#316 – Ashley McBryde on Being To Small To Play the Guitar + Amazing Support from Her Mom Being the 6th of 6 Kids + Being Nominated for 3 CMAs including Female Vocalist of the Year

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Speaker 1: M HM, You're gonna love this episode. Welcome to episode three sixteen. Ashley McBride will be on with me for about an hour and being too small to play the guitar, so she played something else for a while, the amazing support of her mom. Six out of six kids. Who's number six on the list? The instrument she played, the guy or a scholarship in the college. It's just a great interview with Ashley McBride. Coming up our New music Top five, Let's do it right now. At number five, Carly Piers put out a new album called twenty nine Written in Stone, and here's a song from Carly and Ashley McBride called never Wanted to Be that Girl I'll never wanted to be. At number four, Scotty McCreary has a new album and the album is called Same Truck and here's a new song that he performed on a radio show called Damn Straight, Damn Straight. Big Thing Now came even listen to sound into Missing Bird. He hates might be here. Bobby wanted to make a last minute change too. At number three, Brett Eldridge has a new song called Mr. Christmas, Every Wish Will Come True. Yell be Mr Christmas Fall You a number two. Jamison Rogers has a new EP, I Love Jameson Rodgers, great songwriter, great artist, the EPs called Betcher from a Small Town. Here's a new song called Girl with a Broken Heart. Sheep your head out, No good Bye, no fun Go send them Selfies on fire, keep selling Yourselfie ain't the long and my number one song this week. Old Dominion has a new song called Hawaii Swept Up And just like Samprasilia, the Bone on Drinking Pine ammor out of them. Those are my favorite releases this week, you guys go check them out. Coming up, Ashley McBride. There is a long haul way leading to the studio and sometimes you hear the voice as they get ever so close. Actually it's just a house, so it's not like a real studio. So sometimes the walls come bouncing, the voices come bouncing off the walls, and here they come. Now we clap if we had a big group of people, but we don't have a big group of people. Okay, come on in, come on guys after that's literally the first time we've ever clapped for anyone in the history of this I'm gonna see you better stay close the case it gets out of hand, in case you just pulled the rip cord. I'm gonna put this monster in some airplane mode. Mom loves to call when I'm doing something. It's like a an innate since that she should call you right when something's happening. Yeah, I wonder what actually is doing. How often do you talk to your mom? Um? Not quite as often right now, but it's usually I don't know, every couple of days, yeah, or anytime I try to cook something? And is that often? If I were you a good cook, I'm not bad. I think what I'm really interested is people who do something really wonderfully, like you as an artist songwriter, but also are you what else are you good at? And does that translate like your drive for being an artist and to anything else in your life that that that same drive that I think that drive pops up in um handiwork really Yeah. I would like to fix stuff myself, and when it's too much for me to tackle, I'm I'm not afraid at all to call in for for the rescue party. Um. But like I had a problem with my air duct my my brand new house. It just kept flooding. The downstairs kept flooding and then that finally results in an air duct getting full of water, and I was like, I can fix that. So did you go? Because what we have now is the ability to go to YouTube for anything, yea, which changes before I went to YouTube, though, I called so my drummer is also a mechanic and an eagle scout and he's awesome. I did not call him. I called his father, who taught that that boy had to be all of those things. So I called um George Hill, and I was like, here's what I want to do, and he was like, okay, here are the steps you need to make sure you take. So I did it. It's also funny too that when you're in an artistic business um like you are UM in in my different worlds that I'm in, your broke a long time and you have to figure out how to do other things because since you're so broke, you have to learn or you just die because you can't do music or I can't, you know, try to do radio or be a comedian because there's no money in it for the first forever forever, So you have to fix your own crap and cook your own meals and learn to survive, and you become a good cook because you get tired of eating crappy food. You kind of acquire all of these skills, and then then you get it kind of all figured out at once and you think you can have a figured out. Then you realize you have no idea and you kind of start over again. Yeah, but I think it just has to do with your ability to be miserable and your tolerance for it. Agree. I mean, I know you're kind of joking, but I but it was about going, well, this is uncomfortable. But I've all it's always been uncomfortable for you know, growing up, you know, a poverty kid. And I was like, what's the worst can happen? I stay the same, Like right, so let's go. My vacuum broke two days ago, just like the little spinny thing stopped being a spinny thing, and I thought, I can probably get someone to fix it. I can probably just buy another one. But what I'm gonna do now is take it apart entirely. You really did that and fix it myself, because you know, before I live back here, back back in Nashville, I was over in Watertown. There was nobody around to help, and growing up, we didn't have a lot of money, and when something broke, my mother would fix it. My father would fix and he can fix anything. But my mom's not afraid to take something apart and see how it works either. So do you feel like a little bit of you does that because you feel like that's where you come from, Because I mean, at this point, you have plenty of money. I can get another vacuum, right, And I struggle with this too sometimes, Like you could get a vacuum, You can hire somebody to get a vacuum, bring it to you in vacuum your floor. You could you I didn't think about having someone else clean my house. And that's but a bit of that I wanted. If that's true, Is that instilled in you and that's what you just do because of where you come from and the people that raised you. Yeah. Absolutely, I think our first instinct for for people like you and I is to roll up our sleeves and figure it out for ourselves. And that's cooking or fixing a vacuum cleaner, or how do I make a career making stuff up and expect to be paid for it? And that's where it comes back over to I mean that's it you had to go. I mean, listen, you you played what these small biker bars. You know you've been to Cabin, Arkansas many times. I mean I know every everywhere that your story has gone from Jonesboro, Arkansas stage Like I that's that's my path as well, you know, one way or the other. And so you know, when I would know your story, but then I would kind of reread your story to make sure that I was still kind of clued in before I do this, I kind of go back over things, and it's just like dang, Like that's a that's a different way to go about it. As someone who wants to be um known as a great songwriter and country music artist and a female right to go into these bars. But there's no other way that no one told me. Just like you know, I'm left handed, but I played guitar right handed and um and but no one ever told me that was an option to restring it or turn it upside down or learn it another way. I just thought this was how things were done. So I, you know, would would play some shows and like borrow people's equipment to do that, and then save up and buy those pieces of equipment and run my own sound and um, you know, I didn't need like a fog machine or anything, but you know how to run monitors and how to how to ring out a room and all of that. I'm still not a great sound engineer, but I had to figure out how to do it all and how to fund it all. Talk to me about when you first started playing shows live, like before you learn how to play guitar. I want we'll get to all that earlierly stuff, but I want to know about your live kind of your live show experience, like was it out of our or a church or like where do you for the first time go and ask for the affection of others? You don't know. I didn't play like a lot of talent shows and stuff. In fact, I was pretty shy, it terrified. Maybe maybe just make me cry for people to so, you mean, like in high school to pay me any attention. I like middle school. Um, but