Quantum sensors benefit from miniaturized ultrahigh vacuum

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Hello, and welcome to the Physics World weekly

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podcast.

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I'm Hamish Johnston.

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My guest in this episode is Florence

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Concepcion,

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who is senior

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quantum engineer

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at Acor Technologies,

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a UK based company that is developing

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cold matter quantum systems.

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That conversation is coming up after this message

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from which

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has generously

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supported this episode.

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This episode is brought to you by

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enabling breakthroughs in science and technology

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through high precision

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positioning,

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metrology,

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and automation.

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In fields like quantum sensing,

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as we'll hear in today's episode,

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performance often depends on motion at the nanometer

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scale.

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Develops

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compact

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positioning

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solutions

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designed for exactly these challenges,

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offering high stability,

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repeatability,

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and reliable

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performance,

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even in demanding

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environments

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such as ultra high vacuum or cryogenic

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conditions.

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To learn more, visit smartact.com.

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Florence Concepcion

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joined ACORC in 2023

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after doing a PhD at Imperial College London

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on a topic at the intersection of astrophysics

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and atomic physics.

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She was awarded an innovate

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future leaders fellowship

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by the UK government,

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which is worth £1,900,000.

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We chat about how that money will be

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spent on developing new vacuum technologies

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at Acquark.

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Florence also talks about her decision

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to move from academia

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to industry

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and gives some advice

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for those with similar career aims.

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Here's our conversation.

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Hi, Florence. Welcome to the podcast.

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Hi, Hamish. Thank you for having me.

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So, Florence, you began your career as an

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astrophysicist,

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and you've done experimental

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work on plasma physics.

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And that was before you made the move

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to ACORC Technologies.

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Why did you move from academia

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to the quantum technology sector?

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My move into quantum

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was almost an accident, really. It wasn't

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planned, and I didn't actually

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think I had the knowledge to work in

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the quantum industry.

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My background,

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yeah, as you said, I was I was

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an astronomer.

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After doing a research placement

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on x-ray astronomy,

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which was all behind a computer sitting at

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a desk, I found that I I really

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actually wanted to do a bit more experimental

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physics.

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And so

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I found my next position was

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measuring the emission spectrum

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of doubly ionized metals and using that data

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to determine

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the atomic structure

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of,

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in my case, it was for iron,

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which was which was great. I had a

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little bit of

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lab experience, a little bit of computational analysis.

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I got to compare to theory. It was

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a a very nice confined project. But

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importantly for me at the time, the applications

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of the data I was producing was for

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astronomers. And so that linked me back to

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my first love of astronomy.

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But I actually had to leave that position,

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for I had to move from London. I

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was I was doing that work at Imperial

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College. Had to move from London down to

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Southampton

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for,

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for family reasons, for,

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to to care for someone full time. And

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so as part of doing that, I I

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did look around

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whether I could continue in academia here. I

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looked at the universities close to where I'm

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based.

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But I the the field that I was

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working in was quite narrow, and so I

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would have to make quite a big change

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in my scientific expertise. And,

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it's not that I wasn't up for that,

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but it was a big task. And there

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were other things at hand to to focus

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on. But,

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one of my now colleagues reached out,

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and,

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he said he let me know there's this

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there's this startup called Acart Technologies, and,

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they're they're looking to hire. You should reach

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out. And, again, I read I read it.

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I thought, oh, it's a it's a quantum

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company. I'm not gonna have anything to be

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able to offer here.

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I I was I was a little discouraged,

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I think, actually, and and I sort of

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responded, like, oh, don't be silly. I can't

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I can't apply for that. But no. He

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encouraged me again, and I I spoke to,

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I met up with Alex and Andre, the

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the cofounders,

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and,

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had a tour and soon realized that, yeah,

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the skills that they need are not people

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who are experts in quantum,

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but people who have a variety of skills.

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And in my case, I had these lab

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skills from,

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in in plasma physics and in the study

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in in, working on vacuum systems.

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And that, yeah, that that

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it was sort of this bizarre sort of

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puzzle piece that fit really well.

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So that was my move into into quantum.

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It wasn't planned,

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but,

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there there's a huge variety of skill sets

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needed for quantum technology.

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So I'm very I'm thrilled that,

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my my colleague reached out. And I'm thrilled

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that I I took the little leap as

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well, and and I did go have the

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tour and I did have the interview,

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thinking that I I wasn't sure what I

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was gonna be able to contribute. But, I

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I also think part of it was just

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attitude. I was very I was very,

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what's the word,

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excited to be able to just contribute,

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what I could. And, yeah, that's brought me

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here. Very exciting. I'm very glad I did

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it.

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So, yeah, you you've hinted a bit at

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at some of the, I suppose,

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instrumentation

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that that you're that you use at Acorn.

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Can you give us a a a an

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idea of the technologies

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that the company is developing and your role

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in that development?

