more fun and it doesn't have to be as heavy either. You don't have to be like crushed when they Let's be real though it would never the team would never be picked unless West was behind it. It was essentially the team of West right and also and also Gregg using the terminology or using the phrase fun and healthy way like, don't be condescending just because Mark and I ride or die with our teams are until something happened, I just you you can handle it better emotionally. But I don't cry. There's moments, yeah, I don't cry. It was close after the week seventeen Jets loss and we had to do a show afterwards. Dan was not That was the greatest act of professionalism that's ever been seen on the programs. Are you on any text threads with Bills players? Are they are the players themselves aware of your not fandom but enthusiasts. Um, I DM just a little bit with Josh Allen a little bit. Like we we've met a couple of times. We've had a couple of conversations. So like, um I met Josh Allen's father in the airport, Joel Allen, who, as you know, is a farmer from Fireball, California. Like that is a man, big gass handshake, super nice to meet you, canned ham Mark McGuire, four arms, like just exactly like you would think. So I know them just a little bit. But other than that, Like, no, it's not really like one little follow up. Are are the Allen's Excuse me? I was impressed with your summertime, bod as I am. You're looking very sharp and you've been on this mission for a while, but it's an impressive physically. I'm surprised it took you so long as we get to this. Thank you for saying that. I noticed he had he has notes in the In the first Kyle's Body, he wrote it down like he wasn't gonna remember during the media sum it says Kyle's Body. You can put your signature on that Thank you very much. Mark, thank you. I'm sure you have other better things to talk about than my body as a Bills fan. Wait, first of all, who's that second round pick that you announced it? It's gonna be cool. You're kind of attached to him his career, and it's good that you didn't die, because then he would have that sort of hanging on him, like if his career didn't go, he would have to do it for you. So that's good. You guys will be connected. Do you think though that this offseason them sort of being the team and and I don't push back against this conventional wisdom that they are kind of the team going into the season. They should have won the super Bowl last year. I think if you replayed how it went, they to me were the best team at the end. It just didn't work out that way. Now they're the favorite. Like their fans get upset if there's like our list where they're not number one, or if their quarterback or their defense is even ranked number three, it's getting it's a lot and just knowing how the NFL works, it just even looking at the Bills last year, the expectations were sky high and the offense coming into it didn't quite perform at first. Is there any certain And you're looking at this team kind of going into this season of eight you kind of have to handle the expectations as the heavyweights, but you actually haven't won in anything yet. It's one of the toughest spots to be It's almost being like a Super Bowl runner up. Yeah, Greg, it's terrifying. Are you kidding me? They the first game of the season is five miles from here against the Rams. They could easily lose that game and then the guy is falling already, And it's like, I'm trying to think of a team like they just never really want anything and that have expectations this high, like if if they if they get to the title game this year and like lose on the last second field, which an amazing season, that is a bitter, soul crushing loss and a terrible wasted season in the eyes of the Bills fans. So yeah, like they're loaded, and we all agreed that they're loaded as hell, But um if I I did a quarterback ranking the other day because June and uh I had like I had Rogers one and Alan second, Like they're like, I guess you're off the bandwagon, you're out. You're like, hold on a second. I got him above Mahomes, above Brady I just because he's second. They were furious. So like the sensitivity is going to be really fun to play with because if they start out like three and two fine disaster, like the world is burning lecture, the pressure would build and they don't want to hear it. But there's like a just statistically there's probably like a thirty percent chance they don't win the division either that they're playing a road game to start the playoffs. Everything went so right the last two years because that's how the NFL is, Like I think they are the best team, Like they would be my pick to win the Super Bowl. I'm not really even pushing again, but that's just sort of that's just how the NFL goes. They were ranked tenth in UM D v O A UM last year, which people kind of forget about because how awesome they closed and Alan was just unstoppable, uh in the playoffs. Um, but that is the one thing that would be on my radars Ken Dorsey taken over Brian Dable, what what happens there? Because there were If you really want to drill in on their season last year, then I know you were uh that they really struggled and it's last year with table, so now another year the division should be better. It's not a slam dunk, So it's it's gonna be