I lived in We lived really close to Hardy, you know, Mammoth Spring is really close to Hardy, Arkansas. And they have like it's like a canoe rentals and antique shops and they had a little place in the gazebo where people would play music, and I did that and they gave me a hundred dollars to stand there and play Who who gave it? The city? Yeah, we're just like go catterwaller up this gazebo. For a couple of hours, I just played, you know, bluegrass songs and stuff and that. So that's probably the first time. And when you first started playing, do you feel like I'm pretty good at this or do you feel like this is something I can do while I figure out what I'm good at. I knew I just I just wanted to do it, and I didn't know yet at that young age if I was good enough to do it. Oh man, I was probably twelve or thirteen when that happened. I started playing guitar when I was nine, but when I was like a little, a little squirt, not any taller than you know, what do they say in NI hid a grasshopper? Um? We read a blue grass festival and I had a plastic telecaster. Got a photo of it and it had like Mickey Mouse or Carmit the Frog or something on it. And um, this this band called the Tennessee Gentleman was on stage and they asked my mom because I'm glued watching these guys. Um, would she like to come and sit on the edge of the stage. So I did, and I didn't take my little plastic guitar at first, UM and I sat there on the edge of the stage and I watched them play, and then the audience erupted, of course, into applause, and my mom looked at me and she said, I knew, I knew you had it. Then you wanted to be on the stage and you wanted people to applaud you. What kind of music was played around you as a kid? Luckily all kinds, UM, I mean, like the carpenters love and spoonful John Um. And then also my mom, she didn't try to shove classical music down our throats at all, but she would just kind of have it playing in the house. Us. It's sort of so I'm that we would ask questions, what is this song, and she'd be like, Oh, that's kind of planet not conmused by Mozart. There's a movie about him if you'd like to watch it, And they're like, oh, yeah, I want to watch a movie about this cool guy. So luckily all of that was included. And then my dad UM was more like Christofferson that area. He really liked those like Tormented. Uh, which version of christoffers? Yeah? Why me Lord? That version? UM? To this day, my favorite, one of my favorite songs of all time, My favorite Christofferson song is to Beat the Devil? Is that because of your dad? Is there a song that was played in your house so much that let's eliminate that one? But you hear it and it just puts you back, like you feel that like dang, I remember being Amanda, Amanda because we had this UM. I think it was supposed to be like a family room, but it's where my dad kept There was like a gun safe in there, and like guitars and the kids weren't really supposed to be in there a whole bunch unless you were going to go in there and use an instrument. And so that is just about half a hallway away from the kitchen where my mom is doing dishes, and my dad was playing Amanda on the guitar, singing and that high part that happens on the end of Uh. My mom was singing it in the kitchen and here I am kind of walking down the hallway and catching both they're singing together. They don't know, he doesn't know that she's singing with him, and I'm hearing it and just that song, you see what it does. I'm like when I think about why not me from the Judds because my mom used to sing that and moms you know that's since passed away. But it's that you. I mean, you kind of feel how you felt then, just for a split second. It's like. There's also the intro to an Alison Krause record. It was Alison Krause and Union Station. It's the one I had it on vinyl. She seated like a staircase or something with her fiddle in her hand. And I am seven ish or nine years old. As soon as I hear that guitar riff startup and I get giddy. My therapist at one point gave me a book. And I've been through a decent amount of therapy um at this point in my life. And that's a superpower. Yeah, it's a tool. It's like Batman superpower, right, Like Batman had much cool stuff, so he was a superhero and so I feel like, again I've accumulated cool tools and traits and um. And she gave me a book that talked about music and you know, the book talked about how when you hear something, even when you smell something very specific for a split second, in your brain, it reacts the exact same way it did when you were what at whatever point. So just for a brief moment, you get that feeling again, like in your chest of like, oh man, that's that. That reminds me of being seven or nine or thirteen. Yeah, because our brains really don't know the difference between an actual experience and the thought of that experience. I suppose, right, and are what do they call that? It's like our our dumb lizard brain, our caveman brain. They just know that that experience is real, so that would make sense. It was actually studying the three parts of the brain yesterday, which is wild. And you know the bottom part of the brain is like the lizard brain. It's they have two modes. They are attacking, running or relaxing. You know, it's those two or they're just like ah, there's nothing else. And I try not to live like that, and I really work on trying. As I've gotten older, I tried not to react as much and I try to respond more. I'm trying. I'm learning because I love my therapist, and I know it was like probably trying to put overalls on a cat, trying to get me to go to therapy. And finally it did, and I was like, this is awesome. I was talking yesterday with my therapist not to go down a whole therapy train, but I was. He was like, when did you know about therapy? I was like, I didn't. I'm from population seven sventy to Arkansas, right that we were trying to afford, you know, hamburger helper for dinner. Not you didn't know about mental health. It wasn't It wasn't really an option. And everything under the rug is an option. Pray about it is an option in which that it does work, you know, for for a lot of people that simply simply praying about it, but let going, like God, but also let go and let therapist, let go and let yeah. And for me it was insurance. I was like, once I even discover with insurance and they were like, he was like, oh, that's how Yeah. I was like, twenty six, I got insurance for the first time. So I started going to therapy and talking to somebody who and I mean, this is the best way possible didn't give a crap about me. Yeah, that was so freeing because I know that you know, you don't have to hang out with me for three days and deal with me. You're just gonna give me your unbiased advice based on what I'm saying in your education. That's why I feel with them and so but yeah, that's been a big tool for me. Um, did you do you feel like you've had a whole different set of Like I wouldn't. I don't want to sort obstacle. But since you've become so popular and famous, like, are you finding new struggles with fame with notoriety Because I would assume someone that comes from where you come from again with experience, like that's just an eye opening world where you're like, sometimes I love it, but sometimes I really hate it. Well, yeah, when you all you know is struggle and I have something to prove. I have something to prove. I have something to prove. But I still feel that way. So, like you know, when you rescue a dog that's spent it's young life, really hungry, that dog is always in hunger mode, and so I'm kind of that way. There's some things that I'm struggling with. Um, I mean, I mean I live over in East Nashville where nobody cares. Right, Um, it's a very cool part of its very cool part of town. Everybody's super cool about stuff. And just just recently, as yesterday, I got stopped a few times, which I think is great. I've worked my whole life for someone to ask for a photo with me. But then I thought, oh wow, I'm not used to that happening. I don't think, Um my address got leaked on the internet. That was super cool because I don't live behind a gate. Um. So it's like, as as things get better and you feel like a lot of your problem, what I have learned is that problem is just pivot, and it's all and how, and it's all and how you you you accept them and realize that everybody's got them and they've Like my life has gotten better in a lot of ways. But also I've had to take on a lot more responsibilities and challenges, and I'm very proud of how I worked. And the same thing. Sometimes I'm so tired, but I have to remind