Bruh Meets World… Meets World (Season 4 Recap)

00:00:19
Speaker 1: So as you know, and I think as a deal that dear listeners know at this point we all love to read. It's, you know, kind of a big deal that it's a big part of all of our lives in one way, shape or form reading. But we all tend to read different things, have different loves and mine, of course, as we all know, if there's not a wizard, I'm usually out right some sort of magical system is integral to me jumping into a book, and then it could be nine thousand pages long. I'm fine as long as there's some sort of elf wizard or somebody has some sort of a magical spell. So I found a new author. Her name is It's it's I hope I'm pronouncing it's right. It's r F Kwang or it's r F kwang. I'm not sure which one. It's k u A nng. Okay, she's The writing is absolutely incredible, And the story that I'm reading right now is called Babbel, and it is takes place at Oxford University in the eighteen hundreds in an alternate kind of timeline where all of power in the world is dictated by silver Wow, but the silver gets its power through language.

00:01:33
Speaker 2: Oh, I'm so in So that's what I'm saying. Is it etymology? Is that the study of language? So what they have to do.

00:01:42
Speaker 1: And it follows a young Chinese boy who's brought over from his family dies in China, and he's brought over because he thinks in Chinese, so he's raised by a professor at Oxford. I don't want to give too much away, but because to make a bar of silver work in a certain way, like an English word has to match up with a Chinese word to make the bar work. So let's say the word is like it has to work up that way to to then light the bar up. But the problem is words and the history of words are so different that what you think one word will mean actually won't, So the bar could just explode or means something else. So the actual book is about breaking down words and idioms where they come from, what they mean, all wrapped into like this magical system. And I'm reading the whole time just going like this should be called the Writer, Strong Strong Magic.

00:02:35
Speaker 3: It's so vocab hole as magic exactly.

00:02:39
Speaker 1: What it is, coupled coupled with the English dynasty at its peak, and all that entailed for the rest of the world kind of the uh, you know, imperialism that was taking place. It's really interesting, but every it sent me down, you know how you you talked not long ago about going down kind of the word rabbit hole. It sent me down, kind of the idiom rabbit hole of like, where.

00:03:02
Speaker 2: Did this come from? Where did this word come from? You know, how did we get you know, drop of the hat, mad as a Hatter?

00:03:07
Speaker 1: Where did all So there are some I'm not going to get into all of them, obviously, but read babble.

00:03:14
Speaker 2: It is just made for you.

00:03:16
Speaker 1: But one of the cool ones I heard was does anybody know where the term cut the red tape comes from? No, So, after the Civil War, soldiers literally had to stand in line and go personally to Washington, d c. To get their benefits, and they would have to wait hours and hours and hours for them to sort through all the rolled up pieces of paper to find a specific soldier's you know, history in the military, and all of those papers were tied.

00:03:48
Speaker 2: With red tape.

00:03:49
Speaker 1: Interesting, so that's where cut the red tape comes from. Mad as a Hatter?

00:03:53
Speaker 2: You know that one?

00:03:54
Speaker 4: Now?

00:03:55
Speaker 3: Oh so yeah, from the mercury right, that would make hatters were actually crazy because they were yes, correct, So that's why I like in Alison Wonderland and it's a mad Hatter because the hatters were always crazy.

00:04:11
Speaker 2: Under under the weather.

00:04:14
Speaker 1: So under the when sailors got sick, they would go to the front, underneath the forecastle of the boat, under everything else, so they'd be under the weather when they were when they were sick.

00:04:25
Speaker 3: Folks, I think.

00:04:26
Speaker 1: It's yeah, I think it's s C A L E. It's a it's a ship term, yeh. So they go under the bow.

00:04:33
Speaker 3: And to recommend a podcast to you will have you heard of no such thing as a fish?

00:04:39
Speaker 4: Oh?

00:04:39
Speaker 3: You would love this podcast. It's basically it's a British podcast where these people get together and they just present strange facts to one another. And but yeah, and the whole thing is just them, you know, like the one of them will present like a strange fact. And the title comes from the idea that like if you actually think of the definition of a fish, and and like all fish defy that definition, you know, Like so there's no such thing technically as a fish. There's some I don't know that it makes sense.

00:05:08
Speaker 1: Because if somebody says it's a fish, sandwich. Well, what does that mean? What kind of fish are you talking about?

00:05:13
Speaker 3: So the whole idea is like just these people like throwing out facts and you know a lot of them are historical or idiomatical, and you love it. It's like every time I'm listening to doing that, gotta tell Will about this. But it's like the perfect podcast for me because it's like kind of important, but also like I can go to sleep to it so I can put it on.

00:05:31
Speaker 1: I can't get off of what went wrong? I keep I'm binging what went wrong again?

00:05:35
Speaker 2: It's just so good.

00:05:36
Speaker 5: I Yeah, as you know, I got back from New York and I was so excited because I was going to have a whole week on my own schedule with tons of time, and I was like, I'm gonna read Jensen and I made a special trip to Barnes and Noble.

00:05:48
Speaker 6: I walked around, what do I want to bring with me?

00:05:52
Speaker 5: I bought The Wager by David Grahan, who is the author of Killers of the Flower Moon. It's about a shipwreck and this it's a true story.

00:06:02
Speaker 6: It's it's amazing. I was so excited about it.

00:06:04
Speaker 5: I get on the plane, I open it up, I get about forty pages in, I decide to take a nap, and then I left it on the plane.

00:06:12
Speaker 3: Oh no, oh no, it's hanging out with a leather jacket.

00:06:16
Speaker 6: It's a leather jacket. And that was day one.

00:06:20
Speaker 1: I have got to say, Danielle, I'm amazed because you are so focused and you are so scheduled, and yet almost every time.

00:06:28
Speaker 2: We travel somewhere you leave something somewhere.

00:06:31
Speaker 6: Well, I've realized what it is for me.

00:06:33
Speaker 5: I have a an like an over concern about like holding people up.

00:06:41
Speaker 6: I don't want to be an imposition to any.

00:06:43
Speaker 3: Mirror expression plane, Oh my gosh, plane, like those people that take forty five minutes to get out of their seat and pick up their luggage and what.

00:06:50
Speaker 5: Are you doing?

00:06:50
Speaker 6: What are you doing?

00:06:51
Speaker 3: You know what happens for twenty minutes I have.

00:06:54
Speaker 5: I only brought a carry on with me for my one week trip, so that meant I have the carry on and the Duffel bag. And I was by myself, so I and I was in the window, so I had put my book on the seat, got out and really quickly wanted to get my stuff, but also had a coat.

00:07:09
Speaker 6: And then my rush of.

00:07:10
Speaker 5: Like I don't want to hold up these people for even half a second longer. And then by the time I realized it, I was like, almost all the way to baggage Claim, and I was like, I'm not going back.

00:07:24
Speaker 1: They got off the shipwreck or whatever. It's all good. By the way, Rider, It's so good.

00:07:35
Speaker 5: I will I also highly recommend the first forty pages of Wager.

00:07:41
Speaker 6: Welcome to Pond Meets World.

00:07:43
Speaker 2: I'm Daniel Fishl, I'm Rider Strong, and I'm Wilfordell.

00:07:57
Speaker 5: So here we are again at the end of another Boy Meets World season, and the tradition continues to fully recap the last few months of Pod meets World. We want a listener's perspective, someone who has been hearing these stories and our analysis for the first time, screaming at their phones or car radios letting us know, hey, idiot, Sean's dad got the RV back from Vernam And with season four being such an over the top success in our rewatch, this one should be a lot of fun. As always, we have invited TJ and Siege from our favorite fancast, Bra Meets World, a show that analyzes Boy meets World with a melanin point of view. They are well into the final season with their rewatch, so we continue to remind them no spoilers and don't tell us how bad it gets. But today they are back with us to talk about our salad days, Peque Danielle, fast girls in leather, jackets, broccoli naching, a rarely used wilderness store, the vital importance of the SATs, and fart Knocker. Come back to the show, our pals from Broh Meets World.

00:09:04
Speaker 2: Hello, Hello, you so happy to be here.

00:09:11
Speaker 6: So happy to see you. All right, so welcome.

00:09:15
Speaker 5: We were just I just mentioned in your intro that season four for us was a real standout season.

00:09:24
Speaker 6: Do you guys agree? How did you guys feel about season four?

