Fair Territory: Bruce Meyer to lead MLBPA, Braves pitching injuries, Jordan Westburg's injury status

00:00:01
Speaker 1: Welcome everyone to the Thursday edition of Fair Territory. I'm Ken Rosenthal here with Alana Rizzo and Alana. I must say it has been a rather eventful week in the baseball world, a week that was highly unanticipated. I'm talking, of course, about the sudden and shocking resignation of Tony Clark, the reasons he resigned, the inappropriate relationship with his sister in law. Of course, the federal investigation that continues into his handling of the union's finances. That investigation has been ongoing, but people were saying the whole time that they never expected to lead to much. We'll see about that. But the way this went down and how he resigned and why he resigned, Alana, I get surprised every so often, not too often, by things that happened in baseball. This one surprised me.

00:00:52
Speaker 2: Well, Kin, I don't think you're alone in that.

00:00:53
Speaker 3: I think it kind of sented surprising shock waves through the world of baseball. And obviously the timing is interesting as well, because we had thought, even before this announcement of the resignation, that there was likely going to be a work stoppage, a lockout, and that seems to be a guarantee.

00:01:09
Speaker 2: Now the union moves forward with Bruce Meyer.

00:01:12
Speaker 1: Right that idea that there is going to be a lockout, that's not changing. There is going to be a lockout. And actually a lot of fans and people I know who are not necessarily in the media asked me in the wake of what happened here, what does this mean? Does this help things along? Because Tony Clark is not out, No, not at all. Tony Clark was, yes, the head of the union, but Bruce Meyer is the lead negotiator and will continue as the lead negotiator. And Bruce Meyer was hired not to be Major League Baseball's friend. He was hired to fight for player rights and he's going to do that in the same way he did that in the last CBA during the twenty twenty COVID negotiations and beyond that, the players seem almost galvanized by what has happened here. Now it's early and we will see how they hold together. We will see how the owners hold together. It's real easy to talk tough right now when we're nine months away or so from the expiration of the CBA. But Bruce Meyer is someone who will be no doubt some experienced in this role and a guy who has been around now for sometime seven and a half years. I believe he understands the issues. He understands what is at stake here. He understands all of that. And Chris Bassett in talking to me last night after this vote went down, when bruce Meyer was elected unanimously by the players, Bassett made the point that the union is going to be more transparent within now to the players from the leadership, and he believes that will help. So we'll see how this all transpires, but it's in terms of the union strategy. In terms of the union's approach, I expect nothing to change, if anything, from what they are saying about how they will now operate internally. Perhaps they will be stronger.

00:03:12
Speaker 3: Ken how important was it in your opinion to make sure that they went with somebody within the organization. Bruce Meyer obviously joined the Major League Baseball Players Association in twenty eighteen. It was the second in command under Tony Clark, so he knows the ways of the world in terms of what's been going on with the union for many years now. And I think the timing of this being nine months away from a potential stoppage. It's important to have somebody internally that has already been within the fabric of the union, so that's not a distraction all.

00:03:42
Speaker 1: And I totally agree, and in many ways, there was no other choice. There certainly was no way, in my opinion, that they could have gone outside and hired someone from beyond the baseball world to go be the head of the Baseball Union. And the reason I say that is the baseball history of labor negotiations, the Baseball particular labor negotiations. It's a world done to its own. It is not something you can bring in or not a situation where you can bring in someone from the outside and expect that person to understand right away and grasp the issues and the history and all of the acrimony that has taken place over what five plus decades now. So from that perspective alone, Bruce Meyer was clearly the right choice. Now he is the interim executive director, and depending upon how this CBA negotiation turns out, they will then determine if he is the permanent director or if they then want to go outside. If you do it at that point, after a CBA is in place and you've got four or five years, Okay, someone can pick it up. Bruce Meyer had to learn all of these things when he came over from the NHL. I believe so yeah, that all is a factor here and certainly was a reason why the players elected Meyer. And I thought also what Bassett said kind of vaguely, but I thought I understood he was saying about bruce Meyer and Matt Nussbaum, the union's general counsel who was appointed to interim deputy executive director. He said, those guys have had the players backs during this FBI investigation. They have done things the right way. Evidently a lot of players felt Tony Clark wasn't doing things the right way, both within the way he was operating the union, whether he's guilty of a crime or not, and of course whether he was or the way he was leading the union. So from that perspective, the players seem pretty comfortable with this as a whole. You're going to always have people who are not happy, and as I wrote, some people don't like bruce Meyer, even within the player population and even within the union, but they go forward. Now. The timing was unfortunate, but we're still a long ways away from this really getting interesting.

