Lethal Weapon (1987) vs. Die Hard (1988) (Pt. 2): Urban Gunslingers

<v Speaker 1>All right, everybody, welcome back to the Surely You Can't
<v Speaker 1>Be Serious podcast. This is episode two of our Christmas
<v Speaker 1>comparison of Diehard versus Lethal Weapon, And to start it off,
<v Speaker 1>we're gonna have a very classic Christmas introduction to this episode.
<v Speaker 2>All right, listen up, guys, twas the night before Christmas,
<v Speaker 2>and all through the house not a creature was stirring
<v Speaker 2>except the four useholes coming in the rear standard to
<v Speaker 2>cover formation.
<v Speaker 1>It's Christmas time in Hollis. Please, Mom's cook a.
<v Speaker 2>Chicken in college.
<v Speaker 1>Oh man, If this is your first time to listen
<v Speaker 1>to us, all I can say is welcome to the party.
<v Speaker 2>Pal Man. You know, we started this a year and
<v Speaker 2>a half ago. I did not anticipate how much work
<v Speaker 2>that we would be putting in to this thing.
<v Speaker 1>But it's been an amazing year. Do you remember when
<v Speaker 1>I called you about a year and a half ago.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Yeah, come out to the coast. We'll get together
<v Speaker 2>and make a podcast.
<v Speaker 1>Well, I'm very proud of what we've done so far
<v Speaker 1>this year. We've had an awesome time. We've made lots
<v Speaker 1>of friends and got out what, well we think is.
<v Speaker 2>A pretty good product. Well, I'm hopeful that our listeners think. So,
<v Speaker 2>We've definitely had a great amount of support from everybody,
<v Speaker 2>and this is kind of an amazing, you know, like
<v Speaker 2>almost bittersweet end to a thing. But I mean we're
<v Speaker 2>just done with chapter one, ready to go on to
<v Speaker 2>chapter two. So it's a great way to end the
<v Speaker 2>season with two of the most amazing movies of the
<v Speaker 2>eighties right at the time that they're in all of
<v Speaker 2>their glory. It's Christmas time, it is.
<v Speaker 1>This podcast is not the is it a Christmas movie podcast?
<v Speaker 1>But here just a little bit we're going to talk
<v Speaker 1>about we'll touch on it whether we think these are
<v Speaker 1>Christmas movies or not.
<v Speaker 2>Right more importantly, we will defend the fact that they
<v Speaker 2>are Christmas.
<v Speaker 1>There you go, There you.
<v Speaker 2>Go, all right. Our executive producer on this episode is
<v Speaker 2>Chris walked In. That's walked in with a d It's
<v Speaker 2>I'm sure he gets it all the time, Christopher walking
<v Speaker 2>But Chris, thank you so much for your support. He
<v Speaker 2>is our first Patreon subscriber to pay us in pounds.
<v Speaker 1>Love it, love it. Chris, thank you so much. We
<v Speaker 1>appreciate you.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I can't say thank you enough. If you want
<v Speaker 2>to be an executive producer of one of our episodes.
<v Speaker 2>Just go to our Patreon page. It's Patreon dot com,
<v Speaker 2>Forward Slash Shirley Podcast and YouTube can become an executive
<v Speaker 2>producer of one of our shows. Okay, cool, all right,
<v Speaker 2>So jumping back into it, I've learned a couple things
<v Speaker 2>since our last episode, even though it was just a
<v Speaker 2>short time ago, that I feel the need to share. So,
<v Speaker 2>Joel Silver is the producer behind both of these movies.
<v Speaker 2>We talked about him a bit in the last episode.
<v Speaker 2>He was the one that got Shane Black in there
<v Speaker 2>and Predator, and he's obviously the one that had him
<v Speaker 2>write the script for Lethal Weapon. He's the one that
<v Speaker 2>had forty eight Hours, which then leads us to Stephen
<v Speaker 2>Desuza coming in helping out on Jim Stewart's script. He's
<v Speaker 2>very much an integral part of both of these stories.
<v Speaker 2>But here's something that I bet that most of our
<v Speaker 2>listeners don't know. When he was in high school, he
<v Speaker 2>went to Columbia High School in Maplewood, New Jersey, and
<v Speaker 2>during that time there he and a friend of his
<v Speaker 2>named Buzzy hill Ring created the rules for the game
<v Speaker 2>Ultimate Frisbee. They were the creators Joel Silver who has
<v Speaker 2>given us some of the best movies of all time.
<v Speaker 2>Also was one of the creators of Ultimate Frisbee. He
<v Speaker 2>has been inducted into the Ultimate Frisbee Hall of Fame
<v Speaker 2>because he was one of the originators of the game.
<v Speaker 1>That is freaking amazing.
<v Speaker 2>I can't believe that it's crazy. It's crazy then, and
<v Speaker 2>he is the type of the nasty producer. I love
<v Speaker 2>watching this guy because if anybody ever complains about somebody
<v Speaker 2>or something back and was like, oh, I hate that guy,
<v Speaker 2>I hate. He has no fear about saying I hate
<v Speaker 2>some big I mean, because who's the heavier hitter than
<v Speaker 2>Joel so far right?
<v Speaker 1>Not many here, right.
<v Speaker 2>So one of the guys that he hated was Michael Eisner,
<v Speaker 2>Like they both work together at Paramount, right, and they
<v Speaker 2>hated each other then. And he has been in a
<v Speaker 2>couple of movies and one that you probably don't recognize
<v Speaker 2>him from is who framed Roger Rabbit At the beginning,
<v Speaker 2>you know, the beginnings the cartoon, Yeah yeah, and then
<v Speaker 2>you know he has the wrong thing spinning around his head. God,
<v Speaker 2>and the director's all, yeah, he shaved off his beard.