00:09:27
Speaker 4: Season four is our favorite season? Go ahead, Tony.

00:09:30
Speaker 7: I have been an advocate for season four Boy Meets World since before the DVDs even came out. As soon as that Season four DVD came out, I was waiting at Target that day because I've always loved this season. As you guys have discussed, it's banger after banger. There's so many iconic episodes, and it's just it's been so great to get your thoughts on it.

00:09:47
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was one of those things where I think all of us after season three, we were kind of there are great episodes in season three. There really were great episodes in season three. But by the fourth or fifth one in a row of season and four, you're kind of going, oh, okay, we're hitting our stride. Like you could tell, I mean, you really could tell.

00:10:05
Speaker 7: And it's just it's a different it feels like, you know, one of the things that we were talking about with season four was that, like, it feels like the world is expanding in season four, and that comes to be the overall themes, Like we're getting new sets every other episode. We're going to hospitals, and we're going to funeral homes, so we're going to wrestling matches, and it just feels like we're we're spending a lot of time outside of the classroom in the Matthews home and things that were very familiar to us in the earlier seasons, but a lot like growing up. You know, as soon as you get your license, you're out of the house. You're gone.

00:10:33
Speaker 6: So yeah, like that exactly.

00:10:35
Speaker 5: I mean, there were so many iconic moments in the season sometimes it was hard for us to remember or imagine that they happened in the same episode like the hair Today Goon Tomorrow episode. We were shocked because we we all remembered both of those storylines so well.

00:10:52
Speaker 6: We were like, that was one episode. How is that possible?

00:10:56
Speaker 4: Yeah?

00:10:56
Speaker 2: It was nuts.

00:10:57
Speaker 3: Yeah.

00:10:57
Speaker 7: I mean to have classic storylines overlap each other, I think is the big thing with season four because you're like, wow, that B storyline with this A storyline, They're both great.

00:11:06
Speaker 2: Yes, I'm sorry.

00:11:09
Speaker 1: That was a good looking guy? Was the hair Yamar?

00:11:12
Speaker 7: Right?

00:11:13
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's right. It was like what Yeah, No, I was just gonna say Tony said it perfectly where he said that boy meet Throat feels like it's been like a recipe handed down generation after generation, and this one they got the recipe just right, like they knew all the ingredients that needed to come and make it like a good balance. To Mellen, that's that's definitely what we get in a lot of these episodes.

00:11:33
Speaker 5: Yes, that's a that's a great way of saying it. So would you guys like to jump in with your questions critiques about our Pod Meets World season?

00:11:43
Speaker 4: Absolutely, as with all things, like we wanted to say right off the bat, like a lot of people think that you can't like enjoy something and also critique it. And I was like, specifically, this season, Boys Throw brings up a lot of things that have to do with like intersectionality and pass and racing, like all of this other stuff and conversations that we're just not having on television as much as we used to. So we appreciate season four for the fact that it did tackle a lot of these things. That said, there were like a couple of blind spots you guys right up, and we were like, they didn't quite hit hit where we wanted you to go, but we understood, like, you know, you can only go some far in I don't know what an hour and a half, Yeah.

00:12:25
Speaker 5: Exactly, So highlight some of those for us to tell us some areas you you think we didn't go deep enough on.

00:12:33
Speaker 4: Yeah, absolutely so. In the Chick Like Me episode, for example, one of the things that we covered and writer, we had sav Rogers, who you met was their movie Chasing Chasing Amy. Oh yeah, yeah, of course they met you and they were telling us about we had them on our show and they are trans director and we had them on for that episode and we talked about passing privilege and just like the things that go in when someone actually, when a boy actually does go in and dress in females clothing, or if a non binary person were to do it. And again, it's so complex, it's so murky when you're dealing with a kid's show, but there is something to say about, like this is played as a joke, and if children do it in real life, violence comes up. So we just want to recount that.

00:13:25
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, that's well, well that's one of the things that we were I know that I'm worried about. Is at least in Chick Like Me, they attempted to have a deeper storyline to why Sean is dressing like a woman, whereas when Eric does it in the later episodes, they attempt nothing. It is simply just the joke. It is the joke of Eric being unattractive. It is a joke of being unattractive women. It is every kind of stereotype you could have. And so that's one that when people always ask me, like, is there one you're not looking forward, It's like, yeah, I can think of one right away, because again, at least in Chick Like Me, they attempted to put a deeper meaning to it, where they might not have always hit what they were looking for, but there was something there, and I, while I don't remember the episode.

00:14:13
Speaker 7: Well, we don't think.

00:14:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't think they did anything with svet Rona. I think it's just put will and address and let them be funny. And that's yeah, it does not age.

00:14:24
Speaker 4: No.

00:14:25
Speaker 7: You know, something else that we were talking about, and you guys had mentioned this a ton, was like how the show tackles class and poverty with like country accents and like people seemingly being from the Deep South in Philadelphia. But like one of the things that we were thinking about is that the show really showcases poverty as like a moral failing instead of a systematic one. Like we never really get into like the systematic issues that could cause Sean to be in poverty. It's always just like, well, you know, he his parents didn't try hardly.

00:14:55
Speaker 3: Take the SATs exactly. It's like this would have happened.

00:15:00
Speaker 7: You don't want to end up a touty Yeah.

00:15:03
Speaker 2: And it's always very interesting. Yeah, yeah, that's true that they did that.

00:15:06
Speaker 1: Yeah, Well that's it's really a big thing because it is it's always like, well, you know, Sean, poor Sean in the trailer park because his Dad's never around, and it was It's things like that.

00:15:15
Speaker 2: It's not like, well, how did we get to this situation?

00:15:18
Speaker 3: Yeah?

00:15:18
Speaker 2: Interesting, they never touch on any of that.

00:15:20
Speaker 3: Well, I wonder if a lot of that has to do with the fact that it's from mostly the kid's perspectives, you know, because it is true that a kid doesn't really have the capability to understand systematic influences on their parent situation. They're just born into their parent situation and then they have to sort of decide where they want to go within that, you know. So that yeah, but you're right, it doesn't Yeah, that's that's a lot, don't they allude.

00:15:45
Speaker 1: Doesn't Alan allude to the fact that Check drinks at the beginning?

00:15:50
Speaker 3: Well, Verna right, Verna and Verna too.

00:15:52
Speaker 1: I mean, it's kind of like that's one of the so of course he's a drink, you know what I mean.

00:15:55
Speaker 7: It is later confirmed by Matt Lawrence's character in season five too.

00:16:00
Speaker 2: Okay, so there you go. Yeah, I mean it's it's like, well, he's a drinker. Yeah.

00:16:07
Speaker 4: In the episode Security Guy, for example, we talked about like the way that Eric immediately adapts to getting the security position and having you know, like this authority without it being earned, and like its commentary on like the police state, and like why Eric would feel a certain way about being like an authority figure with costs. But then also if you go back to Dangerous Secrets, Sean has a different history with cops, which is would be painted differently because of like his surroundings and so like again, these are things where it's like we're really glad that what mean throw eaton brought them up, but they kind of really do make you say this can only be told from or this is currently only being told from like one perspective, right, absolutely, all right.

00:16:51
Speaker 7: But I will say that there's a lot of great stuff with season four as well, and like, for example, one of our favorite episodes is bm B B. There's it's there's no downtime, it's straight jokes throughout. It's everyone is performing, like at their top tier level. And we also love seeing Sean as like the street smart, entrepreneurial businessman. We feel like that's not something we really get fleshed out in later seasons, but we kind of love that aspect of Sean's personality.

00:17:23
Speaker 3: Yeah, well that's it. We we we kind of stumbled upon that when we did the bizarre episode where Seawan is like suddenly a doctor and the hot you know, his ability to just like blend in wherever and and kind of succeed no matter what the situation is really funny. And I don't know if that continues. I think they kind of dropped that, but in season four. Throughout season four, whatever weird situation there, and Shawn's just like map, I'm totally fine, totally And I love.

00:17:47
Speaker 6: That we had mentioned that it's a real natural evolution.

00:17:50
Speaker 5: It's a real natural quality to have when you're the son of Chet, and I don't I don't know that it's ever directly acknowledged that way, but it is. It's my It's one of my favorite qualities of Sean. Because after as we were watching it, we kept seeing it happen. I was like, of course, this is Chet's kid, this is a kind has grown up watching his dad take command of any situation, be whatever he needs to be to get through or to get by or to succeed, and so of course Sean has it.