myself, I'm so grateful that I get to be tired doing something I love. Right, I don't know how you have time to be sitting across from me right now. Well, everything is going on. I don't have a talent, and you say that, I'm no. I'm gonna swear to you. I'd have to hustle as my talent, like I have nothing. Hustle is a talent. I will agree with you there. But if you weren't talented, you wouldn't live behind the gate, I promise true. But they're just some grat You're right, I'll let you have that one. I'm not even gonna argue that I'll let you have that one. Um your talent? When did you start to be told that you might be great at singing? I think it started with not being told to not sing when I wasn't great at singing. I was a little kid. Were you a good little kid singing or you a passionate little kid singing? I both. I was singing UM somewhere out there from an American tale, and like fall goes West, somewhere up, oh yeah, and UM somewhere over the Rainbow. And then there was a record. Um, there was a Ricky Skaggs record that I loved with like live in London and um a record by the Whites I'm hanging it around, just a little kid all then you'll get lonely. Um, and mom never told me not to sing. There's six of us kids. So there's three boys and then a girl, and then another boy than me. The boy right before me, Daniel, used to throw like shoes and stuff at me and try to get me to shut up when I'm trying to learn to play mandolin and learning to play guitar and learning to play bass and I'm singing all the time. And he was the one that was like, but he's also he lives really, he doesn't live far from me at all. And um, he's one of my biggest champions, my biggest cheerleaders. So um, my mom was on a bowling league and like I said, I was a really shy kid, but I didn't mind singing as my way of communicating. Uh, So I would sing. I would go to her friends at the bowling alley and said, you want to hear me sing something from um an American tale? And they were like sure, you know, And I'd sing a few things and I'd go get back in my chair and lear in my coloring book. So I think not being necessarily told that I was great, but just not being um, not being shamed about it. From a really young age. Your dad played music, your mom loved music. Did that rub off on any of the other kids to where they everybody can sing? Everybody can sing. My sister has a beautiful voice. My mother has a beautiful voice. And in church, you know, we were required to know all of the parts alto tenders a broad out base everything. My grandmother used to, UM, take my finger and move it along the page of the hymnal to show me what notes we were going to be singing. Even if it was the base we would everybody on on mom's side and Dad's side, everybody can sing. Um. I'm the only one that just kind of took off with it. I even had one of my brother's skin was played guitar in our younger years, and I don't know why he stopped at a brother that played trumpet. My sister played flute. Um, So we are a musical family. I'm just the only one that I guess it kind of stuck. It's interesting because I'm left handed and I played guitar left handed. When I first I went to a paunch shop and I was doing comedy and I thought, Okay, I don't want to have to steal other people's music to do parodies. I want to actually write original comedy stuff. So I want to paunch shop fifty bucks about The guitar was right handed, and I just switched the strings around. But what happened when there's a nut in it and it holds different? So I kept busting I was gonna say, busting nut. I kept breaking these nuts. Yes, these nuts. The strings kept breaking the nuts at the bottom of the guitar. It like fracturing, fracturing it. Oh my god, yes, I got your back, so over and ope. So so it took a long time until I actually got a left handed guitar. But I did not take to it well. I I music for me has been very difficult. I've put a lot of work into, you know, learning chords and bar chords, and for me, very difficult. And I can't sing. I can sing just well enough to do comedy that people aren't distracted by my bad singing. Boys, now I'm pretty funny. You gotta give yourself for credit that I don't trust me. I get enough credit, don't With you growing up with a family full of music, did you feel like it was kind of intrinsic. I love the way it's sounded when we all sang in church together. But yeah, it just kind of just is playing guitar in love it when you started still assuming you got bloody fingers like everything, like, do you feel like you got it? Well? They wouldn't let me play guitar at first because I was too small to hold it safely, so they let me bang on a mandolin. I remember I was probably in kindergartener first, right, going outside of the driveway and rubbing my fingers on the concrete because I thought that would help me get Callice's. I was tired of my fingers being sore. And then when I'm nine years old, my dad takes me to a music store and Fair, Missouri, which is just right across the line from Mammoth Spring. So up until now I've been playing bandolin. And then I was big enough that I could sort of play with my mom's Alvarez um but kind of under supervision. But they were going to get me a three quarter sized guitar. I didn't know. So we went into this music store called Fair Music, cleverly named, and Dad hands me this little three quarter sized k guitar, and he says, see if you can play something on that goes and talks to the guy. You know, when I was sitting there playing like go tal Aunt Roadie or something, and he walked back into where I was, he said, can you play it? I showed him what I figured out. He said it's time to leave. So I handed the guitar back to the guy behind the counter and Dad said, nope, that's yours. Take it home. And so I wasn't great. Mom tells the story that it was like three days. My dad shows me like three chords when we get home, and about three days later, I'm bawling in the kitchen because I can't play and sing at the same time. So I'm learning Snowbird and by Anne Murray and I'm learning Steel Rails by Alison Krause in Union Station and I'm super upset, and Mom said, give it a week. Just just give it a week and see if you feel better about it. So I don't. I don't know. I think I think there wasn't there weren't a lot of distractions growing up on a farm, and with access to instruments, I think that helps everything kind of click. There's nothing else to do. That whole situation. If you upset, you can't sing him play. That happened to me last week, the same thing. I was like, Okay, I can't sing a play. Why can't I do it? There are still certain things I can't sing and play. I can't do it. Do you ever get um? I mean, it's just wild that you started on the mandolin. I don't hear of many people that, because of their size, just start on the mandolin. Mostly it's people learn a string instrument and they go to the mandolin, but not because you're literally hands are so My hands were so tiny. Yeah. Do you feel like that was a good lead into the guitar? This is really really different because it is so I feel like it's a bit more advanced. It is more advanced, and I think what it did for me is even though it wasn't great at mandolin, I'm still terrible um, but it did teach my right hand a lot about rhythm and making it hit the strings I wanted to hit. So I didn't have to struggle when it came to guitar with how do I strum and what are the patterns? So I think that that was probably beneficial, but I was just terrible. I have to imagine because for me to have a relationship ship now with Ricky Scaggs, it's like the coolest thing. But for someone who because you're a bigger blue grass fan than I was, I just wasn't exposed to much of it. Us it was pure country or his fifties and sixties country. We didn't listen to a lot of seventies countries. You know, only Randy, only Randy Travis in the eighties. But my grandmother adopted me for a while, and you know, if it was it was a lot of gospel, Andy Griffith, gospel record, It's a lot of I thought Ray Charles was a country artist for the first was country artist, yes, I mean, but but I thought like that was what he did my grandmother and so, But you know, Ricky Skaggs was about the only bluegrass influence that I had. But there was a while where he was like a you know, pop country guy in terms of what was popular in country, not like people would assume a pop country guys now. But to know, Ricky is so cool to me, But I would imagine as someone who loved the mandolin and his and his influence and inspired by blue grass. That's gotta be pretty cool for you as well, right, It's awesome. We were