The Holiday with Rebecca Bulnes

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Speaker 1: On the dol cast. The questions asked if movies have women and are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands? Do they have individualism? The patriarchy? Zef and best start changing it with the bec Del Cast. Hello, welcome to the bec Del Cast. Why is Jamie cast? We're going really fast? Look really fast? God, I'm like, fully, okay, Can I just say I just went to seven eleven obviously, obviously, and I did eat a piece of pizza on the way back. I was so upset. I got the Mike's Harder lemonade Cranberry, that's my current flavor that I'm into. And when I went to the front and I did not have my I d and she was just like, I'm sorry, It's like I couldn't get it. No, I didn't. I didn't you see no Mike cards before you There's none. And I'm personally I was, how can I not have a Mike's Hard Lemonade to do this particular episode, you know, right, because this is a kind of want to drink about because yeah, I'm very excited anyways. Uh yeah, if anyone wants to just send like letters of sympathy and just like I'm personally very upset. Who knows when I'm going to get to drink of Mike's hard lemonade. Now, I'm so sorry for your loss. I'm honestly furious, and nothing is okay, in complete disarray. How are you? You're injured a disaster? Yeah, I fell playing soccer, yester disaster, and I'm scraped up like a little kid. We're in bad shape today and these are really not going well. I'd like have taken two showers. But still somehow it's not like a plane like, it's just like I think you're all out of sorts. Well, hey, maybe we'll get back on track in our lives with this episode of cinema. Yeah, so let's introduce our guess. I want excited. However, I just I full this closure. I just recorded an episode of her amazing podcast. I never heard of it. Yeah. She's also written for The A V Club. Rebecca Bono, My god, I wrote about you, and now I'm here. I'm god. I did it. You manifested, We manifested. It was a mute manifest. Mute manifest. That's what I live for. That's how I make anything happening in my scream of That's also the name of the man who does my Texas very nice muge manifest and guys, this is how comedy works right here. Yeah, that's what it is to happen there. Yeah, we just made muge manifest and assesss. Here's something I've been doing recently that really throws people for a loop is if you introduce your friend as like, this is an associate of mine, and they'll be like, oh, like there, it suddenly implies like a level of business to your friendship that simply does not exist. We should go on calling each other our associated in my business. Yeah, you don't actually don't say business, say associate. Let's figure it out. Yeah, that's like, oh, how are you guys associating because that's all it means we've associated, which we have, Yeah, pretty blatantly. I think it's on the record that you've associated. Yeah, there's there's too much of a trail to be able to erase the fact that we have at many points associated at least on at least fifty occasions. We've associated at least once a week for the past year. So right, so, like, what's the endgame? What's the plan? We don't know. We'll find out. Hey, let's talk about a movie. So, Rebecca, you've brought us the Holiday. You also overruled the movie we suggested for the Holiday, Okay, because here's the thing. I was into the idea, but then I was watching The Holiday with myself with wine on Thanksgiving and I was like, wow, I mean the Holiday right, guys, right here? So I did have to pitch it because I'm thrilled. You dead, I'm glad. I mean, I've put you through something with this movie. But I hope you loved it. It was loved the experience. I've seen this movie several times. Yeah, I had not, and it's going to be very dramatic. Basically, Caitlyn plus Roncom is like me plus any movie with like a robot in it. I'm like, God, I'm exhausted. And the thing is, did I know that? Yes? Did I did. I were fully aware of how this would go a little bit, not like in a predictable way, but I was like, yeah, it could be fun. Well, I loved hating it that. Yeah, it's a fun, great time hating it. It really is. There is some I mean and watching it, I mean, I feel like there's so many red flags for this movie, even when you're not watching it for its treatment of women. It's just a gigantic they're so okay, let's okay. So wait when did you first see The Holiday? Okay? So I have like a long history of The Holiday just watching it with my mom. It's very much a me and my mom movie. Her like one is Jude Law. She's she loves to talk about how she would cheat on my stepdad, like and growing up, I was I thought I was really cool. So because I was like, um, I'm into Bamar Jarra, so I'm gonna call Jude Law Judy Lacks. I was like I would make fun of her because I was like, oh wow, he's like a pretty boy. And of course now I'm like I would do anything to fuck you with Law, right, Like he's beautiful, out of gorgeous with Jude Law. But yeah, so I've seen it like many many times. We always watch it in the holiday seasons and and I can't stop. And it's a part of me. And there are like specific lines that like I have the line delivery like in my head ingrained that I'll mention them when they come up. So yeah, I've seen it many many times, and um, most of it's for Jack Black. Jack Black, who, by the way, this movie could not want you to know that it does not find Jack Black attractive. That first fucking shot where they're like clearly love it, You're just like, what the fuck? Why would he be? God? I was so on Jack black side until I was very suddenly like, wait a second, he's cheating on his girlfriend. Yeah, why is this? There's a lot and so wait you saw this movie for the first time, yeah, like a couple of days ago, and I went into it pretty much assuming that I was not going to enjoy it, And turns out I was right. I don't think you know yourself if well. I have had known about this movie since it came out in like two six and you know it's the movie where Cameron Diaz and Kate Win's a switch houses during Christmas time and novel pre Airbnb, right fun, I love an early internet movie, right, which also features a Blockbuster movie scene with the Dustin Hoffman. Oh yeah, that didn't go anywhere. They're just like yeah. Also, Jack Black's character, who's like a film composer, has the most basic taste. He's like humming, gone with the wind. This this is just like, um, what a little little basic bitch in terms of his knowledge of his own profession. Yeah, well, when who do you first seen the movie, Jamie? Oh uh, probably within a year of it coming out. I want to say, this movie, I think came out when I was in middle school, and so it was like perfect in terms of like this is only me and my mom can watch together. That's like not too raunchy, but it's also like girls. Yeah, like, yeah, it sounds like a similar deal where I first saw it with my mom and then it's never been like one of my favorite favorites. But I remember my first Christmas in l A. With the first Christmas, I didn't go home. I met up with a bunch of friends when we all watched Holiday. I went to a Christmas party yesterday afternoon and this movie was playing on the TV and I didn't know anyone there except for the host, and I just loudly announced how much I hate this movie. And everyone's like, oh God, what did Who's that? And