00:06:06
Speaker 3: Ken bruce Meyer, of course, is known as a labor negotiator, a labor lawyer knows that type of law inside and out. How important is it at this point in where the union is to have somebody that is a labor negotiator versus somebody that was a former player like Tony Clark was. Obviously bruce Meyer is the interim executive director, Mike Nesbaum the interim deputy executive director. How important is it to have labor negotiation at the top of the union. And moreover, do the players need to kind does bruce Meyer kind of need to win these players over that wanted him ousted about two years ago?

00:06:42
Speaker 1: It's important to have a labor negotiator at the top. Tony Clark was the first former player to lead the union, after Marvin Miller, Donald Fear and Michael Wiener, all attorneys preceded him. And yes, it seems to me that that person should be an attorney, a labor lawyer, someone who understands the ins and outs of that part of it. Now. Tony Clark had his own skills as a leader of the union, mostly in the way he related to players as he could as a former player. Himself. What I wrote today is that Bruce Meyer, he has led, to a certain degrees, led his staff. He has led labor negotiations with baseball, but he hasn't had to lead in this manner. He has to lead now in a grander manner. And yes, a lot of you're right. There was an attempted coup two years ago. It wasn't all the players, but it was a significant number, at least a significant number for this to become an issue. And even in the last few days there have been people who have said, I'm not so sure this is the way we should go. I know the vote was unanimous, but there have been some dissenters. So he's going to have to grow into that part of the role. He certainly can negotiate, that's what he does, but there is a distinction between being the lead negotiator and the leader of the entire union.

00:08:06
Speaker 3: Definitely some interesting times within the Major League Baseball Players Association. Can I appreciate the insight. Let's move on to some baseball, shall we brave? Spencer Schwellenbach underwent elbow cleanup on Wednesday, and Hurston Waldrop will undergo similar a similar procedure on Monday. Of course, we're talking about the Braves here. What does this mean for this club?

00:08:26
Speaker 1: It's not good news and the Braves. If you remember, at the start of the offseason, what alex Anthopolis, that president Baseball Operations, has talked about is finding a pitcher who could be a playoff starter, someone to start a playoff game. They have not acquired that person, and that was when they were healthy, when they were still looking for that type of pitcher. Now, Spencer Schellenback Schwellenback, I'm sorry, was arguably their number two starter, while Stryder comes off the surgery and is still kind of finding himself. That's a huge loss. Hurston Waldrop a little less of a loss. Not that he didn't show great things last season. He did, but he had options left. Bryce Elder does not have options left. Joey Wentz does not have options left. Hurston Waldrip had an uphill fight to make the team. Just from that perspective alone, forget talent ability and even performance. We all know how it works when a player has options left versus players who don't, that player has an uphill battle. So obviously you don't want to see any pitcher go down, but Schwellenbach is perhaps the bigger blow. Now, where are they with this, Let's take a look at their starting rotation options, because it's still an interesting group, but it's not necessarily a group that you thought was as good as before Sale Strider and Lopez, Good, grand Holds Good. Bryce Elder now he is the interesting guy. His velo jumped about two miles in September. He was better in September. He's not a hard thrower, but they feel perhaps that he can hold this down and hold it down in a way that at least buys them some time. And if they have the offensive year that they anticipated last year and didn't get with out a Kunya and without Profar to start the season, then maybe they'll get back to a team that is indeed a threat, even with these injuries that they're facing. Now. The question fans might have, question I have, frankly, is why don't the Braves just go sign Lucas Giolito for Zach Littel or even Max Scherzer. And obviously that still can happen, and maybe that is something they will look at. But with the exception of Schurzer, at least in his past, those are not top of the rotation starters, and the Braves might argue for a certain price that they're not worth even more than Bryce Elder would be kind of at a minimum salary. So I'm not so sure they're going to go in that direction. But those pitchers still are out there, and one more injury, I will say this, the Braves are gonna have no choice.