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Yeah. Of course. So AQARC Technologies,

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is

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its aim is to take

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quant quantum technology

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out of the lab and into the real

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world.

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It's,

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the our main focus is is deployment of

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this quantum technology. For that to happen, there

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are lots of challenges,

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which we need to tackle.

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Size, weight,

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power consumption, cost,

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robustness, these are all things that need to

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be worked on. A very key component of

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these quantum technologies

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is the vacuum chamber in which

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atoms are trapped

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and probed and used for measuring.

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This vacuum chamber is essential.

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Without a ultra high vacuum,

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the atoms that we are using to take

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these measurements,

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will be bombarded and,

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and and measurements that we get will be

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imprecise.

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And so part of my job is to

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create these ultra high vacuum chambers, these chambers

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with essentially

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one molecule

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per,

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I don't know, centimeter cubed as it were,

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less than that.

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And

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beyond that now is to be able to

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miniaturize them and make them more robust. That

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is the aim of of what I do

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at Acro Technologies.

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And and Florence, you've been awarded a £1,900,000

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innovate

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UK

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future leaders fellowship

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from the the government of the United Kingdom.

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And you're going to use that,

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of money over the next four four years

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to develop new technologies

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at ACORC.

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Can can you give us a a bit

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of a background

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into that fellowship? What's the purpose

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of the fellowship?

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And,

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what technologies

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are you developing?

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So

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the aim is

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the engineering, the miniaturization,

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and the scalability

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of ultra high vacuum chambers for quantum technology

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purposes.

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So I said the as as I said,

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the vacuum chamber is a limiting factor

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in, currently in some of our quantum systems.

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It has,

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usually, it's made of something out of stainless

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steel and glass or titanium,

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but relatively heavy,

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metals.

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These this can be made lighter. This could

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be made smaller.

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And we're currently

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using

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iron pumps, which are

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power hungry is not the word, but we

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we're currently using ion pumps, which have a

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power consumption

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and must be on at all times in

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order to ensure that ultra high vacuum

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remains throughout the lifetime of that of that

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item, of that sensor, of that system.

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By

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creating a passive vacuum, we will not need

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to have the ion pump constantly pumping for

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the lifetime of that sensor. We can have

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a system which is essentially switched on and

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switched off as needed,

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rather than have it constantly running.

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Another

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con of the ion pump is a magnetic

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field. If we want to use the quantum

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sensor to measure magnetic fields, the ion pump

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gets in the way of that because we're

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producing our own magnetic field.

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All these

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small little,

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small factors compound and add a layers of

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complexity to these quantum sensors which which are

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not needed. And so the aim of my

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fellowship is to

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tackle all the little vacuum challenges in order

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to be able to create smaller,

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robust,

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less

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expensive

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ultra high vacuum chambers

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and in doing so, enabling

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quantum sensors and quantum technology to do the

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same.

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Another factor is manpower. For example, it takes,

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people who are highly specialized and highly skilled

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to

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create to to to build one and then

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to go through the process

287
00:10:22,259 --> 00:10:23,559
of building this,

288
00:10:24,259 --> 00:10:27,059
chamber made of metal and glass down bringing

289
00:10:27,059 --> 00:10:29,115
that down to ultra high vacuum and then

290
00:10:29,115 --> 00:10:31,274
ensuring it stays at ultra high vacuum throughout

291
00:10:31,274 --> 00:10:33,274
the lifetime of the quantum sensor. All of

292
00:10:33,274 --> 00:10:36,014
these are the people who maintain these,

293
00:10:36,634 --> 00:10:38,394
are very skilled. And so in order to

294
00:10:38,394 --> 00:10:39,214
be able to

295
00:10:39,754 --> 00:10:40,235
make the

296
00:10:40,875 --> 00:10:43,195
streamline the process and make it cheaper and

297
00:10:43,195 --> 00:10:44,159
make it scalable,

298
00:10:44,700 --> 00:10:47,279
we will no longer have all these resources

299
00:10:47,500 --> 00:10:48,240
being drained.

300
00:10:48,940 --> 00:10:52,399
And so the the future leader fellowship has,

301
00:10:53,419 --> 00:10:55,679
provided me with, like he said, money.

302
00:10:56,195 --> 00:10:57,934
And that money will be used to,

303
00:10:58,475 --> 00:11:00,495
it has been used already so far to

304
00:11:00,634 --> 00:11:01,695
build my lab,

305
00:11:02,475 --> 00:11:03,455
build my team,

306
00:11:03,835 --> 00:11:06,634
and, the through the program, there is a

307
00:11:06,634 --> 00:11:08,554
huge amount of resources in order to make

308
00:11:08,554 --> 00:11:10,320
sure that I'm making the most out of

309
00:11:10,399 --> 00:11:11,940
the time that I have and,

310
00:11:12,879 --> 00:11:15,539
will can can do the research independently

311
00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:17,059
to the best of my ability.

