Kathy Ireland Meets World

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Speaker 1: How's everybody doing on this rainy drive here in Los Angeles? Beautiful rainy day. It's awesome. Um, I have a new baby, cousin you. Yes, my cousins who I have been very close to my whole life. UM, had a baby this past Sunday. And guess what they named their baby? Oh my gosh, you have either one of those. Imagine if they went Wilfred and then their last name or to Panga in their last name, that would be crazy. No, they named their baby Eastern, and we how a wonderful dear super fan Easton Allen on our podcast that any good name is great name. It's one of those names that you actually don't hear that often, but it doesn't. It's not like hard to pronounce her right when you're you're like, oh, yeah, that name makes sense. But you Eastern on our show is the first Eastern I've met. Same, That's how I felt. And yet similarly to the way we felt about Adler, which is exactly what you're saying, which is like, it's unique, it's strong, but it's not like weird. People aren't like, what what's that name? Um? And so yeah, Easton James is my strong You know, just weird. Did your parents think that at all? When did they put it? Here's here's the arty. So if I was a girl, they were going to name me Sierra, so I would have been Sierra Strong. And my dad said at the time that sounds like a stripper name, but riders strong, right or Strong is fine, which it wasn't until I was fifteen or whatever. It must have been fourteen, because it was the first season when I was living at the oak Woods with you, Will are not with you, but we're both living at the oak Woods and we're hanging around the pool and I introduced myself to somebody at the pool and so this teenage girl was like, what your name's Ride her Strong? And I was like, oh, I never got that. I have a question for you, Danielle, about your that maybe you can answer. So your cousins had a baby, I know, So what does that mean? What does that relation? Is that a second cousin or is that removed? Is that how that works? I am the first cousin twice from you know you do that too. I never know a second cousin twice removed. I don't. I don't know. I know that we keep it very simple in my family and and um, and we'll know everyone's a cousin except for like will exactly. My kids call my cousins aunt and uncle, which makes no sense. It's gonna say, how's that not confusing? But it's because they're older than them. So instead instead of just random names there, they call them you know, anti ali and whatever. And then uh, and then we call my cousin's kids the cousin. Like that, my kids and their kids are cousins. Okay, yeah, I never we never I do that same thing in our family. It's like, all right, so my cousins kids. Second, if it's your second cousin, cousin, Yeah, right, my understanding. But okay, you know, I remember I actually did look this up. There's a graph there's graphs. But I think there's some flexibility. Like I think the notion of like cousins is kind of just a it's a flexible term. So what you want to show that I'm basically related to everybody every That's the thing about those ancestries and twenty three and me, it's like, oh, yeah, that guy I met yesterday that was my cousin. So yeah, you get that a lot too. I really love the phrase though, like twice removed, like I'd like to remove, I'd like to just add removed to a few family members. I always be confused by in laws, like so, if my wife's sister is married, man is my brother. He is still a brother and he's not your sister and brother in law. It's yeah, I just always I'm like my brother, I mean my Yeah, it's such a confusing Yeah, it's very it's very I get that with with Sue's family because there it's there's people my age in the family, but that are her nieces and nephews. But it's like this is my step nephew. It's like it isn't my friend. It's like I once learned from a TV show that you don't have Walker Texas Ranger Okay, different different Walker Texas, and you can clean up any problem in this town. Oh man, there's an entirely I'm assuming he was a ranger ranger and then all I know is that at one point Haley Joe Osmond showed up and had AIDS and it's become one of the most famous clips. It's the the most ridiculous. Are I think this is why we made fun of the shows because there were so many ridiculous episodes. But there's one that's world famous where there's that one, and then there's one where the entire episode Walker is just trying to find an escaped tiger. Well that's pretty cool that like during this season seven, that's again that's Eric, that's the the Walker Texas Ranger. That's that's embracing the Walk Texas Ranger nest, like we gotta find a tiger and all I've got is this gun and my horse. That like but like I'm going to deal with a child with h that's HIV positive. Like that's when the ship shows like stretching its boundaries. And but there's a famous clip where it's just Haley Joe Osma and the clip with no setup is one of the strangest clips in television, and it's him. He's probably six or seven and he just goes, that's okay. Walker told me I have aids. That's the clip, and you're like, what is it just happened? Official official bid to when Pod Meats World wraps, because we have no more Boy Meats World episodes. Official bid to rewatch, not even reach just to watch to watch should do? Maybe we should just pick an episode, like every season of art, we have to just do a Walker to because I've never seen I've never seen an episode ever, to be honest with you, neither of I okay, okay, so confidently you know what's going on, like sir Charles and do you remember I want to say that Lance or somebody from and SYNC at one point heard about all the stuff we were doing on the set and they sent us a box of like Walker Texas, right, we got shirts because I still have it, and it was so like the the guys that didn't sink, Like I'm almost positive because