AvTalk Episode 292: Airplane facts with Max

AVT 292 Transcript
EPISODE 292
[EPISODE]
[0:00:07] IP: Hello and welcome to Episode 292 of AvTalk. I am Ian Petchenik, here, as always
with –
[0:00:16] JR: Jason Rabinowitz. Hello, Ian. How's it going?
[0:00:18] IP: Hello Jason. It's going well. How are you, sir?
[0:00:21] JR: I'm good. I'm home, back from my unexpected trip to Istanbul. I'm tired.
Apparently, I can't handle jet lag I used to.
[0:00:29] IP: Oh.
[0:00:30] JR: Yeah, I know. It's not great. But I'm here and I'm awake with you right now.
[0:00:35] IP: You're here and we're tempting fate somewhat, because we're recording a little
early today. There's still plenty of time for something to happen after we hit the stop button. I'm
trying to preempt that.
[0:00:47] JR: I predict nothing, nothing will happen. It'll be fine. It'll be fine, because we know,
we can predict the future and we know that there's not going to be any major updates with the
Boeing strike, or anything, because they've basically have told us so far, there is no update.
[0:01:02] IP: There is no update. And that's the update.
[0:01:05] JR: Yup. Okay.
[0:01:05] IP: Yeah. There you go. We do have a great show for you today and absolutely
fantastic conversation coming up. This week, I mentioned it last week, but this week, we are
chatting with Max from Airplane Facts with Max. Not only do you get an airplane fact, but you
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AVT 292 Transcript
get a comparison and contrast between the Lord of the Rings. That sounds crazy, but it's just so
crazy, it works. We're talking with Max about all things aircraft mechanic, all things Tolkien and
how he's found a niche doing that. We'll talk with Max a little bit later in the show.
[0:01:43] JR: Fantastic.
[0:01:45] IP: We now go to some maintenance issues. The NTSB released its preliminary report
on the Frontier flight that made an emergency landing in Las Vegas a few weeks ago. What we
physically saw on the outside was an airplane landing and then the landing gear at that point,
we didn't know exactly what was on fire, but there was a fire near the landing gear. We now
know at this point that that was fire from the brakes, and we'll get to why that happened in just a
moment. But let's back up to the NTSB, basically, burying the lead about what their investigation
is.
[0:02:25] JR: That was a little weird, wasn't it?
[0:02:26] IP: They go through this whole thing, and we'll talk about the whole list of what
happened and everything like that. Then they get to the bottom and they're like, “Oh, yeah. By
the way, we found a computer fan that was on fire and broke.”
[0:02:39] JR: That's a problem. It's probably be leading the report there, but at least it's there at
all.
[0:02:45] IP: Yeah. There was a burning smell, acrid smoke in the cabin, but no visible smoke at
the beginning, smelled of petroleum and rubber. Anybody who has ever heard, or smelled an
electrical fire and melting plastic knows what they were smelling. They down their oxygen
masks, the pilots did, and they initiated an emergency descent into Las Vegas. As they were
running through the quick reference handbook, the auto pilot and auto throttle became
unavailable. The captain's focusing on flying the airplane. The first officer is focusing on helping
the captain fly by calling out airspeed references and things like that, as well as communicating
with their traffic control.
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From the report, the crew, based on what the QRH was telling them, if the source of the smoke,
or the fumes cannot be determined, they elected to say, “Yeah, we can't figure that out.” So,
they’re going to go with the electrical emergency configuration, which drops the Ram Air
Turbine, or RAT. That, or the fire and smoke in where this computer is located, they're not sure
yet. That's still part of the investigation. Something led to limited data being displayed on the
captain's primary flight display.
It wasn't quite leaning out the window to see where you were going, but the systems on the
aircraft were quite degraded. When they landed, the captain said that he went full reverse thrust
and smashed on the brakes, because he didn't sense that the aircraft had any autobrakes and
didn't sense that there was any anti-skid. No autobrakes, no anti-skid, smashing on the brakes,
this is where you get the fire in the landing gear, because of the extreme heat and pressure
being put on the brakes. That's where that came from.
[0:04:40] JR: Yeah. That's exactly why after a rejected takeoff at any higher speed on the
takeoff roll, that's often why pilots have to basically, sideline the aircraft for a little bit to do a
rejected takeoff checklist, because the brakes might just be too hot to the point where this exact
situation could occur. You certainly wouldn't want to go for another takeoff while your brakes are
about to spontaneously combust.
[0:04:40] IP: Yeah, you certainly don't want that.
[0:05:07] JR: Nobody wants that. That's not good for anyone. In this case, the pilot elected not
to evacuate the aircraft, because the fire crews said, “Nah, we got it. We put out the fire. You're
all good.” Hey, at least that's nice.
[0:05:19] IP: Yeah. They did not evacuate using the slides. They made the determination that
they could safely get everybody off with stairs, which is exactly what happened, and there were
no injuries, whatsoever. The aircraft is still hanging out in Las Vegas today.
[0:05:34] JR: Yeah. Many eyes will be kept on to see if this is just a manufacturing issue with
that fan, or if this is a wider issue that Airbus will have to tackle fleet-wide. I'm sure the NTSB is
all over this, even if they did bury the lead.