<v Speaker 2>He plays the director in that movie The Angry you know,
<v Speaker 2>throwing his stuff down, which was an inside joke by
<v Speaker 2>Spielberg and Zamechis because it was supposed to be like
<v Speaker 2>a Disney cartoon, and so they had him playing the
<v Speaker 2>part which would be like the Michael Eisner part, because
<v Speaker 2>they knew that they hated each other. And when and
<v Speaker 2>when they showed it to Eisner, Eisner's like, who's that
<v Speaker 2>actor because he had his beard shaved off, and they're like,
<v Speaker 2>it's Joel Silver and he's like, well, he did a
<v Speaker 2>good job.
<v Speaker 1>That is great, man. I didn't know that. That's fantastic.
<v Speaker 2>Have you seen Tropic Thunder? I have.
<v Speaker 1>It's been a while, but I have.
<v Speaker 2>Okay, but you remember the Tom Cruise part. Absolutely, it's
<v Speaker 2>it's a parody of Joel Silver. That kind of raunchy cigar.
<v Speaker 1>Show makes sense.
<v Speaker 2>Yep, for sure.
<v Speaker 1>That makes sense, both of these movies. I have a
<v Speaker 1>feeling some cocaine news. What I've got something for you? Yes,
<v Speaker 1>go ahead, Okay, this is something that I learned that
<v Speaker 1>blew me away.
<v Speaker 2>All right.
<v Speaker 1>I don't want to try and top you right on
<v Speaker 1>the top, and this is what we're about. I'm not
<v Speaker 1>trying to top you, Okay. I just found this blew
<v Speaker 1>my frigging mind. Okay, Yeah, the Mrta House. All the
<v Speaker 1>action in lethal weapon happened one, two, three, four, right
<v Speaker 1>and one Joshua crashes the car through the front door.
<v Speaker 1>Two they blow up the freaking toilet. Part four The
<v Speaker 1>whole house like gets blown up, right right? Okay, So
<v Speaker 1>the Merta House, it's a character in all four of
<v Speaker 1>these movies. Right next door to the Myrtal House Okay,
<v Speaker 1>this is on the Warner Brothers ranch.
<v Speaker 2>Okay.
<v Speaker 1>Right next door to the Myrtle House is the Christmas
<v Speaker 1>Vacation Chevy Chase House.
<v Speaker 2>No.
<v Speaker 1>So that means that, in this fictional world that the
<v Speaker 1>Myrtas live in the same house as Todd and Margot. Right,
<v Speaker 1>why is the floor all Todd?
<v Speaker 2>I don't know? Margot? So, what what did Roger Murtaz
<v Speaker 2>say when he saw the lights finally light up at
<v Speaker 2>the house?
<v Speaker 1>There is a world where the Murtaz and the Grizzwolds
<v Speaker 1>live next door to each other.
<v Speaker 2>That's crazy. That is crazy.
<v Speaker 1>Oh, okay, so.
<v Speaker 2>Appropriate that they're both Christmas movies though.
<v Speaker 1>It absolutely it is, and we will tell you why
<v Speaker 1>in just a little while. Right, do we want to
<v Speaker 1>get into the plot we're kind of, yeah, let's jump
<v Speaker 1>into the plot.
<v Speaker 2>Let's let's bounce. Do you really want to jump?
<v Speaker 1>I'm gonna say that every time with it.
<v Speaker 2>That's fine with me. Okay. So both of the movies
<v Speaker 2>start off and we see our main characters vulnerabilities right
<v Speaker 2>off the bat. Right the first time that you see
<v Speaker 2>John McClain, he's got white knuckles in the airplane because
<v Speaker 2>he's scared of flying. Right, So, your big, big hero character,
<v Speaker 2>You've got to keep in mind that this was going
<v Speaker 2>on at the time of Rambo and Commando and Conan
<v Speaker 2>and where the big hero was invincible, and we introduce
<v Speaker 2>our big hero as the guy who's scared of planes.
<v Speaker 1>In order to relax, he's got to make fists. Was
<v Speaker 1>his toes with your toes?
<v Speaker 2>Well? And I guess that's really not all because even
<v Speaker 2>as it carries on, we get more vulnerabilities. He's obviously
<v Speaker 2>got marriage on the rocks, and he's also obviously got
<v Speaker 2>an impulsive mouth that we see when he's arguing with
<v Speaker 2>his wife.
<v Speaker 1>He's kind of a jerk. He's a jerk to Holly,
<v Speaker 1>and he's a little bit of a jerk to our guy.
<v Speaker 1>I'll coming out of the Gate.
<v Speaker 2>And then with Leith a weapon, we've got my gosh,
<v Speaker 2>suicidal Martin Riggs, you know, just living in a dirty,
<v Speaker 2>nasty trailer, drinking beer from last night, naked to the toilet.
<v Speaker 2>How many movies, by the way, in a row was
<v Speaker 2>Mel Gibson naked?
<v Speaker 1>Mel Gibson's butt got a co starring credit in like
<v Speaker 1>his first ten movies, I know.
<v Speaker 2>And then we've got Roger, who's too old for this.
<v Speaker 1>She's fifty years old. Fifty damn years old.
<v Speaker 2>Right.
<v Speaker 1>Have we talked about the bathtub scene?
<v Speaker 2>I don't think we did.
<v Speaker 1>Maybe you touched on it.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, But so let's just my wife put this movie on.
<v Speaker 2>I mean, god, God bless her. I didn't even ask
<v Speaker 2>for it. She put it on as a Christmas movie midday,
<v Speaker 2>all the kids are there. I'm like, honey, this is
<v Speaker 2>not a kid. It didn't matter. Our kids and my
<v Speaker 2>nine year old little girl loved it, loved this movie.