312
00:11:18,799 --> 00:11:20,980
I see. And and and so with passive

313
00:11:21,360 --> 00:11:23,700
pumping, this this is the idea that,

314
00:11:25,434 --> 00:11:28,174
you I mean, do do you use a

315
00:11:28,554 --> 00:11:29,054
conventional

316
00:11:29,835 --> 00:11:32,095
ion pump or mechanical pump to first

317
00:11:32,554 --> 00:11:35,195
pump down the system, and then the vacuum

318
00:11:35,195 --> 00:11:36,495
is maintained using

319
00:11:37,355 --> 00:11:37,855
materials

320
00:11:40,100 --> 00:11:40,920
that absorb,

321
00:11:43,460 --> 00:11:45,800
gas molecules, and and that maintains

322
00:11:46,340 --> 00:11:48,580
the vacuum. So is is the idea that

323
00:11:48,580 --> 00:11:50,660
you you sort of pump these things down,

324
00:11:50,660 --> 00:11:52,884
you seal them up, and then you ship

325
00:11:52,884 --> 00:11:54,184
them out. And

326
00:11:54,725 --> 00:11:56,745
these special coating materials

327
00:11:57,445 --> 00:12:00,004
maintain the vacuum over the lifetime of the

328
00:12:00,004 --> 00:12:00,504
sensor?

329
00:12:01,205 --> 00:12:03,924
Yeah. That's exactly it. So currently, we will

330
00:12:03,924 --> 00:12:06,024
receive a a chamber, and we'll use

331
00:12:08,740 --> 00:12:10,659
rough pumps such as a scroll pump or

332
00:12:10,659 --> 00:12:12,899
rotary vein pump. And these will get get

333
00:12:12,899 --> 00:12:14,039
things down from,

334
00:12:15,379 --> 00:12:18,440
one bar, which is almost equivalent to atmospheric

335
00:12:18,500 --> 00:12:20,120
pressure, down to

336
00:12:20,659 --> 00:12:23,825
10 to the minus two millibar, for example.

337
00:12:23,965 --> 00:12:25,804
And then we'll have a further pump such

338
00:12:25,804 --> 00:12:27,164
as a turbo pump that will get us

339
00:12:27,164 --> 00:12:28,764
down to 10 to the minus six, ten

340
00:12:28,764 --> 00:12:30,044
to the minus seven, ten to the minus

341
00:12:30,044 --> 00:12:31,664
eight, ten to the minus nine millibar.

342
00:12:32,125 --> 00:12:34,445
And then once and then we will move

343
00:12:34,445 --> 00:12:36,044
on to iron pumps, and they will get

344
00:12:36,044 --> 00:12:37,320
us down to the 10 to the minus

345
00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:39,019
ten, ten to the minus 11 millibar.

346
00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:43,259
And then in a conventional system, we would

347
00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:45,000
seal off the system from the from the

348
00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:47,000
larger pump, separate them, and we would leave

349
00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:47,899
the iron pump

350
00:12:48,279 --> 00:12:50,379
running to actively pump away.

351
00:12:51,065 --> 00:12:52,585
Like you said, in a in a passive

352
00:12:52,585 --> 00:12:53,965
system, we can have materials,

353
00:12:54,825 --> 00:12:58,585
such as non non evaporable getters. They can

354
00:12:58,585 --> 00:13:00,445
coat the inside of your chambers.

355
00:13:01,225 --> 00:13:02,820
Not only do they add this

356
00:13:03,779 --> 00:13:05,879
sticky layer as it were in order to

357
00:13:06,100 --> 00:13:09,539
enable to in order to have molecules stick

358
00:13:09,539 --> 00:13:11,700
to that instead of roam free inside the

359
00:13:11,700 --> 00:13:12,519
vacuum chamber,

360
00:13:13,220 --> 00:13:14,039
they help

361
00:13:16,259 --> 00:13:18,440
to enable the ultra high vacuum,

362
00:13:19,034 --> 00:13:22,235
but they also reduce outgassing from the material

363
00:13:22,235 --> 00:13:23,134
body itself.

364
00:13:23,754 --> 00:13:26,235
The material, you know, a a a chunk

365
00:13:26,235 --> 00:13:28,394
of stainless steel will will not be pure

366
00:13:28,394 --> 00:13:31,549
stainless steel. There'll be molecules in there. And

367
00:13:31,610 --> 00:13:33,929
by having that neg coating, we actually can

368
00:13:33,929 --> 00:13:35,929
prevent a little bit of outgassing as well.

369
00:13:35,929 --> 00:13:37,210
And that helps us with,

370
00:13:37,690 --> 00:13:39,789
ensuring that we can have that passive vacuum.

371
00:13:40,169 --> 00:13:42,110
Another factor is gas permeation.