00:11:01
Speaker 3: The Brave's not the only ones Ken dealing with some injuries. Let's focus on the Baltimore Orioles in the American League. Now, Jordan Westburg is not participating in any sort of baseball activities for the O's the Baltimore Banners, Andy Coska saying Westburg went for imaging on his elbow. That's the last thing that this club needs, Ken, it is.

00:11:20
Speaker 1: He's a huge part of what they do, and of course he missed a lot of time last year and that hurt them, no question about it. Now, first off, with Westburg, we need to find out what exactly is wrong. Is it the oblique is it the elbow as Andy Coska is perhaps suggesting here, And if it's the elbow, well then what are we looking at? How long is he going to be out? Now? The Orioles are in somewhat of a protected position in that they have Kobe Mayo, and Kobe Mayo was a guy that was a top prospect, top twenty prospect in the game as of a year ago. Didn't have a great year at least in Baltimore in the major leagues, but is a guy that certainly would benefit from a chance, And if Westburg is out for any length of time, he's going to get that chance. So they have options here if Westburg is out. But again, Westburg was part of their young fabric, part of the reason why a lot of us believe this team was going to be set up well for the present and the future. They need him, and Kobe Mayo may turn out to be even better than Westburg, but we don't know that right now. He's still a prospect.

00:12:29
Speaker 3: Ken. Do you think that the Orioles are gonna end up having a right handed hitting logjam when perhaps Westburg is healthy, when Jackson Holliday who's dealing with the hamlet bone injury and the surgery there when he comes back, is that something to look at now or is that a down the road type of problem.

00:12:45
Speaker 1: Alanna, It's certainly a possibility, But these guys are not healthy right now. Jack'son holiday, not healthy, George Westburg not healthy. So that logjam and I actually wrote about this, I believe last week. The logjam was poss because of Mayo's presence and because Ryan Mountcastle is still on this team first basement behind Pete Alonzo. It seems like there's no place for him, but as a DH first base type, Yeah, maybe there is with these injuries. So obviously you're right alon It if everybody ever gets healthy. Yeah, they've got a log jam. And they've even explored trades for Mayo and Mountcastle, but with Westbrook possibly out now, they've got to probably hold Yeah.

00:13:28
Speaker 3: I adapt very seriously that there's ever a time, Ken Rosenthal, when all twenty six guys on the twenty six man roster are healthy and ready to go, that would be quite the problem to have. All Right, coming up here on Fair Territory with Ken Rosenthal, it's your opportunity to ask Ken some questions.

00:13:44
Speaker 2: We'll be back with Grill and Ken right after this.

00:13:51
Speaker 3: All right, welcome back to Fair Territory with Ken Rosenthal. Time now to get some questions in for Ken and the first one Ken that we're going to start with is regarding Patrick Orbin or John Gray in free agency? Is there any news about either of those guys, And of course this gentleman or person says that he's wishing them best of luck.

00:14:10
Speaker 1: Both former Texas Rangers, and to be perfectly honest, I have not heard anything about either of them so far this offseason and into spring training. Do I expect they'll be in camp. I'm not sure about Gray's health for starters, and Corbin, sure, I would think that some team would at least sign him to a minor league contract, But at the same time, he's still out there.

00:14:34
Speaker 3: What about Lucas Giolito, that's a question just coming from me.

00:14:37
Speaker 2: Ken.

00:14:38
Speaker 3: Are you surprised that he's still out there looking for a job?

00:14:41
Speaker 1: I am. He was hurt at the end of last season, so I don't know what his medicals look like, and perhaps that's a factor. Perhaps he is asking more than teams are willing to pay him. That probably is what's going on here. It's what always is going on when a player lingers into free agency. But I would expect he is going to sign, and probably sign fairly soon.

