Episode 175: Wild-Range Metabolomics and Nutrient Density with Glenn Elzinga

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And when you do that, you got

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green grass growing way into the

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winter.

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And, you know, I'm just

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continually astounded.

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I've been at this 34 years.

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And the stuff I'm still picking

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up is, you know, stuff that

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is life changing revelations.

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And a lot of it is just from

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looking at the land and looking

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at the cattle.

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But, you know, I've been bumping

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into so many stockmanship

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things. You know, we could talk

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about so many things like this

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cortisol thing and cattle.

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And oh, gosh, it just it is

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taking me to brand new places.

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And I don't have answers.

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I just got questions, John.

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So I should be actually

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interviewing you.

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Well,

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for some of the questions you

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might have, I may not be the

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person that has the answers.

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Well, you know, I'm sure,

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you know, and that is the

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interesting thing about the

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regenerative space.

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You know, I was brought up

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working on very conventional

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farms of every shape and size,

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you know, all the way from corn

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and soybeans to

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produce to orchards, using

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chemicals all the time.

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That

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was my childhood growing up.

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And, you

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know, the thing about the

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regenerative space that's

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different from that is like

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everybody in commodity

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agriculture, not everybody, but

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most people in commodity

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agriculture follow this

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formulaic

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way of doing business.

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I don't care if you're an

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orchard. I don't care if you're

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growing sod or

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corn or soybeans,

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and then you get into the

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regenerative space, and it's the

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Wild West.

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There is no formula, that's for

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sure.

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Yeah, everybody's doing

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something different.

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And so you can go to somebody's

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place, like the Alexander's

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place,

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and I know I'm going to learn

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stuff.

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Hey, I never thought about that

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before. And it's because for

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them, it's just like me, you're

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opening a new box every day.

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And it's like, wait, I didn't

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even know that was in there.

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And it's because we can.

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And it's because we can.

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by definition, that's what we

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do.

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And that's

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why it's fun. And that's why

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we're seeing burnout and

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conventional ag and people

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getting disillusioned and

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hopelessness.

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So anyway,

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and you're bringing a lot of

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hope to people and asking the

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questions that actually create

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more questions for them.

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And that's just what we want.

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That's the beautiful thing.

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That is one of the things that

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I've learned.

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I think one of the most,

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I don't know if I would call it

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the most underrated skill, but

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perhaps the underappreciated

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skill or one that I've learned

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to appreciate is

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the ability to ask the right

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questions.

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Um,

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and, and it's

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actually one of my

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biggest frustrations at times

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has been when I have been here

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as a podcast host

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and, or not even, or even just

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in conversation.

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And

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I recognize that I'm having a

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conversation with someone who

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is.

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not necessarily genius, but who

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is very wise, who is rich in

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experience and rich in

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knowledge, who is a walking

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encyclopedia,

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and who's not smart enough to

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know the right question to ask.

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That can be

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very frustrating.

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When I recognize,

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and I've had conversations with

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a few individuals like this who,

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I mean, they're the classic

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example

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of a walking encyclopedia,

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but they also didn't volunteer

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information. You had to be smart

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enough to know the question to

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ask in order to find the answer.

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Yeah.

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That's

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a frustrating experience when

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you recognize that here are

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people who are on the edge of

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being geniuses and you can't

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draw out what they have within

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them because you don't know the

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subject that they know.

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You know, and I think a lot of

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it, John, and correct me if I'm

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wrong, I think it's paradigm.

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You know, I think when you're

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when you're in a paradigm and

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you don't see, you

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know, that it's saying

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this dish on the table, the

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fruit bowl is now empty.

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You're in that fruit bowl,

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and you can't see out.

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You can't see over the sides.

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All of your

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thoughts revolve around

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your life in the fruit bowl,

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and you really can't see out of

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it.

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The fruit bowl is life.

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So until somebody like knocks

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over the fruit bowl or, um, you

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know, shoots a fire hose of

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water in there to get you to

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want to find out brownie.

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I mean, that's what happened to

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a lot of us in conventional ag.

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You know, I was pretty

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conventional on our cattle

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business

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and there were certain times

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where somebody came along and

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started clubbing me over the

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head and I was not going to

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survive the clubbing

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unless if I pulled away and

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said,

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Wait, we need to think about

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this differently.

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You know what I mean?

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So I see this in crop

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agriculture all the time.

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I got many relatives in the

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Midwest.

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They're fantastic farmers.

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And for them, the tweak,

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because of the paradigm,

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is I'm

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going to switch to anhydrous.

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I'm going to switch to

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anhydrous. I'm going to do the

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switch. And I know it's

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dangerous. And I know people get

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hurt.

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But I'm going to go to

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anhydrous. Or I'm not going to

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take my corn to the elevator

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anymore.

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I'm going to build a bin.

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And for them, those are the

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shifts that

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their brilliance gets

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attention to. You know what I

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mean? These hacks within that

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system. But they can't see

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outside the bowl.

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And

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until something abruptly, you

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know, say, say we pulled the

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entire subsidy off

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the business of commodity crops,

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cotton, corn,

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soybeans.

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You say we pulled subsidies off

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that.

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That would be a fire hose in a

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bowl for people.

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It would just blow them right

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out of there. And either they

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just quit.

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or the genius would kick in,

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John. It would kick in

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for a lot of them.

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You are so spot on.

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The genius would kick in because

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necessity is the mother of

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invention. And you know,

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there's this question,

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as I've been at a number of

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conferences this winter, people

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ask me to talk about

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agricultural economics and the

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history of agricultural

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economics and how we got to this

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place.

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we recognize we were in a very

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different place 70 or 80 years

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ago. How do we get,

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first of all, reminding us what

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that used to look like

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and bringing

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it flash forward to today.

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You know,

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my grandfather served as a

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conscientious objector during

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the Second World War

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and he came home at the end of

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the war.

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He was 28 years old.

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He married,

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got married,

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bought a farm,

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paid for it in four years.

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Wow.

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And you go back and

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look at the history and there

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was this entire era,

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late 40s, 50s,

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60s,

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many farms were paid for in a

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five to seven year time period,

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depending on where you were in

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the country and what crops you

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were growing and so forth.

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And the

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challenge that I've, I really

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liked the framing of a question

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that Peter Thiel often asks

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investee companies,

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you have a 10 year goal.

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If you had to achieve the 10

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year goal in six months, how

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would you do it?

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And it's a fascinating question

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because

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You can't achieve a 10 -year

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goal in six months by going

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faster or

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by going harder.

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You have to do something

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different.

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Exactly.

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And

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so the challenging question I've

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been asking people and when I'm

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asked to talk about this topic

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is, if you had to pay for your

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farm in five to seven years, how

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would you do it?

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Because I personally believe,

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well, I don't believe,

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I've got lots of evidence that

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it is still possible.

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I know many people who are

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producing revenue and

293
00:07:50,540 --> 00:07:52,819
profitability to that extent,

294
00:07:53,470 --> 00:07:54,810
but they're not doing it on

295
00:07:54,810 --> 00:07:55,870
commodity crops, obviously.

296
00:08:01,829 --> 00:08:02,629
Yeah.

297
00:08:02,769 --> 00:08:03,709
Those are good questions.

298
00:08:04,089 --> 00:08:04,930
I'm going to think about the

299
00:08:04,930 --> 00:08:05,730
Teal question.

300
00:08:08,970 --> 00:08:09,770
You know,

301
00:08:10,370 --> 00:08:11,470
for us, it wasn't

302
00:08:13,029 --> 00:08:15,370
a Peter Teal asking us, it was

303
00:08:15,370 --> 00:08:16,389
the club over the head.

304
00:08:18,300 --> 00:08:19,659
You know, it was survive or die.

305
00:08:20,149 --> 00:08:21,230
And if you're going to survive,

306
00:08:21,430 --> 00:08:22,470
you had to be innovators.

307
00:08:22,810 --> 00:08:23,970
You had to be you had to make

308
00:08:23,970 --> 00:08:25,970
the right choices and innovate.

309
00:08:26,209 --> 00:08:27,509
And, you know, and you had to be

310
00:08:27,509 --> 00:08:29,230
willing to make mistakes because

311
00:08:29,509 --> 00:08:31,209
there is far more mistakes and

312
00:08:32,549 --> 00:08:33,349
then

313
00:08:33,769 --> 00:08:35,730
positive features which created

314
00:08:35,730 --> 00:08:37,070
profitability ultimately.

315
00:08:39,730 --> 00:08:40,909
So it is a tough place.

316
00:08:41,009 --> 00:08:42,289
And, you know, I was talking

317
00:08:42,289 --> 00:08:43,190
about a

318
00:08:44,779 --> 00:08:45,579
good friend of mine.

319
00:08:45,639 --> 00:08:47,259
He worked on our ranch for 10

320
00:08:47,259 --> 00:08:49,180
years. And, you know, he was

321
00:08:49,180 --> 00:08:50,980
always listening to stuff like

322
00:08:50,980 --> 00:08:52,159
Peter Thiel. He was always

323
00:08:52,159 --> 00:08:52,959
listening to

324
00:08:54,419 --> 00:08:55,299
David Ramsey,

325
00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:58,860
small business creation and

326
00:08:58,860 --> 00:09:01,720
creating passive income streams.

327
00:09:01,919 --> 00:09:02,940
So you can go over here and

328
00:09:02,940 --> 00:09:05,100
create a new business and he's

329
00:09:05,100 --> 00:09:07,379
possibly selling that business,

330
00:09:07,519 --> 00:09:08,600
creating a new business over

331
00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:09,399
here.

332
00:09:09,259 --> 00:09:10,740
He's really into small business.

333
00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:12,100
And I'm

334
00:09:14,940 --> 00:09:15,980
just wondering about it because

335
00:09:15,980 --> 00:09:16,879
I was talking to him the other

336
00:09:16,879 --> 00:09:18,700
day and he's really struggling.

337
00:09:18,879 --> 00:09:20,379
He bought a small processing

338
00:09:20,379 --> 00:09:21,580
plant here

339
00:09:22,019 --> 00:09:23,319
in Idaho and he processes

340
00:09:23,319 --> 00:09:24,580
chickens. He's doing a great

341
00:09:24,580 --> 00:09:25,379
job.

342
00:09:25,909 --> 00:09:27,730
But I could tell just by talking

343
00:09:27,730 --> 00:09:28,870
to him, you know, he's been at

344
00:09:28,870 --> 00:09:30,210
this now for 10 or 12 years.

345
00:09:30,330 --> 00:09:31,490
He's struggling for cash.

346
00:09:34,330 --> 00:09:35,169
And I'm wondering what,

347
00:09:36,029 --> 00:09:36,829
you know, with all that

348
00:09:36,649 --> 00:09:37,970
knowledge he had, and I know he

349
00:09:37,970 --> 00:09:39,789
still invests in a lot of time,

350
00:09:39,870 --> 00:09:41,159
you know, he listens to a lot of

351
00:09:41,159 --> 00:09:42,500
podcasts. He reads a lot of

352
00:09:42,500 --> 00:09:43,299
books.

353
00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:44,500
You know, he's got the business

354
00:09:44,500 --> 00:09:45,980
hacks, John. You know, he's

355
00:09:47,100 --> 00:09:49,019
and I thought I said to my wife,

356
00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:50,460
Carol, I said, so I

357
00:09:51,409 --> 00:09:52,330
think he's got all the right

358
00:09:52,330 --> 00:09:53,590
ideas. He's thinking right.

359
00:09:54,779 --> 00:09:55,639
But is it that

360
00:09:56,500 --> 00:09:58,600
he still is in the business of

361
00:09:58,600 --> 00:09:59,419
cheap food

362
00:10:00,980 --> 00:10:02,980
and trying to add value to an

363
00:10:02,980 --> 00:10:03,899
already cheap

364
00:10:07,250 --> 00:10:08,789
product that people aren't used

365
00:10:08,789 --> 00:10:09,589
to paying more for?

366
00:10:09,549 --> 00:10:10,450
I mean, think of chicken.

367
00:10:11,730 --> 00:10:13,190
You can go to Costco and you can

368
00:10:13,190 --> 00:10:14,490
get a whole chicken for like $2.

369
00:10:15,629 --> 00:10:17,129
You know, that's already cooked,

370
00:10:17,350 --> 00:10:18,149
you know, winter on sale.

371
00:10:18,649 --> 00:10:20,590
You can walk out of Costco or a

372
00:10:20,590 --> 00:10:21,909
lot of grocery stores and get a

373
00:10:21,909 --> 00:10:22,750
broasted chicken

374
00:10:23,320 --> 00:10:24,759
that they've prepared for you.

375
00:10:24,799 --> 00:10:25,860
They've seasoned it, they've

376
00:10:25,860 --> 00:10:26,659
done everything.

377
00:10:27,039 --> 00:10:28,340
You can haul it out of there for

378
00:10:28,340 --> 00:10:29,139
a few dollars.

379
00:10:30,700 --> 00:10:31,639
And when we were selling

380
00:10:31,639 --> 00:10:32,639
chicken, we used to have a

381
00:10:32,639 --> 00:10:34,440
broiler program on our ranch, a

382
00:10:34,440 --> 00:10:36,279
pastured poultry operation, kind

383
00:10:36,279 --> 00:10:38,139
of a la Joel Salatin, you know,

384
00:10:38,860 --> 00:10:40,720
and we were raising not that

385
00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:41,740
many, you know, it was like 600

386
00:10:41,740 --> 00:10:42,539
birds a year.

387
00:10:44,299 --> 00:10:45,440
John, I couldn't make a pencil

388
00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:47,620
for less than $25 a whole

389
00:10:47,620 --> 00:10:48,419
broiler.

390
00:10:48,440 --> 00:10:50,139
I could not make it work for

391
00:10:50,139 --> 00:10:51,960
less than $25. To put that in a

392
00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:53,379
box and ship it all across the

393
00:10:53,379 --> 00:10:54,179
country,

394
00:10:54,220 --> 00:10:55,960
maintain a web store, keep the

395
00:10:55,960 --> 00:10:57,240
dry ice flowing, have the

396
00:10:57,240 --> 00:10:58,620
employees stuff it in a box,

397
00:10:59,080 --> 00:10:59,879
get the insulation,

398
00:11:00,500 --> 00:11:02,059
maintain a freezer, maintain all

399
00:11:02,059 --> 00:11:02,980
those infrastructures.

400
00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:05,360
I couldn't make it work for less

401
00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:06,159
than $25.

402
00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:07,960
And we sold out.

403
00:11:08,100 --> 00:11:09,319
We sold out. But yet,

404
00:11:10,539 --> 00:11:12,100
right across the street, you

405
00:11:12,100 --> 00:11:12,899
know, figuratively,

406
00:11:13,159 --> 00:11:15,100
you have this ability for

407
00:11:15,100 --> 00:11:16,240
somebody to buy a chicken for

408
00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:17,039
three bucks.

409
00:11:18,610 --> 00:11:20,330
This story is the perfect

410
00:11:20,330 --> 00:11:21,909
encapsulation of

411
00:11:22,990 --> 00:11:25,190
the last 80 years of our cheap

412
00:11:25,190 --> 00:11:26,029
food policy.

413
00:11:26,629 --> 00:11:27,470
And actually, you know, what

414
00:11:27,470 --> 00:11:28,769
makes it an even better contrast

415
00:11:28,769 --> 00:11:30,830
Clinton is the story of cheap

416
00:11:30,830 --> 00:11:32,730
chicken versus your grass fed

417
00:11:32,730 --> 00:11:33,529
steak.

418
00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:37,299
It's a complete inversion of

419
00:11:37,649 --> 00:11:39,529
the reality that used to exist

420
00:11:39,529 --> 00:11:41,750
prior to about 1950's or

421
00:11:41,750 --> 00:11:42,549
thereabouts.

422
00:11:42,570 --> 00:11:43,370
Yes.

423
00:11:43,639 --> 00:11:44,439
I

424
00:11:44,629 --> 00:11:46,549
think I may have first heard

425
00:11:46,549 --> 00:11:47,349
this from Joel,

426
00:11:48,029 --> 00:11:51,509
but he spoke about and I

427
00:11:51,509 --> 00:11:52,830
read the history as well.

428
00:11:53,090 --> 00:11:55,029
Franklin Roosevelt's second

429
00:11:55,250 --> 00:11:57,929
presidential campaign slogan

430
00:11:58,909 --> 00:12:00,610
was a chicken in every pot.

431
00:12:00,870 --> 00:12:01,830
It was.

432
00:12:02,220 --> 00:12:03,019
Yep.

433
00:12:02,639 --> 00:12:04,240
Because at the time, chicken was

434
00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:05,159
the expensive meat,

435
00:12:06,309 --> 00:12:07,269
beef was cheap,

436
00:12:07,639 --> 00:12:09,320
because beef could be pre -grown

437
00:12:09,320 --> 00:12:10,879
on grass and on rangeland.

438
00:12:11,309 --> 00:12:12,529
Chicken required grain.

439
00:12:13,019 --> 00:12:13,819
Right.

440
00:12:13,809 --> 00:12:15,409
And so that was the beginning

441
00:12:15,789 --> 00:12:16,690
of

442
00:12:17,610 --> 00:12:19,570
the federal level of a cheap

443
00:12:19,570 --> 00:12:20,370
food policy.

444
00:12:20,940 --> 00:12:23,059
And it was the beginning of

445
00:12:23,059 --> 00:12:24,919
significant incentivization of

446
00:12:24,919 --> 00:12:27,799
grain production and this entire

447
00:12:27,799 --> 00:12:29,759
system, which has now developed

448
00:12:29,759 --> 00:12:31,639
all of these tremendous societal

449
00:12:31,639 --> 00:12:32,639
externalities,

450
00:12:33,179 --> 00:12:35,519
the public health costs, the

451
00:12:35,519 --> 00:12:36,860
subsidies. You know,

452
00:12:37,220 --> 00:12:38,580
what is intriguing to me

453
00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:41,120
is looking at,

454
00:12:43,019 --> 00:12:44,139
I've now been in agriculture.

455
00:12:45,500 --> 00:12:46,940
I'm half your age.

456
00:12:47,059 --> 00:12:48,000
I've been around and paying

457
00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:49,319
attention for about 20 years.

458
00:12:51,750 --> 00:12:52,990
I don't know how many farmers

459
00:12:52,990 --> 00:12:54,889
are really paying attention and

460
00:12:54,889 --> 00:12:55,730
are really aware,

461
00:12:56,879 --> 00:12:59,399
but the public perception of

462
00:12:59,769 --> 00:13:00,569
farmers

463
00:13:00,789 --> 00:13:02,230
used to be,

464
00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:04,419
if you looked at consumer trust

465
00:13:04,419 --> 00:13:05,219
index,

466
00:13:05,379 --> 00:13:07,840
it was farmers were trusted at

467
00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:08,980
the top levels, right?

468
00:13:09,019 --> 00:13:09,980
Along with the clergy.

469
00:13:10,529 --> 00:13:11,329
Yes.

470
00:13:11,110 --> 00:13:12,950
And they are sliding fast

471
00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:15,700
because they are being perceived

472
00:13:15,700 --> 00:13:16,500
as

473
00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:18,720
Welfare recipients, they are

474
00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:19,960
dependent on welfare.

475
00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:22,299
Now, you can make the argument

476
00:13:22,299 --> 00:13:24,539
that a large degree of that has

477
00:13:24,539 --> 00:13:26,860
been deliberately created policy

478
00:13:26,860 --> 00:13:28,200
created that people have been

479
00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:29,500
farmers and producers have been

480
00:13:29,500 --> 00:13:30,299
guided

481
00:13:30,139 --> 00:13:31,720
this pathway by federal policy.

482
00:13:31,980 --> 00:13:32,860
I think you could make an

483
00:13:32,860 --> 00:13:34,419
argument for that, but it

484
00:13:34,419 --> 00:13:35,679
doesn't change the reality of

485
00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:36,600
what currently exists.

486
00:13:38,480 --> 00:13:39,360
It doesn't. I think the other

487
00:13:39,360 --> 00:13:40,840
part of it too, though, John, is

488
00:13:40,840 --> 00:13:41,639
that

489
00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:44,860
for

490
00:13:45,620 --> 00:13:47,019
us, one of the standing

491
00:13:47,019 --> 00:13:48,299
principles on

492
00:13:48,929 --> 00:13:50,110
the whole direct market paradigm

493
00:13:50,110 --> 00:13:52,649
for us is we need to establish

494
00:13:52,649 --> 00:13:53,970
customers that know, love and

495
00:13:53,970 --> 00:13:54,769
trust us.

496
00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:58,659
And we need to know, love, and

497
00:13:58,659 --> 00:13:59,459
trust them as well.

498
00:13:59,580 --> 00:14:01,019
It's a mutual. It goes both

499
00:14:01,019 --> 00:14:01,819
ways.

500
00:14:01,740 --> 00:14:02,539
And I

501
00:14:02,700 --> 00:14:03,500
think that

502
00:14:06,690 --> 00:14:08,230
because of the commodification

503
00:14:08,230 --> 00:14:09,549
of the food system,

504
00:14:09,850 --> 00:14:12,610
there is no knowledge, there's

505
00:14:12,610 --> 00:14:13,990
no loving, and there's no

506
00:14:13,990 --> 00:14:14,789
trusting.

507
00:14:16,269 --> 00:14:18,269
There's no association.

508
00:14:18,889 --> 00:14:21,110
And we have the stereotypes of

509
00:14:21,110 --> 00:14:22,509
we think milk comes from the

510
00:14:22,509 --> 00:14:23,750
grocery store. We think meat

511
00:14:23,750 --> 00:14:24,809
comes from the grocery store.

512
00:14:24,929 --> 00:14:28,169
Those things may or may not be

513
00:14:28,169 --> 00:14:28,969
true.

514
00:14:29,639 --> 00:14:30,940
But the fact of the matter is

515
00:14:30,940 --> 00:14:32,620
they do have no knowledge

516
00:14:32,960 --> 00:14:35,440
of the land from which I came or

517
00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:36,720
the family from which I came.

518
00:14:37,220 --> 00:14:38,080
So it isn't only,

519
00:14:38,740 --> 00:14:40,120
you know, I think not everybody

520
00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:42,879
is aware of the subsidization of

521
00:14:42,879 --> 00:14:44,240
the thing, but they are totally

522
00:14:44,240 --> 00:14:47,039
aware that they have no idea, no

523
00:14:47,039 --> 00:14:49,590
idea whether this state came

524
00:14:49,590 --> 00:14:50,389
from Brazil.

525
00:14:50,850 --> 00:14:52,529
or Argentina, Paraguay,

526
00:14:53,409 --> 00:14:54,209
Australia,

527
00:14:54,450 --> 00:14:56,450
or maybe a United States

528
00:14:56,450 --> 00:14:57,250
feedlot.

529
00:14:57,269 --> 00:14:58,950
And the perception of feedlots

530
00:14:58,950 --> 00:15:00,649
itself is a toxic thing for a

531
00:15:00,649 --> 00:15:01,449
lot of people.

532
00:15:01,190 --> 00:15:02,250
They've seen it.

533
00:15:02,690 --> 00:15:03,850
you know, you can't hide a

534
00:15:03,850 --> 00:15:04,649
feedlot,

535
00:15:04,750 --> 00:15:05,549
you know, nicely,

536
00:15:05,789 --> 00:15:06,870
most of them are in Kansas.

537
00:15:07,569 --> 00:15:08,750
And you only need to experience

538
00:15:08,750 --> 00:15:10,129
them once to develop an opinion.

539
00:15:10,529 --> 00:15:12,389
One time, one time, like, and

540
00:15:12,389 --> 00:15:13,610
that's actually what got us off

541
00:15:13,610 --> 00:15:15,230
the commodity train.

542
00:15:15,330 --> 00:15:16,590
It was that one day in Kansas,

543
00:15:16,590 --> 00:15:19,450
we're traveling west on I -70,

544
00:15:19,750 --> 00:15:21,149
and it's pouring down rain,

545
00:15:22,529 --> 00:15:24,230
and we're driving an old Chevy

546
00:15:24,230 --> 00:15:25,840
Suburban, we're we just came

547
00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:27,279
from our Carol's

548
00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:29,259
folks,

549
00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:31,059
my in -laws in Indiana.

550
00:15:31,539 --> 00:15:32,700
We helped them with corn harvest

551
00:15:32,700 --> 00:15:33,500
every year.

552
00:15:34,409 --> 00:15:35,730
And before that, we just loaded

553
00:15:35,730 --> 00:15:37,309
our calves on a truck, our calf

554
00:15:37,309 --> 00:15:38,629
crop, you know, it was about 200

555
00:15:38,629 --> 00:15:39,950
calves, two semi loads.

556
00:15:40,129 --> 00:15:42,549
We sent them off and my kids

557
00:15:42,549 --> 00:15:43,950
helped me and it was all

558
00:15:43,950 --> 00:15:45,210
wonderful. And you know, we

559
00:15:45,909 --> 00:15:47,169
raise those calves through the

560
00:15:47,169 --> 00:15:49,049
season and put them on the range

561
00:15:49,049 --> 00:15:50,009
and put them on some of the best

562
00:15:50,009 --> 00:15:51,330
grass on earth and raise these

563
00:15:51,330 --> 00:15:52,750
super healthy calves and we're

564
00:15:52,750 --> 00:15:54,429
going through Candace on I -70

565
00:15:54,429 --> 00:15:55,229
and it's pouring.

566
00:15:58,490 --> 00:15:59,769
And my daughter says to me,

567
00:16:00,110 --> 00:16:00,909
dad,

568
00:16:01,250 --> 00:16:02,230
yeah, honey,

569
00:16:04,519 --> 00:16:05,700
what is that smell?

570
00:16:07,549 --> 00:16:08,850
What is that smell?

571
00:16:08,929 --> 00:16:10,450
It's horrible. And I said, well,

572
00:16:10,470 --> 00:16:11,590
don't open your window, but

573
00:16:11,590 --> 00:16:12,669
we're passing a big feedlot

574
00:16:12,669 --> 00:16:13,469
right now.

575
00:16:13,690 --> 00:16:14,490
And she said,

576
00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:16,200
you mean where they feed

577
00:16:16,830 --> 00:16:18,649
calves? I said, yeah, yeah.

578
00:16:19,700 --> 00:16:20,799
And she said, can I just roll

579
00:16:20,799 --> 00:16:21,899
down my window for a second?

580
00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:23,139
I said, well, it's just going to

581
00:16:23,139 --> 00:16:24,120
make the smell worse.

582
00:16:24,220 --> 00:16:25,500
And she said, I'm not trying to

583
00:16:25,500 --> 00:16:26,299
deal with the smell.

584
00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:27,720
I just want to look and see

585
00:16:28,230 --> 00:16:29,330
because, you know, the windows

586
00:16:29,330 --> 00:16:30,210
are rain streaked.

587
00:16:30,899 --> 00:16:32,139
And I said, sure, go for it.

588
00:16:34,149 --> 00:16:35,490
She rolls down the window and

589
00:16:35,490 --> 00:16:36,870
she just stares out there.

590
00:16:37,069 --> 00:16:38,970
And this is one of these deals.

591
00:16:39,129 --> 00:16:40,370
They must be feeding like 70

592
00:16:40,370 --> 00:16:42,230
,000 head or 100 ,000 head or

593
00:16:42,230 --> 00:16:43,289
something done.

594
00:16:44,039 --> 00:16:45,360
And it was unforgettable because

595
00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:46,980
it had been pouring down rain

596
00:16:46,980 --> 00:16:48,139
there apparently for a couple of

597
00:16:48,139 --> 00:16:50,039
days. And there's these calves

598
00:16:50,039 --> 00:16:51,360
out there and they're literally

599
00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:52,379
belly deep in mud.

600
00:16:53,139 --> 00:16:54,700
just belly deep in fecal mud.

601
00:16:54,879 --> 00:16:56,139
And my daughter is smart enough

602
00:16:56,139 --> 00:16:57,580
to know that it's fecal mud.

603
00:16:57,779 --> 00:16:59,000
You know, obviously we can smell

604
00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:00,419
it. And, and

605
00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:02,180
she just stares out the window

606
00:17:02,180 --> 00:17:03,460
for a while. And then I hear a

607
00:17:03,460 --> 00:17:04,259
roll up the window.

608
00:17:04,779 --> 00:17:05,579
We

609
00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:07,519
drive for a while, another few

610
00:17:07,519 --> 00:17:08,319
miles.

611
00:17:08,079 --> 00:17:08,879
And

612
00:17:10,299 --> 00:17:11,099
she says, Dad,

613
00:17:14,339 --> 00:17:15,380
are our calves in there?

614
00:17:18,309 --> 00:17:19,609
And I said, no, they're not.

615
00:17:19,690 --> 00:17:21,259
And she said, you told me they

616
00:17:21,259 --> 00:17:22,059
went to Kansas.

617
00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:24,039
I said, yeah, but there's many

618
00:17:24,039 --> 00:17:25,160
of these things in Kansas.

619
00:17:25,980 --> 00:17:27,339
And she said, so our calves

620
00:17:27,339 --> 00:17:28,480
could be in

621
00:17:29,619 --> 00:17:30,819
a situation just like those

622
00:17:30,819 --> 00:17:31,619
calves.

623
00:17:32,779 --> 00:17:34,019
I said, yeah, they could be.

624
00:17:34,779 --> 00:17:35,579
I can't lie to you.

625
00:17:37,460 --> 00:17:39,200
And I just turned to my wife and

626
00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:40,539
her eyes were already there.

627
00:17:41,869 --> 00:17:43,529
I'm looking at her and her eyes

628
00:17:43,529 --> 00:17:44,650
are already there waiting.

629
00:17:46,740 --> 00:17:48,460
And I said to her, never again,

630
00:17:50,599 --> 00:17:51,399
never again.

631
00:17:51,730 --> 00:17:53,130
So people have that kind of

632
00:17:53,130 --> 00:17:54,910
imagery in a lot of their minds.