we did an opery. I don't remember how many operas to go it was, but my mando player, Chris Um, wasn't able to come to sound check, so Matt and I the lead guitar player, went ahead to the stage. We're just going to kind of get our ears about us. And it was almost time for Mr Scaggs to have his sound check, or maybe he was finishing his up, but he was kind of, you know, futson around with a childycaster in an amp and kind of doing stuff. And I walked on stage and was talking about our mandelin player is gonna be late, and I'm wishing our sound engineer the best of luck when he gets there. And I just looked at Mr Scaggs and I said, you don't know any good Mandelin players, do you? And he said not biblically no, And and then it occurs to me that what kind of life of my living right now? Where I just I'm standing on the same stage as Ricky Skaggs and asking if you list any good Mandlin players? Blows my mind, blows my mind. Yeah, it's really cool too for me. The cool people, and I say cool people that I thought were really neat when I was a kid, I still feel like a really neat Yeah, like Luke Brian, he's just a dude. Now he's my friend, so I don't He's one of the nicest. Absolutely, that's why he's my friend. But I'm saying like it's it's the when we had in Chestnut, for example, the nut that's cool. I was like, this is the coolest thing in the whole world. Like that, to me is still what excites me, you know, being forty years old and in Nashville, and I would imagine that for you, that whole that history of country music and being able to be around those folks as a big deal as you're a huge deal. Like and just this past opry Um. This last week, I was standing in my dressing room and Miss Jennie Seely came walking in as she often does, and says, hey, I think that's just the coolest thing. And Crystal Gale popped in one night. Man, that's crazy, Huh, that's crazy to tell yourself that if when you're if you were to be able to tell your twelve year old self that, yeah, no, I would think you're high if you told me that. I do want to talk about this, this new song that you wrote. If I'm right here, you wrote this with Carly and Shane mcinally when that came out today. UM, so it's called never wanted to be that girl. You're gonna play a loot clip up at here. I never wanted to be somebody I'm always curious about because it's you, Carly and Shane, all three great songwriters. You and Carl are both artists who gets the song. And when you walk in and you have the idea were you're writing for? Carly? Were you just writing? I think the way I understand it was my publisher asked were there any artists I would like to write with? And I think Carly was posed the same question, and we had each mentioned each other's name. So that's how the right kind of happens. We both worked with Shane before I really liked what we got, so the three of us together was gonna make sense. And they were already in the room chit chatting by the time I got there, and Carly said, you can shoot it down if you want to, but I'd love to write a duet. That's awesome. That's what I was thinking the whole way here was when was the last time we had a female duet? And I think, um, that you and I would have a really good shot at it, especially given that we right so well with Shane, and um, so you wrote to sing it together? Yeah, we wrote on purpose? Yeah? Nice? And so you're right the song with who gets the song? I mean, it's obviously gonna be Carly's record, right, but who I mean? Is that a thing where it could have gone either way? What do you have if the timing goes right? Do you think you would have also put the song on your record? Right? So she right, she's cutting before we're cutting, So let's let her do that. In fact, there's a song I wrote recently with Kaylee Hammock and Nicolette Hayford, and Kaylee is gonna cut it, and I'm like, yeah, but I want to cut it too, And if what if I cut it first? It's so it's just, um, I don't know, it's just kind of a respect thing. And because I know Kaylee is going to kill that song, and um, when Carly said she was putting this one written in Stone, I flipped. I love her, I adore her. How long ago did you cut the song? Oh? When did we do this? Like? When did you ride it? When did you record it? It was only a couple of months. Here, let's see what the date was on the old work tape here. Oh you have the work tape. Yeah, that's gold there. Um, I'm not sure if it's and you know what I think. But actually doesn't have a case on her phone, like she go, actually just lives life. So March just no case on our phones. The case that looks like a wall here, but you had to pull it out to look at it. Why I'm a wild woman. March wrote it. We wrote it, and then it was it was probably April, the end of April. Yeah, you cut it that quick, I think so. I think so because in the beginning of May, I know, I was like out of pocket for a while, so we had to have cut it before that. When you write a song that is a duet and you're writing it for yourselves at least when you're in the room, are you writing parts for yourselves that you each want to sing or is it a group? Okay, well what if this verse just said this, Yeah, we kind of wanted to because our options were, Um, there was a leand Wi Max song. It would have made a great duet back of the day I'm the fool in love with the fool still in love with you. If that were duet, Okay, well we we can't outdo that song. So let's look at the mcentirely to Davis, does he love you? We're not going to outcool that song either, and I'm gonna reinvent that song. So we just thought, what if we what if we don't confront each other. What if we know about each other but we don't confront each other or say, um, you know, damn you or damn me, or call the guy a crap sack. We never did that either. We just decided that let's just start. Let's just tell some stories about ourselves here and and not be afraid. I'm not afraid to tell you I've gone through somebody's phone. You've done it too, And anybody who's not willing to admit that it's okay, they can just lie about it. Most of them are on a case though, and I don't feel like I'm gonna break it a way to get busted too, Like if you're going through somebody's phone, it's not in a case. Then you drop it like I don't know it was the cat. Um. So we really did start, as you know, by asking the question, who's the other woman who's our first character, and how does she come in contact with guy? And maybe you just left an award show, or maybe you just got your nails done and you don't you can't change your tire properly or whatever. Um, it would be that innocent that you offer to help me change the tire, and then you go, I think you owe me a beer, and you hit it off, and then you just don't think, you know, you just don't think to ask any of those questions because this seems so fine. But then when you run across something like you do in this song, which is just hey babe, what time are you coming home? And then you're like, oh, crap, this is why we only go out on Tuesdays, this is why I've never been to his house. And you feel so stupid, and now you realize that you're kind of a piece of crap right now, but you didn't mean to be. And then on Carly's verse, we talked about women who didn't have a clue. Um, that was my mom. She didn't have a clue. And when when we found out about all of that stuff, it just it just hit her like a ton of bricks. And there are ones that kind of find out about it and still make excuses for it. Um. And in that verse, he jumps in the shower consistently as soon as he gets home, and she picks up his phone and goes looking through it and finds me. And that's not a behavior that she would want to exhibit. When you go through someone's phone, an invasion of privacy that severe, there's something way, way, way wrong. You should know as soon as you have the feeling that you want to look through someone's phone that something's wrong enough to really have a conversation about it. You don't want to be that person. Bless his heart, man. You know, hopefully there there'll be some guys that hear this song too and go, I have got to stop doing that, or some that go, I've got to put a better code on my phone. You know that's true. Plus we have facial recognition and all that's true. That's true. Um. You know, you talk and you have a history of writing very personally at times at what point in your writing career did you feel like, Okay, now feel comfortable to do this because you have to. It's not even just about singing it publicly, it's about writing it with someone sometimes that you're not familiar with, and sharing an extremely vulnerable