Dear Horse World, It's Nick Dowers: Reined Cow Horse Training Methods That Work for Any Discipline (Sponsored by YETI)

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A horse that is really in tune to what the
task is, and they're giving it their all.

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They just look different
than a horse that's forced.

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What if the calmest person in the
arena was also the most powerful?

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Today we're sitting down with
someone who's redefining what real

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horsemanship looks like, quiet,
consistent, and incredibly effective.

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Nick Doers is a professional
trainer clinician in 2016.

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Rode to the horse cold starting Champion,
a top reined cow horse competitor.

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He blends cowboy grit with a
deep respect for the horse's.

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Mind his method.

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Find the try, direct the effort
and reward, and let it soak

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simple and quietly revolutionary.

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In this episode, we're diving
into why feel and timing

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matter more than technique.

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What Real World Ranch work can teach
us about communication and clarity.

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How to apply Nick's quiet horse.

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First philosophy in any discipline,
whether you're a seasoned competitor or

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a curious beginner, this conversation
is packed with grounded wisdom that

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will shift how you think about training
and how you show up for your horse.

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Dear horse world, it's Nick Dowers.

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Nick, welcome to the
Dear Horse World Podcast.

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Thanks for having me.

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So you have been requested by a couple
people for, to come on the podcast.

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You have many fans, Robert
Schultz being one of them.

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Yeah.

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I would love for you to take us,
so if your book, if you were to

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write your biography, which I have
a feeling you might at some point,

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uh, uh, probably just get somebody
else to help remember that.

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But yeah,

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what would the first page read?

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Oh

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man, we're getting deep right off the bat.

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Um, I don't know.

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Um,

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like I'm really big on just like, I
try, I'm not saying I'm there, but

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I try really hard to just be a good
person and a good role model first.

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Like that's very, very important to me.

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Um, so it would probably
be something like that.

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Like I'm not saying I'm there
'cause I'm human and I struggle

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and I'm trying to grow, but,
uh, that's very important to me.

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That's primary.

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What do you think makes a good
role model in the horse world?

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Hmm.

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Truth, honesty,

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authenticity, being real, not
trying to be somebody else.

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Being confident in what you are and
who you are and what got you there.

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Like that's,

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that's, that's my checklist.

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Yeah.

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Are there particular people in the horse
world that have emulated that to you

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In various degrees?

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For sure.

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Yeah, for sure.

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Like, I, I definitely, uh, been
blessed to be around some really

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good role models in the horse world.

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Um, like brand Neubert, Joe Walter,
um, gene Armstrong, Russell Reed,

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like there, there's been a lot of 'em.

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Yeah.

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Bill Van Norman.

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Um, yeah, I probably the most on this
regard would be like Bill Van Norman.

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He had a incredible way of
making everybody feel very

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welcome and important from.

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I mean, I was just a cowboy on his crew.

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And when Jackie would come to visit,
I mean Jackie felt leave, left

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there feeling like she was just
as important as me working there.

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And it's, it, it was so simple.

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Like it wasn't like he went out of
his way, but he just genuinely cared.

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And I, I try to do the same 'cause
it's, you know, means a lot.

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Do you think that makes an impact when
you like, 'cause the horse world can be

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very inclusive and very exclusive mm-hmm.

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All at the same time.

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Yep.

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And what you're talking about is an
environment that feels very inclusive.

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Mm-hmm.

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Do you think that transmutes
down to the horses?

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Do you think?

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For sure.

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For sure.

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Yeah.

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Like if I walk in, like we're at Road
to the Horse, if we walk into that round

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pin right there and we don't let that
horse feel like he can be a part of what

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we're doing and he needs to, you know,
do all these things for me, not with me.

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They know that, like, that, like we.

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Um, and it's the same
way with people, right?

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I feel like, and so yeah.

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The horses, they know that.

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And I think, I think that's what you're
seeing with, with some of the, some of

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the competitors is some of 'em are very
welcoming and doesn't mean life's roses

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and you don't have to work through issues.

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But there's a different, there's
a different vibe there for sure.

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And that's, that's what I
try to have with my horses.

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Okay.

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Let's dive into that because you are
so, for everyone who's listening and

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watching this episode, you are 2016
and 2019 Road to the Horse Champion.

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I think you're wearing
even your buckle mm-hmm.

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From one of them today.

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Yep.

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Talk me through when you decided you
wanted to compete at Rode with a Horse,

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and what kind of goes through your
mind when you wanna make that step?

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'cause it's a big stage and it's
quite, from what I've read, being

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here, it's, it's an intimidating.

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It's an intimidating environment.

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But you don't, I I get the
sense that that's not something

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that goes through your mind or
something that you experience.

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Um, I, I mean, to some degree, yeah.

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The first, the first session of
the first time I was here for sure.

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Like, there's some nerves, there's
some, but, um, if we go back to the,

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the why, um, I like to put myself
in places that force me to grow.

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And that's why I wanna do this.

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That's why I compete with horses.

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Um, uh, I, I like the feeling of the
unknown and I like to be pushed to

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have to, uh, maybe find a little,
little nuance of something that I've

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done to take me to the next level.

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And without competition, I feel
like it's so easy to get stagnant

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and doesn't force you to grow.

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Um, yeah, it's just, I, I
just love that feeling of.

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Uh, the unknown because it, it
pushes me to play, pushes me to

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places I didn't know I could go.

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And then once you, you get there, then
you know, then there's, there's, there's

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bridges and there's more places to go.

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So that's why I compete.

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So that's why you're not a cowboy in the
mountains and we don't know who you are.

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Right.

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Because if, if you know me, uh,
that would be easy for me to be.

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'cause I love it.

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I love to just be out by myself with
my kids, my crew doing my thing.

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But I, I like, I like the
competitive atmosphere.

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I like the growth that the
com competition gives me.

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Mm-hmm.

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Because if I, whether I go and
I fail at a show or fail or

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succeed, it's all material things.

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But like, whether I go and do
good or I go and do bad, um, I

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gotta go home and revamp it and.

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The awesome part about where I live.

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There's, there's not a, I mean,
my nearest, I'm trying to think of

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where the nearest competitor to me,
or like, uh, in that does what I do.

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I mean, it's five, six hours
away, so it's not like I can

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go get help, I gotta go home.

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I gotta, I gotta figure it out for
me and be better at the next one.

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And I love that.

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So,

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so you live in Nevada, dire Nevada.

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Yep.

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Can you, like, paint a picture for all
of us what your day-to-day life is like?

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Whew.

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It's busy.

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Um, a lot of times, most days,
um, depending on the season.

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We'll start out in the arena, um,
except for when it's hot in the summer.

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Um, well, it just depends on what's going
on, but like a lot of days I'll be in

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the arena, uh, we'll start early there.

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Hopefully I'll get through with my horses
by one two o'clock and then I can go

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finish up, do some things on the ranch, go
work on a spring, uh, drive around, check

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waters, check cattle, do things like that.

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If we're, um, actually riding
and moving things on the ranch,

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then it might be reversed.

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We might start out at the ranch if it's
hot, get the cows moved, do what we need

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to do, come back, finish up in the arena.

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Um, yeah, I do a lot of that.

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And then you mix in the clinics and
the horse shows and stuff like that.

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Like we, we, I got a great crew
at home and we keep pretty busy.

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But you, it would needless
to say you live a life.

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That is true.

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It seems like it's very true and
authentic to the cowboy way of life.

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Like your, your online
platform is called Cowboy Week.

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Yeah, yeah, for sure.

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For sure it is.

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Yeah.

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Like we, um, we are very much, very
much a ranch and a crew, and, and we

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do, we got a lot of things that we do.

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Yeah.

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Like, we cover a lot of ground
and do a lot of things For sure.

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So for people who have maybe
like watched Yellowstone mm-hmm.

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And they, they, it's a, that's a one would
say it's hollywoodized maybe slightly

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version, or you tell me maybe is if
you watch that, whether it's authentic.

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What's something that if people have
watched Yellowstone and they, they,

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they're really drawn to that way
of life, what are some things about

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that way of life that they might not
realize or that you could then maybe

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open their eyes to a little bit?

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Well, I think it's, it, it just takes
so many, it takes so many people

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to, to make that work, you know?

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And it, it's, uh, like an ordeal at home.

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Hmm.

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You know, my dad and my mom, you know,
from my mom taking care of the books to

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my dad, taking care of all of us, right?

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Like he's, he's got his,
his hand in everything.

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Hmm.

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Um, as far as just from a man manager
standpoint or like a operator.

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And it's really good because
he kinda oversees it all.

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And then, like, especially on the cow
side of things, I, um, I do the day to

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day, but it, uh, it really takes a good
core group of people, um, all working for

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the common goal to, to make it all work
from the, you know, from the top down.

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Um, so that part about it is really cool.

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Like, uh, I get the comment a lot,
like, what a, they'll see me with

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my family interacting or something.

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They're like, oh, what a great family.

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And it's like, well, we have to
be like, it's, we need each other.

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Right.

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So it's, it's super pure
and it's super honest.

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The way that we rely on each other.

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I think that part's really cool.

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Mm, that's beautiful.

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I never thought about that.

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Yeah.

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Because in this road trip that we're
on, you know, doing this podcast and

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learning and experiencing different ways
of, of living and ways of being with

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horses in the horse world, one thing
that really stands out is ranch kids.

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Mm-hmm.

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And ranch families have been some of
the most welcoming and some of the

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most remarkable experiences for us.

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Yeah, yeah, for sure.

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Yeah.

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And I think that comes just because
there's a level of responsibility there,

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um, that you just, you just can't get.

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Like, we rely on 'em, you know?

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For sure.

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Like, like my, my oldest daughter
for the last I bet, I don't know,

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one or two years, she feeds four
or five, 600 cows a day every day.

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Like that's just what she does.

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Sunday, every day Sunday she'll
meet cows and go have dinner

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with her or breakfast with.

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It's grandma.

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Mm-hmm.

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Grandpa every day.

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So how

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old is she?

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She's

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17.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, she's 17.

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So, and she's

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responsible for five or 600 cows,

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uh, depending on how
many is in the feedlot.

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Yeah.

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But yeah.

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Yeah, there might be, I don't know.

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I think right now there's probably, huh.

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00:11:50,625 --> 00:11:52,334
400 head in there that
she feeds every day.

237
00:11:53,084 --> 00:11:53,385
Yeah.

238
00:11:53,714 --> 00:11:54,795
So it just, things like that.

239
00:11:54,795 --> 00:11:59,865
And, you know, my, my other kids, like
my son is very valuable to me when

240
00:11:59,865 --> 00:12:02,145
we're cowboying and my daughter as well.

241
00:12:02,145 --> 00:12:03,464
So it's, yeah.

242
00:12:03,855 --> 00:12:04,605
It's, it's good.

243
00:12:05,895 --> 00:12:11,324
So Nick, you are the N-R-C-H-A
snaffle bit Futurity champion.

244
00:12:12,165 --> 00:12:15,720
So when you make that transition
from the ranch mm-hmm.

245
00:12:16,995 --> 00:12:18,015
To competition.

246
00:12:18,660 --> 00:12:18,900
Yeah.

247
00:12:19,500 --> 00:12:23,340
What's that like when, what, what, what
inspires you to make that decision?

248
00:12:23,699 --> 00:12:29,010
For me, it was, it was just kind of
what we spoke or I spoke on earlier, is,

249
00:12:29,520 --> 00:12:31,740
is I like to, I like to be challenged.

250
00:12:31,740 --> 00:12:36,090
I like to meet a goal and, and move
it off, move on to the next one.

251
00:12:36,090 --> 00:12:39,840
So for me, it was at, at the beginning
of this horsemanship deal, it's like,

252
00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:43,199
man, it'd be cool if I could get
a horse to turn around, like spin.

253
00:12:43,199 --> 00:12:45,329
If I get a horse to slide a
little bit, that would be cool.

254
00:12:45,329 --> 00:12:48,840
And then, you know, once I reach
that, then it's like, well, what

255
00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:51,569
if I can go here and, and show?

256
00:12:51,569 --> 00:12:56,281
And the awesome thing about Rain
Cow Horse is it's, it's just a.

257
00:12:57,525 --> 00:13:01,275
Performance extension of what we do
on the ranch anyway, to some degree.

258
00:13:01,335 --> 00:13:01,425
Mm-hmm.

259
00:13:01,755 --> 00:13:02,835
So it was a natural fit.

260
00:13:02,835 --> 00:13:05,865
It's not like I'm doing things with
horses that don't fit on the ranch.

261
00:13:06,255 --> 00:13:08,445
Like, uh, it's just, it's just what we do.

262
00:13:08,775 --> 00:13:09,435
Um, yeah.

263
00:13:09,435 --> 00:13:14,295
It's not as polished and it's not as, uh,
precise, but it's essentially, it's, it's

264
00:13:14,295 --> 00:13:15,765
things I'll use my horses for anyway.

265
00:13:15,975 --> 00:13:20,835
So that was kind of a natural, uh,
progression and, um, yeah, just putting

266
00:13:20,835 --> 00:13:25,665
myself in positions to be challenged and
that's, that's why I started showing.

267
00:13:26,265 --> 00:13:26,565
Yeah.

268
00:13:27,195 --> 00:13:29,835
So for everyone who's listening,
who's maybe from the English world

269
00:13:29,835 --> 00:13:34,665
or from who are, who are just
dipping their toe in rodeo mm-hmm.

270
00:13:34,830 --> 00:13:37,455
Or, and what is Rained Cow?

271
00:13:37,455 --> 00:13:37,965
Horse

272
00:13:38,805 --> 00:13:39,255
Rained Cow.

273
00:13:39,255 --> 00:13:43,185
Horse essentially, in a nutshell
is if you've seen raining.

274
00:13:44,340 --> 00:13:46,830
Where they run and they slide a
long ways and they spin, really

275
00:13:46,830 --> 00:13:47,820
spin the horse really fast.

276
00:13:47,820 --> 00:13:48,420
We do that.

277
00:13:48,425 --> 00:13:48,665
Mm-hmm.

278
00:13:48,780 --> 00:13:50,580
That's one that, uh, aspect of it.

279
00:13:50,910 --> 00:13:52,260
And then the other one is cutting.

280
00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:58,050
Um, it's pretty simple, uh, or similar to
what you would think of a cutting horse.

281
00:13:58,050 --> 00:13:59,970
Just hold it out a cow and
you work it back and forth.

282
00:13:59,970 --> 00:14:01,755
So we do that, that's another part.

283
00:14:01,755 --> 00:14:05,460
And then we call it, uh, fence work
down the fence where they let one

284
00:14:05,460 --> 00:14:09,510
out and you hold it on one end of the
arena, take it down to those big long

285
00:14:09,510 --> 00:14:11,460
turns and then you circle your cow.

286
00:14:11,460 --> 00:14:13,770
That's, that's what I did
yesterday was the fence work.

287
00:14:13,770 --> 00:14:14,970
And it's super exciting.

288
00:14:14,970 --> 00:14:16,440
Like crowds go nuts.

289
00:14:16,560 --> 00:14:18,150
It's very impressive to watch.

290
00:14:18,150 --> 00:14:19,140
Yeah, it's super fun.

291
00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:23,550
So these are all skills that you require
on the ranch when you work in cattle

292
00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:24,360
in some degree.

293
00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:28,320
Like probably the, the least amount
I would say would be like, uh.

294
00:14:28,890 --> 00:14:30,570
Maybe a sliding stop or a spin.

295
00:14:30,570 --> 00:14:35,040
You don't really use those, but the,
the soft skills it takes to get those,

296
00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:39,180
you use those like just willingly
guided and stops when you pull, like

297
00:14:39,180 --> 00:14:40,860
all those, we use cutting a cow.

298
00:14:41,340 --> 00:14:42,090
It's similar.

299
00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:47,580
Um, the, the way you do it is a little
different, um, just technique wise as

300
00:14:47,580 --> 00:14:52,500
far as, uh, football and things like
that are a little different, but the

301
00:14:52,650 --> 00:14:53,970
soft skills are the same for sure.

302
00:14:54,689 --> 00:14:57,449
It's, it's really interesting
that there's a three phase.

303
00:14:57,449 --> 00:14:57,540
Mm-hmm.

304
00:14:57,780 --> 00:15:00,180
Because we have something somewhat,
we have three day eventing.

305
00:15:00,270 --> 00:15:00,420
Yeah.

306
00:15:00,425 --> 00:15:05,189
In the Olympic side, which is
three in very important stages.

307
00:15:05,850 --> 00:15:05,910
Yeah.

308
00:15:05,910 --> 00:15:08,970
And in in rain, cow horse, is it measured?

309
00:15:08,970 --> 00:15:10,319
All three are measured the same?

310
00:15:10,350 --> 00:15:10,500
Yes.

311
00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:14,400
But they inform one another and
they're done in a specific sequence.

312
00:15:14,490 --> 00:15:14,939
Is that correct?

313
00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:17,130
Yeah, for the most part
they're done in a sequence.

314
00:15:17,160 --> 00:15:22,110
Um, like some shows, depending, you
might flip flop the reigning and

315
00:15:22,110 --> 00:15:25,140
the herd work, depending on cattle
supplies and things like that.

316
00:15:25,140 --> 00:15:26,010
Those might be flip flop.

317
00:15:26,010 --> 00:15:29,730
But at the end of the day, the fence
work's gonna be the last event and

318
00:15:29,880 --> 00:15:31,980
all three scores hold equal weight.

319
00:15:32,100 --> 00:15:33,750
So it's basically a
third, a third, a third.

320
00:15:34,470 --> 00:15:34,680
Um,

321
00:15:35,100 --> 00:15:36,180
which one do you have a favorite?

322
00:15:37,140 --> 00:15:38,069
Uh,

323
00:15:40,110 --> 00:15:45,930
I think what's funny about that is it's
kind of, that's changed over the years.

324
00:15:46,020 --> 00:15:49,949
So like when I was in my twenties
for sure, it was the fence work.

325
00:15:49,980 --> 00:15:51,089
'cause it's the most exhilarating.

326
00:15:51,209 --> 00:15:51,480
Right.

327
00:15:51,689 --> 00:15:52,290
Um.

328
00:15:52,740 --> 00:15:58,260
And then it probably went from, there was
the time when I started where fence work

329
00:15:58,260 --> 00:16:00,210
was probably my favorite to train it.

330
00:16:00,210 --> 00:16:01,890
I'm just talking train at home and things.

331
00:16:02,250 --> 00:16:03,750
And then it went to raining.

332
00:16:03,810 --> 00:16:09,060
Um, I really enjoy just getting a horse
on the team and just willingly guided.

333
00:16:09,060 --> 00:16:10,560
Like, I really like that.

334
00:16:11,100 --> 00:16:18,090
Um, and then, uh, now lately, uh, the last
few years it's been the, the cutting part.

