25 Players in 25 Years: Brian Baldinger on Nos. 15-12

00:00:03
Speaker 1: Welcome to episode three of NFL Daily's twenty five Players in twenty five Years. Yes, we are talking about the best players of this century, and there is no one I would rather talk to than Brian Baldinger of NFL Network. Baldy, you've been covering the league this whole time. I'm going back and watching some of the highlights. You're on the Fox calls for some of these guys, and of course you've been with us at the network, so a great perspective that I know you'll give. And I had to get you on a show where there will be an offensive lineman. No spoilers yet, but there will be an offensive lineman on this one.

00:00:42
Speaker 2: All right, well, well done. You can't have a list without a few offensive linemen on. I know that.

00:00:47
Speaker 3: Let's just get right to it.

00:00:48
Speaker 1: We're not starting with the lineman, but we are starting with someone that I loved watching when I was starting my career.

00:00:54
Speaker 3: Out number fifteen, Ladanian Tomlinson. And the hand off to Thomlinson left sun and he will.

00:01:04
Speaker 2: Gallop into the unzone, charger fans or witnesses to history.

00:01:09
Speaker 3: The kid from Rosebud, Texas get done good.

00:01:13
Speaker 2: I want to thank you for allowing us.

00:01:15
Speaker 3: To witness your greatness. Wow, what a player, what a person we want to bring?

00:01:22
Speaker 2: Y'all want to be?

00:01:23
Speaker 4: Jimps, What y'all want to be?

00:01:24
Speaker 5: Joe from the left hatch on second and four, A little pitch pack to LT.

00:01:29
Speaker 3: He's looking at Crow George the enzone. Gates got it cut down.

00:01:36
Speaker 4: That's why you're the greatest.

00:01:37
Speaker 2: That's why you're the greatest.

00:01:39
Speaker 1: Ladaian Thomasson one of the best to ever do it. He could run, he could catch, and heck you get him on the move. He could throw a little bit right there to Antonio Gates. Just an incredible career. There was a six year stretch Baldy where he goes three first team All Pros and three second team All Pros mixed in there.

00:01:59
Speaker 3: And during that stretch he played.

00:02:01
Speaker 1: The running back position about as high a level as I've ever seen anyone play it.

00:02:07
Speaker 2: Well, you know, we've all got a chance to work with them, Greg, so we know what kind of person is. So you got to factor that into because just you know the person, the quality of person, the team, ate all that, but to get the god given talent, I mean, there's so many flashback memories I remember Greg doing the Senior Bowl his year coming out of TCU, And I remember we were going to practice and I'm doing the game for TNT. I'm walking down to practice with all the guys, and the first person I see is number five. It's Ladani and Thompson. I'll never forget it, Like he just moved differently than everybody. So that like that was my first memory visually of watching LT. Then I remember, you know, Marty Schottenheimer was his coach for a while with the Chargers, and I remember, you know, back when veteran players, even star players used to play in the preseason. Greg, I'll never forget like the first play of the game of a Chargers preseason game, they flipped it to LT and you know it was a touchback. You get the ball to twenty yard line. He goes eighty yards off right side, like literally eighty yards. Nobody touches them. He lays the ball on the ground. Marty Schottenheimer waves them over to the sideline says, you're done, not just done for the day, but you're done for preseason. Eighty yards one play. We've seen enough. Let's get ready for the season, you know, I mean he's had a year. We had one hundred catches in the season you mentioned, you know, those first seven or eight years, Greg, he averaged four hundred touches a year. Like you give any back in this league over the last twenty five years, four hundred touches. They were done the next year, Jamal Anderson, Sean Alexander Duce mccows. So you go through a list of guys four hundred touches, it like it really really breaks a running back. LT just thrived on the volume of work that he got, especially those first eight years.

00:04:02
Speaker 1: Right, So the stats are crazy, and his first nine seasons he scores nineteen more touchdowns than any player in NFL history. And so that's the meat of a guy's career. And even if you look at the whole career touchdowns per game, only Jim Brown goes better than him. And you're absolutely right about saying that he did it year after year after year. I have to point it out because I was in the industry at the time. He's got to be the fantasy football go I actually went and checked some stats and he had to be. Like of this era, if you're giving points per reception, he has the most fantasy points per reception of any of these running backs by so much. It's ridiculous because you're absolutely right, Like, usually you have a season like that MVP season he had, and you mentioned what a great person he was. He won the Walter Payton Man of the Year and the MVP in the same season, and you expect some sort of fall off the next year, and then it's just like, nope, I'll just go for another two thousand arts from scrimmage.

00:05:00
Speaker 3: He did that three different times.

00:05:02
Speaker 1: So it was the consistency and the complete game that he had, There's no.