00:18:19
Speaker 3: I love it, right, And then Corey is the counterpoint, just freaking out. It's so funny.

00:18:24
Speaker 1: Do you see you see Sean being raised where at some point, you know, Chet turned over in the car and went.

00:18:28
Speaker 2: Remember if anybody asked, I'm a congressman something like that.

00:18:32
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh. You know that Sean and Chet were pulling scams, you know, like they had all their little pattern down and their cons to be able to like manipulate suave.

00:18:41
Speaker 7: See an episode of that.

00:18:44
Speaker 3: Heartbreak episode of like Chet Sean.

00:18:47
Speaker 2: That would have been great.

00:18:50
Speaker 7: Something else that, you know, As I was listening to you guys talk about log Walk to Pittsburgh, for example, I understand that as actors you probably have your own personspective of these episodes from filming it and watching it as adults. I cannot tell you the cultural milestone, which is a long Walk to Pittsburgh in terms of like, yes, it resets the entire show. But for that moment when I remember watching Live ABC Friday night when To showed up in the rain, I was clapping watching the show like it like I don't know, it did something to my generation in terms of like needing someone to root for and needing a couple to root for. And I know, like we kind of dissect if it's really responsible to kind of show a couple like this but at the time it really meant a lot to I mean, I took more from this episode than Siege did, so I'll speak for myself.

00:19:41
Speaker 4: This is one where he and I completely disagreed because I looked at Long Walks to Pittsburgh and I was like, it's iconic because of like the surprise element of it all. But I honestly feel like, A, we should have spread it out some more. I feel like, like having to ping A be missing, especially considering the fact that she's missing very often in this show for a few episodes in between would have given some weight to the separation. And uh, you know, maybe they do need to see other people, especially considering the fact that Corey has no problem seeing other people when they're together.

00:20:15
Speaker 3: He's off to the look for ski bunnies. He's always like yeah.

00:20:20
Speaker 1: I also think one of the reasons Long Walk to Pittsburgh worked for the generation that watched it live like you is because there was no binging. Yeah, so you were allowed to forget what happened before and just kind of started you every week if you had to.

00:20:36
Speaker 2: If you binge this, then you're like, wait.

00:20:38
Speaker 5: A minute, but we're also not binging. We're also mostly doing one episode a week.

00:20:44
Speaker 6: When we were born.

00:20:45
Speaker 5: We're watching one episode a week almost on the same schedule that we would have been watching it back then. We are not taking five months off in the summer, so between seasons, we're not We are binging it from season to season. So the drop shock we experience at the beginning of every season is absolutely due to the fact that we're watching them consecutively, but we're not watching more than one episode at a time, so I guess that's true.

00:21:11
Speaker 7: Well, I will say about something about watching it live was that if you missed an episode, you just missed it, like there was no geting around to it. So a lot of our like my opinion of Coreyantapanga was kind of the idea of Coreyantipanga. And it wasn't until I did the rewatch where I was like, oh, this isn't really earned, Like they didn't really like showcase them as a couple long enough to make this breakup mean anything. But at the time, it was just like, no, Quoreyan Tapanga are the rawsome rachel for me as a kid, and so seeing them get together was.

00:21:40
Speaker 4: A big deal.

00:21:41
Speaker 5: And I think a lot of that has to do with the age you are when you're watching it, when you think about and you can truly remember, writers should be able to remember it more than anybody, how very real and overwhelming your emotions are for a person you're in a relationship with. Even if you are thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, and now in our forties or thirties, you can look back and say, Wow, I had no idea I was a kid.

00:22:10
Speaker 6: What could I have What could it have possibly meant? But it's so real, and.

00:22:14
Speaker 5: It's one of the reasons why it's so important not to discount the feelings of children, because for them it is absolutely life or death. It means everything in those moments, And so I can bring myself back to being a teenager, and I would have absolutely been rooting for Corey and Tapanga just to see teenagers who love each other winning and it being taken seriously. It is everyone's telling you when you're a teenager, you don't know what love is, and you just want someone to say, maybe you do, Maybe this is real, Maybe you're right and this is forever and we're wrong.

00:22:51
Speaker 6: That's all you want to hear as a teenager.

00:22:53
Speaker 5: So watching it and seeing them win, I can imagine it was a big victory for teens everywhere.

00:22:59
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I think the key there is is that it was live right, like this idea that we didn't know. I mean, I guess we kind of knew there was probably gonna be another season, but what the I mean, I think part of the reason that we were harsh on the episode, or at least I was, is that you know, we know what's coming, which is that once you've set the stakes this high, once this these teenagers have said, we're going to convince all the adults and we're going to win against all the odds. Yeah, it's you know, then the next next season you got to end with marriage, and then you got to have the marriage, and then you know, you just got to keep up being the sort of in order for there to be conflict, in order for there to be story. But if you erase all that and you just think in terms of like living on the edge of week to week, Yeah, it's a win, you know, and it's super It must have been super satisfying and feel like, oh my god, they're actually going to do it. The show is going to go there, you know, and like we talked about it, that's a huge swing yeah, And I think for some people it's like that was the swing that hooked them into the show, and that will forever be the memory of like why why Boy Meets World exists. It's just like it's so interesting that the Corey into Panga stored. Like if anybody, if you ask anybody, what is Boy Meets World about? Corey Intopang is probably the first thing out of their mouth, if not the second thing. And yet watching season four, especially with the way this season ended, you know what I came away with was like, Wow, this was this was the Eric and Shawn season besides Long Walk to Pittsburgh, Corey Corey's strugg is not struggling as much like he struggles with the Topanga. But like, compared to when you think about season one, which was all Corey all the time, every episode was driven by Corey's meandering or mistakes, this season is you know, very much focused on basically alternating Will and Ryder episodes where we're watching these characters and Corey is supportive or sort of interrogating our arcs, but it's our arcs that are driving this season, and that's forgotten. You know, It's so funny. I didn't remember I'm watching going wow, from episode episode it's it's Will or it's me, and then like, yeah, the end of the season with like basically Eric coming around to gonna do the sat He's gonna go to college, and like from where he started, which was you know, the yogurt cup episode, that's like, that's the arc. I mean, that's the structuring device of the whole season. And yet you know what we remember of Boybe's world is Corey to Bank, which.

00:25:22
Speaker 1: Is interesting because it also that when it does, it is alternating between you and me.

00:25:26
Speaker 2: It leads to my favorite corries of all time.

00:25:31
Speaker 1: I mean that Corey is just that Corey who comes in and is in between us and looking back and forth and has the zingers and is kind of the neurotic Cory.

00:25:40
Speaker 2: I could watch that Cory forever.

00:25:43
Speaker 1: Ben was so good in season four and it was just a great He wasn't too whiny, and he wasn't too needy and he was he was just really funny and neurotic and my god that he would have He had me laughing out loud like most of this season.

00:25:57
Speaker 2: So yeah, it was my favorite.

00:25:59
Speaker 7: Like what one of the things I love about Corey is the season, he kind of plays the role of like peacekeeper more than he does like trying to understand the world around him. He's not other confusion. He's like, Oh, I'm going to walk across this highway and talk to your mom, not because it benefits me, but because it benefits you. Like he's really trying to help the people around him more like with Frankie and his dad, Like he's trying to help people more than he's trying to understand his own confusion, which I think leads to his better moments.

00:26:23
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:26:24
Speaker 4: Yeah, and a version of Corey by the way, Yeah right, because this is this is like some of the best Corey that we get, and that's one of the reasons why we absolutely love it. And Will you said something that Tony and I were totally excited to talk to you guys about, which is that the boy in Boy Meets World this season constantly is shifted. We get so much more world expansion in terms of the families and where Eric is going in life, the idea that Eric is great with kids. These are all things that we really love. And I think when you look at all of that and then you go back to the Korean tapanga of it all, it becomes murky because while we want to champion Corey and Tapinga's love, we also know that something I'm just gonna say, Corey is like an habitual cheater, Like like Corey wants the lots to Panga down, but constantly the moment he has her is like looking elsewhere. So I feel like that, yeah, get.

00:27:26
Speaker 3: The last notation of Corey set that up in what season two? Right?

00:27:29
Speaker 4: Exactly?

00:27:29
Speaker 2: Yeah?