633
00:17:55,230 --> 00:17:56,809
Maybe they haven't seen it as

634
00:17:56,809 --> 00:17:57,849
bad as we have,

635
00:17:58,829 --> 00:18:00,950
but this visceral

636
00:18:01,740 --> 00:18:04,200
animal husbandry feeling that

637
00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:06,519
some of us have, cattle like

638
00:18:06,519 --> 00:18:07,960
that in a situation of

639
00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:08,759
confinement,

640
00:18:10,390 --> 00:18:12,349
especially those of us who've

641
00:18:12,349 --> 00:18:13,589
been around cattle, I mean, it

642
00:18:13,589 --> 00:18:14,389
pulls the trigger.

643
00:18:14,369 --> 00:18:16,170
So it's pretty complicated, but

644
00:18:16,170 --> 00:18:16,970
I do

645
00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:18,180
believe that

646
00:18:19,839 --> 00:18:21,680
people don't trust people

647
00:18:22,220 --> 00:18:23,279
in agriculture anymore.

648
00:18:24,460 --> 00:18:25,720
And this this is why this

649
00:18:25,720 --> 00:18:27,119
thing's happening right now, I

650
00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:27,919
think, you know,

651
00:18:28,759 --> 00:18:30,759
Trump says these things that,

652
00:18:31,180 --> 00:18:31,980
you know, hey, we're going to

653
00:18:31,900 --> 00:18:32,779
lower beef prices.

654
00:18:33,019 --> 00:18:33,819
And you know what?

655
00:18:34,279 --> 00:18:35,299
My neighbors

656
00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:37,319
hate that.

657
00:18:37,900 --> 00:18:39,160
They hate that because they feel

658
00:18:39,160 --> 00:18:41,140
like for once in their lives,

659
00:18:41,180 --> 00:18:42,819
their cow -calf operations are

660
00:18:42,819 --> 00:18:44,019
finally in

661
00:18:44,869 --> 00:18:46,589
the black, finally in the black,

662
00:18:46,809 --> 00:18:47,990
you know, after years and years

663
00:18:47,990 --> 00:18:48,789
of waiting.

664
00:18:48,809 --> 00:18:49,769
I think Jim Garris

665
00:18:50,660 --> 00:18:53,200
told me once that 1972 was the

666
00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:54,000
last time this happened.

667
00:18:54,670 --> 00:18:55,849
and cattle prices weren't, you

668
00:18:55,849 --> 00:18:56,910
know, they weren't around four

669
00:18:56,910 --> 00:18:57,710
bucks,

670
00:18:57,670 --> 00:18:58,829
but everything else was super

671
00:18:58,829 --> 00:19:00,089
low. You could buy a pickup for

672
00:19:00,089 --> 00:19:01,869
what, $2 ,000 or something like

673
00:19:01,869 --> 00:19:03,130
that. Labor was, you know,

674
00:19:03,730 --> 00:19:05,150
in the single digits, like

675
00:19:05,150 --> 00:19:06,269
around one to $2.

676
00:19:07,180 --> 00:19:08,640
So all things put equal,

677
00:19:09,019 --> 00:19:10,359
Jim was like, no, this happened

678
00:19:10,359 --> 00:19:11,740
before. It was in 1972.

679
00:19:13,859 --> 00:19:14,859
So meanwhile,

680
00:19:15,309 --> 00:19:16,170
you know, we waited,

681
00:19:16,630 --> 00:19:19,349
what is that, 50 years, 53 years

682
00:19:19,349 --> 00:19:20,509
since that

683
00:19:20,950 --> 00:19:22,150
time for it to happen again.

684
00:19:22,309 --> 00:19:23,109
Here we are.

685
00:19:23,900 --> 00:19:25,200
And my neighbors are going crazy

686
00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:26,319
when Trump says we're going to

687
00:19:26,319 --> 00:19:27,160
lower beef prices,

688
00:19:27,710 --> 00:19:29,769
because they feel like for once

689
00:19:29,769 --> 00:19:31,009
in their lifetime, after 50

690
00:19:31,009 --> 00:19:32,730
years, they're finally, finally

691
00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:34,740
a little bit in the black.

692
00:19:35,019 --> 00:19:35,819
They're a little bit in the

693
00:19:35,740 --> 00:19:37,019
black. They're not harvesting

694
00:19:37,019 --> 00:19:38,180
their equity anymore.

695
00:19:39,049 --> 00:19:40,190
You know, they're not increasing

696
00:19:40,190 --> 00:19:41,930
their size or credit line based

697
00:19:41,930 --> 00:19:44,269
on equity increase because all

698
00:19:44,269 --> 00:19:45,549
agricultural land in the country

699
00:19:45,549 --> 00:19:47,089
is increasing in equity value.

700
00:19:47,210 --> 00:19:48,369
So these bankers, they love it

701
00:19:48,369 --> 00:19:49,169
and say, hey,

702
00:19:49,990 --> 00:19:51,049
we could give you a higher

703
00:19:51,049 --> 00:19:51,849
operating.

704
00:19:53,089 --> 00:19:54,269
because your equity's improved.

705
00:19:54,430 --> 00:19:55,609
You're doing a great job.

706
00:19:56,150 --> 00:19:57,509
Your equity's improved, even

707
00:19:57,509 --> 00:19:58,470
though they have nothing to do

708
00:19:58,470 --> 00:19:59,410
with it, John. You know what I

709
00:19:59,410 --> 00:20:00,210
mean?

710
00:20:00,089 --> 00:20:00,889
Yeah.

711
00:20:00,509 --> 00:20:01,309
I mean, it's because, you know,

712
00:20:01,390 --> 00:20:02,750
farmland appreciation for us,

713
00:20:02,809 --> 00:20:03,829
it's recreational value

714
00:20:03,829 --> 00:20:04,829
appreciation. We live in a

715
00:20:04,829 --> 00:20:05,970
beautiful country, you know,

716
00:20:06,369 --> 00:20:08,970
just big mountains and snowy

717
00:20:08,970 --> 00:20:11,009
crested mountain vistas with

718
00:20:11,009 --> 00:20:12,309
green grass underneath and

719
00:20:12,309 --> 00:20:13,109
people love it.

720
00:20:13,089 --> 00:20:14,029
And they they're willing to

721
00:20:14,029 --> 00:20:15,210
spend a ton of money for it.

722
00:20:15,690 --> 00:20:17,150
And so as a result, land

723
00:20:17,150 --> 00:20:18,210
appreciation is just

724
00:20:18,210 --> 00:20:19,009
exponential.

725
00:20:19,349 --> 00:20:21,309
And these bankers say, hey, we

726
00:20:21,309 --> 00:20:22,589
love your equity position.

727
00:20:22,990 --> 00:20:23,869
Do you want more money?

728
00:20:25,509 --> 00:20:26,569
That was what precipitated the

729
00:20:26,569 --> 00:20:29,529
1980s farm crisis is getting

730
00:20:29,529 --> 00:20:31,450
farmers and getting farmers

731
00:20:31,450 --> 00:20:32,650
comfortable with increased

732
00:20:32,650 --> 00:20:33,450
credit.

733
00:20:33,650 --> 00:20:34,450
No.

734
00:20:33,890 --> 00:20:35,150
And I remember, John,

735
00:20:35,779 --> 00:20:37,140
you know, neighbors, Carol's

736
00:20:37,140 --> 00:20:38,359
neighbors had airplanes.

737
00:20:39,299 --> 00:20:41,359
These guys grew corn and beans.

738
00:20:41,519 --> 00:20:42,319
They had airplanes.

739
00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:43,700
They bought airplanes because

740
00:20:44,079 --> 00:20:44,879
they could they

741
00:20:45,210 --> 00:20:46,130
could they could just borrow the

742
00:20:46,130 --> 00:20:46,930
money.

743
00:20:47,430 --> 00:20:49,789
and, you know, corn was okay,

744
00:20:50,130 --> 00:20:51,329
and they could buy airplanes.

745
00:20:51,430 --> 00:20:52,450
It was an exciting time,

746
00:20:53,099 --> 00:20:54,859
but it wasn't in just a little

747
00:20:54,859 --> 00:20:55,659
bit.

748
00:20:55,819 --> 00:20:56,779
There's another contributing

749
00:20:56,779 --> 00:20:59,000
factor to a rapid erosion of

750
00:20:59,000 --> 00:20:59,960
trust of agriculture.

751
00:21:01,210 --> 00:21:02,769
And this is a very controversial

752
00:21:02,769 --> 00:21:04,769
topic. But since we are

753
00:21:04,769 --> 00:21:06,190
embracing controversial topics,

754
00:21:06,190 --> 00:21:07,349
I'll just rip the can off,

755
00:21:08,170 --> 00:21:09,109
rip the lid off the can of

756
00:21:09,109 --> 00:21:09,909
worms.

757
00:21:10,809 --> 00:21:13,599
And that is the recent issue

758
00:21:13,599 --> 00:21:14,859
around glyphosate

759
00:21:15,940 --> 00:21:17,640
and Trump's executive order

760
00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:19,460
around glyphosate supplies.

761
00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:20,539
Now you can have lots of

762
00:21:20,539 --> 00:21:21,380
conversations about

763
00:21:22,559 --> 00:21:24,079
the incentives around that and

764
00:21:24,079 --> 00:21:25,140
how that all came to be.

765
00:21:26,339 --> 00:21:27,539
But the reality is,

766
00:21:29,150 --> 00:21:29,950
Maha,

767
00:21:30,599 --> 00:21:31,859
people who care about public

768
00:21:31,859 --> 00:21:32,659
health,

769
00:21:33,069 --> 00:21:34,569
the people who are awake and are

770
00:21:34,569 --> 00:21:35,990
paying attention, and there are

771
00:21:35,990 --> 00:21:37,970
tens of millions of them more

772
00:21:37,970 --> 00:21:39,369
today than there were five years

773
00:21:39,369 --> 00:21:40,169
ago,

774
00:21:40,049 --> 00:21:41,789
are ticked.

775
00:21:43,420 --> 00:21:45,619
They are ticked and they go on

776
00:21:45,619 --> 00:21:47,599
social media and say that they

777
00:21:47,599 --> 00:21:49,160
see farmers universally

778
00:21:49,539 --> 00:21:51,839
defending the use of glyphosate

779
00:21:54,069 --> 00:21:54,869
and

780
00:21:55,309 --> 00:21:57,450
not defending the use of

781
00:21:57,450 --> 00:21:58,329
glyphosate. That's not quite the

782
00:21:58,329 --> 00:21:59,129
right framing,

783
00:21:59,450 --> 00:22:01,430
but in complete denial that

784
00:22:01,430 --> 00:22:03,369
glyphosate has any human health

785
00:22:03,369 --> 00:22:04,230
impacts.

786
00:22:06,150 --> 00:22:07,049
And so there

787
00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:08,339
isn't

788
00:22:08,750 --> 00:22:11,930
the polarities are so opposed

789
00:22:11,930 --> 00:22:14,170
and so far apart from each

790
00:22:14,170 --> 00:22:14,970
other.

791
00:22:15,130 --> 00:22:17,190
that it's difficult to have even

792
00:22:17,190 --> 00:22:19,029
a reasoned conversation to say,

793
00:22:19,269 --> 00:22:21,130
yes, we understand that

794
00:22:21,130 --> 00:22:22,769
agriculture today is

795
00:22:23,150 --> 00:22:25,309
in a spot of dependency, and

796
00:22:25,309 --> 00:22:26,430
that there is a need for

797
00:22:26,430 --> 00:22:27,230
transition.

798
00:22:27,490 --> 00:22:29,720
But also, we shouldn't deny the

799
00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:31,559
fact that there are human health

800
00:22:31,559 --> 00:22:32,359
implications.

801
00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:34,460
Because and

802
00:22:34,930 --> 00:22:36,069
anyway,

803
00:22:36,670 --> 00:22:37,589
it's that that whole

804
00:22:37,589 --> 00:22:38,389
conversation,

805
00:22:39,190 --> 00:22:40,150
you

806
00:22:41,069 --> 00:22:42,950
know, reminds me reminds me of a

807
00:22:42,950 --> 00:22:43,869
quote from Charlie Munger,

808
00:22:46,269 --> 00:22:47,069
Charlie said,

809
00:22:47,650 --> 00:22:48,970
something to the effect of you

810
00:22:48,970 --> 00:22:50,869
have no right to have an opinion

811
00:22:51,500 --> 00:22:53,279
unless you can articulate the

812
00:22:53,279 --> 00:22:54,500
opposing point of view better

813
00:22:54,500 --> 00:22:55,299
than the opposition

814
00:22:57,109 --> 00:22:59,630
and yeah and i think

815
00:23:00,940 --> 00:23:01,740
if

816
00:23:02,079 --> 00:23:05,099
consumers were able and they

817
00:23:05,230 --> 00:23:06,289
have the experience, the

818
00:23:06,289 --> 00:23:08,029
context, many of them, but if

819
00:23:08,029 --> 00:23:09,990
they were able to walk a mile in

820
00:23:09,990 --> 00:23:11,250
the footsteps of a farmer, they

821
00:23:11,250 --> 00:23:12,670
would have more sympathy for the

822
00:23:12,670 --> 00:23:14,009
dependency on glyphosate that

823
00:23:14,009 --> 00:23:15,589
many growers have and vice

824
00:23:15,589 --> 00:23:16,389
versa.

825
00:23:16,470 --> 00:23:18,230
If farmers were willing to

826
00:23:18,230 --> 00:23:20,230
authentically without bias,

827
00:23:20,349 --> 00:23:22,369
actually look at the real data

828
00:23:22,809 --> 00:23:24,349
that is published in the peer

829
00:23:24,349 --> 00:23:25,149
reviewed literature.

830
00:23:24,970 --> 00:23:25,769
I mean,

831
00:23:25,430 --> 00:23:26,470
there's a simple reality.

832
00:23:26,650 --> 00:23:28,630
Why, why does

833
00:23:29,230 --> 00:23:30,690
Bayer keep losing lawsuits?

834
00:23:31,589 --> 00:23:32,389
It's pretty clear.

835
00:23:32,410 --> 00:23:33,210
Yeah.

836
00:23:33,759 --> 00:23:36,000
If there were clearly no

837
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:37,660
evidence for glyphosate causing

838
00:23:37,660 --> 00:23:38,960
harm, then Bayer would never

839
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:39,759
lose.

840
00:23:39,839 --> 00:23:41,460
Yeah, or why do

841
00:23:41,799 --> 00:23:43,880
those same companies try

842
00:23:44,869 --> 00:23:45,990
to set up legislative

843
00:23:45,990 --> 00:23:46,789
protection?

844
00:23:47,430 --> 00:23:48,670
You know, we've had a bill in

845
00:23:48,670 --> 00:23:50,589
our state in Idaho that failed,

846
00:23:50,769 --> 00:23:51,930
thankfully, for legislative

847
00:23:51,930 --> 00:23:52,730
protection.

848
00:23:52,609 --> 00:23:54,049
You can't sue these companies

849
00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:58,279
for glyphosate claims, you know,

850
00:23:58,339 --> 00:23:59,720
as regarding human health.

851
00:24:00,259 --> 00:24:02,359
So, I mean, that to me is very

852
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:03,980
clear that they must see

853
00:24:04,730 --> 00:24:06,390
An issue here. Well, that is an

854
00:24:06,390 --> 00:24:07,529
aspect. That's another

855
00:24:07,529 --> 00:24:08,710
consideration of farmers

856
00:24:08,710 --> 00:24:10,230
destroying public trust is

857
00:24:10,230 --> 00:24:11,950
because they're not even willing

858
00:24:11,950 --> 00:24:13,109
that they have this inherent

859
00:24:13,109 --> 00:24:14,569
bias because they feel that it's

860
00:24:14,569 --> 00:24:15,369
dependency.

861
00:24:15,769 --> 00:24:16,710
And so they're not even willing

862
00:24:16,710 --> 00:24:18,170
to consider the opposing point

863
00:24:18,170 --> 00:24:20,109
of view and actually look at

864
00:24:20,710 --> 00:24:23,410
the raw source information and

865
00:24:23,410 --> 00:24:24,650
develop their own unbiased.

866
00:24:24,890 --> 00:24:26,230
Right. And the consumers are

867
00:24:26,230 --> 00:24:27,490
seeing this. They're seeing

868
00:24:27,490 --> 00:24:28,690
farmers trying

869
00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:31,279
to get these bills sponsored.

870
00:24:32,519 --> 00:24:33,420
They're the ones who are doing

871
00:24:33,420 --> 00:24:34,220
it.

872
00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:35,680
You know, they're, you know,

873
00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:37,000
actually lackeys.

874
00:24:38,970 --> 00:24:40,150
You know why they are out there

875
00:24:40,150 --> 00:24:41,190
by the chemical companies?

876
00:24:42,309 --> 00:24:44,549
Because companies are not

877
00:24:44,549 --> 00:24:46,509
stupid. And they know that

878
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:48,599
farmers historically have rated

879
00:24:48,599 --> 00:24:49,859
extremely high on the consumer

880
00:24:49,859 --> 00:24:51,900
trust index. Yes, rated right up

881
00:24:51,900 --> 00:24:52,700
there with clergy.

882
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:54,769
So if you're a pharmaceutical

883
00:24:54,769 --> 00:24:55,849
company, or if you're an

884
00:24:55,849 --> 00:24:57,369
agribusiness company, who better

885
00:24:57,369 --> 00:24:58,549
to get to represent your

886
00:24:58,549 --> 00:24:59,950
interests than farmers?

887
00:25:00,140 --> 00:25:01,140
persuade them that it is in

888
00:25:01,140 --> 00:25:02,359
their best interest to represent

889
00:25:02,359 --> 00:25:03,159
you?

890
00:25:03,450 --> 00:25:04,470
Yeah, Idaho is still pretty

891
00:25:04,470 --> 00:25:07,150
rural state. In fact, a lot of

892
00:25:07,150 --> 00:25:08,569
the legislators who

893
00:25:10,390 --> 00:25:11,289
are trying to promote that

894
00:25:11,289 --> 00:25:12,450
legislation were

895
00:25:12,789 --> 00:25:13,589
farmers.

896
00:25:13,589 --> 00:25:15,009
I mean, the people in

897
00:25:15,319 --> 00:25:17,099
the Senate, you know, state

898
00:25:17,099 --> 00:25:18,940
congressionals, they are

899
00:25:18,940 --> 00:25:20,119
farmers. I know these guys

900
00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:20,919
personally.

901
00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:22,319
They're the ones pushing for

902
00:25:22,319 --> 00:25:23,119
this bill

903
00:25:23,059 --> 00:25:25,279
of legislative protection of

904
00:25:25,279 --> 00:25:26,079
immunity.

905
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:27,440
for these companies.

906
00:25:27,380 --> 00:25:29,079
And you got non -Hodgkin's

907
00:25:29,079 --> 00:25:30,059
lymphoma over here.

908
00:25:30,420 --> 00:25:32,190
And it's like, yes, this is

909
00:25:32,190 --> 00:25:32,990
really happening.

910
00:25:33,559 --> 00:25:35,279
It's been tried and true and

911
00:25:35,279 --> 00:25:36,759
tested in courtroom over and

912
00:25:36,759 --> 00:25:37,559
over again.

913
00:25:37,759 --> 00:25:38,819
And there's a whole bunch of

914
00:25:38,819 --> 00:25:39,839
settlements that have already

915
00:25:39,839 --> 00:25:40,639
occurred.

916
00:25:41,130 --> 00:25:42,430
And it's like, what are we even

917
00:25:42,430 --> 00:25:43,809
doing here? Why can't we even

918
00:25:43,809 --> 00:25:44,730
ask the question?

919
00:25:44,890 --> 00:25:46,170
That's what I want to ask is,

920
00:25:46,670 --> 00:25:47,809
why can't we even ask the

921
00:25:47,809 --> 00:25:48,609
question

922
00:25:49,940 --> 00:25:52,680
about why can't we wait and

923
00:25:53,210 --> 00:25:54,390
see what science says about

924
00:25:54,390 --> 00:25:55,190
this?

925
00:25:55,700 --> 00:25:57,259
Why do

926
00:25:57,259 --> 00:26:00,740
we even want to gamble

927
00:26:00,740 --> 00:26:01,539
human

928
00:26:01,759 --> 00:26:02,559
health here?

929
00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:05,900
Why would we just say, oh, wait,

930
00:26:06,539 --> 00:26:07,759
we trust these companies.

931
00:26:08,059 --> 00:26:09,900
The non -Hodgkin's lymphoma

932
00:26:09,900 --> 00:26:12,420
suits are invalid.

933
00:26:13,279 --> 00:26:14,339
We're going to disregard them.

934
00:26:14,619 --> 00:26:15,859
But why not say, hey, wait,

935
00:26:16,460 --> 00:26:17,539
this might be a human health

936
00:26:17,539 --> 00:26:19,119
issue. Let's check it out first.

937
00:26:20,599 --> 00:26:22,200
And instead, we've gone the

938
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:23,000
opposite direction.

939
00:26:24,940 --> 00:26:25,740
No, that,

940
00:26:25,859 --> 00:26:27,240
you know, I'm actually involved

941
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:28,519
with some of the Maha stuff.

942
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:30,279
And right now I can't even sort

943
00:26:30,279 --> 00:26:31,859
out what

944
00:26:32,490 --> 00:26:33,450
side people are on.

945
00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:36,519
Because, you know, on one hand,

946
00:26:36,599 --> 00:26:37,599
you know, from the farmer's

947
00:26:37,599 --> 00:26:38,880
side, like I said, I, you know,

948
00:26:38,900 --> 00:26:40,299
I have relatives in the corn and

949
00:26:40,299 --> 00:26:41,099
beans,

950
00:26:40,819 --> 00:26:42,359
corn and bean business who

951
00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:43,460
depend on glyphosate.

952
00:26:43,829 --> 00:26:44,930
They got Roundup Ready corn,

953
00:26:45,049 --> 00:26:46,769
they got Roundup Ready beans,

954
00:26:46,890 --> 00:26:47,690
you know, when they're doing an

955
00:26:47,690 --> 00:26:49,150
off crop like alfalfa, they got

956
00:26:49,150 --> 00:26:51,089
Roundup Ready alfalfa.

957
00:26:51,890 --> 00:26:54,630
And their whole infrastructure

958
00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:56,559
been built around this one

959
00:26:56,559 --> 00:26:57,359
chemical.

960
00:26:58,269 --> 00:26:59,809
And so now

961
00:27:00,859 --> 00:27:02,319
do we just pull the rug out from

962
00:27:02,319 --> 00:27:03,380
under them and say it's over?

963
00:27:03,930 --> 00:27:04,750
Hey, the party's over.

964
00:27:04,890 --> 00:27:07,230
And meanwhile, I don't even know

965
00:27:07,509 --> 00:27:09,109
what their alternative is.

966
00:27:09,190 --> 00:27:10,549
Is it going back to atrazine?

967
00:27:10,609 --> 00:27:11,569
For some people it is.

968
00:27:11,750 --> 00:27:13,029
Some people are night spraying

969
00:27:13,029 --> 00:27:13,829
dicamba.

970
00:27:14,029 --> 00:27:15,589
Some states are legislating

971
00:27:15,589 --> 00:27:16,389
dicamba.

972
00:27:17,289 --> 00:27:18,609
So I mean, what are we going to

973
00:27:18,609 --> 00:27:19,730
do, John? You know, I mean, if

974
00:27:19,730 --> 00:27:21,069
you jerk the rug out from under

975
00:27:21,069 --> 00:27:22,890
him, do John Kemp get a whole

976
00:27:22,890 --> 00:27:25,650
bunch of phone calls about, you

977
00:27:25,650 --> 00:27:27,170
know, I mean, you know, there's

978
00:27:27,170 --> 00:27:28,430
no easy answers there.

979
00:27:28,609 --> 00:27:30,509
No, there are no easy answers.

980
00:27:30,509 --> 00:27:32,470
And there need to there needs to

981
00:27:32,470 --> 00:27:33,549
be a transition there.

982
00:27:33,650 --> 00:27:35,569
It isn't appropriate to do a rug

983
00:27:35,569 --> 00:27:36,470
pull, as it were.

984
00:27:36,569 --> 00:27:38,849
And also, it doesn't work to

985
00:27:38,849 --> 00:27:40,309
ignore the conversation, stick

986
00:27:40,309 --> 00:27:41,349
our heads in the sand and hope

987
00:27:41,349 --> 00:27:42,470
it goes away and gets better on

988
00:27:42,470 --> 00:27:43,269
its own.

989
00:27:45,190 --> 00:27:46,589
It's not our fault that bear

990
00:27:46,589 --> 00:27:47,389
bought Montano.

991
00:27:50,809 --> 00:27:51,710
Might have been a bad

992
00:27:51,710 --> 00:27:52,509
investment.

993
00:27:52,759 --> 00:27:53,559
I think they're thinking it

994
00:27:53,500 --> 00:27:54,299
over.

995
00:27:54,220 --> 00:27:56,240
So I would truly,

996
00:27:56,799 --> 00:27:58,119
when I looked at that deal going

997
00:27:58,119 --> 00:27:58,919
through like,

998
00:27:59,079 --> 00:28:00,359
who did the due diligence on

999
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:01,159
that?

1000
00:28:01,819 --> 00:28:03,519
Who did the due diligence on

1001
00:28:03,519 --> 00:28:04,319
that?

1002
00:28:04,279 --> 00:28:05,160
It's like, who have you been

1003
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:06,839
talking to? What kind of bubble

1004
00:28:06,839 --> 00:28:07,640
have you been working?

1005
00:28:10,019 --> 00:28:10,920
So anyway,

1006
00:28:11,259 --> 00:28:12,859
I sprayed my share around up,

1007
00:28:13,079 --> 00:28:14,380
you know, when I was a kid with

1008
00:28:14,380 --> 00:28:15,180
- As did I.

1009
00:28:15,630 --> 00:28:17,809
cutoffs on and just pair of work

1010
00:28:17,809 --> 00:28:18,609
boots,

1011
00:28:18,730 --> 00:28:20,509
hot, humid weather, East Coast

1012
00:28:20,509 --> 00:28:22,670
cornfields. We just round up the

1013
00:28:22,670 --> 00:28:23,950
crap out of everything that was

1014
00:28:23,950 --> 00:28:24,789
emergent, you know,

1015
00:28:25,230 --> 00:28:26,029
and I

1016
00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:28,099
drank a fair share.

1017
00:28:30,390 --> 00:28:32,089
Thank God I'm not looking at non

1018
00:28:32,089 --> 00:28:33,690
-Hodgkins, but I do worry about

1019
00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:37,200
it. This is not a worthwhile

1020
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:38,839
brag, but I think I can one -up

1021
00:28:38,839 --> 00:28:40,000
your story that I sprayed

1022
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:41,680
Roundup backpack sprayer

1023
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:42,480
barefoot.

1024
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:44,079
Oh, barefoot.

1025
00:28:44,200 --> 00:28:45,480
See, I was half naked.

1026
00:28:45,740 --> 00:28:46,779
You had a shirt on.

1027
00:28:51,700 --> 00:28:53,200
No, no, I didn't have a shirt

1028
00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:54,319
on. It was just a pair of cutoff

1029
00:28:54,319 --> 00:28:56,240
jeans and I did have work boots

1030
00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:58,319
on, but I haven't read anything

1031
00:28:58,319 --> 00:28:59,119
that

1032
00:28:59,140 --> 00:29:01,140
absorbent at the foot level is

1033
00:29:01,140 --> 00:29:01,940
anything.

1034
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:04,880
You got your bare feet in soil,

1035
00:29:05,039 --> 00:29:06,559
I'm hoping. Well, at least dirt.

1036
00:29:07,799 --> 00:29:08,599
Meanwhile,

1037
00:29:09,180 --> 00:29:10,319
I'm just sweating bullets.

1038
00:29:10,519 --> 00:29:12,960
This is 99 % humidity and

1039
00:29:13,980 --> 00:29:15,640
I got fertilizer burned from the

1040
00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:16,440
morning.

1041
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:17,619
We're hand spreading fertilizer

1042
00:29:17,619 --> 00:29:18,799
in sweet corn fields.

1043
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:20,039
And wow,

1044
00:29:20,529 --> 00:29:22,750
it was a little bit of burn and

1045
00:29:22,750 --> 00:29:24,890
sizzle. So certainly you and I

1046
00:29:24,890 --> 00:29:25,990
have both been exposed to it.

1047
00:29:26,049 --> 00:29:26,849
Thank God we

1048
00:29:27,130 --> 00:29:28,950
don't have any symptoms yet that

1049
00:29:28,950 --> 00:29:29,750
I know of,

1050
00:29:30,059 --> 00:29:30,859
but we might.

1051
00:29:31,339 --> 00:29:33,140
And the reality is that it was

1052
00:29:33,140 --> 00:29:33,940
ubiquitous.

1053
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:35,660
We were all using it.

1054
00:29:35,819 --> 00:29:36,619
And still is.

1055
00:29:37,700 --> 00:29:38,640
So Glenn,

1056
00:29:39,619 --> 00:29:41,579
We've been at some point in our

1057
00:29:41,579 --> 00:29:42,579
conversation, I just hit the

1058
00:29:42,579 --> 00:29:43,799
recording button because we've

1059
00:29:43,799 --> 00:29:44,660
just we were in this fun

1060
00:29:44,660 --> 00:29:46,319
conversation. It was it was too

1061
00:29:46,319 --> 00:29:47,240
good to go to waste.

1062
00:29:48,299 --> 00:29:49,099
But,

1063
00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:49,960
you know,

1064
00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:52,339
I I didn't come from the

1065
00:29:52,589 --> 00:29:53,509
ranching side of the world.

1066
00:29:53,549 --> 00:29:54,569
It came from fruit and vegetable

1067
00:29:54,569 --> 00:29:55,730
production, started working with

1068
00:29:55,730 --> 00:29:56,529
a lot of farmers.

1069
00:29:56,390 --> 00:29:58,599
And then I started hearing about

1070
00:29:58,599 --> 00:29:59,740
this interesting character in

1071
00:29:59,740 --> 00:30:01,119
Idaho named Glenn Elzinga.

1072
00:30:01,259 --> 00:30:02,500
Ray Archuleta told me I need to

1073
00:30:02,500 --> 00:30:03,720
reach out and connect with you.