335
00:16:18,450 --> 00:16:24,390
Like just getting that horse to be
able to, um, know what that cow's

336
00:16:24,390 --> 00:16:26,010
gonna do before that cow does it.

337
00:16:26,010 --> 00:16:29,640
And just the technique and the,
the football and the positions.

338
00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:34,800
Like, that's super intriguing to
me 'cause it's, it's like, uh, it's

339
00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:36,600
almost a step up like reigning.

340
00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:40,380
It's just you and the horse where herd
work, it's you, the horse, the cow.

341
00:16:40,500 --> 00:16:40,590
Mm-hmm.

342
00:16:40,830 --> 00:16:43,410
So there's, there's three,
three minds right there.

343
00:16:43,410 --> 00:16:48,480
And getting my horse and myself on
the same mind, uh, is, is really fun.

344
00:16:48,545 --> 00:16:49,860
I, I really enjoy that right now.

345
00:16:50,355 --> 00:16:51,824
Okay, I wanna dive into that.

346
00:16:51,824 --> 00:16:52,095
Mm-hmm.

347
00:16:52,110 --> 00:16:58,425
Because, um, you have said some
really interesting things about

348
00:16:58,425 --> 00:17:01,574
your training and that, and the
approach that you take with horses.

349
00:17:01,875 --> 00:17:08,895
But before I ask, before I dive into, or
before I quote you to, to you, I'd love to

350
00:17:09,885 --> 00:17:17,085
ask you what you look for when you want,
when you look for your future cow reigning

351
00:17:17,085 --> 00:17:19,365
champion horse, what are you looking for?

352
00:17:20,625 --> 00:17:25,065
So, I, I buy a lot of
prospects for clients now.

353
00:17:25,125 --> 00:17:31,215
Uh, very blessed in a good, uh, situation
where I've built a great group of

354
00:17:31,215 --> 00:17:34,545
owners that trust me, uh, believe in me.

355
00:17:34,785 --> 00:17:41,175
And so that's not uncommon for me to
go to a sale and they, you know, they.

356
00:17:41,729 --> 00:17:43,830
Buy me a horse, buy me
something I can win on.

357
00:17:43,830 --> 00:17:46,889
So, um, very blessed
to be in that position.

358
00:17:47,070 --> 00:17:50,399
Um, seems like trainers work their whole
life to have that kind of a customer

359
00:17:50,399 --> 00:17:51,750
base that believes in them that much.

360
00:17:51,810 --> 00:17:51,899
Mm-hmm.

361
00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:56,100
And I don't take that lightly, but,
um, to answer your point, the first

362
00:17:56,100 --> 00:18:03,360
thing for me is, uh, when I walk in
there, um, like I, and I'm looking at

363
00:18:03,899 --> 00:18:08,969
going through a hundred yearlings, I
want to see those are as I walk by.

364
00:18:09,030 --> 00:18:11,340
They gotta, there's gotta be
something that catches my eye.

365
00:18:12,030 --> 00:18:16,560
Like, I don't know what it is, but there's
something needs to draw me to that horse.

366
00:18:17,219 --> 00:18:19,679
Or I probably won't even go look at it.

367
00:18:19,830 --> 00:18:22,679
Like, there's gotta be an
intangible there that you can't

368
00:18:22,679 --> 00:18:25,260
really say, this is what it is.

369
00:18:25,709 --> 00:18:26,909
That's number one.

370
00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:30,929
Uh, then pedigree behind that
and what the pedigree says,

371
00:18:31,649 --> 00:18:34,409
and, you know, confirmation, you
just kind of go down the list.

372
00:18:34,409 --> 00:18:37,649
But I would say first and
foremost, like that horse has to,

373
00:18:37,709 --> 00:18:39,389
has to catch my eye in some way.

374
00:18:39,449 --> 00:18:41,550
Like there's gotta be something
special about him to me.

375
00:18:42,120 --> 00:18:42,780
Interesting.

376
00:18:42,780 --> 00:18:43,050
Yeah.

377
00:18:43,139 --> 00:18:47,520
So you believe that there is, and you
look at a hundred horses, do you believe

378
00:18:47,520 --> 00:18:52,110
that there's one in there or two in there
that have, there's something inside them

379
00:18:52,110 --> 00:18:55,800
that is drawing you to them, that there's
an intangible that you cannot measure?

380
00:18:56,760 --> 00:18:57,030
Yeah.

381
00:18:57,030 --> 00:19:00,209
Well there's, there's
definitely something there.

382
00:19:01,530 --> 00:19:05,100
Yeah, there's, there's, I, I just
need to see, and I don't know if

383
00:19:05,100 --> 00:19:08,399
it's something, I just need to see
something special in that horse.

384
00:19:08,730 --> 00:19:13,110
Like if I see something that I've,
for me would be special, I, I've

385
00:19:13,110 --> 00:19:14,250
gotta be drawn to that horse.

386
00:19:14,280 --> 00:19:17,850
Like I, I need to see the diamond
in the rough or whatever it

387
00:19:17,850 --> 00:19:19,800
is before I pull the trigger.

388
00:19:20,459 --> 00:19:21,030
Like for.

389
00:19:21,840 --> 00:19:22,080
Yeah.

390
00:19:22,139 --> 00:19:24,750
And then you go through
pedigree, confirmation movement.

391
00:19:24,780 --> 00:19:25,110
Yeah.

392
00:19:25,305 --> 00:19:27,570
Then, then after that, the
next thing would be pedigree.

393
00:19:27,570 --> 00:19:33,000
And if the pedigree is something that's
a complete outlier or just doesn't match

394
00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:36,990
what I see, like I might not even go
look at his legs because I'm like, wow.

395
00:19:37,230 --> 00:19:41,310
Oh man, that's just, that's
just not, maybe not it.

396
00:19:41,490 --> 00:19:43,139
Or if it's like, well, that could work.

397
00:19:43,139 --> 00:19:45,420
And then, then I go look and demo it.

398
00:19:45,810 --> 00:19:46,050
Yeah.

399
00:19:46,980 --> 00:19:49,440
So this is an important part of
the process because you're someone

400
00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:54,690
who has taken horses from their
first ride to championship level.

401
00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:55,320
Yes.

402
00:19:55,379 --> 00:19:57,389
And that's a very specific skill.

403
00:19:57,450 --> 00:19:57,810
Yeah.

404
00:19:58,050 --> 00:19:58,530
Yeah.

405
00:19:58,740 --> 00:20:00,210
Like, um, yeah.

406
00:20:00,210 --> 00:20:03,930
And for sure that's, that's kind of been
my business for the last little bit.

407
00:20:03,990 --> 00:20:06,240
And, um, and it's been good.

408
00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:12,420
Like, uh, yeah, I've got, I've been
able to do that and duplicate it quite

409
00:20:12,420 --> 00:20:14,310
a few times now, so it's, it's cool.

410
00:20:15,195 --> 00:20:18,465
So something that your
training philosophy emphasizes.

411
00:20:18,615 --> 00:20:24,105
Find the, try direct the effort
and reward and let it soak.

412
00:20:25,515 --> 00:20:29,895
Could you elaborate on what all
of those four elements mean?

413
00:20:29,950 --> 00:20:30,240
Yeah.

414
00:20:30,620 --> 00:20:30,840
Um,

415
00:20:33,195 --> 00:20:41,985
I, I try to look at things through the,
like, I wanna really wanna pay attention

416
00:20:41,985 --> 00:20:46,455
to where their mind is and what their
mind is telling me that they need.

417
00:20:46,455 --> 00:20:51,585
Like, whether their mind's telling me that
they're scared, they're, uh, they're not

418
00:20:51,585 --> 00:20:53,985
focused, they're focused the wrong place.

419
00:20:54,045 --> 00:20:59,415
I like, I, I'm very big on,
uh, getting, getting them to

420
00:21:00,015 --> 00:21:02,955
mentally be where they need to be.

421
00:21:03,375 --> 00:21:04,965
To get what we need to get done.

422
00:21:05,025 --> 00:21:09,885
Like, that's huge for me because
I feel like, um, I kind of talked

423
00:21:09,885 --> 00:21:11,655
about it in the clinic the other day.

424
00:21:12,075 --> 00:21:17,955
If, if I'm working a cow and the
horses let, let's just say he's 50%

425
00:21:17,955 --> 00:21:19,965
present, 50% looking at the crowd.

426
00:21:19,995 --> 00:21:20,085
Mm-hmm.

427
00:21:20,685 --> 00:21:24,705
Like, it's only gonna be so good
because yeah, he could reign over there

428
00:21:24,705 --> 00:21:28,635
and I could pull him and, and I could
physically move him to these places.

429
00:21:29,085 --> 00:21:33,765
But if he's only 50% engaged mentally,
he's not gonna be able to use himself

430
00:21:33,795 --> 00:21:36,615
to his full ability to be great.

431
00:21:36,975 --> 00:21:37,335
Right.

432
00:21:37,335 --> 00:21:40,545
He's just not, because he's
only 50% there mentally.

433
00:21:40,545 --> 00:21:45,195
But if I can take technique and feel
and all the things, but get him a

434
00:21:45,195 --> 00:21:49,905
hundred percent mentally connected to
what we're doing, then he's gonna use

435
00:21:49,905 --> 00:21:52,395
the gifts God give him to the fullest.

436
00:21:52,965 --> 00:21:53,775
And that's.

437
00:21:54,209 --> 00:21:58,679
If I can do that, um, we got a, we
got a good chance of being successful.

438
00:21:58,919 --> 00:22:03,000
If, if they're 50%, you know,
it's how good can I ride today to

439
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:04,620
help you be where you need to be?

440
00:22:04,649 --> 00:22:06,419
And I don't wanna, I don't
wanna have to ride that good.

441
00:22:06,419 --> 00:22:07,530
I don't want that responsibility.

442
00:22:07,530 --> 00:22:11,070
Like, I, I wanna help you, you, the horse.

443
00:22:11,070 --> 00:22:13,590
Like, I wanna help you get this done.

444
00:22:13,709 --> 00:22:15,990
Like, I don't want to drag
you to where I want to be.

445
00:22:16,469 --> 00:22:19,080
Um, so that's, that's huge for me.

446
00:22:19,620 --> 00:22:20,639
And that's where.

447
00:22:22,140 --> 00:22:26,730
Uh, I'll get the comment like, your
horses, they last and they just

448
00:22:26,730 --> 00:22:28,740
look different and things like that.

449
00:22:28,740 --> 00:22:34,500
And, and that's kind of my goal because
a horse that is really in tune to

450
00:22:34,500 --> 00:22:38,490
what the task is and they're giving
it their all, they just look different

451
00:22:38,490 --> 00:22:40,050
than a horse that's forced a hundred

452
00:22:40,050 --> 00:22:40,350
percent.

453
00:22:40,410 --> 00:22:41,460
They just look different.

454
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:42,750
And that is my goal.

455
00:22:42,750 --> 00:22:43,530
I'm not there.

456
00:22:43,830 --> 00:22:46,530
Um, I feel like I'm inching closer
to that all the time, but that's

457
00:22:46,530 --> 00:22:47,340
the cool thing about horses.

458
00:22:47,340 --> 00:22:48,090
I'll never get there,

459
00:22:48,390 --> 00:22:48,870
but

460
00:22:48,930 --> 00:22:49,470
I'm trying.

461
00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:49,980
Right.

462
00:22:49,980 --> 00:22:51,330
And that's, that's the goal.

463
00:22:51,330 --> 00:22:55,200
And I think if somebody says, your
horses look different, it's just the

464
00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:57,600
fact that they know what they're doing.

465
00:22:57,660 --> 00:23:03,720
Hopefully, um, not always, but they know
what they're doing and they're able to use

466
00:23:03,750 --> 00:23:06,360
their gifts accordingly to get it done.

467
00:23:06,420 --> 00:23:10,200
Some, some are gonna have, you
know, some are gonna be Michael

468
00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:11,820
Jordan athletically and some aren't.

469
00:23:12,180 --> 00:23:12,480
Hmm.

470
00:23:12,630 --> 00:23:15,660
And that's, but if they're on
the team and they're trying,

471
00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:16,710
that's all you can ask for.

472
00:23:17,430 --> 00:23:17,760
Right.

473
00:23:17,865 --> 00:23:20,580
And, and you can get a lot
done with the horses trying.

474
00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:20,700
Yeah.

475
00:23:21,270 --> 00:23:28,590
Can you draw on a story, a
horse that, that epitomizes

476
00:23:28,590 --> 00:23:30,120
this, that helped you find for

477
00:23:30,120 --> 00:23:30,390
sure?

478
00:23:30,510 --> 00:23:30,750
Yes.

479
00:23:30,780 --> 00:23:30,960
Yeah.

480
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:33,330
Didn't, yeah, that's, that was easy.

481
00:23:33,330 --> 00:23:37,950
So, uh, 2013 snuffle bit 30,
uh, time for the Diamond.

482
00:23:38,250 --> 00:23:43,050
Um, that horse, he, he was
incredible in that sense.

483
00:23:43,230 --> 00:23:45,330
And it wasn't anything
I did like that was him.

484
00:23:45,390 --> 00:23:53,220
Like he was the most selfless horse
to, uh, take the smallest little

485
00:23:53,220 --> 00:23:57,510
inclination of what he thought I wanted
and run with it in a positive way.

486
00:23:57,960 --> 00:23:59,250
Like, he was incredible that way.

487
00:23:59,370 --> 00:24:06,030
And so, like with him, it was, it,
it, it, yeah, he, he's just selfless.

488
00:24:06,030 --> 00:24:08,940
He was so selfless in the
things that he thought I wanted.

489
00:24:08,940 --> 00:24:09,870
He would just give it all.

490
00:24:10,500 --> 00:24:13,410
And I've been, I've been trying
to recreate that ever since,

491
00:24:13,410 --> 00:24:15,180
and I have to various degrees.

492
00:24:15,570 --> 00:24:19,020
Um, but I haven't ridden
a horse that is that.

493
00:24:19,665 --> 00:24:24,645
On the team and that like, just
down to help you like that horse.

494
00:24:24,825 --> 00:24:25,635
So that was fun.

495
00:24:25,935 --> 00:24:29,085
And that was, that was very
early in my career, very early.

496
00:24:29,145 --> 00:24:35,985
Um, and that was, you know, God put
that horse in my life for sure to show

497
00:24:35,985 --> 00:24:43,425
me, um, I feel like, show me what,
what I'm capable of and like to get me

498
00:24:43,425 --> 00:24:46,095
over that step so that I could roll on.

499
00:24:46,155 --> 00:24:48,675
And like, I'm forever grateful
for that horse, for that.

500
00:24:48,675 --> 00:24:49,125
For sure.

501
00:24:49,425 --> 00:24:50,115
What was his name?

502
00:24:50,175 --> 00:24:50,865
Time for the Diamond?

503
00:24:50,865 --> 00:24:51,315
Mm-hmm.

504
00:24:51,555 --> 00:24:51,556
Yeah.

505
00:24:52,305 --> 00:24:52,575
Yeah.

506
00:24:52,575 --> 00:24:54,015
He's, he's pretty awesome.

507
00:24:55,275 --> 00:24:55,785
Really Awesome.

508
00:24:56,025 --> 00:25:01,485
Did you know that he was the, the sort of
the top of the pyramid as you could say,

509
00:25:02,235 --> 00:25:03,045
to know that at the time?

510
00:25:03,075 --> 00:25:04,095
Um, yeah.

511
00:25:04,095 --> 00:25:08,385
I had my suspicions like I was
still green enough or like naive

512
00:25:08,385 --> 00:25:12,915
enough about what it took and I
didn't know, um, like I didn't know.

513
00:25:13,155 --> 00:25:14,120
I knew he was incredible.

514
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:19,830
But I didn't have the knowledge base or
the experience base to know like, wow,

515
00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:23,310
you know, like if he come back around
right now, I would be like, oh my gosh.

516
00:25:23,310 --> 00:25:23,670
You know?

517
00:25:23,790 --> 00:25:24,750
'cause I know what I had.

518
00:25:24,780 --> 00:25:27,210
I'd have like, and I knew what
I had, don't get me wrong.

519
00:25:27,810 --> 00:25:31,410
Um, but when other top trainers
at the time are just like,

520
00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:32,940
Hey, you know, sell 'em.

521
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:34,050
Hey, do you wanna sell 'em, you?

522
00:25:34,050 --> 00:25:35,550
I'm like, well, what do I have here?

523
00:25:36,180 --> 00:25:41,730
And that actually built confidence in
me to know that I had a horse, that I

524
00:25:41,730 --> 00:25:44,580
was capable to win an event like that.

525
00:25:44,580 --> 00:25:48,540
Because like, that event
is, it's insanely difficult.

526
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:51,600
Um, you know, like you've got top
professionals that have been there

527
00:25:51,600 --> 00:25:53,220
whole career and haven't won.

528
00:25:53,220 --> 00:25:55,139
And I was here, I'm my
third time and I win.

529
00:25:55,740 --> 00:25:58,410
Um, that's, that horse carried
the team, no doubt about it.

530
00:25:58,410 --> 00:25:59,430
Like that horse carried the team.

531
00:25:59,430 --> 00:26:03,780
But having those guys coming, trying
to buy my horse gave, actually

532
00:26:03,780 --> 00:26:05,730
gave me confidence that like, wow.

533
00:26:05,730 --> 00:26:07,815
I. I really, I could do this.

534
00:26:07,815 --> 00:26:09,555
Like I have this, I have this horse.

535
00:26:09,555 --> 00:26:10,515
So it was fun.

536
00:26:10,815 --> 00:26:13,005
And you built him up from his first ride?

537
00:26:13,125 --> 00:26:13,425
Yeah.

538
00:26:13,575 --> 00:26:13,875
Yeah.

539
00:26:13,875 --> 00:26:19,125
I mean, uh, if you just go back to,
like you were saying, um, about what

540
00:26:19,125 --> 00:26:24,645
I look for, he, uh, like I've told
this story quite a bit, but we were

541
00:26:25,155 --> 00:26:29,715
at a horse sale looking at yearlings
and I seen his head and neck sticking

542
00:26:29,715 --> 00:26:31,275
out of a stall from a ways away.

543
00:26:31,695 --> 00:26:34,005
And I rolled over, I went over there.

544
00:26:34,005 --> 00:26:35,955
'cause it's just like,
whoa, that is different.

545
00:26:36,405 --> 00:26:38,175
And that's when I bought him.

546
00:26:38,355 --> 00:26:38,955
Really?

547
00:26:38,955 --> 00:26:39,225
Yeah.

548
00:26:39,675 --> 00:26:40,005
Yeah.

549
00:26:40,575 --> 00:26:42,075
And yeah.