00:27:30
Speaker 7: And then even in this season, like Long Walk to Pittsburgh happens, and a few weeks later he's debating if he wants to sleep with Mary Beth out of college, Like it really took no time at all, right, I know.

00:27:41
Speaker 5: I mean even in the Long Walk to Pittsburgh, although he is preoccupied with thinking about Tapanga, he's still like agreed to a double date at his house.

00:27:49
Speaker 6: With Sparrow sisters, with the Sparrow sisters, and.

00:27:52
Speaker 2: And then but then says to Tapanga, like you went to a dance.

00:27:55
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it was like wait, whoa, Like did you did you remove the woman from your life? App so you could speak to Tapanga about whether she went to a dance or not, Like yeah.

00:28:05
Speaker 7: So as you watch it, you really understand that Corey likes the idea of Topanga more than he likes Topanga, and so that's a little heartbreaking as you kind of go through as a thirty something. Now looking back on it, I'm like, yeah, this is a manic pixie dream girl things.

00:28:20
Speaker 5: Yeah, there's also a little bit of like, you know, when you think of the speech he gives in the Long Walk to Pittsburgh where he's like, you know, this love is about the fact that she makes me better.

00:28:32
Speaker 6: Yeah, and they're really.

00:28:34
Speaker 3: Good for me. She's me for her.

00:28:38
Speaker 5: I like the way she makes me feel because she loves me. And there's it's not really quite so much. It is definitely hard for me to see this the Corey and Topanga storyline without very much also feeling like I'm I'm way too close to the mindset of the men who wrote the relationship.

00:29:00
Speaker 4: I understand that, you know, And.

00:29:03
Speaker 5: So it's like it's one of those things where when I see the relationship and I see those things, I'm very pointed to exactly what you guys were talking about at the very beginning of this episode, which is this is a singular POV. Yes, the Corey Topanga relationship is a singular POV. That tells you a lot about that POV from and where it was coming from, and the way that POV views women and views relationships, and so it's you know, it's good to acknowledge and and then you just move on and try.

00:29:43
Speaker 6: To enjoy the show.

00:29:44
Speaker 7: It's so funny that you said that, because I remember when we did our season one recap, we were like, hey, we're not really a fan of the way they write women on the show, and you guys were like, oh really, And now that you're four seasons in and we've seen Lonnie, we've seen Jennifer and the Fair to forg or Mary Beth and Learning to Fly or even Amiens Payga stories and how they fleshed out, what do you think now of how the women have been betrayed? And I know you were Daniel always has the best women are men. Yeah, that seems to be I think.

00:30:14
Speaker 2: I think Lannie was a deep, well thought out.

00:30:21
Speaker 3: Just what they're kind of but also show her bell.

00:30:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was very And it's just it's funny because you think of, uh, when when I started or when we started out to speak myself, when I started really really noticing at first you I think of it character wise, So I'm like, man, these characters aren't flushed out and they're they're very one dimensional. But then the older I'm getting in, the more i'm watching, I'm thinking more of the actors, and it's like, you're given nothing, and a lot of these women came in and killed their performances with not a whole lot to work work with. Sure, so that from an acting standpoint, it's even more impressive because it's like, Wow, you're your one note. You're gonna make it for because you're good at what you do, but they're really.

00:31:13
Speaker 2: Giving you nothing to work with.

00:31:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, So that was that's what changed for me, was thinking about more about the the actors that came in and with just nothing to work with.

00:31:21
Speaker 3: Yeah. I think that I think that there is you know, especially with like Amy Antipanga. I mean, there is this understanding that that that women are are potentially nuanced and multi layered, but the perspective of the show is definitely on on the outside of them. You know, they're they're a force to be reckoned with. They're not actually driving the story. They're they're either contended against or brought into the fold, but they're not the show itself feels, you know, it's just very it's very male driven, like it's just a guy's perspective, especially a teenage boy's perspective. And yeah, that's you know, I think.

00:32:02
Speaker 2: That that's what they're going for.

00:32:03
Speaker 1: I mean it was called it's called Boy Meets World, So I mean that's what they were going for. But when as as we were talking about, though, once the show expands, which it is, especially in season four, why not expand that too exactly? And it doesn't seem that they did it all.

00:32:20
Speaker 3: No, I mean, because you think about even like the you know, I'm blanking on the character's name, but when you date the woman with a child, you know, she she does seem complicated?

00:32:29
Speaker 2: She she won don't they do a couple? They did a couple in this scene this season was what was Brittany Powell. Britney Powell's character, and I.

00:32:37
Speaker 3: Think, you know, like she's actually a good actor and it's great, it's a but all of her sort of nuances off off off screen, you know, like we know that this person has a complicated life with a kid and a babysitter and all, you know, and it's hard for her. And so there's like nods towards it, But it's all about how Eric's going to relate to that, you know, that's the whole point of the show. And and so she's never really you know, she is. She is a complicated character. We're just not part of that complication. It's just pushed aside.

00:33:06
Speaker 5: Well, it's interesting you say that, though, because I thought of her as well, and I thought it added a new type of woman, which is the woman you feel sympathy for.

00:33:17
Speaker 2: The woman who.

00:33:20
Speaker 6: Right, the woman, the woman who.

00:33:22
Speaker 5: Needs protection, the woman who has a complicated life that you know, I I do like her. She sure is cool, but I can't have that life. That life would be bad for me. It's even hard for her. That's that's the extent of.

00:33:39
Speaker 2: And she's gonna let Eric out of it.

00:33:40
Speaker 3: Like the Madonna horror complex. It's a little bit better, but it's still kind of sure.

00:33:48
Speaker 5: Absolutely, And and you know we see it then in the in a lot of ways with the Long Walk to Pittsburgh, where the other type of woman that we've discussed a few times is like the woman who you know, commands a situation is either a nag or.

00:34:04
Speaker 6: Is gonna is gonna Hey, you have to listen to.

00:34:07
Speaker 5: Me, and there's a little bit of like a, well, I'm I'm not afraid of her physically, although because.

00:34:11
Speaker 6: We love that. We love it when a woman can beat us up, so we're not scared.

00:34:16
Speaker 7: We love it.

00:34:17
Speaker 5: But I'm scared of her because she's the person I'm intimate with, and so therefore I'm going to listen to her perspective, like there's it's just yeah.

00:34:29
Speaker 7: Well, Danielle, you know, even Tapega's character, Like, there were so many times in season four that I remember thinking, oh, this is a big Topanga episode with like the sixteen candles thing, and then she's like hardly in it. Like watching season like four seasons, do you feel like your memory of Tapanga matches up to the reality of Tapanga?

00:34:48
Speaker 6: No?

00:34:49
Speaker 3: No.

00:34:50
Speaker 6: I was shocked.

00:34:51
Speaker 5: I remembered the episode with the wrestling and it was Tapega's sixteenth birthday, and yet I knew I couldn't really remember, well, what happens at Tapanga's birthday party?

00:35:00
Speaker 6: What is does? How does Topanga feel about her birthday? I didn't.

00:35:04
Speaker 5: I was like, I don't remember any of that stuff. But I'm used to having a bad memory, So what I'm realizing is I actually don't have a bad memory. I just don't have many memories because it wasn't there exactly.

00:35:15
Speaker 6: I wasn't there as much.

00:35:16
Speaker 3: But Hair Today, Goon Tomorrow is a really good Panga episode that.

00:35:19
Speaker 6: Is maybe my favorite episode of the season.

00:35:22
Speaker 3: It's a really great that the fact that you drive the story, your perspective and your feelings are really showcased, and you have an arc, you know, and it's a great It's great because you come in like a sort of typical boy meets world character with like let me teach you a lesson, Corey, and then it flips on you. And that was a great opportunity, you know, I wish, I wish the word.

00:35:42
Speaker 7: I was going to use.

00:35:43
Speaker 1: It's such an opportunity because they're starting to show to Pega and Shan together and maybe, yeah, there's a history there, and there's a history between all of them and they're like a crew, and it was like, oh, we're starting it now. Now to Pegas started, she's part of the show. Now she's part of this crew. She's going to be part of the capers. And then it's like and then nothing, well.

00:35:59
Speaker 3: Then like air B and b B and b's where it's just like put her in a French you know, and she'll just like sell out in a heartbeat, and then it's it's a joke. It's a it's a one off joke, and it's like, oh, is that the Tapanga here today?