1074
00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:06,460
And then I heard about

1075
00:30:07,230 --> 00:30:08,589
the nutrient density analysis

1076
00:30:08,589 --> 00:30:10,029
results that you got coming out

1077
00:30:10,029 --> 00:30:10,869
of Utah State.

1078
00:30:11,430 --> 00:30:12,230
And

1079
00:30:11,740 --> 00:30:13,420
so

1080
00:30:14,380 --> 00:30:16,180
I thought to myself, you know, I

1081
00:30:16,180 --> 00:30:17,200
got to try these sticks.

1082
00:30:17,299 --> 00:30:18,579
I want to know exactly what this

1083
00:30:18,579 --> 00:30:19,960
looks and what this tastes like

1084
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:20,759
and what this is.

1085
00:30:21,819 --> 00:30:22,900
Do you know I couldn't get any?

1086
00:30:24,180 --> 00:30:25,539
I do know that.

1087
00:30:27,259 --> 00:30:29,059
It's biweekly, John, there is a

1088
00:30:29,059 --> 00:30:31,400
time when you can get it.

1089
00:30:31,599 --> 00:30:33,059
And it's every every other week.

1090
00:30:33,220 --> 00:30:35,119
And my customers all know when

1091
00:30:35,119 --> 00:30:35,919
to push click.

1092
00:30:37,039 --> 00:30:38,640
And let's see, where are we at

1093
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:39,440
in the schedule?

1094
00:30:40,140 --> 00:30:40,940
Wednesday,

1095
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:42,160
Wednesday, they'll be available

1096
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:42,960
again.

1097
00:30:42,859 --> 00:30:44,059
So they all set their alarms.

1098
00:30:44,180 --> 00:30:45,160
I already know how this works.

1099
00:30:45,740 --> 00:30:46,740
No, they do. They do.

1100
00:30:46,839 --> 00:30:48,039
And also, I sent a tickler.

1101
00:30:48,180 --> 00:30:50,400
I got an email, new subscription

1102
00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:52,519
list of about 12 ,000 people.

1103
00:30:52,819 --> 00:30:54,299
And we send that out twice a

1104
00:30:54,299 --> 00:30:56,420
week. And it coincides with the

1105
00:30:56,420 --> 00:30:57,900
release of new product.

1106
00:30:59,180 --> 00:31:00,539
So and it's not like we're

1107
00:31:00,539 --> 00:31:01,339
stockpiling.

1108
00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:03,099
I mean, we literally sell out

1109
00:31:03,099 --> 00:31:04,420
every two weeks, John.

1110
00:31:05,089 --> 00:31:06,609
And and these people know

1111
00:31:06,609 --> 00:31:07,930
nothing about soil biology.

1112
00:31:08,700 --> 00:31:10,180
They know about flavor.

1113
00:31:10,650 --> 00:31:11,869
But they know about flavor but

1114
00:31:11,869 --> 00:31:13,329
they also know about health.

1115
00:31:13,849 --> 00:31:15,430
And, you know, if I don't know

1116
00:31:15,430 --> 00:31:16,230
how much you

1117
00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:19,259
pride at a Stefan van Vliet you

1118
00:31:19,259 --> 00:31:20,579
had him on the podcast.

1119
00:31:20,740 --> 00:31:22,019
I had him here on the podcast a

1120
00:31:22,019 --> 00:31:23,460
year, a couple years ago maybe

1121
00:31:23,460 --> 00:31:24,779
at this point and yeah he was.

1122
00:31:27,029 --> 00:31:28,529
It was a really landmark study.

1123
00:31:28,650 --> 00:31:30,869
He took 18 of our steers

1124
00:31:30,869 --> 00:31:32,490
directly off the range.

1125
00:31:32,569 --> 00:31:33,890
My daughter and I went up there

1126
00:31:33,890 --> 00:31:35,829
and sorted them out horseback,

1127
00:31:36,230 --> 00:31:37,650
brought them down to some remote

1128
00:31:37,650 --> 00:31:38,450
corrals.

1129
00:31:38,690 --> 00:31:40,369
They went directly to the

1130
00:31:40,369 --> 00:31:43,029
process. And he got a piece of

1131
00:31:43,029 --> 00:31:44,769
pectoralis profundus, which is

1132
00:31:44,769 --> 00:31:46,609
the upper part of the chuck off

1133
00:31:46,859 --> 00:31:48,559
these, actually lower if you're

1134
00:31:48,559 --> 00:31:49,359
an animal,

1135
00:31:51,309 --> 00:31:54,450
and did the same thing with 18

1136
00:31:54,450 --> 00:31:55,269
feedlot animals.

1137
00:31:55,940 --> 00:31:57,200
All Angus beef.

1138
00:31:57,660 --> 00:32:00,359
all basically the same age, you

1139
00:32:00,359 --> 00:32:01,159
know,

1140
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:01,980
physiologically,

1141
00:32:02,460 --> 00:32:03,500
they were different ages,

1142
00:32:03,660 --> 00:32:05,099
actually, because the grass fed

1143
00:32:05,099 --> 00:32:06,880
our grass fed takes longer.

1144
00:32:07,140 --> 00:32:08,920
I mean, feedlot cattle can die

1145
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:10,279
in 16 months, right, john.

1146
00:32:10,839 --> 00:32:12,440
And these were probably 25.

1147
00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:14,599
So for equal physiological

1148
00:32:14,599 --> 00:32:16,460
maturity, just because the lower

1149
00:32:16,460 --> 00:32:17,880
average, that's

1150
00:32:18,250 --> 00:32:19,049
where we arrived.

1151
00:32:18,890 --> 00:32:20,910
So basically, same sort of

1152
00:32:20,910 --> 00:32:22,410
cattle, and you know, not

1153
00:32:22,410 --> 00:32:24,549
specifically the exact same

1154
00:32:24,549 --> 00:32:25,349
genetics, but

1155
00:32:25,690 --> 00:32:27,789
genetic Angus, so phenotypically

1156
00:32:27,789 --> 00:32:29,029
they look the same, they're all

1157
00:32:29,029 --> 00:32:29,829
black,

1158
00:32:30,750 --> 00:32:33,410
and he compared those two types

1159
00:32:33,410 --> 00:32:36,619
of cattle in his metabolomics

1160
00:32:36,619 --> 00:32:38,140
lab in Utah State University

1161
00:32:38,140 --> 00:32:40,779
using spectrographic analysis.

1162
00:32:41,099 --> 00:32:43,160
So what's crazy, I had no idea,

1163
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:46,200
but he picked up 1500 different

1164
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:47,000
compounds.

1165
00:32:47,299 --> 00:32:48,740
What he did is he made these

1166
00:32:48,740 --> 00:32:49,660
things into patties, put them

1167
00:32:49,660 --> 00:32:52,019
through a meat grinder and put

1168
00:32:52,019 --> 00:32:53,440
these patties in an oven

1169
00:32:53,980 --> 00:32:55,559
and took the interior

1170
00:32:55,559 --> 00:32:56,359
temperature

1171
00:32:56,880 --> 00:32:59,359
of these individual patties to

1172
00:32:59,359 --> 00:33:01,960
170 degrees or 160 degrees.

1173
00:33:02,079 --> 00:33:03,000
It was 71 Celsius.

1174
00:33:04,890 --> 00:33:05,690
So, you know,

1175
00:33:05,990 --> 00:33:07,490
what's crazy about it, John, is

1176
00:33:07,890 --> 00:33:09,190
these things were cooked.

1177
00:33:09,869 --> 00:33:11,529
And normally we associate

1178
00:33:11,529 --> 00:33:13,390
cooking with volatilization,

1179
00:33:14,230 --> 00:33:15,029
caramelization,

1180
00:33:15,430 --> 00:33:17,190
compound change, if not full

1181
00:33:17,190 --> 00:33:19,970
loss due to volatilization and

1182
00:33:19,970 --> 00:33:20,769
denaturing.

1183
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:21,799
So anyway,

1184
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:23,680
I'm sure he lost some of the

1185
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:24,859
complexity there,

1186
00:33:25,730 --> 00:33:27,250
but he wanted to emulate

1187
00:33:27,250 --> 00:33:28,930
something that we would ingest.

1188
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:30,799
So anyway,

1189
00:33:31,049 --> 00:33:33,569
did a cooking way beyond what

1190
00:33:33,569 --> 00:33:34,710
I'd want. I don't know if you're

1191
00:33:34,710 --> 00:33:37,049
a medium rare guy or a well done

1192
00:33:37,049 --> 00:33:39,509
guy, but you know, 160 degrees

1193
00:33:39,509 --> 00:33:40,369
too hot for me.

1194
00:33:40,509 --> 00:33:42,809
I like to go 138, 139 somewhere

1195
00:33:42,809 --> 00:33:44,289
in there, you know, have a nice

1196
00:33:44,289 --> 00:33:46,549
caramelized exterior, nice, you

1197
00:33:46,549 --> 00:33:47,869
know, pink interior, but he went

1198
00:33:47,869 --> 00:33:48,669
way beyond pink.

1199
00:33:48,569 --> 00:33:49,549
He's going into well done

1200
00:33:49,549 --> 00:33:50,349
country now.

1201
00:33:51,259 --> 00:33:52,819
So anyway, takes these things

1202
00:33:52,819 --> 00:33:55,380
and applies his analyses to it

1203
00:33:55,380 --> 00:33:57,500
and comes up with 1500

1204
00:33:57,720 --> 00:34:00,740
compounds in each of these

1205
00:34:00,740 --> 00:34:01,539
samples.

1206
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:05,119
18 and 18, 18 from feedlot fed

1207
00:34:05,119 --> 00:34:06,900
DDGs in South Dakota

1208
00:34:07,539 --> 00:34:10,340
and 18 directly from our wild

1209
00:34:10,340 --> 00:34:11,539
ranges. And I got to tell you

1210
00:34:11,539 --> 00:34:12,659
something about the wild ranges,

1211
00:34:13,610 --> 00:34:15,210
John, just so the listeners

1212
00:34:15,210 --> 00:34:16,210
know. I mean, there's

1213
00:34:17,059 --> 00:34:19,320
2200 plant species up there.

1214
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,199
My wife is a PhD botanist.

1215
00:34:22,460 --> 00:34:23,380
She's the plant girl.

1216
00:34:23,559 --> 00:34:24,360
I'm the cow guy.

1217
00:34:25,019 --> 00:34:27,079
And she's evaluated this and

1218
00:34:27,079 --> 00:34:28,559
checked it. There's 2200

1219
00:34:28,559 --> 00:34:29,780
different plants up on this

1220
00:34:29,780 --> 00:34:32,420
rangeland. We run on a 70 square

1221
00:34:32,420 --> 00:34:33,619
mile pasture.

1222
00:34:35,550 --> 00:34:37,429
That's 47 ,000 acres,

1223
00:34:37,909 --> 00:34:39,230
and it's basically wilderness.

1224
00:34:40,449 --> 00:34:42,010
It's extremely wild country.

1225
00:34:42,130 --> 00:34:44,070
A lot of elevation gradient from

1226
00:34:44,070 --> 00:34:45,469
one end to another starts at 4

1227
00:34:45,469 --> 00:34:47,210
,700 feet elevation, goes all

1228
00:34:47,210 --> 00:34:49,170
the way almost up to 10 ,000.

1229
00:34:49,730 --> 00:34:51,429
Alpine tundra at the bottom,

1230
00:34:52,050 --> 00:34:52,850
low desert,

1231
00:34:53,030 --> 00:34:54,469
effective precipitation at two

1232
00:34:54,469 --> 00:34:56,050
to three inches at the bottom of

1233
00:34:56,050 --> 00:34:57,349
that range and a canyon bottom.

1234
00:34:58,030 --> 00:34:59,869
So what that means is with that

1235
00:34:59,869 --> 00:35:01,650
elevation gradient, you have a

1236
00:35:01,650 --> 00:35:04,050
huge, huge vegetative

1237
00:35:04,679 --> 00:35:06,679
ecological gradient as well,

1238
00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:07,820
because you have all these

1239
00:35:07,820 --> 00:35:09,480
different plant communities and

1240
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:11,179
ecosystems based on elevation,

1241
00:35:11,739 --> 00:35:14,239
rainfall aspect, the direction

1242
00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:16,219
which your health faces,

1243
00:35:16,539 --> 00:35:17,340
soil types,

1244
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:18,840
all these things where you get

1245
00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:20,480
huge biological diversity.

1246
00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:23,059
So, these cattle don't eat at

1247
00:35:23,059 --> 00:35:23,860
all.

1248
00:35:23,699 --> 00:35:25,159
Some are pine trees, some are

1249
00:35:25,159 --> 00:35:26,880
cactus down in the low country.

1250
00:35:28,650 --> 00:35:29,590
You know, there's just things

1251
00:35:29,590 --> 00:35:31,230
that you wouldn't picture a cow

1252
00:35:31,230 --> 00:35:32,289
eating, and you're right in some

1253
00:35:32,289 --> 00:35:33,510
of those. But on the other hand,

1254
00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:35,519
I see these cattle eating up

1255
00:35:35,519 --> 00:35:36,320
there.

1256
00:35:37,250 --> 00:35:38,530
And I'm surprised at what

1257
00:35:38,530 --> 00:35:39,690
they're using a lot of times.

1258
00:35:39,909 --> 00:35:41,309
And it's all because,

1259
00:35:42,110 --> 00:35:42,910
John, they've been given a

1260
00:35:42,869 --> 00:35:43,670
choice.

1261
00:35:44,940 --> 00:35:46,460
So we're on horseback up there

1262
00:35:47,349 --> 00:35:49,329
24 -7. We live with our cattle

1263
00:35:49,329 --> 00:35:50,389
because wolf predation,

1264
00:35:51,460 --> 00:35:52,440
I don't know when you press that

1265
00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:54,380
button, John, but wolf predation

1266
00:35:54,380 --> 00:35:55,559
was one of the clubs that

1267
00:35:55,559 --> 00:35:56,820
smacked us across the side of

1268
00:35:56,820 --> 00:35:57,620
the head.

1269
00:35:57,940 --> 00:35:59,320
We were losing our cattle to

1270
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:00,380
wolves and it was because we

1271
00:36:00,380 --> 00:36:01,260
were not up there with them.

1272
00:36:02,230 --> 00:36:03,650
And now with human presence on

1273
00:36:03,650 --> 00:36:05,110
the ground, we coexist with

1274
00:36:05,110 --> 00:36:06,469
these wolves and we haven't lost

1275
00:36:06,469 --> 00:36:07,730
anything to wolves now for 12

1276
00:36:07,730 --> 00:36:08,530
years.

1277
00:36:09,150 --> 00:36:11,389
So that's what necessitated our

1278
00:36:12,429 --> 00:36:13,570
on the ground presence.

1279
00:36:14,869 --> 00:36:18,130
So now we see ourselves as a

1280
00:36:18,409 --> 00:36:20,869
long term proponent of Jim

1281
00:36:20,869 --> 00:36:23,130
Garrish and read his book when

1282
00:36:23,130 --> 00:36:23,930
it first came out.

1283
00:36:23,909 --> 00:36:25,369
I think that was the late 80s

1284
00:36:25,369 --> 00:36:27,190
and Management Intensive Grazing

1285
00:36:27,190 --> 00:36:28,929
was the book and I kind of

1286
00:36:28,929 --> 00:36:30,800
absorbed it. started practicing

1287
00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:31,920
it at home with Hotwire.

1288
00:36:34,110 --> 00:36:35,070
And I thought, you know, that

1289
00:36:35,070 --> 00:36:37,670
really can't be something that's

1290
00:36:37,670 --> 00:36:39,090
emulated on our rangeland

1291
00:36:39,300 --> 00:36:40,619
because it's vast.

1292
00:36:40,860 --> 00:36:41,660
You know, it's just an

1293
00:36:41,500 --> 00:36:43,199
incredible amount of country, 49

1294
00:36:43,199 --> 00:36:44,000
,000 acres.

1295
00:36:45,710 --> 00:36:46,849
But then I realized when the

1296
00:36:46,849 --> 00:36:48,769
wolves got after us that because

1297
00:36:48,769 --> 00:36:50,130
we're living with these cattle

1298
00:36:50,130 --> 00:36:51,909
and managing them on horseback,

1299
00:36:52,030 --> 00:36:55,059
that now we could be the grazing

1300
00:36:55,059 --> 00:36:56,440
cell on horseback.

1301
00:36:58,789 --> 00:37:00,050
What's crazy,

1302
00:37:00,389 --> 00:37:02,730
John, is I never really made

1303
00:37:03,269 --> 00:37:04,510
this correlation, but I found

1304
00:37:04,510 --> 00:37:05,310
out

1305
00:37:05,630 --> 00:37:06,809
the principles are the same.

1306
00:37:08,349 --> 00:37:09,949
The principles of growing grass

1307
00:37:09,949 --> 00:37:11,409
and rest periods

1308
00:37:12,449 --> 00:37:15,530
and grazing efficiency and stock

1309
00:37:15,530 --> 00:37:16,330
density,

1310
00:37:16,710 --> 00:37:18,150
all those things are the same

1311
00:37:18,150 --> 00:37:20,489
principles that our irrigated

1312
00:37:20,489 --> 00:37:21,769
ground has. You know, we

1313
00:37:21,769 --> 00:37:23,789
irrigate pivots and we align

1314
00:37:23,789 --> 00:37:25,570
irrigation on about 2000 acres

1315
00:37:25,570 --> 00:37:26,370
at home.

1316
00:37:26,550 --> 00:37:27,449
There we've been practicing

1317
00:37:27,449 --> 00:37:29,110
management intensive grazing and

1318
00:37:29,110 --> 00:37:30,690
multi paddock grazing, whatever

1319
00:37:30,690 --> 00:37:31,490
you want to call it for

1320
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:34,760
Oh, gosh, it's been ever since

1321
00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:35,780
like 93.

1322
00:37:36,199 --> 00:37:37,000
I've been doing it.

1323
00:37:37,340 --> 00:37:39,260
And so that's, you know, that's

1324
00:37:39,260 --> 00:37:40,500
quite a while. That's over 30

1325
00:37:40,500 --> 00:37:41,780
years that we've been practicing

1326
00:37:41,780 --> 00:37:43,039
that those grazing principles

1327
00:37:43,039 --> 00:37:44,780
and learning them still, we're

1328
00:37:44,780 --> 00:37:46,340
learning them still, I just want

1329
00:37:46,340 --> 00:37:48,500
to say that we never say,

1330
00:37:49,039 --> 00:37:49,840
oh, we've arrived.

1331
00:37:50,639 --> 00:37:52,300
But anyway, on horseback,

1332
00:37:54,269 --> 00:37:55,289
That management intensive

1333
00:37:55,289 --> 00:37:56,989
grazing, that adapted multi

1334
00:37:56,989 --> 00:37:58,489
-padded grazing thing is a

1335
00:37:58,489 --> 00:38:00,989
moving amoeba going across

1336
00:38:00,989 --> 00:38:01,789
landscape.

1337
00:38:02,690 --> 00:38:03,909
And because we know the country

1338
00:38:03,909 --> 00:38:04,710
so well,

1339
00:38:05,230 --> 00:38:06,630
you can ask my daughter,

1340
00:38:08,079 --> 00:38:09,519
Melanie, she's my oldest, she's

1341
00:38:09,519 --> 00:38:11,219
32. She's been a horseback up

1342
00:38:11,219 --> 00:38:12,619
there since she was like seven.

1343
00:38:15,059 --> 00:38:16,039
And John, you could say,

1344
00:38:16,159 --> 00:38:17,340
Melanie, do you remember the big

1345
00:38:17,340 --> 00:38:18,900
Douglas fir tree that's growing

1346
00:38:18,900 --> 00:38:20,360
right next to that big boulder

1347
00:38:20,360 --> 00:38:21,539
that's been split?

1348
00:38:22,190 --> 00:38:23,730
And it's got the lightning

1349
00:38:23,730 --> 00:38:24,829
streak

1350
00:38:25,780 --> 00:38:27,239
the black lightning streak on

1351
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:28,179
the right hand side.

1352
00:38:28,300 --> 00:38:29,100
If you're looking at the right,

1353
00:38:29,059 --> 00:38:29,860
do you remember that tree?

1354
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:32,679
And she'll say, yes, it's at the

1355
00:38:32,679 --> 00:38:33,659
head of Park Creek.

1356
00:38:34,260 --> 00:38:35,559
There's 55 miles of Creek up

1357
00:38:35,559 --> 00:38:36,360
there, John.

1358
00:38:36,360 --> 00:38:38,679
And she'll remember this tree.

1359
00:38:38,820 --> 00:38:39,620
I mean, that's,

1360
00:38:39,940 --> 00:38:42,699
that's how much this stuff gets

1361
00:38:42,699 --> 00:38:43,920
under your skin when you're on

1362
00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:44,960
horseback up there with these

1363
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:45,760
cattle all the time.

1364
00:38:46,329 --> 00:38:48,269
So we know the country and as a

1365
00:38:48,269 --> 00:38:49,250
result, then we can,

1366
00:38:49,619 --> 00:38:50,420
run this thing.

1367
00:38:50,380 --> 00:38:52,400
We've done this with GPS and

1368
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:53,619
Google Earth as well.

1369
00:38:54,239 --> 00:38:55,840
So, we've, you know, absorbed a

1370
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:57,820
technological factor to it to

1371
00:38:57,820 --> 00:38:59,199
kind of mirror what's in our

1372
00:38:59,199 --> 00:39:01,179
mind, but in our minds are a

1373
00:39:01,179 --> 00:39:01,980
map.

1374
00:39:02,949 --> 00:39:04,409
And as a result, we've been able

1375
00:39:04,409 --> 00:39:06,269
to manage it so that our average

1376
00:39:06,269 --> 00:39:08,250
grazing return interval is about

1377
00:39:08,250 --> 00:39:09,210
three years on

1378
00:39:09,780 --> 00:39:12,400
any given acre of ground.

1379
00:39:12,780 --> 00:39:14,420
And our average duration of

1380
00:39:14,420 --> 00:39:15,940
grazing with the entire herd of

1381
00:39:15,940 --> 00:39:16,940
four to 500 head

1382
00:39:18,269 --> 00:39:19,590
is three

1383
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:21,280
minutes.

1384
00:39:21,780 --> 00:39:22,580
Wow.

1385
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:24,099
I thought you were going to say

1386
00:39:24,099 --> 00:39:25,800
a few hours or half a day.

1387
00:39:26,219 --> 00:39:27,739
No, they're moving all the time.

1388
00:39:28,059 --> 00:39:29,000
They're moving all the time.

1389
00:39:29,579 --> 00:39:31,739
I got this one favorite slide I

1390
00:39:31,739 --> 00:39:33,460
show often at a conference or

1391
00:39:33,460 --> 00:39:34,260
something like that.

1392
00:39:35,250 --> 00:39:36,070
It's Annie,

1393
00:39:36,469 --> 00:39:38,250
my middle -age, my middler

1394
00:39:38,250 --> 00:39:40,750
daughter. She's like 23 right

1395
00:39:40,750 --> 00:39:41,550
now.

1396
00:39:41,409 --> 00:39:42,650
She's on horseback and she

1397
00:39:42,650 --> 00:39:44,570
brings a herd of about 400 head

1398
00:39:44,570 --> 00:39:45,370
of cattle.

1399
00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:47,280
into this Douglas fir stand.

1400
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:49,260
And it's really a beautiful

1401
00:39:49,260 --> 00:39:51,800
stand because the grass is just

1402
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:52,600
beautiful.

1403
00:39:53,329 --> 00:39:54,469
It's, you know, I got a before

1404
00:39:54,469 --> 00:39:55,269
picture,

1405
00:39:55,760 --> 00:39:57,000
I'm just sitting on my horse, I

1406
00:39:57,000 --> 00:39:58,059
take a, you know, these phones

1407
00:39:58,059 --> 00:39:59,300
are amazing for these pictures.

1408
00:40:00,469 --> 00:40:01,610
And I take a picture of this.

1409
00:40:02,730 --> 00:40:03,809
And so you're looking at like 10

1410
00:40:03,809 --> 00:40:05,030
inches of

1411
00:40:05,570 --> 00:40:07,329
available forage on the before

1412
00:40:07,329 --> 00:40:08,130
picture.

1413
00:40:08,590 --> 00:40:09,650
And then

1414
00:40:10,599 --> 00:40:11,960
the next picture has Annie in

1415
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:13,179
it. And she's bringing this 400

1416
00:40:13,179 --> 00:40:14,980
head into that picture into the

1417
00:40:14,980 --> 00:40:15,780
frame.

1418
00:40:16,389 --> 00:40:17,289
And they all get their heads

1419
00:40:17,289 --> 00:40:18,090
down.

1420
00:40:18,119 --> 00:40:20,000
And you can see their walking.

1421
00:40:20,059 --> 00:40:21,380
because they're all oriented in

1422
00:40:21,380 --> 00:40:22,180
the same direction.

1423
00:40:23,710 --> 00:40:25,050
And you know, if you were to

1424
00:40:25,050 --> 00:40:26,690
take pounds of beef per acre

1425
00:40:26,690 --> 00:40:28,090
there, I'd say you're easily a

1426
00:40:28,090 --> 00:40:28,890
quarter million,

1427
00:40:29,079 --> 00:40:29,880
you're probably a quarter

1428
00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:31,280
million pounds of beef per acre.

1429
00:40:31,579 --> 00:40:32,380
So

1430
00:40:32,469 --> 00:40:34,050
anyway, these cows are evidently

1431
00:40:34,050 --> 00:40:35,309
moving because you can see their

1432
00:40:35,309 --> 00:40:37,489
legs are stretched or are all

1433
00:40:37,489 --> 00:40:38,570
oriented in the same direction.

1434
00:40:38,789 --> 00:40:39,909
So anyway, the next picture

1435
00:40:40,099 --> 00:40:41,199
shows nothing.

1436
00:40:41,900 --> 00:40:42,700
There's no cattle.

1437
00:40:42,699 --> 00:40:44,039
There's just trees and grass.

1438
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:45,239
And there's a residue.

1439
00:40:45,579 --> 00:40:46,679
They're probably probably about

1440
00:40:46,679 --> 00:40:47,579
six inch residual.

1441
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:49,199
They're still all green.

1442
00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:51,619
And I'll ask the audience how

1443
00:40:51,619 --> 00:40:52,420
much time.

1444
00:40:54,010 --> 00:40:55,659
And John, I get stuff like two

1445
00:40:55,659 --> 00:40:56,460
months.

1446
00:40:57,199 --> 00:40:58,780
I'm like, how is that possible?

1447
00:40:59,420 --> 00:41:01,739
I can't even make that work.

1448
00:41:02,599 --> 00:41:04,659
You know, and it's OK, because

1449
00:41:04,659 --> 00:41:06,239
some people come come a little

1450
00:41:06,239 --> 00:41:07,559
closer and they'll say an hour,

1451
00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:08,960
two hours, you know, and then I

1452
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:10,739
say three minutes or two and a

1453
00:41:10,739 --> 00:41:12,219
half minutes. It actually was in

1454
00:41:12,219 --> 00:41:13,019
that picture.

1455
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:16,440
And they're dumbfounded.

1456
00:41:16,699 --> 00:41:18,260
And then I hit him with the rest

1457
00:41:18,260 --> 00:41:19,060
period.

1458
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:20,099
And it's three years.

1459
00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:21,160
It's three years.

1460
00:41:21,500 --> 00:41:22,300
So anyway,

1461
00:41:22,489 --> 00:41:23,869
the reason why the long rest

1462
00:41:23,869 --> 00:41:26,090
period is because it's rainfall.

1463
00:41:26,730 --> 00:41:27,530
You know, if we're in a high

1464
00:41:27,510 --> 00:41:28,889
rainfall area like where you

1465
00:41:28,889 --> 00:41:31,170
live or artificial rainfall

1466
00:41:31,170 --> 00:41:32,690
areas like under center pivots,

1467
00:41:32,889 --> 00:41:34,769
you know, we've got 30 or 40, 40

1468
00:41:34,769 --> 00:41:36,909
inches equivalent rainfall under

1469
00:41:36,909 --> 00:41:37,710
a center pivot.

1470
00:41:37,730 --> 00:41:39,489
We can return sometimes in 25

1471
00:41:39,489 --> 00:41:40,289
days.

1472
00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:41,440
It just depends whether that

1473
00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:42,860
grass has reached stage three or

1474
00:41:42,860 --> 00:41:44,239
not. And we'll come back, you

1475
00:41:44,239 --> 00:41:45,039
know.

1476
00:41:45,039 --> 00:41:46,099
Um, so anyway,

1477
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:47,519
you know, it's the same

1478
00:41:47,519 --> 00:41:49,239
principles, but rainfall and

1479
00:41:49,239 --> 00:41:50,840
brittle environments just

1480
00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:51,980
changes the timing.

1481
00:41:52,599 --> 00:41:54,780
So anyway, that's what we're

1482
00:41:54,780 --> 00:41:55,639
practicing up there.

1483
00:41:55,719 --> 00:41:56,679
So I just want to make that

1484
00:41:56,679 --> 00:41:59,199
clear that they're grazing 500

1485
00:41:59,199 --> 00:42:00,880
to a thousand plants in that

1486
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:02,860
unique environment at home on

1487
00:42:02,860 --> 00:42:04,000
our irrigated pastures.

1488
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:06,239
They're probably averaging

1489
00:42:06,239 --> 00:42:08,019
pretty much across the board.

1490
00:42:08,199 --> 00:42:10,510
Now they're over 8 % or 8 %

1491
00:42:10,510 --> 00:42:11,310
organic matter.

1492
00:42:11,289 --> 00:42:13,329
They're all certified or 8 %

1493
00:42:13,329 --> 00:42:14,130
organic matter.

1494
00:42:14,989 --> 00:42:16,530
But they're those

1495
00:42:17,190 --> 00:42:17,990
cattle,

1496
00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:19,719
you know, they'll be on that

1497
00:42:19,719 --> 00:42:22,199
piece. And that's got about 80

1498
00:42:22,199 --> 00:42:23,000
species,

1499
00:42:23,159 --> 00:42:24,500
which is pretty good for a

1500
00:42:24,500 --> 00:42:25,300
temperate.