550
00:26:42,255 --> 00:26:45,315
Yeah, he just, there was something
about the way his head and neck

551
00:26:45,315 --> 00:26:46,605
is, and it's still that way today.

552
00:26:46,605 --> 00:26:50,355
Like he, he's got the coolest
head and neck in my opinion.

553
00:26:50,445 --> 00:26:53,385
Um, so yeah, that's, that drew me to him.

554
00:26:53,385 --> 00:26:56,985
And then I took him home, got him going
and yeah, he's been there ever since.

555
00:26:57,885 --> 00:27:01,365
I think that's really inspiring for people
who are listening or watching this episode

556
00:27:01,365 --> 00:27:06,135
because there are a lot of people across
all different facets of the horse world

557
00:27:06,435 --> 00:27:14,355
that really want and are, are passionate
and inspired to find their time.

558
00:27:14,355 --> 00:27:18,825
For the diamond, people want
to find their future star.

559
00:27:18,825 --> 00:27:18,945
Mm-hmm.

560
00:27:19,185 --> 00:27:20,085
In a young horse.

561
00:27:20,115 --> 00:27:20,235
Yep.

562
00:27:20,775 --> 00:27:23,415
But I think people are
intimidated by the process.

563
00:27:23,475 --> 00:27:23,655
Yep.

564
00:27:23,775 --> 00:27:27,075
Because it can go so well
or it can go so badly.

565
00:27:27,075 --> 00:27:27,105
A

566
00:27:27,255 --> 00:27:27,645
hundred percent.

567
00:27:27,645 --> 00:27:27,735
Or

568
00:27:27,735 --> 00:27:31,605
not badly, but I mean like it can go
maybe differently than you expected.

569
00:27:31,635 --> 00:27:31,725
Mm-hmm.

570
00:27:32,475 --> 00:27:40,245
What advice would you have for people
who are wanting to really emulate what

571
00:27:40,245 --> 00:27:44,505
you're doing, which is to start them super
young, like to get by them as a yearling.

572
00:27:44,535 --> 00:27:44,625
Mm-hmm.

573
00:27:44,865 --> 00:27:46,905
And then to put their first ride on them.

574
00:27:46,905 --> 00:27:49,395
'cause I know people who are trying
to, who wanna do this in eventing.

575
00:27:49,575 --> 00:27:51,225
I know people who wanna
do this in show jumping.

576
00:27:51,465 --> 00:27:53,775
I know people who wanna
do this in barrels.

577
00:27:53,775 --> 00:27:55,425
Like people are really.

578
00:27:55,860 --> 00:27:59,340
This is, I think that's actually in some
ways to many people like the pinnacle

579
00:27:59,340 --> 00:28:04,860
of horsemanship to have built your
champion from the very first day mm-hmm.

580
00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:07,379
To, and have them to the very last day.

581
00:28:07,425 --> 00:28:07,774
Right.

582
00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:08,639
Right.

583
00:28:08,940 --> 00:28:11,490
Um, I don't know what my advice would be.

584
00:28:12,510 --> 00:28:18,629
And, and I'm not even against, like,
for me it worked because, um, like

585
00:28:18,629 --> 00:28:24,180
as far as going from the very first
ride on, because my, my foundation

586
00:28:24,180 --> 00:28:25,530
in horsemanship was cult starting.

587
00:28:25,530 --> 00:28:28,980
So like I was a cult starter,
and then I just moved into the

588
00:28:28,980 --> 00:28:31,080
performance all the way to the mm-hmm.

589
00:28:31,410 --> 00:28:33,090
Highest levels of that.

590
00:28:33,360 --> 00:28:35,970
So I kind of started from the
ground up and worked my way up.

591
00:28:35,970 --> 00:28:38,610
So it was just, it's,
it's, it's normal for me.

592
00:28:38,970 --> 00:28:39,870
Um, I get it.

593
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:44,190
If somebody has somebody they really like
and they send 'em out for a few months

594
00:28:44,190 --> 00:28:45,810
or whatever, like that's, that's fine.

595
00:28:45,810 --> 00:28:49,290
And they just better be somebody you
can ride behind and, and you trust.

596
00:28:49,290 --> 00:28:53,370
But as far as like picking the, uh.

597
00:28:54,210 --> 00:28:55,200
The prospect.

598
00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:59,490
Uh, I don't know how to tell
somebody how to pick one.

599
00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:06,570
Um, but I would say I, what I see
a lot at sales is people come over,

600
00:29:06,570 --> 00:29:07,380
what do you think of this one?

601
00:29:07,380 --> 00:29:08,310
What do you think of this one?

602
00:29:08,310 --> 00:29:09,150
What do you think of this one?

603
00:29:09,750 --> 00:29:11,760
It doesn't really matter what I think.

604
00:29:11,940 --> 00:29:17,580
Like I, uh, like find something
you, you like, like something

605
00:29:17,580 --> 00:29:18,390
that stands out to you.

606
00:29:18,390 --> 00:29:23,310
Because like I said, what I see in,
in, in, uh, time for the diamonds head

607
00:29:23,310 --> 00:29:25,350
and neck isn't what other people see.

608
00:29:25,380 --> 00:29:28,140
'cause I bought 'em for 10,000
bucks, so clearly what I seen

609
00:29:28,140 --> 00:29:29,280
wasn't what everybody else seen.

610
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:29,820
Right.

611
00:29:29,850 --> 00:29:31,560
Find what, find what that is.

612
00:29:31,890 --> 00:29:34,230
Um, and just go with it.

613
00:29:35,190 --> 00:29:35,910
That's what I say.

614
00:29:36,180 --> 00:29:40,110
Like I, I'm, I'm, I'm never one to,

615
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:47,460
and I don't know how the
saying goes, but, um, if you,

616
00:29:48,810 --> 00:29:50,340
there's, there's certain things.

617
00:29:50,970 --> 00:29:55,080
A guy, uh, a person needs a mentor for
and somebody to guide him for sure.

618
00:29:55,440 --> 00:30:00,660
And then there's other things that I say,
take a chance on yourself and just do

619
00:30:00,660 --> 00:30:05,940
it like, like, uh, you know, whatever.

620
00:30:05,940 --> 00:30:06,270
Right?

621
00:30:06,270 --> 00:30:06,660
Like

622
00:30:06,810 --> 00:30:07,680
find your own way.

623
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:08,040
Find your

624
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:08,580
own way.

625
00:30:08,670 --> 00:30:13,020
Like you don't, if you, if you listen to
three people that are, that are careful

626
00:30:13,020 --> 00:30:17,940
and things like, you'll never blaze your
own trail and take you to places you, you

627
00:30:17,940 --> 00:30:20,340
know, like, I don't know, be an innovator.

628
00:30:20,490 --> 00:30:21,570
Like, I, I don't know.

629
00:30:21,990 --> 00:30:23,820
I don't know what I'm
saying, but I love it.

630
00:30:23,880 --> 00:30:24,330
Yeah.

631
00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:24,960
Yeah.

632
00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:29,490
I'm, I'm not afraid to fail and I'm not
afraid to try new things because you

633
00:30:29,490 --> 00:30:31,500
never know where the next great thing is.

634
00:30:31,530 --> 00:30:31,830
Right.

635
00:30:32,490 --> 00:30:36,510
Because there's so, I mean, I think
that's in general in business and life

636
00:30:36,510 --> 00:30:41,370
and different things, like just you think
it works for you and it's your vision.

637
00:30:41,370 --> 00:30:42,570
Don't tell people your vision.

638
00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:44,520
'cause they, they don't see,
they don't see your vision.

639
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:47,400
Like they, they see the logical
side, they don't see the vision.

640
00:30:49,260 --> 00:30:49,890
And so.

641
00:30:50,460 --> 00:30:53,460
Like that's, that's where
I kinda left my life.

642
00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:54,420
I love that.

643
00:30:54,930 --> 00:30:56,460
I think that's a really important message.

644
00:30:56,490 --> 00:30:56,640
Yeah.

645
00:30:56,670 --> 00:31:02,490
Because there are a lot of aspects of the
horse world that really foster a lot of

646
00:31:02,490 --> 00:31:04,185
codependence, especially on the drainer.

647
00:31:04,185 --> 00:31:04,186
Yeah.

648
00:31:04,345 --> 00:31:04,545
Mm-hmm.

649
00:31:04,625 --> 00:31:09,360
You know, it's, you're gonna, and I
think in some situations, you know,

650
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:11,430
again, not knocking that Right.

651
00:31:11,610 --> 00:31:16,890
And how empowering is, is it to
be able to look at a horse and

652
00:31:16,890 --> 00:31:18,600
have your own opinion mm-hmm.

653
00:31:19,020 --> 00:31:21,390
To build, to build your own eye.

654
00:31:21,420 --> 00:31:21,510
Mm-hmm.

655
00:31:22,770 --> 00:31:23,700
But that does take.

656
00:31:24,629 --> 00:31:28,680
A certain, you have to choose to
believe in yourself and what you see.

657
00:31:28,980 --> 00:31:29,399
Yeah.

658
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:30,840
You have to choose to believe in yourself.

659
00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:34,410
And then the thing about that too is
like, you're the one that has to live with

660
00:31:34,410 --> 00:31:36,060
those consequences of buying that horse.

661
00:31:36,060 --> 00:31:37,290
'cause you're the one that's riding him.

662
00:31:37,500 --> 00:31:37,860
Right?

663
00:31:37,860 --> 00:31:39,360
And I've made mistakes a hundred percent.

664
00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:40,110
I've made mistakes.

665
00:31:40,470 --> 00:31:44,129
But if you, if you ride that horse and
you've gotta dig yourself outta that

666
00:31:44,129 --> 00:31:49,620
hole, you're, you're gonna, you're like,
what that's gonna do to me, it's like,

667
00:31:50,250 --> 00:31:53,040
and maybe that's just the way my brain
works again, but I'll remember what

668
00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:54,389
that horse looked like in the stall.

669
00:31:54,389 --> 00:31:58,410
Like, like I can almost flashback and
be like, this is the way that that

670
00:31:58,410 --> 00:32:00,480
horse moved when he was a yearling.

671
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:01,920
And I, sometimes I'll go
back and watch a deal.

672
00:32:01,980 --> 00:32:04,080
This is the way that horse
moved when he's a yearling man.

673
00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:05,280
I really see that now.

674
00:32:05,595 --> 00:32:06,555
Going down the fence.

675
00:32:06,585 --> 00:32:06,675
Mm-hmm.

676
00:32:06,735 --> 00:32:09,975
Like as a 4-year-old, like I real
or a 3-year-old, I really see that.

677
00:32:10,365 --> 00:32:11,445
I sure I miss that.

678
00:32:11,895 --> 00:32:14,805
And then, but you're, you,
you're not gonna miss that again.

679
00:32:14,925 --> 00:32:17,775
Um, you know, so some of
that just takes time as well.

680
00:32:17,775 --> 00:32:20,685
Like, you're not gonna just go pick the
prettiest horse and, and win on 'em.

681
00:32:20,685 --> 00:32:22,425
Like, there's, there's other things to it.

682
00:32:23,085 --> 00:32:28,845
But if you, if you overlook something
and then two years down the road you're,

683
00:32:29,085 --> 00:32:34,695
you're struggling to get past a mechanic's
thing in the horse or something because

684
00:32:34,695 --> 00:32:38,325
you didn't see it, hopefully you're
not gonna make that mistake again.

685
00:32:39,765 --> 00:32:43,845
It makes me think of the saying
around mistakes are inevitable.

686
00:32:43,845 --> 00:32:45,405
The trick is not to make a habit of them.

687
00:32:45,465 --> 00:32:45,885
Right?

688
00:32:46,395 --> 00:32:46,605
Yep.

689
00:32:47,415 --> 00:32:47,685
Yep.

690
00:32:48,254 --> 00:32:53,294
That, and I love what you talked about
earlier in terms of you're gonna fail.

691
00:32:53,354 --> 00:32:55,935
And I love how you put air quotes
for everyone who's just listening.

692
00:32:56,024 --> 00:32:56,114
Yeah.

693
00:32:56,655 --> 00:33:00,645
Like Nick Full put air quotes
for failure and for success

694
00:33:00,885 --> 00:33:02,625
and what I love immediately.

695
00:33:02,625 --> 00:33:05,385
That gave me such an impression
of your relationship with the

696
00:33:05,385 --> 00:33:06,915
concept of failure and success.

697
00:33:06,945 --> 00:33:07,185
Right.

698
00:33:07,875 --> 00:33:12,675
Because like why did you choose air quotes
when you, when you did, when you talked

699
00:33:12,675 --> 00:33:14,114
about failure and success at a horse show?

700
00:33:14,564 --> 00:33:19,905
Well, like what, what comes to mind right
there is we're out road of the horse.

701
00:33:20,054 --> 00:33:21,344
Um, keep talking about that I guess.

702
00:33:21,344 --> 00:33:27,195
But, um, I, they asked me in an
interview the other day, uh, like

703
00:33:27,195 --> 00:33:29,774
most memorable moment at Rode to
the Horse or something like that.

704
00:33:30,014 --> 00:33:32,745
And I brought up 2018, the year I lost.

705
00:33:33,284 --> 00:33:39,614
Um, I had a horse that the crowd named
Leroy and Leroy was incredibly difficult.

706
00:33:39,614 --> 00:33:43,304
He would've been incredibly difficult
at home, let alone in a competition.

707
00:33:43,844 --> 00:33:47,114
And he was, oh, he was hard.

708
00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:52,695
He was really hard with the circumstances
that you're, you're given in an event

709
00:33:52,695 --> 00:33:59,085
like this without a saddle horse that
year, but first round didn't go the best.

710
00:33:59,085 --> 00:34:01,544
Like he wouldn't quit
bucking and different things.

711
00:34:01,544 --> 00:34:07,514
And anyway, by the end of the
last round, uh, I had him, man, I

712
00:34:07,514 --> 00:34:08,864
went through half the obstacles.

713
00:34:08,864 --> 00:34:11,775
I'd only been on 'em for probably 10
or 15 minutes, and I went through half

714
00:34:11,775 --> 00:34:13,364
the obstacles, like we were rolling.

715
00:34:13,665 --> 00:34:17,955
I just ran outta time and I lost,
but I walked outta here feeling like

716
00:34:17,955 --> 00:34:19,904
I just slayed a dragon, so to speak.

717
00:34:20,114 --> 00:34:20,415
Yeah.

718
00:34:20,475 --> 00:34:21,165
But I lost.

719
00:34:21,465 --> 00:34:25,545
So when I think of my most
memorable moments in competition,

720
00:34:26,085 --> 00:34:28,965
that's like top five for sure.

721
00:34:29,175 --> 00:34:29,775
Cool.

722
00:34:30,195 --> 00:34:34,065
And it was a failure by
the world standards, right?

723
00:34:34,154 --> 00:34:36,375
By the, by the competition standards.

724
00:34:36,375 --> 00:34:41,594
But, uh, like to me, I felt,
I mean, I felt like David and

725
00:34:41,594 --> 00:34:43,935
Goliath out there and I won.

726
00:34:44,565 --> 00:34:45,795
Like I didn't win, but.

727
00:34:46,529 --> 00:34:46,650
Yeah.

728
00:34:46,650 --> 00:34:48,389
But you went on your standards

729
00:34:48,929 --> 00:34:50,759
like I was very fulfilled,
let's say that way.

730
00:34:51,060 --> 00:34:51,960
Mm. Not

731
00:34:52,739 --> 00:34:56,639
I, I like, I, I've left here
like very proud of what I was

732
00:34:56,639 --> 00:34:57,569
able to achieve right there.

733
00:34:58,380 --> 00:35:01,920
I think that's actually,
it's really starting to get

734
00:35:02,130 --> 00:35:04,290
an insight into who you are.

735
00:35:04,710 --> 00:35:06,330
As you explain that to me.

736
00:35:06,330 --> 00:35:13,529
I'm, all I hear is someone who really
measures yourself on yourself Yeah.

737
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:18,660
Versus what is maybe
taking place around you.

738
00:35:18,665 --> 00:35:18,915
Right.

739
00:35:19,380 --> 00:35:19,650
Right.

740
00:35:20,100 --> 00:35:20,339
Yep.

741
00:35:20,549 --> 00:35:26,339
If, if, if the year you lost rode to the
horse or you failed as being one of your

742
00:35:26,339 --> 00:35:28,890
top five, like career highlights For sure.

743
00:35:28,890 --> 00:35:30,990
I feel like that says
a lot about you, Nick,

744
00:35:33,450 --> 00:35:34,080
I guess.

745
00:35:34,770 --> 00:35:35,040
Yeah.

746
00:35:35,130 --> 00:35:36,870
I think that's, that's
a horseman's answer.

747
00:35:36,900 --> 00:35:37,170
Yeah.

748
00:35:37,230 --> 00:35:37,589
Right.

749
00:35:37,650 --> 00:35:38,730
And it, it's the truth.

750
00:35:38,730 --> 00:35:40,859
It a hundred percent is the truth.

751
00:35:41,310 --> 00:35:42,480
Like, yeah.

752
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:43,350
Like that was.

753
00:35:44,775 --> 00:35:49,335
He took me to places in cult, starting
in this environment that I didn't know

754
00:35:49,335 --> 00:35:51,495
that I could go or I was willing to go.

755
00:35:51,945 --> 00:35:55,215
Like I would, I, you know, getting on
a horse like that in front of this,

756
00:35:55,215 --> 00:35:57,135
like, you are extremely vulnerable.

757
00:35:57,495 --> 00:36:00,465
'cause he could have,
like, who knows, right?

758
00:36:00,945 --> 00:36:07,695
Um, and under normal circumstances I
just would've took more time and it

759
00:36:07,695 --> 00:36:15,045
wouldn't, it wouldn't have, uh, pushed
me and Leroy and like, it's not like I

760
00:36:15,045 --> 00:36:17,055
did anything that I, I'm not proud of.

761
00:36:17,235 --> 00:36:22,455
But like, we got on the same page and we
were rolling like, and it was awesome.

762
00:36:23,085 --> 00:36:29,085
I think now I understand listening to you,
I understand now why you, why competition

763
00:36:29,085 --> 00:36:31,725
has that special place in your life.

764
00:36:31,785 --> 00:36:31,875
Mm-hmm.

765
00:36:32,505 --> 00:36:37,635
Because it's like this very intense
moment in time, you know, and I

766
00:36:37,635 --> 00:36:41,745
talk like, they talk about how, you
know, pressure is privilege mm-hmm.

767
00:36:42,045 --> 00:36:43,666
And that, you know, you look at.

768
00:36:44,385 --> 00:36:48,450
If you look at Nature diamonds can only
be created through pressure mm-hmm.