story and then trying to make art out of a situation or a life out of something uncomfortable. When did that kind of click for you that the power was in vulnerability. I loved I thought I was unafraid. Earlier in my early twenties, I thought, you know, I'm I'm writing these songs and they feel personal, and this is great and hopefully it helps people. And then I heard a record called Killing Uncle Buzzy, and it was the first time I've ever heard Travis's name. Travis by the Way of Trees, Travis Meadows, if You're Travis Meadows, and Minefield is the first song that my friend Shelley Tackett plays for me and then explains where the record came from, what was going on in his life, And I thought, I thought, I've been um I thought I've been pretty vulnerable and in truth telling here and this guy just made that look like Mary had a little lamb so, and then I kind of learned through listening and becoming friends with Travis and talking to him a bunch that not only can you do the thing that that makes you a little bit uncomfortable, but you should because that is number one. It's gonna help heal you. But our overall goal here is to try to help somebody else too. So if it scares me, it's fine, I'll still do it. Do you have a song that you think back to and go, man, that's when I hit a next the next level of being a songwriter or or sharing a sense of vulnerability, because I feel like I'm always growing, but every once in a a while I go, Okay, I think I just kind of clicked up to a new level. Do you think back to a song where you go, boy, this is this is a whole This is new territory for me, But I like where I'm going. Bible in a forty four for me was when I recognized myself as a songwriter. Really like. I think Tricia was the one talking to me about that song. She sang the pants off of it, and with Patty Loveles singing the harmonies, I mean they could sing the back of a cereal box and it would sound wonderful. But that was when I kind of went all right, Okay, it's not a hobby. I can do this. And I think the next time that that click happened was probably a girl going nowhere. Um, because I was, I was unafraid to be like man. Almost everyone was like, you're insane when you moved to town because you had I don't want a lot of artists? Do you regionally? You play regionally, try to get good where you get good, and then you move here when you move here, like, did you move to be a songwriter? Did you move to be an artist? I did? I moved here to be a songwriter. And who taught you that you could make enough money to have a nice living writing songs or just a living at all? Lacy J. Dalton sang a song called Sixteenth Avenue. That's when I tell my mom at like twelve years old, um, wherever sixteenth Avenue is where I want to be? And she said it's Nashville, Tennessee. Later that year, she takes me to Nashville, Tennessee, takes me to Spigma. I get to kind of experience the city. Did she take you because she knew you wanted. Oh yeah, So I knew through watching people here that oh, this this, this is a band and they make a living with this guy. This guy wrote going against the Grain Garth Brooks. Oh. He also wrote, there ain't no future in the past, even skille. Songwriting is the other thing you can do. And I know, even at a young age, that doing music on the level that I want to do it, you know, Arena's stadiums amphitheaters what I want to do someday. The chances are pretty slim, but I know that I've got the stuff. I've got all. I've got the basic edge of that blade. If we can sharpen it, I can make a living doing it. And I didn't care if I wound up just as dirt poor as Mozart in the and this is I gotta do it. And I hear your mom bringing to Nashville because you were inspired by a song as a kid and go and your mom loved the crap out of you. She's awesome, She's awesome. I mean to have that much support, then you're the sixth kid six you know what tired she is. I'm saying, like you think she'd be all all out of support by the sixth kid. We were driving over here. We went to UM after get COVID tests like every two days, even though I had the vaccine, I have to flag in this weekend. So we're driving back and my wife is like, who's coming over today? I said, Ashbride and she was like, let me tell you, and she this is my song and she played it and this is what sucks and she played one night standards. I was like, why is this your song? Like we just got married, and she's like, no, he's just my vibe. Bill. I'm like, you know what this is about, right, She goes, I don't care. You tell her I love her and this is my vibe. Yeah. So we were listening to this over here. Then I walk in and Read is who's the video guy? Over here? Read is singing it wasn't in the car with us? Is this? And I guess you haven't really have been able to play a whole lot of shows since this song really popped. I was going to ask how how loud this song is sung back to you? But I guess maybe the sample size isn't big enough yet. It's um it gets sung just as much as Delanaga does. I think since we had time, everyone had time to live with it for an entire year, like we put it out and then we have to wait an entire year to tour it. But now everyone's had the ability to digest the whole record. So almost as many people know styrofoam as No One night standards. Have you played a lot of shows we started back, Okay, so you've had some time. I'm wrong, you've had some time to actually go out and and hear audiences and it's it doesn't it's it's the same feeling every time somebody starts singing along. We were in Raleigh this last weekend with UM with Luke comes and there's not a part of my show UM where we yell you know but drig pretty. It's not part of our show. But during if it was Delanaga our standards way up in the nosebleeds, some cell phone lights came on and within about twenty five seconds, the whole arena had followed suit. And that is an amazing feeling, especially after you haven't had it, yeah for a long time, and especially that you can do that as not the main that the last act and by the way, God bless Luke Combs. For putting you on before him. There had no chance I'll put you on before me. You're gonna, I mean, I just put it. I recently talked about this as someone Um. I think it was yesterday. You know, Miranda is the same way. You know, we're all full band and when I'm at with Luke, it's Drew Parker or Fulter awful band and me and and Luke and that what that shows is someone that's so secure in their show and in their lane that they want us to succeed and be able to fully get our message across um. Miranda said, at one time when when Kaylee and I, it was right after we did the fool around and fell in love thing. So you know, Miranda and I were both using j Joyce It's Prett's at the time. So I listened to some tracks off of her record, she listened to some off of mine, and Kaylee asked, should I be here? Should I go? Like and Randasi, why would you leave? Should that? You know? I didn't know. I couldn't even know how to read the situation. And Randa said, anybody who's ever made you feel like that considered you a threat because they didn't know their lane and when they find their lane, they'll understand that you're not a threat. So I think it's awesome that Luke allows us to do that full band. Yeah, I would have you buy yourself without a microphone looking away from the crowd, you know what. On this three sixties stage that we're working with right now, I am not facing the crowd a lot of the time. Hardy, Arkansas is about the same size as where I grew up. Where did you grow up? What's called Mountain Pine And the literal population is two and there was a sawmill and there's not anymore. So the town struggles because what everybody used to do they aren't doing anymore. And so it's just the people that used to be there, Like, no one's moving in and so so there's one store. What is Hardy like right now? Um, it looks like the town time forgot. It used to be multiple antique stores, canoe outfitters, um, a place called Beach Club Barbecue that was always hopping and I don't remember. It had to have been soon after I went to college. Then all those shops kind of closed up. There was a guy that did magic tricks in the big antique small he wore a top hat, and he made Native American flutes out of out of pine and cedar, and he did slide of hand tricks, and he taught me a ton of slide of hand tricks when I was growing up. It's really sad to see all of that go away there. You know, there used to be a dinner theater there in Hardy, Arkansas. I guess it's between ash Flat and Hardy. It's all kind of it's three different towns, but it's all basically