372
00:13:42,490 --> 00:13:42,825
Gas

373
00:13:43,304 --> 00:13:45,325
per helium permeates through everything.

374
00:13:45,865 --> 00:13:47,565
And so if we can find a way

375
00:13:47,625 --> 00:13:50,125
to reduce that, we will be improving our

376
00:13:50,264 --> 00:13:51,404
our passive vacuum

377
00:13:51,945 --> 00:13:52,684
even better.

378
00:13:54,105 --> 00:13:55,544
There are so many there are so many

379
00:13:55,544 --> 00:13:58,445
factors. I I'm I mean, even just

380
00:13:59,050 --> 00:14:01,710
preventing leaks from occurring in the first place,

381
00:14:02,090 --> 00:14:03,930
we need to think about what materials we're

382
00:14:03,930 --> 00:14:07,389
using, what our method for sealing these materials

383
00:14:07,450 --> 00:14:08,190
up are.

384
00:14:08,570 --> 00:14:09,070
And,

385
00:14:09,850 --> 00:14:11,769
yeah, it it's there there are so many

386
00:14:11,769 --> 00:14:13,290
factors, and and a lot of them start

387
00:14:13,290 --> 00:14:14,995
right at the design stage. If you pick

388
00:14:14,995 --> 00:14:16,834
the wrong material at the start, you may

389
00:14:16,834 --> 00:14:19,314
never reach below a certain vacuum at all

390
00:14:19,314 --> 00:14:21,074
no matter what you do, no matter what

391
00:14:21,074 --> 00:14:22,615
processes you put it under.

392
00:14:23,074 --> 00:14:24,834
So I that is that is the part

393
00:14:24,834 --> 00:14:27,714
where I'm at now, designing and testing what

394
00:14:27,714 --> 00:14:29,360
I can in order to be able to,

395
00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:31,200
within the next few years, be able to

396
00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:31,700
provide

397
00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:33,460
passive vacuum chambers.

398
00:14:34,639 --> 00:14:36,320
I see. And and when you talk about

399
00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:38,660
the lifetime of the sensor, is that

400
00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:40,340
well,

401
00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:42,799
how how long is you know, can you

402
00:14:42,799 --> 00:14:43,299
maintain

403
00:14:43,964 --> 00:14:46,044
one of these sensors at, you know, a

404
00:14:46,044 --> 00:14:46,544
sufficient

405
00:14:47,004 --> 00:14:50,284
vacuum level for it to operate properly? Is

406
00:14:50,284 --> 00:14:52,204
it is it a matter of hours or

407
00:14:52,204 --> 00:14:53,264
days or

408
00:14:54,044 --> 00:14:55,584
months or is it forever?

409
00:14:56,779 --> 00:14:59,179
So right now, with the vacuum chambers I'm

410
00:14:59,179 --> 00:15:01,339
making with the ion pumps attached, with our

411
00:15:01,339 --> 00:15:01,820
current,

412
00:15:02,139 --> 00:15:02,639
materials,

413
00:15:03,339 --> 00:15:03,820
the,

414
00:15:04,299 --> 00:15:06,720
ion pump is good to go for years.

415
00:15:06,779 --> 00:15:08,539
That that that system will remain at a

416
00:15:08,539 --> 00:15:10,559
low pressure sufficiently for years.

417
00:15:11,134 --> 00:15:12,654
I can't tell you what I would be

418
00:15:12,654 --> 00:15:14,735
able to do with passive yet as I

419
00:15:14,735 --> 00:15:15,315
I haven't

420
00:15:15,774 --> 00:15:17,375
done the experiments yet in order to be

421
00:15:17,375 --> 00:15:19,134
able to have a number to back up,

422
00:15:19,134 --> 00:15:21,535
but the aim is years. The aim is

423
00:15:21,535 --> 00:15:22,115
to have

424
00:15:22,575 --> 00:15:25,039
a a sealed passive ultra high vacuum chamber,

425
00:15:25,039 --> 00:15:27,459
which I know reliably will be,

426
00:15:28,399 --> 00:15:30,399
at at ultra high vacuum for on the

427
00:15:30,399 --> 00:15:32,179
order of years. That's the aim.

428
00:15:32,879 --> 00:15:34,959
I see. And and so the idea here

429
00:15:34,959 --> 00:15:37,059
is that you can take these sensors

430
00:15:38,004 --> 00:15:40,164
out of the lab. You can, I don't

431
00:15:40,164 --> 00:15:41,304
know, put them on

432
00:15:41,684 --> 00:15:44,004
a a submarine if you wanted to, or

433
00:15:44,004 --> 00:15:45,865
you could launch them into space,

434
00:15:46,404 --> 00:15:49,784
and they would they would continue to sense,

435
00:15:50,610 --> 00:15:52,049
and you wouldn't have to worry about the

436
00:15:52,049 --> 00:15:52,549
vacuum?