00:05:05
Speaker 2: Question about it. And you know, just the way that they used him. And and then you got to talk about how he played in the postseason, whether with the Chargers or the Jets. He played very well in the postseason. Even after all that that that stuff isn't even mentioned when you just look at the regular season stats. But uh, you know, I just think that he had this. You know, I think all of the very great athletes have a different level of stamina than everybody else. Like I've played my share of Hall of Fame players and they just didn't get fatigued. And you know, to see a guy like LT we could talk about all the stats. We can all read him, greg Andr, and he's worthy of all of those. But then you know, he didn't miss games, and he came back to next week, and he didn't get tired out there, you know, in September out there in San Diego, whatever the temperature was. All of those kind of things mixed in as well, and then like, look, he was the focal point of the offense. Okay, if you want to stop a running back, go stop him. Well, everybody had a hard time even with that was the focal point of stopping him because the way that he was built was a big part of his success. I mean, the size of his body from the waist down, it's it's enormous, Like he could handle the punishment. But then at the same time, he was built, you know, almost like an offensive guard from the waist down on a five ft ten frame. But then he had incredible elusiveness and ability to stop and start and make people miss. Like that was the other part. He could truck you, but he basically made you miss and then he outran you.

00:06:42
Speaker 1: I love that you brought that up in sort of how you first saw him move at TCU, because I do think of the contact balance like he was very tough to get on the ground. And I found a quote while researching this from Marshall Folk, who I would put right there, maybe even a little above lt And the reason he's not on this list we're cutting it off at two thousand. Some of his best years were before two thousand, and otherwise he would be on this list. Ladanian Tomlinson, by the way, it is the highest running back on this list. But what Fox said that was so interesting to me was Ladanian can do everything that I do just as well. But the difference is if you want to give him the ball on the inside on the goal line situation just to run over someone, he's even a little better than me at doing that. And look, Marshall Falk believes in his greatness because he was one of the greatest players of all time. So for him to say that about Ladanian Tomlinson, who was a big play waiting to happen when he got in the open field and was so not crafty but so precise as a receiver, for him to say that, yeah, he had all that, but he had a little more even with the power game.

00:07:49
Speaker 3: That really speaks volumes to me.

00:07:51
Speaker 2: Well, what's interesting, Greg is I remember, you know, his signature move at the goal line was to leap over everybody. And he learned that he watched Walter Payton, you know, so Walterver Payton is the one that went up and over. He would protect the ball, he would go backwards over and like I remember one day we were doing you know something out in Culver City on his leap and we had like these high pitch, like these high jump pits out there for him to kind of emulate it the whole thing. But his thing was, you know a lot of guys are afraid to do that dive over a pile at the goal line because he gets the ball knocked out. Well, he strapped the ball to his chest the way Walter Payton did. And you know that year when he scored thirty one touchdowns, I forget the number of runs that were touchdowns were from two yards in, but he literally could take off every bit from the three yard line and go over the top to score.

00:08:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, and obviously a very smart player. But everyone on this list. It's funny because you could basically say this bout, You're not going to get this far unless you're an incredibly hard worker and incredibly intelligent, but he had that feel of man. He would get on the defenders so quickly, he would eat up that open space. And then when he would get in the space, he could make you move and make you miss in tight quarters. So Lorenzo Neils spoke about that, his longtime full back, that they don't they don't really play football Baldy like they did back with Marty Schottenheimer and those Chargers teams.

00:09:18
Speaker 2: Lo' neil never cared. He never cared if he ever cared a ball one time in a season. He was the eyes of LG so many great backs in the history of this game. But you know those that run with him, I mean they're still best friends, as you can imagine. But I mean that run of those two guys, you know, I formation, you know, lead back, all that kind of stuff that we all kind of you know, went through. We all, I mean, I played in a number of those type of systems. You know, we don't see much of that anymore, unfortunately.

00:09:47
Speaker 1: Yeah, the Chargers that that team and aj Smith had put together with Marty, and then even after Marty, one of the great teams that didn't get over for the top like Ladanian Tomlinson would do at the goal line, didn't quite break through because of some of those Patriots teams.

00:10:06
Speaker 3: I'm glad he had that time with the Jets.

00:10:08
Speaker 1: He really enjoyed it, said that was one of the best moves he ever made in his career. Really enjoyed the back half of his career with the Jets, so salute to him.

00:10:16
Speaker 3: He was a tough man to take down.

00:10:18
Speaker 1: One of the few players I guess historically that I can imagine actually being able to tackle la Danian Tomlinson in the open field. Is our next player, number fourteen, Luke Keikley top ten, third five, right side Aje.

00:10:40
Speaker 2: Lou Chick.

00:10:41
Speaker 3: Very quiet, he goes onto the field, flips switch, won't it tech?

00:10:45
Speaker 2: All right?

00:10:46
Speaker 3: I'm all over him. We gotta go now, hut.

00:10:53
Speaker 2: Anybody know you?

00:10:56
Speaker 3: Third and three?

00:10:57
Speaker 4: Here the comments kick Lee who catched the Manning back at the favorite blitz fit in these linebackers up inside and Luke Keithhley just so fast.

00:11:06
Speaker 3: Luke Keith Cleck.

00:11:07
Speaker 2: He reminds me of Peyton Manning.

00:11:09
Speaker 3: Guy that is totally prepared, that is going to know what's gonna happen before it takes place because he has studied so much on.

00:11:16
Speaker 2: Second down, Rombo looking to throw has time, sings it and it's intercepted at.

00:11:20
Speaker 3: The thirty eight yard line. Keith Lee has it.

00:11:23
Speaker 2: He's gonna go into the house. It's the second pick six of the game for the Carolina Panthers.

00:11:30
Speaker 3: Luke Kickley, he was a problem.