when I sheet like I was instantly hate it by everyone there, Well, you can't just talk about the holiday like that, to be fair, you can't just like do that. I like how it does just elicit such a visceral reaction while not not actually being good, and I'm like, right, like I get it, I do, I really do. Well, let me do the Recapuh So, the Holiday is about Cameron Diaz and Kate Winslet. They've both been unlucky in love and they're also doing this movie for sort of everyone involved is a victory lap of sorts like there no one's here to make history. Although I will say it is an actor's film, so not a tum poem. It's more of an actor I think it's also am There's certain parts of it I have a lot of hearty depth, and other parts of it do not. But it is an actor's film and a tom film. Okay. I'd also just like to add really using voice over for what it's meant to be, you know, just very much like that's like the tone of all of the voiceovers, like I am sucking acting. I'm Kate Winslett. I am acting a movie. But she's also giving it se and the fights over she's not giving it her all. She's saving her all for the Reader or whatever other movie she was in. It came out around this time. She can't be giving this movie a percent just to conserve her energy, although he will say I was fully triggered by her. Um, what is it that she plays air guitar too? She wants the song? She plays air guitar in the stud Okay, wait, I remember it's very guitar Oh to a Jet song? Are you gonna be mic? It explicably just playing air guitar and Cameron Diaz is bad because she's thrilled about the fact that it's it seems it wasn't sure the context of the team, but she woke up and it was day and then a Jet song turned out excited and she just like was like I can't not no, no, And she even goes she goes, thank you, Amanda, like she right because she had that selection. Imagine bonding with another woman because it's like, oh you love Jet, I love Jets one song? Oh god, And in two thousand six, this would have been a lot of work to program this into your alarmlocked, like you couldn't just wake up to Jet I'm sure. Yeah. She was rich and so she could wake up. She was so rich and she house shamed Kate Winslet for having a small house, you know, and they're like, fucking high, but she's just like my house, well it's a little bit bigger than yours, not that that's hard, and it's like, you bitch house shame her? Okay, really quick, before I know we're okay. But who do you of the four, who do you hate the most? Yeah? But I also, I mean, normally I think I would hate law that's the obvious answer, but it might be Jack Black. I know I wouldn't have said this, but this time he's Tea's cheating on his girlfriend and then he's like, why did my girlfriend? He he catches his girlfriend cheating on him while he's also cheating on his girlfriend taking another woman out on a date, and then goes home and he's like, sucks out down, I'm such a nice guy, Like it's just experiating. It's okay. Sorry, Well that and then Jack Black can't not just like mug for he can't act. This is your problem with Jack Black. Everyone loves about him, and I love it. But because I love when he's mugging in this movie. I love when he's every part every time. The only time. The only reason they made him like a music supervisor in this movie is so he could do his little It was like, this is the most romantic scene he's in and the entire movie, Jude Law is constantly panting, just here's the thing, Howard and sweat. Fuck boy man. You say that Jack Black is not a bad actor, but I just have to point you to to the to the line delivery. That is one of the funniest things is is officially crazy weather. That scene makes me laugh every fucking time. Do you know how it wasn't that funny when I did it. It's because Jack Black is just really he doesn't does this thing? Does this space is so funny And I'm like, you know what, it is crazy weather, And that's hilarious to point that out. Some of Jack Black's linaries in this movie are baffling. Where there's that scene. Okay, first of all, this movie it's too long. It's so it's like two hours and forty it's like a Lord of the Rings movie. I forgot how long. And there's there's certain scenes that you're just like, yeah, I'd lose that. What is that doing? Now? The whole I Plant with the old man, it literally there is absolutely no purpose for it. It's done so much of the movie falling in love with that old man. Yeah, it's so weird. Well, I guess he wants her to have gumption. He needs to tell her to be a strong woman. I don't know that's a thing, that whole being. And then like all this weird old Hollywood. I'm like, who is this for? It's very unnecessary. It was very weird. So there's the old man. But there's one part where I guess the plot needs to justify Jack Black constantly hanging out with Kate Winslet in spite of the fact that he like, just make him not have a girlfriend. Write that up, that's easy. Whatever. But he comes over because he's Cameron Diaz, his ex boyfriend's friend, colleague associate Eddie Burns, Eddie Burns Eddie Burns, who delivers some choice exposition in the beginning. He's just basically here, all yours you can't be in relationship, and it says not. So Jack Black comes over and she's like, sorry, this old person I met wants to have a Hanagah dinner because a last and I don't know unclear. So Jack Black is like, yeah, I want to join in. It's like okay, But then Jack Black joins the party and gives some of the most insane. The way Jack Black talks to old people in this movie is crazy, Like he talks like he's like a wizard to old people, Like he's like, oh, I'll be giving you a call to play par cheesy like social social butterflies, condescending to the elderly. I loved it. I mean that said. I loved it, and I love Jack Black, and I'm a big Jack Black defender. His character shouldn't have been chaned on his girlfriend though his character is the first person you see on screen and then he does, Okay, here's the thing. Not only that he's like the first person you see, it's like I feel like he doesn't actually come back until like forty five minutes, like they really wait to actually dude. Law doesn't show up for a long time too, which is like, yeah, I guess it's about the two women, but like still like Kate to the post Kate and you know, But honestly, I feel like all of the Jack Black stuff happens fully, like in the third act, like fully, it's it's like remember the guy from the beginning who he's going he said he looked like remember the guy who said looked like shit at the beginning of the movie, we're gonna bring him back now and now he's gonna be dating Kate Winslett Like that's doesn't doesn't And I would argue biggest problem with the film is that there's actually not enough tack Black is what I would say. I'm on board with that. I'm only unbalanced movie. I'm only not super annoyed by him in this movie because he has so little screen time. See, I would say, replaced all the weird old man stuff with like Kate Winslett and Jack Black doing something because or her just randized what were you doing? Or just like pursuing a personal endeavor of hers or like I mean, we'll get into this, but like the two storylines of Cameron diez Is during Kate Win's, that's character are just like how their lives are framed around the men that they know and or are trying to get over, or the new men that they're getting involved with. It's just