maybe not to not to you know, get down on the Bills at all, but if you're a Bills fan, this season maybe won't be as quote unquote fun as the last couple because the expectations are so high that you're just expected to be back at the game. You got eliminated that last year, but you gotta win that game and the one after it. How about when Josh Allen met Josh Allen. Can't have that happen now, that's kind of cool. Yeah, the Jaguar thing, right, Yeah, yeah, they didn't have a moment. They The thing that I think my bottom line with the Bills in the off season is like if they did not add Von Miller, if they did not draft any players, I still think they're going to be the Super Bowl favorite. I still think they were like those things were all I'm rich, screw it purchases, Like someone who like is just gonna get heated floors in their bathroom because they can afford to like, you don't need to get von Miller, but we're gonna do it anyway. Also, we're gonna draft a punter because he's the best punter anyone's seen in twenty It's full on, like it's one per center. I'm gonna get a walk in humid or because I don't know what to do with my money, so I'll buy stupid stuff that I don't need. They're that loaded. They something changed in their season about halftime of Tampa before that, oh my god, the offense really wasn't the Bill's offense that we kind of remember it as. And and my big thing with them that I'm worried about is whenever you go into a season, it's like everything is great except for the offensive line. It's like, well that's that's a problem. And to me, like on paper, they're probably average, and there's a scenario where they're significantly below average offensive line, and that's just like, it's not gonna torpedo your season. But then you're just one of like seven a FC teams that has a chance that seems more realistic. Finally, before we say goodbye, Kyle and thank you again for the time. Um you're a pop culture. Dude, you are You just did a hard to Kill Segal retrospective with Simmons, which I can't wait to listen to. Um, football movies, football movies. Okay, we gotta get we gotta get a good one in there. I feel like it's been a while, um the last one. It's I think it's telling that draft day, which was you know, all due respect Mark, it is it is a C C solid sea. I think it was all the it's full of heart from start to finish. Forget that Kyle, Kyle doesn't know this. But and maybe our new listeners don't that. They showed it to us and they asked people from the NFL for it's gonna closs over at Mark. But now were but Kyle needs to know you guys for consultants. We went to a screening for NFL media employees in two thousand thirteen or whatever when the movie came out, and then they asked, they asked, hey, if you want to like give us some type of write up, we might use you in the promotion. And they really used Mark and they used it is quote full of heart from start to finish, A long chunky they're advertising. It was a long chunky paragraph. I tried to balance the positive aspects of the film and its shortcomings. But at some point that you know, they just grab what they want and I and that gets the pull quote on like eighteen, that's what's the kind of quote that they like. They do They like the full of heart from start to finish. That's like, it's a great it's a great premise for a movie that they didn't quite land. What about the idea. What if we get behind it as producers or some way and we reboot it and we try again draft or original I p any ideas that you had, we could kind of spit ball. Well the draft day thing. The first question you have to answer is who's the team going to be? Like, who's that featured team? You know what originally was the Bills and then they rewrote it for the Browns because I think tax breaks or something where they could film it. Well. Listen that I'm looking in your direction in terms of the teams that they would need to focus on on and I think you have to have a New York based team and I think it has to be the Jets. And I think it's immediately got some edge. Um, I think you redo it, or even there's a sequel, or you know there's something, but the draft is always amazing thing it or maybe you need more people in this scene where somebody comes out and chokes on a chicken wing and dies at the end of it, and then everyone just makes fun of him. Someone can play him like Jeremy Renner, Frank Frank Ellen Burst. Yeah, or we do. It's like, you know, it's spin off like a Better Call Sault with Jennifer Garner's character is a cap analytics expert. We just really dig it deeper on her arc. That's fine. Three. I feel like the features have suffered because the documentaries are usually have been so good. I love that movie Undefeated, which is on Netflix, but I remember j Simmons one, No, it's a it's a it's a documentary about like a high school team, and I just always end up loving those. Last Chance You is great, and to me, they like the features never matched that sort of drama. We haven't had it in a minute. It's well, work on it. We're gonna work on it. Kyle, nothing you have to work on, at least in the gym. According to Mark hey Now Kyle's body it says it right there on on is on the notes. Thank you, thank thank you very much. Kyle Brand, thank you very much, buddy, and uh, maybe we'll have a cocktail a little