00:11:32
Speaker 1: And Baldy, I know you're joining this series midway through, but I wanted to let you know I wasn't thinking about guys who accumulated stats over a long stretch. I wanted to pick the guys who I thought were the absolute greatest at what they did when they did it at their very best. And to me, Luke Keighley defines that it's not gonna take him off this list. To me that he retired when he was twenty eight years old because every single day he was in the field in the NFL, he was one of maybe the best linebacker off ball that I've ever seen.

00:12:07
Speaker 2: At what he did, well, let me just put it in a nutshow for you, Greg, Like if you didn't block Luke Keickley, he made every tackle. It was just that simple, Like he literally took the right angle diagnosed to play. It was as if he stood in the offensive huddle, heard the play call, heard the quarterback explain the play to all ten other players, and then he went and defended the play. That's that's literally how it looked. I remember, uh, I mean his last year in Carolina. I remember his final game he didn't play is the final game of the season was against the Saints. I'll never forget. And I was announcing the game and I saw him and I wasn't sure if he was playing not playing, But you know, he had the injuries, and you know, you know, certainly they curtailed his career. But all I wanted. I had a show called Film Sessions that NFL Films produced, and all I wanted was Luke to come into the film room with me and explain the game. Because when you sit down with him, I don't know that anybody can explain the game better than Luke. And what he sees, what he studied, how he immersed himself in it, what he gleamed from it. I Mean, there's an old saying that linebackers. Two old sayings that are always true to a great linebacker. One, if you know the formation, you know the play. So he knew the formation. He basically knew the play and then it's always slow to you know, all right, so that you can prevent the cutback and the reverses and some of the other things. But I mean he was very difficult to fool, and he was very difficult to block. I mean, if you're a guard trying to cut him off of the backside, I mean you did have any chance. So then he ruined your run game. And so then you had to figure out, well, how are we going to move them? How are we going to block them? Like do we go straight at him? Because he was two hundred and forty five pounds, he knew how to take on a block, a lead block from a full back or a guard, so knew how to take it on and shed it, you know, and he was very good at that part of it as well.

00:13:58
Speaker 1: Yeah, in a way, he almost like broke the game because I loved that having that Tony dungee clip in there by the way, our producers Eric Roberts, Chris Bobona just killing it and Chris has the biggest smile on his face listening to Utac ball to keep it up, Baldy.

00:14:12
Speaker 3: It's awesome. But he was such I mean.

00:14:14
Speaker 1: He wasn't like a lightweight guy, but you know, under two hundred and forty pounds. That's the only reason why he didn't go even higher in the draft. And some people I remember at the time, were surprised they took Keighley that high. They said, why would you take Luke Keighley that high when you have John Beeson who was a fantastic player at middle linebacker, and you had Thomas Davis who had an awesome career like an all time Carolina Panther on the weak side, and they just knew this guy was too good. And Beeson made the mistake of he got injured during his rookie year. Kickley's on the outside and they put him on the inside, and he.

00:14:45
Speaker 3: Never moved his entire career.

00:14:47
Speaker 1: Baldi every single year he was either a first team All Pro, a second team All Pro, or the defensive Rookie of the Year. Because yeah, that first season he got Defensive Rookie of the Year and the next he gets Defensive Player of the Year.

00:15:01
Speaker 3: That was twenty thirteen. I don't even think that was his best year.

00:15:04
Speaker 1: The best year I thought was when they went to the Super Bowl and you heard the call at the very beginning of him making that pick six in the NFC Championship Game of him sacking Peyton Manny. In the Super Bowl, I know they didn't win it, but it wasn't because of that defense. That defense led by Luke Keigley, to me, was an all time defense that just happened to go against another all time defense in that Super Bowl against the Broncos.

00:15:27
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I think they were fifteen to one that year. You know, Cam was the MVP. I've had a fantastic season, but I remember going to training camp I think it was that year, and they trained at Watford College, Okay in South Carolina, so you know it's you know, it's one hundred degree day out there, but they've got Ron Rivera's got a pretty significant offense defense scrimmage lined up for so I could wait him out there and watching practice. I mean, to watch Keithley go at it with Cam, you would have thought it was Sunday like it was game the way that they went at it like it just there's something about the competitive fire of that practice that I've never forgotten. And kick Ley drove it on defense. He was you know, you saw you know, guys talking about him flipping a switch. You know, a game day, and that's true because you get them, you know, an hour after practice and he was back to being it's just very reserved, very thoughtful, insightful individual. But on the field the emotions ran hot. But you know, to him, game day was the test that you study all week, you do all this film study, you take all these notes, and then Sunday was the test, like let's go do something about let's go you know, let's sho shut this run game down. But it's way more than that. I mean, his ability to read route combinations, to know what's going on behind him, you know, in the passing game and you get into those passing lanes. He might be as good, you know. I mean, there's there's Ray Lewis, there's a bunch of guys, but I mean he might be as good as anybody from that department of under standing the passing game from the inside linebacker spot as we see.

00:17:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm glad you said that, because look, he led the league in tackles while he was in the league by far. He was the leader who second tackles for loss while he was in the league. But his his play and coverage, how he could adapt to how the NFL was changing.

00:17:16
Speaker 3: Was so awesome. I actually have a clip.

00:17:19
Speaker 1: Let's play when he had two interceptions against Romo in back to back plays. The second one is just amazing.