like what about any other part of your life? Oh no, I mean in the in the beginning Kate Win's, it's like real upset because Jasper right, Jasper her like love boy who is now getting engaged. I forgot about this until I rewatched it recently. She's so devastated and she's like crying like a child. Um and there's like a casual like suicide attack joke. I guess like not even she she she like turns the gas on and she like almost to breathe it. She almost fully plaths out. And you're just like, what's in the first like ten minutes of the guy, because she goes from sobbing is so much? This is so much. I have a hundred pages of notes for this, and we're not going to be able to get to at all. There was Paul Read in this movie for like two seconds, no, not thinking of John John Zinski. And I noticed John because I thought I saw Paul. I thought like Paul Red had to be an. I thought he had to be in every movie between two thousand. I thought I saw him. Maybe I didn't. I don't think so. Yeah, I guess he would have made himself known, right, he's the famous. But just to go so to go over the story super quickly, So Cameron Diaz, whose character's name is Amanda, and Kate Winslet, whose character's name is Iris. They switch houses because they've both been like, oh, I found out the guy who was in love with just gone engaged, or oh my living boyfriend Ed Burns is cheating on me. The Christmas holidays coming up, and they're like, what if I just get away from it all? So they decide to switch houses on the Internetois for a movie, Yes, but I would argue that it makes no sense for it to be set at Christmas time. In fact that I feel like it was like they not have families at all, that was that something that never comes out. And then also Kate Win's let we find out later in a weird twist, has two adorable nieces that she does and totally fails on. And they don't have a mom. This is like like one of their first Christmas is without a mom. She's like, actually, I'm really bummed out. Got to get out of here. Kind of selfish guys. I have a theory that the first draft of this script was not set at Christmas time, but then they got like a studio note, They're like, let's make it a Christmas movie because at no point do they celebrate Christmas or and most of Christmas and a bunch of things happen. Then it makes no sense for it to be said at Christmas time, like the w G a tribute to Arthur and his career. They're like, yeah, this is on Christmas Day. Why did w G A a major plot point in this movie? I don't get it there the whole I totally for I haven't seen this movie, and I think two years before last night and I completely forgot the old Man. I was like, oh yeah, and then you're like, but wait, this movie, this part takes up forty five minutes. Why you know what it is? It's because this movie is I'm actually a movie for like a fans of cinema. You know. It's a love letter to to writing. It's a love letter to writing. And it's a screenwriter's film. It's a director's film. Up like, we can't for a movie that talks about screenwriting a lot um not great writing. And I feel bad for hating this movie so much because it was written and directed by a woman. Nancy You know what she's hands this. She did bad. She did a bad job. I think, Okay, so Nancy Myers film. Uh, there's there's a lot. There's one of my faves parents Trap ninety eight, Dennis Quade wet Something's got to give. I have not seen that what women want with mel Gibson. Uh where mel Gibson reads women's mind the Honday, it's complicated the intern like, it's good that she has a job. However, we the exception of parent trap. What maybe her body of work isn't very good? Listen. I think it's the ultimate feminism to be able to declare another woman mediocre. It's haven't we achieved a quality where we can be like, you know what, I don't care for it if you're gonna have to censor your opinions about Nancy, for feminism is a feminism? No, I don't right exactly? You know what, Nancy, she's a great jobs. I've seen this movie more than most movies in my life this many times. I do genuinely like, I don't. I don't know if I can say I like the Holiday after this viewing, but I think I still like, like, I know, I'll watch it again. I don't know what that says about me, trying to think, like, what else plot wise is it? So? Um Irish lives in Surrey and um Amanda lives in l A. And they decided to switch houses. So at a moment notice, because even though it's you know, five days before Christmas, tickets would have been thousands of dollars. They both seem to have limitless means, it seems to yeah, and Kate Winslet as a wedding writer, it's just like, yeah, cool, sure, you're a millionaire. So it doesn't make any sense. So they switch houses to escape from the love situations that are plaguing them, the romantic entanglements that they want to get away from it, and Cameron Diaz really spells it out. She says, I have to ask is there any men in your town? And then Kate ties back zero, you know, because she actually lives on Famous Gara, the island at the beginning of Wonder Woman where it's just a bunch of Amazon women and no men. So that's a fun plot twist that none of us stopped coming. But okay, so Amanda shows up in England and she's like there for a while, and then she's like, oh, I'm bored, a better drink some wine. And then who comes knocking? Women? Wine? Who comes knocking at her door? But Jude law Iris's hot brother, and he's like, oh wow, oh that's exactly when he comes. And then one thing leads to another in the five minutes that they interact and then suddenly they have sex. Meanwhile, Iris is in l a and then she befriends an old man and then kind of dates Jack Black. That's pretty much so were like. And then the last scene of the movie they all go back to Sorry for New Year's makes zero sense to me. The last did I never thought about it before this viewing of like what an uncomfortable Okay, Karen Diaz and Jude Law, who is Caitlinslet's brother, and then Cameron Diaz is ex boyfriend's friend slash associate slash associate Lourescent World to be at a New York party. And also there's child I hate that there's children involved. I'm bad for all the kids, Okay, I just all I have is questions. Jude Law leaves his children on Christmas Eve to Cameron Diaz. Y yeah, who appreciates. I mean, though he does say I am daddy in this film, which shout out fran Hoffner for really pointing that out and making that an Internet moment um I am um. Is he a good daddy? Well? I don't know. I mean he's going through a ship. His wife Don died but like a year ago and he seems to be stealing away to fun random women. Yeah all the time, he says. He's like, oh, when I find myself at the local pub all drunk and like not able to get crash on my sister's, it's like this is very sad. Yeah, this is okay, Okay, here's a scene to hone in on every scene with Cameron Diaz and Jude Law and bananas. I just say one thing about Cameron Diaz right now, like I think we just do need to say it, is that, Wow, what's happening? Um? She is like overacting is an understanding. She kind of is like a high schooler and a place she's like nod on senior year. It's wild, gunning for an award. Yeah, like not charming. It's like it's irritating. It so annoying. It's a lot, and it's god the and Kate wins pushing it with the whole jet. But you can tell that wasn't her idea. Like the way that I look at it is that like Cameron Diaz is like