769
00:36:48,530 --> 00:36:51,765
Through a lot of actual,
like, quite intense pressure.

770
00:36:52,335 --> 00:36:56,805
And so I've never thought of it that way
until sitting in front of you to think

771
00:36:56,805 --> 00:37:01,905
of those moments as these really intense,
powerful moments that can create diamonds.

772
00:37:01,935 --> 00:37:02,145
Yeah.

773
00:37:02,415 --> 00:37:02,745
Love it.

774
00:37:03,435 --> 00:37:03,765
Yeah,

775
00:37:04,035 --> 00:37:04,455
for sure.

776
00:37:04,545 --> 00:37:07,185
Well, that's you, you totally
inspired that, so Yeah.

777
00:37:07,605 --> 00:37:07,875
Yeah.

778
00:37:07,965 --> 00:37:08,625
I love that.

779
00:37:08,715 --> 00:37:08,925
Yeah.

780
00:37:08,925 --> 00:37:11,055
No, that's, that's, that's why I do it.

781
00:37:11,175 --> 00:37:13,305
I mean, I mean, that's one of
the reasons why I do it for sure.

782
00:37:13,305 --> 00:37:15,105
Like, I, I like that.

783
00:37:15,765 --> 00:37:15,975
I like

784
00:37:15,975 --> 00:37:16,185
that.

785
00:37:16,785 --> 00:37:19,965
So what about, you know, we're
here at Road of the Horse.

786
00:37:20,115 --> 00:37:25,050
There are a competitors who have not
done, who did not build their career

787
00:37:25,185 --> 00:37:26,625
like yourself off cult starting.

788
00:37:26,625 --> 00:37:26,925
Mm-hmm.

789
00:37:26,931 --> 00:37:32,235
They actually come into it from
another side of the horse world.

790
00:37:32,295 --> 00:37:32,385
Mm-hmm.

791
00:37:32,625 --> 00:37:37,800
And I think maybe as cult starting,
I. Finds its way, you know, look, we

792
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:42,565
have Tick Maynard and Vicki Wilson, two
riders that don't have necessarily have

793
00:37:42,630 --> 00:37:43,765
like a big cult starting background.

794
00:37:43,765 --> 00:37:44,045
Mm-hmm.

795
00:37:44,130 --> 00:37:47,460
And they come from the English world,
you know, as the rest of the horse world

796
00:37:47,460 --> 00:37:51,270
maybe draws a little bit more attention
to cult starting and the art of it.

797
00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:52,920
'cause it really is an art form.

798
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:53,010
Mm-hmm.

799
00:37:53,850 --> 00:37:57,870
What is some advice or maybe a
reality with people who are listening

800
00:37:57,870 --> 00:38:01,350
going, well, I kind of wanna like,
this looks really interesting.

801
00:38:01,350 --> 00:38:03,030
I wanna, I wanna take, I wanna have a go.

802
00:38:03,150 --> 00:38:03,360
Mm-hmm.

803
00:38:03,420 --> 00:38:04,080
I wanna try.

804
00:38:04,440 --> 00:38:08,010
Or, what the heck is Colt starting
gonna do from my horsemanship?

805
00:38:08,460 --> 00:38:08,730
Right.

806
00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:09,390
For

807
00:38:09,390 --> 00:38:14,880
me, the colt starting and if we had
horses in front of it, I could, I

808
00:38:14,880 --> 00:38:19,710
could relate it from beginning to end
so easily, but all the same principles

809
00:38:19,740 --> 00:38:22,980
that make horsemanship, horsemanship
and make things work with horses.

810
00:38:22,980 --> 00:38:27,330
All those same principles are the
same ones that you use to halter break

811
00:38:27,330 --> 00:38:29,520
'em, to start 'em, to finish 'em.

812
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:31,020
Like it's all the same.

813
00:38:31,230 --> 00:38:33,270
The only thing that's
different is the practices.

814
00:38:36,810 --> 00:38:42,240
Whether we're deep in the Rocky
Mountains or down in the heat of Florida,

815
00:38:44,430 --> 00:38:48,690
we trust Yeti products on
this journey of a lifetime.

816
00:38:51,390 --> 00:38:56,250
From the Roadie 48 cooler to the Yeti
mugs, you see right here in the studio,

817
00:38:56,490 --> 00:39:02,220
Yeti coolers and drinkware are built
tough, smooth, and ready for anything

818
00:39:02,370 --> 00:39:04,230
the horse world has in store for us.

819
00:39:07,095 --> 00:39:12,075
So like the practices change, but the,
the, uh, horsemanship is the same.

820
00:39:12,105 --> 00:39:13,305
So like, I'll give you an example.

821
00:39:13,305 --> 00:39:17,145
Like when I'm starting a colt, when
I pick up the right reign and I want,

822
00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:19,125
I, I want some flexion to the right.

823
00:39:19,575 --> 00:39:22,905
I not only want him physically
to bend to the right, I want his

824
00:39:22,935 --> 00:39:26,685
mind to look to the right and I
won't release until he's physically

825
00:39:26,685 --> 00:39:28,305
soft and his mind is to the right.

826
00:39:29,175 --> 00:39:32,625
Same thing I need when I'm
working that cow yesterday,

827
00:39:32,895 --> 00:39:34,545
and it's incredibly intense.

828
00:39:34,965 --> 00:39:38,535
If, if I slide that neck, ring
up that horse's neck, he needs

829
00:39:38,535 --> 00:39:39,825
to take his focus to that cow.

830
00:39:40,245 --> 00:39:40,995
It's the same thing.

831
00:39:41,295 --> 00:39:44,775
It's just, it's just built upon itself.

832
00:39:44,835 --> 00:39:50,955
And it, and it's, I I've always said like
the, the principles are 100% the same.

833
00:39:50,955 --> 00:39:52,665
The way a horse learns is
the way a horse learns.

834
00:39:53,055 --> 00:39:58,545
But the, uh, the practices are
just a little, a little bit

835
00:39:58,545 --> 00:39:59,535
different, but it's all the same.

836
00:39:59,835 --> 00:40:03,675
So it's, it's been really
interesting to me to, um.

837
00:40:04,755 --> 00:40:10,185
The last few years I've started minimal
cults compared to what I used to.

838
00:40:10,605 --> 00:40:15,435
Um, and it, and most of 'em
in the performance deal.

839
00:40:15,435 --> 00:40:18,165
We started 'em in January,
February, sometimes December.

840
00:40:18,345 --> 00:40:18,945
Somewhere in there.

841
00:40:18,945 --> 00:40:19,905
We'll start 'em and get 'em going.

842
00:40:20,235 --> 00:40:22,605
But anyway, like, so it's
kind of a one year event now.

843
00:40:22,815 --> 00:40:25,995
Where before it was all year long.

844
00:40:25,995 --> 00:40:31,215
Story short, every time, every year when
I go back and start horses, I feel like

845
00:40:31,215 --> 00:40:32,955
I'm like, I've grown and I'm better.

846
00:40:33,855 --> 00:40:38,835
And I haven't worked on the technique
or the, the practices, but my mental, my

847
00:40:38,835 --> 00:40:45,615
mental, uh, game for the horses and my, my
mental game and technique there is better.

848
00:40:46,095 --> 00:40:49,245
So it's been really interesting
to me that I haven't started

849
00:40:49,245 --> 00:40:50,715
near the horses that I used to.

850
00:40:51,225 --> 00:40:54,885
But I feel like every year I've
gotten, I've taken a step forward,

851
00:40:55,185 --> 00:40:56,295
even though I'm not even doing it.

852
00:40:56,565 --> 00:40:58,065
But it's 'cause it's the mental game.

853
00:40:58,905 --> 00:41:03,285
I'm noticing a pattern, which is
you refer a lot to the thought.

854
00:41:03,674 --> 00:41:08,145
And the mind of the horse when
someone's watching rode to

855
00:41:08,145 --> 00:41:09,345
the horse for the first time.

856
00:41:09,375 --> 00:41:09,464
Mm-hmm.

857
00:41:10,035 --> 00:41:14,415
What should they look for when you talk
about having the mind, because I now,

858
00:41:14,415 --> 00:41:17,834
this is my second year watching, I can
now start to understand the difference.

859
00:41:17,865 --> 00:41:17,955
Mm-hmm.

860
00:41:18,194 --> 00:41:27,134
When the thought becomes evident
between the, the rider and the

861
00:41:27,134 --> 00:41:27,910
horse and the rider mm-hmm.

862
00:41:27,910 --> 00:41:32,174
The col and the starter, you can start
to see it, but you have to watch a

863
00:41:32,174 --> 00:41:34,064
lot to be able to recognize those.

864
00:41:34,095 --> 00:41:34,484
Yeah.

865
00:41:34,484 --> 00:41:34,906
For for sure.

866
00:41:34,910 --> 00:41:37,424
And when you can see when the thought,
you know, I was watching yesterday,

867
00:41:37,424 --> 00:41:40,995
you could see when the thought was
the, the bo the body was moving,

868
00:41:40,995 --> 00:41:42,765
but the, the mind was not moving.

869
00:41:42,765 --> 00:41:43,185
For sure.

870
00:41:43,395 --> 00:41:43,634
Yep.

871
00:41:44,415 --> 00:41:48,165
Can you explain though, for those who are
maybe first, maybe they have just started

872
00:41:48,165 --> 00:41:51,194
watching Road to the Horse, maybe they're
a fan of Tig Maynards and they, or Vicki

873
00:41:51,194 --> 00:41:53,714
Wilson's, and this is the first year
that they've watched Road to the Horse.

874
00:41:54,645 --> 00:41:56,504
When you go into that round pen.

875
00:41:56,689 --> 00:41:57,109
Mm-hmm.

876
00:42:00,049 --> 00:42:02,475
How and why?

877
00:42:03,090 --> 00:42:08,790
Are you thinking and focusing
and prioritizing the mind of

878
00:42:08,790 --> 00:42:10,530
the, of the cult versus the body?

879
00:42:10,950 --> 00:42:11,400
Yeah.

880
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:17,400
Um, I think first thing it, when you
go in there, like you've gotta find,

881
00:42:18,060 --> 00:42:20,790
if we're talking like specifically
to road to the horse is like

882
00:42:20,820 --> 00:42:24,810
that they need to feel welcomed.

883
00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:30,450
Like the horse needs to feel like, okay,
this guy's got my interests at, at heart.

884
00:42:30,450 --> 00:42:32,940
Like he can tell that I'm
a little insecure about the

885
00:42:32,940 --> 00:42:34,920
situation, the, the goings on.

886
00:42:35,550 --> 00:42:37,020
Am I inviting to him?

887
00:42:37,560 --> 00:42:42,390
Like, and inviting can be like a
soft word and be like, oh, I'm just

888
00:42:42,390 --> 00:42:44,460
gonna pet him and rub him and no.

889
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:47,880
Like, they'll get sick of that in about
a minute and they'll realize you really

890
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:50,100
don't have anything to offer them, right?

891
00:42:50,910 --> 00:42:56,310
Mm. But if, if you offer them like lead
in, uh, leadership and just guidance of

892
00:42:56,310 --> 00:42:58,410
where like, Hey, I know this is scary.

893
00:42:58,410 --> 00:43:01,020
I'm gonna take you under my wing
and we're gonna go do these things.

894
00:43:01,020 --> 00:43:02,430
Like, come on, I got you.

895
00:43:02,640 --> 00:43:04,380
Like, I know it's
challenging, but look at this.

896
00:43:04,380 --> 00:43:05,850
You can do this, you can do this.

897
00:43:06,150 --> 00:43:07,170
That's my mindset.

898
00:43:07,170 --> 00:43:07,529
Right.

899
00:43:07,799 --> 00:43:08,130
Cool.

900
00:43:08,160 --> 00:43:13,890
And um, 'cause when you just go, like,
what is a big turnoff for me is when

901
00:43:13,890 --> 00:43:18,000
somebody goes in there and they just start
working on like, physical and technique

902
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:21,509
and like, I'm gonna get your hindquarters
and I'm gonna like physically move you.

903
00:43:21,509 --> 00:43:22,380
And it's just technique.

904
00:43:22,380 --> 00:43:23,790
And it's like, whoa, whoa,
whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

905
00:43:23,790 --> 00:43:28,170
Like, what is like, let's, let's offer
that or something a little bit better.

906
00:43:28,200 --> 00:43:28,980
Like deeper.

907
00:43:29,009 --> 00:43:29,490
Deeper.

908
00:43:30,180 --> 00:43:30,660
Um.

909
00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:34,109
And some horses take a little
longer to respond to that.

910
00:43:34,109 --> 00:43:40,410
And like I with that doesn't mean
it's, it's all, uh, you know, petting

911
00:43:40,410 --> 00:43:44,879
and standing there because that's,
that's only gonna get you so far.

912
00:43:45,120 --> 00:43:47,970
Like, they need, they need somebody
to take 'em under their wing and

913
00:43:47,970 --> 00:43:49,980
feel good about going to work.

914
00:43:50,790 --> 00:43:55,049
Um, that's, I don't know if
that answered your question, but

915
00:43:55,230 --> 00:43:59,549
well, correct me if I'm wrong, but I
love how you said, I think it's very

916
00:43:59,549 --> 00:44:03,930
enlightening for you to say, or, or
at least revealing for me to, for

917
00:44:03,930 --> 00:44:06,839
you say like, you know, you can rub
on him and love on him, but that's

918
00:44:06,839 --> 00:44:09,480
not gonna, that's gonna be good
for like the first minute or two.

919
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:10,379
And then they're gonna be like, okay.

920
00:44:10,379 --> 00:44:11,279
And Yes.

921
00:44:11,609 --> 00:44:11,879
Right.

922
00:44:11,910 --> 00:44:12,180
Yeah.

923
00:44:12,480 --> 00:44:13,924
And so leadership mm-hmm.

924
00:44:14,009 --> 00:44:18,000
Is, and tell me if this
resonates with you.

925
00:44:18,149 --> 00:44:19,950
Leadership is timing.

926
00:44:19,980 --> 00:44:23,759
Leadership is being able to pivot
in the moment based on the feedback

927
00:44:23,759 --> 00:44:25,020
that that call is giving you.

928
00:44:25,020 --> 00:44:25,020
Mm-hmm.

929
00:44:25,026 --> 00:44:25,205
Mm-hmm.

930
00:44:25,529 --> 00:44:29,370
Leadership is feel, leadership
is recognizing when.

931
00:44:29,759 --> 00:44:32,460
The, when you've asked too much.

932
00:44:33,240 --> 00:44:33,330
Mm-hmm.

933
00:44:33,569 --> 00:44:37,620
Or you've, you know, you're being, the,
the cult is being generous in that moment,

934
00:44:37,620 --> 00:44:39,450
and you find what you need to find.

935
00:44:39,569 --> 00:44:39,660
Mm-hmm.

936
00:44:39,660 --> 00:44:40,710
And then you give them a break.

937
00:44:40,770 --> 00:44:40,859
Mm-hmm.

938
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:45,029
Like, you even say in, in your saying,
you talk about letting them wear it.

939
00:44:45,029 --> 00:44:46,529
Let 'em soak, let 'em soak.

940
00:44:46,589 --> 00:44:46,740
Yeah.

941
00:44:46,740 --> 00:44:50,370
And I was like, Ooh, this refer is,
this reminds me of the Martin back,

942
00:44:50,549 --> 00:44:52,169
Martin Black talks about the cocktail.

943
00:44:52,290 --> 00:44:52,379
Mm-hmm.

944
00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:53,669
Like allowing Yeah.

945
00:44:53,669 --> 00:44:56,490
The, the neuroscience Yep.

946
00:44:56,730 --> 00:44:57,870
Behind horses.

947
00:44:57,899 --> 00:44:58,109
Yep.

948
00:44:58,109 --> 00:44:58,950
To work in your favor.

949
00:44:58,950 --> 00:45:01,470
And this is what I found has found
fascinating in this journey of

950
00:45:01,470 --> 00:45:05,759
the podcast, learning how many
cowboys are actually like I would,

951
00:45:05,940 --> 00:45:07,859
so like closeted neuroscientists

952
00:45:07,890 --> 00:45:08,370
for sure.

953
00:45:08,609 --> 00:45:09,419
Yeah, for sure.

954
00:45:09,750 --> 00:45:15,899
And it, it, it would work, uh, it can work
in your favor or it can work against it.

955
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:18,210
And it just depends on, like, that's

956
00:45:19,230 --> 00:45:19,529
the

957
00:45:19,529 --> 00:45:22,169
soap period, or the
break or whatever it is.

958
00:45:22,259 --> 00:45:26,220
Like, if it's not timed right, it's
not gonna have the same effect either.

959
00:45:26,430 --> 00:45:26,580
Mm-hmm.

960
00:45:26,580 --> 00:45:27,629
Like, so it's gotta be timed right.

961
00:45:27,629 --> 00:45:36,404
Like I. I like to get just to the
point of where it's about to break

962
00:45:36,404 --> 00:45:38,085
through, like physically break through.

963
00:45:38,625 --> 00:45:43,515
'cause like right before it physically
happens, like lets say it just physically

964
00:45:43,515 --> 00:45:45,194
you get the hindquarters, right?

965
00:45:45,194 --> 00:45:45,255
Yeah.

966
00:45:45,645 --> 00:45:48,404
Right before that physically happens,
mentally there's a switch 'cause

967
00:45:48,404 --> 00:45:51,165
they're preparing their body and
it's, it's about to happen like

968
00:45:51,165 --> 00:45:53,205
mentally they've switched physically.

969
00:45:53,205 --> 00:45:56,085
Maybe it hasn't come out yet.

970
00:45:56,174 --> 00:45:56,265
Mm-hmm.

971
00:45:56,654 --> 00:46:00,915
If you can release when they
mentally switch, oh my gosh.

972
00:46:00,975 --> 00:46:05,895
Like you can roll with them and
you leave them wanting more 'cause

973
00:46:05,955 --> 00:46:10,125
because they feel what it felt
like before it actually happened.

974
00:46:10,634 --> 00:46:14,205
And so if you can leave
a horse wanting more Wow.

975
00:46:14,415 --> 00:46:16,095
Like they, they roll quick.

976
00:46:16,634 --> 00:46:23,610
Um, and so like I always try to,
um, get the release, like one of

977
00:46:23,610 --> 00:46:26,985
my kind of sayings is the closer
I can release for the thought.

978
00:46:27,495 --> 00:46:29,385
The, the more impact I'll have.

979
00:46:29,805 --> 00:46:33,105
So like if, if a horse is gonna do
something, you know, first they'll

980
00:46:33,105 --> 00:46:35,655
think about it, then they'll
prepare and then it happens.

981
00:46:35,655 --> 00:46:35,985
Right?