00:17:26
Speaker 3: Second and thirteen Romo. I can see you from He's on something by Keithley. He clean signed the twenty to the ten.

00:17:34
Speaker 2: And city end zone for another Panther defensive touchdown.

00:17:39
Speaker 4: It's a defense that forced five turnovers against the Redskins.

00:17:44
Speaker 2: Thinking right up before they left off Sunday, first down row and.

00:17:49
Speaker 3: Can't play right back with another one. Can you believe it? Back to back plays?

00:17:55
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you're watching on YouTube, you could see Luke Keithley what do they call in the poll, you know, sticking with Jason Witten, a tight end running up the seam and catching a pass over his shoulder. And if you're looking at the time, Baldy, it's the exact same time that ends one play, two thirty six left in the second quarter, and the exact same time that starts the next play. And Luke Kickley's does end in the game for the Carolina Panthers.

00:18:17
Speaker 2: Well, he's there's a Tampa two defense. The safeties are widening and he's got you know, number three down down the seam, it happens to be witting. And you know, Romo had a great relationship with Witten and most most middle linebackers. I mean, you pick a great one, Brian Urlacker. A lot of guys are running that defense. But you know, but for him to get his head around, and you see that most guys don't get their head around. They play the play blind. They run the ball if it's being thrown, they're looking at the eyes of the receiver and then they're defending it when the receiver goes to play. But he got his head around and then got his eyes on the ball before he took it away. That's that shows you the level of coordination and athletic ability that it took, because not guys can make that play. No.

00:19:01
Speaker 1: And yeah, like I mentioned, he got that Defensive Player of the Year early in his career twenty thirteen. Actually when it wasn't there wasn't like an obvious pick, and I think everyone just looked around.

00:19:11
Speaker 3: It's like Luke Keegley is the best defensive player.

00:19:14
Speaker 1: In the league right now, even though he wasn't getting like sacks or any like a ton of sacks. Although he wasn't like a sneaky good blitzer when they asked him to do that as well.

00:19:21
Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember Greg Carolina went out to play the forty nine ers. Kyle Shanahan had gotten into San Francisco. He's running his offense with all the priest and at motions and shifts and all that, and they ran the ball down Carolina's throw and so it was, it was. It was eye opening. It was what it was. And because there was like three or four plays where they didn't block Keekley and he didn't make the play and they literally took him out of the play with the motions and the shifts, and so I broke it all down, and so it's like Monday, I break it down. I actually posted it right, and how good San Francisco was in the motions and how they moved Keekley. And so I get a call on TUESDA and I don't recognize the number, but it's Ron Rivera and he's like, you know, Baldi, I don't usually watch your stuff, but my wife does. And I think her name is Judy, but I might be wrong. But anyways, he goes. My wife was watching it. She showed it to me and she said, you should take a look at this, you know. Ron. So Ron watches it and he's like he's like he's starting to pick my brain because Kickley never gets moved like that, like that he's looking at it like Ron himself a linebacker. He's looking at it through linebacker's eyes and he's now picking my brain. What did you see that we didn't see? Like? How did they what? What? Because he's like any coach, like, how do we make sure this to prevent this from ever happening again? It was so rare that literally Ron it was forced to pick up the phone and called me, asked me what I what I saw in the game.

00:20:49
Speaker 1: Ah, that's that's an amazing story and it's true, like seeing that would just absolutely stun you. And it's a credit to Kyle Sannyon because I love what Tony Dundee said that he was like a quarterback. I think he buying the physical ability because I mean, let's not sleep on he was just a physical beast. I mean he had all the speed and the power when he was tackling that you would ever want. He had twenty four tackles in a single game, and Panthers coaches swear it should have been twenty six because that was the record at the time. They said, we got him down for twenty six, but they had him for twenty four. It became such a thing, Baldy. I don't know if you remember, like watching these games, whenever anyone would make a tackle for the Panthers, the crowd would just go lou But it wasn't even Luke. It was just sometimes it was Thomas Davis. Sometimes it was just like pick your other white guy. It was just like they just assume Luke Keigley made a tackle every single time.

00:21:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I mean it's easily done. Although you know him and Thomas Davis, there was a pretty significant competition, yes, about getting to that tackle and claiming that tackle. So there was a race to the ball.

00:21:52
Speaker 1: One of the best duos of my lifetime. And yeah, all these players, of course, the very best of the best. As Baldy is, let's take a quick we will be back with number thirteen, back on NFL Daily's top twenty five players of the last twenty five years. This is a man who initially was in my top ten. I moved him up, I moved him down. No matter where you put him, you gotta recognize he has the best nickname of anyone in the top twenty five.

00:22:30
Speaker 3: Number thirteen, Calvin Johnson.

00:22:34
Speaker 2: He left looking deep, grow into the end zone, wants Calvin well covered.

00:22:38
Speaker 3: He goes up, He makes the cats. Why do you kidding me? Come back?

00:22:43
Speaker 2: A drovia?

00:22:44
Speaker 4: Did it again?

00:22:45
Speaker 2: Touchdown the true Lyons, fab Worths three Bengals. Drake got him and Calvin went up and hauling.

00:22:52
Speaker 3: In fifty yards in a score. Jill Realms four yards away, Johnson Stafford.

00:23:01
Speaker 2: Try into the record books a single season, all the time NFL receiving yardy to prefer I've never.