00:15:00
Speaker 3: All right, National League West News A question about Tony Vittello. The new manager, of course, of the San Francisco Giants, who's already kind of making some waves ken, if you will, in terms of media and.

00:15:11
Speaker 2: Those types of questions.

00:15:13
Speaker 3: All right, So, Tony Vittello, what first, before we get to the question itself, what has been your impression of him so far in the first couple of weeks, if you will, being the Giants manager.

00:15:23
Speaker 1: Well, I was around the Giants two days, the first day they had pitchers and catchers working out, and then a couple of days later to interview Tony Vitello for Fox, And we'll have that interview later at some point during the season. He is obviously a guy who is new to the major league experience. He is not new to baseball and competitive baseball, and he did it at a high level at Tennessee. We all know that the comments that he made in the press conference the other day. He started his press conference is daily news briefing with reporters by talking about the fact that it got out that he was going to be perhaps the Giants manager before maybe he wanted it to get out. Now. I was one of the people who wrote that story with Brick Gioli and Andrew Baggerley and what we wrote at the time was that the Giants were closing in on the hiring of Vtello. We didn't write that he had an offer. We just wrote that he was the target. He was the guy. Now. I haven't spoken specifically to Tony Bytello about this. He didn't bring it up to me, but if he does, I will tell him. Listen, this is what we were hearing. And I know the timing probably didn't work out too well for him. Maybe he had informed players and coaches at Tennessee and even family members people he was close with about how this was going where it was going, but we were hearing it, and we were hearing it from credible enough sources to of course publish. Of course he gets named the Giants manager as well, so obviously we were on the right track. He might not have liked the timing, but our obligation is to our readers, and that is what we did there.

00:17:02
Speaker 3: Okay, let's get to the actual question in terms of Grill and Ken here regarding Tony Vittello. If we could put that up momentarily, I'd appreciate that very much. All right, So Sarah Harmon wants to know, Ken, what did you think of the comments by Tony Vittel earlier this week and the timing of the offer.

00:17:18
Speaker 2: So it's along the same lines.

00:17:19
Speaker 1: Of what that's what I'm talking about. A. Yeah, that's what I'm referring to. That was his complaint, right that the report about the offer, or it wasn't even a report about an offer, it was a report about the Giants closing in was in his mind premature, and okay, he can feel that way, but again, we had what we had and we felt compelled to publish, and that is why we published.

00:17:42
Speaker 3: Okay, very good. Next question here on Grill and Ken. Spring training can also be extension season, but should we expect less than usual over the next few weeks due to the incoming labor dispute?

00:17:51
Speaker 2: Fair question?

00:17:52
Speaker 3: Are there any players teams we should keep an eye on? This is from Mike G fifteen.

00:17:56
Speaker 1: Mike G fifteen, To be perfectly honest, I have not been focused on extensions. I am sure we will see some, even with the looming dispute in twenty seven and the possibility of games being canceled. We've seen free agents signed contracts beyond and including twenty seven, of course, so I don't know that it would be any different in the extension market, perhaps a little bit different. But every spring, toward the end of spring, we do hear of extensions, and I'm sure that will be the case again this spring.

00:18:27
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was surprised to hear of the Max Munsey extension when that happened. Obviously, this is a guy that even said, you know, he left some money on the table, but Los Angeles is the place that he wants to be. All right, coming up after the break, we're going to be talking about our dudes and dorks.

00:18:43
Speaker 1: Of the week.

00:18:44
Speaker 4: We'll be right back, bet, I'm jam account holders today. How about any sport parlay boost token. You can score a bigger payout if your wager with that token. Hits tokens can be used on parlays and on same game parlays. Gambling problem or concerned, there's help called one eight hundred gambler.

00:19:00
Speaker 2: Dude, Dude, dude, this.

00:19:08
Speaker 3: Is always a fun time. I love that we can point the fingers. Although we have named ourselves dude and dorks of the way, well, definitely dorks of the week at a certain point, okay, we will start with dude and Ken you have the honors.

00:19:18
Speaker 2: Who is your Dude of the.