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[0:05:52] IP: Well, Jason, unfortunately, it sounds like, that might not be the only Frontier plane
that's grounded for a while coming up soon. So far, Frontier, because of the newness of its fleet,
has been able to be outside of the grounding, because inspections are required window due to
the Pratt & Whitney geared turbofan engines. It sounds like, that luck is about to run out. We
don't know when the aircraft might need to go in. We don't know for how long they might need to
go in. At the moment, it looks like, at least some of the Frontier aircraft will also be affected, at
least by inspection criteria, if not replacement of any parts, or anything like that.
[0:06:48] JR: Nobody seems to be able to escape this particular fate. I guess, at this point,
unless the engines are really actually brand-brand new, since they presumably have fixed this
issue on new deliveries. Yeah, Frontier has taken delivery of a staggering number of 320 family
aircraft. Even these new aircrafts at some point, they have to be sidelined for the infamous Pratt
inspections. Your turn. We'll see what happens to Frontier, because it’s damn near-killed Spirit.
We'll talk about in a minute how it's damn near-killing JetBlue at the same time. We already
know it is outright killed other airlines, specifically, what was it the one in India that I can't
remember the name up already? It's already left my memory.
[0:07:31] IP: They've already gone. They've already gone.
[0:07:34] JR: I can't even remember them. We know Indigo is doing okay as best it can, but
we've got a lot more to talk about this particular topic.
[0:07:41] IP: Yeah. Like Jason mentioned, JetBlue has been in the muck and mire as far as
Pratt & Whitney engine problems are concerned. During their third quarter financial results,
JetBlue says that among other things, their long-term capacity planning continues to be
challenged by GTF powered aircraft that are on the ground. That was the CEO, Joanna
Geraghty speaking, and then Marty St. George says, and this was a diplomatic quote on his
behalf, “We continue to be very frustrated, as far as status right now, as far as being able to
actually get a good handle on what is happening with Pratt.”
[0:08:17] JR: Oh, Marty. I want more spin on that. There's not enough Boston in that particular
quote.
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[0:08:23] IP: There is that. But also, I think that quote is – that's an executive from a major Pratt
& Whitney customer saying, “We don't know exactly what's happening.”
[0:08:39] JR: We've talked about this a number of times, where airlines across the world are
extremely frustrated with both Airbus at this point and Pratt, because there seems to be no
consensus amongst anyone on when this is going to get better. We keep hearing that, oh, we've
hit the peak number of aircraft that are going to be impacted by this and things are trending
down. But on the airline side, that really doesn't seem to be the messaging, does it?
[0:09:06] IP: No. It's frustrating. I mean, obviously, I'm not a Pratt & Whitney customer, other
than flying on aircraft that –
[0:09:14] JR: In a roundabout way, you are. You are buying a ticket on an airline that operates
its aircraft using Pratt & Whitney engines. It does impact you in one way or another.
[0:09:24] IP: Eventually, yes. But my level of frustration, I guess, is proportional to my financial
commitment to Pratt & Whitney. As an airline, I can only imagine that the conversations have
been frank, let me put it that way, in diplomatic context. A frank exchange of views, I'm sure is
being had on a regular basis, because I can only imagine how airlines are feeling about it. Not
necessarily the actual thing that's happening, but just the not knowing exactly what's happening.
[0:09:58] JR: Yeah, this is especially tough for JetBlue right now, which finds itself in a do or die
scenario. It has to turn the business around. It has to do things that will generate profit, which is
the goal of any real business. As much as JetBlue can do with the things it’s announced,
refocusing on New York and opening lounges and differentiating its extra legroom seating,
which it said, it's going to do today, or this week they announced, if they have mid to high teen
number of aircraft. Anywhere in the high teens, this could be 18, near 20 aircraft grounded in its
fleet in 2025, that's a huge chunk of its fleet, making it, I don't know, maybe impossible for the
airline to complete its turnaround process. What is it? Jet Forward, I think is what they call it.
What I'm trying to say here is, Marty, if you're listening, we'd love to have you as a guest. Come
on.
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[0:10:56] IP: Well, you can say slightly less diplomatic things, but we are family friendly, so not
too undiplomatic.
[0:11:01] JR: Probably we keep it diplomatic, but maybe less diplomatic than Wall Street –
[0:11:06] IP: The earnings call. Right, right. We head north of the border now for a little bit, but
then we get sent back south, because on August 5th, a hail storm impacted Calgary Airport,
especially, and damaged an extensive portion of WestJet's fleet. It now turns out, and this
comes to us from a long-time podcast listener and we'll call them a Canadian plane person.
There are three 737-700s that WestJet has determined are not repairable, or perhaps, the
insurance company has determined that they're not repairable, that received enough damage
that they are retiring the aircraft. The first one, CGYWJ has been flown down to Tucson, and
there are two more. CGWJT and CGWCN that are slated to head down either later this week, or
early next. What's interesting here is that the aircraft are being flown from Calgary to Tucson,
Arizona, unpressurized.
[0:12:14] JR: Ooh, that tells you, I think all you need to know. There would be some holes in
that airplane that –
[0:12:20] IP: Adds a bit of time. Adds a bit of time to the flight. About two and a half hours added
to the flight. Not great, but great that they're airworthy enough to retire and they don't have to
chop them up.