00:23:10
Speaker 5: Met a humbler, harder working after Kisley.

00:23:14
Speaker 4: Outstanding player than you're sure.

00:23:17
Speaker 1: Book Calvin Johnson aka Megatron, a guy where if you just start adding up the All pros, you know, three first team AP pros one second. Maybe not as much as some of the other guys atop this list, but when I thought about greatness, kind of like Keikley, even though the career was shorter, what could you possibly do with this man six five, two hundred and thirty nine pounds and ran a four to three five. To me, he's the definition of one in one, So I could have put him any lower than this. What do you remember most about Calvin Johnson's career, Baldy Well, I mean, just.

00:23:52
Speaker 2: The uniqueness of what you described. We've never seen a guy that size, weight, uh forty times leaping ability, I've seen a guy with that those many that that many identifiable features, okay, and then the passion for the game, the hands, everything that goes with it. So that's the first thing. He led the league, if I'm not mistaken here, He has led the league in I mean he had over two hundred targets in the season, you know, when he had caught one hundred and twenty two pass He led the league in targets, receptions, He's led the league in yards obviously almost two thousand, led the league in touchdowns. He led the league in every department at one point or another in one year or another. But I mean he just compacted, you know. I mean he retired in league thirty, and you know he did all this before basically aged thirty. But I remember his rookie year and I don't know, I guess I was announced the game for Fox and there was that Lincoln Financial field and he went up for a ball. This is the only time he was ever I ever saw him injured. He went up for a ball. I don't know who the corner was, Sidney Brown. I'm not sure who it was, Sheldon Brown maybe, but regardless, he goes up for the ball, and I mean he came down right on his back, and I mean he just laid there and I think he only played like ten games that year, but I don't know how many times while he was laying down we showed the highlight. There wasn't a single person on the planet that could have gone up as high as he went up to go get that ball. And unfortunately, when you're that big and you could jump that high, sometimes those falls hurt. They kind of took, you know, took a pounding on him. But you know his ability, just like the play against Cincinnati and your b roll right there, I mean just to out jump three defenders right there to get the ball. There's a lot of those catches throughout his career where literally you could just throw it up and let him go get it, and he could have taken that Moniker you know, always never never covered that could just call Megatron mat.

00:25:52
Speaker 1: Yeah, It's just like there was nothing you could do with it. And you mentioned that that injury, and it did slow him down his rookie but for the most part in his career he was durable. He missed a couple games here and there towards the back end, but by the end, you know, he basically was playing every game every season and he went out on top. That does mean something to me. I'm not gonna knock a guy that he didn't have his thirties when he was the second youngest Hall of Fame player ever, when he's racking up yards play after play. You mentioned that there were plays that he could just make that no one else could in the Yeah, he's jumping over guys in triple coverage.

00:26:27
Speaker 3: Let's actually watch another play.

00:26:29
Speaker 1: This is gonna be against the Green Bay Packers in twenty fifteen.

00:26:36
Speaker 3: Roun the seventeen.

00:26:40
Speaker 5: Tring and it's a touchdown right over Sam Shields.

00:26:45
Speaker 3: How about the jump he gets the left toe win.

00:26:50
Speaker 4: Yeah, Watch what he does to get that left foot down holding onto the football.

00:26:56
Speaker 3: Yeah, you got that other hand back on it. That would have been look at him control by the nose.

00:27:02
Speaker 1: That's incredible because he just he made other NFL players just look like regular mortals, like he was an adult playing with a bunch of kids.

00:27:10
Speaker 2: He's megatronic. He's megatronzed from another planet, right, I mean that he literally was and and so great nickname. It's a great talent. You know, like the other Hall of Famer walk In Hall of Famer and Barry Sanders. I mean their careers were short, but in those compressed period of time, ten for very, nine for Calvin, they were the best player at their positions. It was hard to argue that. And so over that period of time, that was the most lethal receiver in the game. And look, I mean Randy Moss was, you know, was that guy. But you know Randy was at six y five, you know, two forty. You know, he was certainly a freak athlete in his own right. But I thought, you know, Calvin Johnson's ability to take a five yard shallow cross and turn it into a touchdown or a long run afterwards, and that stride of his was just you know, there's something graceful. You know, it's like watching Secretariat run. You know, it's just something graceful about the athlete that he was and how smooth and easy he made everything.

00:28:11
Speaker 1: Look, yeah, that's a great It's a great comp for him because I don't know what else it would be, but at that size, Yeah, it was just kind of a beautiful thing to watch. And those those three straight first team All pros, and he had a second one in there too. Was actually towards the back end of his career. And you mentioned the record breaking season, but I'll spell it out. It was nineteen hundred and sixty four yards still the all time record for receiving yards in a single season. He had one hundred and twenty two catches that season, and he just made things that felt a little impossible feel possible.

00:28:42
Speaker 3: So Baldy, it.

00:28:43
Speaker 1: Wasn't even in that season that he had his three hundred and twenty nine yard game against the Cowboys. That game had fourteen catches, and that to me was a symbolic of what that era was like for the Lions. They won that game thirty one to thirty. So all these catches that he's making, they needed every single one of those three hundred and twenty nine yards because the defense usually wasn't there for them, and he had Matthew Stafford helping him out along the way, so it's not like he was in a bad spot that the organization let him down a little bit. But he did everything that he could absolutely do to lift them up, no.