trying to act. Kate One's is just having fun, you know, like you know I would love you know, her kids need to go to college or whatever. Cameron Diaz seems to be the only person in this movie who's taking the movie weirdly serious, Like she's like, this is a big role. Well, this is her like Wheelhouse, this is the type of role she always gets cast in, and she's living it up. She literally like there's like another an explicable minute long scene of like why is it here where Cameron Diaz drunkenly faces off with a dog and they do like I wrote that down because you know what, that dog is an act better than Cameron Diaz. No, I literally wrote that downing dog acting. But just since you brought up Jet, should we talk about how she jams out to the Killers, Mr Bryan, Mr Bride, Yeah, there's oh god, it is the mid odds in this movie. And that's another thing that's like one of the like I mentioned, one of those things that's in my brain forever is the way that she sings along to smoking or what are on your Oh it's just like yeah, the like is this a joke to you? Like why are you? And I God, I can just picture like Cameron Diaz going up to nanthy Myers and be like I'm gonna try something and she's like, go for a cam and them Kim does that fucking thing and she's like, cut love it. This movie is six hours long, so we have to keep moving. Oh my god, I also forgot these women talk to themselves. So in this movie, yeah, I mean, and we're coming off a die Hard episode and it was a lot compared to die Hard. Kevin Diaz is a monologue. She's God, there's so there's so much. There's the first scene in this movie which does at one point pass the mental test Kate Winslet, where she's just sulking around this Christmas party. We learn about Jasper, who's her boss that she's in love with, and he comes over and he's like, you're hot, and she's like, yeah, I got you a present, and then she goes out. She goes she goes out, and then like immediately finds out that not only is he getting married, but she has to write about it for some reason. But they have an exchange in there where it's just Kate Winslett and Jasper. We don't need to refer to the main for actors by anything other than the yeah are so Kate wins and Jasper are talking in the room and the Vegas. It's a great vague business conversation where she's like, you've got a new thing, you got promoted, and he was like, yeah, well it took a lot of work, but couldn't have done it without the work of you as well, and she's like excellent. It's like where do they work? What is happening? This could be anything. We later found out that she and her brother both work in publishing. Publishing a very lucrative business because print is alive. And well, here's the thing I want to say about Kate Winslett right now, though, is that it's like the same girl though throughout the entire movie. I'm like, yeah, I get it, Like I've had a Jasper and there's yeah, there's there's a line where he goes like like you're must survival kit and I'm like, oh, like that hurt me because I'm like, wow, same, that's been there, There's been there, done that. I've had a jasper who has not been as hot as this actual jasper. Excellent casting though, of like he can't be as hot as Jewed Law, but he's got to be close and he's got to look a little evil. Yeah, with like the same piercing blue eyes, but just like a little bit maybe he's like not totally symmetrical. We don't know, there's a little weird thing going on there, but there there there was one point where I because is also a horrible character, but there was one point where he sends her his manuscript because he knows she's so good at her job that that's why he keeps her around, because he needs her professionally. And that was like, well, and then I drowned myself in a river. All right, Well, okay, so I'm just gonna try to jump in here where the Okay, So if you just boiled down the plot of the movie, it's about two women who need to escape the problematic men in their lives, so they switch places. But there would be an opportunity, you think, for a story that would be about like they're sort of self discovery and hey, maybe let's pursue something in my career while I'm away, or maybe I'll like try to write a book, or maybe I'll try to make a friend or something like that. But both of their stories just revolve around other men. So they leave one man just to jump to another one. Because camer Diaz is like, oh, actually, Ed Burns not the guy for me, but Jude Law the guy for me. I were I'm gonnakinly shows up in my house, could be fucking anyone, and also doesn't appear drunk that entire like he's he's imagine a man bagger and a little little little slur, but drops it pretty clearly. And then it's like, so where do you work? You're just like this man isn't drunk. A little tiny thing. You said, books and this was reminded me. Okay, on the plane when she's going to the cottage, so many books. She has a stack of like seven books, the Kite Runners. There, there's Harry Potter, what's your plan? What's your plan? You're gonna read all these fucking books. You're not gonna read all these fucking book No way, not on this flight, not during this trip. I do that sometimes though I'm like, wouldn't it be wouldn't it be nice if I did? If I managed? And then you just end up making your home vacation very heavy and you read nothing. So Cameron did is his character is just like, oh but Jude Law, and he suddenly falls in love with me even though we've only known each other for a week and they're like, he's emotional and she needs to open up and learn how to cry because her whole thing is that she hasn't cried since she was fifteen. Fun, fun and not to say and not to like shame. You know, everyone has their life difficulties. Been like I can't cry, but literally, but it's like, okay, your parents got divorced. We're self aucking. Sorry everyone's parents got divorced. Cool, Like, literally, yeah, I can't cry. I haven't cried in twenty years because my parents got I'm sorry. I can't do Cameron Diaz and pressure. I'm not shrill. I can't do it. But she is just like I am in Kyenne twenty or being it. I'm my There was a student case and I was just like, shut up, you, I wish her unhappiness. I love I love after her in um June law Bone and she's like, honestly, my life is a bit of a mess in that department too, you know, don't worry about it like it's all cool. And he's all like WHOA, Okay, like I guess you're not. And she's like, no, I'm not going to fall in love with you blah blah. Dude does one of my favorite things in the entire thing A film that I like to tell people sometimes if I feel comfortable enough for them. One of the first things he appears and he's like, don't fall in love with I love that so much, and then he called back to it later it's like, I know I told you not to fall in love with me, but now somehow I have fallen in love with you, and you're just like this that world okay. Also, he keeps calling her like he's like, he's like really one of the most interesting women girls, saying not like the other girls, just saying like, also is she she's so, She's so not she's so faking more. The one moment I connected with Cameron Diaz's character and I actually felt for her a little bit. I feel I feel like I know what it's going to was when she and Judel are about to have sex for the first time, and she says that she's like, just you know, I don't know if I'm good at and