<v Speaker 2>But that first scene when there's singing him Happy Birthday
<v Speaker 2>and they come in and he's in the tub. All
<v Speaker 2>of us were like why, why why except my wife,
<v Speaker 2>and she's like, I think it's a cultural thing, and
<v Speaker 2>every single one was like, no, it's not. It's not
<v Speaker 2>a cultural thing. I don't think that any culture does that.
<v Speaker 1>What what eighteen and sixteen and fourteen year olds bargain
<v Speaker 1>on their dad taking a bit?
<v Speaker 2>Right? A bath?
<v Speaker 1>A bath?
<v Speaker 2>I mean why number one? Why is he taking a
<v Speaker 2>bath in the morning? Right? I mean who, I don't
<v Speaker 2>know guys that take baths generally at all, but in
<v Speaker 2>the morning.
<v Speaker 1>No, what And you can clearly see there's not a
<v Speaker 1>lot of bubbles. No, the bubbles are gone.
<v Speaker 2>No, you got a little turtlehead flowing to the top.
<v Speaker 2>And it's just no, not comfortable, Lea.
<v Speaker 1>The weapon would be exposed.
<v Speaker 2>I mean, any other human being that I know if
<v Speaker 2>this happened, would be grabbing the towel, like, what the
<v Speaker 2>heck are you doing?
<v Speaker 1>To get out out of here? We wanted to say
<v Speaker 1>happy birthday? You can tell me later.
<v Speaker 2>So then let's go back to diehard called action machine
<v Speaker 2>guns firing and women screaming with their tops off and
<v Speaker 2>all kind of stuff. And he's got this split second
<v Speaker 2>to get out of the room because he's just been
<v Speaker 2>making fists with his toes.
<v Speaker 1>He's got no shoes, he's barefooted.
<v Speaker 2>But he does grab his gun. Does that's a man
<v Speaker 2>priorities right there.
<v Speaker 1>That's right, grab your gun, worry about your shoes later.
<v Speaker 1>First of all, I just want to say point it
<v Speaker 1>out right out of the gate. John mcclean's attitude about
<v Speaker 1>attending his wife's company Christmas party. It's probably the same
<v Speaker 1>as yours of mine. Yeah, how soon before we can
<v Speaker 1>duck out of here? What is the shortest amount of
<v Speaker 1>time I'm obligated to be here?
<v Speaker 2>Right?
<v Speaker 1>Okay? This is the eighties, and I know that we
<v Speaker 1>would like to say this, but there are three playmates
<v Speaker 1>in the movie die Hard. Okay, So there's three playmates
<v Speaker 1>in the movie.
<v Speaker 2>Okay. One of them is the.
<v Speaker 1>Topless girl at the very beginning, which that's the scene
<v Speaker 1>I've always kind of got to put my hand over
<v Speaker 1>my son's eyes.
<v Speaker 2>There's one. I'll give you one, one playmate right there,
<v Speaker 2>right maybe the story behind that one, by the way, Okay,
<v Speaker 2>she got that part.
<v Speaker 1>She got that part because Joel Silver was interested in dating.
<v Speaker 2>Her with the quotations with the fingers right there. In
<v Speaker 2>order to this radio and not TV, we get to
<v Speaker 2>see the quotation mark.
<v Speaker 1>In order to convince her to date him, he had
<v Speaker 1>to give her a part in a movie. And that's
<v Speaker 1>her part.
<v Speaker 2>What a payoff? All right?
<v Speaker 1>So she was in Playboy, all right.
<v Speaker 2>That's number one, all right, number two, Well you got
<v Speaker 2>the girl who's the actual Playboy magazine that's on the wall.
<v Speaker 1>That's exactly right. That's November of nineteen eighty seven, play
<v Speaker 1>Playboy centerfold on the wall right there.
<v Speaker 2>And that boying sound. I got to capture that boying.
<v Speaker 1>My girls girls, all right? One more, The World's Greatest
<v Speaker 1>Action movie had three playmates that barely get noticed.
<v Speaker 2>Only hot girl f not that the girls at the
<v Speaker 2>party weren't nice looking girls, and there were the police
<v Speaker 2>officers were nice looking.
<v Speaker 1>Girls, not police officers.
<v Speaker 2>Girl at the airport, girl.
<v Speaker 1>At the airport, ding ding ding Ning named all three
<v Speaker 1>of them. Good job, Google's search all right, back on track.
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So then the call to action for Riggs and
<v Speaker 2>Mertaw obviously is Huntsucker. Right. Huntsacker is like, you've got
<v Speaker 2>to get him, and you've got to kill him, right,
<v Speaker 2>you gotta kill him.
<v Speaker 1>What you gotta do, You gotta kill him.
<v Speaker 2>You gotta find him and kill him. Come on, you'll
<v Speaker 2>find him, you'll find I mean, you've killed him. You
<v Speaker 2>can do that. You owe me, right, And so this
<v Speaker 2>is where we see the big differing dynamic between Merton Riggs,
<v Speaker 2>because Riggs, I mean Shane Black toxic. I've heard him
<v Speaker 2>say this five times. Riggs is the monster that gets
<v Speaker 2>put away until we need him. Right. He talks about
<v Speaker 2>the gentrification of America and how people live their happy
<v Speaker 2>little lives in suburbia and know that the war is over,
<v Speaker 2>and this guy is the only guy that really knows
<v Speaker 2>that the war is still going on. We got two
<v Speaker 2>veterans here, and by the way, John McLain was also
<v Speaker 2>a veteran like this was. It was originally supposed to
<v Speaker 2>be a three act movie where the first act is
<v Speaker 2>in New York and you find out about his veteran
<v Speaker 2>status and you really developed the character. So it's interesting
<v Speaker 2>they eliminated that whole thing. Okay, but anyway, these old
<v Speaker 2>war veterans, some of them, obviously they've got the sniper
<v Speaker 2>mentality of some people just need to die, right, And
<v Speaker 2>obviously Riggs is still in that world have a nice day,
<v Speaker 2>and so he's this Frankenstein that the rest of society
<v Speaker 2>wants to hide and put away until evil comes back
<v Speaker 2>into their lives in the middle of suburbia. And then
<v Speaker 2>it's time to get Frankenstein out and say we need
<v Speaker 2>you to save us right now. And so when Huntsackers
<v Speaker 2>like you've got to kill him, You've got to kill him,
<v Speaker 2>Roger Murtaw is like, we're going to do this by
<v Speaker 2>the rules, and we're going to get him, We're going
<v Speaker 2>to rest them, We're going to protect you and Riggs.