1501
00:42:25,500 --> 00:42:26,300
Yeah,

1502
00:42:27,119 --> 00:42:28,219
you know, and you

1503
00:42:29,050 --> 00:42:29,949
know, I don't want people to get

1504
00:42:29,949 --> 00:42:30,769
hung up on that,

1505
00:42:31,559 --> 00:42:32,539
John, because it's not like I'm

1506
00:42:32,539 --> 00:42:33,340
going to take a square meter

1507
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:34,300
plot and say, see,

1508
00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:36,639
There's all 80 right here.

1509
00:42:36,840 --> 00:42:38,000
They're right. No, that's not

1510
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:39,320
true because you have all

1511
00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:40,239
profile changes.

1512
00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:41,639
So this is like on a 200 acre

1513
00:42:41,639 --> 00:42:43,059
pasture next to our house that

1514
00:42:43,059 --> 00:42:44,780
my wife and I did a plant list.

1515
00:42:45,699 --> 00:42:47,059
But it doesn't matter if they're

1516
00:42:47,059 --> 00:42:48,559
on the same square meter.

1517
00:42:48,940 --> 00:42:51,440
What matters is over the grazing

1518
00:42:51,440 --> 00:42:52,240
interval,

1519
00:42:52,380 --> 00:42:53,699
over that grazing rotation,

1520
00:42:53,780 --> 00:42:54,619
you're going to pick up all that

1521
00:42:54,619 --> 00:42:56,800
species diversity and all that

1522
00:42:57,690 --> 00:42:59,170
plant compound richness.

1523
00:43:00,070 --> 00:43:01,130
And so it's the plant compound

1524
00:43:01,130 --> 00:43:02,690
richness that Stefan, coming

1525
00:43:02,690 --> 00:43:04,070
back to Utah State,

1526
00:43:04,969 --> 00:43:05,769
found interesting.

1527
00:43:05,829 --> 00:43:07,050
Fifteen hundred different

1528
00:43:07,780 --> 00:43:10,349
plant compounds identified in

1529
00:43:10,730 --> 00:43:11,869
both of

1530
00:43:13,429 --> 00:43:14,530
these types of animals,

1531
00:43:14,889 --> 00:43:17,869
the DDG animals and our wild

1532
00:43:17,869 --> 00:43:18,750
grassland animals.

1533
00:43:19,170 --> 00:43:20,650
And he found, I think it was,

1534
00:43:21,039 --> 00:43:23,920
I think it was 1525 and then 907

1535
00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:24,720
of

1536
00:43:25,510 --> 00:43:28,090
those compounds were unique in

1537
00:43:28,090 --> 00:43:30,429
terms of the differences in

1538
00:43:30,429 --> 00:43:31,989
concentration. They were marked,

1539
00:43:32,269 --> 00:43:33,090
marking differences.

1540
00:43:33,929 --> 00:43:35,210
And so the best thing about it,

1541
00:43:35,289 --> 00:43:36,590
the most exciting thing about it

1542
00:43:36,590 --> 00:43:37,989
was that the

1543
00:43:40,409 --> 00:43:41,670
chemicals that he discovered

1544
00:43:41,670 --> 00:43:43,289
that were quite a bit higher

1545
00:43:44,780 --> 00:43:46,340
in our beef,

1546
00:43:47,489 --> 00:43:48,570
we're the ones we like to hear

1547
00:43:48,570 --> 00:43:49,370
about.

1548
00:43:49,789 --> 00:43:51,389
They're the ones that are anti

1549
00:43:51,389 --> 00:43:52,190
-inflammatory.

1550
00:43:53,269 --> 00:43:54,389
They're the ones that are anti

1551
00:43:54,389 --> 00:43:55,969
-microbial. They're the ones

1552
00:43:55,969 --> 00:43:57,250
that are antioxidant.

1553
00:43:58,539 --> 00:43:59,800
Some of these antioxidants were

1554
00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:00,600
three times higher.

1555
00:44:01,769 --> 00:44:03,170
There's some really esoteric

1556
00:44:03,170 --> 00:44:03,970
names here.

1557
00:44:03,929 --> 00:44:04,730
There's like

1558
00:44:05,730 --> 00:44:07,690
icosapotonic acid

1559
00:44:08,030 --> 00:44:10,289
or docosapotonic acid.

1560
00:44:10,599 --> 00:44:12,199
That's DPA and EPA.

1561
00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:14,340
OK, and we think of conjugated

1562
00:44:14,340 --> 00:44:15,739
linoleic acid,

1563
00:44:16,059 --> 00:44:17,159
you know, that's CLA.

1564
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:18,780
We think of those in terms of

1565
00:44:18,780 --> 00:44:20,139
acronyms, mostly in terms of

1566
00:44:20,139 --> 00:44:20,940
three letter

1567
00:44:21,260 --> 00:44:22,400
abbreviations.

1568
00:44:22,739 --> 00:44:24,440
But they're key antioxidants.

1569
00:44:25,199 --> 00:44:26,480
And they averaged,

1570
00:44:27,030 --> 00:44:28,369
I think it was four

1571
00:44:29,610 --> 00:44:31,030
to six times higher in

1572
00:44:31,889 --> 00:44:34,909
our beef than the feedlot beef.

1573
00:44:36,539 --> 00:44:38,019
This is perhaps an

1574
00:44:38,460 --> 00:44:39,400
oversimplification.

1575
00:44:40,059 --> 00:44:41,079
People smarter than I.

1576
00:44:41,480 --> 00:44:42,699
might say that it is.

1577
00:44:44,099 --> 00:44:46,000
But as I've looked at what

1578
00:44:46,949 --> 00:44:49,329
does it mean to have nutrient

1579
00:44:49,329 --> 00:44:50,829
density or as I've started

1580
00:44:50,829 --> 00:44:51,869
calling it, nutritional

1581
00:44:51,869 --> 00:44:53,849
integrity, what does it mean to

1582
00:44:54,420 --> 00:44:56,780
for us to consume a healthy

1583
00:44:56,780 --> 00:44:58,059
diet? What really is a healthy

1584
00:44:58,059 --> 00:44:58,860
diet?

1585
00:44:58,800 --> 00:44:59,600
And

1586
00:44:59,679 --> 00:45:02,440
very broadly, there's this whole

1587
00:45:02,440 --> 00:45:03,860
conversation around seed oils

1588
00:45:03,860 --> 00:45:04,880
and on and on the list goes.

1589
00:45:04,980 --> 00:45:05,860
But I think as

1590
00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:09,219
a general broad brushstroke, you

1591
00:45:09,219 --> 00:45:10,019
could

1592
00:45:10,679 --> 00:45:12,519
put things in a pro

1593
00:45:12,519 --> 00:45:14,059
-inflammatory versus anti

1594
00:45:14,059 --> 00:45:15,960
-inflammatory category, it'd be

1595
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:17,159
pretty much spot on.

1596
00:45:17,539 --> 00:45:18,340
And

1597
00:45:18,030 --> 00:45:21,269
I was intrigued by the research

1598
00:45:21,269 --> 00:45:23,030
work that was done by Blu Blanc

1599
00:45:23,030 --> 00:45:24,750
Coeur in France, Pierre Vail and

1600
00:45:24,750 --> 00:45:26,110
his group of colleagues,

1601
00:45:26,670 --> 00:45:28,789
where they were deliberately

1602
00:45:28,789 --> 00:45:31,829
feeding flax to livestock to

1603
00:45:31,829 --> 00:45:33,070
produce a narrow omega -3 to

1604
00:45:33,070 --> 00:45:33,929
omega -6 ratio.

1605
00:45:35,159 --> 00:45:36,000
And well,

1606
00:45:36,780 --> 00:45:37,980
that raises all kinds of

1607
00:45:38,190 --> 00:45:39,050
questions. They were obviously

1608
00:45:39,050 --> 00:45:40,289
doing some very good things, but

1609
00:45:40,289 --> 00:45:41,289
I also have some reservations

1610
00:45:41,289 --> 00:45:42,690
about the phytoestrogen content

1611
00:45:42,690 --> 00:45:43,829
and some of the implications of

1612
00:45:43,829 --> 00:45:44,630
that. But

1613
00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:46,199
of course it's being processed

1614
00:45:46,199 --> 00:45:47,000
by

1615
00:45:47,019 --> 00:45:48,840
ruminants and that makes a

1616
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:49,659
significant difference.

1617
00:45:50,159 --> 00:45:51,539
But they are one of the few

1618
00:45:51,539 --> 00:45:53,639
groups that did human

1619
00:45:53,639 --> 00:45:55,380
consumption trials of

1620
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:58,420
people who were eating animal

1621
00:45:58,420 --> 00:45:59,220
products.

1622
00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:02,179
This was eggs and dairy and beef

1623
00:46:02,179 --> 00:46:03,500
and chicken, and I think perhaps

1624
00:46:03,500 --> 00:46:04,360
pork as well.

1625
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:07,739
that was fed with flax to have a

1626
00:46:07,739 --> 00:46:09,119
narrow omega -3 to 6 ratio.

1627
00:46:09,480 --> 00:46:11,780
And they found that just that

1628
00:46:11,780 --> 00:46:14,199
simple change of the omega -3, 6

1629
00:46:14,199 --> 00:46:16,420
ratio produced an anti

1630
00:46:16,420 --> 00:46:17,579
-inflammatory effect in the

1631
00:46:17,579 --> 00:46:19,039
human body versus a pro

1632
00:46:19,039 --> 00:46:20,579
-inflammatory effect from

1633
00:46:20,579 --> 00:46:22,559
mainstream grocery store animal

1634
00:46:22,559 --> 00:46:23,360
products.

1635
00:46:23,860 --> 00:46:27,039
And you then layer on all these

1636
00:46:27,039 --> 00:46:28,280
other anti -inflammatory

1637
00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:29,080
compounds that you're

1638
00:46:29,039 --> 00:46:29,840
describing.

1639
00:46:31,739 --> 00:46:33,320
the human health implications

1640
00:46:33,320 --> 00:46:35,559
become very consequential and

1641
00:46:35,559 --> 00:46:36,699
very far -reaching, I think,

1642
00:46:36,820 --> 00:46:37,780
more so than most people

1643
00:46:37,780 --> 00:46:39,519
realize. The reality is we are a

1644
00:46:39,519 --> 00:46:42,039
very inflamed society,

1645
00:46:42,199 --> 00:46:44,280
generally, because of our

1646
00:46:45,320 --> 00:46:47,179
abysmal choices of the things

1647
00:46:47,179 --> 00:46:48,599
that we call food that aren't

1648
00:46:48,599 --> 00:46:49,400
actually food.

1649
00:46:50,039 --> 00:46:51,900
Yeah. And our environment, too,

1650
00:46:51,940 --> 00:46:52,740
John.

1651
00:46:52,420 --> 00:46:53,220
I mean, you're out there

1652
00:46:53,099 --> 00:46:54,739
spraying Roundup, as was I,

1653
00:46:55,059 --> 00:46:55,860
you know.

1654
00:46:55,440 --> 00:46:56,920
And so we have all these

1655
00:46:56,920 --> 00:46:58,199
atmospheric pull -ins we're

1656
00:46:58,199 --> 00:46:59,360
doing. You know, a lot of people

1657
00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:01,679
are drinking water that's fairly

1658
00:47:01,679 --> 00:47:03,079
undrinkable, you know, by

1659
00:47:03,079 --> 00:47:04,099
drinking water standards.

1660
00:47:04,639 --> 00:47:06,480
So we're creating a

1661
00:47:07,530 --> 00:47:09,989
perfect atmosphere for

1662
00:47:11,010 --> 00:47:12,409
free radical formation.

1663
00:47:13,010 --> 00:47:13,810
Yeah.

1664
00:47:13,590 --> 00:47:14,590
You know, so with all these free

1665
00:47:14,590 --> 00:47:16,289
radicals running around, we have

1666
00:47:16,289 --> 00:47:17,809
to we absolutely have to

1667
00:47:18,500 --> 00:47:20,400
have antioxidants in our life to

1668
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:21,200
maintain life.

1669
00:47:22,070 --> 00:47:23,289
Because otherwise, you know, I

1670
00:47:23,289 --> 00:47:24,489
mean, this this is, you know,

1671
00:47:24,750 --> 00:47:25,670
this is historically.

1672
00:47:27,619 --> 00:47:28,940
Yeah. So, you

1673
00:47:29,570 --> 00:47:30,750
know, the fact you know, when

1674
00:47:30,750 --> 00:47:32,010
Stefan called me, he called me

1675
00:47:32,010 --> 00:47:33,010
one day, he said, I got to tell

1676
00:47:33,010 --> 00:47:33,810
you something.

1677
00:47:35,630 --> 00:47:36,789
This is like the first beef I've

1678
00:47:36,789 --> 00:47:37,590
ever seen

1679
00:47:39,269 --> 00:47:41,389
that had almost a one to one

1680
00:47:41,389 --> 00:47:42,190
ratio.

1681
00:47:42,250 --> 00:47:43,750
Actually, I think the sample he

1682
00:47:43,750 --> 00:47:45,309
tested was a point nine.

1683
00:47:45,750 --> 00:47:48,079
So that's omega six over omega

1684
00:47:48,079 --> 00:47:49,619
three. The fraction is omega six

1685
00:47:49,619 --> 00:47:50,519
over omega three.

1686
00:47:50,579 --> 00:47:51,679
That means there are more omega

1687
00:47:51,679 --> 00:47:53,239
threes and omega sixes in this

1688
00:47:53,239 --> 00:47:54,139
particular that

1689
00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:55,760
he discovered.

1690
00:47:55,599 --> 00:47:56,699
He said, I've never seen this

1691
00:47:56,699 --> 00:47:57,500
before.

1692
00:47:57,619 --> 00:47:59,179
And that was super exciting.

1693
00:47:59,179 --> 00:48:01,280
because the omega -3s are only

1694
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:02,080
one part of it.

1695
00:48:02,179 --> 00:48:02,980
We're talking these

1696
00:48:02,820 --> 00:48:04,019
phytochemicals as well.

1697
00:48:04,760 --> 00:48:05,560
There are also

1698
00:48:05,829 --> 00:48:08,349
these really amazing things that

1699
00:48:08,349 --> 00:48:10,369
cause these same three things,

1700
00:48:10,510 --> 00:48:11,650
anti -inflammatory,

1701
00:48:12,079 --> 00:48:13,099
antioxidant,

1702
00:48:14,219 --> 00:48:15,239
antimicrobial,

1703
00:48:15,780 --> 00:48:17,420
the things we need for immune

1704
00:48:17,420 --> 00:48:18,220
system

1705
00:48:19,650 --> 00:48:22,829
maintenance and

1706
00:48:23,179 --> 00:48:23,980
defense.

1707
00:48:24,650 --> 00:48:25,929
We've given up on a lot of those

1708
00:48:25,929 --> 00:48:27,349
things because with

1709
00:48:28,210 --> 00:48:29,369
You know, I'm hoping your

1710
00:48:29,369 --> 00:48:31,670
listeners already know that when

1711
00:48:31,670 --> 00:48:32,630
we give up flavor,

1712
00:48:33,889 --> 00:48:35,250
we give up those attributes.

1713
00:48:36,369 --> 00:48:37,170
Because flavor.

1714
00:48:37,349 --> 00:48:38,489
You understand, you create

1715
00:48:38,489 --> 00:48:40,210
flavor with sugar and salt and

1716
00:48:40,210 --> 00:48:41,010
fats.

1717
00:48:41,949 --> 00:48:42,809
Right. And that's the

1718
00:48:42,809 --> 00:48:43,969
perception, you know, I mean,

1719
00:48:44,010 --> 00:48:45,030
it's you know, you ever read

1720
00:48:45,030 --> 00:48:46,550
Mark Shatner's book, The Dorito

1721
00:48:46,550 --> 00:48:47,350
Effect?

1722
00:48:47,230 --> 00:48:48,389
Yes, he's on my list.

1723
00:48:48,510 --> 00:48:49,429
I've been on my list of people I

1724
00:48:49,429 --> 00:48:50,429
want to interview for years.

1725
00:48:50,710 --> 00:48:52,010
He's actually been on the ranch

1726
00:48:52,010 --> 00:48:53,130
several times. He and I have

1727
00:48:53,130 --> 00:48:54,210
become really good friends

1728
00:48:54,210 --> 00:48:55,070
because, you know,

1729
00:48:55,500 --> 00:48:57,360
He started by inner beef and he

1730
00:48:57,360 --> 00:48:59,039
actually featured it in one of

1731
00:48:59,039 --> 00:49:01,559
his books, and it was because it

1732
00:49:01,559 --> 00:49:02,980
won his taste test.

1733
00:49:04,239 --> 00:49:06,960
At that time, and the reason you

1734
00:49:09,159 --> 00:49:10,980
know he didn't just dismiss.

1735
00:49:12,429 --> 00:49:14,110
the fact that, yes, this was

1736
00:49:14,110 --> 00:49:15,070
good tasting beef.

1737
00:49:15,590 --> 00:49:17,329
He then made the association

1738
00:49:17,329 --> 00:49:19,329
after conversations with Dr.

1739
00:49:19,429 --> 00:49:20,230
Fred Provenza,

1740
00:49:20,829 --> 00:49:22,449
another guy from Utah State.

1741
00:49:23,130 --> 00:49:24,230
He's also been on the ranch.

1742
00:49:24,349 --> 00:49:25,789
But all these people have come

1743
00:49:25,789 --> 00:49:26,769
to the ranch to look at this

1744
00:49:26,769 --> 00:49:27,829
range because they want to see

1745
00:49:27,829 --> 00:49:29,869
where these plant compounds are

1746
00:49:29,869 --> 00:49:30,969
coming from. And when you get

1747
00:49:30,969 --> 00:49:31,769
out there and see that

1748
00:49:31,750 --> 00:49:32,869
biological diversity, it's

1749
00:49:32,869 --> 00:49:34,030
really, really clear.

1750
00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:37,159
where these compounds can

1751
00:49:37,159 --> 00:49:38,400
originate from, because, you

1752
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:39,380
know, I'm standing there with

1753
00:49:39,380 --> 00:49:40,460
Dr. Fred Provenza,

1754
00:49:40,820 --> 00:49:42,780
and I said, Fred, what are you

1755
00:49:42,780 --> 00:49:43,679
looking at here?

1756
00:49:43,820 --> 00:49:45,179
And he said, I'm observing what

1757
00:49:45,179 --> 00:49:46,179
your cattle are eating.

1758
00:49:47,750 --> 00:49:48,750
And I said, what does that mean?

1759
00:49:50,239 --> 00:49:51,800
And he said, there's tannins

1760
00:49:52,760 --> 00:49:53,760
in that plant.

1761
00:49:54,659 --> 00:49:56,449
And it's tannins that

1762
00:49:56,889 --> 00:49:58,110
he won't eat much of it.

1763
00:49:58,630 --> 00:50:00,230
It's a steer. He's grazing,

1764
00:50:00,469 --> 00:50:02,010
browsing this shrub.

1765
00:50:03,239 --> 00:50:04,880
But he's looking for something

1766
00:50:04,880 --> 00:50:07,019
there. And so Fred, in his work,

1767
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:09,679
has basically documented

1768
00:50:12,610 --> 00:50:14,050
nutritional wisdom,

1769
00:50:14,500 --> 00:50:15,980
first in animals, and then in

1770
00:50:15,980 --> 00:50:16,780
us.

1771
00:50:16,800 --> 00:50:18,599
And it's associated with

1772
00:50:19,010 --> 00:50:19,810
palates,

1773
00:50:21,050 --> 00:50:22,670
how we taste things.

1774
00:50:22,670 --> 00:50:23,470
That's our palate.

1775
00:50:23,909 --> 00:50:25,329
So animals, how they taste

1776
00:50:25,329 --> 00:50:26,130
things.

1777
00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:28,079
It's based on a feedback loop

1778
00:50:28,550 --> 00:50:30,409
called nutritional wisdom that

1779
00:50:30,690 --> 00:50:32,050
their body is basically telling

1780
00:50:32,050 --> 00:50:32,850
them.

1781
00:50:32,429 --> 00:50:34,230
It's messaging their palate to

1782
00:50:34,230 --> 00:50:36,590
say, I need that biochemical in

1783
00:50:36,590 --> 00:50:37,390
there.

1784
00:50:36,929 --> 00:50:37,849
I need that chemical.

1785
00:50:38,969 --> 00:50:40,090
I need that phytochemical.

1786
00:50:40,929 --> 00:50:42,269
I need that flavonoid

1787
00:50:42,809 --> 00:50:44,050
or I need that

1788
00:50:44,679 --> 00:50:45,519
CLA.

1789
00:50:46,019 --> 00:50:46,820
And

1790
00:50:46,829 --> 00:50:49,449
I need it not because I'm sick,

1791
00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:51,619
John. That's the amazing thing

1792
00:50:51,619 --> 00:50:53,940
about animals versus us and

1793
00:50:53,940 --> 00:50:54,920
where we've gotten to.

1794
00:50:55,039 --> 00:50:56,820
I think the human genome used to

1795
00:50:56,820 --> 00:50:57,620
be here.

1796
00:50:58,219 --> 00:50:59,579
Well, actually, I actually think

1797
00:50:59,579 --> 00:51:01,099
we still have that capacity.

1798
00:51:01,320 --> 00:51:02,120
I do too.

1799
00:51:03,110 --> 00:51:05,550
It's been masked by addiction to

1800
00:51:05,550 --> 00:51:07,809
sugars and salts and other

1801
00:51:07,809 --> 00:51:09,210
stuff. No, I think we have it

1802
00:51:09,210 --> 00:51:10,530
too, but we have to relearn it.

1803
00:51:10,590 --> 00:51:11,769
But these animals already have

1804
00:51:11,769 --> 00:51:12,570
it.

1805
00:51:12,769 --> 00:51:13,869
So they're going around.

1806
00:51:15,460 --> 00:51:16,539
And, you know, when we have a

1807
00:51:16,539 --> 00:51:17,599
headache, we take

1808
00:51:18,099 --> 00:51:20,159
bear aspirin. There you go.

1809
00:51:20,239 --> 00:51:22,940
How about that for a comparison?

1810
00:51:23,099 --> 00:51:24,039
The same company, right?

1811
00:51:24,340 --> 00:51:27,219
Or we take, you know, ibuprofen

1812
00:51:27,219 --> 00:51:28,760
or if we're getting sick, you

1813
00:51:28,760 --> 00:51:29,560
know,

1814
00:51:29,639 --> 00:51:30,639
A lot of friends of mine will

1815
00:51:30,639 --> 00:51:32,400
douse the Vicks Formula 44.

1816
00:51:32,639 --> 00:51:34,920
They'll go to the drugstore and

1817
00:51:34,920 --> 00:51:37,260
maybe get some codeine elixir

1818
00:51:37,260 --> 00:51:38,400
with it or something like that

1819
00:51:38,400 --> 00:51:39,200
to mitigate.

1820
00:51:39,579 --> 00:51:42,599
We're always mitigating illness

1821
00:51:42,909 --> 00:51:44,929
in our human experience,

1822
00:51:45,050 --> 00:51:46,269
especially in Western culture.

1823
00:51:46,989 --> 00:51:48,190
Meanwhile, I'm watching these

1824
00:51:48,190 --> 00:51:49,489
cows. I'm up there with them on

1825
00:51:49,489 --> 00:51:50,440
horseback. day.

1826
00:51:50,900 --> 00:51:52,079
I'm up there with Fred Provenza

1827
00:51:52,079 --> 00:51:53,719
talking about this and Stefan

1828
00:51:53,719 --> 00:51:54,519
Van Vliet.

1829
00:51:55,079 --> 00:51:56,320
They're saying, no, no, no.

1830
00:51:57,019 --> 00:51:58,539
They're medicating,

1831
00:51:59,460 --> 00:52:00,440
but they're medicating

1832
00:52:00,440 --> 00:52:01,240
preemptively.

1833
00:52:02,619 --> 00:52:03,619
They're preventative

1834
00:52:05,369 --> 00:52:08,269
minded in how they absorb these

1835
00:52:08,269 --> 00:52:09,070
chemicals.

1836
00:52:10,039 --> 00:52:10,840
As a result,

1837
00:52:11,159 --> 00:52:12,420
they're the picture of health

1838
00:52:12,420 --> 00:52:13,780
and they don't get sick.

1839
00:52:14,079 --> 00:52:14,880
They're right.

1840
00:52:15,320 --> 00:52:17,059
Our doctoring rates are

1841
00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:18,240
now

1842
00:52:19,389 --> 00:52:20,489
you know, probably a tenth of

1843
00:52:20,489 --> 00:52:21,289
what they used to be.

1844
00:52:21,469 --> 00:52:22,530
They're already low.

1845
00:52:22,929 --> 00:52:24,550
But right now, I mean, you know,

1846
00:52:24,550 --> 00:52:25,929
we run about an average of 600

1847
00:52:25,929 --> 00:52:27,489
head of cattle and

1848
00:52:28,440 --> 00:52:29,639
we had one pink eye last year

1849
00:52:29,789 --> 00:52:31,050
and we didn't even doctor it

1850
00:52:31,050 --> 00:52:32,030
because it just self healed.

1851
00:52:32,469 --> 00:52:33,690
We had two foot rats.

1852
00:52:34,570 --> 00:52:35,690
And if I talk to my neighbors

1853
00:52:35,690 --> 00:52:37,650
and we have good cattle in our

1854
00:52:37,650 --> 00:52:38,510
country, we have good,

1855
00:52:38,929 --> 00:52:40,489
solid Angus

1856
00:52:41,019 --> 00:52:41,920
genotypes.

1857
00:52:43,510 --> 00:52:45,170
Their doctoring rates are way,

1858
00:52:45,230 --> 00:52:46,250
way, way, way, way higher,

1859
00:52:47,389 --> 00:52:48,750
John. And I think it's just

1860
00:52:48,750 --> 00:52:50,449
because we've offered these

1861
00:52:50,449 --> 00:52:51,429
animals a choice.

1862
00:52:53,250 --> 00:52:54,349
And they have the nutritional

1863
00:52:54,349 --> 00:52:55,289
wisdom to do it.

1864
00:52:56,530 --> 00:52:57,349
It was the

1865
00:52:59,170 --> 00:53:01,210
conversation about disease,

1866
00:53:01,650 --> 00:53:03,030
illness versus health.

1867
00:53:04,579 --> 00:53:07,039
I heard framed once as we tend

1868
00:53:07,039 --> 00:53:07,860
to think of,

1869
00:53:08,409 --> 00:53:10,389
of health as being binary,

1870
00:53:10,789 --> 00:53:11,590
either you're

1871
00:53:11,750 --> 00:53:13,050
well, or you're sick.

1872
00:53:13,429 --> 00:53:14,230
Yes.

1873
00:53:14,210 --> 00:53:15,010
When in fact,

1874
00:53:15,719 --> 00:53:17,159
wellness exists on a spectrum,

1875
00:53:17,159 --> 00:53:18,139
and you have

1876
00:53:19,010 --> 00:53:20,849
a state of one of the spectrum,

1877
00:53:21,030 --> 00:53:22,269
you have vibrant health, and on

1878
00:53:22,269 --> 00:53:23,210
the other end of the spectrum,

1879
00:53:23,449 --> 00:53:24,250
you have disease.

1880
00:53:24,909 --> 00:53:26,230
And then you have this in

1881
00:53:26,230 --> 00:53:27,789
between spectrum that you could

1882
00:53:27,789 --> 00:53:29,389
appropriately label it as again,

1883
00:53:29,449 --> 00:53:30,590
it is a spectrum, but you could

1884
00:53:30,590 --> 00:53:32,409
label this spectrum pre disease,

1885
00:53:32,789 --> 00:53:34,699
like you are moving to a pre

1886
00:53:34,699 --> 00:53:37,059
disease state, or moving in the

1887
00:53:37,059 --> 00:53:38,219
direction of a disease state.

1888
00:53:39,210 --> 00:53:40,190
And I

1889
00:53:40,820 --> 00:53:42,679
think that that instinct that

1890
00:53:42,679 --> 00:53:43,739
self medication that you're

1891
00:53:43,739 --> 00:53:44,800
describing is

1892
00:53:45,500 --> 00:53:47,739
the moment there is any

1893
00:53:47,739 --> 00:53:48,539
perception,

1894
00:53:48,719 --> 00:53:49,800
or perhaps not even moving

1895
00:53:49,800 --> 00:53:51,199
outside the optimal health

1896
00:53:51,199 --> 00:53:52,500
state, they are maintaining

1897
00:53:52,500 --> 00:53:53,360
optimal health.

1898
00:53:54,550 --> 00:53:55,429
Yeah, and it could be a very

1899
00:53:55,429 --> 00:53:56,230
small percentage.

1900
00:53:56,489 --> 00:53:57,289
Perhaps they're feeling

1901
00:53:57,230 --> 00:53:58,190
something that's

1902
00:53:58,789 --> 00:54:00,070
2 % off optimum,

1903
00:54:01,530 --> 00:54:03,829
and they have signaling built in

1904
00:54:04,429 --> 00:54:06,750
that says, I now have a taste

1905
00:54:06,750 --> 00:54:07,550
for

1906
00:54:07,719 --> 00:54:08,519
that flavor.

1907
00:54:08,579 --> 00:54:10,440
I now have a taste for that

1908
00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:11,240
scent

1909
00:54:12,139 --> 00:54:13,619
being emitted by

1910
00:54:15,110 --> 00:54:16,289
those flavonoids in

1911
00:54:16,760 --> 00:54:17,560
that plant.

1912
00:54:19,000 --> 00:54:20,420
You know, so I don't even think

1913
00:54:20,420 --> 00:54:21,220
they I

1914
00:54:23,090 --> 00:54:24,409
think they know their plants,

1915
00:54:24,510 --> 00:54:25,310
you know, obviously, they don't

1916
00:54:25,309 --> 00:54:26,230
have names for them.

1917
00:54:26,710 --> 00:54:28,349
But I watch him being very, very

1918
00:54:28,349 --> 00:54:31,789
careful about selecting plants.