one town. Um. And I worked at that dinner theater back when it was hopping, And that breaks my heart too, that the Arkansas Traveler dinner theater went away at that dinner theater. Oh yes, so walk me through a night then at dinner theater because I waited tables, but I'd never saying okay. So it's an amphitheater um down outside, so there's gonna be like for me, it was music man. I was Amorialists music man. But during dinner I would go and serve and there was a different show up inside the restaurant that was called Dreams of Hank and Patsy. And so I wore like a turquoise pearl snap and had fringes all over it, which is not super healthy if you're a server, because you know, butter beans and fringe not not friends. Um, But then it would you know, no, no, no, and I'd have to hand you your your sweet tea and go sweet if you can go up here and sing Patsy Cline songs. I loved it, so help me out again. There there's an Amphitheater and there's a show that people can just watch by itself. Yeah, you can. You can select to go just to the Amphitheater show, or you can come for the just the Dinner show, or you can go to both shows. And you would do you'd have a role on both. Yeah, I liked. I liked to And then when we weren't doing music Man that we did the Arkansas Traveler story about the cartographer that finds you know, Mom and Paul and would your would you get bigger tips than other people? Because I don't remember getting tips. I did it from like fourth grade to tenth grade. I don't remember that really being a grade is you're nailing it the just I really just wanted to do it, and I loved the experience of learning to act, and I mean, you know what community theater. You know, it could be like um, but I don't know what it's like to be have the potential to be next level while doing community theater, which I wonder if that was the case with you, if you're you're doing your local stuff, if everybody else looks he was like, why is she here? Like you're so good? Like you did? They did? They kind of kick in the button, go you have got to do this as your thing. The lady that owned the Arkansas Traveler Dinner Theater also when we were in the cast, um, you could take her acting classes. I think it was like once a week or whatever. Um, And never did anyone say you're so good? Why are you here? But she did say I want you to know that you can do this. This is something you're going to be good at. Was it always what you were going to do as a seventh year old? Were you gonna move to nahvillvie a songwriter? In a thousand percent? That was it? And I went to school like you're supposed to, and I studied music because I did What else am I going to study? There's nothing else takes up my brain space? So here I go with my french horn off to Arkansas State and I want to learn about your french horn. French horn scholarship at Arkansas State. Yea of every instrument, I think that's last. I want to put the list of you playing. Yeah, it's also the hardest. Yeah, it's the hardest to walk down the hallway and not get your ass kicked to Wow, how do you start on french horn? Well, you start as a trumpet player, and then your school doesn't have enough french horn players and the band director asks you, can you figure out how to play a french horn? And you say yes, so but you got that good at french horn? Yeah, I got a scholarship full ride Arkansas State. What's that like? How do you get a scholarship playing an instrument? Do you have to go an audition in front of someone? Where do you go to the school? You do? And also so um, the guy who was the french horn instructor at Arkansas State, his name is Robin Dower, and he had come and watched, you know, like the marching portion of our stuff and our concerts and things, and then auditioned at Arkansas State. Did you feel good about your audition? I'm not a great French horn player, and I didn't love the instrument, not the way I love playing guitar. So it never it didn't really, it didn't ever find its voice. The notes were there, the dynamics were there, but it didn't ever find its heart. Really. I think if you put five horns in front of me, I don't know that I could identify a French horn. Yeah, it's it's so curvy it faces backwards. Yeah, and you put your hand and it's bell. That's wild. You look really stupid. You've done at all. Yeah, French you have to do your hand as you're playing it. Yeah. To me, it's that like a trombone when you're when you're putting the toilet plunger on the back. So it's it's not not to get too far into legs. Here's how French horner. I'm curious, but it has to do with tuning. Yeah, so the way the way you place your hand in the way you shape it on the inside of the notes. Out of tune, you can shape it that way, so your hand is Yeah, it's sitting like that over the whole it's inside. So like here's the bell and it just sits the way you move your hand shapes the sound you're hearing. Yeah, it can. You can use it to affect it. Wow, because back in the day, nerd time kids. Back in the day, French horns did not you know, they have like valves, call them buttons, but they have buttons. Now they have four buttons. You have three finger ones and up on one. But back in the day they were just this loopy, loopy, silly looking instrument with a bell and that's how they changed pitches. It's called hand horn, and it sounds ridiculous. If I were to bring in a french horn now, I'm terrible, But could you play something? Probably I've got a flugel horn at the house now because thanks to cm A Foundation, I got to be an ambassador for music education during what I'm calling the Great Separation. So I borrowed a french horn. I borrowed a mellophone, and A borrowed a flugel horn, and I picked up my french horn and was awful. You gotta think, probably to you, I'm thirty eight now, probably to the last time I played a french horn. You have already thought you were cool, but now you're so freaking cool. Like you you played a horning. That's the coolest thing ever. That you can play horns and guitar things like that is what that's that's like, that's what gets you. That's what gets you beat up in the lunch room is but what gets you beat up is also in later And I could just from experience, you're like, I beat up every day of school for being the nerdy kid that wanted to read and what encyclopedias and jokes and but that's what got me here. Yeah, that's awesome, it's it's I I loved learning about conducting. I learned all about musical theater just so, But when did that change to you? Because it seems like there's a style shift or a shift in your phote. You could you could have all the lot, you could like it, but a shift in your focus on what you wanted to do. When did it shift from you know, being in a band playing horn type music too, I'm gonna go play bars and like play soul. I was playing. I had formed kind of a Nickel Creek cover band with two guys and we were called Dry County, and um, I really loved doing that. And so I'm playing in like the coffee around or like in the basement of the Mexican restaurant, the real thing. It's called Julio's Um, and I knew I wanted to do that. Well then, since Jones Parol is not very far from Memphis, so I start going to Memphis and trying to play these coffee shops and open mic nights, and I start getting gigs in bars. So then I'm like nineteen or twenty when I first started playing in bars, and I get to do it for four hours and then you know, a friend whoever, I decide we get like half half off beer, and so I'm loving that. Will I start doing that like five nights a week. So I'm missing class, missing class, missing class, falling farther and farther behind, failing music history, failing piano. I got kicked out of piano class for not showing up. Yeah, well, and also I cussed the instructor out, but it was it was out a Christian love. And I've got this class called pedagogy, right, which just teaching me how to teach. And that's called pedagogy. Yeah, pedagogy. It's a pedagogical class. So it's just you and an instructor, just just like you and I are sitting here and you've got your notebook and I've got mine, and you're going to teach me to teach a child a concept. And I won't say his name because I don't want him to get in trouble. But he closed his notebook and he said, Um, you gotta get out of here. I think you should drop out. You are young, you're skinny, your hair is pretty, and things are gonna happen easy for you. Five years from now, you're going to be fat and nobody's gonna care. I think you should go. You don't love this music. You love that music. And what he said was kind of harsh, but you know, um, what he meant was