[0:12:35] JR: That's really rough. I mean, we saw images of these aircraft and they were truly
beat up by this hail storm. It's not surprising that at least one of these aircraft was beyond
economical repair, but three of them, aircraft that probably had quite a bit of life left in them,
especially at WestJet, where they're scrapping for aircraft at this point. Maybe scrapping is the
wrong word, because they're scrapping these planes, but they're really – they need aircraft in
their fleet and they're doing things like, reintegrating swoop aircraft into WestJet mainline that
aren't up to WestJet standards and they're also taking in Sunwing Airlines aircraft next year that
also won't be up to the mainline standards.
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They're losing these three aircraft, especially 700s, which can potentially do some high
operation that I think WestJet might actually need. That's rough. That's not great, because we all
know, they ain't making any more 700s.
[0:13:30] IP: The replacement is nowhere near available.
[0:13:35] JR: Yeah, we haven't really had an update on that in a long time, have we?
[0:13:39] IP: Nope.
[0:13:41] JR: Okay.
[0:13:42] IP: That's the best I got.
[0:13:44] JR: For posterity that we're talking about the MAX 7 and 10. Haven't heard enough on
those in a very long time.
[0:13:50] IP: I will say that the MAX 10 is flying this week.
[0:13:53] JR: Oh, that's good. That's something.
[0:13:54] IP: It has started flying again for the first time in a while. I'm not sure exactly what
they're up to, but the aircraft is flying.
[0:14:03] JR: That's good news.
[0:14:04] IP: Let's take a quick break. Then, we will come back with our chat with Max from
Airplane Facts with Max.
[CONVERSATION WITH MAX]
[0:14:17] IP: As promised, we are here with a fascinating and incredible conversation, one that I
am so excited to have. Welcome to the AvTalk Podcast, Max from Airplane Facts with Max.
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[0:14:31] MC: Hello. Happy to be here.
[0:14:33] IP: Thank you so much for coming on the show. You did a pre-interview with my wife,
just a moment ago, because she's the one who found your videos first and showed me and got
me hooked. She's like, “You're really going to like this.” It's true. I do really like this. We played a
little clip before this conversation to prime everybody. For those that don't watch your stuff on a
regular basis, can you describe what it is you're doing?
[0:15:01] MC: Yeah. It's a weird thing to try to describe, but I'm an aircraft mechanic. I make
videos called Airplane Facts with Max. I basically compare and contrast the world of aviation
maintenance and the world of JRR Tolkien. I try to clarify some of the glaring differences
between airplanes and Lord of the Rings, because people get confused sometimes. They look
at an airplane and be, “Is that from Lord of the Rings?” It's actually not.
[0:15:29] IP: There are so many things that I thought were from the Lord of the Rings that are
just in fact, parts of an airplane.
[0:15:34] MC: Yeah.
[0:15:35] IP: I had no idea.
[0:15:37] MC: Yeah. I talk about how different parts, or components of aircraft and then I talk
about Lord of the Rings. That's what I do, I guess.
[0:15:46] IP: How? Just how did this get started? I mean, there's no through line in my mind that
goes, this is what somebody should do. Yet, and yet, it is incredibly compelling.
[0:15:57] MC: Yeah. I started making videos about two years ago. I've been an aircraft
mechanic for quite some time. I was at a low point in my life and my wife had recently passed
away. A few months after that, I found myself at work and I was on Instagram and I posted a
story to my page, and I just was like, this is an airplane tire and it's different than the tire on your
car, because it's on an airplane and not a car. People were like, “Oh.” My friends were like,
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“That's really funny.” I was making little stories like that just to my friends and they thought they
were funny.
Then, one day I uploaded those to TikTok and it just took off on its own from there, because
people are like, this is really funny, right? I guess. Then, I was rereading Lord of the Rings and
getting back into Tolkien and I was like, I wonder if I could make one of my little airplane facts
about Lord of the Rings, but how could I do that? I started looking at the airplane, because I love
Lord of the Rings, obviously. I was looking at the engine and I saw the fan blades, and I was
like, “Blades. Fan blades, sword blades. I could talk about that.” Then it just became its own
thing. After that first Lord of the Rings one, I thought – I was like, “There's no way I could keep
doing Lord of the Rings ones.” Then I kept coming up with more ideas and it just spiraled from
there.
[0:17:17] IP: How do you keep coming up with new ideas? Are you looking at the airplane first
and then going, “Okay, this is how I can do this”? Or is there a scene in one of the books and
you're like, “Okay, I've got it”?
[0:17:28] MC: I've come up with a way of thinking about it. Usually, I'm at work and I only make
really two to four videos a month maybe, and they're only a minute long. I'm not putting out
videos that often, because it takes me time to think of something. I'll look at the airplane and I
think like, what's Lord of the Rings here? Or, I'll see a video online and then I'll be like, “Okay, I
could talk about that.” I had a video that I did recently that really got a lot of views on it and it
was about speed tape. People –
[0:17:58] IP: Everyone loves to freak out that there's duct tape on their airplane.