later. Uh listen, Um, Dan, Greg, guys, thank you for having, Thank you for having very much. It's always a pleasure. We're back in a bad place, all right, there goes Kyle Brand. That was awesome. Also awesome. Late in the seminar on Wednesday, they brought out two guest speakers as a part of the UM podcast segment pod Podcast Power. We were not asked to come. I thought it was going to be about our podcast, and it wasn't mentioned once, which was fine. Again, I just kind of like de lay Low for this event. But two ladies that have successfully launched a show called nine O two one, Oh my god, Tori Spelling and Jenny garth Um the actress is to be the official name. Uh, they came out. And then of course after when the Q and A opened up to that, Kyle and noted pop culture buff especially in that era Rose's hand and asked a very direct question about a specific plot line from an episode from nineteen well I think also a moment and they had no recollection of what he was talking about it, but they were there spelling and Jenny Garth, who if you're a certain age, are iconic, Jenny Garth, especially to to some of us. Um both were quite taken aback by Kyle Brandton noted his cuteness multiple times, like I don't remember that at all, Mark's projecting what. They absolutely talked about the fact that he was. They literally at one point she called him adorable, which I actually took the player that D'Angelo and Ladinian Thomlinson, who we were sitting next to, took it in the way I did, which is like it was a nice pat on the head of like, oh, aren't you an adorable little fan and anything? And I thought that they thought he tried very hard with his with this comment. I don't mean that in a negative way, but he was a subject matter expert. I'm not surprised he was, and I think they were. It was an interesting choice of because I told Emma, my wife, last night, about it, and I mentioned to her how at least half the people in the room had no idea who they were because they were too you know, the people in the room like a graver. If he had been you know too young, they have no clue or and that shocked them because she was like, what how would they not know them? And I was like, if you're like thirty eight or under, you probably especially Garth, I think spelling, you know, with the reality show, it's a little more on the A nineteen eighty baby, I'll give you my um um my babe Mount Rushmore from and I'll tell you Jenny Garth was on that absolutely on that side of that mountain. In the Ae blancoln spot. He was on that Rushmore right a famously you know, anybody, don't ask me to open ended questions. George Washington abe though famously not a looker, a gigantic man, but kind of not a looker. George Washington would have been a better example. Lincoln was kind of sneaky hot and also get better look at the more, you know, because of his wisdom, his oratory. You gotta get Ian over here. Um. But Jenny Garth, um, Cathy Ireland, no arguments. Vanessa Williams, m M. They didn't save the best for last. The best for last for me is Tiffany avertheuson Kellys and Tory spelling. I know we're more the best for last plan with thank You Say by the bell She played Violet the nerd and a recurring role screeches girlfriend. I wanted to ask about that, but then Kyle sucked up all the oxygen with his and I said, well, he can't double down because then you're kind of again asking them to go down a memory of the wormhole that they have no interest in going down. But I would have had a saved by the bell Us. You're a true pro. You're a true pro. You understood the room all right, understand ending the room. Greg. That is sometimes something that I feel like you battle with um, certainly today with the conversation with management. I mean I understood it. I knew exactly what I was getting into. I don't give it, you know, I wanted it, wanted them to feel me. You are the bad boy of NFL media. But what happens when you come and clash with one of the more visible um members of NFL media, the news breaker Ian Rappaport. Drama between the two men, and here is the conversation that we had, Ian Greg marking myself all right as promised. You know, I sometimes on the target of some good natured ribbing about giving myself too many nicknames. Um, but I'll risk it again and let you know there's another nickname that I want to bring to the forefront, all right, the Peacemaker. Oh and um sitting out. I don't know if that it's not sorry to curse on here, but you're just giving sitting to my right as a longtime friend, known him for over twenty years, and and sitting to my left is um a work colleague that I've known for ten or works so closely with. So to see, I mean we have now you just called him a friend and I'm a work colleague. That's just called reality. To see the friendship dissolve between Greg Rosenthal and Ian Rappaport. Uh, it's been difficult. So now we've brought them together Mark to try to iron things out. Now, the Peacemaker is going to back out of the way, and Mark, if you want to jump in and help mediate in your own way, that's great. Well, I think it's it's primarily the role of these two individuals to to heal whatever's going on. Um, I'm not sure that's a home run that's gonna happen here, because you know Ian is Ian, but um, Greg is one of the more hyper contrarians on the