00:36:12
Speaker 5: Goon tomorrow is also made my favorite Corey and Tapanga episode of them all. I feel like they are such a team, and they are so supportive of each other, and they're so good at expressing what they love about the other one. It just like that episode was like, Wow, even if we just got little nuggets of that in every episode, that would have been great. It would have really helped solidify why they love each other. I'm grateful we got that episode. I love that episode.

00:36:42
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then coupled with a great Beast story. So that's a solid episode just all the way around. Plus plus solid episode all the way around.

00:36:49
Speaker 7: Yeah.

00:36:49
Speaker 4: Great. Something that you guys mentioned that I thought was really important is that this season and Body Throat as a whole, as we start to look at it just kind of shows into like, sorry, it doesn't show. It tells us so much without showing. And I really had a problem that, specifically with the female characters because I think of the Security Guy episode when Eric is just like disrespectful to Amy and it's like, I don't work for you, I work for my dad. And then Alan and Eric come to the conclusion that Amy is deserving and was right, but they don't say it in front of Amy. And that's my thing. It's like, if we are taking this time and we are speaking to men and we want men to learn lessons or boys, then we should be teaching them lessons on how to treat women in general, and that includes if you're gonna say that woman had a valid opinion, say that in front of the woman as well.

00:37:41
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, right, agreed.

00:37:44
Speaker 4: Okay, As we said earlier, we love this show.

00:37:49
Speaker 3: We did, we didn't you.

00:37:50
Speaker 8: Susan Zora was great.

00:38:03
Speaker 4: So I want to talk about Quiz Show a little bit because that's an episode where we have Corey, Seawan, and Tapanga, the three of them were coming together. However, you talked about the idea in Quiz Show of we disagreed or sorry, I think you all disagreed on whether or not Feenie or the episode had a point in terms of pop culture versus like arts and sciences and what is like real knowledge. And it was funny to me because when we talked about that episode, we talked about the facts that nerds are like running culture now, like there's a way to blend both. I was like, you can ask anyone on Reddit and they will tell you the weight and density of Captain America's shield, So like there is a way of like blending both that we could have brought in some of those I think it's more of a discussion about substance versus spectacle. And also really wanted to get your guys take on like media literacy. We know that media literacy and the ability to like critique art is kind of dwindling, so again that I just wanted to like bring that up big subject. By the way, I had.

00:39:13
Speaker 5: No idea Quiz Show was such a polarizing episode. There are a whole faction of people who say, it's my favorite episode, I love this one really yeah, and then there are a whole bunch of people who are like, skip it, don't like it, hate this episode, worst of the season. It's it's very it's very polarizing. I did not I did not realize it. I would for me, it did not fall so strongly on either way. I enjoyed it way more than I thought I was going to. But I wouldn't put it in like in my favorites of the season. But it also to me wasn't the worst of the season. Sure, so I didn't quite just the one.

00:39:45
Speaker 2: Where you changed my mind. I think this is, yeah, where you change that.

00:39:48
Speaker 1: I did not like it at the beginning. By the end, I'm like, you're making some good points.

00:39:51
Speaker 7: You're making it.

00:39:51
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, I thought you did have a good point. I thought your whole point was why, like why can't there be like mindless television or you know, like the things in pop culture. As we said all the time with X Men, it's like, no that has value that can get children into science and art and kind of like we do.

00:40:10
Speaker 7: It all the time with this show, miss All Turner get them into myth with an X Men exactly.

00:40:16
Speaker 2: I mean, that's that's the point, is I thought.

00:40:18
Speaker 1: And again it's as a television junkie there, I'm okay with going in knowing it.

00:40:24
Speaker 2: I think what they were trying.

00:40:25
Speaker 1: To do is essentially say that when it came to a quote unquote television program that just dealt with intelligence and facts and bastardizing that to turn that into something different as opposed to just spinning off a whole new show with Corey Tapanga and Sean and I, to me, it fell a little flat, like that's it's funny because I went and I watched Quiz Show. I think immediately after Yeah, we watched this episode, I went and went watched a movie again, and that the whole idea of the Quiz Show scandal was about cheating.

00:40:55
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and they weren't cheating.

00:40:57
Speaker 1: They were It was like they were just being get you know, given pop culture references, which the nerds, of course aren't going to know that Captain America shield is made of vibranium, but Sean is going to.

00:41:09
Speaker 2: But that doesn't make one of them smarter than the other. They're just talking about you.

00:41:13
Speaker 1: Know, if you sit me down and you talk about math, I'm gonna come off as the biggest idiot you've ever met in your life if you talk, if you sit there and you talk to me about Brandon Sanderson books, I'm gonna look like a genius.

00:41:23
Speaker 2: So it was strange with that episode for me.

00:41:26
Speaker 3: You know, what's occurring to me about just while we're talking about it is that the difference between the media landscape then and now. And like, really what our writers were writing about is power and responsibility. And I think it's easier like nowadays there is less divide between content creators or storytellers and their audience. Right, Like, you can be a content cred You can be a storyteller and publish it right now, right you just need a mic, need a computer, and you get. But back then, in the nine d if you were in any position to create a television show, to create content, you were given a lot of power. And that is sort of gone nowadays, right, Like that's just not a thing we think about. But back then, I think our writers were wrestling with this sense of responsibility, you know, the sort of you know, to be very spider manny about it. You know, with great power comes great responsibility. And I think that's what they were really, It's it's really a group of a group of creatives struggling with, you know, this question of like what do we do with this power? Like do we just entertain? Do we just create a show like where we're sliming kids and whatever, you know, just jokes, and or do we insert you know, insert education? Do we try and feenie it up, and obviously our writers fell on the side of feenie it up. And I think that that's good, right, Like, and I think nowadays it's less of an issue because now there's so many different ways to go and like, so I think, I think, Will, I think your point is well taken in today's landscape. But back then I would have probably pushed back a little harder and say, no, you actually do have a responsibility. And I think that it's easier to see in the realm of like news, which I think we talked about in the when we did the episode, which is like, you know, uh, there's like this is an argument for u NPR, right, a nationally funded uh you know, tax dollar funded news source, because the idea there is that it's not the bottom line is not try and get as much money as possible by appealing to advertisers, but instead to have a source of just information to that to that the neutrality is the goal, and that it's actually built into the structure of the content itself. Right. And I think if you go all the way back to like Quiz Show the movie, it was even more important then because you only had three networks and it was right those networks were being broadcast in the air and that was the only source people had for and so there was more of a sense of responsibility. Yeah, that's kind of gone now, right, Like so now we're in this complete free for all, and in a weird way, maybe it is more important, but the pressure is definitely off.

00:44:20
Speaker 5: I also think our writers were if we think about other things that were very successful at the time, and I think back to the other episode we did in I don't remember which season it was, but where you guys had where Corey and Sean had the radio show and they brought in girls and it was very salacious. I think there was a major commentary on shock Jock Nature where Howard Stern and those kinds of things where it was like, oh the ratings that, oh the numbers they're making millions, the people tuning in, like you said, a spectacle. But we had to get that message of anyone can do that, that's the lowest common denominator. We had to do that within the confines of a family slash kids show. So it became about pop culture mindless TV. When I really think what they were and what they tried to hint to with us being you know, oh hair and I'm the queen, and look how cute Sean is with his poudy lips. They were getting to a thing of a little bit of salaciousness, sing out, selling out, not about the straightforward kind of it's okay to just have a fun TV show. I think it was a bigger commentary, but they had to do it within the confines of a family and kids show, and it then, you know, pop being a pop culture nerd took the fall for salacious shock jock.

00:45:46
Speaker 4: It sounds like we could have used the media teacher the time.

00:45:53
Speaker 6: I wonder where we would have had one of those.

00:45:56
Speaker 3: Great character to insert into the quiz show episode, right, like if he was the one sort of on the set, like who would arranged this a job at the show? Like that would have been great.

00:46:09
Speaker 1: And you've got you got Minkus there as well as one of the nerd I mean, come on, it's yeah to that point.

00:46:14
Speaker 4: What we just talked about is like this balance and this need to have a substance as we go, like all agreed on you guys this episode have a lot of very special episodes. And I was going to say, for me, I don't feel like we do things like Dangerous Secret or cult fiction as much as we used to, And is there something lost in not having those very special episodes in kids at least in live television. I believe they do it in animation a lot. I know that there was like a really big deal a few weeks ago on blue Yeah, everyone tell me about Bluey. But like in live action, I don't think we do these very special episodes in the way that we used to do. You, as people who work in children's television, do you feel like we're losing something by not having that?