1919
00:54:32,489 --> 00:54:33,389
So, you know,

1920
00:54:33,690 --> 00:54:35,650
my people might call this

1921
00:54:35,650 --> 00:54:37,110
selective grazing, but I think

1922
00:54:37,110 --> 00:54:39,170
we've left something on the

1923
00:54:39,170 --> 00:54:40,769
table by saying we don't want

1924
00:54:40,769 --> 00:54:42,050
any selection in grazing.

1925
00:54:42,530 --> 00:54:44,090
Because if you don't allow

1926
00:54:44,090 --> 00:54:45,530
second selection and grazing to

1927
00:54:45,530 --> 00:54:46,330
some degree,

1928
00:54:47,130 --> 00:54:48,590
yes, you get to balance this out

1929
00:54:48,590 --> 00:54:49,390
on the plant side.

1930
00:54:50,449 --> 00:54:52,849
But now, if you allow no

1931
00:54:52,849 --> 00:54:53,650
selection,

1932
00:54:54,039 --> 00:54:55,400
you're in a place where you have

1933
00:54:55,400 --> 00:54:56,460
to figure out how to balance it

1934
00:54:56,460 --> 00:54:57,539
out on the animal side.

1935
00:54:58,519 --> 00:55:00,679
This is why we get into, you

1936
00:55:00,679 --> 00:55:03,079
know, medication and feedlots

1937
00:55:03,079 --> 00:55:05,820
and engineering of feedlot

1938
00:55:05,820 --> 00:55:07,539
rations to try to maintain

1939
00:55:07,539 --> 00:55:09,159
wellness, because the animals no

1940
00:55:09,159 --> 00:55:09,960
longer have a choice.

1941
00:55:11,010 --> 00:55:12,110
They just can eat what's in the

1942
00:55:12,110 --> 00:55:12,910
feed bunk.

1943
00:55:13,369 --> 00:55:14,409
And to me, it's a travesty

1944
00:55:14,409 --> 00:55:16,730
because you have this elegant

1945
00:55:17,199 --> 00:55:18,000
fermentation

1946
00:55:18,889 --> 00:55:21,670
machine slash mechanism in a

1947
00:55:21,670 --> 00:55:22,470
cow.

1948
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:24,139
And it's this thing of just

1949
00:55:24,420 --> 00:55:25,239
beauty.

1950
00:55:25,659 --> 00:55:26,460
It's this

1951
00:55:26,239 --> 00:55:29,199
perfect Elliot picture of

1952
00:55:29,199 --> 00:55:30,960
matching diverse plant

1953
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:32,360
ecosystems into

1954
00:55:33,030 --> 00:55:34,510
health that then provides food

1955
00:55:34,510 --> 00:55:35,610
for us for meat and milk.

1956
00:55:36,510 --> 00:55:37,510
And we

1957
00:55:37,860 --> 00:55:39,239
just put put all that aside.

1958
00:55:39,320 --> 00:55:40,219
We cast it off.

1959
00:55:40,219 --> 00:55:41,940
aside, cast all those good gifts

1960
00:55:41,940 --> 00:55:42,740
aside,

1961
00:55:43,409 --> 00:55:46,239
and put these animals in

1962
00:55:46,739 --> 00:55:48,199
a feedlot, in a concrete bunk

1963
00:55:48,199 --> 00:55:50,860
with a TMR ration that often is

1964
00:55:50,860 --> 00:55:51,900
comprised of DDGs.

1965
00:55:52,079 --> 00:55:52,880
It's a waste product.

1966
00:55:53,019 --> 00:55:54,420
DDGs are a waste product.

1967
00:55:54,739 --> 00:55:56,579
DDGs also happen to have

1968
00:55:57,329 --> 00:55:58,469
a lot of times antibiotic

1969
00:55:58,469 --> 00:56:00,730
residue in them, because in

1970
00:56:00,730 --> 00:56:02,329
ethanol culture, you have to

1971
00:56:02,329 --> 00:56:04,110
apply antibiotics to keep it a

1972
00:56:04,110 --> 00:56:06,550
pure use culture to get the

1973
00:56:06,550 --> 00:56:08,230
desired result out of ethanol.

1974
00:56:08,989 --> 00:56:10,429
That was interesting in Van

1975
00:56:10,429 --> 00:56:11,230
Vliet's study, too.

1976
00:56:11,329 --> 00:56:12,710
He also picked up antibiotics.

1977
00:56:13,670 --> 00:56:16,820
It was all through the...

1978
00:56:16,820 --> 00:56:17,620
I think it's all...

1979
00:56:17,500 --> 00:56:18,300
That doesn't happen.

1980
00:56:18,769 --> 00:56:21,449
It tested in 97 % of his

1981
00:56:21,449 --> 00:56:23,590
samples. I think it was 97.

1982
00:56:24,250 --> 00:56:25,849
There was one segment, it was

1983
00:56:25,849 --> 00:56:27,110
80, and I think the other one

1984
00:56:27,110 --> 00:56:30,530
was 97%. I think it was

1985
00:56:30,530 --> 00:56:33,789
a quinone, hydrofluoroquinone, I

1986
00:56:33,789 --> 00:56:34,590
believe,

1987
00:56:34,510 --> 00:56:36,170
showed up. And they haven't been

1988
00:56:36,170 --> 00:56:37,789
able to trace it because the

1989
00:56:38,099 --> 00:56:40,099
ranchers who were growing those

1990
00:56:40,099 --> 00:56:41,139
products had

1991
00:56:41,840 --> 00:56:42,640
no recall.

1992
00:56:43,019 --> 00:56:44,599
They said, we didn't apply

1993
00:56:44,599 --> 00:56:45,400
antibiotics.

1994
00:56:45,610 --> 00:56:47,489
So it had to come from the DDG

1995
00:56:47,489 --> 00:56:48,289
supply chain.

1996
00:56:48,619 --> 00:56:51,000
Carol, my wife, found an article

1997
00:56:51,000 --> 00:56:53,039
that tested 36 ethanol plants

1998
00:56:53,039 --> 00:56:55,300
and found that, oh,

1999
00:56:57,280 --> 00:57:00,260
a significant amount had use

2000
00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:02,840
of antibiotics to maintain the

2001
00:57:02,840 --> 00:57:04,619
purity of their yeast strains to

2002
00:57:04,619 --> 00:57:05,420
create ethanol.

2003
00:57:06,219 --> 00:57:08,000
but it was measurable in about

2004
00:57:08,000 --> 00:57:10,280
12%. 12 % had measurable

2005
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:12,199
antibiotics in the final

2006
00:57:12,199 --> 00:57:13,980
byproduct DDG.

2007
00:57:14,460 --> 00:57:15,699
So anyway, we're feeding this,

2008
00:57:16,139 --> 00:57:17,340
these, these things to these

2009
00:57:17,340 --> 00:57:19,739
cattle. And for me that, you

2010
00:57:19,739 --> 00:57:21,039
know, I'm not a huge science

2011
00:57:21,039 --> 00:57:22,679
person. You know, I love this

2012
00:57:22,679 --> 00:57:23,480
research.

2013
00:57:24,579 --> 00:57:25,679
That's not where I'm at.

2014
00:57:25,699 --> 00:57:26,840
I'm on the cow side,

2015
00:57:27,199 --> 00:57:29,059
John. So I'm their horseback.

2016
00:57:29,139 --> 00:57:29,940
Okay.

2017
00:57:30,650 --> 00:57:32,909
And I'm watching this group of

2018
00:57:32,909 --> 00:57:33,710
cattle.

2019
00:57:33,610 --> 00:57:34,829
There's about five,

2020
00:57:35,170 --> 00:57:37,449
mama cows, and they're older and

2021
00:57:37,730 --> 00:57:38,750
wiser, I'm assuming.

2022
00:57:40,170 --> 00:57:41,230
And they got their babies with

2023
00:57:41,230 --> 00:57:42,309
them. They got their calves with

2024
00:57:42,309 --> 00:57:43,110
them.

2025
00:57:42,889 --> 00:57:44,590
And they're on the far,

2026
00:57:47,119 --> 00:57:49,059
the northwest corner of the

2027
00:57:49,059 --> 00:57:51,019
ranch. It's a barbed wire fence

2028
00:57:51,019 --> 00:57:52,559
piece. It's off irrigated

2029
00:57:52,559 --> 00:57:53,800
ground. It's about two miles

2030
00:57:53,800 --> 00:57:55,219
from my house. And I trot out

2031
00:57:55,219 --> 00:57:56,360
there and say, what are they

2032
00:57:56,360 --> 00:57:57,160
doing?

2033
00:57:57,070 --> 00:57:58,210
What are they doing out there?

2034
00:57:59,820 --> 00:58:00,739
And I trot out there.

2035
00:58:02,409 --> 00:58:03,949
And John, they're just standing

2036
00:58:03,949 --> 00:58:06,070
in this little godforsaken pair

2037
00:58:06,070 --> 00:58:08,590
of sagebrush dirt that's been

2038
00:58:08,590 --> 00:58:10,230
kind of beat to death because

2039
00:58:10,230 --> 00:58:11,329
they've been standing there for

2040
00:58:11,329 --> 00:58:12,130
a while.

2041
00:58:12,150 --> 00:58:13,349
They've eaten every blade of

2042
00:58:13,349 --> 00:58:14,309
grass off that.

2043
00:58:16,090 --> 00:58:16,890
And I

2044
00:58:16,869 --> 00:58:18,389
get them out of there and bring

2045
00:58:18,389 --> 00:58:19,610
them back to irrigated pasture

2046
00:58:19,610 --> 00:58:21,110
to the 80 species, right?

2047
00:58:22,570 --> 00:58:23,610
It's like, girls,

2048
00:58:24,050 --> 00:58:24,850
here's food.

2049
00:58:25,110 --> 00:58:26,769
But they keep going back.

2050
00:58:31,239 --> 00:58:32,340
One night I'm laying in bed.

2051
00:58:32,380 --> 00:58:33,559
I just have a light bulb moment.

2052
00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:34,659
And maybe it's God.

2053
00:58:35,670 --> 00:58:37,730
It says, no, they know.

2054
00:58:38,090 --> 00:58:38,989
what's about to happen.

2055
00:58:39,170 --> 00:58:40,070
They know what's about to

2056
00:58:40,070 --> 00:58:41,389
happen. And it's because that

2057
00:58:41,389 --> 00:58:42,349
northwest corner

2058
00:58:44,710 --> 00:58:47,030
is kind of the closest point of

2059
00:58:47,030 --> 00:58:49,030
beginning off our home ranch to

2060
00:58:49,690 --> 00:58:51,750
get to those rangelands eight

2061
00:58:51,750 --> 00:58:53,550
miles away. They know that's

2062
00:58:53,550 --> 00:58:55,230
where the journey begins to walk

2063
00:58:55,230 --> 00:58:56,030
to the range.

2064
00:58:57,130 --> 00:58:58,449
So sure enough, that following

2065
00:58:58,449 --> 00:58:59,250
week,

2066
00:58:59,469 --> 00:59:01,929
we now have about 250 mama cows.

2067
00:59:02,309 --> 00:59:03,590
They're included in that.

2068
00:59:03,980 --> 00:59:05,699
We walk right past that very

2069
00:59:05,699 --> 00:59:07,460
spot, right past that very spot,

2070
00:59:07,579 --> 00:59:09,619
all 250 pairs. These are mama

2071
00:59:09,619 --> 00:59:11,880
and baby, so a total of 500

2072
00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:13,179
head. We're on horseback.

2073
00:59:13,579 --> 00:59:15,239
We hit the main road.

2074
00:59:15,619 --> 00:59:17,800
We go down the paved road to get

2075
00:59:17,800 --> 00:59:19,159
to the range. It's across the

2076
00:59:19,159 --> 00:59:20,619
Salmon River, and that's where

2077
00:59:20,619 --> 00:59:21,820
the wild country starts.

2078
00:59:22,929 --> 00:59:24,389
And the open grazing starts just

2079
00:59:24,389 --> 00:59:25,610
in about eight and a half miles.

2080
00:59:27,389 --> 00:59:29,070
And I watch those old mamas.

2081
00:59:29,309 --> 00:59:30,110
They're in front.

2082
00:59:30,349 --> 00:59:31,150
they're in front.

2083
00:59:32,300 --> 00:59:33,260
And they start trotting,

2084
00:59:34,630 --> 00:59:35,430
they start trotting.

2085
00:59:35,429 --> 00:59:36,349
And then they start running.

2086
00:59:36,449 --> 00:59:37,670
We gotta keep going in front of

2087
00:59:37,670 --> 00:59:38,470
them to slow them down.

2088
00:59:38,920 --> 00:59:40,800
Hey, slow down girls.

2089
00:59:40,960 --> 00:59:41,760
And they know what's coming,

2090
00:59:41,800 --> 00:59:42,840
John. No, you nailed it.

2091
00:59:42,880 --> 00:59:44,179
A lot of people are like, what

2092
00:59:44,179 --> 00:59:45,079
is wrong with them?

2093
00:59:45,139 --> 00:59:46,659
They would say, no, instead I'm

2094
00:59:46,659 --> 00:59:48,119
watching and say, what is right

2095
00:59:48,119 --> 00:59:48,920
with them? There's something

2096
00:59:48,920 --> 00:59:50,039
right about those cattle.

2097
00:59:50,480 --> 00:59:52,340
And the reason they're running,

2098
00:59:52,460 --> 00:59:54,400
I realized as soon as we crossed

2099
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:55,780
the Salmon River Bridge and get

2100
00:59:55,780 --> 00:59:57,059
onto that range, they put their

2101
00:59:57,059 --> 00:59:57,860
heads down.

2102
00:59:58,469 --> 00:59:59,889
They go right to business.

2103
01:00:00,409 --> 01:00:01,210
And I'm watching them.

2104
01:00:01,269 --> 01:00:02,449
And they're eating all these

2105
01:00:02,449 --> 01:00:03,250
different,

2106
01:00:03,110 --> 01:00:05,289
this esoteric variety of plants.

2107
01:00:05,469 --> 01:00:07,150
And they're just eating the

2108
01:00:07,300 --> 01:00:09,159
species diversity that is in

2109
01:00:09,159 --> 01:00:10,280
that low country on a range.

2110
01:00:10,400 --> 01:00:11,900
They're eating wildflowers like

2111
01:00:11,900 --> 01:00:13,280
wild geranium or Indian

2112
01:00:13,280 --> 01:00:14,080
paintbrush.

2113
01:00:14,440 --> 01:00:15,820
And they're taking even a bite

2114
01:00:15,820 --> 01:00:17,360
out of sagebrush or greasewood.

2115
01:00:17,440 --> 01:00:18,989
These are like plants that we

2116
01:00:18,989 --> 01:00:20,190
consider, oh man, they're not

2117
01:00:20,190 --> 01:00:21,889
cow food, but they're trying

2118
01:00:21,889 --> 01:00:23,130
them all. And they're just going

2119
01:00:23,130 --> 01:00:23,930
through it like,

2120
01:00:25,050 --> 01:00:25,869
You know, remember when your

2121
01:00:25,869 --> 01:00:27,150
kids you go to like a

2122
01:00:27,150 --> 01:00:29,110
smorgasbord or a nice buffet,

2123
01:00:29,429 --> 01:00:30,969
you know, we go to, you know, a

2124
01:00:30,969 --> 01:00:32,010
wedding or something like that.

2125
01:00:32,230 --> 01:00:34,050
And man, as a kid, I just loved

2126
01:00:34,050 --> 01:00:34,850
it because there's all these

2127
01:00:34,849 --> 01:00:36,170
things to try. And I fill my

2128
01:00:36,170 --> 01:00:37,269
plate with all this diversity.

2129
01:00:37,690 --> 01:00:38,490
That's what these cows are

2130
01:00:38,489 --> 01:00:39,630
doing. They're doing exactly the

2131
01:00:39,630 --> 01:00:41,150
same thing. And it's because

2132
01:00:41,150 --> 01:00:42,590
they are designed

2133
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:44,599
for diversity.

2134
01:00:45,380 --> 01:00:47,219
And it isn't only because they

2135
01:00:47,219 --> 01:00:48,019
like it.

2136
01:00:48,199 --> 01:00:49,079
I mean, their palates are

2137
01:00:49,079 --> 01:00:49,980
saying, oh, try that.

2138
01:00:50,019 --> 01:00:50,840
Oh, try that. Try that.

2139
01:00:51,059 --> 01:00:52,159
I think it's because they have

2140
01:00:52,159 --> 01:00:52,960
to have

2141
01:00:52,909 --> 01:00:53,769
I think it's because they're

2142
01:00:53,769 --> 01:00:55,170
missing nutrition.

2143
01:00:55,969 --> 01:00:57,670
In fact, this is an interesting

2144
01:00:57,670 --> 01:00:58,470
thing.

2145
01:00:58,369 --> 01:00:59,829
Whenever we put them on the low

2146
01:00:59,829 --> 01:01:00,710
area of the range,

2147
01:01:01,610 --> 01:01:03,469
if we try to supplement minerals

2148
01:01:03,469 --> 01:01:04,269
or

2149
01:01:04,710 --> 01:01:06,440
supplement even salt,

2150
01:01:07,230 --> 01:01:08,030
those two things,

2151
01:01:08,539 --> 01:01:09,340
untouched,

2152
01:01:10,449 --> 01:01:12,210
untouched. They just left home.

2153
01:01:12,880 --> 01:01:13,940
They're eating some mineral.

2154
01:01:14,139 --> 01:01:15,460
We usually feed kelp.

2155
01:01:16,980 --> 01:01:18,619
And they're eating Redmond salt.

2156
01:01:18,920 --> 01:01:19,720
You know, we're certified

2157
01:01:19,539 --> 01:01:20,739
organic across the entire

2158
01:01:20,739 --> 01:01:21,539
operation.

2159
01:01:22,300 --> 01:01:23,880
And intake is pretty maintained,

2160
01:01:24,019 --> 01:01:24,820
you know, and they're pretty

2161
01:01:24,539 --> 01:01:25,340
steady on it.

2162
01:01:25,710 --> 01:01:26,969
They don't overkill in either

2163
01:01:26,969 --> 01:01:28,590
one of them, but it's, it's a

2164
01:01:28,590 --> 01:01:29,590
pretty steady intake.

2165
01:01:29,769 --> 01:01:30,849
Everybody's taking in some.

2166
01:01:30,929 --> 01:01:32,389
Second we get to that range and

2167
01:01:32,389 --> 01:01:33,469
they put their heads down and

2168
01:01:33,469 --> 01:01:34,829
start to experience diversity

2169
01:01:34,829 --> 01:01:35,630
again,

2170
01:01:35,750 --> 01:01:36,550
all,

2171
01:01:37,639 --> 01:01:39,820
all minerals and all salt is

2172
01:01:39,820 --> 01:01:41,380
off. It's off the table for

2173
01:01:41,380 --> 01:01:42,180
them.

2174
01:01:42,360 --> 01:01:43,460
Does that last for the entire

2175
01:01:43,460 --> 01:01:44,260
season?

2176
01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:45,800
No, it changes.

2177
01:01:46,199 --> 01:01:47,000
And, um,

2178
01:01:47,480 --> 01:01:49,460
I think it's because the most

2179
01:01:49,460 --> 01:01:50,659
diversity that

2180
01:01:51,480 --> 01:01:52,500
we're going to pick up for any

2181
01:01:52,500 --> 01:01:53,300
one day,

2182
01:01:53,619 --> 01:01:54,599
and their grazing journey

2183
01:01:55,809 --> 01:01:57,150
is down in the low country.

2184
01:01:57,679 --> 01:01:59,420
Because there you have these

2185
01:01:59,420 --> 01:02:01,239
incredible aspect shifts.

2186
01:02:01,940 --> 01:02:03,099
So aspect is, again,

2187
01:02:03,480 --> 01:02:06,170
what direction you are in

2188
01:02:06,170 --> 01:02:07,150
reference to the sun.

2189
01:02:07,250 --> 01:02:08,289
So south aspects,

2190
01:02:08,650 --> 01:02:10,010
you're going to have these very,

2191
01:02:10,150 --> 01:02:11,849
very just brittle environment

2192
01:02:11,849 --> 01:02:13,309
plants, these desert plants.

2193
01:02:14,070 --> 01:02:15,449
There's even cactus there,

2194
01:02:15,610 --> 01:02:16,449
there's scorpions, there's

2195
01:02:16,449 --> 01:02:17,250
rattlesnakes.

2196
01:02:17,849 --> 01:02:19,530
It is desert. And it's because

2197
01:02:19,530 --> 01:02:20,369
it's got an effective

2198
01:02:20,369 --> 01:02:22,070
precipitation of probably two to

2199
01:02:22,070 --> 01:02:22,870
three inches a year.

2200
01:02:23,769 --> 01:02:24,769
And it gets a little bit of

2201
01:02:24,769 --> 01:02:25,949
snow, like right now has some

2202
01:02:25,949 --> 01:02:26,750
snow on it.

2203
01:02:26,809 --> 01:02:28,610
But what's crazy, John, is when

2204
01:02:28,610 --> 01:02:30,190
the warm winds of spring come in

2205
01:02:30,190 --> 01:02:31,369
April, snow

2206
01:02:31,929 --> 01:02:33,010
gets scoured off.

2207
01:02:33,710 --> 01:02:34,550
And guess who gets it?

2208
01:02:35,380 --> 01:02:36,180
The wind.

2209
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:38,039
It sublimates. It goes through a

2210
01:02:38,039 --> 01:02:39,099
phase change. It goes right from

2211
01:02:39,099 --> 01:02:39,900
solid,

2212
01:02:40,710 --> 01:02:41,869
doesn't even bother with

2213
01:02:41,869 --> 01:02:42,670
liquefaction,

2214
01:02:46,769 --> 01:02:47,949
and goes into the atmosphere.

2215
01:02:48,550 --> 01:02:50,110
And you can dig a hole under a

2216
01:02:50,110 --> 01:02:51,570
snowbank on those low country

2217
01:02:51,570 --> 01:02:52,370
ranges.

2218
01:02:52,329 --> 01:02:53,489
And a lot of times the soil is

2219
01:02:53,489 --> 01:02:54,289
powder dry.

2220
01:02:54,630 --> 01:02:55,430
Wow.

2221
01:02:55,440 --> 01:02:57,380
Even though it's 85 degrees out.

2222
01:02:58,840 --> 01:03:00,019
You know, you got snow that's

2223
01:03:00,019 --> 01:03:01,039
melting and you're like, oh,

2224
01:03:01,079 --> 01:03:01,880
it's going to snow.

2225
01:03:01,980 --> 01:03:02,780
A

2226
01:03:03,159 --> 01:03:04,179
lot of it does not.

2227
01:03:04,639 --> 01:03:05,659
So you need a rain on snow

2228
01:03:05,659 --> 01:03:06,920
event. So that's where the two

2229
01:03:06,920 --> 01:03:07,760
inches of

2230
01:03:08,199 --> 01:03:09,460
rain comes from, from rain on

2231
01:03:09,460 --> 01:03:10,719
snow events. So sometimes it's

2232
01:03:10,719 --> 01:03:11,780
as much as five or six, you

2233
01:03:11,780 --> 01:03:12,719
know, but a lot of years it's

2234
01:03:12,719 --> 01:03:13,519
two, three.

2235
01:03:15,039 --> 01:03:16,519
So those South aspects are

2236
01:03:16,519 --> 01:03:17,320
there.

2237
01:03:17,179 --> 01:03:18,460
And then we'll tilt them over

2238
01:03:18,460 --> 01:03:20,139
into a North aspect in a year.

2239
01:03:21,059 --> 01:03:22,659
Because the South aspect plants,

2240
01:03:22,739 --> 01:03:23,639
they're still made of all

2241
01:03:23,639 --> 01:03:24,440
clothes.

2242
01:03:25,329 --> 01:03:26,130
And guess what?

2243
01:03:26,269 --> 01:03:27,610
Photosynthesis pretty much shuts

2244
01:03:27,610 --> 01:03:28,410
down.

2245
01:03:28,460 --> 01:03:29,340
You're not going to end up with

2246
01:03:29,340 --> 01:03:30,559
any sugar in the leaf material.

2247
01:03:30,820 --> 01:03:32,860
The solar panel has got no sugar

2248
01:03:32,860 --> 01:03:33,660
in it.

2249
01:03:33,840 --> 01:03:35,219
So your bricks is fall off.

2250
01:03:35,380 --> 01:03:36,180
And guess what?

2251
01:03:35,980 --> 01:03:37,619
We're trying to make money by

2252
01:03:38,190 --> 01:03:39,130
picking up bricks, right?

2253
01:03:39,210 --> 01:03:40,070
Because bricks is pounds.

2254
01:03:42,170 --> 01:03:44,349
So anyway, so we switch over to

2255
01:03:44,349 --> 01:03:45,150
our north aspect.

2256
01:03:45,369 --> 01:03:46,929
I talked to the crew and my

2257
01:03:46,929 --> 01:03:48,289
daughters are finally getting it

2258
01:03:48,289 --> 01:03:49,389
because I'll come up there

2259
01:03:49,389 --> 01:03:51,309
sometimes when I'm not up there

2260
01:03:51,309 --> 01:03:52,369
and I'll say, what are these

2261
01:03:52,369 --> 01:03:54,070
cattle still doing on the south

2262
01:03:54,070 --> 01:03:55,550
aspect? It's two o 'clock in the

2263
01:03:55,550 --> 01:03:56,350
afternoon.

2264
01:03:57,250 --> 01:03:58,409
You got to get off this thing

2265
01:03:58,409 --> 01:03:59,449
because we're here to make

2266
01:03:59,449 --> 01:04:00,250
money.

2267
01:04:00,289 --> 01:04:01,449
And the cattle are already

2268
01:04:01,449 --> 01:04:02,550
telling you they're not

2269
01:04:02,550 --> 01:04:03,670
interested because they're just

2270
01:04:03,670 --> 01:04:06,030
wandering around or laying down.

2271
01:04:06,269 --> 01:04:07,130
They're not eating.

2272
01:04:07,329 --> 01:04:08,130
They're done with it.

2273
01:04:08,469 --> 01:04:09,650
But as soon as you tilt over

2274
01:04:09,650 --> 01:04:10,929
into north facing slope,

2275
01:04:12,400 --> 01:04:13,219
everything changes.

2276
01:04:13,809 --> 01:04:14,789
because now your effect of

2277
01:04:14,789 --> 01:04:17,010
precipitation is up 50, 60 %

2278
01:04:17,010 --> 01:04:17,810
more.

2279
01:04:17,940 --> 01:04:18,900
Your plant diversity has

2280
01:04:18,900 --> 01:04:20,219
changed. You have new species

2281
01:04:20,219 --> 01:04:21,019
over here.

2282
01:04:21,159 --> 01:04:22,719
So this, I think, John, is why.

2283
01:04:22,860 --> 01:04:24,300
Because there's the

2284
01:04:24,300 --> 01:04:25,100
phytochemical,

2285
01:04:25,320 --> 01:04:26,260
the biological,

2286
01:04:27,170 --> 01:04:29,860
plant diversity has just

2287
01:04:29,860 --> 01:04:31,400
dramatically increased

2288
01:04:32,159 --> 01:04:34,199
because of these aspect changes

2289
01:04:34,199 --> 01:04:36,019
and because of

2290
01:04:36,360 --> 01:04:39,199
desert variances and then

2291
01:04:39,199 --> 01:04:41,000
comparing them with like,

2292
01:04:41,500 --> 01:04:43,179
for instance, in the low country

2293
01:04:43,179 --> 01:04:44,579
on steep north slopes,

2294
01:04:45,400 --> 01:04:46,200
I'll have

2295
01:04:46,570 --> 01:04:48,570
Idaho fescue -dominated stands

2296
01:04:48,570 --> 01:04:50,210
that almost covered the ground.

2297
01:04:51,090 --> 01:04:52,670
If I flip that over and go right

2298
01:04:52,670 --> 01:04:53,889
over that ridge to the south

2299
01:04:53,889 --> 01:04:54,690
aspect,

2300
01:04:56,170 --> 01:04:57,550
I got cactus, greasewood,

2301
01:04:57,869 --> 01:04:58,670
sagebrush,

2302
01:04:59,179 --> 01:05:00,460
and blue bunch wheatgrass, and

2303
01:05:00,460 --> 01:05:01,420
same river wild rye.

2304
01:05:01,940 --> 01:05:03,599
So, the species difference is

2305
01:05:03,599 --> 01:05:04,400
completely different.

2306
01:05:05,469 --> 01:05:06,909
Soil covering is a lot higher.

2307
01:05:07,030 --> 01:05:07,830
So, there's a lot more green

2308
01:05:07,829 --> 01:05:08,829
grass on the north slope.

2309
01:05:09,349 --> 01:05:10,570
So, you know, we got to just

2310
01:05:10,570 --> 01:05:12,929
basically have that in mind all

2311
01:05:12,929 --> 01:05:13,730
the time.

2312
01:05:13,869 --> 01:05:15,820
And it's completely spectral

2313
01:05:15,820 --> 01:05:17,380
opposite from a feedlot

2314
01:05:17,380 --> 01:05:18,659
environment where you're feeding

2315
01:05:18,659 --> 01:05:19,920
the same thing all the time.

2316
01:05:20,920 --> 01:05:22,679
Here, we're trying to provide

2317
01:05:22,679 --> 01:05:24,840
for them a diverse palette

2318
01:05:25,949 --> 01:05:27,130
choice every

2319
01:05:28,150 --> 01:05:28,950
hour of the day.

2320
01:05:29,340 --> 01:05:30,239
You know, we're trying to craft

2321
01:05:30,239 --> 01:05:31,179
that in our heads with our

2322
01:05:31,179 --> 01:05:32,659
grazing plan. Where are we going

2323
01:05:32,659 --> 01:05:33,460
today?

2324
01:05:33,699 --> 01:05:34,719
You know, so we'll be in cow

2325
01:05:34,719 --> 01:05:35,519
camp,

2326
01:05:35,480 --> 01:05:37,159
put it, put the cattle all down

2327
01:05:37,159 --> 01:05:38,579
at the end of the day, after 10

2328
01:05:38,579 --> 01:05:39,739
o 'clock at night, sun's gone

2329
01:05:39,739 --> 01:05:40,960
down, they're ready to lay down,

2330
01:05:41,019 --> 01:05:41,820
they're done.