earth. So where is this felt like an insult? Well? Yeah, I mean I I actually just put I'm not claiming to know your personality. But I wonder that this is a manufactured joke, uh to to use a popular phrase on this podcast. But on the other hand, I have people within the company, um coming up to me at this meetium saying like, oh, what's what's your uh what's your beef with Ian here? So this this thing that you've started that uh interns didn't start making it public. Um, you know you're also trying to bring together. But I will I will mention a situation last night was funny because I saw Ian and we're not the type too. I think take take things too personally, H and Ian generally. I come over to a group which has some high powered executives in this little group last night one at the NFL one outside the NFL shadowy shadowy League figure there, and I assume we're gonna ignore whatever is going on here Ian and I. But the first thing Ian does is just like give me a big scowl face and like to make everyone. I was just like, oh, me and me and I and are in a fight. We're called I was like, I was like people, I was like, this was not the spot to do it. I don't think you really want to go through it in front of these people. I didn't want to go through it. But you can't ignore something like that. It's like, you know, it's like if you're on to make like a cartoonist mad face either that was my regular face, but resting Ian face. UM No, it's like if you do something dumb on TV, like, the only way to get past it is to acknowledge it, Like I like to acknowledge this cold world that is happening and for people don't know who don't know. Um, Greg and I have been friendly, probably friendly. I've never been over to your house, so we can't say we're friends, but we're friendly for a long time. Uh. He will often text me asking me for information, and I will text him, uh my various observations that go on on this podcast, which I will listen to infrequently, uh, and other things, and it feels like a one sided relationship. Um. And then I saw a tweet by and I'm not gonna talk about the topic of the tweet. Well that we have to what are you talking about but it was okay. It was discussing the coverage of Deshaun Watson. It was lumping all of the UH national reporters in together as if all of us were on the same page in ignoring or UH deciding that the Deshaun Watson coverage would be the same. And I believe what Greg was upset with mostly was we were talking about the football part of it, right that you felt we were talking too much about the football part of it. I think that the way that the it was covered throughout the process was yes, essentially assisting Deshaun Watson's agent and getting that trade and getting that contract like that part of my feeling about it didn't change that the way the media and you're just part of that, you know. And we had a long conversation on the day of the Watson press conference because that day I thought was an important day because it was like the local reporters got in and I think got to ask the types of questions that the national reporters won't because I think ultimately they had relationships that they were trying to protect that got a higher um importance in the reporting on our networking, on the ESPN and on Fox and wherever else, uh than just actually reporting what was going on here. So I don't think that's true. But first of all, the reason the local reporters reporters got to ask to Shawn Watson all these questions, and they did it again the other day at Mini campus because they were literally there. So I have met to Shaun Watson a couple of times. I do not know him well. I don't have the kind of audience with him where I could ask him the kind of questions that you wanted to press conference. Uh, what I do know is that we have, and I believe I have, and Pella Sero has and Garret Foe has covered it all of it. So when some of the accusers had a press conference, uh, kind of early on in this, I can't remember when that was, but it was last year, it was, yeah, it was yeah, it was kind of when this had really started. We covered that. UM when there was a new lawsuit, we often covered that. UM. I would not say that we covered every single detail because there's been so many details, but we have covered the bad and then we have covered there's not been a lot of good. But then we've covered the football. And this was a time to cover the football because he had just been traded. It was all about the trade, what it means for the football team, his contract, what that meant. And just because we were covering the football part of it today, that day didn't overshadow the fact that we've covered all of it over the last several months. And that was my main point to you, See, this is Dan. Dan's disappointed by this because ultimately we're getting into like a nitty gritty of like how how the media Jordan Dan is calmly set this up. And I think, I think, I actually think, even though yes, I I like the heat, the heat's fun, I think it's good that Ian's talking about this because this has been a major part of the Watson story. And Greg, you've been very outspoken, so it's good actually hear from Ian, who isn't a very difficult situation. I mean where Ian's roll the company and Ian's job um is to find a balance to that. So right, but I