that was the joke. We opened it up. We're like, oh, you've got to be kidding like them. We've got Walker Texas Ranger stuff and pretty sure it was from them, but yeah, we've got to We've got to do that. That sounds about right. Well, Walker Texas podcasts are coming up next. Yes, welcome to pod meets World. I'm Danielle Visual, I'm right or Strong, and I'm Wilfredell so d D Sorry it was in my head. What's that the thing you hear every time you listen to the when the commercials think the I heart break music. I am I want to be, uh, the new voice of the Sonic Logo. I think it should just me going be going dank, dank, dank you dank. That should be it. Wait, what that's the Sonic you know, the when we're listening to the podcast music, right, Yeah, it sounds like thank thank thank you, nink. And I want to do it myself. Yeah, I want to be the new voice called Sonic Logo. Stick with what we got, No, I think I want to do it. Well, you could probably just do it for poctively. Yeah, it's not the same. It's not the same. Thank thank thank you, nink. Well, we have been having very special episodes, not one of those like very special episodes, but just very special episodes. Crying. It's not a very special episode exactly. We have just been having regular special episodes throughout the month of December, and this one is no different. She is an absolute pioneer who helped define the term supermodel and has since done the same for entrepreneur, but most importantly for us today. She played Alexis on season one, episode fifteen of Boy Meets World Model Family, and Uh, I can't wait to talk to her because I know Will has a lot of memories and a lot of stories, and I'm I'm legitimately curious if she even remembers her week on Boy Meets World. So I hope if she doesn't, she at least lies about it. I hope she. Yeah, I hope she liked. For your sake, I hope that way where it's like, of course I remember you, Phil, I remember everything about you, like, hey, thank you. It is Phil, always your go to make fun of somebody forgetting your name. I do feel perfect. I'm not criticized it. I just noticed that this stappen like three or four times, and it makes me laugh every every time because I remember you also pointed out one time that people think your name is Wilfred Wilfred because you'll say you say your name too fast, Wilfred now, and they're like, oh, hi Wilford, Mr El, mr L. I get that a lot, mr L. And I'll be looking around like, oh that means me, yes, And then I was Wilfred for years for friends of mine, So I don't mind the nickname. It's just very fast. I call you Wilfred because I remember you call you Phil. From now on, I got I got just so people don't forget I got my name on the back. Okay, we're good. Good, We're good. Now soon knows what to call you when you walk around your house exactly exactly. She's like, hey, Friedle. She doesn't pronounce it right either, so it's fine, Like, hey, yeah, I'm so excited. I'm legitimately excited to talk to Kathy. I'm excited too. She's in the waiting room, So let's please welcome Kathy Ireland to the pod. Hi. How are you? Oh my god, how are you doing. I'm so good, It's so great. I'm I'm so overjoyed to be with all of you again. It's been a very long time. Congratulations to each of you. You've all done so many amazing things, and it's so fun to experience your love for each other. And you're awesome people. So much. We were just talking before you arrived about how like, super excited and truly honored we are that you joined us and we I think my very first question is do you remember being on Boy Meets World? Do you remember the week you were with us? We feel like you were staring it to be with us. I was so nervous, um because I tell people I'm not an actress. I have like the movies and the TV shows to prove it. I'm great, you know, it was it was an opportunity and helped me pay some bills, and I'm really really grateful, but I knew it was like, oh, my goodness, what am I doing here? Um, you all were so kind. I was actually newly pregnant for the first time when I filmed, and and all and and I'm a worker. I've worked since I was four years old, and I can't think of another time that I called in sick. I called in sick for half a day one day because I was throwing up, and I didn't know any of that. They don't tell us anything. They don't tell us anything. Oh that's so funny. Wow, that's amazing. Well, you say you were nervous, but will here was very nervous because he was a very big fan of yours. He had he had posters of you on his wall. My goodness. I I totally played it cool because you know, I think I was sixteen or maybe seventeen at at the time. And uh, you know, they came in and said, we're Cathy Ireland's coming on the show, and I went, no, no, she's not don't do that. And so I was so excited to get a chance to work with you. It was the coolest thing in the world for me. Um. And then I just remember the whole week was very odd because I normally didn't have a big role in the show. They brought on a new best friend for me on the show, which had never been done before. That week, we were shooting on a set that we'd never shot on before. They were so so they built that mall set, I think for you because you had come on the show. Um. So the idea that all of this new stuff was happening and then the cameras were going to be focused on us was was very odd to me. So I just remember stumbling through that week and trying to keep it cool the entire time. Yeah, Oh, you were so good, And I remember I just I felt so bad because my character wasn't very nice. This totally exploiting this poor kid awful. It was great. Well, first of all, I have to also point out where you're actually zooming from. It looks gorgeous. Well, it's beginning to look a lot like Christmas. We we are filming some um, some Christmas messages and uh, episodes for some projects that we're working on, and I haven't quite finished my tree yet, but it's getting