go forth, my child, and create the music you believe in, even though he said it that way. So I got up right then out of my chair and I went and dropped out of school. Weird way to say it, but I think he said what I was looking for for someone to say to you at that musical dinner theater, like what are you doing? Like? What are you doing? Weird way to say it again, weird weird conversation there for But did you feel like that was support? Yes? And I needed that two. I needed that get the hell out of my nest, because I knew that's what I wanted to do. But I also knew I was supposed to be a good girl and finished my degree, and I'm you know, I need to have some type of backup plan before I get to Nashville. And then I went, no, I don't, so I dropped out of school and moved to Memphis. I continue playing in the bars there, cut my teeth. Find out that the reason I sound strange singing Lee and Wilmack style and Alison Krause style is because that's not what's in me. What's in me is this thing that lives in this city, this weird Mississippi River. Oh that's rock and roll great. And then that just kind of I was like, ding, ding ding. I gotta take this to Nashville. I have to to find out if I'm any good. So far, I've been a blue fish in a goldfish pond, and then I moved to a little bit bigger goldfish pond, and I want to be where all the other blue fish are. And how did you feel when you moved to Nashville, Land of the giants were scared? Yeah, I didn't know anybody. My friend Jenny worked at a storage place and she lived in the apartment that was on site on the storage place, so I lived there with her until I got a house with some friends. Um and I played at Dan McGinnis on like Tuesdays from six to eight on the patio and just anywhere anywhere I could. Did you feel like you could compete or when did you start to feel like you could compete? Here in town there was there was a Monday night writer's night called Guinness Girls, and it was run by Terry Joe Box and it was at the time the longest running writer's night apart from Bluebird Cafe. And I went there and I would watch Lisa Carver, Daniel Peck um people that I was like, Wow, I can't believe I'm just watching her play a guitar right here instead of you know, like in a big club or something. And I wanted to start so that those you can kind of at the end of the night, after the roster has played, you can play. And I started doing that. And then the woman that ran at Terry Joe Box, who's now we've been friends for a decade now, but um, she yelled I don't want to curse on your show. But I got through singing a song and from the back of the patio, I hear you singing bitch, and I thought that was a great thing. So I went and talked to her afterward and we set up a co write Bang Bang. Now now I'm getting somewhere. I'm still terrified because I'm, like you said, I'm in the land of giants. But for someone who has is booking people like Danielle Peck and Lisa Carver and Shelley Tackett to give me that um recognition, she was like, you should be playing here every Monday. You should be also doing this other writer's night that I do. So that was kind of the start of me going yep, this is it as an artist, because I think that's mostly how people know you now, you know, just generally people know you as the artist. When did it start to happen for you where you had people in management going, hey, I want to represent you because that means I mean, that's their time and money going into representing someone. So that's that's a sacrifice on their end. Yeah, it's a big gamble. Who When did that start happening for you? Let's see, I'm trying to figure out when when gelops and expensive guitars. The EP came out and I was trying to kick up as much dust as I could, and I kicked up a little bit but not enough. But I did get to um start being booked through w ME, which is nice, which is an agency. Yes. Um. Shortly after that people start doing the thing where they're like, I have a giant house and jet skis and a leprechn like all kinds of weird chick. I said to you, Um, but I played a show at It was third and Lensley, and into the room walks this Sky and his assistant and another one of his employees, and he says, Hi, my name is John Pete's. Um. I like what you do, and I think I know what to do with it. I look forward to talking to you. That's it. The rest is history. Because I went and had my meeting with him, and I was like, Yeah, where's this guy been for the last ten years that I've been here? Is it? Because John walks a bit of a different path too. He didn't throw me any fluff or try to sell me a car. He just walked in and said Hi, I like what you do, I'd love to help you do that, and then left, which leaves me with the follow that car feeling um and he just he's just no, he's just no bullshit, which was really refreshing. I have dear friends that also work with John, you know as as, and they were drawn to him because again he said, you know this is how I work, right, if you like to work this way, I think we'll work well together. And that was it. Yeah, I mean, same similar story. Well, in the night I meet him, I don't really understand. I just I really like that guy. And then I'd go home and google him. Just did big guys. Yeah, yeah, if you're following along at home, I realized who he is and you knew immediately you wanted to work with them? Absolutely? What did he do? Two and for you as in a form of having confidence? What did he do? Like, did he inspire you to chase a direction you wanted to chase? They just continue to push you with where you're already going. He literally gave me permission to go the direction I wanted to go because at the time I was still writing for a publishing house and I feel like we're always riding behind the curve and they're like, you know, this is who's cutting and you should write at that. I'm like, that's sort of like me just showing up to your house today with a flavor of ice cream, assuming that it's going to be your favorite. Um, And he said, you can stop writing that way. What if you only wrote songs you wanted to write and if we get them cut, they get caught, and if you cut them, then you cut them. So here's permission to just sorry, sorry, guys, to just do your thing because I think your thing is gonna work. And how much does that do for you psychologically? Oh? It made me walk pretty tall. It also scared me a little bit because now there's nothing holding me away from doing my thing, and if it falls, it's it's all on me. And there is a risk obviously to that. But the reward is so freaking great. The rewards awesome, And I never wanted to fail on somebody else's terms. It's so frustrating when somebody convinces you to go a direction and it doesn't work. Well, now you're a bona fide superstar. Is that weird to hear? Yes, that is weird to hear. My god children, over the because it was anywhere you When I went to see them and we went into a coffee shop, of course we're all masked and everything. And um, little Cohen, who's eight at the time, he said, they call me Smash because they couldn't say my name when they were younger. And he said, Smash, do you think people are gonna bother you in the coffee shop? I said, I don't think so. And he said, it's kind of assumed everybody knows you because you're super famous. I'm not super famous, buddy, It's okay. So um. I had a conversation early on with Miranda. There's a situation I wanted to run past her because she's such a wealth of knowledge, and I said, and these people think I'm famous. I end the story with that, I said, and they're just mistaken. She said, they think you're famous and you don't. Then who do you think is right? Mind blown? It's kind of cool. It's kind of crazy how you got to this point too, because you accepted and took the credibility what you earned, and then the commercial success came later and what they can never take from usual credibility. Right, it's a hard it's a hard thing to to navigate because a lot of people want to be famous or have money right now, and you give up some of your credibility in order to have the commercial success. But the commercial success never lasts forever. At best, it's cyclical. Has been, you know, a little bit behind on on just absolutely putting their arms round me. And that's okay because we were selling out everything we do. The merch numbers are are reflecting hugely um and it's just resonating with real fans in real time. So, like you said, the commercial success, we'll we'll catch up. But for us, it's it's been about connecting with folks and and just plant playing our asses off every night. I love doing that. Still exciting for