[0:18:02] MC: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. It's one of those things that as an aviation maintenance
professional, I was like, that's not duct tape. It's not holding anything together. Then, I'm making
the video and I noticed that the part tape was the strake on the engine cowling. I was like,
“Okay, well, what's the strake do, right? It helps redirect airflow over the wings to increase lift
and I was like, redirect.” Then I think, “Oh, Eric Gordon redirected Sauron's forces in Return of
the King when he showed himself in the Palantir,” right? That's how that comes about in my
head, I guess.
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[0:18:34] IP: That's the idea process. This is where I am most in awe of these videos. How do
you shoot the video? Do you write a script and then work it all out, or is this just something
where you pick up the camera and you're like, “All right, I've got an idea. Let's go.”
[0:18:49] MC: It's the second. It's, I have an idea. Let's go, right? I usually film the videos when
I'm on my lunch break, or on break time, because I don't want anybody else in the background. I
don't obviously don't want the planes to be moving, or functional at the time. During lunch
everybody's going to eat their food and I can just walk out there and take a little quick video on
the plane. I think about what I'm going to say before, so I have an idea of the video that I'm
going to make. Then I'm like, “All right. Well, let's go do it real fast.” It's just a quick one minute,
one and a half minute video. That doesn't take long. I don't edit them or anything.
[0:19:24] IP: I mean, but that's the crazy part to me is that you don't edit them, because it's not
a paragraph. It's a page of information. Every time I watch, I'm thinking to myself, I'm like, how
do you get all that out? I mean, is it just whatever I get out in a take is what I get, or do you give
yourself some leeway to do another take?
[0:19:44] MC: Oh, I give myself leeway to do another take. Yeah.
[0:19:46] IP: Oh, okay. Good, good.
[0:19:48] MC: It usually takes me a couple before I get out without stumbling, or mumbling. It's
a gift I didn't really realize I had, I guess, until I started doing it. Then when I first started, if you
went back to my older videos, they're only 20, or 30 seconds long. I learned. It's evolved over
the years where I can – I like to get more in depth on the aircraft. I used to do my segue. I used
to be like, right away. This is a part of an airplane. Then I just do the Lord of the Rings tangent.
Then as it's grown, I'd have made it 50% airplane and 50% Lord of the Rings. That way, I
realized, I'm actually able to teach people about some of these components that are on aircraft,
as well as teach people about Lord of the Rings. Who doesn't like learning about both of those
things? They're wonderful.
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[0:20:35] IP: I mean, I've been just along for the ride. I mean, I know more about the airplane
stuff probably than most viewers, but I know much less about the Tolkien stuff than most.
Maybe. I don't know. But I don't know very much. It's been interesting to follow along and be
like, “Okay. I don't necessarily see how they can – Oh, they're different, but –”
[0:20:52] MC: They're different. They are different.
[0:20:55] IP: I'm learning. I'm learning. But it's been a lot of fun.
[0:20:59] MC: I think in aviation, especially as mechanics, we don't get a lot of representation in
the field as a profession. Not a lot of people think about aircraft maintenance, unless their flight's
getting delayed. Most people don't know what goes into maintaining aircraft. I think that there's a
fascination with aviation maintenance and the mechanical side of flying that a lot of people don't
get to see very often. I really enjoy being able to share that in that side of the industry.
[0:21:28] IP: Other than having well over a million followers across multiple social media
platforms, what's been the reaction from people? Is it more, “Yay, I'm learning about airplanes”?
“Hey, this is really cool. You're talking about Tolkien.” Or is it just, “I very much enjoy these
videos. I find them interesting”?
[0:21:48] MC: It's been a mix of all three. It's really interesting. There's people that follow me
and they'll comment and they'll be like, “I don't care about airplanes at all, but I love Lord of the
Rings.” Then there's people like, “I don't care about this Lord of the Rings stuff, but I love
airplanes.” For some reason, they both like the way that I deliver stuff. Then there's people that
are like, “I don't like airplanes or Lord of the Rings. But for some reason, I really like watching
your videos.”
[0:22:12] IP: Great.
[0:22:13] MC: It's in that. The one thing that's really surprised me, because I've been doing this
for about two years now, is that the reaction that I've received personally is been
overwhelmingly positive for the most part. I remember when my first video started going viral
and I was like, “Oh, no. Here comes the trolls.” Not the trolls that the fellowship encountered in
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Moria after they went into the Chamber of Mazarbul, which was the records chamber that they
found Balin’s tomb in. But more the trolls that you see in Internet comments. They never really
showed up. People have been really positive the whole time.
[0:22:46] IP: That's fantastic. I mean, I've often said that aviation's in my experience, been one
of the places where the community is rather tight knit. I assume that the Tolkien community is
probably very similar. I guess, I'm not totally surprised that the reception's been overwhelmingly
positive.
[0:23:08] MC: Yeah. It's been so much fun to do. I've learned to really enjoy making the videos.
For me, it's low stress. With some weeks, I'm like, “Yeah, I don't feel like –” I didn't make a video
last week. I didn't feel like it. I don't really have a content plan, or strategy. I'm just posting when
I feel posting something, when I have an idea. It's low stress and really fun. It's become a fun,
creative outlet for me.
[0:23:31] IP: What do your co-workers think?