there. Well, your tree looks a lot better than mine. My I have two very small children. I have a three and a half year old and a fifteen month old, and so the lower half of my tree is all soft ornaments that if they fall or someone takes them off and throws, and then the upper half has all these glass and crystal ornaments. So your tree looks better than mine. But you were very humble saying that you were not an actress. You actually were a very well established actress before you even got to boy Meat's world. I mean, you had a lot more experience than any of us had, that's for sure. I mean you had done loaded weapon, necessary roughness, Mom and Dad saved the World. But your actual first acting job, if I'm correct, was actually on another Michael Jacob show, Charles in Charge. Is that true? Yes, that was the first. I think my character didn't even have a name. I was like, you know, a woman at the phone booth or right right, right, of course, but yes, oh my goodness, yeah that was the first one. But I'm just I just always knew I belonged on the other side of the camera, and um, even in necessary roughness, it's a football movie. When I read the script, like this is how literal I am, I thought it was a drama. I had no idea it was a comedy. And I was telling a friend of my husband's like, oh, what's this project you're doing in Texas? And it's like, it's a football movie and I'm playing the kicker on a college football team. He's like, oh, it's comedy. It's like, no, it's a drama. Don't I look like a kicker on a football team. That's normal. I didn't understand. It's like, well, I could do it. Why not? You know about a great cast though, I mean it was you, it was Scott Baccula, it was Jason Bateman, it was sin Bad. I mean it was a huge cast. And I'm not even to get into Mom and Dad Saved the World, because I will start I'll start doing very silly. It was a great movie. That was an acting stretch. I gotta tell you, well, because I had to play an alien on a planet of idiots. So that that was Academy Award winning. You were so good at it though it was such a funny movie, Todd Spango to the president of this is so funny. So you weren't actually pursuing acting, like these opportunities just kind of kept coming to you. I mean I wasn't and you know, I did modeling and that wasn't like part of my plan. Um, but I was offered the opportunity, and um, I was seventeen, and it was oh that like wasn't something that entered my mind. The look of the moment was kind of changing, and so you know, they were like into like a different kind of look at that moment. So it's like, hm hmmm, um, well maybe it'll be an opportunity to save money for college or to start a business. So the whole time that I was working in that industry, I was trying and failing at businesses, and then some acting jobs came along and it's like, okay, well this helps pays the bill to It just took me a long time to get started. Actually, Um, I mean, so much of life as a blur. I mean, Danielle, you talked about having two young kids. Ever since we started having children when they were little, especially time is kind of a blur. But I think it was nine when I worked with you guys. Yeah, it was right right, because it was I knew it was newly pregnant. And it was shortly after I worked with you guys that we started our company. Um, I was a pregnant aging model at our kitchen table, and we started with a pair of socks, and and that's where we started. And then so it's like, okay, now I can you know, get where I really know I'm better? And that is exactly what I wanted to talk to you about next, because it was you started with and with socks that sold one hundred million pairs, and obviously you sell a hundred millions exactly, So you do that and obviously everyone's going to take notice. So Kmart, who was your partner at the time, took notice and then gave you the opportunity to do an entire like clothing line. Right they did they? I mean it was we really started. It was pretty grassroots used to model. I had people say, like, you know, you're so cheap, why don't you buy better clothes or drive a better car? And I just thought of myself as being fiscally frugal, and I was saving to invest in a team because I knew what I wanted to do would require more than I had the gifts and the knowledge for it. And I love sports, and I love the idea of people coming together, different gifts, different strengths, different ideas, different thoughts coming together for a common goal. And so I put this little team together. And I mean, this is honestly how where the career was at the time. I was offered the opportunity to model a pair of socks and it was a really tiny budget. Um, there was no exotic location that and they weren't sure if they were even going to like use my mug, like maybe they'd crop at the knees, um and get my feet in the foot model. Yeah, but you know, it was a job, and not a lot of job offers were coming my way at that time. So um, but I just kind of knew like that career had gone on longer than I knew it it should. And I knew that if I didn't close the door on that, I might not live my dream of building a business of the design and the marketing and all of that that I wanted to do. And I liked the people. John and Marilyn Mourette's from North Carolina, really great people. So started doing the research and that included surprise factory inspections because you learn a lot when you show up unexpectedly. Anybody can clean up if they know you're coming. So the how is always really important. How are you able to make these? We love the socks. The fox were great. It's like, oh, my goodness, and um, my husband and I, uh, you know, we we like backpacking and we love the socks. Him being e er on his speed all the times, like these are amazing socks. It's like, all right, what could our team bring to make you know, fashion and great materials and fabrics? How can we make these really special? And come