<v Speaker 2>First thing he sees from these guys is Huntsacker getting
<v Speaker 2>sniped from the helicopter.
<v Speaker 1>Which is a great scene by the way. I don't
<v Speaker 1>know if you know this or not, mister Joshua shoots
<v Speaker 1>Huntsecker from his helicopter, which Riggs doesn't notice shows. I mean,
<v Speaker 1>it's just kind of appears.
<v Speaker 2>That's weird. That's a weird thing, for sure.
<v Speaker 1>But the bullet goes through him and through the carton
<v Speaker 1>of eggdog that he's holding. Yeah, and I guess this
<v Speaker 1>is from The Manchurian Candidate. Oh okay, which was a
<v Speaker 1>Frank Sinatra movie.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I love that movie.
<v Speaker 1>Okay, hang on one second. D One of the things
<v Speaker 1>they talk about in the movie is that Riggs is
<v Speaker 1>a sharp shooter from the war right. That was his background.
<v Speaker 1>He was nineteen years old and is one of the
<v Speaker 1>great marksmen in the Vietnam War.
<v Speaker 3>Right when I was nineteen, I did a guy in
<v Speaker 3>Laos from a thousand yards out a rifle shot in
<v Speaker 3>high wind. Maybe eight or even ten guys in the
<v Speaker 3>world could have made that shot, the only thing I
<v Speaker 3>ever could have one.
<v Speaker 1>Interestingly enough, I read up on the scene where Riggs
<v Speaker 1>is hiding in the desert and Murtad goes to meet
<v Speaker 1>the bad guys who's going to try and get ran back,
<v Speaker 1>and he pulls out the hand gerna and all that stuff.
<v Speaker 1>So Riggs is in the weeds shooting this rifle and
<v Speaker 1>he's dropping bad guys left and right. I don't know
<v Speaker 1>if you know this or not, but that rifle, that
<v Speaker 1>very rifle was designed for a specific purpose. The nineteen
<v Speaker 1>seventy two Olympics, when those terrorists took the Israeli Olympic
<v Speaker 1>athletes hostage. Yeah, the swat team or whoever arrived to
<v Speaker 1>kind of deal with that situation was lamenting the fact
<v Speaker 1>that they didn't have any sharpshooters and they didn't have
<v Speaker 1>any guns that were good enough. And so that gun
<v Speaker 1>that mel Gibson used in that scene was a specifically
<v Speaker 1>designed as a quick accurate from long range to take
<v Speaker 1>out bad guys due to that Olympic terrorist incident.
<v Speaker 2>Interesting, Okay, that's awesome. Okay, So Merta wanting to play
<v Speaker 2>by the rules is kind of his refusal to go
<v Speaker 2>into the world of Frankenstein, to go into this mass killing.
<v Speaker 2>And he keeps trying to keeps trying to get him
<v Speaker 2>not to kill people. Yeah, I used it. That was ooh,
<v Speaker 2>still alive. Now we questioned them.
<v Speaker 1>You know why we questioned him because I got him
<v Speaker 1>in the lake.
<v Speaker 2>I didn't shoot him from the hole to try to
<v Speaker 2>jump off a building where it's no fair the building
<v Speaker 2>guy lived.
<v Speaker 1>Now whatever, be no killing, no killing?
<v Speaker 2>Right? Have you met anybody that you haven't killed?
<v Speaker 1>I haven't killed you yet.
<v Speaker 2>Don't do me no favor. And then John McLean's refusal
<v Speaker 2>of the call. He's not trying to be Rambow, right,
<v Speaker 2>He's trying to get the cops.
<v Speaker 1>He runs and hides. Yes, he runs, he pulls the
<v Speaker 1>fire alarm.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, he's trying to get people to come help, the
<v Speaker 2>people who should be helping. He's trying to get to
<v Speaker 2>come help, and he can't get him to come.
<v Speaker 1>Absolutely, he wants the fireman to show up so he
<v Speaker 1>can kiss their fin Dalmatians.
<v Speaker 2>So you've got this very interesting thing that he's working
<v Speaker 2>against both the obvious enemies and against what should be
<v Speaker 2>the good guys, which should be the authorities. Right, he's
<v Speaker 2>working against both of them. Both of them are against him. Attention,
<v Speaker 2>whoever you are, this channel is reserved for emergency calls only.
<v Speaker 2>Lay sound like I'm wannering a pizza.
<v Speaker 1>That's right, He's pretty unappreciated.
<v Speaker 2>Glass. And then we talked about the fact that die
<v Speaker 2>Hard is sort of a buddy cop movie. Right I
<v Speaker 2>would say so, but yeah, go ahead. But it's interesting
<v Speaker 2>these two movies. If you call Diehard a buddy cop movie,
<v Speaker 2>they are like number two and number three of the
<v Speaker 2>buddy cop genre. Number one you want to guess what
<v Speaker 2>do you think it is?