437
00:15:53,330 --> 00:15:55,169
Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. We,

438
00:15:55,649 --> 00:15:58,789
ACOG has has done trials using these systems,

439
00:15:58,850 --> 00:16:00,710
using our current vacuum chambers.

440
00:16:01,809 --> 00:16:02,549
We had

441
00:16:03,009 --> 00:16:03,509
our

442
00:16:03,904 --> 00:16:06,245
cold atom system on the submersible

443
00:16:06,785 --> 00:16:08,085
called Boaty McBoatface.

444
00:16:08,705 --> 00:16:11,764
We ran that trial last year. And, similarly,

445
00:16:11,985 --> 00:16:12,644
we had,

446
00:16:13,345 --> 00:16:15,605
one of our atomic clocks on

447
00:16:16,144 --> 00:16:16,644
a

448
00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:19,820
on with a trial with the Royal Navy.

449
00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:21,879
I think that was three days on the

450
00:16:21,879 --> 00:16:22,379
Solent,

451
00:16:22,839 --> 00:16:24,700
just just nearby close to Southampton.

452
00:16:25,559 --> 00:16:27,639
So yeah. And and these these systems have

453
00:16:27,639 --> 00:16:28,779
been proven to

454
00:16:29,095 --> 00:16:31,595
to to be robust enough to continue operating

455
00:16:31,654 --> 00:16:33,115
under a variety of conditions.

456
00:16:34,294 --> 00:16:37,195
It is I think they're they're great milestones

457
00:16:37,254 --> 00:16:40,054
improving the that these systems can come out

458
00:16:40,054 --> 00:16:41,914
of the lab will be useful,

459
00:16:42,679 --> 00:16:45,080
and and that is very important to us

460
00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:47,159
too so that we know which direction to

461
00:16:47,159 --> 00:16:49,179
keep on going in. There's no point in

462
00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:51,240
making a a sensor for the sake of

463
00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:53,000
making a sensor if we can't then deploy

464
00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:53,659
it later.

465
00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:56,644
I see. And and so these sensors that

466
00:16:56,725 --> 00:16:58,164
I mean, it sounds to me like,

467
00:16:59,284 --> 00:17:03,065
the the an important application would be navigation,

468
00:17:03,365 --> 00:17:05,704
and in particular, navigation when

469
00:17:06,085 --> 00:17:09,545
a GPS GPS system has has failed or

470
00:17:09,849 --> 00:17:12,089
has shut down. So you've got you've got

471
00:17:12,089 --> 00:17:13,230
a very good clock

472
00:17:13,690 --> 00:17:14,429
on board.

473
00:17:17,049 --> 00:17:19,309
Do do this do you also do sensors

474
00:17:19,369 --> 00:17:19,690
that,

475
00:17:20,649 --> 00:17:21,549
that sense,

476
00:17:22,169 --> 00:17:22,669
acceleration?

477
00:17:23,654 --> 00:17:25,914
So you can you can navigate,

478
00:17:27,015 --> 00:17:29,515
by knowing how your vessel

479
00:17:29,894 --> 00:17:32,934
or vehicle is accelerating and and in which

480
00:17:32,934 --> 00:17:33,434
direction.

481
00:17:33,975 --> 00:17:34,855
Is that also,

482
00:17:35,414 --> 00:17:37,035
something that you're looking at?

483
00:17:38,019 --> 00:17:40,180
It is it's definitely something that can be

484
00:17:40,180 --> 00:17:41,320
done with this technology.

485
00:17:41,700 --> 00:17:43,539
If we're looking at that right now, I

486
00:17:43,539 --> 00:17:45,140
wouldn't be able to tell you. I don't,

487
00:17:45,619 --> 00:17:47,700
I I don't oversee what what every project

488
00:17:47,700 --> 00:17:49,539
is, but I I can tell you that

489
00:17:49,539 --> 00:17:50,200
we made

490
00:17:50,579 --> 00:17:51,320
a gravimeter,

491
00:17:52,294 --> 00:17:52,794
gravitometer.

492
00:17:53,815 --> 00:17:55,494
We we made a we made a sensor

493
00:17:55,494 --> 00:17:57,355
that can that can measure gravity,

494
00:17:58,775 --> 00:18:01,255
a year or two ago. And so it

495
00:18:01,335 --> 00:18:03,335
it's it's proven that this technology can be

496
00:18:03,335 --> 00:18:05,654
used for a variety of sensing, a variety

497
00:18:05,654 --> 00:18:07,380
of things. But, yes, that's exactly it.

498
00:18:08,180 --> 00:18:10,500
The aim is that these will contribute to,

499
00:18:10,819 --> 00:18:12,259
the these will be out these will be

500
00:18:12,259 --> 00:18:13,160
useful for,

501
00:18:13,779 --> 00:18:16,819
position, navigation, and timing. And like you said,

502
00:18:16,819 --> 00:18:17,640
in GNSS

503
00:18:18,099 --> 00:18:19,079
denied environments,

504
00:18:19,700 --> 00:18:20,680
these will be invaluable.