00:29:17
Speaker 2: Question about it, no question. I mean, there was not I mean, I remember Matt Millan was there as you know, the general manager, and you know, they went through some quirky head coaches and all that. I mean, he survived all of that, and he was like, look, if you wanted to defend Detroit, you had to defend Calvin Johnson. And so that's that's what the game plan was for defense. How do we not take Calvin Johnson out? How do we how do we slow how do we like at least limit him and could try to contain him because we always going to get catches and we always going to make some big catches and he's going to force all kinds of pass interference calls and all that stuff, you know, But how do we, you know, how do we take care of everybody else because we know he's probably.

00:29:59
Speaker 1: Going to get most his right, there's this famous screenshot of forget who it was, whether it was the Packers just putting three guys on him in the in the red zone. They just were like, you can do whatever you want, you can, but like even before the snap, putting three guys on him before the snap, that you're not gonna you're not gonna score on us. How did you think he was like as a route runner and as a technician, Like there was there a part of his game that you thought was underrated in terms of that one but or was it more just he physically just kind of overwhelmed everyone.

00:30:30
Speaker 2: I think he physically just overwhelmed people. I mean, there's better route runners than Calvin Johnson, but that's okay when you have that kind of size and you can still come out of your brakes the way he came out of his bracey, you know, I mean, when you can still move like that, it doesn't really matter if you can turn guys around, because ultimately there was always separation because of his size and his leaping ability. And you know, some guys have to be great route runners because you know, they don't have the gifted size that Calvin had or that Randy Moss had, and so you know, he just by lining up wherever they put him, because they moved him everywhere. But just by lining up, you know, he had people in their backpedal, you know, before the ball was snapped, because last thing you wanted was to get beat deep by Calvin Johnson. You give him a lot of stuff underneath, maybe try to tackle the catch, but you didn't want to be on the highlight reel on Sunday night or Monday morning with Calvin Johnson, you know, going over the top of you.

00:31:25
Speaker 1: Yeah, and some of it to me is just these It's not just the numbers, but just the physical feats that few people could do. He has the most career games of two hundred plus receiving yards, the only one that ties him his Lance all Worth. So like it's almost like like a different generation of players. Calvin Johnson just felt like he came from another planet. And yeah, maybe not as many all pros. It's like it Antonio Brown, who's not on this list, or too who we've already done on this list, but when he was at his absolute best, he also has a consecutive one hundred yard you know game streak that no one else has. To me, he's he's one of one. He's Calvin Johnson. And yes he is number thirteen on the list. Our last guy we will talk about with you today. Baldy is coming up.

00:32:13
Speaker 3: Next, number twelve.

00:32:15
Speaker 4: Joe Thomas, with the third pick in the two thousand and seven NFL Draft, the Cleveland Browns select left tackle Joe Thomas, Wisconsin.

00:32:35
Speaker 5: Ten three hundred and sixty three. That's how many consecutive snaps I had.

00:32:39
Speaker 2: During my career.

00:32:41
Speaker 5: That number ten thousand, three hundred and sixty three is special to me in a lot of ways, and not just because it's an NFL record, but because it shows that I was there for my brothers ten three hundred and sixty three times in a row. Being an offensive lineman is all about being a servant and showing up for everybody else. Loyalty, consistency, doing something bigger than yourself, showing up for the man next to you. Those are the values that I learned at an early age, and those are the values that I took on.

00:33:10
Speaker 2: To the football field.

00:33:12
Speaker 1: Joe Thomas with one of the most handsome busts there in the Hall of Fame.

00:33:16
Speaker 3: They did a great job with that one.

00:33:17
Speaker 1: The hairs on point and a player who won an All Pro eight times, six times First Team, another two times second team, was the All twenty tens All Decade team for the Hall of Fame and for Pro Football Reference, and that snap streak, Baldy, I think helps to fight him. Not just that he stayed on the field, but that the repetitiveness and you can explain this as an offensive lineman to be excellent in so similar snap after snap and the discipline that that takes.

00:33:50
Speaker 3: What impresses you the most about Joe Thomas?

00:33:53
Speaker 2: Well, before I get to the question, one of my great regrets in life is I was offered an opportunity that the shot you have of Joe there on the boat, that's where he went draft day. He went fishing with his dad, and they offered me a chance to be with Joe on the boat fishing Draft Day with Joe. And they didn't know he was going to be a top ten pick. We didn't know which number whatever. He was a third pick. But like I could have been there with Joe.

00:34:24
Speaker 3: You got to be there, Baldy went. Where were you? What were you doing?

00:34:28
Speaker 2: You know? I mean, fishing just isn't one of my high priorities, Greg, Like, I don't know, like it could be really boring if the fish aren't jumping in the boat.

00:34:36
Speaker 1: Just like swimming with sharks, Baldy, you gotta eat more action starts.