<v Speaker 1>The number one?
<v Speaker 2>First? No? No, no, first, Like we're we've the buddy
<v Speaker 2>cop genre starts. Where do you think it starts?
<v Speaker 1>Man, I don't know what you get?
<v Speaker 2>Forty eight hours?
<v Speaker 1>Oh good, call Stephen Desusa.
<v Speaker 2>Yes, and so both Jeb Stewart and Shane Black both
<v Speaker 2>pointed forty eight hours and say this was the beginning
<v Speaker 2>of the interesting cop movie. A lot of people will
<v Speaker 2>say lethal weapon, but forty eight Hours is really the.
<v Speaker 1>First one I can see that. I can see that.
<v Speaker 2>And so you've got Al Powell and you've got John McClain,
<v Speaker 2>and obviously Al is there as kind of a mentor
<v Speaker 2>to help kind of guide him. Not that he's like wise,
<v Speaker 2>but just that he's a voice of reason and support
<v Speaker 2>when it appears that the whole world is against him. Now,
<v Speaker 2>the question for for me to you is who is
<v Speaker 2>the mentor between Riggs and Murta.
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, what do you think?
<v Speaker 2>I think it's both, as much as you can cheat
<v Speaker 2>that answer, because it's not the next movie. Shoot. Okay,
<v Speaker 2>So Murta is trying to be the mentor for Riggs, right,
<v Speaker 2>He's trying to assure him that there that there can
<v Speaker 2>be a better way. You know, Riggs has gone into
<v Speaker 2>full crazy and is just hanging on by a thread.
<v Speaker 1>Hey, look, friend, people either think I'm suicidal, in which
<v Speaker 1>case I'm ft and nobody wants to work with me.
<v Speaker 1>Or I'm trying to draw a psycho pension, in which
<v Speaker 1>case I'm a ft and nobody wants to work with me. Basically,
<v Speaker 1>I'm ft.
<v Speaker 2>I don't want to work with it.
<v Speaker 1>Hey, don't.
<v Speaker 2>I ain't got no choice. Yes, we both aft.
<v Speaker 1>Do this all day, right, right, okay, Hey, one thing
<v Speaker 1>I want to talk about as we're moving through the plot.
<v Speaker 1>I'm sorry, no, leave the weapon. There are three scenes
<v Speaker 1>that introduced Rigs. Okay, oh yeah, one didn't make the movie.
<v Speaker 1>Bits in the director's cut. And so you have the
<v Speaker 1>Rigs where he's at home. He's bare naked and drinking
<v Speaker 1>last Night's.
<v Speaker 2>Be when everybody saw in the theaters back in nineteen
<v Speaker 2>eighty seven.
<v Speaker 1>Clearly he's sad and depressed and messed up. Yeah, okay.
<v Speaker 1>Then you have the other one where he's at the school.
<v Speaker 1>This is on the director's cut. He shows up, there's
<v Speaker 1>a school shooter. There's like a snipe sniper yeap, and
<v Speaker 1>he everybody's ducking for cover. Rigs walks out in the
<v Speaker 1>middle of daylight, right, and he says, I'm still here.
<v Speaker 1>A hole guy tries to shoot him and Riggs drops him.
<v Speaker 2>Right, Okay, let's have miss a couple of times. Like,
<v Speaker 2>he doesn't even start shopping, he's shooting immediately back. He
<v Speaker 2>just stands there towards the guy trying to let a
<v Speaker 2>cigarette all time.
<v Speaker 1>It's the equivalent of Rambo screwing his explosive arrow tips
<v Speaker 1>in while the guys are trying to shoot him, he's
<v Speaker 1>just getting ready. Yeah okay, right, so that was in
<v Speaker 1>the director's cut. Then there is a deleted scene Riggs
<v Speaker 1>is at a bar and these three robbers try to
<v Speaker 1>work him over.
<v Speaker 2>And we talked about that a little bit last time.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so interesting. So can you quite figure that out?
<v Speaker 2>I wanted to be that dark, Like the bar scene
<v Speaker 2>was too dark, and then the sniper scene was too
<v Speaker 2>immediately killing a guy. They wanted the character to not
<v Speaker 2>be quite so dark as Shane Black had written him,
<v Speaker 2>because they wanted there to be hope. You know that.
<v Speaker 2>You look at those two scenes and there's a guy
<v Speaker 2>with no hope, and so what you have then instead
<v Speaker 2>is the Christmas Tree slash drug deal scene, which is fantastic.
<v Speaker 2>And you told me about one of the guys who's
<v Speaker 2>doing the drug deal, the very last guy to survive.
<v Speaker 2>He's like he's lost his mind, he's got the crazy
<v Speaker 2>eyes and he's threatening him at the end the long airage.
<v Speaker 1>Okay, yes, I absolutely learned this and I was blown away.
<v Speaker 1>So the Christmas Tree lot where Riggs is doing this
<v Speaker 1>drug deal and he's paying one hundred Bucks for all
<v Speaker 1>of the cocaine in the world, and they're like hundred thousand.
<v Speaker 1>I love the line where he's like, they're like, you
<v Speaker 1>ain't a real cop.
<v Speaker 2>And that's a real bad dumb a real cop.
<v Speaker 3>And they said a real pink gun.
<v Speaker 1>And he says it was such intensity, I'm not going
<v Speaker 1>to try to match it. But the last guy left,
<v Speaker 1>the guy where he's like, hey, shoot this guy, just
<v Speaker 1>shoot this guy. That guy's name is Blackie. Damn it,
<v Speaker 1>damn it, damn His real name is John Ketis. He
<v Speaker 1>is the father of Anthony Ketis, lead singer of Red
<v Speaker 1>Hot Chili Patrick.