would disagree that it was like okay, right, there was. It was about the football, so that was discovering. My problem was with the entire six months leading up to I think throughout the process, a lack of context of what Watson was accused of doing and and also how that could impact like what is moving forward. Absolutely made it easier for the Browns to give him this contract, made it easier for his agent to make this money, made it easier for his UH lawyer UH to also fighting against it. And one thing I've really come to believe is that Deshaun Watson's the last person I feel bad for in this scenario. But I think the way that his agent UM has used his media relationships to gain favorable coverage, and that's not like prow Watson, it's just it's just silence. But what wasn't brought up in a lot of our coverage is all the negative aspects of what's going to happen when DeShawn and if Deshaun Watson gets treated before he's actually suspended, before these cases were set, were seeing that, Now, what do you mean? What I mean is that I think the Browns and I think Watson in general are continually surprised about how difficult this process has been and is going to continue to be. And it never made sense to me for him to get traded and for all the business part of it to happen before the legal and especially before the NFL suspension thing happened because of this. And I think if if the Browns knew how the last couple of months were going to go, and I think if Deshaun Watson knew how the last six months would go, I think they probably would have acted maybe differently. I don't think he wouldn't have necessarily gotten that huge commission for his agent and that huge contract. I don't think it would have happened as quickly and as easily. And you can say, oh, that's him doing a good job, and it's not because this is gonna follow Deshaun Watson forever. He he is starting to dawn on him and the Browns. I think that, like, this isn't going to go away. And I think one of the reasons why they entered into it is they felt like it was going away because for the most part, it had gone away. And you think of the timing of it. Um. I disagree with a lot of things you just said, but you think of the timing of it, um it the trade happened, was it a couple of days within the week of him being receiving a no bill from one grand jury and then the next grand jury. Right, So that was so the trade. Now, obviously there's been uh two and then maybe two more lawsuits in addition to that. Obviously there's been all these depositions, a lot of which has become public. There's been a lot of reportings since then. But the trade and the discussions that we were having on air and in other places all happened in the context of him receiving a no bill, which obviously does not mean he's innocent, but it does mean he's not going to be indicted by a grand jury. So I think that uh, those two facts, the two grand juries, did color the kind of coverage that we gave um, which is he's not going to be charged legally. So that sort of gave a window to all of us, I think, to talk about the football part of it, which really paved the way for the trade, right. I mean, I just I we don't need to go in circles, and this is similar in some ways, but we we got into it a little more like in a conversation, like I meant, and it wasn't personal. It was just I really disagreed with the way we like I I it's not just you that I talked to about this. I talked to some of the news editorial executives about this too, because it was upsetting. Ultimately, were we all work for NFL Media, NFL network. You want to be like proud of the coverage that you can do, and you should try to like impact the coverage in any way you can. And I and having gone through the Greg Hardy and Ray Rice situations, which is very, very different, but that was at a at a time when I was having to deal with how we were handling that stuff editorial, I was kind of amazed that a we had forgotten a lot of the lessons in theory we had learned from back then and be where I think we were worse now, like because I'm not an expert in almost anything, but one thing I feel like I have good experience from after the last fifteen years is how the sports media sausage was getting made. And I was seeing how people who are lining their pockets off of Deshaun Watson, namely his agent, but his lawyer too, and the networks and and other things who who wanted this to go away for the purpose of making money. We're helping to make this issue go away, and it's not helping him Uh, and it's not helping the Browns. In the end, I think like this is going to work out worse than any of them imagined it would, and it has. I I would say the assumption that they have all bought the silence of the media doesn't make any sense to me. First of all, we're talking about it here and in many many other places too. I have not had anyone able to talk about on our podcast because no one pays attention to our podcast. But we couldn't exactly have these conversations on It's not true though we talk about this constantly on NFL network. We've talked about the allegations, we talked about the fallout, we talked about the new lawsuits. Uh. Pellicero did Total Access yesterday and his topic was Deshaun Watson and the new lawsuits. And so I feel like we do talk about it every