982
00:46:35,985 --> 00:46:40,035
And if, if, if I can release, if
I'm setting something up and I can

983
00:46:40,035 --> 00:46:45,495
release as they're thinking before
they even prepare, before they action.

984
00:46:45,495 --> 00:46:45,915
So like.

985
00:46:46,215 --> 00:46:49,485
When you're getting going, you're gonna
have to see the, like if you, if you

986
00:46:49,485 --> 00:46:52,725
haven't like paid attention to this
stuff or like really thought about

987
00:46:52,725 --> 00:46:55,755
it first, you're gonna have to see
the action and then you can release

988
00:46:55,755 --> 00:46:58,245
for the action and get what you want.

989
00:46:58,515 --> 00:46:59,205
And that works.

990
00:46:59,925 --> 00:47:03,165
But you can take it another level, like
you could release for the preparation.

991
00:47:03,585 --> 00:47:04,635
That'd be the next step.

992
00:47:04,635 --> 00:47:06,405
Or you can release for the mind switch.

993
00:47:07,185 --> 00:47:10,815
My goal is to release, like I'm always
constantly trying to get it down to

994
00:47:10,815 --> 00:47:12,735
where the mind takes a hold of it.

995
00:47:13,335 --> 00:47:15,405
Then the body prepares, then the action.

996
00:47:15,825 --> 00:47:18,645
The closer you release to the
thought, the more impact you'll have.

997
00:47:19,095 --> 00:47:24,315
The less, the less times you would have
to set a certain scenario up to get the

998
00:47:24,315 --> 00:47:29,085
same effective result because it's so
close to what they, they know exactly

999
00:47:29,085 --> 00:47:32,475
what you're asking because it was, as
soon as they thought about it, pressure

1000
00:47:32,475 --> 00:47:35,355
went away versus they thought about it.

1001
00:47:35,925 --> 00:47:41,370
Five I. 20 seconds ago and it took their
body and then you released for the body.

1002
00:47:41,370 --> 00:47:41,970
And that's fine.

1003
00:47:41,970 --> 00:47:45,509
Like if you're, when you're learning,
like I'll miss it sometimes and I'll have

1004
00:47:45,509 --> 00:47:46,799
to release for the body, that's fine.

1005
00:47:47,339 --> 00:47:51,629
But you're gonna have more impact
if you can see that happen sooner.

1006
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:52,740
That's my goal.

1007
00:47:53,970 --> 00:47:55,080
I wonder whether,

1008
00:47:56,220 --> 00:47:57,149
and the horses know,

1009
00:47:57,720 --> 00:48:01,890
okay, God, because I was gonna say like
if I were a horse, if I imagined myself

1010
00:48:01,890 --> 00:48:11,370
as best I can, if someone were to release
pressure on my thought versus my action

1011
00:48:11,370 --> 00:48:13,080
or my preparation for that action mm-hmm.

1012
00:48:13,589 --> 00:48:16,740
I would feel as though
that person sees me.

1013
00:48:16,740 --> 00:48:17,220
Mm-hmm.

1014
00:48:17,294 --> 00:48:17,645
Right?

1015
00:48:17,819 --> 00:48:17,940
Mm-hmm.

1016
00:48:18,240 --> 00:48:20,970
So when we talk about, you know,
like the inherent need to be

1017
00:48:20,970 --> 00:48:23,970
seen, felt, heard, understood.

1018
00:48:24,000 --> 00:48:24,120
Yep.

1019
00:48:24,180 --> 00:48:27,120
These are like basic core needs
of all, you know, in a lot of

1020
00:48:27,149 --> 00:48:29,609
aspects of relational life.

1021
00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:29,759
Mm-hmm.

1022
00:48:30,870 --> 00:48:32,940
When you think of our lives with horses.

1023
00:48:33,510 --> 00:48:34,890
To feel seen.

1024
00:48:35,430 --> 00:48:36,600
That is how we feel.

1025
00:48:36,630 --> 00:48:41,730
That's how we help horses feel seen by us,
and therefore, the bridge of trust begins.

1026
00:48:41,910 --> 00:48:42,210
Yep.

1027
00:48:42,300 --> 00:48:43,860
That's ex, that's a hundred percent.

1028
00:48:44,160 --> 00:48:48,480
And that's, that's the, uh,
welcoming, the inviting, the thing

1029
00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:51,270
that I was talking about that I
want to get developed with my horse.

1030
00:48:51,300 --> 00:48:56,130
Like the ability to be
understood means so much to them.

1031
00:48:56,550 --> 00:49:00,300
And I feel like sometimes
technique can get in the way

1032
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:01,920
and they don't feel understood.

1033
00:49:02,220 --> 00:49:06,240
And it, and understood doesn't mean
that they're not gonna struggle here.

1034
00:49:06,240 --> 00:49:10,620
And then, oh my gosh, that is,
that gate is wide open, right?

1035
00:49:10,625 --> 00:49:11,005
Mm-hmm.

1036
00:49:11,185 --> 00:49:16,140
So I, uh, yeah, that's what I mean,
because, uh, a horse doesn't feel

1037
00:49:16,140 --> 00:49:18,960
understood if they're bothered
and you're petting them and you're

1038
00:49:18,960 --> 00:49:20,250
not helping them get unbothered.

1039
00:49:21,300 --> 00:49:23,250
Mm. Like, it, it, it doesn't mean much.

1040
00:49:23,310 --> 00:49:23,640
Right.

1041
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:28,680
But these things, like you're saying, from
a self-preservation standpoint, uh, from

1042
00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:30,690
their standpoint, that feels good to them.

1043
00:49:31,620 --> 00:49:31,830
Right.

1044
00:49:32,250 --> 00:49:33,509
So that's, that's my goal.

1045
00:49:33,779 --> 00:49:38,939
Well, it would, I would imagine
that that then it's where method

1046
00:49:39,299 --> 00:49:44,819
is then put down and sort of
presence and feel is then picked up.

1047
00:49:45,569 --> 00:49:45,899
Right.

1048
00:49:46,020 --> 00:49:50,520
Because method to me would then suggest
that you have a pre-established agenda.

1049
00:49:50,580 --> 00:49:50,730
Right.

1050
00:49:50,790 --> 00:49:53,759
Which means that you're then not
observing moment to moment what's

1051
00:49:53,759 --> 00:49:55,140
taking place in front of you, right.

1052
00:49:55,319 --> 00:49:58,649
Which means you are not able
to actually technically sort

1053
00:49:58,649 --> 00:50:00,000
of release to the thought.

1054
00:50:00,029 --> 00:50:00,120
Mm-hmm.

1055
00:50:00,450 --> 00:50:03,120
Because you already have a
preconceived notion of what you want

1056
00:50:03,120 --> 00:50:04,379
and how you want the body to move.

1057
00:50:04,410 --> 00:50:04,919
Exactly.

1058
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:05,700
Exactly.

1059
00:50:05,700 --> 00:50:10,560
And, and you will get results and, and
you'll get results to a certain extent.

1060
00:50:10,560 --> 00:50:12,930
Like you will get physical
results to a certain extent.

1061
00:50:13,439 --> 00:50:16,680
Um, I'm, I'm not denying that at all.

1062
00:50:17,160 --> 00:50:23,549
Um, but for me, I want that horse like
we talked about that just has that

1063
00:50:23,640 --> 00:50:27,629
extra look of willingness on the team.

1064
00:50:28,529 --> 00:50:28,950
Um.

1065
00:50:29,820 --> 00:50:34,860
The thing about it, if they know
what to do, their individualness

1066
00:50:34,950 --> 00:50:36,420
can come out and flourish.

1067
00:50:36,510 --> 00:50:39,810
Mm. If they're mechanical, it
looks mechanical like, and,

1068
00:50:40,710 --> 00:50:41,700
and that's the difference.

1069
00:50:41,700 --> 00:50:42,060
Right.

1070
00:50:42,210 --> 00:50:42,630
To me,

1071
00:50:43,020 --> 00:50:45,990
you can ask the difference between
like the art and the science of it.

1072
00:50:45,990 --> 00:50:46,110
Mm-hmm.

1073
00:50:46,980 --> 00:50:49,470
Because I think it's important
we understand our fundamentals.

1074
00:50:49,470 --> 00:50:52,215
We understand how and why
we have the body for Yeah.

1075
00:50:52,215 --> 00:50:52,495
Right?

1076
00:50:52,495 --> 00:50:52,735
Mm-hmm.

1077
00:50:52,740 --> 00:50:54,720
The biomechanics, these
things are important.

1078
00:50:54,720 --> 00:50:54,990
Yep.

1079
00:50:55,080 --> 00:50:56,220
And yep.

1080
00:50:56,250 --> 00:50:58,380
If you want that feeling of like telepathy

1081
00:50:58,385 --> 00:50:58,655
mm-hmm.

1082
00:50:59,940 --> 00:51:03,150
That every single, I have found,
every single rider, great riders

1083
00:51:03,690 --> 00:51:08,730
from all disciplines, talk about
that connection, that tel, that

1084
00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:10,500
telepathy between horse and rider.

1085
00:51:10,505 --> 00:51:10,615
Mm-hmm.

1086
00:51:10,770 --> 00:51:12,135
If you want that mm-hmm.

1087
00:51:12,245 --> 00:51:13,055
Then you have to,

1088
00:51:13,590 --> 00:51:16,920
you have to, you have to work
towards it and like, to me,

1089
00:51:16,920 --> 00:51:18,360
this is how you do it for me.

1090
00:51:18,750 --> 00:51:19,020
Yeah.

1091
00:51:19,830 --> 00:51:20,010
Yep.

1092
00:51:20,405 --> 00:51:20,695
Yeah.

1093
00:51:21,180 --> 00:51:21,390
Yeah.

1094
00:51:21,390 --> 00:51:22,590
You have to work towards it and.

1095
00:51:22,995 --> 00:51:29,595
And like I, I'm not saying that it's bad
to release for their physical actions.

1096
00:51:29,595 --> 00:51:33,645
Like if I'm, if I'm learning or
I'm helping somebody or working on

1097
00:51:33,645 --> 00:51:37,095
myself, like there's times where
I'm gonna miss it and I'm gonna

1098
00:51:37,095 --> 00:51:38,865
release, or the physical thing.

1099
00:51:38,955 --> 00:51:39,045
Mm-hmm.

1100
00:51:39,525 --> 00:51:43,305
But I wanna see what happened before
those, like maybe what happened two things

1101
00:51:43,305 --> 00:51:45,464
before, and try to get as close to that.

1102
00:51:45,495 --> 00:51:48,915
I'm always trying to get as close to
that as I can, but there's a hundred

1103
00:51:48,915 --> 00:51:52,305
percent, there's gonna be countless
times throughout a day where I'm

1104
00:51:52,305 --> 00:51:54,404
gonna miss it and I'm gonna have
to release for the physical thing.

1105
00:51:54,975 --> 00:51:56,685
It's just, it's, there's no way around it.

1106
00:51:57,404 --> 00:51:58,305
Like, there's no way around it.

1107
00:51:58,305 --> 00:52:03,645
Well, and I love that invitation or
that, um, maybe that check in this moment

1108
00:52:03,645 --> 00:52:07,424
where you're saying, you know, just be
aware of the fact that this is a process.

1109
00:52:07,455 --> 00:52:07,545
Mm-hmm.

1110
00:52:07,785 --> 00:52:11,205
That as you, like this is
an art that you develop.

1111
00:52:11,790 --> 00:52:13,290
For your entire lifetime.

1112
00:52:13,290 --> 00:52:13,410
Yep.

1113
00:52:13,410 --> 00:52:13,980
And then you die.

1114
00:52:14,220 --> 00:52:14,460
Yeah.

1115
00:52:15,265 --> 00:52:15,555
Yeah.

1116
00:52:15,840 --> 00:52:16,440
Sorry, y'all.

1117
00:52:16,440 --> 00:52:16,500
Yeah.

1118
00:52:16,680 --> 00:52:19,410
That's like kind of, it's kind
of, you know, not crude, but like

1119
00:52:19,410 --> 00:52:20,880
it's a bit straight straight.

1120
00:52:20,940 --> 00:52:21,060
Mm-hmm.

1121
00:52:21,330 --> 00:52:25,259
But I'd say that that's the more I
speak to great horsemen and horse

1122
00:52:25,259 --> 00:52:28,980
women, the more that becomes evident
that this is just, this is you're

1123
00:52:28,980 --> 00:52:30,660
getting closer and closer to the thing.

1124
00:52:30,665 --> 00:52:30,875
Mm-hmm.

1125
00:52:31,110 --> 00:52:32,549
Closer and closer to that feel.

1126
00:52:32,790 --> 00:52:37,410
And then you might get it and you might
get closest to it, and then you'll,

1127
00:52:37,410 --> 00:52:38,790
your body fails you or something.

1128
00:52:38,790 --> 00:52:38,970
Yeah.

1129
00:52:38,975 --> 00:52:39,235
Yeah.

1130
00:52:39,240 --> 00:52:41,160
And then you, and then
you leave this moral life.

1131
00:52:41,160 --> 00:52:41,670
Yeah.

1132
00:52:42,240 --> 00:52:42,540
Yeah.

1133
00:52:43,049 --> 00:52:44,640
That's, I think that's why we love 'em.

1134
00:52:44,640 --> 00:52:47,009
It's like kinda like golf or something.

1135
00:52:47,009 --> 00:52:49,080
You just can't ever, there's no mastery.

1136
00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:51,029
There's really no mastery.

1137
00:52:51,029 --> 00:52:55,710
Like there's, there's levels, but there's
no, it's not like you can ever get it.

1138
00:52:57,299 --> 00:53:02,310
I'm curious to ask you a question about
when people, I've heard a lot of really

1139
00:53:02,310 --> 00:53:06,660
great horsemen and horse women say
that, you know, like horses are simple.

1140
00:53:07,140 --> 00:53:09,840
I've even heard some say horses are dumb.

1141
00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:15,570
And yet when we talk about their
ability to soak on the thought and

1142
00:53:15,570 --> 00:53:20,070
that I've, I've also had great horsemen
and horsewomen say that, you know, you

1143
00:53:20,070 --> 00:53:22,895
have a session, you let that horse,
that horse is gonna go think mm-hmm.

1144
00:53:23,100 --> 00:53:25,259
About what you did, and
then we'll come back.

1145
00:53:25,259 --> 00:53:27,060
And we've watched that with the
colts that rode to the horse.

1146
00:53:27,060 --> 00:53:27,061
Mm-hmm.

1147
00:53:27,067 --> 00:53:28,981
Like, you can see that
they've thought mm-hmm.

1148
00:53:29,250 --> 00:53:31,200
And they've built off of
what happened yesterday.

1149
00:53:31,200 --> 00:53:31,290
Mm-hmm.

1150
00:53:33,450 --> 00:53:36,780
There's something about it that,
that in my mind, that challenges

1151
00:53:37,020 --> 00:53:38,670
this idea that horses are simple.

1152
00:53:38,670 --> 00:53:41,910
If they have an ability to sit
and think about what took place

1153
00:53:42,060 --> 00:53:42,270
Yeah.

1154
00:53:42,300 --> 00:53:42,990
Prior.

1155
00:53:43,530 --> 00:53:43,740
Yeah.

1156
00:53:44,070 --> 00:53:47,820
I kind of wanna challenge the horse
world, that this idea that I think they're

1157
00:53:47,820 --> 00:53:49,440
simple in, that they're straightforward.

1158
00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:52,980
They don't have, you know, like Vicki
Talks, Vicki Wilson talked about it

1159
00:53:52,980 --> 00:53:57,360
this week in her, in her demonstration
like that horses are not malicious.

1160
00:53:57,360 --> 00:54:00,210
They don't come out trying
to make you have a bad day.

1161
00:54:00,240 --> 00:54:00,509
Right.

1162
00:54:01,740 --> 00:54:04,830
But I kind of wanna, what do you, what
would you say if I said, I kind of wanna

1163
00:54:04,830 --> 00:54:09,120
challenge this idea that horses are
sort of simple, like simplistic, almost

1164
00:54:09,120 --> 00:54:12,450
alluding to a lack of intelligence,
because an ability to think about

1165
00:54:12,450 --> 00:54:15,540
everything that you've worked on,
the ability to like, integrate that.

1166
00:54:15,540 --> 00:54:15,630
Mm-hmm.

1167
00:54:15,870 --> 00:54:18,285
Integration is one of the most
important aspects of life.

1168
00:54:18,415 --> 00:54:18,835
Mm-hmm.

1169
00:54:19,470 --> 00:54:20,730
And they, I think, do that.

1170
00:54:21,300 --> 00:54:22,650
It's giving 'em the opportunity.

1171
00:54:22,650 --> 00:54:23,760
Do that incredibly well.

1172
00:54:23,820 --> 00:54:24,660
Well, they're brilliant.

1173
00:54:24,660 --> 00:54:24,990
Yeah.

1174
00:54:25,500 --> 00:54:28,170
They, they do it negatively or positively.

1175
00:54:28,380 --> 00:54:33,420
Like are they, are they, are they
simple in the fact that they're they're

1176
00:54:33,420 --> 00:54:36,120
pure and they're gonna be the same.

1177
00:54:36,630 --> 00:54:40,440
Um, and they'll take you from where
you are and, and they can take a

1178
00:54:40,440 --> 00:54:42,330
good handler and be good or bad.

1179
00:54:42,630 --> 00:54:42,900
Yes.

1180
00:54:42,900 --> 00:54:44,070
They're incredibly simple that way.

1181
00:54:44,070 --> 00:54:47,340
Like they, their self
preservation is what it is.

1182
00:54:47,340 --> 00:54:48,720
And they wanna be comfortable.

1183
00:54:48,990 --> 00:54:50,100
They're simple in the facts.

1184
00:54:50,160 --> 00:54:52,890
They have their checklist of
things that they want to get.

1185
00:54:53,265 --> 00:54:54,825
They wanna feel, right?

1186
00:54:55,065 --> 00:54:55,335
Yes.

1187
00:54:55,335 --> 00:54:55,905
They're simple there.

1188
00:54:55,905 --> 00:54:55,965
Yeah.

1189
00:54:55,995 --> 00:54:58,905
But like, they're very, they're
brilliant in the fact that

1190
00:54:58,905 --> 00:55:00,735
they can, they can move on.

1191
00:55:00,735 --> 00:55:08,715
Like, I, uh, kind of what come to mind
is if somebody, um, makes a comment,

1192
00:55:09,105 --> 00:55:15,105
like, I've been working on X and I
just, uh, I've been working on, let's

1193
00:55:15,105 --> 00:55:16,485
just call it loading in, in a trailer.

1194
00:55:16,575 --> 00:55:16,785
Yeah.

1195
00:55:16,965 --> 00:55:20,805
And it took me 30 minutes
yesterday, and then I come out

1196
00:55:20,895 --> 00:55:24,015
today and it, it took me 30 minutes
again to get him in the trailer.