2331
01:05:41,739 --> 01:05:42,659
They're going to ruminate all

2332
01:05:42,659 --> 01:05:43,880
night until five o 'clock in the

2333
01:05:43,880 --> 01:05:44,760
next morning, and we'll pick

2334
01:05:44,760 --> 01:05:45,579
them up and move them again.

2335
01:05:46,039 --> 01:05:47,300
And every

2336
01:05:48,730 --> 01:05:50,050
night, you know, while we're

2337
01:05:50,050 --> 01:05:51,429
sitting around camp,

2338
01:05:51,949 --> 01:05:53,659
cooking dinner, or whatever,

2339
01:05:53,780 --> 01:05:54,880
we'll decide, hey, where we're

2340
01:05:54,880 --> 01:05:55,739
going to go next.

2341
01:05:57,000 --> 01:05:59,139
And where can we maximize their

2342
01:05:59,860 --> 01:06:02,110
grazing choices and maximize

2343
01:06:02,110 --> 01:06:02,910
their,

2344
01:06:03,400 --> 01:06:05,630
their nutritional needs and

2345
01:06:05,630 --> 01:06:06,889
matching what their palate is

2346
01:06:06,889 --> 01:06:07,690
looking for.

2347
01:06:09,130 --> 01:06:10,349
I remember one time I was up

2348
01:06:10,349 --> 01:06:11,449
there, and I

2349
01:06:13,039 --> 01:06:14,420
saw this whole bunch of steers

2350
01:06:14,420 --> 01:06:16,519
kind of heading sideways out of

2351
01:06:16,519 --> 01:06:17,519
the herd, and they all got their

2352
01:06:17,519 --> 01:06:18,320
heads down.

2353
01:06:20,090 --> 01:06:21,610
And I can't even see anything

2354
01:06:21,610 --> 01:06:22,410
over there, John.

2355
01:06:22,389 --> 01:06:23,429
It's like they're grazing air.

2356
01:06:26,349 --> 01:06:27,610
There's sagebrush, there's

2357
01:06:27,610 --> 01:06:28,550
bluebunch wheatgrass, but

2358
01:06:28,550 --> 01:06:30,030
they're not eating the bluebunch

2359
01:06:30,030 --> 01:06:31,010
wheatgrass, which is a really

2360
01:06:31,010 --> 01:06:32,090
good grass. I have bricks

2361
01:06:32,090 --> 01:06:33,550
bluebunch wheatgrass at 22.

2362
01:06:34,730 --> 01:06:35,630
You know, at the right time of

2363
01:06:35,630 --> 01:06:36,590
year, early in spring,

2364
01:06:37,090 --> 01:06:38,309
when it's really coming pre

2365
01:06:38,309 --> 01:06:39,110
-boot stage,

2366
01:06:39,369 --> 01:06:40,690
you know, 22 bricks.

2367
01:06:43,329 --> 01:06:45,269
And I'm like, that grass,

2368
01:06:45,630 --> 01:06:46,769
that blue bunch wheatgrass is

2369
01:06:46,769 --> 01:06:48,269
running 22 bricks, but they're

2370
01:06:48,269 --> 01:06:49,070
grazing air.

2371
01:06:49,469 --> 01:06:50,269
What

2372
01:06:50,219 --> 01:06:51,239
is going on?

2373
01:06:52,989 --> 01:06:53,969
So I go over there and see what

2374
01:06:53,969 --> 01:06:54,769
they're doing.

2375
01:06:57,289 --> 01:06:58,449
And I see that they're grazing

2376
01:06:58,449 --> 01:06:59,429
this plant that's almost

2377
01:06:59,429 --> 01:07:01,210
invisible. It's just this wispy

2378
01:07:01,210 --> 01:07:03,010
little plant about, you know,

2379
01:07:03,750 --> 01:07:04,690
10 centimeters high.

2380
01:07:07,000 --> 01:07:08,440
It's got these tiny, tiny little

2381
01:07:08,440 --> 01:07:09,659
white flowers on top.

2382
01:07:10,909 --> 01:07:12,030
And I know what it is.

2383
01:07:12,130 --> 01:07:13,210
It's called Erin area.

2384
01:07:13,690 --> 01:07:14,490
It

2385
01:07:15,760 --> 01:07:17,079
really likes these low desert

2386
01:07:17,079 --> 01:07:18,300
environments and

2387
01:07:18,960 --> 01:07:20,019
they're sweeping it up.

2388
01:07:20,099 --> 01:07:21,239
They just hold their tongue out

2389
01:07:21,239 --> 01:07:22,320
and sweep it up.

2390
01:07:22,519 --> 01:07:24,079
It's easily broken and they

2391
01:07:24,079 --> 01:07:25,519
sweep it up and they just

2392
01:07:25,519 --> 01:07:27,320
they're just lawnmowers going

2393
01:07:27,320 --> 01:07:28,840
across this Erin area flat.

2394
01:07:30,389 --> 01:07:32,210
I told Fred Provenza about this

2395
01:07:32,210 --> 01:07:33,230
and he just started laughing at

2396
01:07:33,230 --> 01:07:34,949
me. And I said, do you know what

2397
01:07:34,949 --> 01:07:35,750
the plant was, Fred?

2398
01:07:35,750 --> 01:07:36,710
And he said, yeah, I bet it was

2399
01:07:36,710 --> 01:07:37,510
Erin area.

2400
01:07:37,860 --> 01:07:39,519
He knew he

2401
01:07:40,380 --> 01:07:41,180
knew.

2402
01:07:42,690 --> 01:07:43,490
Anyway,

2403
01:07:43,409 --> 01:07:44,210
um,

2404
01:07:44,309 --> 01:07:45,289
so I had to try it.

2405
01:07:45,329 --> 01:07:46,469
So I tried the same thing.

2406
01:07:46,550 --> 01:07:47,730
I just swept a bunch of it up

2407
01:07:47,730 --> 01:07:48,969
with my hand and stuck it in my

2408
01:07:48,969 --> 01:07:49,929
mouth. And guess what?

2409
01:07:51,369 --> 01:07:53,630
I mean, it tasted like maple

2410
01:07:53,630 --> 01:07:54,630
syrup, John.

2411
01:07:54,989 --> 01:07:55,789
I

2412
01:07:55,989 --> 01:07:57,949
mean, those little flowers, they

2413
01:07:57,949 --> 01:07:58,789
were maple syrup.

2414
01:07:59,239 --> 01:08:00,179
I bet they would bricks.

2415
01:08:00,340 --> 01:08:01,400
I should, I'm going to try

2416
01:08:01,400 --> 01:08:02,480
brixing him this spring.

2417
01:08:02,840 --> 01:08:04,550
I bet they would bricks at like

2418
01:08:04,550 --> 01:08:05,350
24.

2419
01:08:05,800 --> 01:08:06,699
They are that sweet.

2420
01:08:06,800 --> 01:08:07,940
They are that sweet.

2421
01:08:08,099 --> 01:08:09,840
And these animals knew it, you

2422
01:08:09,840 --> 01:08:10,719
know, and, but they're picking

2423
01:08:10,719 --> 01:08:12,199
up all this other stuff with it.

2424
01:08:12,260 --> 01:08:13,060
That's what's amazing.

2425
01:08:13,019 --> 01:08:13,820
You know,

2426
01:08:13,519 --> 01:08:14,320
yes,

2427
01:08:15,670 --> 01:08:16,470
it's,

2428
01:08:16,729 --> 01:08:17,529
sugar,

2429
01:08:17,550 --> 01:08:18,869
it's maple syrup,

2430
01:08:19,210 --> 01:08:20,789
but it's got a side of

2431
01:08:21,590 --> 01:08:23,729
all the plant compound diversity

2432
01:08:23,729 --> 01:08:26,760
that we can't even begin to get

2433
01:08:27,449 --> 01:08:28,250
our mind around,

2434
01:08:28,729 --> 01:08:29,529
you know.

2435
01:08:29,920 --> 01:08:31,239
Stéphane Van Vliet, when he was

2436
01:08:31,239 --> 01:08:32,800
out there, he's stuffing plant

2437
01:08:32,800 --> 01:08:33,680
samples in test tubes.

2438
01:08:33,800 --> 01:08:34,899
I said, what are you doing?

2439
01:08:35,619 --> 01:08:36,760
He said, I'm throwing these on

2440
01:08:36,760 --> 01:08:37,560
dry ice.

2441
01:08:37,260 --> 01:08:38,439
I said, no, what are you doing?

2442
01:08:39,229 --> 01:08:40,729
And he said, I want to find out

2443
01:08:40,729 --> 01:08:42,069
what's in these plants and try

2444
01:08:42,069 --> 01:08:43,630
to trace it to what's in them,

2445
01:08:44,609 --> 01:08:45,649
because I want to see if it

2446
01:08:45,649 --> 01:08:46,449
changes.

2447
01:08:47,260 --> 01:08:49,079
from plant compound into beef.

2448
01:08:49,199 --> 01:08:50,420
And he did indeed find that.

2449
01:08:50,539 --> 01:08:52,220
Some of these plant compounds,

2450
01:08:52,680 --> 01:08:54,100
he felt like disappeared.

2451
01:08:55,000 --> 01:08:56,539
They already had been turned

2452
01:08:56,539 --> 01:08:57,880
into something different.

2453
01:08:58,220 --> 01:09:01,069
They were metabolized into

2454
01:09:01,069 --> 01:09:02,170
something now the animal can

2455
01:09:02,170 --> 01:09:02,970
use. Very specific.

2456
01:09:04,579 --> 01:09:07,140
So anyway, this whole

2457
01:09:07,140 --> 01:09:09,260
business has really underscored

2458
01:09:09,260 --> 01:09:10,079
to me the importance

2459
01:09:11,479 --> 01:09:13,800
of letting the cow be the cow

2460
01:09:13,800 --> 01:09:15,159
and letting them make the

2461
01:09:15,159 --> 01:09:16,119
vegetative choices.

2462
01:09:16,300 --> 01:09:17,819
You know, even in grazing, even

2463
01:09:17,819 --> 01:09:19,260
in regenerative grazing, I see

2464
01:09:19,260 --> 01:09:20,060
this,

2465
01:09:20,119 --> 01:09:21,939
we can't be not, we can't be

2466
01:09:21,939 --> 01:09:22,739
selective.

2467
01:09:22,720 --> 01:09:23,840
We have to practice non

2468
01:09:23,840 --> 01:09:24,739
-selective grazing.

2469
01:09:25,279 --> 01:09:27,560
And there are truisms in there,

2470
01:09:27,680 --> 01:09:29,119
you know, but I would submit to

2471
01:09:29,119 --> 01:09:30,840
you that almost all grazing has

2472
01:09:30,840 --> 01:09:32,460
some aspect

2473
01:09:33,479 --> 01:09:35,600
of selectivity to it.

2474
01:09:36,079 --> 01:09:37,300
And I think we've lost that.

2475
01:09:37,399 --> 01:09:38,420
I mean, to me,

2476
01:09:39,159 --> 01:09:40,819
the test of selective grazing

2477
01:09:40,819 --> 01:09:42,560
versus non -selective is what if

2478
01:09:42,560 --> 01:09:43,360
we didn't graze it?

2479
01:09:44,010 --> 01:09:45,529
What would we see happen?

2480
01:09:46,109 --> 01:09:47,289
What plants would manifest?

2481
01:09:47,430 --> 01:09:48,529
What plants would dominate after

2482
01:09:48,529 --> 01:09:50,350
10 years of not grazing it?

2483
01:09:50,829 --> 01:09:52,069
And it's obviously different

2484
01:09:52,069 --> 01:09:53,409
than what the sword would look

2485
01:09:53,409 --> 01:09:54,789
like if we weren't grazing.

2486
01:09:55,069 --> 01:09:56,430
So, evidently, there's selection

2487
01:09:56,430 --> 01:09:57,230
going on,

2488
01:09:57,600 --> 01:09:58,400
you know.

2489
01:09:58,779 --> 01:10:00,000
So, I think what we need to do

2490
01:10:00,000 --> 01:10:00,800
is think about what our

2491
01:10:00,720 --> 01:10:01,520
objectives are.

2492
01:10:01,739 --> 01:10:02,779
And our objective is plant

2493
01:10:02,779 --> 01:10:03,579
diversity.

2494
01:10:03,640 --> 01:10:05,199
So, how can we create that?

2495
01:10:05,420 --> 01:10:06,220
And

2496
01:10:06,270 --> 01:10:08,310
how can we hack their palettes

2497
01:10:08,310 --> 01:10:09,409
to help us do that?

2498
01:10:10,069 --> 01:10:10,869
Exactly.

2499
01:10:11,130 --> 01:10:12,489
Because plant diversity is going

2500
01:10:12,489 --> 01:10:13,289
to contribute.

2501
01:10:13,829 --> 01:10:14,630
Plant

2502
01:10:15,420 --> 01:10:17,680
diversity will contribute to all

2503
01:10:17,680 --> 01:10:18,859
the medicinal compounds.

2504
01:10:19,220 --> 01:10:20,020
Yes.

2505
01:10:19,659 --> 01:10:20,460
Beef,

2506
01:10:20,300 --> 01:10:22,539
anti -inflammatory compounds,

2507
01:10:22,720 --> 01:10:24,260
antimicrobial, all the medicine.

2508
01:10:24,579 --> 01:10:25,420
The medicine is in the

2509
01:10:25,420 --> 01:10:26,220
diversity.

2510
01:10:26,449 --> 01:10:27,250
Exactly.

2511
01:10:27,279 --> 01:10:28,079
Exactly.

2512
01:10:28,550 --> 01:10:29,770
Glenn, this has already been

2513
01:10:29,770 --> 01:10:31,149
such a rich conversation.

2514
01:10:32,270 --> 01:10:33,609
I haven't, we haven't, you're,

2515
01:10:33,609 --> 01:10:34,529
you're very well known.

2516
01:10:34,729 --> 01:10:36,149
So, and people can find your

2517
01:10:36,149 --> 01:10:37,250
backstory. I'm not going to ask

2518
01:10:37,250 --> 01:10:38,409
for a history and backstory of

2519
01:10:38,409 --> 01:10:40,489
the ranch, but let's go to what

2520
01:10:40,489 --> 01:10:42,590
are, what are, what comes next?

2521
01:10:42,869 --> 01:10:43,869
What are the new things that

2522
01:10:43,869 --> 01:10:45,069
you're looking forward to

2523
01:10:45,069 --> 01:10:45,869
emerging?

2524
01:10:47,000 --> 01:10:47,939
So I

2525
01:10:48,760 --> 01:10:50,100
think that the biggest

2526
01:10:53,779 --> 01:10:55,399
place that's really, really

2527
01:10:55,399 --> 01:10:57,100
gotten rich for me just in the

2528
01:10:57,100 --> 01:10:59,380
past few months, John, is this

2529
01:10:59,380 --> 01:11:01,300
aspect, of stockmanship.

2530
01:11:01,760 --> 01:11:02,800
And, you know, we've always

2531
01:11:02,800 --> 01:11:03,840
practiced stockmanship.

2532
01:11:04,119 --> 01:11:05,300
So I didn't really think of it

2533
01:11:05,300 --> 01:11:06,359
in the context that

2534
01:11:07,250 --> 01:11:08,329
I'm thinking of it now.

2535
01:11:08,409 --> 01:11:10,869
This is one of those clobber

2536
01:11:10,869 --> 01:11:12,250
over the head moments, maybe.

2537
01:11:15,039 --> 01:11:16,720
And I was talking to a guy named

2538
01:11:16,720 --> 01:11:17,640
Dr.

2539
01:11:18,439 --> 01:11:19,460
Tom Nofsinger.

2540
01:11:19,899 --> 01:11:21,060
He's a veterinarian from

2541
01:11:21,060 --> 01:11:22,359
Nebraska. Have you heard of him?

2542
01:11:22,760 --> 01:11:23,560
Yes, I have.

2543
01:11:24,090 --> 01:11:25,189
Stockmanship expert,

2544
01:11:26,210 --> 01:11:27,010
but

2545
01:11:28,109 --> 01:11:29,590
I was actually first listening

2546
01:11:29,590 --> 01:11:31,170
to a podcast with him in it.

2547
01:11:31,569 --> 01:11:32,789
So this is a value of podcast

2548
01:11:32,789 --> 01:11:34,010
sometimes because they'll make

2549
01:11:34,010 --> 01:11:35,210
you think about something brand

2550
01:11:35,210 --> 01:11:36,010
new.

2551
01:11:36,130 --> 01:11:37,529
And I hope we can do that today.

2552
01:11:38,689 --> 01:11:39,489
And anyway, Dr.

2553
01:11:39,449 --> 01:11:41,430
Tom started talking about the

2554
01:11:41,430 --> 01:11:42,310
stockmanship thing.

2555
01:11:42,510 --> 01:11:44,289
And then he said this thing

2556
01:11:44,289 --> 01:11:45,529
about how your

2557
01:11:47,119 --> 01:11:48,100
left eye,

2558
01:11:48,630 --> 01:11:50,270
how an animal's left eye is

2559
01:11:50,270 --> 01:11:51,729
connected to the right

2560
01:11:51,729 --> 01:11:53,789
hemisphere and vice versa for

2561
01:11:53,789 --> 01:11:54,590
the right eye.

2562
01:11:56,479 --> 01:11:57,659
And I've been practicing Bud

2563
01:11:57,659 --> 01:11:59,319
Williams stuff for most of my

2564
01:11:59,729 --> 01:12:01,029
life. livestock career, but I

2565
01:12:01,029 --> 01:12:02,550
never knew this about the eye.

2566
01:12:02,729 --> 01:12:04,050
And it just so happens that that

2567
01:12:04,050 --> 01:12:05,810
right hemisphere is where

2568
01:12:05,810 --> 01:12:07,449
animals process fear of flight.

2569
01:12:09,920 --> 01:12:11,760
And so they got to evaluate with

2570
01:12:12,229 --> 01:12:13,350
their left eye first,

2571
01:12:13,960 --> 01:12:15,779
whether there's a fear of flight

2572
01:12:15,779 --> 01:12:17,579
concern to respond to.

2573
01:12:18,279 --> 01:12:19,720
That's their test area.

2574
01:12:20,180 --> 01:12:21,760
So that's why an animal turn

2575
01:12:21,760 --> 01:12:22,819
their head to you and look at

2576
01:12:22,819 --> 01:12:23,619
you directly.

2577
01:12:24,300 --> 01:12:26,300
If you approach them on the

2578
01:12:26,300 --> 01:12:27,100
right side,

2579
01:12:27,350 --> 01:12:28,189
they will always turn their

2580
01:12:28,189 --> 01:12:28,989
head.

2581
01:12:28,829 --> 01:12:29,770
And you'll be able to make them

2582
01:12:29,770 --> 01:12:31,670
do that just by getting into

2583
01:12:31,670 --> 01:12:32,789
their space. As soon as they

2584
01:12:32,789 --> 01:12:35,270
perceive that there's a chance

2585
01:12:35,270 --> 01:12:37,649
for stressful interaction here,

2586
01:12:38,270 --> 01:12:40,170
they want to now evaluate you

2587
01:12:40,170 --> 01:12:40,989
with their left eye.

2588
01:12:41,090 --> 01:12:42,090
So they will turn toward you.

2589
01:12:45,149 --> 01:12:46,310
So I didn't know any of this.

2590
01:12:46,350 --> 01:12:48,430
So I started trying it with my

2591
01:12:48,430 --> 01:12:49,230
daughter,

2592
01:12:49,909 --> 01:12:50,989
Melanie. And she thought, of

2593
01:12:50,989 --> 01:12:52,229
course, this was one of dad's

2594
01:12:52,229 --> 01:12:53,289
crazy ideas, you know.

2595
01:12:53,510 --> 01:12:55,779
And so we started handling these

2596
01:12:55,779 --> 01:12:56,880
cattle, trying to be

2597
01:12:56,880 --> 01:12:58,000
consistently in a

2598
01:12:58,000 --> 01:12:59,260
counterclockwise direction.

2599
01:13:02,640 --> 01:13:03,619
And it began to change

2600
01:13:03,619 --> 01:13:04,420
everything.

2601
01:13:05,909 --> 01:13:06,710
And,

2602
01:13:06,560 --> 01:13:07,800
you know, let me give you an

2603
01:13:07,800 --> 01:13:09,680
example. We were loading cattle

2604
01:13:09,680 --> 01:13:11,229
in gooseneck trailers,

2605
01:13:11,529 --> 01:13:12,329
and

2606
01:13:13,250 --> 01:13:15,189
I'm holding the gooseneck

2607
01:13:15,189 --> 01:13:16,729
trailer door in the right hand

2608
01:13:17,810 --> 01:13:18,970
and trying

2609
01:13:19,789 --> 01:13:21,789
to get these cattle to go past

2610
01:13:21,789 --> 01:13:23,590
me while they're looking at me

2611
01:13:23,590 --> 01:13:24,390
with the right eye.

2612
01:13:27,020 --> 01:13:28,560
And I'm trying to do some

2613
01:13:28,560 --> 01:13:29,760
movement to try to get those

2614
01:13:29,760 --> 01:13:30,819
cattle to go. They won't go in

2615
01:13:30,819 --> 01:13:32,279
the trailer because my trailer

2616
01:13:32,279 --> 01:13:33,779
is already fairly full.

2617
01:13:34,260 --> 01:13:35,239
I like to make it

2618
01:13:36,899 --> 01:13:38,600
all the way full, not stuffed.

2619
01:13:39,100 --> 01:13:40,220
I mean, I like cattle to be able

2620
01:13:40,220 --> 01:13:41,439
to move around, shift weight.

2621
01:13:42,039 --> 01:13:43,739
But I like them pretty well

2622
01:13:43,739 --> 01:13:44,539
stuffed,

2623
01:13:44,579 --> 01:13:45,439
you know, filled in there,

2624
01:13:45,439 --> 01:13:46,960
because if we hit the brakes or

2625
01:13:46,960 --> 01:13:48,100
something like that or hit a

2626
01:13:48,100 --> 01:13:48,900
curve bad,

2627
01:13:49,039 --> 01:13:50,159
you don't want cattle falling

2628
01:13:50,159 --> 01:13:51,840
over and other cattle landing on

2629
01:13:51,840 --> 01:13:52,880
them. You want them to be able

2630
01:13:52,880 --> 01:13:54,279
to use each other's body to

2631
01:13:54,279 --> 01:13:55,079
steady themselves.

2632
01:13:55,340 --> 01:13:56,140
So

2633
01:13:56,260 --> 01:13:57,060
anyway,

2634
01:14:00,449 --> 01:14:01,569
I then said to Melanie, I

2635
01:14:01,569 --> 01:14:02,609
couldn't get those last four

2636
01:14:02,609 --> 01:14:03,409
head loaded.

2637
01:14:03,939 --> 01:14:05,159
And I said, could you just hold

2638
01:14:05,159 --> 01:14:06,579
the gate here? And I go over on

2639
01:14:06,579 --> 01:14:07,380
the other side

2640
01:14:08,329 --> 01:14:09,569
and work the left side.

2641
01:14:11,329 --> 01:14:12,689
And anyway, John, it was three

2642
01:14:12,689 --> 01:14:13,489
seconds.

2643
01:14:13,470 --> 01:14:14,609
I mean, I just moved back and

2644
01:14:14,609 --> 01:14:15,770
forth a little bit on that left

2645
01:14:15,770 --> 01:14:16,570
side,

2646
01:14:17,189 --> 01:14:19,449
interacted with that left eye.

2647
01:14:20,170 --> 01:14:21,510
And they just looked at me and

2648
01:14:21,510 --> 01:14:22,550
just loaded in trailer.

2649
01:14:22,930 --> 01:14:24,050
And Melanie brings a trailer

2650
01:14:24,050 --> 01:14:24,949
gate over and click.

2651
01:14:25,109 --> 01:14:26,250
So anyway, I called Tom

2652
01:14:26,250 --> 01:14:27,170
Nofsinger about that.

2653
01:14:27,250 --> 01:14:28,890
I said, Doc, I got to talk to

2654
01:14:28,890 --> 01:14:29,690
you about this thing.

2655
01:14:29,550 --> 01:14:30,630
And he starts laughing about

2656
01:14:30,630 --> 01:14:31,750
laughing at me.

2657
01:14:31,810 --> 01:14:32,610
And I said, what are you

2658
01:14:32,449 --> 01:14:33,989
laughing at? He said, I think I

2659
01:14:33,989 --> 01:14:34,789
know what you're going to talk

2660
01:14:34,750 --> 01:14:35,550
about.

2661
01:14:36,199 --> 01:14:37,399
And I told him about the

2662
01:14:37,399 --> 01:14:38,199
trailer.

2663
01:14:39,739 --> 01:14:40,539
And I said,

2664
01:14:41,060 --> 01:14:42,000
I mean, they really started

2665
01:14:42,000 --> 01:14:43,020
laughing. And I said, what are

2666
01:14:43,020 --> 01:14:43,820
you laughing at?

2667
01:14:43,520 --> 01:14:44,320
He said, go on.

2668
01:14:44,359 --> 01:14:45,300
I think I know what you're going

2669
01:14:45,300 --> 01:14:46,159
to say. And I said,

2670
01:14:46,779 --> 01:14:47,600
OK, here's the deal.

2671
01:14:48,039 --> 01:14:50,560
I think every trailer door in

2672
01:14:50,560 --> 01:14:52,260
America has been hung on the

2673
01:14:52,260 --> 01:14:53,060
wrong side.

2674
01:14:54,020 --> 01:14:54,820
And

2675
01:14:55,189 --> 01:14:56,890
he said, I think you're right.

2676
01:14:56,970 --> 01:14:58,029
And then he laughed some more.

2677
01:14:58,149 --> 01:14:59,109
And we talked a little bit more

2678
01:14:59,109 --> 01:15:00,670
and laughed some more and hung

2679
01:15:00,670 --> 01:15:02,010
up the phone. But anyway, those

2680
01:15:02,010 --> 01:15:02,970
kind of things,

2681
01:15:03,640 --> 01:15:05,500
John, this is only a few months

2682
01:15:05,500 --> 01:15:07,300
ago that I just picked up this

2683
01:15:07,300 --> 01:15:08,100
nuance.

2684
01:15:08,159 --> 01:15:10,319
But it's opened a door for me

2685
01:15:11,529 --> 01:15:14,689
to how to respectfully handle

2686
01:15:14,689 --> 01:15:15,489
these cattle.

2687
01:15:15,939 --> 01:15:17,619
Even on the range, if I'm on

2688
01:15:17,619 --> 01:15:19,420
horseback, I realized,

2689
01:15:20,279 --> 01:15:21,819
I went in my mind's eye and just

2690
01:15:21,819 --> 01:15:23,220
thought about how we were

2691
01:15:24,850 --> 01:15:28,350
actioning ourselves upon these

2692
01:15:28,350 --> 01:15:29,510
cattle with pressure and

2693
01:15:29,510 --> 01:15:31,310
release, and how much more

2694
01:15:31,310 --> 01:15:32,909
effective we could be if we

2695
01:15:32,909 --> 01:15:34,470
considered those sorts of

2696
01:15:34,470 --> 01:15:36,770
things, those nuances that

2697
01:15:37,430 --> 01:15:38,449
would just make them perform

2698
01:15:38,449 --> 01:15:39,250
that much better.

2699
01:15:39,630 --> 01:15:40,670
And when we do that,

2700
01:15:40,970 --> 01:15:43,630
we afford them better stress

2701
01:15:43,630 --> 01:15:44,710
-free environments to make

2702
01:15:44,710 --> 01:15:45,729
nutritional choice.

2703
01:15:47,869 --> 01:15:48,989
Like, let me give you this.

2704
01:15:49,109 --> 01:15:50,609
I found this weird esoteric

2705
01:15:50,609 --> 01:15:52,569
paper that talked about how

2706
01:15:53,939 --> 01:15:55,460
animals that

2707
01:15:57,180 --> 01:15:57,980
you

2708
01:16:00,479 --> 01:16:02,380
involve yourself in the right

2709
01:16:02,380 --> 01:16:05,220
hand side of their head by

2710
01:16:05,220 --> 01:16:07,699
entering their space, by

2711
01:16:07,699 --> 01:16:09,140
entering that flight zone,

2712
01:16:10,739 --> 01:16:11,739
if they get their head down

2713
01:16:11,739 --> 01:16:12,939
grazing and they don't raise

2714
01:16:12,939 --> 01:16:13,739
their head up

2715
01:16:14,090 --> 01:16:14,949
when you do that,

2716
01:16:15,390 --> 01:16:16,190
because you've built a

2717
01:16:16,170 --> 01:16:17,470
relationship of trust with that

2718
01:16:17,470 --> 01:16:18,270
animal already.

2719
01:16:19,630 --> 01:16:21,010
Those animals are generally one

2720
01:16:21,010 --> 01:16:23,329
body condition score heavier

2721
01:16:23,329 --> 01:16:24,130
than

2722
01:16:24,489 --> 01:16:25,970
ones that would have to raise

2723
01:16:25,970 --> 01:16:27,069
their head and turn toward you.

2724
01:16:27,329 --> 01:16:29,850
So John what that means is one

2725
01:16:29,850 --> 01:16:31,289
one body condition score is

2726
01:16:31,289 --> 01:16:33,529
about 85 pounds Wow, that's

2727
01:16:33,529 --> 01:16:35,630
that's they didn't have no fight

2728
01:16:35,630 --> 01:16:37,569
-or -flight response They don't

2729
01:16:37,569 --> 01:16:38,550
they don't because they're used

2730
01:16:38,550 --> 01:16:39,350
to you,

2731
01:16:39,340 --> 01:16:40,819
you know You still can move them

2732
01:16:40,819 --> 01:16:42,439
and action on them to create

2733
01:16:42,439 --> 01:16:44,720
movement and direct them to new

2734
01:16:44,720 --> 01:16:45,960
ground Those are important

2735
01:16:45,960 --> 01:16:47,279
features. I don't want docile

2736
01:16:47,279 --> 01:16:48,079
cattle.