time it comes up. Every time it's news, we talked about it, just like every time the football part comes up, we talked about it. What I would also say, one thing we have not done is and this is I'm not saying we should deserve like a medal for this. I'm just saying we haven't really been like, oh, well, let's just talk about how great addition to Shaun Watson is going to be to the Browns offense. I mean, we did plenty of that and the end of the days after he was traded, and that's fine, Like it's like like you can you can have both, but we did plenty of that. I just don't want you. I just don't want you overlooking the coverage that we've done of all of the negative just because we spend some time on football, like we are football reporters. And I also wasn't doing this out of like the goodness of my heart, but it also like I think can help like our industry or you or schefter has taken I think hits because of this, Like it's not helping you, like and we are friends and and I want your coverage to be great and stuff like there are going to be a lot of people that look at the way we do things in a certain way, and it's good for you to know that, you know what I mean, Like you'd rather know that than not know that I would assume. I mean, I'm I'm pretty well aware of all of the things I report on and how they are viewed. I just don't view it as sort of negatively as you do. I just I spend a lot of my time and a lot of my reporting work trying to figure out how to make that balance that you were we're talking about, right, because you know, obviously the off the field stuff is extremely important every and it's not just with the Shawn. It's what's gonna happen to Baker Mayfield. Okay, Well, is he gonna get traded? I don't know, but if he does, then he's not going to be the starting quarterback who steps in if and when Deshaun Watson is is trading. And that sort of led to another many many other news cycles. Um, I'm I don't know. I am as I told you at the time. I'm fine with my coverage. I know it has not been uh glory for all of us national media people across the board. I'm fine with the way I've handled it. Um, but I don't I don't mind you. I mean, you're sort of snarky, and that's annoying, but I don't mind you pointing it out because one of the things that in these cases, I wasn't being snarky. I was just kind of furious, and it hasn't hadn't gone away, Like I've been surprised that it's stuck with me. I know, But I would say, um, I one of the things with me doing this job and being very public and not just news but really all the things that I do are pretty public, is I don't really care and I don't really mind that all of the things I do get dissected, Like I don't mind that you're sort of picking apart the coverage. I take issue with some of the conclusions that you made because I think you're wrong on some of them, but it doesn't offend me. And you know, I would say that jerky tone probably did. But the fact that you critique it, it's all out there. It is all I mean, the same thing for schefter. It's like it is all for everyone to judge. The fact that I disagree on how you judge it is sort of a different way. And I told you like it wasn't about you either, which is like, that's why it wasn't like any rappidport criticism. I told you, I could have made a top ten rankings of the people that have offended me the most, and you would have made the list. But you weren't in the top you have. That's men, that's women like that, it's it wasn't just one type of We've heard your take on this for weeks and weeks and I and I strongly Lincoln agree with a lot of what you said, but we have not heard from Ian, and I think that's very glad that happened. And now if we can find a way to move past this. UM, I would love to see the men shake hands or perhaps even hugged. Is that a possibility. I would We would have never have hugged even beforehand. The best this is a peacemaker. I don't think I'm happy to shake hands yesterday when we saw we get a photo of the handship. Now you're making it into what do you mean to making it into a bit? You at the very beginning told me there wasn't even any heat, and of course the peacemaker. That was a wrong way to put it. You're absolutely right, not that there wasn't heat. Like I was disappointed in something. I'm sure Ian has been, um disappointed in me in many ways. Some of those tweets, Oh my god, what if I were to craft like back in fifth fourth fifth grade in the summer when you'd make little friendship bracelets, you'd weave them and one could have Greg's name on it and one could have Ian's name. If you'd wear the other person's name on your wrist, would you do that? That's a fair all right? So but we are are we going to be back on texting terms again after this? See what he needs? Well? What can you offer Ian about that? Right? What do you offer in this? Let's comedic advice? I comedy in those realms, um, you know. I give him like these lists of possible cuts and trade I give him. I have given him idea give him ideas for breaking things that I've actually been right about over the years that have been this is not a joke. There have been a couple of times when he has been like, I was thinking about this. Does this make sense? Has anyone looked into And there's been a couple of stories where I've been like, I