00:46:58
Speaker 5: Yes, I am solutely do, and I know that they're Like I worked on Sydney to the Max and that show was so grounded and so great and so real, and they did do a couple episodes that were very special, but they did a very good job, similar to a Boy Meets World, where you didn't feel the entire time like what am I watching?

00:47:17
Speaker 6: There were still there were still laughs.

00:47:19
Speaker 5: Like we talked about what a stellar job Dangerous Secret did of having such a serious topic and yet complimented so well by laugh out loud moments, And I feel like Sidney to the Max did that. But I know that on a lot of the other shows I work on. You are in the room for pitching one of those things, and the thing you hear is, I don't know, it sounds so sad, And there's a real wanting to shy away from that, like a real wanting to end. Part of it is also our to give them credit. We are so interconnected, for better or worse, with everything that's going on in the world that we are aware of so many sad things that are going on. TV has become even more so in escape from real life.

00:48:11
Speaker 6: So there's a little bit of like, do we not have enough sad? Have you?

00:48:15
Speaker 5: Have you been anywhere? Have you talked to anybody recently? We have enough sad. Let's give somebody something else to pay attention to. And I understand that as well, But I love the TV shows where we actually walk away with a great message.

00:48:28
Speaker 1: But is TV unfortunately now is not just not just now, but for a while, has leaned into the sad everywhere. That's why, I mean, the family sitcom is gone. You don't get to turn on Home Improvement anymore. You don't get to turn on any of these shows, and it's just it sucks that we don't have more of the Fun Friends Seinfeld. You know, the modern versions of these shows I think would kill and they just they're gone.

00:48:53
Speaker 2: So yeah, it's terrible.

00:48:55
Speaker 7: Well, particularly with children's television, I feel like watching your favorite characters, watching Sean dealing with something intense, watching Eric's struggle with not getting to college, like all of those things I think help children to process those emotions that they might be feeling in their individual lives because they're watching their favorite characters do it like they're able to see it, so it's able to pay a new reality for them of how to process it, which nowadays, when you're constantly just making it about the jokes, it kind of almost feels like there's no space for a child to express their emotions that happen to be sad.

00:49:27
Speaker 2: There's also a huge power in knowing you're not alone. Yes, so when you see somebody else going through what you're going through, it's amazingly empowering to know that you're not on an island by yourself.

00:49:39
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, I think that is the point, Like that's where we've really lost I don't think special episodes work in today's environment anymore because we were no longer a captive audience right like it was back then, we were the show on Friday night. You were watching it. It was what your family did, and we could take this sort of plunge into drama and you had to sit there. That was it for the episode, whether you liked it or not. And that was I think that was great. But now, yeah, I think they'll just change the channel. They'll just find their content somewhere else. It's all available all the time, so those episodes would just drop off. So it's harder. But I do think to your point, will just representation. Just find a story to talk about abuse, like it doesn't have to be a special episode, but maybe just have a character who's poor, or character whose parents are getting the divorce or whatever whatever issue or drugs or whatever the issue is. I think it's harder to write to, but it should be being written to. I definitely think.

00:50:37
Speaker 4: But I don't think.

00:50:37
Speaker 3: I don't think that you can get away with a very special episode the way point that is a bye that's of a bygone.

00:50:44
Speaker 5: Aeron Lopez versus Lopez did some great episodes at the end of season two that dealt with alcohol addiction that you know, and so there are shows doing it and doing it well and you're right, right, or they don't have the same like, but this is a very special one. It's just in part of the storyline, this character has a drinking problem, and this character has now broken their sobriety, and what are the repercussions of that? What are the consequences of that? So it is it is definitely being done.

00:51:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, but one of the reasons I never took pills, no joke, is because of Alex Keaton on Family Ties. I mean watching that growing up was like it affected me to where I never took pills.

00:51:24
Speaker 2: I know that has something to do with it.

00:51:26
Speaker 1: Just that moment in my life of watching what my favorite character on television was going through and I never did it.

00:51:34
Speaker 2: So it meant stuff like that matters, It really does. It makes an impact.

00:51:37
Speaker 4: Jesse Spano, I'm so excited, Like with both of the Caffie pills and stuff like that. I also think of like an episode of like Wheels where we get like to pake It'll be like sometimes you just want to get in the car and go ahuga and then but also we get the heart at the end of it. So I just feel like there is a way to have ballads all one or the other.

00:51:58
Speaker 7: I agree, and classic season four tradition. You guys kind of had your own very special episode with two nineteen twenty four. It's the episode that was came out right before the Quiet on Set documentary that has now been released. Everyone's watched it. You guys have watched it. Do you guys have any follow up thoughts on that, any like updates on anything that you know? Have you know, how you've processed things since watching it?

00:52:22
Speaker 4: What was that like for you?

00:52:24
Speaker 1: Still processing? Still massive, still massively processed. It's going to be and this is not it's it's certainly not going to be an easy thing to talk about. It's going to be lifelong processing.

00:52:35
Speaker 7: For me.

00:52:36
Speaker 1: I knew I had been lied to and manipulated by Brian essentially from the courtroom, but you didn't know how much until you saw the documentary, and then I really didn't know how much until I spoke with Drake. So talking to Drake was amazing for a number of reasons. It was horror for a number of reasons.

00:53:01
Speaker 7: It was.

00:53:03
Speaker 2: Healing for a number of reasons.

00:53:05
Speaker 1: He started the conversation by saying to me, before you say a word, I want you to know I love you and I forgive you. That's how the entire conversation started.

00:53:16
Speaker 5: And I don't I don't want to cut you off, but I do think it's important because you know, we did not we did not know who the victim was until the documentary aired. Will who had been in the courtroom, had never seen Drake on a TV show When he was in the courtroom. His name was never said in the courtroom. He was John Doe or whatever they used.

00:53:44
Speaker 2: Well, Dake and I talked about this because this.

00:53:46
Speaker 6: Was I don't think our listeners know that.

00:53:49
Speaker 4: Thank you for that clarity, because again from observer, especially when you listen to the to nineteen twenty four episode and then you watch it, it does kind of paint the picture that you were in there, you saw him, you have a familiarity with him. No.

00:54:02
Speaker 2: I was in there and I saw him, but I didn't.

00:54:04
Speaker 3: I didn't agree that. When when the trailer dropped for the doc we were frantically texting each other being like, oh my god, there's another it was and we thought it was another victim he did. It was like, great, No, it wasn't. I don't know it was. It was.

00:54:17
Speaker 2: I'm sitting in the back of the courtroom. There's no social media.

00:54:21
Speaker 1: I am twenty six years old at the time. I don't watch Nickelodeon. I don't know who Drake Bell is. I see a kid walk into the courtroom and I'm like, okay, I've been lied to.

00:54:30
Speaker 2: Automatically, I know this.

00:54:31
Speaker 3: Right, because that was the age, was the factor.

00:54:34
Speaker 2: This is what the hell is going on?

00:54:37
Speaker 5: Yeah, Brian had told the people, he told about it.

00:54:40
Speaker 6: He was almost eighteen.

00:54:44
Speaker 3: Half a decade.

00:54:45
Speaker 1: One thing happened one time, and so ten years later Drake and I worked together, and it was a decade later we worked together and he walked into Spider Man and I didn't know who he was, and he didn't know that I was there. He because we talked about this, he said, no, I didn't in the courtroom, he goes, I didn't know you were there, and we both talked about how happy we were that that was the case, because we had the best day working together. All I wanted to do from the day in that courtroom was apologized to whoever was there. And the idea that I found out later that he was standing in front of me and I did not have that was nuts and Drake literally spent a good forty five minutes of our conversation trying to make me feel better about.

00:55:32
Speaker 4: What had happened.

00:55:33
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's the way it was with me too.

00:55:35
Speaker 1: And then you change your exchanging stories about Brian and he's telling you what actually happened, and the knife in my gut and I mean the knife and Rider and I've spoken about this at nauseum was exactly what we feared happened happened. Where Drake said, I loved you guys, I loved Boymet's world.

00:55:53
Speaker 2: I loved him possible. And that's what Brian told me was, look who I get to work with. I'm working Oh, I.

00:55:59
Speaker 3: Know all the these are my best friends.