to gather and start? So I said, I, you know, I don't really want to model your socks, but I'd love to work with you. Why don't we start something? And that's how we started. Wow. I mean I can't get over having, especially when you come from a business like either modeling or acting, having the kind of I know self knowledge for lack of another word, to to kind of say yeah, no, it's time, I want to move on because there's so many people in our industry that we hold on. You hold on for as long as you can because you're scared of maybe taking that next step, maybe saying, Okay, this chapter in my life might be done and now it's time to go find the big amazing thing next, and you're so worried about losing the only identity you've had, especially like the four of us here who started so young. So it's amazing to think that you were like, no, it's it's time now to just move on to go and I'm gonna start at square one and I'm gonna build something from the bottom up. I'm just it's so impressive the level of fame you had at that time too, like the potential for public failure that idea, because I mean you were you were on three Sports Illustrated swimsuit covers. That is a level of fame like at that time that we can't even comprehend today. And so it is so inspiring that you were like, well, what it really sounds like is you knew from the time, way before modeling that that's really what you wanted to do, that you had that entrepreneur spirit, and you kind of fell into modeling and that success was not even what you had ever intended. Where did your entrepreneurial spirit start as a kid. Where did you get it? I had, thank you. UM, A lot of it came from my parents. I know they encouraged. They always encouraged hard work. And my first job I was four years old. I get rocks. I'd paint them and I'd stick them into my wagon and go door to door. I was that kid should sell my neighbors whatever they would buy. And uh, you know, my first serious job was a paper route. And where I grew up in Santa Barbara, California. Get to be eleven and a half, and when I finally came of age, my dad he puts this newspaper under my nose and the ad read newspaper carrier one or are you the boy for the job? And he totally knew the reaction that would get. I write to the paper and I said, I'm not the boy. I'm the girl for the job, and I can do it just as well as any boy. And I was a really scrawny eleven year old. I couldn't even lift the sack over my head. I had to crawl on my belly and try to stand up, and just thinking what have I got myself into? And it was it was hard, but um, that I remember, you know, the first day there was a man waiting for his newspaper. I'm riding my bike up the hill and he just starts yelling at me. He's like, you know, what are you doing here? It's a boy's job. You're never gonna last. And it just it was just so shocking. Um. You know, after I handed him the paper, I peddled away so we wouldn't see me cry. But I'm so grateful for kind of rejection because there's nothing to that, you know, there's nothing valid to that. And there were a lot of days I wanted to quit, but I couldn't because what would that do to the next girl? You would want such a responsibility, and I wouldn't give him the satisfaction. So I kept it for three and a half years, and I one Carrier of the Year from my district each year, and I didn't we doing Carrier of the year. Yeah, we've had runner ups, Kathy, but never the winner full city, just from my district. There about that. Um, they did get to go to a luncheon, UM, three luncheon's um. But my dad always said, you know, Kathy, give a hundred and ten percent if the customer expects the paper on the driveway, you put it on the front porch. So that was foundational to learning to under promise over deliver. It's what we do today. And then I have to say the biggest gift of that modeling career was all the rejection. And I didn't appreciate it at the time, but when we started our business and started taking those socks door to door and that comments people would make, Oh my goodness, you know, that's a stupid idea. You can't start a brand with a para sol you know, just and much worse things than that. But it didn't bother me, it didn't destroy me. I was so used to it, and it's like, well, no means we're talking. I'll come back tomorrow, maybe your circumstances will have changed, or maybe you'll be in a better mood. And so I'm great. You know, things in life that are difficult at the time they can really be gifts. Yeah, I need to take that quote. That's an amazing quote. No means we're talking. Yeah, that's a great quote because it's it's true, you're still in the conversation. We're still talking, and you can call back like, hey, help me learn what is it about these great socks that you don't want in your retail store? Because I think they're pretty awesome and I think we'd be a good fit. So yeah, you you persevere, You persevere. And in the beginning, we were in a handful of sporting goods stores. We were in Big five. We um, as you said, Daniel, we were at Kmart and they we were selling our socks there. It's like wow, okay, and the CEO called me in and you know, you having young children, you'll understand this. He uh, he says to me that your socks are a blowout. I was like, oh, no, youngest, that you don't want to blow out. The product is moving out faster than it's coming in. So they asked for exclusivity. Our brand grew, and you know, it was when we started, it was an adventure. I mean we and it's like we just did what we had to do. We slept in airports to save money when we had to, and it really wasn't a big deal. You know. It's it's like, Okay, that's a bold investment. It's not a sacrifice. And it did lead to selling that hundred million par of socks. But um, you know our as our company grew so many lessons. Oh my goodness, I mean so many. I've learned so many lessons the hard way, and one of them was depending on one client