should, Yeah, I should actually ask about that, and that is true. And then there was another I cannot remember which it was definitely a fake trade that you floated that ended up happening, and I cannot remember what it was a healthy friendship? Is that enough? Is he giving you enough a couple of scoops, So I think we I think we're getting close here, we're bridging the divide, and I think we have to get back inside for the second part of the seminar, spinning his fingers. I don't know if there's a I don't know if we're going back, but I think I think maybe there's a post seminar cocktail. Maybe we we sealing them from the drink. I'm trying hugs drinks all out. I think you mean we can do a handshake after you know we're done. You know we don't have to do it for it must be documented for posterity. This peacemaker nickname, you're giving yourself, your the effort behind it. UM today has been umenous. Was trying to be the best part is when we got our we got our new contract, and UM Greg had a really nice tweet and then me and he and we're texting, and it was like, why don't you put out a tweet so I could quote retweet you. No, that's not what I said. That's not what I said. Now what I said. I said, Hey, did you guys get a new contract? He said, yeah, I just saw Greg's tweet. Definitely not retweeting him now. And then he did a post and Bang retweeted almost immediately, So there you go. It's my job, because I've been on both sides of this, is to bring everyone together again, and I think we've done that on something. But I don't think you've done it. But I do love that freaking the peacemaker is spoken. Everything is okay, now, we're good. All right, let's get back to the seminar. Let's get back to uh. Ian. Thank you very much, no problem, thanks guys. All right, there you go. Can I say something when when we talked about the situation with Greg and Ian, it's like, oh, it would be good pod fodder maybe to get them on and you just see what happens, see some fireworks go off. But then when the conversation started, like, oh this, I think this is effective and on a different level because I think it's good to hear both sides of this and uh I don't think necessarily Greg, you guys ended up um landing in the same place, but you just had a better idea of the whole situation, as naughty as it is. No, I agree. I think it's a good conversation to have and I appreciate it having it and our listeners being able to listen to it. I think that's it's great to hear like both perspectives of it. And it wasn't it was not necessary personal. But what you told me that afterwards, like oh, I I didn't really think about it would get you know, that deep into the Watson stuff and to me that that's all it was about. I mean, it was that was that was It was a very specific to that issue. Like we've been friendly, as Ian said for years talking about news stories and I I still do have a major problem. I wish I had said that too, is like the story is still ongoing, and so that's part of it is I'm I'm trying to make I'm trying to change how he acts. Is what I'm trying to do. Whether it works or not, I don't think, um it's going to I thought number one, you did not back down from your position at all, and he also showed strengthen his position, and that that's what made it a great listen. I was an observer for almost say it like that, I want to change how he acts. That's I don't know if that's necessarily something that is going to cause him to change of anything. It might cause him to dig in more and be like, forget what Greg's saying. I mean, it's just that just putting it that way, I guess it's not like I'm like trying to manipulate the situation. I'm just trying, Like, here's someone I know. I think Deshaun Watson could use some people around him who like tell him things that you know, that are different from the way he's being told them. I think the agent, who I think is really the one I'm talking about here ultimately, and the power that the agent has over the media, and how like David Mulla Mullaghetta has basically been like people should be telling him because ultimately I don't think they're doing themselves uh any good. And I include that for Ian. I don't want Ian to be remembered or to take a lot of criticism, uh, for how we're covering this, and it still feels like we're going down that road. I don't get the sense you two will be vacationing together on martha S vineyard anytime. So here's here's the question I have. And I was thinking about this after the conversation. Um, you you've taken issue with how it's been covered, Um, but do you think if it would have been covered in a way that you found to be more effective or tactful, that would have changed anything about what happened with his Because I'm gonna say no, I think no matter how the media covered this, there's still these NFL teams that want that guy. Not that they don't care so much about the guy off the field. If they think they can get away with the off the field stuff. If I can get the top seven quarterback, top five quarterback at twenty six years old, I'm paying anyway. So I eventually I agree, but I disagree in that the way that it happened and the timing that it happened, I absolutely think, and that the media has an enormous impact on how these teams and leagues and d uh players in everyone opera rate