505
00:18:21,384 --> 00:18:23,384
We chatted a bit about your career,

506
00:18:23,865 --> 00:18:25,884
at the beginning of this interview,

507
00:18:26,585 --> 00:18:29,005
and I wanted to go back to careers

508
00:18:29,304 --> 00:18:30,684
in quantum technology.

509
00:18:32,345 --> 00:18:35,065
What advice would you give to, an early

510
00:18:35,065 --> 00:18:37,369
career physicist? You know, let's say somebody who's

511
00:18:37,369 --> 00:18:39,929
finished a PhD or, you know, maybe even

512
00:18:39,929 --> 00:18:40,890
somebody who's,

513
00:18:42,569 --> 00:18:45,369
done an undergraduate degree in physics and is

514
00:18:45,369 --> 00:18:46,190
really keen

515
00:18:46,650 --> 00:18:47,630
on entering

516
00:18:48,009 --> 00:18:49,549
the quantum technology

517
00:18:49,849 --> 00:18:50,349
sector.

518
00:18:51,605 --> 00:18:53,845
What what what what would your top bits

519
00:18:53,845 --> 00:18:56,004
of advice be for for a person like

520
00:18:56,004 --> 00:18:56,504
that?

521
00:18:57,845 --> 00:18:58,345
If,

522
00:18:58,804 --> 00:19:01,924
for example, they they have studied, someone has

523
00:19:01,924 --> 00:19:04,420
studied quantum and they want to continue studying

524
00:19:04,559 --> 00:19:05,059
quantum,

525
00:19:05,599 --> 00:19:07,220
within education, for example,

526
00:19:07,519 --> 00:19:10,000
there are definitely very clear avenues for that.

527
00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:11,779
I you know, there are there are,

528
00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:15,200
PhDs in in quantum technologies that that can

529
00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:15,940
be found.

530
00:19:16,505 --> 00:19:19,005
But if I I I think that that

531
00:19:19,224 --> 00:19:20,184
path is quite,

532
00:19:21,304 --> 00:19:23,404
is is linear and and easy to follow.

533
00:19:23,865 --> 00:19:26,204
But for someone who maybe

534
00:19:26,585 --> 00:19:29,849
hasn't quite studied quantum or, has some quantum

535
00:19:29,849 --> 00:19:32,650
background but doesn't want their entire expertise to

536
00:19:32,650 --> 00:19:34,750
be based around it, I would say

537
00:19:35,130 --> 00:19:38,670
try try everything. But, yeah, be be resilient.

538
00:19:38,809 --> 00:19:41,210
Find your skill set, which, which you are

539
00:19:41,210 --> 00:19:43,424
comfortable with, which you excel in,

540
00:19:43,985 --> 00:19:46,305
which you are passionate about. And there is

541
00:19:46,305 --> 00:19:47,904
a good chance that there there will be

542
00:19:47,904 --> 00:19:50,625
quantum technology related to that somehow. There will

543
00:19:50,625 --> 00:19:53,505
be a space for for whatever skill set

544
00:19:53,505 --> 00:19:54,404
that you have.

545
00:19:55,105 --> 00:19:57,990
But as well as this, I think I

546
00:19:57,990 --> 00:20:00,170
think networking, reaching out to people,

547
00:20:01,269 --> 00:20:03,829
saying hello to everyone and anyone, I I

548
00:20:03,829 --> 00:20:05,349
think is is really nice. You get to

549
00:20:05,349 --> 00:20:06,809
know a variety of people,

550
00:20:07,349 --> 00:20:09,430
and you get to expose to new worlds

551
00:20:09,430 --> 00:20:11,109
that you that you don't even know are

552
00:20:11,109 --> 00:20:11,769
out there.

553
00:20:12,554 --> 00:20:13,294
I think

554
00:20:13,674 --> 00:20:15,994
being resilient in in both of those things

555
00:20:15,994 --> 00:20:16,894
are really important.

556
00:20:17,355 --> 00:20:19,434
You need to keep pushing through that. You

557
00:20:19,434 --> 00:20:21,115
might try something and absolutely hate it, but

558
00:20:21,115 --> 00:20:22,554
at least you know now, and you can

559
00:20:22,554 --> 00:20:24,089
move on to the next skill set.

560
00:20:25,450 --> 00:20:27,230
Yeah. That would be that would be my

561
00:20:27,369 --> 00:20:29,390
my advice. Just keep pushing through.