<v Speaker 2>Oh, of course, of course they look so much alike.
<v Speaker 2>That's awesome. How about that? Yes, okay, So the original
<v Speaker 2>question is martaw the mentor or his Riggs the mentor.
<v Speaker 2>It looks like Roger Martin until when they take his daughter,
<v Speaker 2>Riggs becomes the mentor. Riggs has to be the one
<v Speaker 2>that says, but we got to do it my way,
<v Speaker 2>we got to kill him.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, great point, great point. And then I would say
<v Speaker 1>that Riggs kind of gives that mentor ship back at
<v Speaker 1>the end of the movie. Okay, Frankenstein goes back into
<v Speaker 1>the castle.
<v Speaker 2>At the end of the movie. Right, Okay, So then
<v Speaker 2>we've got two guys who cannot be good cops. They
<v Speaker 2>can be good cops. You've got the scene with Tony.
<v Speaker 2>You won't hurt me, pficers. Police officers have rules.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's what my captain keeps telling me.
<v Speaker 2>Smack. Now, even at that point, he wasn't trying to
<v Speaker 2>kill Tony, right, that was just a happy accident, really
<v Speaker 2>was He was very lucky? Yeah? Yes. And then with
<v Speaker 2>you know, Riggs is obviously got a bad habit of
<v Speaker 2>killing people too quick. And so Murta is like, can
<v Speaker 2>we can we just question the guy shot him in
<v Speaker 2>the leg. It's still alive, we can question him.
<v Speaker 1>Okay, Let's I want to back up a step because
<v Speaker 1>right before Murtaz shoots that guy in the leg, let's
<v Speaker 1>back up a second. There's a suicide jumper that Riggs
<v Speaker 1>goes up to help down right, his job is to
<v Speaker 1>bring him down, and Mertos says, look, no guns, no
<v Speaker 1>jiu jitsu, just bring him down. That's his instruction. So Riggs,
<v Speaker 1>as we know, suicidal. This guy is clearly suicidal. He
<v Speaker 1>goes up and says, hey, you want a cigarette, And
<v Speaker 1>when the guy reaches for a cigarette, he cuffs him,
<v Speaker 1>and that's the do you really want to jump?
<v Speaker 2>You really? Okay?
<v Speaker 1>And if you watch that scene, there is a blooper
<v Speaker 1>in that scene that bugs the crap out of me. Really,
<v Speaker 1>So here's the deal. When Riggs pulls the guy off e,
<v Speaker 1>they're gonna jump. As they jump, there's a slow motion
<v Speaker 1>where both guys are clearly stunt men and they're both leaping.
<v Speaker 1>Their handcuffs break. Oh and they link hands. They like
<v Speaker 1>lock hands and I'm like, guys, we can we try
<v Speaker 1>it again?
<v Speaker 2>No, CGI, and you can't. So it was still the
<v Speaker 2>best take.
<v Speaker 1>Every time I watch it, I'm like that those cuffs
<v Speaker 1>break instantly and they hold hands all the way down. So,
<v Speaker 1>but that scene is great because you learn that Riggs
<v Speaker 1>really is suicidal, right.
<v Speaker 2>Because what follows immediately after that is Murta offering him
<v Speaker 2>his gun, trying to get him to prove that he's
<v Speaker 2>really not crazy. But what he does instead prove I mean,
<v Speaker 2>gets his thumb caught in the hammer of the gun
<v Speaker 2>as the trigger gets pulled.
<v Speaker 1>That and I watched that with my son. He didn't
<v Speaker 1>catch that until this last viewing. Yeah, and when he
<v Speaker 1>sticks his hand the hammer hits home and pinches his finger.
<v Speaker 2>Yep, so yeah, I mean half second later and he's boom.
<v Speaker 2>His brain's on the wall like full metal jacket. Yep. Okay,
<v Speaker 2>all right, you're ready to talk enemies, Yes, okay, we have,
<v Speaker 2>in full circumstances, a bad guy and a bad guy's
<v Speaker 2>number two, which might be worse than the bad guy himself. True. Right,
<v Speaker 2>You've got Hans and you've got Carl. Hans' job is
<v Speaker 2>to keep things in order. He's not concerned about John
<v Speaker 2>McLean insomuch as getting revenge on him or anything like that.
<v Speaker 2>He just wants to keep him from sing up the plan.
<v Speaker 2>You've got to stick to the plan, right, stick to
<v Speaker 2>the plan. And then Carl I want blood.
<v Speaker 1>Carl doesn't want neutral, he wants dead.
<v Speaker 2>And then for lethal weapon, we of course have the
<v Speaker 2>General General mccowster, that's right, who is ultra calm in
<v Speaker 2>all circumstances. Right, and then we've got Joshua, who is
<v Speaker 2>reserved in control but has the crazy behind his eyes,
<v Speaker 2>which is why Gary Busey was the perfect choice.
<v Speaker 1>He was awesome that he's that albino jack rabbit son
<v Speaker 1>of a bitch that shoots rigs right.
<v Speaker 2>Okay, And so the distinction is on the enemies here though,
<v Speaker 2>is in die Hard, you've got a whole slew of
<v Speaker 2>bad guys, and they did really a very good job
<v Speaker 2>of giving each of these what would normally be just
<v Speaker 2>kind of faceless henchman names and personalities.
<v Speaker 1>It's really true.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, John is also, as I said just before, working
<v Speaker 2>against Dwayne T. Robinson and Johnson and Johnson and Thornberg. Yeah.
<v Speaker 2>I mean, he's got everybody in the world against him.