2737
01:16:48,340 --> 01:16:49,859
I just want cattle that know

2738
01:16:49,859 --> 01:16:51,760
that we respect them.

2739
01:16:52,960 --> 01:16:53,760
Like, you know, this whole

2740
01:16:53,659 --> 01:16:54,680
business of

2741
01:16:55,479 --> 01:16:57,979
creating cattle disposition that

2742
01:16:57,979 --> 01:17:00,140
you can basically pet and handle

2743
01:17:00,140 --> 01:17:02,100
their calves. We don't agree

2744
01:17:02,100 --> 01:17:02,920
with any of those things.

2745
01:17:03,039 --> 01:17:04,560
We work with wolves, John.

2746
01:17:05,420 --> 01:17:07,079
These cattle have to be alert.

2747
01:17:07,319 --> 01:17:08,119
They have to be paying

2748
01:17:07,979 --> 01:17:08,779
attention.

2749
01:17:08,800 --> 01:17:09,939
And plus we're moving them

2750
01:17:09,939 --> 01:17:12,539
across rangelands for miles a

2751
01:17:12,539 --> 01:17:15,479
day. We put GPSs in our

2752
01:17:15,479 --> 01:17:17,000
saddlebag and found out that

2753
01:17:17,000 --> 01:17:19,920
we're traveling 600 miles a year

2754
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:21,640
with these animals on their

2755
01:17:21,640 --> 01:17:23,060
grazing journey.

2756
01:17:24,060 --> 01:17:25,460
So that means they have to be

2757
01:17:25,460 --> 01:17:26,260
actionable.

2758
01:17:26,340 --> 01:17:27,699
They have to be alert.

2759
01:17:27,899 --> 01:17:29,960
They have to be ready to take

2760
01:17:29,960 --> 01:17:31,539
energy from us and

2761
01:17:32,079 --> 01:17:34,220
respond to release and pressure

2762
01:17:34,220 --> 01:17:36,100
release is what we do all day on

2763
01:17:36,100 --> 01:17:36,900
horseback.

2764
01:17:36,859 --> 01:17:38,479
So we don't want dull cattle.

2765
01:17:39,239 --> 01:17:40,500
So as a result, we don't even

2766
01:17:40,500 --> 01:17:41,460
tag our calves anymore

2767
01:17:41,829 --> 01:17:43,569
because they these cows will

2768
01:17:43,569 --> 01:17:44,369
kill you.

2769
01:17:45,189 --> 01:17:46,149
You know, they take no

2770
01:17:46,149 --> 01:17:47,250
prisoners. They would just I've

2771
01:17:47,250 --> 01:17:48,810
been rolled by cows and it's

2772
01:17:48,810 --> 01:17:49,610
painful.

2773
01:17:49,270 --> 01:17:50,329
My brother ended up in a

2774
01:17:50,329 --> 01:17:51,449
hospital for a while, broken

2775
01:17:51,449 --> 01:17:52,529
ribs, getting rolled by a cow.

2776
01:17:52,829 --> 01:17:54,229
So, you know, this whole

2777
01:17:55,439 --> 01:17:57,039
generation of cattle raisers has

2778
01:17:57,039 --> 01:17:59,640
said, we want calm dispositions.

2779
01:18:01,039 --> 01:18:03,159
And I'm over here saying, no, we

2780
01:18:03,159 --> 01:18:04,680
want cattle that are responsive

2781
01:18:04,680 --> 01:18:05,480
and

2782
01:18:05,909 --> 01:18:07,710
we're going to respect them for

2783
01:18:07,989 --> 01:18:08,789
who they are.

2784
01:18:09,170 --> 01:18:10,710
So anyway, we don't like those

2785
01:18:10,710 --> 01:18:11,510
kind of cattle.

2786
01:18:11,649 --> 01:18:13,090
But what I do want is somebody

2787
01:18:13,090 --> 01:18:14,029
who

2788
01:18:14,369 --> 01:18:16,890
has the determination in their

2789
01:18:16,890 --> 01:18:18,210
head that they can trust me

2790
01:18:18,210 --> 01:18:19,250
because I respect them

2791
01:18:20,109 --> 01:18:22,510
so that when I move into their

2792
01:18:22,510 --> 01:18:23,310
flight zone,

2793
01:18:23,789 --> 01:18:24,949
just a little bit with my horse,

2794
01:18:24,970 --> 01:18:25,909
they're still grazing.

2795
01:18:26,460 --> 01:18:28,000
They're watching me, they see

2796
01:18:28,000 --> 01:18:28,960
me, they see it's me,

2797
01:18:29,960 --> 01:18:31,680
and they don't respond by

2798
01:18:31,680 --> 01:18:32,600
stopping grazing.

2799
01:18:34,119 --> 01:18:35,000
And as a result,

2800
01:18:35,659 --> 01:18:37,140
I'm a body condition score for

2801
01:18:37,140 --> 01:18:38,840
it. I mean, how much on a $4

2802
01:18:38,840 --> 01:18:40,020
market, what are we $85?

2803
01:18:40,689 --> 01:18:41,489
You know, we're,

2804
01:18:41,489 --> 01:18:44,050
we're, we're 340 bucks right

2805
01:18:44,050 --> 01:18:44,850
there, right?

2806
01:18:44,930 --> 01:18:45,730
That's a big deal.

2807
01:18:46,260 --> 01:18:47,640
It's a huge deal.

2808
01:18:47,939 --> 01:18:49,560
So this stuff actually makes so

2809
01:18:49,560 --> 01:18:50,360
much,

2810
01:18:50,239 --> 01:18:51,199
so much sense,

2811
01:18:51,579 --> 01:18:53,539
you know, in terms of not only

2812
01:18:53,539 --> 01:18:54,340
production,

2813
01:18:54,489 --> 01:18:55,289
but profitability.

2814
01:18:55,189 --> 01:18:56,649
These are freebies.

2815
01:18:56,689 --> 01:18:58,069
These are things that are so

2816
01:18:58,069 --> 01:18:59,729
easy to achieve once we've built

2817
01:18:59,729 --> 01:19:00,829
that trust with these cattle.

2818
01:19:01,130 --> 01:19:02,890
Now, what if we work with them

2819
01:19:02,890 --> 01:19:04,670
by encouraging them to go

2820
01:19:05,869 --> 01:19:07,170
left side counterclockwise,

2821
01:19:07,770 --> 01:19:08,649
you know, when we're, you know,

2822
01:19:08,689 --> 01:19:09,670
I see so many handling

2823
01:19:09,670 --> 01:19:10,949
facilities now that are built

2824
01:19:10,949 --> 01:19:11,750
backwards.

2825
01:19:11,949 --> 01:19:12,750
I mean, they've got Temple

2826
01:19:12,729 --> 01:19:13,909
Grandin elements,

2827
01:19:14,420 --> 01:19:15,640
you know, they got the curves

2828
01:19:15,640 --> 01:19:16,440
and,

2829
01:19:16,279 --> 01:19:18,420
but they've laid out the key

2830
01:19:18,420 --> 01:19:20,500
chute that fills the alley

2831
01:19:20,500 --> 01:19:21,359
backwards,

2832
01:19:21,710 --> 01:19:23,210
it makes those cattle go counter

2833
01:19:23,210 --> 01:19:24,869
go clockwise instead of

2834
01:19:24,869 --> 01:19:25,670
counterclockwise.

2835
01:19:25,869 --> 01:19:27,289
And as a result, we're creating

2836
01:19:27,289 --> 01:19:28,590
we're just inciting stress

2837
01:19:28,590 --> 01:19:29,770
before they even get to the

2838
01:19:29,770 --> 01:19:30,729
chute, or they're going to

2839
01:19:30,729 --> 01:19:31,810
receive all kinds of stress.

2840
01:19:32,329 --> 01:19:35,189
So I actually talked to my

2841
01:19:36,170 --> 01:19:37,649
You can see I get crazy on this

2842
01:19:37,649 --> 01:19:38,449
stuff.

2843
01:19:38,250 --> 01:19:39,430
I talked to my crew and I said,

2844
01:19:39,710 --> 01:19:40,949
get the backhoe in the barn

2845
01:19:40,949 --> 01:19:43,640
there and rip down that whole

2846
01:19:43,640 --> 01:19:44,680
portion of our shoot.

2847
01:19:45,140 --> 01:19:46,100
We're going to make these cattle

2848
01:19:46,100 --> 01:19:47,079
flow counterclockwise,

2849
01:19:47,439 --> 01:19:48,239
you know, when I started

2850
01:19:48,000 --> 01:19:49,119
learning all this stuff months

2851
01:19:49,119 --> 01:19:49,920
ago.

2852
01:19:50,140 --> 01:19:50,940
And so we did.

2853
01:19:51,449 --> 01:19:52,689
And they thought this guy's

2854
01:19:53,329 --> 01:19:54,310
you know, Glenn's got a screw

2855
01:19:54,310 --> 01:19:55,850
loose, you know, got gray hair,

2856
01:19:56,170 --> 01:19:57,210
you John, you don't have any of

2857
01:19:57,210 --> 01:19:58,250
that. So you're, you're cool.

2858
01:19:58,510 --> 01:19:59,510
I do. I just hide it.

2859
01:20:00,989 --> 01:20:02,470
Oh, you just got nothing.

2860
01:20:02,689 --> 01:20:04,250
Those are distinguished looks.

2861
01:20:04,970 --> 01:20:06,310
Very distinguished looking.

2862
01:20:06,810 --> 01:20:08,170
But anyway, I'm all white now.

2863
01:20:08,369 --> 01:20:09,250
And my kids are like this.

2864
01:20:09,869 --> 01:20:10,829
Yeah, he's getting old.

2865
01:20:11,170 --> 01:20:11,970
He's getting old.

2866
01:20:13,909 --> 01:20:14,710
So anyway,

2867
01:20:15,529 --> 01:20:16,329
anyway,

2868
01:20:16,979 --> 01:20:19,159
I had him turn over this whole

2869
01:20:19,159 --> 01:20:20,420
thing. We put a bud box in here,

2870
01:20:20,539 --> 01:20:22,020
Bud Williams box, and we made

2871
01:20:22,020 --> 01:20:22,920
sure that these cattle were

2872
01:20:22,920 --> 01:20:23,920
always going to flow

2873
01:20:23,920 --> 01:20:24,720
counterclockwise.

2874
01:20:25,239 --> 01:20:26,520
Anyway, they came in a chute.

2875
01:20:27,180 --> 01:20:29,079
We had to preg check 250 cows a

2876
01:20:29,079 --> 01:20:29,880
few weeks ago.

2877
01:20:31,909 --> 01:20:33,529
And I have never seen this

2878
01:20:33,529 --> 01:20:34,789
before in my life, John.

2879
01:20:34,800 --> 01:20:36,500
I've never seen it before.

2880
01:20:38,800 --> 01:20:40,020
250 range cows.

2881
01:20:40,079 --> 01:20:41,399
And these are not docile

2882
01:20:41,399 --> 01:20:42,199
animals.

2883
01:20:42,180 --> 01:20:43,939
They're not. I mean, if you're

2884
01:20:43,939 --> 01:20:46,180
alone in a crowd with them and

2885
01:20:46,180 --> 01:20:47,600
you incite them, they will take

2886
01:20:47,600 --> 01:20:48,899
you. They will even without a

2887
01:20:48,899 --> 01:20:49,800
calf. They will take they'll

2888
01:20:49,800 --> 01:20:50,600
come after you.

2889
01:20:50,500 --> 01:20:51,460
They'll send you over the fence,

2890
01:20:51,520 --> 01:20:52,320
you know.

2891
01:20:52,430 --> 01:20:53,649
So you got to respect them

2892
01:20:54,060 --> 01:20:55,260
and you got to you got to run

2893
01:20:55,260 --> 01:20:56,500
them in a way that they want to

2894
01:20:56,500 --> 01:20:58,359
be run. And this left side

2895
01:20:58,359 --> 01:21:00,619
counterclockwise thing is a way

2896
01:21:00,619 --> 01:21:01,420
to respect them.

2897
01:21:01,819 --> 01:21:03,319
I got them coming into the shoot

2898
01:21:03,319 --> 01:21:04,119
there.

2899
01:21:05,060 --> 01:21:07,060
And the vets on one side, he's

2900
01:21:07,060 --> 01:21:08,739
pregging, his wife's running a

2901
01:21:08,739 --> 01:21:09,539
shoot on the other.

2902
01:21:10,279 --> 01:21:12,890
I'm just running body position

2903
01:21:12,890 --> 01:21:14,270
to get him to come into the

2904
01:21:14,270 --> 01:21:15,070
shoot.

2905
01:21:17,159 --> 01:21:18,140
And they're flowing really

2906
01:21:18,140 --> 01:21:18,940
nicely.

2907
01:21:19,869 --> 01:21:21,329
We're pregging these cows, and

2908
01:21:21,329 --> 01:21:22,310
I've never done this before.

2909
01:21:22,770 --> 01:21:24,729
It's 45 seconds to 50 seconds

2910
01:21:24,729 --> 01:21:25,909
per cow. They're flying through

2911
01:21:25,909 --> 01:21:26,710
there.

2912
01:21:26,520 --> 01:21:28,300
For a full arm preg check, this

2913
01:21:28,300 --> 01:21:29,479
isn't, you know, ultrasound.

2914
01:21:29,699 --> 01:21:31,960
This is a full arm palpation

2915
01:21:31,960 --> 01:21:32,760
preg check.

2916
01:21:33,579 --> 01:21:35,560
45 seconds, 50 seconds per cow.

2917
01:21:36,100 --> 01:21:37,840
And what was crazy is I've never

2918
01:21:37,840 --> 01:21:39,800
seen this before, but after we

2919
01:21:39,800 --> 01:21:42,510
set up a left flow, a

2920
01:21:42,510 --> 01:21:44,529
counterclockwise motion in that

2921
01:21:44,529 --> 01:21:45,529
shoot with these cattle,

2922
01:21:47,989 --> 01:21:50,050
they started walking out of the

2923
01:21:50,050 --> 01:21:51,130
head catch in the shoot.

2924
01:21:51,250 --> 01:21:52,369
We've never seen that before.

2925
01:21:52,470 --> 01:21:53,270
They always like,

2926
01:21:53,829 --> 01:21:56,090
and they fly out there.

2927
01:21:56,189 --> 01:21:57,689
You just open this thing, they

2928
01:21:57,689 --> 01:21:58,489
step out.

2929
01:21:58,489 --> 01:21:59,909
In fact, four of these cows

2930
01:21:59,909 --> 01:22:00,949
turned around

2931
01:22:01,810 --> 01:22:05,220
15 feet away and watched us to

2932
01:22:05,380 --> 01:22:06,470
see what we're doing.

2933
01:22:06,220 --> 01:22:07,460
never seen it before.

2934
01:22:07,659 --> 01:22:08,840
These are wild range cows.

2935
01:22:08,939 --> 01:22:10,060
These are not docile

2936
01:22:10,819 --> 01:22:12,359
Holsteins.

2937
01:22:12,659 --> 01:22:13,979
These are animals you cannot

2938
01:22:13,979 --> 01:22:15,840
touch. There's no way you're

2939
01:22:15,840 --> 01:22:16,640
going to touch them.

2940
01:22:16,659 --> 01:22:17,600
If you touch your baby,

2941
01:22:17,939 --> 01:22:19,359
they will touch you, but

2942
01:22:20,279 --> 01:22:21,760
they will touch you to make you

2943
01:22:21,760 --> 01:22:22,659
part of the soil.

2944
01:22:26,239 --> 01:22:27,720
Anyway, I never saw this before.

2945
01:22:27,899 --> 01:22:30,000
It's just because we've created

2946
01:22:30,060 --> 01:22:30,920
this respect.

2947
01:22:32,079 --> 01:22:33,960
And I'm just thinking now lately

2948
01:22:33,960 --> 01:22:35,840
how much that

2949
01:22:37,180 --> 01:22:38,840
can influence every aspect of

2950
01:22:38,840 --> 01:22:39,640
our operation.

2951
01:22:39,819 --> 01:22:41,380
It's how these cattle will

2952
01:22:41,380 --> 01:22:42,180
finish.

2953
01:22:42,300 --> 01:22:43,939
It's how they'll perceive

2954
01:22:43,939 --> 01:22:45,399
nutritional choice and be able

2955
01:22:45,399 --> 01:22:46,199
to self -medicate.

2956
01:22:47,380 --> 01:22:49,380
It's a whole plethora of things

2957
01:22:49,380 --> 01:22:50,220
that come in

2958
01:22:50,659 --> 01:22:52,640
because we've enabled them

2959
01:22:53,239 --> 01:22:54,220
to be

2960
01:22:54,779 --> 01:22:56,239
what they were created to be.

2961
01:22:56,779 --> 01:22:58,079
It's just like when we get out

2962
01:22:58,079 --> 01:22:58,979
of the way with soils.

2963
01:22:59,479 --> 01:23:01,399
I see this as a huge parallel.

2964
01:23:02,100 --> 01:23:03,899
When we create biodiversity

2965
01:23:03,899 --> 01:23:04,699
above ground,

2966
01:23:06,510 --> 01:23:08,130
we're not creating biodiversity

2967
01:23:08,130 --> 01:23:09,529
intentionally below ground.

2968
01:23:10,260 --> 01:23:11,199
We're not saying, oh, we're

2969
01:23:11,199 --> 01:23:13,319
going to create microorganisms

2970
01:23:13,319 --> 01:23:14,380
down there. We're going to get

2971
01:23:14,380 --> 01:23:16,140
more arbuscular mycorrhizae.

2972
01:23:16,779 --> 01:23:18,359
We're going to get a soil

2973
01:23:19,119 --> 01:23:20,779
biology that kicks butt and

2974
01:23:20,779 --> 01:23:22,020
we're going to Haney at 50,

2975
01:23:22,619 --> 01:23:24,619
and we're going to get 12 %

2976
01:23:24,619 --> 01:23:25,560
organic matter.

2977
01:23:25,699 --> 01:23:26,960
You know, we won't, we don't go

2978
01:23:26,960 --> 01:23:28,039
in there saying that, but

2979
01:23:28,039 --> 01:23:28,840
instead we say,

2980
01:23:29,159 --> 01:23:30,039
no, we need biodiversity.

2981
01:23:30,479 --> 01:23:31,359
That's the first thing we need

2982
01:23:31,359 --> 01:23:32,159
above ground. We need

2983
01:23:32,140 --> 01:23:33,100
biodiversity. So we're going to

2984
01:23:33,100 --> 01:23:33,900
work for that.

2985
01:23:34,079 --> 01:23:35,319
So there's no way we're

2986
01:23:35,319 --> 01:23:36,579
engineering what's happening in

2987
01:23:36,579 --> 01:23:37,380
soil below.

2988
01:23:37,770 --> 01:23:39,630
So instead we almost get out of

2989
01:23:39,630 --> 01:23:40,869
the way and say, we're going to

2990
01:23:40,869 --> 01:23:42,289
provide that soil everything it

2991
01:23:42,289 --> 01:23:43,090
needs to win.

2992
01:23:43,750 --> 01:23:44,890
And we're going to get out of

2993
01:23:44,890 --> 01:23:45,810
the way and see what happens.

2994
01:23:45,930 --> 01:23:46,730
And I,

2995
01:23:47,069 --> 01:23:48,050
I think in regenerative

2996
01:23:48,050 --> 01:23:48,850
agriculture,

2997
01:23:48,930 --> 01:23:51,390
we tend to say that with things

2998
01:23:51,390 --> 01:23:52,190
like soil,

2999
01:23:52,630 --> 01:23:53,850
things like plant diversity.

3000
01:23:55,069 --> 01:23:56,310
But what if we got out of the

3001
01:23:56,310 --> 01:23:57,210
way and said,

3002
01:23:57,670 --> 01:23:58,470
hey, Cal,

3003
01:23:59,229 --> 01:24:00,829
do what you were designed to do,

3004
01:24:00,890 --> 01:24:01,890
and we're going to provide you

3005
01:24:01,890 --> 01:24:02,909
all the means and

3006
01:24:03,250 --> 01:24:04,649
our power to make that happen?

3007
01:24:05,409 --> 01:24:06,210
Oh, that's beautiful.

3008
01:24:06,850 --> 01:24:07,650
You know what I mean?

3009
01:24:07,989 --> 01:24:11,250
I even see people, their

3010
01:24:11,250 --> 01:24:12,369
cattle are drinking out of mud

3011
01:24:12,369 --> 01:24:13,170
holes.

3012
01:24:14,520 --> 01:24:15,640
And just

3013
01:24:16,239 --> 01:24:17,840
this one little thing, just one

3014
01:24:17,840 --> 01:24:19,560
little hack of saying, no, no,

3015
01:24:19,619 --> 01:24:20,420
no, no, no, no, no.

3016
01:24:20,640 --> 01:24:22,020
we're going to ensure crystal

3017
01:24:22,170 --> 01:24:23,430
clean water.

3018
01:24:24,869 --> 01:24:26,109
Because crystal clean water,

3019
01:24:26,289 --> 01:24:27,090
when you're running a

3020
01:24:26,810 --> 01:24:27,610
fermentation,

3021
01:24:27,470 --> 01:24:29,850
say you're a brewer and you're

3022
01:24:29,850 --> 01:24:30,729
running a brewery

3023
01:24:31,109 --> 01:24:33,739
and you bring a truckload of mud

3024
01:24:33,739 --> 01:24:35,180
water over to the brewery and

3025
01:24:35,180 --> 01:24:36,539
say, hey, I got your water for

3026
01:24:36,539 --> 01:24:37,340
you.

3027
01:24:37,479 --> 01:24:38,319
They're going to think you're

3028
01:24:38,319 --> 01:24:39,119
nuts.

3029
01:24:39,260 --> 01:24:40,100
They're going to think, dump

3030
01:24:40,100 --> 01:24:41,779
that stuff. We need the crystal

3031
01:24:41,779 --> 01:24:42,579
clear stuff.

3032
01:24:43,199 --> 01:24:44,119
We need the Rocky Mountain

3033
01:24:44,119 --> 01:24:44,920
spring water.

3034
01:24:45,390 --> 01:24:47,229
We don't want to go to Lake Erie

3035
01:24:47,800 --> 01:24:49,199
for our brewery water.

3036
01:24:49,359 --> 01:24:50,699
We're not going to do that.

3037
01:24:50,840 --> 01:24:52,239
There's sludge residue in the

3038
01:24:52,239 --> 01:24:53,380
bottom of Lake Erie, and the

3039
01:24:53,380 --> 01:24:54,180
wind's been blowing.

3040
01:24:54,239 --> 01:24:55,100
Absolutely not.

3041
01:24:55,180 --> 01:24:56,100
That's the stupidest thing I've

3042
01:24:56,100 --> 01:24:56,900
ever heard in my life.

3043
01:24:57,020 --> 01:24:58,340
Just for the record,

3044
01:24:58,659 --> 01:25:00,220
since I live 20 miles from the

3045
01:25:00,220 --> 01:25:01,020
lake,

3046
01:25:01,260 --> 01:25:04,689
Lake Erie is no longer the news

3047
01:25:04,689 --> 01:25:06,229
headlines of the 1980s.

3048
01:25:07,430 --> 01:25:08,829
Lake Erie is clean.

3049
01:25:08,989 --> 01:25:10,449
It's clear. It's clear as a

3050
01:25:10,449 --> 01:25:11,609
crystal. You know what made it

3051
01:25:11,609 --> 01:25:12,409
so?

3052
01:25:14,090 --> 01:25:15,670
I'm using air quotes here for

3053
01:25:15,670 --> 01:25:16,470
all the people listening.

3054
01:25:16,630 --> 01:25:18,189
An invasive species called the

3055
01:25:18,189 --> 01:25:18,989
zebra mussel.

3056
01:25:19,289 --> 01:25:20,869
Oh, no way. It filtered it all.

3057
01:25:21,149 --> 01:25:22,949
Zebra mussel filtered it all in

3058
01:25:22,949 --> 01:25:24,770
Lake Erie as clear as can be.

3059
01:25:26,989 --> 01:25:28,310
You know what's crazy about

3060
01:25:28,310 --> 01:25:29,110
that, John?

3061
01:25:29,170 --> 01:25:32,529
My dad, he quit dairy farming

3062
01:25:32,529 --> 01:25:33,329
and

3063
01:25:34,090 --> 01:25:35,090
we used to live on the East

3064
01:25:35,090 --> 01:25:35,890
Coast.

3065
01:25:35,829 --> 01:25:37,289
And he hauled,

3066
01:25:37,770 --> 01:25:39,970
he picked up a semi and he

3067
01:25:39,970 --> 01:25:41,170
hauled semi over the road.

3068
01:25:41,270 --> 01:25:42,409
He'd usually be back

3069
01:25:42,909 --> 01:25:43,970
every night.

3070
01:25:45,039 --> 01:25:46,479
So it wasn't like long -term

3071
01:25:46,479 --> 01:25:47,619
trucking. You know, sometimes

3072
01:25:47,619 --> 01:25:48,579
you have to be gone.

3073
01:25:49,359 --> 01:25:52,500
But he told me about hauling

3074
01:25:53,100 --> 01:25:54,340
semi -loads of

3075
01:25:55,550 --> 01:25:57,510
goods over the Cuyahoga River.

3076
01:25:59,319 --> 01:26:00,119
It was on fire.

3077
01:26:00,810 --> 01:26:02,529
The Cuyahoga was literally on

3078
01:26:02,529 --> 01:26:03,329
fire.

3079
01:26:04,550 --> 01:26:05,869
And that was flowing directly

3080
01:26:05,869 --> 01:26:06,670
into Lake Erie.

3081
01:26:08,010 --> 01:26:09,289
What's amazing is

3082
01:26:09,949 --> 01:26:11,210
that's different.

3083
01:26:11,739 --> 01:26:12,779
That's the amazing thing.

3084
01:26:13,460 --> 01:26:14,859
Yeah, the EPA gets some of the

3085
01:26:14,859 --> 01:26:16,079
credit and the zebra mussel gets

3086
01:26:16,079 --> 01:26:16,880
more credit.

3087
01:26:19,079 --> 01:26:20,079
But anyway, you know, John,

3088
01:26:20,199 --> 01:26:21,380
don't you agree we just got to

3089
01:26:21,380 --> 01:26:22,319
get out of the way on some of

3090
01:26:22,319 --> 01:26:23,319
these things and provide those

3091
01:26:23,319 --> 01:26:24,760
opportunities, you know, for

3092
01:26:24,760 --> 01:26:26,760
biodiversity to occur and for

3093
01:26:26,760 --> 01:26:28,319
these cows to actually manifest

3094
01:26:28,319 --> 01:26:29,699
in what they're created to be.

3095
01:26:29,840 --> 01:26:31,060
Because I think, you know, some

3096
01:26:31,060 --> 01:26:32,220
of it is epigenetics.

3097
01:26:33,140 --> 01:26:35,260
You know, we could be getting in

3098
01:26:35,260 --> 01:26:36,060
the way of our cattle.

3099
01:26:36,140 --> 01:26:36,940
We could be creating

3100
01:26:36,859 --> 01:26:38,239
environmental pressures on them

3101
01:26:38,239 --> 01:26:39,439
that present,

3102
01:26:39,920 --> 01:26:41,000
you know,

3103
01:26:41,680 --> 01:26:43,479
no opportunity for genes to

3104
01:26:43,479 --> 01:26:44,279
express.

3105
01:26:44,180 --> 01:26:45,300
I think there's genes, there's

3106
01:26:45,300 --> 01:26:47,920
so many genes that we leave on

3107
01:26:47,920 --> 01:26:49,140
the table that we're not

3108
01:26:49,140 --> 01:26:50,600
allowing to express because

3109
01:26:50,600 --> 01:26:52,260
we're unknowingly placing

3110
01:26:52,260 --> 01:26:53,539
environmental pressure on these

3111
01:26:53,539 --> 01:26:55,819
animals or even the plants that

3112
01:26:55,819 --> 01:26:56,619
we work with.

3113
01:26:56,960 --> 01:26:57,800
Well, as

3114
01:26:58,689 --> 01:26:59,970
I'm listening to you describe

3115
01:27:01,180 --> 01:27:03,939
your analogy of not deliberately

3116
01:27:03,939 --> 01:27:05,399
engineering, attempting to

3117
01:27:05,399 --> 01:27:06,960
engineer the soil microbiome was

3118
01:27:06,960 --> 01:27:09,060
a beautiful and a very apt and

3119
01:27:09,060 --> 01:27:10,000
appropriate analogy.

3120
01:27:11,180 --> 01:27:12,880
There is an aspect of what

3121
01:27:12,880 --> 01:27:13,680
you're describing.

3122
01:27:14,180 --> 01:27:15,659
It occurs to me that perhaps the

3123
01:27:15,659 --> 01:27:17,859
appropriate word to use is a

3124
01:27:17,859 --> 01:27:18,979
control or

3125
01:27:19,359 --> 01:27:20,319
attempted control.

3126
01:27:20,979 --> 01:27:22,800
We attempt to control

3127
01:27:23,779 --> 01:27:25,840
what plants we're planting, what

3128
01:27:25,840 --> 01:27:27,260
crops we're planting in row crop

3129
01:27:27,260 --> 01:27:28,439
environments, what cover crop

3130
01:27:28,439 --> 01:27:29,739
combinations and so forth.

3131
01:27:30,100 --> 01:27:32,539
And to what degree are we

3132
01:27:32,539 --> 01:27:33,840
restricting ourselves and

3133
01:27:33,840 --> 01:27:35,720
restricting the development of

3134
01:27:35,720 --> 01:27:37,600
the whole ecosystem by our

3135
01:27:37,600 --> 01:27:38,699
attempts to control?