1197
00:55:24,495 --> 00:55:27,585
And like, I, like, I get what I
need to get, but I just feel like

1198
00:55:27,585 --> 00:55:29,175
the horse doesn't retain anything.

1199
00:55:30,045 --> 00:55:34,425
Um, so then instantly what's triggered
in my mind is it's your idea.

1200
00:55:34,875 --> 00:55:39,675
It's if it's your idea, like eventually
you will wear your idea into 'em and

1201
00:55:39,675 --> 00:55:44,685
they will do it, but there's not gonna
be any retention because there's,

1202
00:55:44,925 --> 00:55:47,235
there's nothing for them to go soak
on because they didn't have it.

1203
00:55:47,325 --> 00:55:48,225
They didn't have an opinion.

1204
00:55:48,795 --> 00:55:51,375
So there's nothing for them to soak on,
so they're not gonna retain anything.

1205
00:55:51,855 --> 00:55:56,955
But if you, if you taught 'em, and
yeah, maybe they're not gonna be perfect

1206
00:55:56,955 --> 00:56:02,085
the next time, but like, if I did my
job, say, loading a horse in a trailer

1207
00:56:02,085 --> 00:56:06,105
and say we struggled and it, it took,
there was some, some history there

1208
00:56:06,105 --> 00:56:07,695
or whatever, and it took 30 minutes.

1209
00:56:08,055 --> 00:56:11,745
If I did my job the next day, I
would be disappointed in myself

1210
00:56:11,745 --> 00:56:13,365
if it didn't take less than 10.

1211
00:56:13,365 --> 00:56:13,455
Mm-hmm.

1212
00:56:13,935 --> 00:56:18,315
Like, it, it needs to be at least
cut in half and then by the third

1213
00:56:18,315 --> 00:56:20,175
session, he should walk right in.

1214
00:56:20,955 --> 00:56:21,225
Right.

1215
00:56:21,225 --> 00:56:24,405
And I'm talking about a horse that would
be really troubled on something like that,

1216
00:56:24,405 --> 00:56:30,645
but it, if you do your job and you leave
them at the right place and you didn't

1217
00:56:30,645 --> 00:56:35,025
physically do it, you taught them how
to do it, every session will get better.

1218
00:56:35,385 --> 00:56:41,355
So, like, uh, Joe's, uh, Joseph's at
Rode of the Horse, his colt was kind of

1219
00:56:41,355 --> 00:56:46,005
a stuck little guy, not super forward,
and really struggled on being free.

1220
00:56:46,935 --> 00:56:51,495
Able to just travel and go like
didn't, wasn't really on that.

1221
00:56:51,555 --> 00:56:57,435
And um, that was, uh, there was something
there that I think just flew over the

1222
00:56:57,435 --> 00:57:05,715
heads of a lot of people to me, getting
a horse free, this is a good example of

1223
00:57:05,745 --> 00:57:10,905
kind what we're talking about, getting
a horse free, um, physically is a

1224
00:57:10,905 --> 00:57:13,155
state of mind, not a speed or a gate.

1225
00:57:14,115 --> 00:57:17,205
So like if, just because a
horse loping doesn't mean that

1226
00:57:17,205 --> 00:57:19,515
they're free, like, uh, mentally.

1227
00:57:20,085 --> 00:57:25,575
And so you can work on getting a horse
to elope from a stop to a just movement.

1228
00:57:25,725 --> 00:57:26,715
And that's what we were doing.

1229
00:57:26,715 --> 00:57:28,785
Like when he got on it.

1230
00:57:28,785 --> 00:57:32,085
There was lots of baby steps
of understanding there.

1231
00:57:32,625 --> 00:57:36,375
And, uh, by the end of that session, um.

1232
00:57:37,005 --> 00:57:37,965
I'm in the round pin.

1233
00:57:37,965 --> 00:57:39,585
I, I, I remember it clear as day.

1234
00:57:39,585 --> 00:57:43,785
I'm in the round pin, I'm helping Joe, and
there was a couple times where he'd ask

1235
00:57:43,785 --> 00:57:48,885
her to go and then I'd kind of back him up
and that horse like started really smooth

1236
00:57:49,275 --> 00:57:52,935
and then, and then ended just licking
his lips and just trotting his soft, and

1237
00:57:52,935 --> 00:57:55,095
it's free mentally that horse had it.

1238
00:57:55,485 --> 00:57:57,045
So I'm like, sweet Joe, we're done.

1239
00:57:57,075 --> 00:57:57,855
Like, we gotta quit.

1240
00:57:57,855 --> 00:58:01,995
Like she, if we end her
thinking and feeling that way

1241
00:58:02,235 --> 00:58:03,345
tomorrow, she's gonna be better.

1242
00:58:03,345 --> 00:58:06,765
And sure enough, tomorrow, the next
day she was quite a bit better.

1243
00:58:07,125 --> 00:58:11,895
And then as a horse learns, like they're
gonna have their ups, their downs and

1244
00:58:11,895 --> 00:58:13,545
like, it's, it's like this on the way up.

1245
00:58:13,545 --> 00:58:13,845
Right.

1246
00:58:14,325 --> 00:58:18,825
So the next day, because we left her so
good, she started out like nailing it.

1247
00:58:19,005 --> 00:58:19,125
Yeah.

1248
00:58:19,155 --> 00:58:22,425
But she still had to go through her cult
moment where in the middle of that ride

1249
00:58:22,665 --> 00:58:26,265
she kind of went back and she's like,
I need, I don't know if this is really.

1250
00:58:26,655 --> 00:58:30,975
What I think it is, I'm gonna try my
deal again and see about getting stuck.

1251
00:58:30,975 --> 00:58:34,785
And she got stuck in the middle
and then we left her, uh,

1252
00:58:34,875 --> 00:58:36,825
mentally in a good place again.

1253
00:58:37,365 --> 00:58:45,225
So he hadn't loped his horse, uh,
by himself in the saddle one time.

1254
00:58:45,225 --> 00:58:51,945
Then in the finals, um, he goes, rides it
in the round pin goes for his rail work.

1255
00:58:51,945 --> 00:58:53,775
He's got to declare a elope.

1256
00:58:53,925 --> 00:58:54,105
Yeah.

1257
00:58:54,255 --> 00:58:55,065
Across the side.

1258
00:58:55,365 --> 00:58:57,075
He asked that horse, was it free?

1259
00:58:57,255 --> 00:58:58,275
It was the freest horse there.

1260
00:58:58,545 --> 00:58:58,755
Yeah.

1261
00:58:59,085 --> 00:59:03,285
And he's never loped it in the
saddle and freeness, isn't it?

1262
00:59:04,005 --> 00:59:08,085
We taught that horse how to do it, but
it, it could get overlooked because

1263
00:59:08,115 --> 00:59:12,525
there wasn't the motion, but it was
the thought we were teaching and that's

1264
00:59:12,525 --> 00:59:13,815
the fruits of our labor right there.

1265
00:59:14,265 --> 00:59:18,405
So like versus, you know, you'll
see some, some other things,

1266
00:59:18,405 --> 00:59:21,675
especially in this competition if
you get caught up thinking it's.

1267
00:59:22,305 --> 00:59:26,325
Getting a horse free and moving
is a physical thing, and you're

1268
00:59:26,325 --> 00:59:27,674
just chasing a physical thing.

1269
00:59:28,214 --> 00:59:30,345
After a while, you can see
those horses shut down.

1270
00:59:30,495 --> 00:59:30,855
Yes.

1271
00:59:30,855 --> 00:59:32,234
And that's, that's what we're seeing.

1272
00:59:32,835 --> 00:59:34,904
So that's when someone's
washing and they go, Ooh, that

1273
00:59:34,904 --> 00:59:36,285
horse looks like glazed over.

1274
00:59:36,315 --> 00:59:36,524
Yep.

1275
00:59:36,674 --> 00:59:40,665
It's because they're, the attention has
been made to the body, not the mind.

1276
00:59:40,904 --> 00:59:41,265
Yeah.

1277
00:59:41,265 --> 00:59:47,625
Or, or, um, a good thing is turning
into a bad thing, like what was good

1278
00:59:47,625 --> 00:59:54,975
to move out because we, we want things
for our selfish things to, to get.

1279
00:59:55,380 --> 00:59:56,670
You know, we think, oh, I gotta elope.

1280
00:59:56,670 --> 00:59:57,300
I gotta do this.

1281
00:59:57,480 --> 00:59:59,190
This is for me, for me, for me, for me.

1282
00:59:59,400 --> 01:00:02,370
You miss the fact that that horse
is genuinely trying really hard.

1283
01:00:02,730 --> 01:00:05,880
And he's like, man, what
I, it's never enough.

1284
01:00:06,030 --> 01:00:06,630
It's never enough.

1285
01:00:06,630 --> 01:00:06,960
I quit.

1286
01:00:07,380 --> 01:00:08,430
And that's where they shut down.

1287
01:00:08,430 --> 01:00:08,520
Mm-hmm.

1288
01:00:08,760 --> 01:00:10,260
And then they start trying new things.

1289
01:00:10,260 --> 01:00:12,180
Like, maybe I'm gonna buck with a saddle.

1290
01:00:12,360 --> 01:00:13,890
Uh, maybe I'm gonna buck with a rider.

1291
01:00:14,160 --> 01:00:15,330
Maybe I'm gonna rub on the fence.

1292
01:00:15,330 --> 01:00:20,010
Like, because he tried before
to some degree, and he didn't

1293
01:00:20,010 --> 01:00:21,120
feel like that was enough.

1294
01:00:21,390 --> 01:00:25,050
He, in his mind, he felt like,
man, it's never enough with you.

1295
01:00:25,410 --> 01:00:26,400
I guess I'm on my own.

1296
01:00:26,970 --> 01:00:27,840
I'm on my own.

1297
01:00:28,380 --> 01:00:31,950
Maybe I'm gonna, you know,
start ragging my head.

1298
01:00:31,950 --> 01:00:33,120
Maybe I'm gonna start
bucking a little bit.

1299
01:00:33,120 --> 01:00:33,600
And that's where

1300
01:00:33,600 --> 01:00:34,620
we ruin the try.

1301
01:00:34,710 --> 01:00:35,550
That's where you ruin the try.

1302
01:00:35,550 --> 01:00:35,790
'cause we're

1303
01:00:35,790 --> 01:00:36,420
being greedy.

1304
01:00:36,570 --> 01:00:38,700
Yep, yep, yep.

1305
01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:40,320
And I'm not saying I've never done it.

1306
01:00:40,535 --> 01:00:42,360
I, I mean, I know a lot about
it because I've done it.

1307
01:00:42,510 --> 01:00:42,960
Same.

1308
01:00:43,320 --> 01:00:45,630
I was just thinking, I was like, I
can think of moments, I've been greedy

1309
01:00:45,660 --> 01:00:46,110
for sure.

1310
01:00:46,455 --> 01:00:49,605
Like, and, and as long as I
think it's good to talk about,

1311
01:00:49,605 --> 01:00:53,115
because then we can look back and
we can think of those moments.

1312
01:00:53,145 --> 01:00:53,265
Yeah.

1313
01:00:53,265 --> 01:00:59,415
And you know, that's where a horse
feels, uh, I don't ever want my horse

1314
01:00:59,415 --> 01:01:04,485
to feel like I don't recognize when
they're giving an effort or trying.

1315
01:01:05,595 --> 01:01:09,315
Um, because once they shut
down there, it's really hard.

1316
01:01:09,825 --> 01:01:10,395
Really hard.

1317
01:01:10,395 --> 01:01:10,455
Yeah.

1318
01:01:10,695 --> 01:01:15,945
Like I, some of the hardest horses
that I've worked with are ones that

1319
01:01:15,945 --> 01:01:19,485
have been trained 'cause they've
been trained to do not to think.

1320
01:01:19,785 --> 01:01:21,135
And that does, that's hard for me.

1321
01:01:21,135 --> 01:01:21,705
And it's hard.

1322
01:01:22,065 --> 01:01:23,235
They're such a callous there.

1323
01:01:23,235 --> 01:01:23,745
It, yeah.

1324
01:01:23,745 --> 01:01:26,145
The horse might physically do
things, but if they don't think

1325
01:01:26,145 --> 01:01:27,405
it's just, it's so different.

1326
01:01:28,005 --> 01:01:28,815
It's so different.

1327
01:01:29,235 --> 01:01:33,675
Um, and so, and I'm not saying it
doesn't work 'cause it does work

1328
01:01:33,675 --> 01:01:35,295
for some people to a certain extent.

1329
01:01:35,295 --> 01:01:35,805
It does.

1330
01:01:35,865 --> 01:01:36,345
It does.

1331
01:01:36,470 --> 01:01:36,761
Like it

1332
01:01:36,766 --> 01:01:37,875
works on paper.

1333
01:01:37,965 --> 01:01:38,355
Yeah.

1334
01:01:38,415 --> 01:01:38,715
You know.

1335
01:01:38,775 --> 01:01:39,015
Yeah.

1336
01:01:39,345 --> 01:01:42,160
But there's something, I feel like when
you start to see the difference mm-hmm.

1337
01:01:42,160 --> 01:01:43,995
When you start to, you
can feel the difference.

1338
01:01:43,995 --> 01:01:44,640
You can't unsee it.

1339
01:01:44,819 --> 01:01:45,799
You can't unsee

1340
01:01:45,799 --> 01:01:46,634
it, you can't unsee it.

1341
01:01:46,875 --> 01:01:47,085
Yep.

1342
01:01:48,435 --> 01:01:50,865
Also, and I'm not saying
I gotta figure it out.

1343
01:01:50,924 --> 01:01:51,134
Mm-hmm.

1344
01:01:51,134 --> 01:01:52,814
But that's, this is where
I'm working towards.

1345
01:01:52,814 --> 01:01:53,115
Right.

1346
01:01:53,205 --> 01:01:54,555
But that's what this podcast is about.

1347
01:01:54,555 --> 01:01:54,856
Right, right.

1348
01:01:55,035 --> 01:01:57,765
Is to talk about, is to be honest mm-hmm.

1349
01:01:57,765 --> 01:01:58,785
About the process.

1350
01:01:58,785 --> 01:01:59,085
Mm-hmm.

1351
01:01:59,339 --> 01:02:04,395
And then to be able to find all our
different language around, because it

1352
01:02:04,395 --> 01:02:09,194
makes me think as we're talking, I'm
thinking how important it is for us

1353
01:02:09,194 --> 01:02:16,245
as riders or as horsemen or as horse
women, to understand what we are trying

1354
01:02:16,245 --> 01:02:19,904
to do and why before we even do it.

1355
01:02:19,904 --> 01:02:19,995
Mm-hmm.

1356
01:02:20,444 --> 01:02:21,165
In some ways.

1357
01:02:21,169 --> 01:02:21,240
Mm-hmm.

1358
01:02:21,345 --> 01:02:24,585
Because when we talk about having the
horse's mind and having the horse's body,

1359
01:02:24,765 --> 01:02:28,095
I actually think about a lot of aspects
of riding being, having the rider's

1360
01:02:28,095 --> 01:02:29,625
body, but not having the rider's mind.

1361
01:02:29,629 --> 01:02:29,799
Mm-hmm.

1362
01:02:29,895 --> 01:02:32,924
And that's where we kind
of become methodical.

1363
01:02:32,984 --> 01:02:33,105
Mm-hmm.

1364
01:02:33,225 --> 01:02:34,484
Is because we actually don't.

1365
01:02:34,830 --> 01:02:39,990
Maybe understand the depth of what
we're trying to achieve and why, why?

1366
01:02:40,530 --> 01:02:42,630
So if we don't have our own mind

1367
01:02:42,780 --> 01:02:42,870
mm-hmm.

1368
01:02:44,460 --> 01:02:46,890
Then how can we Right.

1369
01:02:47,130 --> 01:02:48,840
Find that depth with our horses.

1370
01:02:48,840 --> 01:02:49,140
Yeah.

1371
01:02:49,380 --> 01:02:49,950
A hundred percent.

1372
01:02:50,220 --> 01:02:58,230
And so, like, I, I am really big
on, it's, it's uh, like attention

1373
01:02:58,230 --> 01:03:00,990
to detail and being better.

1374
01:03:01,290 --> 01:03:03,600
Like, it, it starts with the
way you feed your horses and the

1375
01:03:03,600 --> 01:03:05,850
way you take care of your barn.

1376
01:03:06,450 --> 01:03:14,070
Like for me, like, I'll get young people
in and like, I know they're thinking, man,

1377
01:03:14,340 --> 01:03:16,410
I, I wanna be able to ride that horse.

1378
01:03:16,530 --> 01:03:18,240
I'm gonna be able to
ride this horse, do this.

1379
01:03:18,930 --> 01:03:26,100
And, and I'll, I'll tell 'em like, I can't
trust you to ride a six figure horse.

1380
01:03:26,415 --> 01:03:31,095
If I can't trust you to adjust
the feed ration to a horse that's

1381
01:03:31,095 --> 01:03:32,384
skinny versus a horse that's fat.

1382
01:03:32,384 --> 01:03:36,795
Like if you, if you, if you can't make
those adjustments to the feed, to the

1383
01:03:36,795 --> 01:03:41,895
feed, it, it's, it might be, might
be super minor or if I can't, if I

1384
01:03:41,895 --> 01:03:45,765
can't, if you're gonna leave halter's
laying around the ranch and you're not

1385
01:03:45,765 --> 01:03:50,325
gonna pay attention to that detail,
how, how can you pay attention to the,

1386
01:03:50,595 --> 01:03:54,105
the, the smallest little detail that's
not even physical in front of you?

1387
01:03:54,315 --> 01:04:00,134
How, and so like, I think you can
train, you've gotta train your mind to

1388
01:04:00,134 --> 01:04:05,685
be disciplined in things that take no
talent, to take it to the things that take

1389
01:04:05,685 --> 01:04:09,405
incredibly, like, it's so, it's so small.

1390
01:04:09,765 --> 01:04:10,605
It's so small.

1391
01:04:11,265 --> 01:04:12,735
And like, to me that's a big deal.

1392
01:04:13,095 --> 01:04:16,485
Um, maybe I'm crazy, but I,
I feel like that is huge.

1393
01:04:17,430 --> 01:04:17,700
Right.

1394
01:04:18,029 --> 01:04:18,330
No.

1395
01:04:18,330 --> 01:04:19,860
As you're talking, I'm thinking of Mr.

1396
01:04:19,860 --> 01:04:21,150
Miyagi and Karate Kit.

1397
01:04:21,150 --> 01:04:21,660
You know, wax,

1398
01:04:21,660 --> 01:04:22,440
that is so funny.