00:34:41
Speaker 2: So anyways, I passed up that opportunity. I regretted it. All the things that Joe said speaks to a brotherhood that really offensive linemen understand the good ones and the great offensive lines. As a group, they all understand how important that number was because on a lot of those teams, they were a bad team, and they were amongst the worst teams for a much of Joe's career, And it would have been very easy to say, Okay, you know this, this elbow is popping out of his joint right now, I can take the Sunday off, or I could go back to for my brotherhood. Like he'll never tell you how many injuries he played through or played with in order to keep that streak alive. That's number one. But the consistency is what everybody strives. That's what repetition is all about. So that when you it's you know, you want to have that muscle memory, so that regardless of who you're playing against, you're gonna your technique is going to be the same play in and play out, no matter what happens on the play, Like you just flush it, you go to the next play. You do a consistently great job, and you string together seventy great plays during the course of the game, and that's that's the goal of every offensive lineman. You could have sixty nine great plays, but the one play where you give up the quarterback sack or the quarterback hit or a hold on a big play, that's all you think about the whole night into the next day, is that one bad play. And I think Joe took that just sitting down in the film room with him and watching him talk through techniques. You think you know the game, you think you understand the game like a lot of us do, and we work out it, we all work at it. But when Joe explains the game to you, it goes to another level now, and things that you might just take for granted, to set the hands, the hand placement, you know, in the run block, they aiming point. All these things that kind of just sort of looked like they run together. They never just ran together. To Joe, there was ultimately a purpose and a reason behind everything he did on the field, even though so much of the game is kind of random and kind of just okay, let's just play the play like you can't control it, but so much of it was what happened to or practice to prepare for those moments.

00:37:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's something too about a guy who comes into the league they actually have some success right off the bat with Derek Anderson, that team that went ten and six, and then after that it's just brutal. It's an incompetently run franchise who happened to make an absolutely great pick at number three. That was a great draft, and they made the great choice there with Joe Thomas, but just made mistake after mistake and it got worse and worse.

00:37:34
Speaker 3: And to show up, Baldy.

00:37:35
Speaker 1: And You've been in a lot of different NFL locker room, some great ones, I'm sure you were in some bad ones. I don't know, but like speak to I guess what it meant for a guy like Joe Thomas to be there for everyone that came through that organization over the ten years that he's there, and have it as an example of how to how to do something the right way, no matter how much they're blowing it from above in terms of how they're running the team.

00:38:03
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll look to Greg. I played on one to fifteen Indianapolis Colt season miserable, but I try to do what Joe did. What happens with the guy like Joe is It's very easy when you're you know, one to ten and you're just playing out the straight, it's very easy to cut every single thing short. All week long practice, treatment, lifting, you know, extra studying, well, it's very easy to cut all that stuff short, or when the wheels fall off during the game, to just start looking at the clock. And I think Joe just never did any of that. I think Joe prepared the exact thing to saying as if they instead of being three and thirteen, they were thirteen and three and they're going to the playoffs. I don't think the preparation ever changed. And so if you're a teammate of Joe, a young Joe Platonio, you know some of these guys that came through Cleveland, you know, with with Joe, like at least you got to see what a real pro looks like and what it's supposed to look like, and and maybe that maybe that guy that might shut it down or not go at it quite as hard, and watching Joe, maybe that makes you want to emulate him even that much more.

00:39:15
Speaker 1: I love that you mentioned that, because Thomas's legacy to me was a part of my thought. He's the highest offensive lineman on this list, and you could you could pick a lot of players. There's so many great players, but Buttonio, I'm forgetting about who else was there that was really great? I'll think of it in a second. But it also struck me. Miles Garrett talked about it. He's on this list, he's at the back end, and he's a guy whose first season was ZHO to sixteen and he he saw what Joe Thomas was doing in that season and as an example. So that's in terms of the way he played in Cleveland. But do you think he's had an impact Joe Thomas, that is as a technician to the to the players and the position that came after him.

00:39:57
Speaker 2: Oh, no question, no question. When I did a film study with him, we went back. You know, he was a shot putter in high school and you know his his his kick start was basically what a shot putter does, and he just basically took the physics of throwing a shot put. You know, both hands were rest, are were braced on the inside knee, his right knee, his left foot was back, and it was just like he was. We did an NFL films where we basically shot him shooting a shot put and then dropping back to you know, I saw, you know, one of the clips that he had was against you know, Terrell Suggs is one of the great pass rushers and one of the great matchups. During his tenure as a left tackle, going against Suggs, you know, twice a year, So there was a carryover from shot putting to what he developed as a left tackle. But I mean Lane Johnson has copied him that same start that Lane has and his strive to be as consistent with that start he did that Jason Peters learned that from from there. Jordan Mylotta. Now in Philadelphia, I've all basically watched Joe Thomas in the copy and that's just a couple guys. I'm just around those guys more frequently in Philadelphia, so I know how hard they studied him. But I would tell anybody that if you wanted, because I you know, you get ready for the draft, greg, you start watching these kids and studying them like I did Joe Thomas coming out of Wisconsin. But you know, what you're looking for at any level is consistency. And so what I'll say that if a young tackle asked me what I think, I go, Man, your your set has to be more consistent, like it's are changing up all the time, you're laying you're you're not hitting the right mark. Like you could literally put a blindfold on Joe Thomas and he would be able to hit that mark his hands, his punch, where his hands landed, what the mark, what the aiming point was, like he rarely ever missed. And that was a big part in the past game and the run Dame. It's interesting like he had this thing greg where if he was on the ground, nobody was allowed to pick him up off the ground. Like he couldn't get up off the ground. He had to off his back, so he had to roll over onto his numbach and then push himself up off the ground. But you go and see it like he talked about it and joking like he would never let anybody pick him up off the ground, you know, like gods just helping my guy up, like that, come up off, go Li You're you're diving in somebody's legs and you're cutting him whatever. Like he that was one of his little pet peeves, like nobody's picking me up off the ground. I'm getting myself up off the ground.