for UM. At this point in time, we had thirty seven team members on our payroll and UH, and that company let it be known that it was filing bankruptcy and it was like, oh my goodness. And then the bank who I'd always met with a bank and shared my business plan and let them know, you know, growth and every just what we were doing UM and for me that our team was entirely responsible for the liability and if this didn't work out, they could take away our homes. And so there we were in debt. Starting over, pulled a lot of twenty four sevens. But you know, I worked with amazing people and UM and it's it's really awesome when you know everybody can be lovely when things are going well, but when you're going through the tough times, when you go through those fires in life, it's the people who you know take your hand and they go right through that fire with you. You come out stronger, you come out better. Kathy, I want to ask you because a lot of our podcasts ended up being talking about our experience sort of as child actors, coming from our backgrounds and then finding ourselves on this TV show and suddenly famous. And it sounds like, you know, you likewise came from a sort of humble beginnings, you know, your paper route, and and it sounds like you kind of fell into modeling. And we haven't talked about what was that, like, I mean, what was what was the modeling world like for you at at seventeen? Was it just overwhelming? Did you did you find friends? Or was it just always this crazy scary place that you were so ready to get away from? Um? It was kind of crazy scary. Um, it was different, it was. I mean, I'm grateful I met some amazing people, uh, including oh my goodness, my dear precious friend Julie Campbell. She was the founder of the Sports Illustrated swisuit issue. And Julie went to heaven just about a week ago. I got to be with her on her farm just six days prior. But she continued just to be such an inspiration, a strong woman. Um. But in answer to your question, writer, I mean, first of all, I mean all of you I've uh you know, I read about you. I being your interviews and writer. You've been so open and honest about insecurities you had. I mean you talked about like your skin or something. I mean when I saw you was like, oh my god, they're all so beautiful. Kids are so beautiful. Um. You know, so other people don't see that, but I know what that feels like to you know. For me and modeling, I think because it wasn't my goal, there was a freedom in that. So it's like if it didn't work out, it's like final, do something else for a living, you know, like Mom kind of taught me. So that helped me to not compromise. I have to say, there's a lot of choices I made back then that I wouldn't make today. You know, you you know better, you do better, and it's all part of life and growth and and everything. You know. Hopefully we continue to do that always. Yet that that gave me strength. My faith gave me great strength to um because it didn't really matter, you know, like if God is with us, who can be against us. I didn't really care what other people thought of me. If they didn't like me, that was okay, it's fine, you know, it's all right. And I remember early in my career, I was in Paris and they had something called the Hope Culture Fashion, that's the high fashion, and everybody was waiting for this designer dress to arrive at the studio. The dress arrives and it was so ugly. I mean it was just ugly, and everybody was silent, and then the hair and the makeup people, the art directors of like one by one they said, oh, it's fabulous, it's gorgeous, you know. They were just all these beautiful adjectives, and I was just looking at everybody like, yeah. I just didn't say anything because my mom said, you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything else, Okay, But it really was a great moment. It was like the Emperor's new clothes. And I just thought, all right, Um, first of all, I don't feel really comfortable earning my paycheck off how someone else perceives that I look, Um, that doesn't feel really secure. So uh that that was important. And I also recognize that whatever somebody thinks of me, if I hear a compliment or a criticism, I'm going to remember that and I'm going to take it with a big grain of salt. And ultimately it doesn't really matter. And I have to say, you know, a good lesson when I was thirty seven, you know, in the midst of our business and everything, and some people would say, Oh, it's because you know you had this modeling career, blah blah blah. I think it opened some doors, um, but unfortunately those were doors of curiosity. They kind of wasted each other's time. They didn't take my ideas as CEO seriously. But when I was thirty seven, our our son was was little and he had this wagon on. We have a brick circular driveway, and my husband's pushing him around on this wagon and I was like, that looks like fun. I want to do it. And my sense of adventure outweighs my grace and so I'm standing in the wagon. I'm holding like the steering stick and I'm telling my husband to push me around the driveway like that. I was wagon surfing and it was really funny. I'm trying to go faster, faster, and then I see my my parked car and I overcorrected my turn and I just did a Thames plant, like I don't my hat where to help mac on my face. My husband who was always so calm. I mean your doctor who's just like so calm, and so he starts praying because I think, Okay, I guess I'm in trouble. Um. Anyway, it was my I look like a monster. I mean I was fine. Obviously there was a fear that, you know, blow to the head could have been fatal and all of that. I was fine, but my face was a mess. Our son was all excited, like, Mom, you look like a monster. Will you hear my friends? This is just just a little and she was crying because she didn't think I was a monster. But during that time, our company experienced its biggest surge of growth, So nobody