that like I have one done that before, like disclaimed myself before having a second just so you know. I have these weird wiry nipple hairs that I haven't taken care of and I don't know it's been pointed out to me before. And if you've got a problem with it, I mean, we couldn't hang out another day, alright. So and I was like in that moment, I was like, I'm Cameron Diaz and I don't like it, but which I'm I don't know. That was a nice character moment. No, I I like that too. Of course, later he's like, by the way, you know, i'd say he's mistaken. Also, his contacts are knocked out of his eyes during the sex. That's the thing that he does. It's literally, it's it's only it's only so they could put him in cute, cute glasses. You know. He's like, my context fell out. You know, I'm like, well that hot, my context fail or she is actually like really just doing some crazy stuff and maybe she thinks she's bad. Maybe she's just like, oh my god, but he does wait, wait, that doesn't mind me of when give me your eyeball? Sorry you don't know, but do you remember when they're sitting, when they're on the couch and they're about to do it, and he kisses her eyelids and he pulls her hair back. Here's the thing. I feel like those are very nice intimate moves. That's not like we're drunk and we're strangers and we're going to fuck you know who just met like literally ten minutes before. And then he's just like delicately kissing her eyelids. I'm like, oh my god, literally what wait. I want to talk more about this scene because I would argue that there is a surprise kiss. It's not the type of surprise kiss we usually see. It's not just like a lunge. But okay, here's what happens. So he's at Iris's house where Cameron Diaz is staying. They chat for a couple of minutes, like kind of get to know who they are. She's like, I just broke up with some and I'm here and I'm all out of sorts. And then he's like, all right, I'm just gonna crash on the couch. She doesn't get some blankets and says good night, and then he leans in and kisses her out of nowhere. Ye, Which, here's the thing that's weird about that. I mean, there are multiple things, but it's almost like he did it in a way that it's like, oh, No, this is just like routine that I that I it's like I missed people just kiss you on the lips good night. It's yeah, it's like it's like a routine thing. That routine routine. I can't say routine, routine thing like Mr Frana. Then the thing that I thought of it was like even if he was, he forgot that, like he didn't know her or something. It's like, oh, do you kiss your sister Kate Winsley on the mouth before you go sleep, like on her couch, right, And it's just what we do. It's just the space reminds me of kissing women, even though the woman who lives here is my sister. Okay, So then after so even if there is romantic tension between them, which we can argue that there is, like he can't just lean in and kiss her. There's there's like no no flirtation really up to that point. Well, but also Cameron Diaz is like, I don't do for a play. Carmon Diaz has a lot of things that men want to hear in this movie. She says, I don't fall in love. I don't do for a play. I can't cry like all this stuff. I'm just like, Wow, this really seems like a great person that has never existed. He's like a play and she's like overrated, and he's like, you're the most interesting girls her interesting women in the world. But he doesn't call her woman. He calls her girl a hundred times woman. He also basically there's that there's that great feminist icon Judela moment where he's like, I'm not in the habit of having sex with women who are unconscious, and it's like slow cop, and then Cameron Diaz is like, I'm so embarrassed. I'm like, no, that's not there. I mean, while she's like, wait, why didn't we have sex? And he's like you're She's like really, oh man, she is okay, And I know that, you know, women be crazy, I think, but her character is fully crazy based on the fact that she's very badly written, like nothing she does make sense. And then it's Cameron Diaz. It just sucks back to this surprise kiss scene. So after he kisses her, reacts in such a way where I was like, oh whoa, Like I didn't mean to do that, and then she says, can you try that again? And he's like huh, okay, and then he kisses her again. So the movie frames this weird moment that you don't think would happened in real life, or if it does, like it's alarming, and again, like a surprise kiss, the movie frames it is like, oh, this is romantic and she's so into this, and like forgetting the fact that they just met and they hadn't been talking about like maybe they say like, oh, you're cute, you're handsome. I'm glad I came in. But like the way, like, yeah, the way that they frame it, it's almost like the scene in the movie where like the two best friends try for the first time, you know, like it almost seems like a chemistry read where it's like we've been friends for a long time, can we just try this? Like that's the sort of move that it is makes sense because they met three minutes ago. She's just like, wait, interesting, interesting, that's how But then her whole thing is that it's interesting because she's never kissed a stranger before. And he's like, really, I do it all the time. Whatever. He's like, meanwhile, I have two young girls at home, but I'm out there fucking every night. He is very straightforward about what a piece of shitty is, which is also frustrating to at Cameron Diaz level, where he at multiple points in the movie lists things that are wrong with him, like he is being pretty Mine is the fact that it's a twist that he's a father and somehow that's a good thing. And also that he cries. You guys, guess what she can't cry, and I guess what he loves to cry, which him weeps, Him weep so much, it's God, Cameron dis like, no one can be like my parents divorced and now I'm like this, like it just doesn't happen. So Kate Winslett, I think is very deeply depressed and really should like say thanks for hanging Jack Black, but I need a new therapist and new medication because she almost kills herself at the beginning and is and really seems prone to like some pretty brutal mood swings. Kate Winslet almost commits suicide and every movie she's in in the beginning because it happens contractual obligation. The movie she's ever been in, she almost killers I Will Actually she almost killed herself in Beautiful Creatures. This thing does. Can we talk about Jack Black? Perhaps I'm in his icon though for this one moment, this one scene where he introduces his girlfriend with her name Maggie to uh, I wrote this. He goes, here's my Maggie. Well, no, not my Maggie. Who that was? I wrote that? Like feminist, ye contract plant? Maybe I think so? Maybe? Honestly yes. So. Still on Kate Winslet story, her whole thing, similar to Cameron Diaz, is that she, oh her Jasper doesn't love her, so she has to get away and escape and get over him. And she does say several times in the movie, like it's clear that I need to fall out of love with you. Please let me do this. And then he's just like, but how can I reach you every day? And then he shows sucking piece of ship And then by the end of the movie, Yes, she does confront him and say like nor grand yeah, big speech, and she's just like, you've been a shitty guy and you've never treated me well and I'm over it and you need to get out of my life so that I can move