1399
01:04:22,440 --> 01:04:23,700
'cause that's what my help says.

1400
01:04:24,090 --> 01:04:26,340
They're like, Nick, well
Mr. Miyagi you to death.

1401
01:04:26,850 --> 01:04:28,350
Like, 'cause it, it,

1402
01:04:28,560 --> 01:04:28,920
yeah.

1403
01:04:28,980 --> 01:04:29,700
That's so funny.

1404
01:04:29,700 --> 01:04:29,910
You said

1405
01:04:29,910 --> 01:04:32,490
you're missing, you're
like, Mr. Miyagi the

1406
01:04:32,490 --> 01:04:32,730
world.

1407
01:04:32,765 --> 01:04:32,924
I am.

1408
01:04:33,565 --> 01:04:33,685
I

1409
01:04:33,685 --> 01:04:34,125
love that.

1410
01:04:34,685 --> 01:04:34,805
Yeah.

1411
01:04:35,355 --> 01:04:36,205
Because that, my

1412
01:04:36,245 --> 01:04:37,205
help is gonna laugh at that

1413
01:04:37,529 --> 01:04:41,970
because it's, well, I love, I mean clearly
then it's true because if, if, if people

1414
01:04:41,970 --> 01:04:42,750
who've never met each other mm-hmm.

1415
01:04:42,990 --> 01:04:46,830
Refer to that, then I think, 'cause
what it, what it reminds me of is you're

1416
01:04:46,830 --> 01:04:50,100
saying that, and as you're saying that
my whole, I'm just like smiling from

1417
01:04:50,100 --> 01:04:55,020
year to year, because I don't think you
understand that when you're young and

1418
01:04:55,200 --> 01:04:56,970
you're maybe a little bit more ego driven.

1419
01:04:56,970 --> 01:04:58,005
I know that I was mm-hmm.

1420
01:04:58,085 --> 01:04:58,205
Yeah.

1421
01:04:58,225 --> 01:05:00,495
You know, same, you know, like,
you just, you wanna do same, you

1422
01:05:00,495 --> 01:05:02,220
same do, do do, do same, right?

1423
01:05:02,340 --> 01:05:02,460
Mm-hmm.

1424
01:05:02,940 --> 01:05:06,210
And I think it comes from a
place of wanting to feel seen.

1425
01:05:06,210 --> 01:05:06,330
Mm-hmm.

1426
01:05:06,570 --> 01:05:10,560
You wanna be, you wanna be recognized, you
want to like, you wanna prove yourself.

1427
01:05:10,620 --> 01:05:12,299
And those are all really important.

1428
01:05:12,305 --> 01:05:13,565
There are really important attributes.

1429
01:05:13,575 --> 01:05:14,040
They're really important attributes.

1430
01:05:14,040 --> 01:05:14,730
Mm-hmm.

1431
01:05:14,736 --> 01:05:14,845
And.

1432
01:05:16,050 --> 01:05:20,340
I love, you're like, that's like
such a dope call to action, Nick.

1433
01:05:20,340 --> 01:05:24,060
Like, care about where you place
the halters, care about your

1434
01:05:24,060 --> 01:05:29,640
food, Russians care about how you
run things from A to Z. Mm-hmm.

1435
01:05:29,880 --> 01:05:29,881
Mm-hmm.

1436
01:05:29,887 --> 01:05:33,450
Because they inform every aspect a
hundred when you're in the saddle.

1437
01:05:34,410 --> 01:05:34,442
A hundred percent.

1438
01:05:34,442 --> 01:05:34,443
Yeah.

1439
01:05:34,448 --> 01:05:38,130
And it's not that I'm OCD this
or like, it's gotta be perfect.

1440
01:05:38,340 --> 01:05:40,920
No, it doesn't have to be perfect, but
it needs to, it needs to be in order.

1441
01:05:41,725 --> 01:05:49,200
You, you have to be like, disciplined
of doing the things is huge.

1442
01:05:49,710 --> 01:05:50,010
Right.

1443
01:05:50,070 --> 01:05:52,051
Like you, you, they're huge to me.

1444
01:05:53,174 --> 01:05:57,254
What on that vein, what do you see that
sometimes the horse world overlooks

1445
01:05:57,254 --> 01:06:00,464
that is actually really important
in terms of whole horsemanship?

1446
01:06:00,464 --> 01:06:05,865
If we're looking at from sundown to, you
know, from sun up to sundown, horsemanship

1447
01:06:06,044 --> 01:06:10,785
as a way of life, just not something you
do, but something that you are, what is

1448
01:06:10,785 --> 01:06:14,145
something that you think people might
overlook when you, in that miss from Mr.

1449
01:06:14,145 --> 01:06:14,714
Miyagi?

1450
01:06:15,254 --> 01:06:18,944
What is something that people
overlook that really informs,

1451
01:06:19,185 --> 01:06:24,075
I'm really big on just like, just
noticing things like is huge.

1452
01:06:24,315 --> 01:06:30,645
Like, I don't know, just the ability
to notice something from a distance

1453
01:06:31,725 --> 01:06:36,254
that I just, the ability to observe,
remember, and compare and notice

1454
01:06:36,254 --> 01:06:41,384
things like, 'cause like notice,
remember, observe, remember compare.

1455
01:06:41,654 --> 01:06:41,955
Cool.

1456
01:06:41,955 --> 01:06:44,565
That's the Tom Dorrance deal
is observe, remember, compare.

1457
01:06:44,865 --> 01:06:46,455
Um, like that's huge.

1458
01:06:46,754 --> 01:06:48,734
Like, just like for me.

1459
01:06:50,580 --> 01:06:55,200
I'll be riding in the arena and there
could be a horse at my, like, up in, in

1460
01:06:55,200 --> 01:07:00,330
the barn a long ways away, and I'll be
like, wow, it's you guys just fed a half

1461
01:07:00,330 --> 01:07:01,740
an hour ago and that horse is laying down.

1462
01:07:01,740 --> 01:07:03,120
Go, go see what's going on right there.

1463
01:07:03,215 --> 01:07:03,295
Hmm.

1464
01:07:03,570 --> 01:07:04,830
Like he shouldn't be
laying down right now.

1465
01:07:05,160 --> 01:07:06,570
Like he just got fed a half an hour ago.

1466
01:07:07,140 --> 01:07:09,900
20 other horses are up eating,
why is he laying there?

1467
01:07:10,020 --> 01:07:11,670
Like, just to be able to
seed things like that.

1468
01:07:12,090 --> 01:07:17,310
So like, to me, to be able to spot that
is learned by being able to be like,

1469
01:07:17,490 --> 01:07:18,779
I better not leave that brush there.

1470
01:07:18,779 --> 01:07:20,190
I'm gonna throw that in a basket today.

1471
01:07:20,370 --> 01:07:26,070
Like, just being little things that
are out of order or, um, and it, this

1472
01:07:26,070 --> 01:07:29,370
is gonna make it sound like I'm like
a clean freak, but I'm really not.

1473
01:07:29,549 --> 01:07:32,759
I just, I just notice those things.

1474
01:07:32,759 --> 01:07:37,140
Like being able to notice that is
gonna lead you to be a better horseman.

1475
01:07:37,140 --> 01:07:40,320
Because you'll notice that horse
that's laying down a little earlier

1476
01:07:40,320 --> 01:07:42,540
than normal or, or that's normal.

1477
01:07:42,600 --> 01:07:44,130
Hey, that's, that's old foot.

1478
01:07:44,130 --> 01:07:45,420
He's, he always lays down quick.

1479
01:07:45,870 --> 01:07:46,020
Mm-hmm.

1480
01:07:46,320 --> 01:07:48,031
Like, that's huge to me.

1481
01:07:49,005 --> 01:07:52,725
Oh, I mean, I guess being able to
observe, remember comparison is huge.

1482
01:07:53,540 --> 01:07:54,020
I love that.

1483
01:07:56,205 --> 01:07:56,265
Yeah.

1484
01:07:56,265 --> 01:07:58,815
So there's one question I
wanted that I think actually my

1485
01:07:58,815 --> 01:08:00,315
whole team wanted to ask you.

1486
01:08:00,375 --> 01:08:00,435
Oh,

1487
01:08:00,435 --> 01:08:00,525
geez.

1488
01:08:01,485 --> 01:08:06,735
Which was, for English writers, are
those in performance focused spaces?

1489
01:08:07,425 --> 01:08:11,505
What do you think they could
borrow from the cowboy mindset

1490
01:08:16,515 --> 01:08:19,904
that would, that's actually hard for
me to speak on because I don't know

1491
01:08:19,904 --> 01:08:21,765
anything about the English world.

1492
01:08:22,305 --> 01:08:28,185
So I, I, I, I, that's, I don't
know, because it would be, I don't.

1493
01:08:28,589 --> 01:08:31,889
Like, I have no experience
there, like none.

1494
01:08:32,490 --> 01:08:35,879
Um, when I hear that, I think,
what could I borrow from there?

1495
01:08:36,179 --> 01:08:38,099
Um, more than I think the other way.

1496
01:08:38,879 --> 01:08:40,589
What could, do you have an idea of
what you could borrow from them?

1497
01:08:40,589 --> 01:08:40,709
I,

1498
01:08:40,769 --> 01:08:42,839
no, because I, I'm so ignorant on it.

1499
01:08:42,929 --> 01:08:43,019
Like,

1500
01:08:45,299 --> 01:08:46,589
I don't know, that'd
be hard for me to say.

1501
01:08:46,620 --> 01:08:46,740
Isn't

1502
01:08:46,740 --> 01:08:51,359
that a fascinating part of our industry
or the, of the horse world, is that we, we

1503
01:08:51,359 --> 01:08:53,819
all have this common thread and this love.

1504
01:08:53,879 --> 01:08:54,029
Mm-hmm.

1505
01:08:54,269 --> 01:08:55,319
And you're not alone.

1506
01:08:55,319 --> 01:09:00,179
Like, I have had Olympians in this studio
from the, from English disciplines that

1507
01:09:00,389 --> 01:09:05,490
have very little to Absolutely no, you
know, they would've fumbled over, like,

1508
01:09:05,519 --> 01:09:06,660
they would've been like, what's a snaffle?

1509
01:09:06,660 --> 01:09:08,009
Bit futurity, right?

1510
01:09:08,040 --> 01:09:08,219
Yep.

1511
01:09:08,609 --> 01:09:12,299
And yet here we are, this entire,
this incredible industry or this

1512
01:09:12,299 --> 01:09:15,179
world, I call it the horse world
more than me in the industry.

1513
01:09:15,899 --> 01:09:18,450
We have the horse world where
we all share this common thing.

1514
01:09:18,450 --> 01:09:21,120
We all love horses and we all
do different things with horses.

1515
01:09:21,120 --> 01:09:23,281
But we all fundamentally
started, I think, mm-hmm.

1516
01:09:23,314 --> 01:09:24,479
With the same.

1517
01:09:24,569 --> 01:09:24,660
Yes.

1518
01:09:25,259 --> 01:09:26,279
Core feeling.

1519
01:09:26,370 --> 01:09:26,549
Yeah.

1520
01:09:26,549 --> 01:09:27,179
There's so menace.

1521
01:09:27,240 --> 01:09:27,420
Yeah.

1522
01:09:27,540 --> 01:09:27,929
Right.

1523
01:09:28,080 --> 01:09:30,479
And yet I feel like we're
like world worlds apart.

1524
01:09:30,569 --> 01:09:30,840
Yeah.

1525
01:09:30,840 --> 01:09:31,859
You're like worlds apart.

1526
01:09:32,099 --> 01:09:36,689
And it's, it, I'm kind
of fascinated by that.

1527
01:09:36,929 --> 01:09:37,019
Mm-hmm.

1528
01:09:37,259 --> 01:09:37,375
You know what I mean?

1529
01:09:37,375 --> 01:09:40,889
Because I don't know if other
sports or other lifestyles,

1530
01:09:40,889 --> 01:09:41,939
'cause we're both, we're a sport.

1531
01:09:42,000 --> 01:09:42,840
Do you agree with that?

1532
01:09:42,929 --> 01:09:44,519
That we're both a sport and a lifestyle.

1533
01:09:44,519 --> 01:09:45,090
Mm-hmm.

1534
01:09:45,484 --> 01:09:45,774
Yeah.

1535
01:09:45,884 --> 01:09:46,535
Yeah, yeah.

1536
01:09:46,620 --> 01:09:47,670
Like, uh, subculture.

1537
01:09:47,670 --> 01:09:47,939
Yeah.

1538
01:09:48,569 --> 01:09:48,899
Right.

1539
01:09:48,899 --> 01:09:51,269
And we're like a culture, like
it's like a culture, a lifestyle,

1540
01:09:51,269 --> 01:09:52,620
and a sport all at the same time.

1541
01:09:52,649 --> 01:09:52,799
Yeah.

1542
01:09:52,979 --> 01:09:53,309
Right.

1543
01:09:53,549 --> 01:09:57,000
And yet there'll be, you can be like,
it's like having two tribes on two

1544
01:09:57,000 --> 01:09:58,740
ends of the other side of the world.

1545
01:09:58,769 --> 01:09:58,860
Mm-hmm.

1546
01:09:59,099 --> 01:10:00,509
That actually have a lot in common.

1547
01:10:00,570 --> 01:10:00,750
Right.

1548
01:10:00,750 --> 01:10:02,695
But they may have never interacted before.

1549
01:10:02,910 --> 01:10:03,179
Yeah.

1550
01:10:03,330 --> 01:10:03,630
That's

1551
01:10:03,929 --> 01:10:04,650
I'm, that's me.

1552
01:10:05,190 --> 01:10:06,120
Fascinating though.

1553
01:10:06,120 --> 01:10:06,360
No.

1554
01:10:06,420 --> 01:10:07,290
Yeah, it is.

1555
01:10:07,715 --> 01:10:07,934
It

1556
01:10:07,934 --> 01:10:08,094
is.

1557
01:10:08,605 --> 01:10:08,894
Yeah.

1558
01:10:09,325 --> 01:10:09,615
Yeah.

1559
01:10:09,674 --> 01:10:10,215
It really is.

1560
01:10:10,410 --> 01:10:12,540
Well then maybe, let me
rephrase the question.

1561
01:10:13,019 --> 01:10:16,500
What could the rest of the world
borrow from the cowboy mindset?

1562
01:10:16,860 --> 01:10:19,290
What could the world borrow
from the cowboy mindset?

1563
01:10:23,415 --> 01:10:30,405
Um, I don't know if it's if it's
a, a cowboy deal or if it's just,

1564
01:10:32,835 --> 01:10:37,515
I don't know the way I was raised or what,
but like to me they, the question was

1565
01:10:37,515 --> 01:10:38,775
what, what does it mean to be a cowboy?

1566
01:10:38,775 --> 01:10:41,205
And this'll kind of segue to
what does it mean to be a cowboy?

1567
01:10:41,235 --> 01:10:45,495
So like, for me, it's kind of where I
started this, like, it's just integrity

1568
01:10:45,555 --> 01:10:50,805
and just, you know, being a good person,
all those skills, like, to me like that's,

1569
01:10:51,434 --> 01:10:56,925
that's cowboy like, um, and I think o
overwhelmingly like that's pretty true.

1570
01:10:56,925 --> 01:10:57,135
Yeah.

1571
01:10:57,135 --> 01:11:00,434
People, people are people and you know,
you're gonna have that days and whatever,

1572
01:11:00,434 --> 01:11:05,745
but, um, like to me that's being, being
a cowboy, like, it, it's like, like

1573
01:11:05,745 --> 01:11:07,605
you spoke about, uh, the ranch kids.

1574
01:11:07,605 --> 01:11:09,255
Like they're just, there's
something different.

1575
01:11:09,255 --> 01:11:11,474
Like, to me that's, that's cowboy culture.

1576
01:11:11,474 --> 01:11:12,015
That's cowboy.

1577
01:11:12,285 --> 01:11:12,345
Yeah.

1578
01:11:12,375 --> 01:11:14,655
Um, it's all skill set aside.

1579
01:11:15,165 --> 01:11:17,684
To me that's, that's cowboy cowboys like.

1580
01:11:18,840 --> 01:11:26,670
This being, being that, like, being
that and like, uh, for Joe, uh, like

1581
01:11:26,670 --> 01:11:28,355
the Mr. Miyagi deal, Joseph, he mm-hmm.

1582
01:11:28,440 --> 01:11:29,130
He worked for me.

1583
01:11:29,130 --> 01:11:35,700
And, um, and so like, I feel like
his Mr. Miyagi lesson, this trip has

1584
01:11:35,700 --> 01:11:41,130
been, um, like we've been talking
a lot about just, you know, this is

1585
01:11:42,300 --> 01:11:47,490
probably the, the first time Joe's had
notoriety for what he's been doing for

1586
01:11:47,490 --> 01:11:49,410
years, but he's got notoriety for it.

1587
01:11:49,410 --> 01:11:53,009
And people come up and tell him how
good he's doing and things like that.

1588
01:11:53,009 --> 01:11:54,480
I'm like, that is awesome, Joe.

1589
01:11:54,480 --> 01:11:56,160
I like, don't use that for your ego.

1590
01:11:56,670 --> 01:11:59,849
Like, when somebody comes up to
you, like fill their cup, like fill

1591
01:11:59,849 --> 01:12:04,590
their cup and don't let them, you
know, don't dump into your ego.

1592
01:12:04,590 --> 01:12:06,090
Like use that to fill their cup.

1593
01:12:06,150 --> 01:12:10,620
Like, um, that's a, like,
that's a huge part of, of.

1594
01:12:11,445 --> 01:12:18,795
Leadership and, and being out there
to me is like, I, I want to, I wanna

1595
01:12:18,795 --> 01:12:20,325
fill their cup when they come to me.

1596
01:12:20,325 --> 01:12:21,825
Like I don't want them to dump into mine.

1597
01:12:21,855 --> 01:12:25,845
Like I, I've got enough self-confidence
and like, I, I'm secure in where I am.

1598
01:12:25,845 --> 01:12:30,225
I, I, it makes my day to make their day.

1599
01:12:30,885 --> 01:12:33,825
Like that's what Joe's Mr.
Miyagi lesson has been this week.

1600
01:12:33,855 --> 01:12:36,135
Like, you, you got the horsemanship
up, you're doing great.

1601
01:12:36,135 --> 01:12:39,615
Like, let's fill their, let's, let's
make their day when they come and talk

1602
01:12:39,615 --> 01:12:44,415
to you because of the, the way you make
'em feel invited and like all the things

1603
01:12:44,415 --> 01:12:46,545
that you do with your cult, let's do
that to the people that come to you.

1604
01:12:46,605 --> 01:12:48,315
Like that's his, oh, wow.