00:56:01
Speaker 2: These are my friends I help with their careers. I bought so he used our names the way that he used the names of the other famous people with us to get this poor.

00:56:11
Speaker 6: Kid Uh to feel comfortable with him.

00:56:15
Speaker 1: There comes a point where you have to look at yourself and go, I I have to be okay to know I made a huge mistake, that I owed this person an enormous apology that it's not gonna be enough. I'm gonna spend a ton of time apologizing this person, but you have to use that and move on to become a better person yourself.

00:56:33
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think, you know, when we recorded the episode, it was you know, all we knew at that point was that there was a documentary coming out and that they were seeking comment from us, and that it was gonna talk about Brian. And from the moment we started this podcast, we had brought up like, oh, we're gonna have to We're gonna have to address the factcause Brian's on camera and we talk about our guest stars. And we'd always said like, let's do it right, let's talk about it, Let's tell the whole story. And then when we got you know, when we were contacted, it was sort of like, oh, I guess we we should just do it now, we should just have the conversation. And then the documentary came out. It was just devastating, the you know, the the pain, you know, just hurting for Drake and and just feeling so so full of regret and shame and then just start picking apart the lies and you know, my brother called me immediately. We just sat there on the phone being like oh my god, like what did what did you know? What did you think happened? What did you know? And we're just I just fell into this hole and yeah, I mean, you know I still haven't quite gotten out of it. Well, there's just so much cognitive dissonance that goes into it too, you know when you're when it's somebody that you consider a friend, you know, somebody that you that you loved, you know. I mean I met Brian when I was team So this is now when I'm twenty four. He's telling me this story and here's how you can help me. And all you have to do is write this letter and you know, it's just this one time thing and it's just awful, and it's like, oh god, you know, and now I can you know. Of course, moral clarity is just something that comes over time and and distance, and you know, there's there's really no excuse. I mean, you know that I accepted Brian's story, that I didn't didn't ask ask the questions or do research or investigate on my own, or just even that I was ever friends with that piece to begin with, you know, I mean, there it was just there was so much denial.

00:58:45
Speaker 2: There was no research to do.

00:58:46
Speaker 1: So that's the thing. I asked the questions. I sat with him. I asked the questions. He had an answer for everything.

00:58:52
Speaker 6: And they were lies.

00:58:53
Speaker 2: And it's we bought it. I mean, the writer's right, there's no excuse.

00:58:57
Speaker 1: We bought it, hook line and sinker from this guy who had ingratiated themselves into our lives. And the wolf in sheep's clothing does is they they will keep a pristine group of people where I can put my hand on the Bible right now and raise my other hand and say, I've never seen Brian Peck do anything even slightly inappropriate. And they do that on purpose, because then when they do find the one person or two people, however many people they then abuse, they can look to the other pristine group and say, you know me, have I ever done anything to you? Have I ever been in And that's what he did, is he separated us into these groups.

00:59:39
Speaker 3: You know, the most disorienting part of watching the documentary, you know, besides just this growing horror, it was like this weird you know, just being so impressed with Drake, Oh my god, his courage and his boy yeah, you know, he's such an articulate, smart guy and and think, you know, not only the courage to come forward now and to do this documentary and and to be able to you know, stand up for himself that way, but that he did it back then too, you know, that that he took the leap, you know, with support from his family and you know, the people around him to be like, we need to you know, we need to do the right thing and and and charge this guy and and and so I mean the feeling the real like beyond the personal awfulness and and and shame. It was like I gotta, I gotta find this guy, you know, I have to. It was just like we need to. I have to connect reach out to Drake and obviously apologize, but also just just hopefully lessen his burden in some way because he had done this courageous thing back then and still doing it now, and to just let him know that it wasn't this wall of people behind Brian knowing what he did and so ordering him still, but it was actually this completely misinformed you know. And to his credit, the second we actually did get a hold of him, it took a little while. It was like, oh, you know, publicists and agents and trying to you know, and then finally it was just Instagram, you know, I d M him and it took him a little while to see it. He was like, yes, call me, and I got on the phone with him and it was just instant connection, instant forgiveness. Yeah, yeah, it was just amazing.

01:01:39
Speaker 4: You know, it's really funny. You very often askets you did in this season, but you usually ask us if you ruined the shows are. One of the things that I want to say is you don't. Because the thing about this podcast is you give context to behind the scenes and how behind the scenes kind of influences what we get on screen. And I think conversations like this where we get an insider's perspective from child, from child actors, from TV show producers and voice actors to be like, this is the culture, and this is what's going on, and this is what we would like to see different so that we can continue to do the things that we love.

01:02:16
Speaker 7: Yeah, well, thank I thank you guys, I mean as fans like, not only you know, are you guys being super open now, but you guys have provided art through episodes like cult fiction or whatever, of how to deal with these situations for kids and how to you know, maneuver these situations that may happen in real life you guys were kind of lucky to be on the show. That kind of helped I think the problem more than heard it.

01:02:38
Speaker 5: So well, we appreciate you saying that, and thank you for you know, we know it's a it was a it's a tough subject, and we appreciate you guys not shying away from asking us about it, and we appreciate you coming here spending your time with us. Again, as always, I don't want to end.

01:02:57
Speaker 6: On this note.

01:02:59
Speaker 4: Have your note.

01:03:00
Speaker 6: I want oh you have a quiz?

01:03:02
Speaker 5: Well, I also want to know what were your favorite episodes of the season, each of you. If you had to pick one, what's your favorite episode?

01:03:09
Speaker 4: Oh, I only get one. I'm gonna cheat. I'm gonna say what my favorite episode is, and then I'm gonna tell you an episode that I really enjoyed and that was like totally worth it, and that would be my favorite would be B and B's. I just I love the balance of Corey Topega and Sean being I love Sean being street smart, as you said, having a different intelligence. I think like Corey playing neurotic is the best version of Corey. But then also the fact that we get like the Feenie and Eric Bond and in a way that they are literally in Boston, they're in a different town, so it really does separate it. And when the bartender says I would call that a friend, he's like, oh, we are friends, And as the show goes, we're like they are friends and everything we get with them afterwards. This makes sense, but also the end is a lesson to adults, which is it's never too late, Like even Phoenie is like, oh, I didn't miss my chance. So that episode just tens across the board for me. And then I actually really enjoy Learning to Fly because I feel like that challenges the characters in such a unique way. How did Eric come in and catch Corey like almost in the act and then being like, hey, you're an adult, I'm not going to tell you what to do, right, But at the exact same time, there's a morning after to this decision, and then having that lesson kind of echo with Corey being like, hey, there's a morning after of your college decision, so don't just make it and take the easy route. So yeah, that's those are the ones that I really wanted to champion.

01:04:49
Speaker 7: I think Hair Today good towhere else a perfect episode. I think it's I mean, there's so many of season four that come up in my favorite episodes of all time, but I'll actually give a shout out so you can't go home again. I think that's such a strong season opener. I mean, in terms of like Eric's arc, I think it's such a beautiful opening to it, to the way the season ends where he's like, you know, he starts the season with you know, where do where do I belong?

01:05:15
Speaker 4: Where do I fit in?

01:05:16
Speaker 7: And then at the end of the season he's like, I know what I want and I'm going to work for it. I just think it's a beautiful art.

01:05:21
Speaker 6: It is for sure.

01:05:23
Speaker 2: Wait did I hear quiz? I want to hear quiz?

01:05:26
Speaker 7: Okay, all right, Yeah, So we wanted to do just like a quick wrap up quiz where I'm gonna do some rapid fire questions and you guys just it's it's it's a this or that we call on our show. We called this on the Fence where we just kind of do you know, are you on the fence? Do you want this or that? So just rapid fire as quick as you can, Okay, Corey Intopega Soulmates or missed the opportunity to date. Other people miss.

01:05:48
Speaker 5: The opportunity to miss the opportunity to.

01:05:53
Speaker 7: Post season four? Are you missing Frankie Moore or Turner more?

01:05:57
Speaker 2: Turner for sure, Turner Yeah, Tony.

01:06:00
Speaker 7: To Pega's best moment cutting her hair and hair today, going tomorrow to proof a point, or risking it all for love and along walk to Pittsburgh.

01:06:10
Speaker 2: Cutting her hair.

01:06:13
Speaker 7: What do you prefer Sean joining the mob or joining a cult mob mob.