[0:23:33] MC: The older guys usually have no idea that I do it. They don't care. They're like, “I
don't know what Lord of the Rings is.” Some people, the most of them, they think it's pretty cool.
They're like, “This is awesome, dude.” I don't know. I think most people think it's pretty fun. It
was really funny. One of the days I was working and one of the guys was like, “What are you
reading?” I was like, “Oh, Lord of the Rings.” He's like, “Oh. I think my wife really likes that.
Every time I walk by the TV, they're doing inappropriate stuff on the TV.” I was like, “I think
you're thinking of Game of Thrones, man.” Anyways, sorry.
[0:24:09] IP: That's, I mean, probably not the case. Yeah, it's a different show. Different movies.
[0:24:15] MC: Yeah. I think the reception there has been pretty good, too. It's fun to do.
[0:24:19] IP: Is there any place you want to take this, or is it just something that hey, this is fun.
I'm enjoying this. Don't mess with the good thing.
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[0:24:28] MC: It's mostly, I'm just having fun and enjoying it I don't really have any – I don't
know where I would take it. I don't know. What do you do? I didn't set out to be like, I want to
build a social media presence. I just thought it was fun. I just thought it was fun.
[0:24:47] IP: I’m going to make some videos about aircraft facts.
[0:24:52] MC: Yeah, the reception and the growth of it has been mind-boggling to me. I really
never expected anybody to watch any of these videos.
[0:25:01] IP: Yet, here you are, millions of views later.
[0:25:04] MC: Yeah. Yeah. There's been fun things that I got to do with it as a result of the
account. I don't take that for granted. I got to go to ComicCon for the Rings of Power Season
Two events. I've met some people that are musicians that I really look up to, and I've gotten to
hang out with them at their shows and stuff. That's been really cool and a fun, unexpected
journey, if you will, that's come about from this thing.
[0:25:34] IP: As someone who partially has the job, the reason I'm talking to you now is
because I made a map of where you could smell chocolate from a factory in Chicago. I totally
understand. It makes perfect sense to me why people are finding these videos and enjoying
them. Have you seen a particular, have the reaction, so-called reaction videos where somebody
sends something in and then you talk about that? Have people found that more engaging? Or is
it just across the board? Some videos are heavy hitters and then others, not so much?
[0:26:12] MC: It's random. I don't know how the algorithm works. I can't figure it out. I have
noticed that a lot of times, the ones where I stitch a video in after somebody's seeing tape, or
something like that go off a little bit higher. Or there was one where somebody's sitting next to a
broken window reveal on the airplane. I'm like, that's not a window.
[0:26:29] IP: Right. Right. Right.
[0:26:31] MC: Those ones seem to do really well. I think some of the reason is it takes you all
over the place. But I think that I try to, in those videos, like with the window and the speed tape
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one, I'm trying to – I'm hoping that what I can do is ensure to people that these are safe defects.
You know what I mean? None of this is jeopardizing safety of flight.
[0:26:54] IP: Well, they look kind of scary. They're cosmetic.
[0:26:58] MC: Yeah. Yeah. I totally get why somebody would see a mechanic put in tape on the
engine mig. Why is he putting tape on this? You're like, “Well, we can talk about that.”
[0:27:06] IP: So many reasons.
[0:27:07] MC: Yeah. So many reasons. Do you want your flight to have a four-hour delay
because you're waiting for sealant to cure, or do you want us to just throw some speed tape on
it?
[0:27:15] IP: I'm all for speed tape any day of the week.
[0:27:18] MC: Or like, sometimes people are like, “Oh, you shouldn't be flying a plane with that
much tape on the wing.” I'm like, “Okay. Do you want to wait for the plane to be repainted, or do
you want us to put some speed tape on it? Cause the painting is going to take a while and
you're in a class three maintenance station. There's no reason.”
[0:27:34] IP: Switching over from just the videos, but as a mechanic, is there a favorite plane
that you really love to work on, or a not favorite plane?
[0:27:43] MC: I have two answers. One of them is a joke answer and one of them is as a more
real answer. I always tell people my favorite plane is the Q400, the Bombardier Q400.
[0:27:53] IP: Okay.
[0:27:54] MC: My least favorite plane to work on is also the Bombardier Q400. It's the first plane
I ever worked on and it's very maintenance not-friendly. It's not friendly to mechanics. A lot of
things on it are hard to work on, and it's sometimes – but since it's the first one I ever worked
on, I was like, “Oh, this is just how planes are.” I didn't know any different. Then as I've grown in
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my career and started working on different fleet types, I'm like, “Oh, that thing sucks to work on.”
I do. I have so much respect for the Q400. I think my favorite plane to work on is probably the
777-200.
[0:28:31] IP: Why the 200, specifically?
[0:28:33] MC: I haven't worked on the 300 very often. I do heavy maintenance, do heavy
checks, and the 300 is just so much bigger that there's a lot more to do. Changing the landing
gear on a 300 is a little bit more involved than changing the landing gear on a 200. I really like
the 200. It works really well.
[0:28:52] IP: Cool.
[0:28:53] MC: The 300 is a little bit – the engines are a little bit too big. I'm like, “This is
ridiculous.”
[0:28:59] IP: They're only getting bigger.