you, absolutely more exciting back at it. Did you realize that you loved it? Well? What did that the you're away do for you? I didn't realize how much I had taken for granted. If you had asked me prior to the Great Separation, do you think you take any of this life for granted? It would be like no, I soak up every minute of it. And then during that I was like, oh man, I can name you two shows where I drank too much before a show where I had to think about what I was doing on stage instead of just going out there. And those people paid money to see me have a buzz, no, to see me perform, to have a moment together. How dare I big slap on the wrist for me myself? So don't do it again? No more, don't do it again? What an asshole move? My band deserves better than that. Some would say that it helps them perform better. Yeah, it helps me play pool better. Also, though I had that whole year to sit and listen to board tapes too and go oh oh you listen to board tapes? Oh no, go crazy? Yeah you tear yourself apart? Did you? Did you make yourself better doing that? Um? I just noticed some things where like I wish I didn't do that, or I wish I didn't say that. Um, and i'cess over part of a show. Yeah, I got it. Yeah. Would you ever hear yourself doing the same thing vocally that you didn't even know you did? And you're like, wow, I want to hear that back? Why do I keep doing that? Does that ever happen with you? Happens to me talking all the time? Yeah? And so if I see like a video clip and I'll be like, why did I leave my leg like that? I don't move like that. You're up for three? C m A S. Yes. When the list comes out and it's the one, then two, then three, I mean yeah. I mean that you're again, you're a superstar. When you see one, You're like, this is probably freaking cool. When you have three, what do you think? Or do they call you and tell you three without you before you see the list? It's like someone It's like me just climbing into a cage with a boxer and just before you can catch your breath because they're tweeting out the list. I'm seeing them tweet out the list live, and so that's why I ask if you actually saw it as it was coming down, or if they just said, hey, you're up for Female Vocalist of the Year, You're up for Single of the I mean these are big awards. Yeah. So I wake up, um and I've got like fourteen or fifteen text messages and I see that one is from Nicolett Hayford, who's one of my best friends and co writers. I've got one from my day to day manager, and I've got one from my publisher, and I'm like, something bad has happened. A member of the band is sick, someone has a broken bone, something bad has happened. And I opened it up and I chose Drew, my day to day manager, and I clicked on his little icon and there it was was the image with the three nominations, and I went, oh, God, what are you expecting? A couple? You hope, But again, we had a really weird time, so it's really kind of hard to especially you don't know all the criteria. Um, how like how does that get decided? And I'm just it doesn't get old, and I'm thankful for it, especially to see my little face up there next to Miranda's and Marin's and Carly's. And then we'll go full circle here and kind of and and on this a little bit. What does your mom think about that? She loves it. My mom will buy the merch. She doesn't ask for free merch, she buys it. She'll do that. And then iron I don't know how big this is, like maybe almost a foot tall letters mom on the back of the shirt. That's how into this she is. She loves it. She is tickled pink my Stepdad's the same way. When we played the Riemann he was just weepy eyed much of the time. Just they're so proud. That's really cool. I think to me like that in this whole story, and you know, when I get to sit for an hour and talk to somebody, and it's different than doing a timiute interview honestly, you know, because because we get to sit and just kind of sit back and talk and learn, Like through all the struggles and the trials and people figuring out who you were, you figuring out who you were, and it all comes back to this. Your mom we started with you going. She may call me during this she takes you as a kid to Nashville. She puts mom on it still now but still does it. I don't know if your mom will hear this or not, but she will hear it. But I'll tell you I love you too. That's it. That that's too, I mean, that is that that moves me a little bit. Yeah, it's it's pretty cool. That's that's really cool. And congratulations to you. That is just I mean, you are a estimate to being ahead because you have been ahead of it. You've been ahead of it for the last few years, you've been ahead of where traditional media they wouldn't quite go there here because for some reason they weren't comfortable. But you've been so far ahead of it at times, I bet it was just so frustrating because you're not just a little you were just a little ahead of it on it. Frankly, you're very in many ways stylistically as a songwriter. You're so far ahead of it. I know that I would have been questioning if I was behind it me personally, what is it? What am I doing wrong? Right? Like? How did I miss so bad? And is it ahead of me? But you were so and it's and it's now catching up to you. And now it's really neat to see like the fruits of that labor and the fruits of that tenacity and the fruits of that artistic liberty that you not only had, were given and now let others have. Like it's just cool to see it all start to you know, be a real tangible thing. Yeah, And I've had butterflies all week. I can't name of time when a single came out where I was like, God, butterflies. We're just happy the single is coming out and you hope it gets ads. But I've just keep telling people like I've got butterflies over. This is great. I'm in a fantastic mood. I'm gonna listen to my favorite Pam Tellis record. So it's not something to even drink about, which I'm a I'm a celebratory drinker and not a not a sad drink or anything. Um, but I'm so happy and tickled to see all of this happening right now that I can't even pop a bottle about it. You know, this this song with you and Carl, You're gonna play it on every Ward show. It's gonna be so cool, I hope. So. I mean, it's it's good, it's powerful, it's vulnerable, like it is what everyone's gonna beg you to do in in the end, that's kind of what the goal is. Yeah, like you're good at it and people are begging you to do it, not as you go pick the spot you want to do it. That's right, that's really cool. I'm so happy you came over. I am too. This is you know, it's really cool for me and I just you know, and I think it's so weird that to our Kansans we've been so disconnected. We haven't ever gotten to sit down. I think we've seen each other maybe twice. I don't a word show and it's always hi. You know. One time I ran into at a restaurant in Las Vegas and it was like there was It was the night that Carly and I actually met. You were in the same little like quarantined off little area, maybe just a lonely and she was talking and she handed me her wine glass and and and like the jackass I am, I asked her, because Hi, the wine was the single, and so I said, did you want me to hide this? And she just kind of flipped at me blankly, and I was like, Okay, cool, we're not gonna work that way. That's not how Carley and I are gonna be friends. Or congratulations on the song, thank you, congratulations on the c m as, just congratulations on on everything. I hope that you're starting to feel fulfilled. If that's what this feeling is, then yeah, thousand per cent, that's awesome. You guys follow Ashley. She's got her own name, which sometimes it's weird. People like, Hi, it's me, I'm Clint Black, but only Clint Black. One on Twitter, and I'm like, well, you couldn't get a tick get that black, Not that that's the exact case, but at Ashley McBride, you guys, go follow her, um, you know, go check out never will maybe if for some reason you've been in a cave and you don't know who she is and you're like, Okay, this is interesting, go go go listen to the music. I think you're one of and I mean this is in a complimentary way. You're one of the few album artists that that I will invest I'm so I need a couple of songs. I'm done, but there were there were a few you Casey Old Dominion, Brandy's that way. And you know, it's all songwriting. Now that I start to say this out loud, it's all it's songwriting more than it is anything else. But you're definitely an album artist. And I don't know if that means anything that's comment, but but thank you for coming. And I think we'll wrap it up there, all right, There she is