01:06:20
Speaker 2: Mob?

01:06:21
Speaker 3: I love the episode, but I love the idea. That could have been a whole, like three episode arc on the criminal Path. It would have been great.

01:06:31
Speaker 7: Preferred alternative timeline Eric the Stepdaddy or Eric the Man of Yoa, the mayor of Yogurt Town.

01:06:37
Speaker 2: Stepdaddy, step Daddy, Stepdaddy. Can I be the stepdaddy in yogurt Town? Because that was.

01:06:46
Speaker 3: Favorite character of.

01:06:47
Speaker 4: The season, Rapid Fire. I told you they were going to do this. If you asked, I was like, they're not going to be able to just go it out.

01:06:55
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh, favorite character of the season. I feel like I don't want to look through.

01:07:01
Speaker 2: My initial My initial reaction is Alan just because.

01:07:06
Speaker 1: Watching his performance and he's just so good and the character the growth and the character, and I'm that would be my initial one.

01:07:13
Speaker 2: But I really like Sean this season too. I really did. But I also really liked Corey because.

01:07:22
Speaker 7: Derek too.

01:07:22
Speaker 2: This was just a solid season all the way around.

01:07:27
Speaker 6: I think because we're.

01:07:30
Speaker 5: I think because we're older, we are we we are so connected to the incredible character that Alan is as a dad. But I think my actual favorite character of the season is Eric. I mean, if I if I take myself out of the fact that I want to be Alan and I actually think of the episodes the joy I mean, we didn't even touch on shallow Boy.

01:07:54
Speaker 6: You guys, I.

01:07:55
Speaker 4: Don't like this.

01:07:57
Speaker 3: I don't like it. What's show boy?

01:08:02
Speaker 4: I just felt like that episode was like such a I felt that it was there. Tony will totally ride with you guys. I love it was all about I was like, miss me with this again.

01:08:13
Speaker 7: That was was.

01:08:14
Speaker 2: Wonderful talking to to.

01:08:19
Speaker 4: Favorite.

01:08:22
Speaker 7: Okay, here's here's one each of you favorite episode of the season.

01:08:26
Speaker 5: Here today Goon Tomorrow with B and B's B and B being my second favorite.

01:08:32
Speaker 3: Checklick me.

01:08:34
Speaker 7: And finally, what has been your favorite season of Bloy Meets World so far?

01:08:39
Speaker 3: He's in far I do want to give a shout out to seasons scause it feels like a completely different show by now. But if we go back and think about how solid that was as a kids show, because a different style of shows great, it's really hard to beat. But yeah, but no, season four is so incredib.

01:09:00
Speaker 6: If they really do feel like two different shows.

01:09:02
Speaker 5: I would if I had to, if I had to like and we'll probably do this at the end when we finish all seven seasons. I still stand by the idea that season one might be the greatest single season of any TV show.

01:09:17
Speaker 6: Every love it from Norman.

01:09:24
Speaker 5: Okay, maybe I have to qualify it by saying that is a kid is the star up there you go, because I can't find anything else that would even come close to it.

01:09:36
Speaker 6: Maybe, but I don't know.

01:09:39
Speaker 5: But of this still even feeling that way, we are really in our groove with season four.

01:09:45
Speaker 6: Season four was just phenomenal.

01:09:47
Speaker 4: You'd have to do a rewatch podcast in order to figure it out.

01:09:52
Speaker 3: I've been thinking a lot about like, you know, I guess we didn't ask you this time, like how are we ruining the show? But it's it's occurred to me, like we we exist in this weird, like this podcast exists in this sort of weird like equivalent to the grandfather paradox. Do you guys know this like time travel paradox of Like right, it's like, well, it's the idea that if you go back in time and kill your grandfather, then you can't exist to have gone back in time to kill your grandfather. So right, so when when we because it's different than like you guys have your podcast and you criticize the show or compliment or whatever, And I think that's just great because it's like fans, when we criticize the show we're in this, we're immediately putting our listeners on defense in a way because it's like we're cracking open this this potential that for us is very obvious. You know that we were there, there, there was there was once a different Topanga. Minkus was gonna be there forever. You know, Eric could have had a spin off. So like our our reality of this of Boy Meets World is like a series of choices that were made by by people like us and people we knew like not God's not people following a script, but like people writing a script, people rewriting a script on a daily basis, in real time, you know, like creating this work of art. And and so then we come on to our podcast and we bring that potential with us, and that's always going to just turn some people off, right, Like, that's just going to be sacrilegious in a way, because it's it's this weird, counterintuitive process. It's like, oh, I liked Boy Meets World, so I'm going to go listen to the actors talk about it. And then if those actors are talking about the potential for to not be the Boy meets World, I liked, why am I listening to them talk about it?

01:11:39
Speaker 2: You know?

01:11:39
Speaker 3: That's that like grandfather paradox of like and I feel like that can be uncomfortable, that can be disquieting for people, and hopefully that's a good thing, like you know, hopefully we can invite them along. But it's it's really weird. It is a really process.

01:11:53
Speaker 4: Cause that point. As I said earlier, I love that you do that though, like for me, like I think for a lot of people, you can't get enough of the potential because we only have what exists. You do want to know the ifs and the what if And as I said earlier, like just understanding that, oh, a certain budget is the reason why we got a swing set, or why Turner is written out, or you know, all of these things actually help with the show's inconsistencies because hearing that, oh, it was this episode and there was a meeting that happened, and therefore Michael doubled down and was like, now this is what the show is about. I'm like, okay, now I can get behind and all of it sweeps right when we remind we were totally forgot about sweeps, and we're like, they needed a big episode.

01:12:39
Speaker 3: Let's make it at the Corey de Bank and you know, it's like sweeps and now we can see it so clearly.

01:12:45
Speaker 7: Yeah, well, just to give you guys some hope. Season five is pretty good too, so you know, like we love season five. It's not as high as season four for us, but there's some classic episodes in season five. If you're a people to track down Candice, Cameron Beuer, Linda Carlini, Jennifer love Hewittt to ask them about their time on the show, that would be great. But we would also love to see Trina McGee come back and talk about Angel a.

01:13:12
Speaker 3: Little bit more.

01:13:13
Speaker 6: That's A, Yeah, that's a that's a no brainer.

01:13:16
Speaker 3: Absolutely, we've been.

01:13:18
Speaker 6: Looking forward to having her come back.

01:13:19
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a given.

01:13:20
Speaker 5: So yeah, that will happen and we will start tracking down those other people. We we may have one of them already scheduled.

01:13:27
Speaker 4: Always love hearing that.

01:13:29
Speaker 5: Thank you guys so much for joining us at as always. You always just help us. You know, think about the season we've just recapped in a slightly different way. You bring povs that we just don't have the ability to have. You guys are so thoughtful and we just we truly we enjoy every second we get to spend with you. We love having you come and recap a season with us. We look forward to doing it again for season five and uh can't wait to see you guys again.

01:13:52
Speaker 6: We love you both.

01:13:53
Speaker 4: Yeah, oh, thank you so much.

01:13:55
Speaker 7: We love you guys.

01:13:55
Speaker 6: Appreciate it yea, It's so fun, man.

01:14:01
Speaker 5: I know they're great, and you know, like I said, I really mean it. I appreciate that they come in and they've developed a relationship with us where they don't hold back, they really tell us their honest thoughts on things, and I'm just so appreciative of Then again, if you haven't checked out their podcast. Their podcast is called Bruh Meets World. They talk about Boy meets World with a melanin point of view, so you could check them out. As always, you can follow us on Instagram pod Meets World Show. You can send us your emails pod Meets World Show at gmail dot com.

01:14:31
Speaker 6: And we have merch.

01:14:33
Speaker 1: March didn't seem like didn't seem like it's deserving of a giant merch.

01:14:37
Speaker 5: The giant March merch Okay, pod Meets Worldshow dot com will send us out.

01:14:43
Speaker 2: We love you all, pod dismissed.

01:14:46
Speaker 1: Pod Meets World is nheart podcast producer and hosted by Danielle Fischel, Wilfordell and Ryder Strong executive producers, Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman, Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor, Tara sudbachsch producer, Maddie More engineer and Boy Meets World super fan Easton Allen. Our theme song is by Kyle Morton of Typhoon and you can follow us on Instagram at Podmets World Show or email us at Podmetsworldshow at gmail dot com. H