<v Speaker 2>Here's the interesting part. You've got well trained German mercenaries
<v Speaker 2>and then you have well trained American mercenaries and you know,
<v Speaker 2>y Diard versus lethal weapon. But the superiors don't seem
<v Speaker 2>to be against Marta and Riggs in this movie. It
<v Speaker 2>kind of happens that way in the following movies a
<v Speaker 2>little bit, but not so much this one, and the
<v Speaker 2>other police officers are helping out like this is. It's
<v Speaker 2>definitely they've got some support, whereas John is acting completely
<v Speaker 2>on his own, well except for Ellis. He's going to
<v Speaker 2>help him out.
<v Speaker 1>John Boy, Hey, John Boy, Hey, you know one of
<v Speaker 1>the things I was gonna mention. You kind of brought
<v Speaker 1>it up there. But in the lethal weapon movies, the
<v Speaker 1>LA Cops are not incompetent. In Diehard, the LA Cops
<v Speaker 1>are completely incompetent.
<v Speaker 2>Certainly Detective Dwayne t. Robinson as well, and Al Powell
<v Speaker 2>drives a car like.
<v Speaker 1>The tournament car and that Swiss cheese. Uh yeah, but
<v Speaker 1>you got Dwayne t Robinson. The guy's coming in the
<v Speaker 1>front door, clueless guy who grabs the rose sticker on his.
<v Speaker 2>Quarterback is By the way, do we like THEO? There's
<v Speaker 2>a lot of hate for the there, and I think
<v Speaker 2>THEO is absolutely hilarious. I love the fantastic When.
<v Speaker 1>He comes in his opening scene, he's like magic. This
<v Speaker 1>is just to ac back to magic, over to Kareem boom. Yeah,
<v Speaker 1>just he has that great interesting Hey do you want
<v Speaker 1>to hear my Danny Glover invitation more than anything in
<v Speaker 1>the world. Okay, I don't do invitations. I got when
<v Speaker 1>invitation is very short. Danny Glover as Roger Murta. Yes,
<v Speaker 1>he rigs, he riggs, thank you, thank you, thank you.
<v Speaker 2>That's all he said, is like a fifty times. He
<v Speaker 2>does do that a lot. It doesn't do that a lot. Okay,
<v Speaker 2>So what do you think is the lowest point for
<v Speaker 2>these guys like, what's the lowest point. Let's start with
<v Speaker 2>John McLean. What's the lowest point in the movie.
<v Speaker 1>When he's picking glass out of his bare feet?
<v Speaker 2>Totally agree, Totally agree.
<v Speaker 1>That's not an eighties tough man. When he drags himself
<v Speaker 1>into the bathroom leaking blood everywhere.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and it's that. I mean, have you ever stepped
<v Speaker 2>on glass before? Oh?
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, hurts, Yeah, yes it does, all things being equal,
<v Speaker 1>I would rather be in Philadelphia.
<v Speaker 2>When I step on glass. Yes, nice, nicely done. It
<v Speaker 2>is a fly in the weight man. So at that point,
<v Speaker 2>this is where he when he reaches that low point,
<v Speaker 2>he has that moment of revelation where he realizes what
<v Speaker 2>a jerk he's been to his wife. And this is
<v Speaker 2>the thing he talked about Jeb Steward realizing whenever he
<v Speaker 2>almost got you know what, it gets hit by the
<v Speaker 2>what he thinks is a refrigerator box. I mean it
<v Speaker 2>is a box, but it's just the box. Right. He
<v Speaker 2>thinks he's going to die having just had a fight
<v Speaker 2>with his wife where he knows he's wrong and is
<v Speaker 2>never going to have the opportunity to just say I'm sorry. Yeah.
<v Speaker 1>The low point for Martin Riggs. Yeah, when he pulls
<v Speaker 1>the trigger of the gun and Mr Todd gets his
<v Speaker 1>handcut by the hammer. Okay, okay, like you said, half
<v Speaker 1>a second later, brain's on the wall.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I think that for it to be truly the
<v Speaker 2>lowest moment, there has to be the turnaround, Like, there
<v Speaker 2>has to be the turnaround. And so I'm going to
<v Speaker 2>say after he's been tortured by the electric shock, because
<v Speaker 2>he's just I mean, he's hanging defeated, he appears to
<v Speaker 2>be dead and still manages to come back to life.
<v Speaker 2>And I'll say this, the scene where he grabs the
<v Speaker 2>guy's head with his legs is a bit absurd.
<v Speaker 1>It's absurd because the guy's.
<v Speaker 2>Just letting his hands out. Really, this guy's just gonna
<v Speaker 2>let his hands hang back.
<v Speaker 1>They need to register Riggs's ankles as lethal.
<v Speaker 2>Right, And so I would say that also Murta's lowest
<v Speaker 2>point is that same incident. Right, they're both captured, they're
<v Speaker 2>both tortured or beaten, and his turnaround is I'm ready
<v Speaker 2>to break the rules. Yeah, I'm ready to do whatever
<v Speaker 2>it takes to get these guys.
<v Speaker 1>Hey, one of the things I want to point out,
<v Speaker 1>just a little tidbit go ahead, little side tidbit. I
<v Speaker 1>don't know how to verify this, but there's a scene
<v Speaker 1>right after the suicide jumper, Riggs pulls down the suicide jumper. Yes,
<v Speaker 1>Murta uses a mobile phone to call the psychiatrist and says, look,
<v Speaker 1>this guy's really crazy. She's like, absolutely, it's crazy. You
<v Speaker 1>should not be around him when he blows.
<v Speaker 2>Right.
<v Speaker 1>My understanding is that is the first on screen use
<v Speaker 1>of a cellular phone.
<v Speaker 2>Oh wow, that's interesting.