could say that it was dependent upon what I looked like. It wasn't nice. Wow, wear a helmet, kids, don't serve your wagons wear a helmet, maybe a full bubble suitor or don't wagons. Sometimes you just got a wagon surf. It's just the way it is. It's really fun. Who were some of your mentors that you had that or the people you relied on during that time? Uh, you know, I mean early on my mom and dad, and I mean talk about entrepreneur my mom. The ultimate um just amazing. She raised three daughters. She I mean avon lady babysitting business, housekeeping business in the seventies, and she made all our clothes and she would make these halter dresses and I'd make jewelry and we'd sell them at art fairs on the beach. I mean, there was like and then she went back to school to become a nurse. So I just saw her. She could do anything, and it's like, Okay, this doesn't work out, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna do this, and nothing would would stop her. And my dad worked with the labor relations with farm workers specifically, so as a kid, we were not allowed to eat grapes. Dad did rallies with says her chavo As. And that's where like the how became so important to me. Like as a little girl, I was very aware of exploitations of people, and how people are treated has always been at the forefront of my mind and of the utmost importance. And so that's why those surprise factory inspections. It's something that continues today. Our company has invested hundreds of thousands of dollars in our human rights contracts um and it is I mean, it breaks my heart to think of children who are caught in sex trafficking. And it first became aware of it in the days of modeling, although I didn't know the name for it um. And frequently when human beings are no longer profitable in the sex slave trade, they're sold into forced labor, and unlike drugs, human beings can be sold over and over and over again. And that's why even though we don't own any factories and we don't manufacture ourselves, because we work with others who do. That's why it's so important. And when we look at John China and the weaker people and the atrocities that are happening, and it's just so important, you know, we just do what we can and shine a light if we find abuses going on, and do everything we can to make a change. That's amazing. It's also so important for the consumer to really know where your product is coming from. I mean, it's not just about the you know, and that's with every aspect. When it comes down to the food we're eating, when it comes down to the clothes we're wearing, when it comes down to the technology we're using, it's it's on us to to have some idea of what it goes in to get these products. UM. So it's it's amazing that you're you're going above and beyond to make sure that everything is is not only on the up and up, but trying to change, you know, different aspects of the industry that's out there. Is so admirable. But it's on us too. I mean, you've gotta you know, we go in and we buy something at a store and you walk away and you don't think about it ever again. And you can't always do that. You know, You've got to make sure that you kind of know where your stuff is coming from. So that's incredible. Well, I want to ask you about the documentary you've produced, but before I get to it, I have a totally selfless question, not selfless, selfish. I have a selfish selfish question, absolutely the opposite of selfless. It's actually totally UM. I have a very small company. You are so inspirational to me. I have a very small company that I started at the very end of two thousand nineteen that is a hair care company called be Free by Daniel Fishel and thank you. We are currently a total of four people, very small and UM. I guess podcast exclusive. We just did a deal to launch on QVC next month on January, and I am so cited about it. It It was like one of my goals from the moment I started the company. But I would just love to know what is some of your advice for female entrepreneurs and business owners like myself. Well, first of all, Danielle, congratulations and AM so excited for you. That's amazing, That is amazing. So my advice to you be authentic, be yourself, and something. I don't know what it is about women, but frequently women end up selling their companies, their businesses, everything that they pour their hearts and souls into. And people have different reasons for wanting to do that. Yet it's um, it's just it's hard to see because I know what it is to build a brand. It's hard work. It's really hard work. So I get to love what you do, Okay. I mean amazing amazing women, um from you know, Martha Stewart, Donna, Karen Um, you know at Kate Spade and that I mean such a tragedy in her life. I mean brilliant, amazing women. UM And I'd see it more than I see um men selling their their businesses. So I just encourage you, uh to to build it carefully, to build it well, and to retain control of it so you know, as as people come in and help you and build it, retain control so that it can represent your values, what you want it to be, and that other people don't own your name and don't own your reputation. So just um, you know, protect it, be really protective, and and take your time when you're bringing in new people, you know, really really take your time to let them to get to know them. Our team is, I mean, we're really verse in every way including thought, and it makes for some great debates, um, but when it comes to what's really important how people are treated, we're on the same page. Great wonderful advice, Thank you and very good point. You're right, um, thank you. My hair Caroline, not for you at all by Wilford l did not do well it listen. If it didn't, it wasn't on you will definitely not. It's just it's finding the right partners, you know. Thank you. So please tell us about the documentary that you have produced called Anxious Nation, because I mean