562
00:20:30,250 --> 00:20:32,169
And, you you know, just speaking to you

563
00:20:32,169 --> 00:20:32,669
now,

564
00:20:32,970 --> 00:20:35,609
it it it sounds to me that your

565
00:20:35,609 --> 00:20:36,109
role

566
00:20:36,650 --> 00:20:38,190
at ACORC is,

567
00:20:38,884 --> 00:20:41,284
I mean, is it sort of similar in

568
00:20:41,284 --> 00:20:42,505
some ways to

569
00:20:43,044 --> 00:20:43,544
academic

570
00:20:44,005 --> 00:20:46,404
research? I mean, you've you you talk about

571
00:20:46,404 --> 00:20:48,264
having a lab, for example,

572
00:20:48,724 --> 00:20:49,944
which, you know, sounds,

573
00:20:50,325 --> 00:20:50,984
you know,

574
00:20:51,444 --> 00:20:52,424
very academic

575
00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:53,740
to me.

576
00:20:54,119 --> 00:20:54,940
Do you,

577
00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:57,480
I mean, do you are are you publishing

578
00:20:57,480 --> 00:20:57,980
papers,

579
00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:02,200
in physics journals on your work at the

580
00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:03,960
moment? Is it is it sort of an

581
00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:04,779
open thing

582
00:21:05,125 --> 00:21:07,224
that you're doing, or is it very much

583
00:21:07,284 --> 00:21:07,784
proprietary?

584
00:21:10,085 --> 00:21:12,025
It's a really interesting question. I,

585
00:21:12,484 --> 00:21:14,804
I I've been fortunate with this fellowship that

586
00:21:14,804 --> 00:21:17,444
I can almost take an academic twist on

587
00:21:17,444 --> 00:21:19,365
on this placement in industry, on this in

588
00:21:19,365 --> 00:21:20,424
this role in industry.

589
00:21:21,039 --> 00:21:25,059
I am not planning to publish any papers

590
00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:25,700
yet.

591
00:21:26,079 --> 00:21:26,579
The

592
00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:30,259
the the technology that I'm working on,

593
00:21:30,559 --> 00:21:32,799
any IP that I have, obvious obviously, I

594
00:21:32,799 --> 00:21:34,579
would want AQAC to

595
00:21:35,039 --> 00:21:36,500
to to have as needed.

596
00:21:37,095 --> 00:21:39,015
But my plan is further on down the

597
00:21:39,015 --> 00:21:39,994
line when I'm,

598
00:21:40,535 --> 00:21:41,755
when I've established

599
00:21:42,134 --> 00:21:42,634
multiple,

600
00:21:43,815 --> 00:21:46,474
when I've made multiple improvements in multiple areas

601
00:21:46,934 --> 00:21:49,095
in vacuum technology to then be able to

602
00:21:49,095 --> 00:21:50,875
to publish the work that I'm doing.

603
00:21:51,740 --> 00:21:54,559
I see. And and that's you at ACORC,

604
00:21:54,619 --> 00:21:55,920
but you you must have

605
00:21:56,220 --> 00:21:58,559
lots of colleagues who are physicists,

606
00:21:59,580 --> 00:22:00,320
and doing

607
00:22:00,700 --> 00:22:01,680
other jobs.

608
00:22:02,059 --> 00:22:02,460
What,

609
00:22:03,884 --> 00:22:06,065
you know, what what are the roles,

610
00:22:06,445 --> 00:22:07,345
at ACORC?

611
00:22:07,964 --> 00:22:09,825
You know, if if if a physicist

612
00:22:10,285 --> 00:22:12,125
were to get a job there, what what

613
00:22:12,125 --> 00:22:13,085
sort of positions

614
00:22:13,724 --> 00:22:15,825
what could they expect to do, let's say?

615
00:22:16,820 --> 00:22:17,320
It

616
00:22:17,740 --> 00:22:20,220
it there's a, yeah, there's a spectrum of

617
00:22:20,220 --> 00:22:22,080
specialties there. We have,

618
00:22:22,940 --> 00:22:26,400
electronic engineering. We have those that that focus

619
00:22:26,460 --> 00:22:26,960
on,

620
00:22:27,740 --> 00:22:28,994
optics. And

621
00:22:30,494 --> 00:22:32,974
we have so many people that have such

622
00:22:32,974 --> 00:22:36,174
a diverse skill set that I'll be honest.

623
00:22:36,174 --> 00:22:37,855
When I think about what everyone is doing

624
00:22:37,855 --> 00:22:38,835
now in the team

625
00:22:39,214 --> 00:22:40,734
and and compare it to what they were

626
00:22:40,734 --> 00:22:43,134
doing maybe six months ago, it's not even

627
00:22:43,134 --> 00:22:44,819
the same the same,

628
00:22:45,619 --> 00:22:47,539
the same skill set being developed or the

629
00:22:47,539 --> 00:22:50,339
same same skill set being contributed to the

630
00:22:50,339 --> 00:22:51,720
current project at hand.