[0:29:01] MC: Yeah, it's really cool. I like it. I'm just like, “Man, I don't want to climb up four
flights of stairs just to get to the top of the engine pylons. It’s wild, dude.”
[0:29:10] IP: It's a four-story building just to get to the top of the engine. Yeah. I guess, when
you think about it like that.
[0:29:16] MC: The 777, it's a pretty good plane to work on that. I've really enjoyed the 777.
[0:29:20] IP: Before I let you go. I thought we could play a game.
[0:29:23] MC: Yeah.
[0:29:24] IP: I'm going to name an airplane part.
[0:29:27] MC: Okay.
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[0:29:27] IP: I want to see how that relate, and we can go into as much, or a little detail as you
want, but I want to see if I can put you on the spot, how it compares and contrasts to Lord of the
Rings.
[0:29:38] MC: All right. Let's try.
[0:29:40] IP: All right. The APU.
[0:29:43] MC: The APU, Auxiliary Power Unit. That is what can provide electrical power and
pneumatic power on the ground to start, or stop the engines, which is a little bit different than
the starting of the events in the war of the ring that are kicked off after Frodo leaves The Shire
and begins his journey through the old forest, where he meets Tom Bombadil and has to cross
through the Barrowdowns before reaching the Town of Brie, where he would encounter Strider.
Then they would venture across the Midgewater Marsh eventually, until Frodo got stabbed on
Weathertop by one of the Nazgul. How's that?
[0:30:18] IP: Incredible. Because I, again, not rehearsed, not scripted, just off the cuff. I mean,
awesome. How about the flight data recorder?
[0:30:28] MC: A flight data recorder. Okay. The flight data recorder is also known as the black
box, which is what records inputs from the flights. That is different than maybe the records that
were kept in Minas Tirith that Gandalf, who was also known in Gondor's Mithrandir would go
through when he was scouring for Isildur’s count of the ring after he left The Shire for 17 years.
[0:30:53] IP: Perfect. Perfect. You want to do one more?
[0:30:55] MC: Yeah. This is fun.
[0:30:57] IP: All right. Let's go, flaps.
[0:31:00] MC: Flaps. The flaps high lift device, trailing edge of the wings. They're used to
increase lift, especially during phases of flight, like takeoff and landing. They're different than the
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flapping of the wings of the Great Eagles, which were sent to Middle Earth by the Valar Manwë,
who would rescue Gandalf from the peak of Orthanc after he was imprisoned by Sauron
carrying him to Rohan, where he would meet with King Theoden and take the horse Shadowfax
to head north.
[0:31:28] IP: Perfect. Love it. Max, you are not just an airplane mechanic. You are not just a
Tolkien fan, but you've got some other projects that you work on. Tell us, where people can find
Airplane Facts with Max, and some of the other stuff you're doing.
[0:31:44] MC: Yeah, Airplane Facts with Max. I have a TikTok, I have a Instagram. You can find
me there. I'm also, sometimes I stream games on Twitch when I have some free time after my
kids are asleep. You might see me streaming on Twitch sometimes. Again, that's Airplane Facts
with Max there. Then I write and record music under my name, Max Comer. You can find that on
Spotify, or Apple Music, or wherever you listen to music, really. It's not about Lord of the Rings,
or airplanes.
[0:32:13] IP: I was listening to some of the stuff before we chatted, and I was enjoying it. I was
like, “Oh, wait. We need to get ready to go now.” We'll put links to all of Max's stuff in the show
notes. We've been chatting with Max Comer from Airplane Facts with Max, an airline mechanic
with an encyclopedic knowledge of Tolkien's works, and just an all-around fascinating human
being to chat with. Max, thank you so much for coming on the show.
[0:32:37] MC: No, thanks for having me.
[END OF CONVERSATION WITH MAX]
[0:32:44] IP: Welcome back. Jason, do you have an encyclopedic knowledge of aircraft parts
and JRR Tolkien's work?
[0:32:52] JR: I can't say I have encyclopedic knowledge of anything ever, especially those two
topics, probably.
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[0:32:58] IP: Fair enough. Then we won't play the game that I played with Max for fear of
showing Max up. We'll say that, right? Let's see, we go to Saudi Arabia, because Riyadh Air has
finally placed its narrowbody order ordering 60 A321neo family-ish aircraft. We don't know
exactly –
[0:33:17] JR: Of some sort.
[0:33:19] IP: - are they regular neos, LRs, XLRs? Nobody knows. But that's the order and
there's 60 of them. Good for them.
[0:33:26] JR: Yeah. 60 of them, at some point of some flavor. We don't know when, don't know
what kind, but 60. That's what we know.
[0:33:34] IP: It's worth talking about, because it is, in fact, an order. It's not just a, we're thinking
about possibly considering ordering these.
[0:33:42] JR: That's good. Not an LOI. Not a memorandum of understanding. It is an order.
They want these airplanes and they'll get them eventually.
[0:33:50] IP: At some point.
[0:33:51] JR: Get at the back of the line.
[0:33:55] IP: Speaking of aircraft orders, we'll continue on the way with LATAM ordering a firm
10 787-9s, plus five more if they want them later on.