just the title of that speaks to all of us here. So uh, tell us, well, thank you, and you know what, and you all I just love that you're so transparent and genuine and well, you've talked about this a lot, and it helps so many people. When you talk about it, you let people know they're not alone, and it removes any kind of perceived you know, stigma or shame that some he would have. So uh. Laura Morton is a twenty one time New York Times best selling author and Vanessa Roth is an Academy Award winning director, and they directed and wrote Anxious Nation, and it is about um, the epidemic of anxiety that is impacting our youth. And so when I learned about this is like this is I've served on boards of education and continue to for over twenty five years, been involved in mentoring programs with children around the globe for over thirty years. UM one of the co founders of a school in our community, and children are so close to my heart. I have never experienced a time when it's been more difficult to be a kid or an old person. I mean, it's just hard. Life is hard. And uh, what I love about this documentary so I'm personally presenting it because I've believe in it, and our company is UM Executive Producing because we all believe in it and recognize it's helping people. And it follows several young people and their lives and their parents, and also people in the medical field who UM just offer some great insight. And it's not about necessarily healing people from this yet, I believe it brings a lot of hope. Everybody's got a different story. Um. You know, we're all different, everyone's unique. Yet it really helps families to know that they're not alone, and it there's a lot of healing there. It's powerful, it's really well done, and I'm so proud of these kids who are in it. UM. Laura Morton White, I told you about the author. She's in this with her daughter, and everybody is so candid, they're so open, they're so honest, and I believe it will help people everywhere. That's amazing. Yeah. The when it comes to the anxiety that when I got hit with my disorder, I was twenty one, UM, and it just cut my legs out from under me. Changed my whole life. Happened in the middle of boy meats world, and I went from instantly loving what I did to it being the scariest thing. I had to do it in a heartbeat. And the thing that helped me more and I you know, you deal with your triggers, and you deal with how you have to figure out how you're going to navigate the world. But the thing that helped me more than anything else was talking about it. So the idea that more people are talking about it, it's out there in the public more. It's a discussion that now you. I always tell people the second you say to you're sitting around a table with eight people and you say, oh, I deal with an anxiety disorder, at least three other people say so do I. Um. It's just such a common thing. And one of the things that makes it so horrible is you keep it inside and you are you start to what I call it what everybody calls, but I really call the spiral where you're just in your head and then you can't sleep, and then not sleeping is one of your triggers. So it gets worse and you don't talk about it anymore. And so anybody who shines a light on it as much as possible is a wonderful thing. And I think it is hitting kids more than anybody else. And harder than anybody else right now. And I have my opinion, which is that there's a direct correlation between the amount of anxiety in our society and the rise of social media. Um but that's a personal opinion. I'm sure they'll do the science on it. But the longer that children are on these devices and they are sitting there and staring at everybody who has a quote unquote better life than them, and there's online bullying and cyber bullying, and everybody has an opinion and not everybody's nice you're then that's your outlook on the world completely changes. So I always say the three things that I did that helped me with my anxiety more than anything we're talking about it, died in exercise, and erasing all my social media. Um So, it's so wonderful when such influential people like yourself and like the author and director that you were talking about, really shine a light on on what's going on, because it is. It's it's everywhere, and the more you talk about it, the better it gets. It's one of those things where it really is, let's talk about it. There's no stigma about it at all, sitting there and saying, you know, what give me one second. I'm having a you know, I deal with anxiety. I just need to take a breath. No one looks at you crazy anymore. You just go They go, all right, no problem, and then you move on. And so it's, yeah, this is great to hear that you're doing this, Like, I really can't wait to see this. I love what you just said, and I want to I'm going to share that with with so many people because it's so helpful. It's so so helpful and um, and I think also is recognizing that, you know, I tell people, don't worry about what somebody else thinks of you. Don't let someone else his opinion, you know, define you or destroy you. I mean, don't let anybody put you in a box and way too odd shaped. I don't fit anybody's box. But um, it's it's just no, thank you for that. That's really powerful. Um. But I have to say to all of you, it is such a joy to spend this time with you. I'm so proud. And I didn't think it's like, oh my god, they see so many people. I had a little TV guest spot on their show and every weekase that's abody knew so You're so kind and and I was just so happy to learn about this and to be invited. You are beloved in every generation, um from mine, my mom's um, and our children, our son Eric and his wife Bethany there two little grand are two little grand babies now, and our daughters Lily and Chloe. I mean, everybody loves you, guys, and I think you're you're you're so talented at what you do, and I think people love you