on with mine or whatever, and then she kicks him out. And it's supposed to be this like big empowering moment, but at the same time the other parts of her story in this movie are her relationship to Jack Black, her relationship to this old guy Arthur. And it's like she's not doing anything for herself really except for maybe just like maybe she feels better by helping this Arthur guy. But I think I think what they're trying to do. I don't know, like the Arthur thing is so strange, but I think like what they're trying to do is like she's helping him, and at the same time, I guess he's like helping because he has such a like an admiration for her, and he's like he's like, yeah, you got spunk, but you're a leading lady. Yeah. And then she's like, oh wait, maybe I am the leading lady in my own story. But like, also could she just realize that herself? Like did she have to write? But like why did he have to be the one to tell her that after they've just met for like a day? Yeah? I just I so much wanted to cease like a subplot for both of them, them to just be pursuing something, you know, in their career or just some other thing they can enrich their lives with and not just men, because all it is I wish that I wish she wrote her She started writing her own books and she fucking sent the pages to Jasper and she's like bitch and like fuck you, you miserable piece of ship. Leave me alone. Well, and from what I can tell, like both of these women fly overseas two lip sync in a bed that is the extent. Like they don't seem to have any plan, and that could have been Another interesting part of the movie is how do they meet if they've got to meet a man, maybe to go out and meet them, but literally both had their doors and kind of forcibly enter when they're like all I was gonna do is lipsing to the killers in England for three weeks. Also a very long time to be away. It doesn't make sense, right, Yeah, they don't go out and explore, even though they're both in like new cities and like wanted to get away, Like yeah, they just don't do anything except for things that relate to the old or new men in their life. And it's but low key, I'm in l a for the first time and that's exactly what I'm Well, you're not here on vacation, like they deliberately went and you could argue short, like it is the Christmas holidays, maybe things aren't open, and yeah they're on vacation. But again that's my argument that clearly this movie was not meant to take place at Christmas, and the studio was. I mean, I'm guessing, but I do like, yeah, that's a thing checks out that I had not thought about that. There's also just like weird little moments that for some reason stand out to me that I'm like, was this supposed to go somewhere? I don't know why, but when she opened, when Cameron Diaz opens the closet and there's like a little black dress, she goes nice dress and then and like that's it. I was like, was there supposed to be? Was this supposed to be a thing? There's like a lot of weird just like loose things like that, you know that I that I just I want to know what Well, No, I don't supposed as if this script is to maybe so there God who is editing this movie? Like the dog scene, the long another scene that should have been cut, A long scene in which Cameron Diaz explains lipstick to one of Jude Law's daughters. Supposed that there it's like where she turns and she's like and those two girls first of all very no, they're cute. I like them. No than you going Amanda, Amanda, dude to leep in my bedroom. You know what, have a mom, straight dad? And then now you look like one of my bombies, you know what. I think. It's like those scenes are supposed to be like I think like they try to make Cameron Dias seem like so hard, which like whatever, shut up um, and then as well, but like they're like, oh no, look look at her, and I don't think she has any chemistry with those children. I don't think she it's like, oh wow, look she's like she can be soft and emotional whatever, Like I think that's the point of it. But I'm like, you just gave her look. I don't know. There's like no, I'm not like, wow, look at maternal she is. I don't know. But then Jude Lng comes in and he's like, no one has ever been a bigger hit with my kids than you, not even their own mother. They just totally lost all remaining memories of their mother because you salmon. That's why I killed her. The girls didn't like she had to go amazing well, okay, I did have. I am shocked at it. I didn't think because Okay, when Jude Blas shows up, I'm like, there's a very different version of this movie where La kill and the first fifteen minutes of the movie because he shows up, Yeah, this is my sister's house. I'll just make myself at home. I do this all the time, you know. And it's like, oh, he's a stone called killer. He's calling other women. He's just like setting up his next prey. While Cameron Diaz is monologue, Oh, looks like he's on the phone with another woman. Oops, I've been spotted. Like She's like, I just I can't. I can't show that I cared because I just told him that I don't care. But now here I am, I'm looking at him talking to an other woman. He has daughters his ultimate secret. Well, the other thing about this movie is that the two women basically spend the whole movie measuring their self worth based on the men that they know or like, whether or not they're lovable. Because early on you see Iris talking to her colleague and the cool one who smokes into right, and she's like, we used to be together, but he cheated on me, but now we're still friends, and and she's like, I never realized how pathetic you are, and I was just like, really, oh god, I'm so aware of it. I cut to her sobbing, and then Amanda is talking to her colleagues and she's just like, remember when they used to say that single women over the age of thirty five were more likely to be killed by a terrorist than to get married. That's horrible. There's that. There's a scene where Kim Diaz and are corresponding and like getting to know each other over this whatever the funk website this would be, and I was just like, I'm iris, by the way, very normal, neat freak, healthy, non smoker, single girl, my horrible liner. She needs a new therapist, literally bad. They're literally all twelve years old, like they tell they they throw tantrums like it's wild. The physicality of it is so over the top totally. And then a man responds by being like, I'm Amanda Lonard, loser and complicated wreck, and it's just like they're just her words. They actually lifted this conversation from us, um no, but it's just these two women measuring their self worth based on how single they are or how much a man loves them and it's just like which is also interesting because the story places them both as people who are very good at their jobs. She they say multiple times, and that's why they pay me the big bucks for her fucking trailer with James Franco can say something about that. Yeah, God, okay. James Franco and Lindsay Lohan exists as themselves in this universe of the movie The Holiday, But Lindsay Lohan was in Mean Girls with Rachel McAdams, who's in Sherlock Holmes with Jude Law it doesn't work out. Also, James Franco was in Pineapple Express with Seth Rogan, who's in super Bad with Sorry, but he was in super Bad with Jonah Hill, who was in Wolf of Wall Street with Leonardo DiCaprio, who was in Titanic with He got there. What a fucking weird