[0:34:06] JR: That's exciting. Particularly exciting was the absolutely ancient rendering that
Boeing put out of LATAM 787-9, which was really confusing, because LATAM has lots of 787-9s
that they could surely use an actual photo of. I mean, it was so dated, it had the One World logo
on the R1 door, which was – I think it was the R1 door. But that was probably the original
rendering from the original order. Are the photographers at Boeing on strike as well?
[0:34:35] IP: We paid money for this rendering. We're going to use it.
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[0:34:38] JR: We're going to use it. We're going to get some more use out of it. Yeah, I just
thought that was particularly funny. But good news for Boeing at a time where good news does
not seem to be the norm, or really ever come.
[0:34:51] IP: Well, we'll take it where we can get it. Good news for Airbus and Iberia as the first
A321XLR was delivered today. Went home from Hamburg to Madrid. It's scheduled to enter
service next week already.
[0:35:06] JR: Yeah. Weird that we left it for all the way down here as an also mentioned. This is
probably should have mentioned this earlier, but it's –
[0:35:14] IP: Ah.
[0:35:15] JR: - a derivative of a derivative of a reengined aircraft.
[0:35:20] IP: It's an impressive aircraft for a variety of reasons, all of which we've discussed.
We've done videos on it. We've written blog posts on it. It's been delivered. I'm excited to see it
in service, so we can certainly talk about it when Iberia takes it next week.
[0:35:33] JR: Yes. We will be much more excited when this aircraft does the thing that it was
built to do and Madrid to Boston on a mainline airline is not very exciting. When this aircraft
starts doing some truly impressive stuff, or when it hits the schedule of ULCC doing some
5,000-mile trans-oceanic route, that's when it will truly stretch its legs. But this ain't it. It's just the
first delivery.
[0:36:01] IP: Yeah. When we see Tampa-Abuja, then –
[0:36:04] JR: Ooh, that's a good one.
[0:36:06] IP: That's when we're going to be excited about it. But yeah, no. Congratulations to
Airbus and Iberia for taking delivery and –
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[0:36:12] JR: Getting literally anything out the door these days is a big deal.
[0:36:17] IP: Yes. Well, if you can't get new aircraft, Jason, maybe you can get some used
aircraft. Maybe 23 used aircraft.
[0:36:24] JR: Yeah. Well, if you're looking for some very yellow aircraft, a bunch of them, 23,
are about to hit the market, coming from Spirit Airlines, which is desperate for cash at this point.
519 million dollars in these aircraft, which is not chump change. Spirit will be getting rid of 23 of
its older A320CO aircraft family, which is going to put it – this is problematic, even more reliant
on its A320neo family aircraft, as we talked earlier. May not be the best-case scenario here, but
Spirit needs cash and it needs to do something by the end of the year when all of its debt will
come due. I'm sure half a billion dollars is going to go a long way, but that's also going to shrink
Spirit’s fleet and therefore, its route network quite a bit, I would think.
[0:37:17] IP: If you're just selling off a few dozen planes, that does not sound great. In any
outside of, we took delivery of a bunch of new planes, and so, now we're retiring this old fleet.
That's not what's happening here.
[0:37:31] JR: No, this is very much, we need to get rid of these aircraft to raise some capital. It's
also leading to the retirement of the A319 at Spirit as a whole, which I believe was always the
plan at some point, but maybe not this quickly. But yeah, that's the end of the 319 as a whole at
Spirit.
[0:37:49] IP: All right.
[0:37:50] JR: Yeah.
[0:37:51] IP: Jason, when safety regulators issue directives saying, “This is really, really
important that you do this, because something very bad could happen if you don't.” The
timelines are usually fairly quickly within X number of hours, or within X number of cycles. This
A220 software update that regulators say is very, very important that operators take care of,
how much time do they have to complete it?
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[0:38:25] JR: Two years. That is a long time. The story here is that A220 operators are told to
upgrade their flight control software to address “design deficiencies.” Reading a quote here from
Fight Global, as usual, of course, “The mandate follows occurrences of nuisance messages,
including rudder, ailerons, or spoiler failures, resulting from erroneous transmissions from their
remote electronic unit, which handles flight computer commands. This could do things like, not
prevent inadvertent autopilot engagement during takeoff, or unannunciated spoiler deployment,
all very bad things that you do not want to happen. These could lead to the disaster of some
sort. Very unlikely, but it's possible.
Very confused here why operators are being given two years to install the software update,
which of course, will become the new baseline production software. I don't really understand
why two years, why it's going to take that long. It's a software update. I mean, you should just be
able to plug a USB drive into the thing and hit enter and away you go. This can't be that
dramatic of an issue, but why would it take this long?
[0:39:37] IP: I'm not a flight control software engineer by any stretch in imagination. But I
assume that there are some sort of something. I honestly don't know why they give them –
unless, the update actually takes a very long time.
[0:39:53] JR: I don't see how it possibly – These are modern aircraft. It's not like they're loading
in new software using 4,500 floppy disks. At least, I hope not.
[0:40:03] IP: This isn’t the 767.
[0:40:06] JR: We both went there. We went different directions, but we both went there. In this
case, Transport Canada says, if these issues were to occur, it could lead to increased worst
workload and even a “large reduction in safety margins,” which isn't really something you want
to hear. If anyone happens to know why airlines are being given two years to do what seems
like a very easy to do software update, I'd love to hear it.