631
00:22:53,299 --> 00:22:53,539
There

632
00:22:54,900 --> 00:22:56,500
I I mean, I I think it can

633
00:22:56,500 --> 00:22:57,640
it can vary wildly.

634
00:22:59,855 --> 00:23:01,954
I see. And and I'm

635
00:23:02,335 --> 00:23:04,414
guessing that I mean, is it not just

636
00:23:04,414 --> 00:23:06,734
technical roles, for example? I mean, if you're

637
00:23:06,734 --> 00:23:07,954
a physicist who,

638
00:23:08,974 --> 00:23:10,914
I don't know, is interested in a

639
00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:13,660
a career in sales

640
00:23:14,039 --> 00:23:14,279
or,

641
00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:19,799
I don't know what what the word is

642
00:23:19,799 --> 00:23:22,039
these days, sort of media relations. Are there

643
00:23:22,839 --> 00:23:24,839
you know, is Acorn a big enough company

644
00:23:24,839 --> 00:23:26,865
that there could be room for for those

645
00:23:26,865 --> 00:23:29,045
sort of people within the organization?

646
00:23:30,065 --> 00:23:31,045
So now,

647
00:23:31,585 --> 00:23:32,565
yes. Definitely.

648
00:23:33,265 --> 00:23:35,984
When I joined the company, we were eight

649
00:23:35,984 --> 00:23:37,825
people, and I think seven of us seven

650
00:23:37,825 --> 00:23:39,365
of us were technical staff.

651
00:23:40,390 --> 00:23:42,869
Now we are a company of, I wanna

652
00:23:42,869 --> 00:23:45,190
say, 21 people, but I might be I

653
00:23:45,190 --> 00:23:47,130
might be a little bit off there. And

654
00:23:47,349 --> 00:23:49,269
I would say a quarter of us are

655
00:23:49,269 --> 00:23:50,009
are nontechnical.

656
00:23:50,950 --> 00:23:52,089
Like you said, the,

657
00:23:53,054 --> 00:23:53,554
marketing,

658
00:23:54,095 --> 00:23:54,595
commercial,

659
00:23:55,134 --> 00:23:57,954
all of these things are are factors that

660
00:23:58,174 --> 00:24:00,194
are are essential in running a company.

661
00:24:00,815 --> 00:24:02,974
But yeah. So definitely, there's like I said,

662
00:24:02,974 --> 00:24:04,595
in quantum, there's all sorts.

663
00:24:05,170 --> 00:24:07,170
Well, that's great. Thanks. Thanks for coming on

664
00:24:07,170 --> 00:24:10,049
the podcast, Florence, and and talking about your

665
00:24:10,049 --> 00:24:13,670
career and, and ACORC as well. Hopefully,

666
00:24:14,049 --> 00:24:14,950
it will inspire,

667
00:24:16,369 --> 00:24:18,769
early career physicists who are listening to the

668
00:24:18,769 --> 00:24:20,230
podcast to look into,

669
00:24:21,035 --> 00:24:22,335
the quantum industry.

670
00:24:22,954 --> 00:24:24,794
Because I mean, it is booming, isn't it?

671
00:24:24,794 --> 00:24:25,855
It's very exciting.

672
00:24:26,234 --> 00:24:27,994
And there seem to be a lot of

673
00:24:27,994 --> 00:24:31,595
really interesting roles that physicists can do. So,

674
00:24:31,595 --> 00:24:33,994
yeah, thanks for coming on. Thank you very

675
00:24:33,994 --> 00:24:35,775
much for having me. It's been great.

676
00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:45,980
That was Florence Concepcion

677
00:24:46,839 --> 00:24:47,660
of ACORC,

678
00:24:48,214 --> 00:24:51,835
who is awarded an innovate future leaders fellowship

679
00:24:52,295 --> 00:24:53,595
from the UK government.

680
00:24:54,615 --> 00:24:55,115
Congratulations,

681
00:24:55,575 --> 00:24:58,954
Florence, and thanks for a fascinating discussion.

682
00:25:00,134 --> 00:25:02,954
This episode is generously supported

683
00:25:03,569 --> 00:25:04,309
by Smaract.

684
00:25:05,250 --> 00:25:08,789
I'm Hamish Johnston, and our producer is Fred

685
00:25:08,849 --> 00:25:09,349
Iles.

686
00:25:10,130 --> 00:25:12,789
The theme music for this podcast is called

687
00:25:12,849 --> 00:25:14,230
one three seven,

688
00:25:14,690 --> 00:25:15,909
and it was composed

689
00:25:16,210 --> 00:25:16,950
and performed

690
00:25:17,335 --> 00:25:18,154
by the physicist

691
00:25:19,015 --> 00:25:19,515
Philip

692
00:25:19,815 --> 00:25:20,315
Moriarty.

693
00:25:22,375 --> 00:25:24,795
This episode was supported by SmartAct,

694
00:25:25,335 --> 00:25:27,355
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695
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