stylistic choice for them to go into the weird like trailer fantasies of Cameron Diaz's life like that never good, so strange, so strange there I do like whenever Cameron Diaz is doing her job, she's just like saying stuff and they're like, she's brilliant, because then she's like, it needs to be shorter, needs to be red, like happy red, not a Scorsese, right, And then John Krasinski is like, oh my god, She's like there, it's just I hate it sucks and she sucks. I love it though, But so you know, we're all dying, so we know about their careers. At least we know what they do, because in movies we've discussed previously, like in When Harry Met Sally, we barely know what any of the women in that movie do for a living. At least in this movie we know what their jobs are and we even see them sort of doing their jobs. Doesn't have to make sense, but they have jobs and they're good at it, but they're no. It just was super annoying to me that there are no subplots around their careers when they're easily could have been, and instead all of the other storylines are dedicated to their relationships with men, when again, it could have been a story about like them going on a journey of self discovery or self improvement doors and like, even even if you do need a weird Arthur subplot, maybe make it not an old white guy. You could be a woman she meets, and you know, because the payoff of the Arthur subplot is also you're just like, that's what we were waiting for. Because Jasper shows up, which is again like you just got engaged, but you just disappeared on Christmas. Sure, that's a that supports your theory even more of like maybe a week where just he could say he was on a business trip. But anyways, he shows up and it's like Kate red bikini, I don't know, I'm just sort of a plot device and he shows up. He's just being a plot device, flopping around and Kate wins like she has this very sudden realization because she had been told about a Barber Standwick movie by Arthur the Old Man, and that's why she But there's a great moment where literally she's asked, like what's gotten into you? And she's like, I don't know, and it's like she might as well just be like, there's fifteen minutes left in the movie. Does she screams gumption and pumps her fists. It's just like for a two hour minute movie, the arcs are like almost everything happens in the last fifteen minutes because it's wild because like her and Jack Black share what a single kiss? And I don't like Arthur's stupid w g a offense. Yes, and now he is like, yeah, I'm going to fucking New Year's with you? What? And I don't know their country and then pumps his fists. But here's the thing. Jack Black is extremely charming, So I get it. I get it. I liked. I liked when he pumped his fists. I will say, Kate Winslet, I was laying it on a bit, thank you. Sure, well, this is an actor's film, so this is an actress film. I mean just just just the blockbuster scene alone is my one of my favorite things that has ever happened, because it's just they're just like, let's just let Jack do his thing, you know, and I love it. So just scene where Jack Black and Kate Winslet are scooterly doodling is It's very tense and difficult to watch because Kate wasn't herself. She does not want to be in there. Does she like Jack Black as a person. I'm gonna guess hard now, no, because then see between them is so like. I watched it two times because the first time I was just like, oh, Kate Winslet's her character is nervous. But then I was like, no, Kate Winslet, She's like, suddenly is Nerve's gonna make me fucking screwdlad do? Like right, and if that's the moment we're supposed to be like, oh there's st here that Kate wins goes like, was like screw, no very one take there? There was no there was no more than one take at the shots. I'm sorry. I just have to mention best line reading in the entire thing, besides the weather is are you embarrassed? But this game to play literally so funny. Guys. The thing is, I think I just want to be the female jack Block. I think that's why it is. Maybe that is the most feeling role in this movie. It's like if you've gotta be anyway, But oh god, she's fun this Please go back and want to the scene checked like a Kate wan slid are scatting. It's crazy. It's she literally is like how you had singing church choir if you did not know the word. But he's really supportive. He's like, oh, oh is it a scrutally do instead of a dutily? And she's like she's just improvence you know, has not taken u CB three oh one. That must be for sure. Okay, right, real quick, I made a list of all of the tropes we see in this movie. So one. A woman cripplingly depressed over a man who doesn't love her, a frigid, career driven woman who can't be emotionally vulnerable. A man who cheated on his girlfriend with his receptionist, a younger woman who is his subordinate, a woman being bad at driving, a person changing their mind at the airport about leaving a romantic interest behind big old prat fall, big old snow. Yeah. Oh wait, right before she starts driving badly, she pratt falls, and then at the end when she's being driven away back to the airport because she has changed her flight twice. In this movie, there's nothing more customer like in two thou seventeen. It's so hard to watch a movie about so many rich white people who are so rich that they can just be like, actually, I'm just gonna buy a million dollar ticket to another country tomorrow. And you know what I always think of, like, not only is that crazy the rich thing, but also she's very rude. She has not reached out to Kate Winflett to be like, hey, I'm coming. I'm just gonna come back, and then be like, oh you can please think my house. Now you're gonna want to leave. But then so at the end whenever camerd Is is like gonna go back and actually leave this time, and she's in the car and she's like, wait a minute, I've changed my mind. I forgot started to because she cried and it fixed her. Nude law fixes her. Let's give him some credit. She's fucking cured whatever her problem. Right, So she makes the car turn around and she's like, can't you go any faster? And he's like no, And then she's like, okay, I'll get out and run in the snow. So she goes back to her house. When she runs, and then she pauses and then the music swells and she's like she goes back to Kate Wins's house. Du Law is still there for some reason, even love. But she shows up and he's like why Christal, okay, that's good. Why Why isn't he with his kids on Christmas? What day is it? Even they're upstairs, they're playing with their scribblings. They actually rilled their mom and he's scared of and then can we put your face on? Off face? Taddy, give me a stiff your naked him and dias it your daddy, daddy, daddy. Um, Okay, let's talk about whether or not in the movie passes the Bechdel test. Somehow it does, somehow it does. I like to argue it passes when Kate Win's letting Cameron Diaz mumbled to each other incoherently at the end of the movie over loud Christmas. They're like a little little bit, They're like, nice to meet you. Because I'm convinced that's when everyone in the movie met for the first time. Kate Judla had never met. Yeah, right, because he's not actually his sister. He's just a murdering person who has murder daughters would murder for him. Yeah. What if Kate Winslet showed up and was like, who's this? Was like, wait, this is your brother. She's like, I