00:19:19
Speaker 1: Week Bobby Wick Junior, and I wrote about him earlier this week. The story came out the same day that all hell broke loose with the Union, so I don't know that a lot of people read it, but the story was about how three years ago Bobby Wick Junior was the kid on Team USA in the World Baseball Classic. It was the youngest member of the team. He had only one full season in the major leagues. He was kind of the little brother, and yet even at that time, the other players on the team could see how talented he was. They loved him because he was mature, he was humble, and all of that. Well, now twenty twenty six WBC, Bobby Wick Junior will be at the center of it all as Team USA starting shortstop. It's just kind of a cool evolution. We see it all the time in our sport, and it's his moment now.

00:20:08
Speaker 3: No question, one of the best shortstops in the game and one of the best people as an ambassador of urgury a game. My Dude of the Week is Ozzy Alby's He loves fish ken I love dogs.

00:20:20
Speaker 2: Ozzie Albi's loves fish. Well.

00:20:21
Speaker 3: He had some time in this offseason, he went to a local elementary school and taught these young kids how to properly take care of some fish in a tank. So took time out of his day. He set up the tank, he set up all the fish. He talked to them about the care of not only taking care of the fish itself, but the proper cleaning of the tank. And they get to keep it, you know, those fishes kind of their class pets. So kind of a nice entree into how to take some responsibility for animals. And I thought that was really sweet of Ozzy Alby's to take one of his passions and spread it in the Atlanta community.

00:20:54
Speaker 2: All right, time now for Dork of the.

00:20:57
Speaker 3: Week's funny can We have unfortunately a lot to choose from this week, And it's an interesting thing if you take a look at this text thread that you and I had with our producer and director Jeremy Meyer early on in this week, you had said that you were claiming Sam Kennedy and Tom Werner as dorks of the week right now. You said, I'm taking them right now, And of course I laughed because I understand why because of the comments that they made about Raphael Devers and then our producer Jeremy says, hi bar to clear for the rest of the week.

00:21:33
Speaker 2: Well he cleared it. Who's your due to the.

00:21:35
Speaker 1: Week dork of the Week Tony Clark, And yes he did clear the bar. And what was so surprising to me about what happened here was that I always thought and I always heard that Tony Clark, for whatever his faults might be as the head of the union, was a man of integrity. And there have been a lot of questions raised about his integrity even before the news of his resignation, Questions about the way he was handling the union's finances. A whistleblower kind of came out and accused him of a number of things a few years ago, and then the FBI investigation commenced. Now on top of that, we have the reported inappropriate relationship with his sister in law, confirmed by The Athletic, first reported by ESPN that led to his resignation. All of these things combined, Yes, he tops Sam Kennedy and Tom Werner. Yes he is, and I say this sadly the dork of the Week.

00:22:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, I understand completely.

00:22:33
Speaker 3: It was a shock to all of us that know Tony Clark and you know obviously care about this this great game. My dork of the week once again is the Angels, not for what they're doing on the field, Ken, but what they're doing to their our colleagues there are they're television partners. They are not televising a single spring training game on television. Ratt BOLLINGERD tweeting the Angels will not televise any of their Cactus League games, the club announced, but they will be on Angels Radio, so you can still if you're not here in Tempe to get the Angels game in person, you can hear it on the radio. But what does this say to you, Ken? That not, as I understand, they don't have to televise all thirty or thirty two or whatever it is, but to not televise a single spring training game, it just seems another lazy approach by the Angels.

00:23:21
Speaker 1: I don't know all the details here, Alana, but you're keeping your product away from your fans. And if the idea of spring training and televising spring training games is to get people excited for the regular season, well the Angels are failing in that regard. Now their team isn't all that exciting to begin with so okay, But that's the point. The televising of spring training games is largely promotional. It gives fans an appetite, gets them ready for the season, gets people interested in some of the new players that you might have. So from that perspective, I don't understand what the Angels are doing. Again, I don't know all the particulars, the ins and outs of the television arrangement, but not to have any spring training games televised not good.

00:24:05
Speaker 3: And it also, as you mentioned, takes the product away from the fan base. But it also, you know, if the broadcasters are not here, it takes away their opportunity to interact with the players and start thinking of some storylines and you know, establish those relationships, perhaps with new players. It's just unfortunate all the way around. I'm assuming it's a cost cutting measure, but I'm not certain about that, Ken.