because you're genuine into panga. Chloe, our youngest, she's like when she saw you One Girl Meets World, She's like, oh, my goodness, were beautiful. It's even more beautiful. Thank you. So I told her I was doing this, um they she thought that, you know, we were going to be in the same physical space. So anyway, well please give her a hug for me, and and thank you for everything you said. Obviously the same can be said for you. We've we are just so honored to have you here, and we have such fond memories of the week you spent with us on boy Meats World, and um, I really I just I can't thank you enough for being here and and educating us. And you know, I can't wait to see anxious nation. And I'm going to take your business advice and I'm going to remember it forever because, um, you are somebody I so look up to. So thank you again. Well you you be in touch. If there's anything I can do to help you, let me know, and I'm going to be watching for you on QBC. We just started after speaking with him for decades, we just started selling our designs on HS and our underwear and they are such great people. I'm loving it. The customers, the connection, so you are going to It's going to be fantastic for you. And I'm really excited for you. We really waited for us until um we had the right it had it had to be right for our customers, the right product, right price to value ratio, all of that. But I'm so excited for you and we'll be shopping. Thank you so much. Thank you you too. Bye bye. Oh my gosh, she's a legend. She lecturing, I mean, just so inspiring all the way around. That was amazing. She is a an absolute pro. How come I feel like she's been following us for thirty years? Does she does she really know us that? Well? She does have kids and then she has grandkids. So you know, I'm sure the show was around in her life and she probably got you know, they probably kept bringing up here you were on that show. Mom. I'm sure it was just the thing. I thought for sure she was going to be like, who are you people? But in a nice way. You know, she's obviously professional. But I mean she knew without having to even look at our zoom names. She knew exactly who we were. She knew things about things we've talked about. Right, she knew you had talked about anxiety over your skin. Well, she knew you had a mental health thing with anxiety. That was amazing. I also have never in my entire life I felt like I was sitting in a crappier room than I do right now. You want a Christmas tree behind you, like entire time, Like, why does it look like I'm in some weird guys basement writing notes behind me for one of my projects. I've got a bed back and beyond curtain right here to block the window. So, yeah, she was in a Hallmark movie and we were we were in closets. But also, I know this is going to sound almost don't even want to say this because it's so the antithesis of everything she was just talking about. But she hasn't aged, Like I don't want to bring it up, make it about her looks at all, but she hasn't. She hasn't aged. She's incredible, incredible. Yeah, just wow, wow, what a healthy, healthy person, you know what I mean? Like whenever she when she's able to talk about her insane success as a model, which would have been enough for most people, and in the way that she's able to talk about that is just sort of the beginning of a journey and then making all of this money and selling all of these these products and expanding to this like worldwide empire, but still talking about it in terms of just a sort of personal journey, Like it's not about how much money she's made, it's about challenging herself and learning from rejection and just you know, it's helping other people, like helping other people. Yeah, it's just yeah, it just seems it's so clear that she sort of started from such a the place and was able to navigate all these different you know, worlds so well. Um. I love how she continued to talk about because we we get we get this a lot um. She continued to talk about her parents, how her parents were such a force in her life, and how that's you know, that sets the stage for you know, where you're gonna go for good or for bad. It kind of sets the stage and and the idea that you know. She kept kind of referring to that and giving her the strength. The other thing going through my head was there's somebody out there right now who has a rock painted by Cathy Ireland doesn't and doesn't know it was like this this little artist. So but that was that was a truly inspiring conversation. That was That was incredible, It really was. That was great. Yea, we gotta have her on for the Walker Texas Ranger recap to her know, if she's the pro we think she is, she would come in and just like thing about this episode of Walker exactly episode two, season three, Oh cats me out. Yes, this was like, oh wow, everyone knows that season twenty four of Walker Texas Ranger is the best season. She would she would have it nailed, and oh man, that was that was great. That was really cool. That was really fun. I'm so glad that that we got to have her on. Well, thank you for joining us for this episode of Pod Meats World as always. You can follow us on Instagram at pod Meats World Show. You can send us your emails at pod Meats World Show at gmail dot com. And we have merch merch it just yet today we have merch, especially our holiday merch available at pod Meats World Show dot com. And we'll see you next time. We love you all, pod dismissed. Pod Meets World is an i heeart podcast produced and hosted by Danielle Fischel, Wilfred l and Wright Strong executive producers, Jensen Carp and Amy Sugarman, Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor, Tara sud Batch, producer, Jackie Rodriguez, engineer and Boy Meets World super fan Easton Allen. Our theme song is by Kyle Morton of Typhoon. You can follow us on Instagram at Pod Meets World Show or email us at Pod Meets World Show at gmail dot com