don't. I don't have a brother, which is why she never mentioned her nieces because she doesn't have. But there is that scene which I think arguably could pass the Bechdel tests. All the things they only talk about Jude Law, but they camer Diaz, and Kate Winslet talk on the phone and she's like on three way cong with all of them, and then she has that real fun moment where she's like, did you sleep with and Camer was like, it's actually it's Cam and said, oh day. She wouldn't say my badge, oh you know, British, my my, oh Mary Poppins. I'm sorry. We gotta go. A couple more times where women interact Kate Winslett and her colleague when they're like She's like, I love this man. He doesn't love him back, and she's like, you're so freaking pathetic, and she's like, I know, I'm so aware. It's crazy that that sone does pass them. No, it doesn't. Though they talk about they talked for her. I got a one minute oh really maybe then, but they talked for her. She does not have a name. I don't think on I AMDB she's named, but I don't think we find out her name in the actual movie. But they talked for a minute in forty five seconds, I timed it, and they spent most the entire time talking about Jasper Uh. And then another woman comes in and interrupts and she's like, I risk, did you fly just store? And she's like, I don't know. Down to the y you're still red. But she does not have a name either, so that does not pass the backte test. There's a scene where Amanda's I think assistant, Yeah, yeah, it comes in. We don't know her role really, but she's like they're in the editing room and she's like, oh is this a bad time? Cameren Dis is like I'm flipping out, and then they talk a little bit, but then she's like, then needs you. So they mentioned a man although I don't even know if we know her character's name, I think, well she again named on IMDb. Wasn't pain close enough attention to know, right? And then they're talking online Kate When's and Cameron Diaz, But I don't know if that counts because it's an internet correspondent. How do you I thought that that maybe counted at because they are talking directly to each other. It's a weird gray area thing. This movie does pass the Bactel tests, though, like it does whenever she camer Dias talks to jud Laws dot Rs and they're like contemplating murdering her and she's like, oh, your perfume. It smells so nice, and thank you, it's very and we know both of their names. Yeah it's Sophie and whatever the hell Sophie? And then and then oh, I like when was she at? When the when the when the little kid asked like, are you going to stay over? You could sleep? In the test, we have a headed grown up here, I'm strong over, I'm sucking your dad really re contextualizes we have but we never have adults zone your finger Naimes. So women do interact in this movie quite a bit, and some of those interactions to pass the Bactel tests, which is upsetting. Alright, let's write the movie on our zero to five nipple scale. Based on the portrayal of women the movie, I'm going to give it like, uh, like a one. It's not doing well for me. Um. I like at least that you see the having jobs and sort of doing their jobs, so it does a little better than a lot of rom comms. But the fact that their entire stories are based solely around other men in their lives, and every pursuit that they have and storyline that they have is all based on men, So there were just so many opportunities for them to like, you know, they're like, oh, I'm at this new place. I can sort of discover myself and try something new and like learn something about myself. But they like pretty much don't or if they do, it's because a man inspire them to do that. So it's just like I might even give it a half nipple. Um, yeah, I'm gonna give it a half nipple, and it belongs to the dog who winks at Caridia's the Yeah, the born Performer, the Ghost. Yeah, so half nipple because this movie sucks and I hate it. I'm I mean, you're right, but I'm so as I'm gonna give um, I'm gonna give it two nipples because, um, Kate Winslet, it can be charming when she's she's charming a bit. I also just like that these girls like to rock, and like, as a girl who likes to rock, yeah, out like they're not listening to like, you know, Selene Dianne or anything. They're listening to rock and roll. And I'm like Jet and the Killers. Um, and both of those are because of Kate Winslet and not Cameron Diaz. And yeah, I mean they are both successful. Mean, camer Diaz does like got that fucking money, and she's like in the industry, and I'm like, okay, cool. Um. I don't know that her trailer is amazing, but people seem to think so. Um, So I'm gonna give it to and I'm gonna give it to um. The Santa Ana Winds, which for some reason are an element of this movie. For no time, because the Santa Ana Wins are actively killing the entire stand true blowing fires from places supplies, I was like, not a good week for this Santa Anna Wins. They're not the magical this week. I take it back. She does what she wants. Yeah, that's what really changes things for her as the winds. Yeah, it's a weird magical not I don't even know element in there so much, I'm gonna give it. I'll give it a full nippy and then give it a full nippy. Uh. Kate Winslet, I'm very worried about her mental health in this movie. And I really wouldn't have loved Kate Winslett to see herself check herself into a facility at the beginning of this movie, genuinely because she makes a suicide attempt. Very scary. That whole thing is troubling. Cameron Diaz honestly not to be not an ally but lost cause flowed around on an Iceberg. She's hopeless. We don't know what's going on there. Uh you know, Jude Law doesn't matter. Jack Black adorable should not be cheating on his girlfriend kind of suffered from nice guy thin drum and literally cut from him cheating on his girlfriend to why am I such a nice guy? Like that killed me? Um, I'm gonna give my one nipple to do. Law's daughter who wants to straight up eat camera. She's like, what's on your face? Because I have some on my list. I want to put your frash on my frash. So that's I want to make a movie about them. Amazing. Um okay, Rebecca, thank you so much for being here. Thanks for having me so much fun. Where can people find you online? Um? I'm on Twitter at Almond Midle Hotel. We love it. It's hilarious. Mom. I have a show called Classroom Crush. It's a podcast. Jamie was just on it. It's about crushes from elementary school to high school. And there's a fucking scorcher of guests this coming this week. Because I recorded a lot here and that's on Twitter at classroom Crush as well. Check it out. You can follow us at Bactel Cast on Twitter and Instagram and go to our website back to cast com. You can subscribe to our Patreon become a matron today. It's actually two episodes of Packing month. Holy shit. Alright, it's such a good bargain. And hey it's the holidays. If you're like, I'm actually not ready to become a matron, but I just want to help you guys out a little bit, keep getting money, you can just throw a little tip in our tip jar if you go to our website backel cast dot com. That would be cool. And you're great and everything's great and now we're better. We fixed. This movie fixed us. I honestly feel completely cured. I don't need I don't need any therapist now because Jack like sang at me for two and a half hours. This movie rules. Sorry, sorry, al right, Happy Holidays by by