00:42:34
Speaker 3: That's amazing.

00:42:35
Speaker 1: And yeah, to me, he's the ultimate example of a guy who he's talked about it for offensive lineman, he had to eat so much, and he was he he focused so much on his career that his study habits of all the pass rushers and studying everything was mean. But he talked about how how much he had to eat and that it was it was unnatural for him, and he was He's the He's the guy who the second his career ended, suddenly three months later he he lost like fifty pounds and he looks like a totally different, amazing, crazy human being.

00:43:05
Speaker 2: Well, that happens to a lot of guys. You can go one or two ways. Either lose the weight or you gain it. But most of the guys that lose it like he did, they lose it quickly because all the things that you know, trying to cram ten twelve thousand calories into your body, like you got so tired of doing it and making sure that otherwise the weight, especially in training camp where you're in two days. Back in those days, you know the weight would fall off if you didn't gram ten thousand calories. So the first thing you do is, man, thank god, I don't have to overread anymore. And so just the fact that you're not just doubling twelve thousand calories into your body on a daily basis, your weight just naturally starts to go back to where it should be normally. So it happens to a lot of guys, and I didn't think Joe's going to be any different than those guys.

00:43:54
Speaker 1: So only six players in the history of the NFL made the Pro Bow. By the way that each of their first ten seasons. It's a wild list. It's Aaron Donald, Joe Thomas, Barry Sanders, Lawrence Taylor, and then we're going way back to mel Renfro and Merlin Olsen back in the sixties. So that's a hell of a list to be on, and so is this one. I felt a little out of my depth with the offensive lineman, so I hope I did you guys proud I got Walter Jones at the back end of the list. I have Zach Martin because I thought we needed to get an interior guy, and he, in terms of him compared to other guards, felt so ahead of the game. So he's in there around seventeen. So many other great players could have made the list, whether it's Tyron Smith. They thought about Trent Williams, your guy Lane Johnson. They all would have been worthy too. So I hope I did your position proud Baldy, and that you're okay with my selections.

00:44:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm okay with it. Yeah, I'm more than fine with it. Mean, you know there is you know, one particular left tackle with Baltimore Greg that you might want to consider. I'm going to drafted. I know he's drafted in ninety six. To know if that qualifies. You know the fact that you know we spent the early part of his years before the twenty five year cutoff right.

00:45:07
Speaker 1: There, Jonathan Ogden had such an amazing career even after two thousand that he did get strong consideration. And if you were counting him from ninety six on, he would probably be first. I would give him to you. But he is someone who came into the league. He was so good right off the bat, like maybe the best part of his career was his first five six years. Although he was he was something I I it helped me take the easy way out ball these sometimes when they had such great years before two thousand, because it was painful. It was like picking between children. Here to knock these guys off. So that helped me take Ogden off because I was like, let's give it to the guys who were almost entirely in this center.

00:45:47
Speaker 2: Yeah, about Joe and what you mentioned about the consecutive streak of you know, Pro Bowls for him and that rarely you know that list that you mentioned of six of five other guys, you know, I'm I'm not saying that the voting is always, you know, a popularity contest, but it's kind of easy just you know, who's the who's the best left tackle on the best team? Like you kind of go in that direction sometimes and you know, you're O sixteen, You're really going to put the left tackle on an old sixteen team in the Pro Bowl. A lot of players wouldn't vote like that, But that's the respect that he garnered. Even we know that the team and the organization was poor for long stretches of his career, Yet the attention that he still received consistency they played at is still a sign of great respect from from his peers and from the fans that vote, and the coaches and personnel people that all involved with voting.

00:46:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I tried to put a little more weight on the on the All pros, and he dominated with that and actually pff, which you know it's not perfect, but it's interesting because they're certainly not caring about what the record is or anything like that. And two of their best four seasons of all time just by by their total score from a tackle. Two of their best four seasons ever any player, any season. We're by Joe Thomas, just just shutting people down in a great division, by the way, four pass rushers, So I feel good about him. We're about halfway through this list. It's gonna be tough to top you, Baldy, Like I would just like to spin the dial and just here, like press a button and hear baldyse stories on all twenty five of these guys.

00:47:27
Speaker 2: Well, you know, you sort of like to stuff over years, but you know a lot of these things that just get triggered by the conversation. Rig So I'm I'm happy that you invited me in, got a chance to talk about, you know, for of these great players, many of the players I'd studied, you know, a week in, week out on film, so they're pretty still pretty fresh in the memory bank.

00:47:45
Speaker 1: Appreciate Brian Baldinger and Yeah, he'll be all over the airwaves for NFL Network in his podcasts in the upcoming season.

00:47:53
Speaker 3: Our next episode will be our fourth edition of.

00:47:56
Speaker 1: NFL daili's Top twenty five players in the last twenty five years. We're going to be joined by Yacht whose sports NFL analyst Nate Tice. There might be a certain player that he was a ball boy for coming up on that episode.

00:48:10
Speaker 3: We'll see you then,