00:24:25
Speaker 1: I am.

00:24:25
Speaker 3: The reason I look like I'm in jail is because I'm not at home. I'm actually at Campbell Back Ranch. I'm at the Dodgers camp today, and we're also doing a foul Territory from the Dodgers camp tomorrow. So a couple of things that I'm noticing here Tao ta Oscar Hernandez kind of the best shape of his life. And also I wanted to get your thoughts on Mookie Bets perhaps in the three hole, Dave Roberts saying that he could possibly be there, Kyle Tucker in the two hole of quotes show Hay leading off formidable lineup, but your thoughts about Mooky in the three hole?

00:24:57
Speaker 1: First off, ta Oscar Alana, Yes, it's the best shape of his life. Whatever, But he did lose twelve pounds, I believe, and he knew that last year his play in right field was not up to par. He's moving to left with Kyle Tucker coming in to play right, And to me, it's encouraging a guy like Ti Oscar, who is a veteran who has a contract, who could conceivably rest on whatever laurels he has acquired. He could do that, and he's not doing that. He obviously is driven to be better and that is a very good sign for the Dodgers. This is a talented dude and a huge part of what they do now. As for the liup, Mookie Bets hitting third. This is a fascinating decision that Dave Roberts faced, and it's a fascinating outcome as well. Rookie Betts, of course, is coming off one of his worst offensive years, maybe his worst, and of course what happened was he got sick early, never seemed to catch up. We all know that. But Dave Roberts is essentially saying, here, Lookie is still our guy. He is still a huge part of what we do. He was always going to bat in the top four, we knew that. But the three spot, that's a spot of great responsibility. And it just seems that Roberts is showing a lot of confidence in Bets, and probably well placed confidence because of who Mookie Bets is and how driven he is to succeed. You see the lineup right there now, it was always going to be a case where you had two left handed hitters back to back among the top four. With those four guys, you couldn't avoid it. But Shohy and Tucker back to back. Tucker can handle lefties just fine. And then Mookie Freeman, Will Smith, Max Munsey, Texts, Oscar hernandez Andy pae Has and Tommy Edmund went healthy. He's not going to be healthy to start the season. It's a formidable group, and if ta Oscar is back to being what he has been, if Mooki returns to something close to the old Mookie Bets, then with the addition of Kyle Tucker, you're looking at perhaps and I say perhaps, which you do not know how this is going to turn out, perhaps even more dynamic offense than we've seen from the Dodgers in their back to back World Series championship years.

00:27:06
Speaker 2: Which is hard to believe.

00:27:07
Speaker 3: Quickly before we say goodbye, Ken, Tommy Edmund not ready for opening day, Who do you see getting the majority of playing time at second base for la.

00:27:16
Speaker 1: Unclear to me a lotta what do you think on that one?

00:27:18
Speaker 3: I can see a lot of Hessan Kim honestly.

00:27:20
Speaker 2: There.

00:27:21
Speaker 3: They want to get him some more at bats. They want to see what he can do opportunity. Obviously, if Tommy Edmund's not back for opening day, Alex call getting some more opportunities in the outfield to spell some of the guys in the outfield as far as Taoskar and Tucker and Pa Haz. But I think Hessan Kim gets the majority of time at second.

00:27:37
Speaker 1: Base, and Rojas will get some time too, I'm sure. So they're as always in decent shape.

00:27:44
Speaker 3: Yeah, they are in decent shape, and so are you. Ken Rosenal, have a great time. I believe you're heading to what Red Sox tomorrow? Is that what you're saying.

00:27:52
Speaker 1: Yes, I'm flying to Florida today and will be at Red Sox camp tomorrow. Ten days in Florida coming up.

00:27:57
Speaker 3: Okay, and I will be back at Dodgers' camp tomorrow borrow, and then of course, Ken, we'll be back on Fair Territory on Monday. Have a great weekend, everybody. Thanks for being with us.

00:28:05
Speaker 2: Take care,