[0:40:34] IP: Absolutely. Email us at podcast@fr24.com. With airlines in Russia running low on
aircraft and with passenger numbers creeping back up on domestic flights, it sounds like,
Russia's putting out feelers to see if anybody else wants to operate domestic flights in Russia.
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At least that's what Reuters is reporting. While no official requests have yet gone out, it sounds
like, Russia is talking to places like Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan to see if they're willing to
operate domestic flights within Russia.
[0:41:13] JR: Yeah. Crazy how quickly we've gone from Russian airlines being allowed to wet
lease between each other to asking airlines from an entirely different country to operate
domestic flights. So far, apparently the quotes from the Reuters article, or other airlines in other
countries going, “Eew.” That's not going to be good for anyone because it could put that airline,
or that country in line for sanctions from pretty much everyone else at play. They probably don't
want that to happen. Man, that's a move of, I don't want to say desperation, but certainly, an
interesting twist. I can't imagine any airlines going to be jumping up the opportunity to do this,
because hey, maybe they never get their aircraft back.
[0:41:58] IP: Well, there's that. I mean, but what's one rung above desperation, whatever that
is?
[0:42:04] JR: I don't know. Email us.
[0:42:08] IP: All right. Fine then. Let's close the show with something that has only taken eight
years. The final report on the crash of Egypt Air Flight 804 was published yesterday, the 29th of
October 2024, which is roughly eight years, or more than eight years after the crash of the
A320, which departed Paris bound for Cairo.
[0:42:41] JR: Does this predate the podcast? I think it does.
[0:42:44] IP: It's eight months before the podcast.
[0:42:46] JR: Wow. Okay. We're only getting the final report now.
[0:42:49] IP: Correct.
[0:42:50] JR: Wow.
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[0:42:52] IP: The investigation has been going on for a very, very long time. The crash
happened in 2016. It was investigated by Egypt, then the French got involved, both as where
the aircraft took off from, but also because it was an Airbus A320. The French investigators were
a party to the investigation as the state of manufacture. They found the wreckage about a month
after the crash, and a few months after the crash, so at the end of June, the Egyptian officials
said that the flight data recorder indicated that there was smoke and high temperatures and soot
on the forward part of the aircraft. At that point, nothing more was said.
A few months go by, there's no update on the investigation, and the French get involved. At the
end of the year, Egyptian officials say, traces of explosives are found on the bodies. At that
point, everyone is thinking that it could possibly, or probably be a terrorist attack. Then in 2017,
the French BEA conducted its own investigation. They couldn't find any explosive residue. No
one has ever claimed responsibility for the crash and the BEA put together a scenario in which
there was a rapidly spreading fire on the flight deck.  They didn't say exactly what could possibly
cause that fire at the time.
Fast forward from – this is mid 2018 by now. Four years go by, the BEA conducts further
analysis and makes a report on possibilities about how this fire could have been caused, one of
which was an oxygen leak in the first officer's emergency oxygen mask, as well as cigarette
smoking on the flight deck. Today, or yesterday, Egypt Civil Aviation Authority, so that was April
2022, by the way. Two years later, after a lot of back and forth and contentious meetings, Egypt
releases its report, saying that the crash was the result of an explosion in the galley behind the
flight deck. The BEA continues to disagree with that analysis and asks that their report and
comments on the final report be amended to Egypt's final report, similar to what the NTSB did
for the Ethiopian report into the crash of ET302.
[0:45:45] JR: Yeah. This is also somewhat similar to the 1999 crash of Egypt Air Flight 990,
where the Egyptian authorities and the US NTSB had very different outcomes to their respective
investigations. Interesting that that keeps happening with Egypt Air, very different situation. This
time, of course, because I don't know if we'll ever truly know what happened. Yeah, there's a bit
of a pattern there, isn't there?
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[0:46:14] IP: Part of the issue here is that there were allegations that the aircraft should not
have been flying, that there were defects with this particular aircraft that should have prevented
it from operating passenger service. I don't think we'll ever know for sure. But you can look at
the report, which we will link in the show notes. If you scroll all the way down, because that is a
long report, it's 660 pages, lots of pictures, lots of graphs. If you scroll all the way down to the
bottom, they have the chart section, or the table section that has what the BEA wants to
comment on, the Egyptian investigator's response, and then how that conversation is reflected
in the final report, which I think is incredibly important to see, that investigators are coming at
this from different angles, and that you have the ability to see where the investigators are
drawing their information from, and how those ideas about what caused the crash, how they
come to be in the final report. I think it's worth looking at, regardless, and I think it's very
interesting about how the international cooperation works in an exit investigation. Jason, what
do you say we stop talking and wait for whatever is going to happen to happen after?
[0:47:45] JR: Okay. Well, it's got an hour and 15 minutes before we typically record, so I'm sure
nothing will happen.
[0:47:52] IP: All right.
[0:47:53] JR: It's all good.
[0:47:54] IP: Well, if something does happen, we will certainly talk about it on next week's
episode. Until then, this has been Episode 292 of AvTalk. I am Ian Petchenik, here, as always
with –
[0:48:08] JR: Jason Rabinowitz. Thanks for listening.
[END]
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