1605
01:12:48,375 --> 01:12:49,365
That's his Mr. Miyagi.

1606
01:12:50,054 --> 01:12:53,894
Like yesterday, it made my day somebody
come by the booth and we were chatting

1607
01:12:54,255 --> 01:12:58,184
and they said, uh, they, they reminded
me of something that I said in a

1608
01:12:58,184 --> 01:13:00,195
clinic five years ago, six years ago.

1609
01:13:00,405 --> 01:13:03,014
And they're like, yeah, we got, we
got your sticker on your fridge.

1610
01:13:03,165 --> 01:13:07,665
And I look at my wife, I was like, man,
you don't realize the impact that you have

1611
01:13:07,665 --> 01:13:10,545
on people in such a small little thing.

1612
01:13:10,545 --> 01:13:11,594
So it's, it's humbling.

1613
01:13:12,105 --> 01:13:12,795
It's an honor.

1614
01:13:12,945 --> 01:13:13,965
And I don't take it lightly.

1615
01:13:13,965 --> 01:13:18,465
And I put a lot of pressure on
myself to, um, fill their cup.

1616
01:13:19,605 --> 01:13:20,144
That's my goal.

1617
01:13:20,684 --> 01:13:20,924
Right.

1618
01:13:22,455 --> 01:13:22,634
Okay.

1619
01:13:22,634 --> 01:13:25,575
Can I reflect something as I'm
listening to you, I, I wonder

1620
01:13:25,575 --> 01:13:26,384
what you think about this.

1621
01:13:26,384 --> 01:13:28,245
I'm gonna reflect back
to you what I think.

1622
01:13:28,605 --> 01:13:28,634
Okay.

1623
01:13:29,625 --> 01:13:32,355
Now I'm starting to understand
a bit about the Cowboy way.

1624
01:13:32,625 --> 01:13:32,865
Yep.

1625
01:13:34,215 --> 01:13:37,965
And it feeds into this, what I've
observed in ranch kids, which is.

1626
01:13:39,060 --> 01:13:44,490
From sun up to sundown, you are in
service to something other than yourself.

1627
01:13:44,550 --> 01:13:44,730
Yeah.

1628
01:13:45,360 --> 01:13:48,060
And there's a level, you talk
about, you know, humility,

1629
01:13:48,060 --> 01:13:49,650
you talk about responsibility.

1630
01:13:49,655 --> 01:13:49,835
Mm-hmm.

1631
01:13:49,915 --> 01:13:51,270
You talk about being a good person,

1632
01:13:53,430 --> 01:13:59,075
there is this inherent energy
of responsibility mm-hmm.

1633
01:13:59,785 --> 01:14:01,470
That I feel in cowboys.

1634
01:14:01,500 --> 01:14:02,315
Yep, yep.

1635
01:14:02,320 --> 01:14:06,060
There is a, and you talk about like your
daughter, you know, she's responsible

1636
01:14:06,060 --> 01:14:08,700
for feeding five, 600 head of cattle.

1637
01:14:09,450 --> 01:14:13,080
There is an inherent level
of responsibility for

1638
01:14:13,080 --> 01:14:14,760
something other than yourself.

1639
01:14:14,760 --> 01:14:15,000
Yep.

1640
01:14:15,450 --> 01:14:19,620
Which I now under, I'm starting
to understand why it is.

1641
01:14:19,620 --> 01:14:24,180
So maybe in some ways romanticized
in some ways, beautiful.

1642
01:14:24,180 --> 01:14:27,750
In some ways, alluring in
some ways captured mm-hmm.

1643
01:14:28,020 --> 01:14:31,590
By modern society, because I would
argue that society has never been

1644
01:14:31,590 --> 01:14:33,300
more selfish than it is right now.

1645
01:14:33,300 --> 01:14:33,600
Right.

1646
01:14:34,050 --> 01:14:34,290
Right.

1647
01:14:34,770 --> 01:14:34,980
Yep.

1648
01:14:35,715 --> 01:14:35,985
Yeah.

1649
01:14:36,210 --> 01:14:37,965
I, I think you're onto it for sure.

1650
01:14:38,325 --> 01:14:40,635
So the cowboy is the antidote

1651
01:14:40,875 --> 01:14:41,235
Yes.

1652
01:14:41,805 --> 01:14:45,765
To the hyper independence
of modern society.

1653
01:14:45,765 --> 01:14:45,945
Yeah.

1654
01:14:46,425 --> 01:14:51,285
It's the, no, I wake up and I am
in service to the lives of others.

1655
01:14:51,345 --> 01:14:51,585
Yeah.

1656
01:14:51,585 --> 01:14:53,025
Lives, lives of others.

1657
01:14:53,025 --> 01:14:53,265
Yeah.

1658
01:14:53,295 --> 01:14:55,725
That's, that's, that's the goal, right?

1659
01:14:55,725 --> 01:14:58,755
And, and all this stuff that
I've talked about today.

1660
01:14:59,835 --> 01:15:04,005
It's not, I'm, this is
what I'm striving for.

1661
01:15:04,005 --> 01:15:07,425
Like, it's not like I, I would hope
in a year we come back and I'd,

1662
01:15:07,485 --> 01:15:10,005
I'd be better at all these things.

1663
01:15:10,005 --> 01:15:10,275
Right?

1664
01:15:10,275 --> 01:15:11,925
Like it's, it's like the horse.

1665
01:15:11,925 --> 01:15:13,815
Like you never get too good at it.

1666
01:15:13,815 --> 01:15:18,765
And, um, authenticity and just being
authentic in the way that you go about it.

1667
01:15:18,795 --> 01:15:21,135
'cause you can try to fill
somebody's cup, inauthentically

1668
01:15:21,165 --> 01:15:22,335
and they will see it a mile away.

1669
01:15:23,925 --> 01:15:24,195
Right.

1670
01:15:24,795 --> 01:15:25,275
I love it.

1671
01:15:26,085 --> 01:15:27,015
It's a, it's a goal.

1672
01:15:27,015 --> 01:15:28,305
It's not a, it's not where I'm at.

1673
01:15:28,305 --> 01:15:29,655
It's a, all this stuff is a goal.

1674
01:15:30,015 --> 01:15:30,315
Yeah.

1675
01:15:30,525 --> 01:15:30,825
Yeah.

1676
01:15:32,235 --> 01:15:32,625
Okay.

1677
01:15:32,925 --> 01:15:33,465
I'm gonna.

1678
01:15:34,424 --> 01:15:41,085
Wrap up every episode like I always
do, and I'm very excited to hear, oh

1679
01:15:41,085 --> 01:15:43,455
geez, your answers to these questions.

1680
01:15:44,025 --> 01:15:44,295
Okay.

1681
01:15:45,525 --> 01:15:48,344
If you could read one book to the
horse world, what would it be?

1682
01:15:49,634 --> 01:15:51,434
One book to the horse world.

1683
01:15:51,915 --> 01:16:02,264
Well, I think everything we've talked
about today is, for me, it's my faith and

1684
01:16:02,264 --> 01:16:11,924
it's, it's, uh, you know, it's the way
it, it's, it's just the way that I'm, I

1685
01:16:11,924 --> 01:16:14,144
feel, led to lead my life through Christ.

1686
01:16:14,144 --> 01:16:19,905
So I would say like, the closer you
are to the creator of the being, the

1687
01:16:19,905 --> 01:16:25,424
animal we're trying to work with, the,
the, the easier it becomes, right?

1688
01:16:26,445 --> 01:16:26,775
Yeah.

1689
01:16:26,865 --> 01:16:30,585
Because all the ego, all the things
that we, we, we want to stay away

1690
01:16:30,585 --> 01:16:32,775
from, like, that's, that's not.

1691
01:16:33,765 --> 01:16:34,545
That's not the path.

1692
01:16:34,695 --> 01:16:34,935
Right.

1693
01:16:35,025 --> 01:16:37,605
So that, that's that'd be my answer.

1694
01:16:37,875 --> 01:16:38,805
So would it be the Bible?

1695
01:16:38,835 --> 01:16:39,585
It'd be the Bible, yeah.

1696
01:16:39,585 --> 01:16:45,705
It'd be faith, it'd be, it'd be Christ,
it'd be, that would be like, uh, yeah.

1697
01:16:46,065 --> 01:16:50,085
To die to self is gain, you know, to die
to the things of the flesh, to world.

1698
01:16:50,895 --> 01:16:52,515
The wins is gain.

1699
01:16:53,085 --> 01:16:53,385
Right.

1700
01:16:54,405 --> 01:16:54,975
That's beautiful.

1701
01:16:54,975 --> 01:16:56,805
That's, that's the base of it all.

1702
01:16:57,675 --> 01:16:58,725
Like for me,

1703
01:17:01,095 --> 01:17:04,245
who is the most iconic horse in history?

1704
01:17:05,865 --> 01:17:07,035
Uh, for me it's time for the diamond.

1705
01:17:07,425 --> 01:17:08,505
I mean, for me it is.

1706
01:17:08,925 --> 01:17:10,725
So, I mean, I, I don't know.

1707
01:17:11,025 --> 01:17:12,705
Uh, but for me it's time for the diamond.

1708
01:17:12,705 --> 01:17:20,385
'cause he, he, uh, you know, he, he let me
believe in myself before I really had the

1709
01:17:20,385 --> 01:17:22,935
resume to even think that I could belong.

1710
01:17:22,965 --> 01:17:25,845
He, he, he put me out
there with the big dog.

1711
01:17:25,845 --> 01:17:27,135
So for me it's time for the diamond.

1712
01:17:29,565 --> 01:17:32,835
What is the most undervalued
skill as a rider?

1713
01:17:34,514 --> 01:17:43,275
Um, the most undervalued skill as
a rider, I would say, maybe not

1714
01:17:43,275 --> 01:17:48,764
undervalued, but I would say like
just, I see so many people not thinking

1715
01:17:48,764 --> 01:17:50,025
and just going through the motions.

1716
01:17:50,715 --> 01:17:54,974
Like, not even like, uh, just
going through the motions.

1717
01:17:54,974 --> 01:18:00,795
Like, I'd say that is being able
to be present and observing.

1718
01:18:00,795 --> 01:18:06,195
Remembering and comparing like moment
to moment is everything to the horse.

1719
01:18:06,195 --> 01:18:07,995
'cause that's what
they're doing constantly.

1720
01:18:08,054 --> 01:18:09,165
They're not going through the motions.

1721
01:18:09,165 --> 01:18:12,974
Like you can teach 'em and you can, you
can teach 'em to go through the motions.

1722
01:18:12,974 --> 01:18:14,235
And a lot of people do, for sure.

1723
01:18:14,235 --> 01:18:15,105
A lot of people do.

1724
01:18:15,554 --> 01:18:18,375
You can teach 'em to go through the
motions, but I want them present.

1725
01:18:18,945 --> 01:18:21,884
And in order for them to be present,
I have to be present as well.

1726
01:18:22,035 --> 01:18:24,240
So that would be important to.

1727
01:18:25,560 --> 01:18:25,830
Yeah,

1728
01:18:25,980 --> 01:18:26,370
that's a good answer.

1729
01:18:28,440 --> 01:18:31,560
Who is the greatest horseman
or horse woman in history?

1730
01:18:32,220 --> 01:18:39,450
I, I would probably just, from what
I've heard, would lean towards Tom

1731
01:18:39,450 --> 01:18:40,980
Dorrance, just from what I've heard.

1732
01:18:40,980 --> 01:18:42,240
But I, I never met him.

1733
01:18:42,570 --> 01:18:47,760
Um, I've just got a window into who
he was through other interpretations,

1734
01:18:47,760 --> 01:18:52,200
other individual's assessment or
like interpretation of what Tom did.

1735
01:18:52,470 --> 01:18:57,510
Um, so I would say it
would probably be him.

1736
01:18:57,840 --> 01:19:06,600
Um, but in a lot of ways for me,
bill Van Norman was on another level.

1737
01:19:06,900 --> 01:19:07,350
Um.

1738
01:19:08,730 --> 01:19:11,219
As far as like, uh, he just got it.

1739
01:19:11,429 --> 01:19:13,919
Like he just got it and it
wasn't technique driven.

1740
01:19:13,919 --> 01:19:17,549
It was just like horses felt
a certain way around him and

1741
01:19:17,549 --> 01:19:18,870
they operated a certain way.

1742
01:19:18,870 --> 01:19:21,000
And like from Bill Van Norman was special.

1743
01:19:21,269 --> 01:19:23,940
He passed away, uh, quite a few years ago.

1744
01:19:24,059 --> 01:19:28,679
And I just, uh, I often think, I
wish I could see what he was doing

1745
01:19:29,219 --> 01:19:35,160
with the, the knowledge that I have
now or the experience I have now.

1746
01:19:35,160 --> 01:19:38,519
I wish I could see it again because
there was so much that was flying

1747
01:19:38,519 --> 01:19:40,290
over my head because it was so subtle.

1748
01:19:40,589 --> 01:19:43,620
Um, so he was pretty
special to me, um, that way.

1749
01:19:44,009 --> 01:19:48,089
And, you know, that's not to take anything
away from, from the other guys that helped

1750
01:19:48,089 --> 01:19:51,210
me, but, um, yeah, he was pretty special.

1751
01:19:53,339 --> 01:19:53,639
Actually.

1752
01:19:53,639 --> 01:19:55,799
Wanna ask you, I don't normally
ask him these rapid fire questions,

1753
01:19:55,799 --> 01:19:56,820
but I wanna ask you a question.

1754
01:19:57,809 --> 01:20:04,080
Do you think that there are people,
that horses just feel better around

1755
01:20:04,230 --> 01:20:04,679
a hundred percent.

1756
01:20:05,715 --> 01:20:06,615
Yeah, a hundred percent.

1757
01:20:06,620 --> 01:20:08,355
Because I feel like I've observed this.

1758
01:20:08,385 --> 01:20:08,474
Mm-hmm.

1759
01:20:09,045 --> 01:20:14,055
And I'm curious that if you,
if you feel that way too.

1760
01:20:14,144 --> 01:20:14,505
Oh yeah.

1761
01:20:14,595 --> 01:20:15,105
A hundred percent.

1762
01:20:15,555 --> 01:20:15,825
Yeah.

1763
01:20:15,885 --> 01:20:20,264
And like Bill was one of those,
one of those people like, and, but

1764
01:20:21,105 --> 01:20:25,695
I mean, I think it all goes back
to too, like he, he did the same

1765
01:20:25,695 --> 01:20:26,805
way with the people around him.

1766
01:20:27,465 --> 01:20:27,525
Hmm.

1767
01:20:28,065 --> 01:20:32,474
You know, he, he just made, he had
a way to make everybody from the

1768
01:20:32,474 --> 01:20:37,394
ranch cook to hire guy's girlfriend
coming to visit to make 'em feel

1769
01:20:37,394 --> 01:20:41,595
important and special and, and 'cause
he didn't need anything from him.

1770
01:20:41,715 --> 01:20:45,045
Like he was filling their cup and
he could do the same thing with

1771
01:20:45,045 --> 01:20:46,275
the horses around him for sure.

1772
01:20:46,785 --> 01:20:46,995
Yep.

1773
01:20:47,325 --> 01:20:52,275
So, I, I, yes, for sure, because
horses have a, a crazy way to,

1774
01:20:52,485 --> 01:20:55,785
to know what the underlying, um.

1775
01:20:56,280 --> 01:20:58,470
Intention of what you're doing is, yeah.

1776
01:20:58,500 --> 01:21:01,740
Like they have a crazy way, and if
it's not pure, they see through it

1777
01:21:01,800 --> 01:21:06,450
and doesn't mean you won't get some
sort of results, but, um, they, they

1778
01:21:06,450 --> 01:21:11,940
have a crazy way of, of being able to
like truly read you for who you are.

1779
01:21:13,200 --> 01:21:13,440
Yep.

1780
01:21:14,640 --> 01:21:14,880
Okay.

1781
01:21:14,880 --> 01:21:15,660
Last question.

1782
01:21:15,750 --> 01:21:16,019
Good.

1783
01:21:16,320 --> 01:21:18,120
Meres stallions or geldings?

1784
01:21:19,769 --> 01:21:20,190
Ooh.

1785
01:21:21,275 --> 01:21:24,059
I, I think it depends
on, on what we're doing.

1786
01:21:24,360 --> 01:21:25,440
Um, Ooh.

1787
01:21:25,740 --> 01:21:28,710
I think it just depends, like, yeah,
like seriously, like, I think it depends

1788
01:21:28,710 --> 01:21:30,059
on what you're, what we're doing.

1789
01:21:30,690 --> 01:21:34,715
Like if I was competing it
would be, uh, it'd be a stallion

1790
01:21:34,740 --> 01:21:35,940
or a mayor, I would say.

1791
01:21:36,345 --> 01:21:38,355
Just because there's, they're intact.

1792
01:21:38,355 --> 01:21:40,785
They're, they're exactly.

1793
01:21:41,865 --> 01:21:45,375
Um, you know, what God created 'em
to be and they're, they're all there.

1794
01:21:45,435 --> 01:21:50,895
And I'm not saying geldings, my two
highest horses performers are geldings

1795
01:21:51,285 --> 01:21:55,605
money earning wise, but there's, there's
just, there's a little extra in the

1796
01:21:55,605 --> 01:21:57,705
tank on Mares and guild stallions.

1797
01:21:57,705 --> 01:22:01,005
So I'd say that, uh, for ranch
work and just, just a good citizen

1798
01:22:01,005 --> 01:22:04,275
to be around and, and just, I'd
say a gelding for sure, but.

1799
01:22:05,515 --> 01:22:07,255
Yeah, so I kind of used them all.

1800
01:22:07,495 --> 01:22:08,665
They all have their place.

1801
01:22:08,875 --> 01:22:08,965
I

1802
01:22:08,965 --> 01:22:09,265
love it.

1803
01:22:10,675 --> 01:22:13,225
Nick, thank you so much
for coming on the podcast.

1804
01:22:13,615 --> 01:22:14,185
My pleasure.

1805
01:22:14,185 --> 01:22:14,845
Thanks for having me.

1806
01:22:15,505 --> 01:22:17,875
Hope I didn't disappoint
the people that referred me.

1807
01:22:19,345 --> 01:22:20,455
I don't think you did at all.

1808
01:22:21,775 --> 01:22:22,075
Cool.

1809
01:22:23,095 --> 01:22:23,905
That was awesome.

1810
01:22:25,045 --> 01:22:26,095
You're so dope.

1811
01:22:26,125 --> 01:22:28,315
You're as dope, if not
more dope than I imagined.

1812
01:22:30,235 --> 01:22:34,585
Thank you Yeti, for supporting us
on this journey of a lifetime as we

1813
01:22:34,585 --> 01:22:36,685
traverse the heart of the horse world.