And if there was a loud drumming, it would just wouldn't have just been ian. But if there was been a different way that the entire media was covering it and there was still like a lot of pressure and a lot of negativity out there, I just don't I don't think it would have happened in that timeline. I think it would have waited until he was suspended. I don't think you would have gotten his guaranteed contract like that. I I do think it would have been a different I want to agree with you, but I can't. I I think that there was a team, there were multiple teams pursuing him, and I think changed. I think eventually it all would have come out in the same same place. And that was that was more of the problem that I had. And that's even more cynical. It's like they're pandering to a certain public opinion, but they're gonna go do what they want anyway. I used to have this sort of cynical view, even when I was sort of quasi in the media, that like, actually we didn't have that much of an impact, and and you realize that's wrong, like it Jimmy Haslum and Roger Goodell and all all the like major players in this are absolutely frightened and hate like the media reaction and want to diminish it as much as possible. And when it's loud, they have to act. I mean, the only reason why there's uh like the Black Lives Matter and the in the different statements on the side of the fields, and everything that's happening is like is because of media and public pressure. Like it's not from any like different feelings, and I would consider like this would be the same way if there was more media pressure and public pressure to be different. I will say I have been encouraged because I think there was a frustration a lot of us had um when the deal went down with the Browns and you saw that it was all guaranteed money and even how the contract was backloaded to protect him in the an event he is suspended, that there are the Jenny Brentis is in the world. You know that there is the HBO Real Sports, and that that expose they did that. The drumbeat has continued and kept the heat on Watson and on the league and on the lawyers, and it's I think that's going to continue. And again I think we talked about this with me and just that I don't I don't think the Browns anticipated this continuing this way. I don't think that it's potentially just starting. He might be battling these things for for a year or two in in um court, and I don't think they quite considered how that was going to play out, right so there you go, Greg, and I just want to say we did get the handshake that was teased at the end of we had a documented we have it. Good for posterity thanks to Drake we had I don't know, I don't want that like that is what because then and then we're making like that was stupid. The cameras on it's it's recording everything we do. That's fine, but I don't want to be like playing it up for like it's like, yeah, George Bush, mission accomplished, you know, Banner, it's simply behind them, it's simply for our archive. Okay, so they have to I found this, um problematic. They refused to embrace. Why can't two male co workers who have come to understand that? But that would have been next level, would have been you know, maybe more appropriate. It's fine. You have, you know, different acquaintances coworkers, colleagues that you go through life. Um and uh you know, you don't have to have the same relationship the whole time. Sometimes you realize, uh, well you are a fine example of that. Yeah, Dan was so Dana so on top of this, and we don't need to get into the details. But he actually called me on his way home. I believe last night, still trying to um. Uh. You know, it's not like the peacemaker takes off the headsets like uncomfortable because he you know, he's been friends with Ian, as he said, for twenty years, and he's you know, worked with me as a colleague with no renditions for ten years too, So he wants those two people to dan. This is man, I'm from heaven. I mean, this is like liquid gold. Like Greg was pretending his feelings were hurt. Uh when we taped with Kyle or with Ian, and Uh, I did come up to him privately, Greg, and I put my arm around him and it made him stiffened, duppy, typed up um like a porky pine. And I said, you are my friend, Greg, Yes you did. I was not really offended. You are. You are reading the room alright. So there we go. Here we are. It's time to say goodbye. Um, I'm getting on a planet Huntington, Texas, so I might do the same. I will be up there in um gee Bob's attict. Next time we're doing a show together. So we continue on anybody else, on anything to say, thank you everybody for listening, Thank you to Ian. Thank you to Kyle, Thank you to the listeners. Till Monday, he the call full of Hot from Stock to finish, delivers on the great tension of the NFL Draft, whilst showing how human the entire process is. Well Now hold on Mark Sessla NFL dot com around the league. That's the banner at running across the wh music from how did it? When did Mark become that? I asked the Gold Center to deliver me some background music with emotional heft that was with Wolves potentially. I was eternally vigilant while I was watching the movie, waiting just to jump over some scene that really wouldn't happen in the NFL, And for the most part I thought it rang pretty true.