<v Speaker 1>I don't know how to verify this. That's one of
<v Speaker 1>the things I read.
<v Speaker 2>Interesting.
<v Speaker 1>You know what the internet is?
<v Speaker 2>You get me to drive?
<v Speaker 1>No, you want a fresh cry?
<v Speaker 2>Okay? And then again another parallel, the Triumph saving a
<v Speaker 2>kidnapped member of the family. Right, yeah, both movies. You
<v Speaker 2>have a kidnapping. Both movies the heroes are related to
<v Speaker 2>the kidnap victim and have to save them and paying
<v Speaker 2>frea fantastic No, it's.
<v Speaker 1>Amazing, love it.
<v Speaker 2>So that brings me to the death of the bad guys.
<v Speaker 2>So let's talk about enemy death in lethal weapon. Okay,
<v Speaker 2>death number one is the general, right, Murtag gets the
<v Speaker 2>general so to speak. My who was it? I think
<v Speaker 2>Caleb was watching my eleven year old. It's like he
<v Speaker 2>doesn't even get to shoot him. Right, That was that
<v Speaker 2>was an interesting thing. You know. He's he dies kind
<v Speaker 2>of of his own.
<v Speaker 1>He flips the car, the car's on fire, and there's
<v Speaker 1>grenades laying around.
<v Speaker 2>Right. It's his it's his own instruments to put him
<v Speaker 2>to death. And it's his own arrogance that puts him
<v Speaker 2>to death because instead of like taking cover or backing
<v Speaker 2>the car back into the garage, they're like, let's just
<v Speaker 2>drive as fast as we can at this police officer
<v Speaker 2>who has to have a gun at this point. Right,
<v Speaker 2>but you see him break down. I mean that death
<v Speaker 2>scene where he's just panicked, he's lost all composure.
<v Speaker 1>It's there's a grenade by my face, yep, and I
<v Speaker 1>can't reach it.
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.
<v Speaker 1>Hey, right before that scene, just back up just one second.
<v Speaker 1>So Riggs does the lethal ankles on. The torture guy
<v Speaker 1>comes in, takes over, shoots some bad guys. Joshua and
<v Speaker 1>the general get away. Okay, Now the pursuit is on
<v Speaker 1>at this point, and he rescues Rhann and merch On. Yes,
<v Speaker 1>when they come out, they go to the heavy metal
<v Speaker 1>dance club whatever it is, right, Oh yeah, and he
<v Speaker 1>just starts blowing people away, right, and like nobody notices
<v Speaker 1>right after they shoot the bartender.
<v Speaker 2>That was another thing. I was like, why did people
<v Speaker 2>not start running until like the fifth guy died.
<v Speaker 1>Riggs just walks out and just starts shooting people. Yeah,
<v Speaker 1>Now we as the audience just take for granted that
<v Speaker 1>those are bad guys. Clearly it's a front.
<v Speaker 2>For They had a name Dagon, he said, bad guy.
<v Speaker 1>It is all right, Riggs just walks out and blowing
<v Speaker 1>people away. Hey, man, we're closed.
<v Speaker 2>Boo boo boom. You don't have to go home, but
<v Speaker 2>you can't stay. And then we have the death of Hans.
<v Speaker 1>The death of Hans.
<v Speaker 2>So we talked about these movies being cowboy movies, yes,
<v Speaker 2>and we'll talk in a bit about them being Christmas movies. Yes.
<v Speaker 2>But you've got the hero at the end of his rope,
<v Speaker 2>and what does he do when he realizes he's only
<v Speaker 2>got two bullets? Two bullets, two bullets and two bad guys. Yes,
<v Speaker 2>so you have the perfect end to a cowboy movie,
<v Speaker 2>a joke followed by a bullet in the head.
<v Speaker 1>It's awesome, so awesome.
<v Speaker 2>So what does he do? He comes in with the
<v Speaker 2>machine gun in his hand because he has taped his revolver,
<v Speaker 2>although I know it's not a revolver. Folks don't know.
<v Speaker 2>Write in to his back with tape that says, season's great.
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I know, more Christmas? Yes, yeah, absolutely, it's a
<v Speaker 1>face off here, it is. It's the show down.
<v Speaker 2>And to further emphasize the cowboy moviness of it all,
<v Speaker 2>Huey Lewis gets the bullet in the head after in
<v Speaker 2>the middle of his laugh or jack funny joke. Actually,
<v Speaker 2>I guess it's Hans that makes the joke. It is
<v Speaker 2>the worst pronunciation of mother ever. What was it you said? Again?
<v Speaker 1>Oh?
<v Speaker 2>Yes, ah. Then Hans doesn't die right away, and of
<v Speaker 2>course the damsel in distress has to be saved. And
<v Speaker 2>you know, she's being pulled out of the window. And
<v Speaker 2>what is it that won't release from her hand? It's
<v Speaker 2>that Rolex watch for that job she got, Yeah, the.
<v Speaker 1>One that Ellis was so intent on John looking at.
<v Speaker 2>At the beginning. Yep, so has to release the rewards
<v Speaker 2>of her women's lib so that the cowboy hero can
<v Speaker 2>save us.
<v Speaker 1>Right, quit your job, stay on with your husband.
<v Speaker 2>Is that the message? Yeah? Kind of is right, kind
<v Speaker 2>of is but hey, you know what, that's part of
<v Speaker 2>the reason that guys love this movie. All Right, Well,
<v Speaker 2>that does it for episode two of the Diehard Versus
<v Speaker 2>Lethal Weapon.
<v Speaker 1>All Right, d The good news is you don't have
<v Speaker 1>to wait that long. We're actually going to release episode
<v Speaker 1>three tomorrow. Merry Christmas, Merry Christmas.