3136
01:27:38,819 --> 01:27:40,239
There's a difference between

3137
01:27:41,579 --> 01:27:42,939
controlling and what's the,

3138
01:27:43,020 --> 01:27:43,859
what's the other word that I'm

3139
01:27:43,859 --> 01:27:45,020
looking for? Um,

3140
01:27:46,890 --> 01:27:48,390
not even guiding necessarily,

3141
01:27:48,409 --> 01:27:49,970
but allowing to express, you

3142
01:27:49,970 --> 01:27:51,649
know, there's this phrage, um,

3143
01:27:51,920 --> 01:27:53,439
this phrase from, I've been

3144
01:27:53,439 --> 01:27:54,579
really intrigued by the body of

3145
01:27:54,579 --> 01:27:55,699
work that has been popularized

3146
01:27:55,699 --> 01:27:56,539
by Otto Scharmer,

3147
01:27:56,930 --> 01:27:59,170
uh, theory, you, the tag phrase,

3148
01:27:59,229 --> 01:28:01,449
the tagline from theory, you is

3149
01:28:01,449 --> 01:28:03,409
leading from the emerging

3150
01:28:03,409 --> 01:28:04,210
future,

3151
01:28:04,960 --> 01:28:05,760
allowing,

3152
01:28:06,279 --> 01:28:07,760
allowing the future to emerge

3153
01:28:07,760 --> 01:28:09,100
and facilitating that being a

3154
01:28:09,100 --> 01:28:09,900
facilitator.

3155
01:28:10,439 --> 01:28:11,760
Rather than trying to control,

3156
01:28:11,880 --> 01:28:13,000
you were a facilitator and

3157
01:28:13,000 --> 01:28:14,960
allowing the optimal solutions.

3158
01:28:15,199 --> 01:28:16,000
emerge.

3159
01:28:16,539 --> 01:28:17,340
Yes.

3160
01:28:17,489 --> 01:28:18,289
Yes.

3161
01:28:18,310 --> 01:28:19,949
No, you're exactly right And

3162
01:28:20,260 --> 01:28:21,779
when we do that we start finding

3163
01:28:21,779 --> 01:28:23,340
out all these other things start

3164
01:28:23,340 --> 01:28:24,619
happening Like one thing we

3165
01:28:24,619 --> 01:28:25,979
noticed several years ago on our

3166
01:28:25,979 --> 01:28:26,779
cattle is

3167
01:28:27,579 --> 01:28:28,760
we no longer had flies

3168
01:28:30,829 --> 01:28:33,250
John I come from this like we

3169
01:28:33,250 --> 01:28:34,470
put it on those cattle we put

3170
01:28:34,470 --> 01:28:36,210
war backs on you know, we put

3171
01:28:36,210 --> 01:28:38,970
ivermectin on dekto max we you

3172
01:28:38,970 --> 01:28:40,949
know used insecticide pyrethroid

3173
01:28:40,949 --> 01:28:42,869
ear tags and then we rotate them

3174
01:28:42,869 --> 01:28:44,470
with organophosphates and

3175
01:28:45,359 --> 01:28:46,159
Man,

3176
01:28:46,090 --> 01:28:48,010
Warbecks, it's illegal to throw

3177
01:28:48,010 --> 01:28:49,090
the container away.

3178
01:28:51,470 --> 01:28:53,149
It says, do not throw this

3179
01:28:53,149 --> 01:28:53,949
container away.

3180
01:28:53,949 --> 01:28:54,930
So what are you supposed to do?

3181
01:28:55,050 --> 01:28:55,850
You know, I mean, everybody

3182
01:28:55,689 --> 01:28:57,029
threw them away at the time of

3183
01:28:57,029 --> 01:28:57,829
Warbecks. So,

3184
01:28:58,229 --> 01:28:59,189
you know, so we did all these

3185
01:28:59,189 --> 01:29:00,109
things. And now,

3186
01:29:01,159 --> 01:29:02,439
of course, you know, when we

3187
01:29:02,439 --> 01:29:03,699
became organic, those things

3188
01:29:03,699 --> 01:29:04,500
ended.

3189
01:29:05,779 --> 01:29:07,279
So these cattle, especially in a

3190
01:29:07,279 --> 01:29:08,079
range.

3191
01:29:08,699 --> 01:29:10,579
And I had Fred Provenza with me

3192
01:29:10,579 --> 01:29:11,739
on one of these questions.

3193
01:29:11,760 --> 01:29:12,560
I said, Fred,

3194
01:29:14,640 --> 01:29:15,600
what do you think of the flies?

3195
01:29:16,960 --> 01:29:17,760
And he said, well, you don't

3196
01:29:17,579 --> 01:29:18,380
have any.

3197
01:29:18,989 --> 01:29:20,010
And I said, well, why?

3198
01:29:20,550 --> 01:29:21,729
I want to know why.

3199
01:29:22,920 --> 01:29:25,079
And he said, it goes back to

3200
01:29:26,100 --> 01:29:27,579
the phytochemical diversity that

3201
01:29:27,579 --> 01:29:28,380
your cows are eating.

3202
01:29:28,920 --> 01:29:29,720
It just goes back.

3203
01:29:29,779 --> 01:29:31,300
He said that they're licking

3204
01:29:31,300 --> 01:29:32,699
themselves. It's in their

3205
01:29:32,699 --> 01:29:33,500
saliva.

3206
01:29:33,739 --> 01:29:34,539
And

3207
01:29:34,720 --> 01:29:36,000
they're also putting out oil

3208
01:29:36,000 --> 01:29:37,819
droplets on their hairs.

3209
01:29:38,300 --> 01:29:39,340
You can see it out there.

3210
01:29:39,340 --> 01:29:40,140
They're glistening.

3211
01:29:40,159 --> 01:29:41,119
They're shiny and

3212
01:29:42,300 --> 01:29:43,100
no flies.

3213
01:29:44,079 --> 01:29:45,680
And he said, it's because

3214
01:29:46,659 --> 01:29:48,420
you've presented them this

3215
01:29:48,420 --> 01:29:50,600
opportunity to self -regulate

3216
01:29:50,600 --> 01:29:51,400
that, too.

3217
01:29:52,180 --> 01:29:53,140
You know, so it's not only

3218
01:29:53,350 --> 01:29:54,210
medicinal,

3219
01:29:55,500 --> 01:29:57,460
it's fly repellent.

3220
01:29:57,500 --> 01:29:58,779
And it's just because

3221
01:29:59,529 --> 01:30:00,529
We've offered them the

3222
01:30:00,529 --> 01:30:01,630
opportunity to maintain

3223
01:30:01,630 --> 01:30:03,149
themselves by their own pallets

3224
01:30:03,149 --> 01:30:04,489
and their own biofeedback loop

3225
01:30:04,489 --> 01:30:05,310
within them

3226
01:30:06,390 --> 01:30:07,770
that allows them to make the

3227
01:30:07,770 --> 01:30:09,470
nutritional choices that are

3228
01:30:09,470 --> 01:30:10,350
going to take care of them.

3229
01:30:10,460 --> 01:30:11,260
this regard.

3230
01:30:16,739 --> 01:30:17,539
So beautiful, Glenn.

3231
01:30:20,619 --> 01:30:22,000
You know, there are...

3232
01:30:22,640 --> 01:30:24,180
I get the idea from

3233
01:30:25,159 --> 01:30:26,619
our conversation that

3234
01:30:27,159 --> 01:30:28,600
I'd like to spend about a week

3235
01:30:28,600 --> 01:30:30,020
in the evening sitting beside

3236
01:30:30,020 --> 01:30:31,260
the campfire with you with a

3237
01:30:31,260 --> 01:30:32,060
microphone on.

3238
01:30:33,869 --> 01:30:35,090
Well, come on out, John.

3239
01:30:35,170 --> 01:30:35,970
We'll put you on a horse.

3240
01:30:38,560 --> 01:30:39,360
Yeah.

3241
01:30:39,420 --> 01:30:40,220
Yeah,

3242
01:30:40,539 --> 01:30:44,039
there is an aspect of wisdom and

3243
01:30:44,039 --> 01:30:47,000
experience of having been in

3244
01:30:47,750 --> 01:30:49,289
doing the work that you have

3245
01:30:49,289 --> 01:30:50,550
been for so long of just

3246
01:30:50,550 --> 01:30:52,270
observing, paying attention,

3247
01:30:52,470 --> 01:30:53,270
observing.

3248
01:30:54,439 --> 01:30:55,800
You know, I get many, I

3249
01:30:56,270 --> 01:30:57,529
get many solicitations from

3250
01:30:57,529 --> 01:30:58,710
people who want to be on the

3251
01:30:58,710 --> 01:30:59,510
podcast.

3252
01:31:00,390 --> 01:31:02,470
So many that I eventually

3253
01:31:02,470 --> 01:31:05,500
drafted a form letter to be a

3254
01:31:05,500 --> 01:31:06,300
kind letdown.

3255
01:31:08,270 --> 01:31:09,070
And

3256
01:31:09,020 --> 01:31:11,239
you should have sent one to me,

3257
01:31:11,300 --> 01:31:12,100
John.

3258
01:31:13,880 --> 01:31:15,819
I would have handled it.

3259
01:31:16,460 --> 01:31:17,659
There are.

3260
01:31:19,779 --> 01:31:20,600
Well, you know, I've been trying

3261
01:31:20,600 --> 01:31:21,560
to get you on for a couple of

3262
01:31:21,560 --> 01:31:23,579
years. It's just been, it's been

3263
01:31:23,579 --> 01:31:24,479
playing tag here.

3264
01:31:25,020 --> 01:31:26,699
But in

3265
01:31:27,699 --> 01:31:29,340
one sentence of the letter,

3266
01:31:29,739 --> 01:31:31,539
I went back, I realized,

3267
01:31:31,859 --> 01:31:32,739
you know, I'm just writing this

3268
01:31:32,739 --> 01:31:33,699
thing, stream of consciousness.

3269
01:31:33,859 --> 01:31:35,039
And afterwards, I read back,

3270
01:31:35,720 --> 01:31:36,699
I read it again.

3271
01:31:36,699 --> 01:31:38,020
And I realized how brilliant it

3272
01:31:38,020 --> 01:31:38,820
was.

3273
01:31:39,489 --> 01:31:40,890
The one sentence I wrote, I

3274
01:31:40,890 --> 01:31:41,690
said,

3275
01:31:41,539 --> 01:31:43,000
decades of experience don't

3276
01:31:43,000 --> 01:31:44,359
count for everything, but they

3277
01:31:44,359 --> 01:31:45,800
sure count for an awful lot.

3278
01:31:46,369 --> 01:31:47,170
Dang, right.

3279
01:31:47,210 --> 01:31:48,010
And

3280
01:31:48,899 --> 01:31:51,260
And it was one of the common

3281
01:31:51,260 --> 01:31:52,760
patterns. I'm getting lots of

3282
01:31:52,760 --> 01:31:53,800
people who want to be on the

3283
01:31:53,800 --> 01:31:54,680
podcast who,

3284
01:31:55,239 --> 01:31:56,220
oh, they've made this amazing

3285
01:31:56,220 --> 01:31:57,020
new breakthrough.

3286
01:31:57,060 --> 01:31:57,880
They've come up with this new

3287
01:31:57,880 --> 01:31:59,140
technology. They have this new

3288
01:31:59,140 --> 01:32:00,479
product, and it's going to solve

3289
01:32:00,479 --> 01:32:01,279
all these problems.

3290
01:32:02,029 --> 01:32:02,829
And it's like,

3291
01:32:02,970 --> 01:32:03,770
yeah.

3292
01:32:04,579 --> 01:32:06,159
try it for 10 years and then

3293
01:32:06,159 --> 01:32:07,220
let's have a conversation.

3294
01:32:08,300 --> 01:32:09,100
Yeah, you're right.

3295
01:32:09,239 --> 01:32:10,560
You know, what I've realized is

3296
01:32:10,560 --> 01:32:12,060
I hire a lot of kids.

3297
01:32:13,399 --> 01:32:15,420
Our internship just flyer went

3298
01:32:15,420 --> 01:32:16,859
out. Last year we had 450

3299
01:32:16,859 --> 01:32:17,659
applicants.

3300
01:32:17,979 --> 01:32:19,319
The year before we had 700.

3301
01:32:21,130 --> 01:32:22,229
Last year we hired,

3302
01:32:23,250 --> 01:32:25,409
I shouldn't say hired, we had 19

3303
01:32:25,409 --> 01:32:26,770
interns over the course of the

3304
01:32:26,770 --> 01:32:27,570
summer and

3305
01:32:28,439 --> 01:32:29,640
Between the interns and the

3306
01:32:29,640 --> 01:32:30,960
employees, I think our number

3307
01:32:30,960 --> 01:32:33,600
was sitting right at 29.

3308
01:32:34,020 --> 01:32:34,820
No,

3309
01:32:34,840 --> 01:32:36,060
it was 39, 39.

3310
01:32:36,600 --> 01:32:39,079
So there was a lot of people

3311
01:32:39,079 --> 01:32:40,260
working on a ranch, you know,

3312
01:32:40,319 --> 01:32:41,500
associated with and

3313
01:32:43,439 --> 01:32:44,600
that would be one thing that,

3314
01:32:44,739 --> 01:32:45,920
you know, talk about in the

3315
01:32:45,920 --> 01:32:46,720
future.

3316
01:32:46,439 --> 01:32:47,239
You know, I

3317
01:32:47,149 --> 01:32:48,670
often see my neighbors, they're

3318
01:32:48,670 --> 01:32:49,529
saying, hey,

3319
01:32:49,869 --> 01:32:50,970
you know, we need to be able to

3320
01:32:50,970 --> 01:32:52,670
buy another ranch for you kids

3321
01:32:52,670 --> 01:32:53,649
to be able to run on.

3322
01:32:53,750 --> 01:32:55,109
So we think always horizontally.

3323
01:32:56,760 --> 01:32:58,319
you know, in terms of expansion

3324
01:32:58,319 --> 01:32:59,699
for the family business and

3325
01:32:59,699 --> 01:33:02,319
creating niches for our

3326
01:33:02,319 --> 01:33:04,739
kids and siblings and other

3327
01:33:04,739 --> 01:33:06,380
family members, or even just

3328
01:33:06,380 --> 01:33:08,340
good ranch hands that have

3329
01:33:08,340 --> 01:33:10,039
stayed with us for several

3330
01:33:10,039 --> 01:33:10,840
years.

3331
01:33:10,539 --> 01:33:12,039
And now they're ready to take

3332
01:33:12,039 --> 01:33:13,560
off on their own and complement

3333
01:33:13,560 --> 01:33:14,819
our current operation.

3334
01:33:15,279 --> 01:33:16,539
So we always think horizontally

3335
01:33:16,539 --> 01:33:18,039
and say, we need to put you over

3336
01:33:18,039 --> 01:33:18,840
on that ranch.

3337
01:33:18,880 --> 01:33:19,920
Let's release it.

3338
01:33:20,039 --> 01:33:20,920
You know, and there's value

3339
01:33:20,920 --> 01:33:21,720
there.

3340
01:33:22,060 --> 01:33:22,860
But, you

3341
01:33:22,920 --> 01:33:23,859
know, land costs,

3342
01:33:24,670 --> 01:33:26,149
you know, when you look at just

3343
01:33:26,149 --> 01:33:27,529
the scale of land

3344
01:33:28,600 --> 01:33:29,859
and look at potential return

3345
01:33:29,859 --> 01:33:30,659
associated

3346
01:33:30,850 --> 01:33:32,949
associated with it, it becomes

3347
01:33:32,949 --> 01:33:33,750
very difficult.

3348
01:33:34,199 --> 01:33:35,899
First of all, purchase is

3349
01:33:35,899 --> 01:33:37,859
usually a very low return

3350
01:33:38,239 --> 01:33:39,439
investment, you

3351
01:33:39,909 --> 01:33:40,909
know, because you're trying to

3352
01:33:40,909 --> 01:33:41,890
make principal, you're trying to

3353
01:33:41,890 --> 01:33:42,890
pay interest all the time.

3354
01:33:43,510 --> 01:33:45,409
So instead, what I encourage

3355
01:33:45,409 --> 01:33:46,489
people to think about is

3356
01:33:47,890 --> 01:33:49,250
what if we

3357
01:33:49,630 --> 01:33:52,149
just go vertical instead and

3358
01:33:52,970 --> 01:33:54,350
build businesses on top of the

3359
01:33:54,350 --> 01:33:55,949
one we currently have, you know,

3360
01:33:56,270 --> 01:33:58,510
and put more diversity into the

3361
01:33:58,510 --> 01:33:59,310
system?

3362
01:33:59,300 --> 01:34:01,319
There is so much opportunity for

3363
01:34:01,319 --> 01:34:02,140
that in agriculture.

3364
01:34:02,600 --> 01:34:03,840
No, it's unbelievable.

3365
01:34:04,079 --> 01:34:04,880
It's unbelievable.

3366
01:34:05,060 --> 01:34:06,600
So that's why farmers complain

3367
01:34:06,600 --> 01:34:07,920
all the time about everyone else

3368
01:34:07,920 --> 01:34:08,720
making all the money.

3369
01:34:09,460 --> 01:34:10,260
Yes.

3370
01:34:10,420 --> 01:34:12,079
Yes. And so we can stack it.

3371
01:34:12,199 --> 01:34:13,340
We could stack it and make that

3372
01:34:13,340 --> 01:34:15,220
money. We can make that money

3373
01:34:15,220 --> 01:34:16,020
with a stack.

3374
01:34:16,640 --> 01:34:17,579
So, you know, that's what I tell

3375
01:34:17,579 --> 01:34:18,920
these these young people that

3376
01:34:18,920 --> 01:34:20,680
come out. But one thing, their

3377
01:34:20,680 --> 01:34:21,640
biggest attribute,

3378
01:34:22,060 --> 01:34:23,390
John, is agility.

3379
01:34:24,270 --> 01:34:25,430
And it's just like those people

3380
01:34:25,430 --> 01:34:26,649
who are saying, hey, put me on a

3381
01:34:26,649 --> 01:34:27,850
podcast. I've thought about this

3382
01:34:27,850 --> 01:34:28,650
thing. And it's a really cool

3383
01:34:28,609 --> 01:34:30,029
thing. And it's because they're

3384
01:34:30,029 --> 01:34:31,229
very agile minded.

3385
01:34:31,609 --> 01:34:32,510
You know, at this point in my

3386
01:34:32,510 --> 01:34:33,590
life, when I'm 63,

3387
01:34:33,890 --> 01:34:35,390
my wife read a book on it.

3388
01:34:35,510 --> 01:34:38,390
And she said, you and I are

3389
01:34:38,729 --> 01:34:41,149
entering the time of crystalline

3390
01:34:41,149 --> 01:34:41,949
intelligence.

3391
01:34:44,630 --> 01:34:46,010
people like you, John, have

3392
01:34:46,010 --> 01:34:47,069
fluid intelligence.

3393
01:34:47,289 --> 01:34:48,670
And that means agility, agility

3394
01:34:48,670 --> 01:34:49,670
and thought, you know, because a

3395
01:34:49,670 --> 01:34:50,470
lot of times we're really

3396
01:34:50,369 --> 01:34:51,449
difficult and stubborn, you

3397
01:34:51,449 --> 01:34:52,909
know, and hard to change ideas.

3398
01:34:53,449 --> 01:34:55,289
But the thing about crystalline

3399
01:34:55,289 --> 01:34:56,090
intelligence,

3400
01:34:56,430 --> 01:34:58,090
it implies a lattice, a

3401
01:34:58,090 --> 01:34:58,890
framework.

3402
01:34:59,729 --> 01:35:01,130
Yeah. And that framework is

3403
01:35:01,130 --> 01:35:01,930
called wisdom,

3404
01:35:03,029 --> 01:35:03,829
right?

3405
01:35:03,550 --> 01:35:04,710
And that's what we see.

3406
01:35:04,710 --> 01:35:05,510
That's what we see in

3407
01:35:05,449 --> 01:35:06,250
agriculture.

3408
01:35:06,609 --> 01:35:08,569
And for some reason, we've lost

3409
01:35:08,569 --> 01:35:10,369
sight of the value of that.

3410
01:35:10,710 --> 01:35:11,510
And

3411
01:35:11,470 --> 01:35:12,989
You know, we put a lot of our

3412
01:35:12,989 --> 01:35:14,489
older people out to pasture and

3413
01:35:14,489 --> 01:35:16,369
say, instead of a young person

3414
01:35:16,369 --> 01:35:17,229
saying, Dad,

3415
01:35:18,689 --> 01:35:19,489
what if I

3416
01:35:20,270 --> 01:35:22,390
tried this on 10 acres here and

3417
01:35:22,390 --> 01:35:23,190
you helped me out?

3418
01:35:24,090 --> 01:35:25,489
And I could use the lattice of

3419
01:35:25,489 --> 01:35:26,810
your wisdom to help me make it

3420
01:35:26,810 --> 01:35:27,789
happen. You know what I mean?

3421
01:35:28,260 --> 01:35:29,460
I know exactly what you mean.

3422
01:35:29,479 --> 01:35:32,100
And I would suggest that part of

3423
01:35:32,100 --> 01:35:34,180
the reason agriculture has

3424
01:35:34,710 --> 01:35:37,270
stagnated and has

3425
01:35:38,420 --> 01:35:40,399
become worn in its groove, if

3426
01:35:40,399 --> 01:35:41,960
you will, is because it's been

3427
01:35:41,960 --> 01:35:43,880
become dominated by

3428
01:35:44,300 --> 01:35:45,840
the elderly generation or the

3429
01:35:45,840 --> 01:35:47,020
younger generation hasn't

3430
01:35:47,020 --> 01:35:49,260
capital wherewithal to get in.

3431
01:35:49,439 --> 01:35:50,239
Yeah. Yes.

3432
01:35:50,420 --> 01:35:51,220
Yeah. And the whole thing

3433
01:35:51,199 --> 01:35:52,000
stacked that way.

3434
01:35:51,979 --> 01:35:53,039
I mean, you look at the process

3435
01:35:53,039 --> 01:35:54,680
of subsidies, it's stacked that

3436
01:35:54,680 --> 01:35:56,550
way. where older farmers,

3437
01:35:56,949 --> 01:35:57,770
you know, they got their

3438
01:35:57,770 --> 01:35:58,570
histories,

3439
01:35:58,869 --> 01:36:00,930
they got an ability to, you

3440
01:36:00,930 --> 01:36:02,109
know, apply for those subsidies.

3441
01:36:02,329 --> 01:36:04,489
So we've governance has set up

3442
01:36:04,489 --> 01:36:05,489
and facilitated

3443
01:36:06,149 --> 01:36:07,510
that even further,

3444
01:36:07,810 --> 01:36:08,789
especially in the Midwest,

3445
01:36:09,090 --> 01:36:10,710
you know, in commodity states.

3446
01:36:11,149 --> 01:36:12,430
So it's,

3447
01:36:12,939 --> 01:36:14,539
it's, it's a difficult premise.

3448
01:36:14,539 --> 01:36:15,619
But you know, you and I have

3449
01:36:15,619 --> 01:36:16,479
talked earlier in this

3450
01:36:16,479 --> 01:36:18,310
conversation about how much

3451
01:36:18,829 --> 01:36:20,310
how scalable these opportunities

3452
01:36:20,310 --> 01:36:21,890
are and how we can layer these

3453
01:36:21,890 --> 01:36:23,470
opportunities on a given acreage

3454
01:36:23,470 --> 01:36:24,270
of ground.

3455
01:36:24,630 --> 01:36:25,470
And that's where the young

3456
01:36:25,470 --> 01:36:26,689
people really can come in and

3457
01:36:26,689 --> 01:36:27,949
shine because they're agile

3458
01:36:27,949 --> 01:36:28,750
enough to

3459
01:36:29,090 --> 01:36:30,289
think about possibility.

3460
01:36:30,689 --> 01:36:32,170
And when they interact with the

3461
01:36:32,170 --> 01:36:33,670
older generation and say, hey,

3462
01:36:33,710 --> 01:36:34,529
what about this?

3463
01:36:34,729 --> 01:36:35,829
What about I have this idea?

3464
01:36:35,949 --> 01:36:36,810
What about this?

3465
01:36:37,289 --> 01:36:38,890
Let's try it on a small scale

3466
01:36:38,890 --> 01:36:40,569
and maybe we could stack that

3467
01:36:40,569 --> 01:36:41,829
enterprise on the rest of what

3468
01:36:41,829 --> 01:36:42,630
we do here.

3469
01:36:42,850 --> 01:36:43,970
You know, I think those are the

3470
01:36:43,970 --> 01:36:45,329
valuable conversations that are

3471
01:36:45,329 --> 01:36:46,130
going to move us forward

3472
01:36:46,010 --> 01:36:46,810
because,

3473
01:36:47,090 --> 01:36:47,890
John, we're

3474
01:36:47,909 --> 01:36:49,550
We're facing crisis right now,

3475
01:36:49,590 --> 01:36:50,949
demographically,

3476
01:36:51,729 --> 01:36:52,850
because everybody's my age.

3477
01:36:53,859 --> 01:36:55,300
It's in agriculture, right?

3478
01:36:55,680 --> 01:36:56,480
I mean,

3479
01:36:56,539 --> 01:36:58,079
I think I think right now it's

3480
01:36:58,079 --> 01:36:59,539
around 87 % of

3481
01:36:59,909 --> 01:37:01,430
the people are my age in

3482
01:37:01,430 --> 01:37:02,369
agriculture in the United

3483
01:37:02,369 --> 01:37:03,170
States.

3484
01:37:03,189 --> 01:37:04,409
That means we're facing crisis

3485
01:37:04,409 --> 01:37:05,569
in 10 to 15 years.

3486
01:37:06,729 --> 01:37:08,010
I mean, either I'm going to die,

3487
01:37:08,090 --> 01:37:09,090
I'm going to be dead, or I'm

3488
01:37:09,090 --> 01:37:10,550
going to turn over the ranch to

3489
01:37:10,550 --> 01:37:12,289
somebody else or whatever, you

3490
01:37:12,289 --> 01:37:13,250
know, those are the

3491
01:37:13,250 --> 01:37:14,050
characteristics.

3492
01:37:14,090 --> 01:37:16,029
My hope is I never stop working.

3493
01:37:16,869 --> 01:37:18,310
I just stopped signing in front

3494
01:37:18,310 --> 01:37:19,770
of checks and I stopped signing

3495
01:37:19,770 --> 01:37:21,529
the back of checks because I

3496
01:37:21,529 --> 01:37:22,609
don't want the financial burden

3497
01:37:22,609 --> 01:37:23,949
of saying, oh, where am I going

3498
01:37:23,949 --> 01:37:24,970
to come up with the money to pay

3499
01:37:24,970 --> 01:37:26,409
these people? And I don't want

3500
01:37:26,409 --> 01:37:27,649
the financial burden of worrying

3501
01:37:27,649 --> 01:37:29,760
about where money for me is

3502
01:37:29,760 --> 01:37:31,119
coming from. I just want to work

3503
01:37:31,119 --> 01:37:31,920
for them.

3504
01:37:32,630 --> 01:37:33,810
And so that's where Carol and I

3505
01:37:33,810 --> 01:37:34,689
are right now. And that's

3506
01:37:34,689 --> 01:37:35,729
actually why we're on a little

3507
01:37:35,729 --> 01:37:36,989
vacation right now, because it

3508
01:37:36,989 --> 01:37:38,270
gives the younger generation

3509
01:37:38,270 --> 01:37:40,409
opportunity to do it without us.

3510
01:37:40,449 --> 01:37:41,390
So we're hoping all the cattle

3511
01:37:41,390 --> 01:37:42,630
are alive when we come back.

3512
01:37:43,170 --> 01:37:44,409
I'm guessing they might be.

3513
01:37:44,739 --> 01:37:48,159
But anyway, you know, we

3514
01:37:48,159 --> 01:37:49,539
got to find, we got to ask those

3515
01:37:49,539 --> 01:37:50,340
hard questions.

3516
01:37:50,779 --> 01:37:51,779
And then we got to come up with

3517
01:37:51,779 --> 01:37:52,579
a way that

3518
01:37:52,979 --> 01:37:54,119
we can move forward together.

3519
01:37:54,539 --> 01:37:56,220
Because the old people have all

3520
01:37:56,220 --> 01:37:57,020
the equity,

3521
01:37:57,060 --> 01:37:57,860
right?

3522
01:37:57,779 --> 01:38:00,119
The equity is in my hands on

3523
01:38:00,119 --> 01:38:01,060
this ranch right now.

3524
01:38:01,600 --> 01:38:03,420
And for me to sell it,

3525
01:38:04,170 --> 01:38:04,970
you know, and have a real estate

3526
01:38:04,970 --> 01:38:06,130
transaction, give the kids

3527
01:38:06,130 --> 01:38:06,930
money,

3528
01:38:07,270 --> 01:38:08,270
that means nobody's in

3529
01:38:08,270 --> 01:38:09,070
agriculture,

3530
01:38:09,619 --> 01:38:11,600
right? Because most sales,

3531
01:38:12,029 --> 01:38:12,869
in my country,

3532
01:38:13,350 --> 01:38:15,850
go to some investment banker

3533
01:38:15,850 --> 01:38:18,369
from California or New York.

3534
01:38:19,050 --> 01:38:20,470
There are people who can afford

3535
01:38:20,470 --> 01:38:21,270
that and they're buying

3536
01:38:21,130 --> 01:38:22,590
recreational value.

3537
01:38:22,789 --> 01:38:24,329
They're not even looking for

3538
01:38:24,329 --> 01:38:25,390
agricultural value.

3539
01:38:25,510 --> 01:38:27,149
They're looking for a place

3540
01:38:27,149 --> 01:38:28,829
where they can go out on their

3541
01:38:28,829 --> 01:38:30,189
back deck with a drink and say,

3542
01:38:30,270 --> 01:38:31,070
this is all mine.

3543
01:38:32,189 --> 01:38:32,989
And that's the only thing

3544
01:38:32,850 --> 01:38:33,650
they're looking for.

3545
01:38:34,449 --> 01:38:35,909
And is that where we want

3546
01:38:35,909 --> 01:38:36,829
agriculture to go?

3547
01:38:37,699 --> 01:38:38,760
But what if we look at it

3548
01:38:38,760 --> 01:38:39,979
different and say, no, no, no,

3549
01:38:39,979 --> 01:38:40,779
no, no, no.

3550
01:38:40,500 --> 01:38:41,920
I do want to fish a little more

3551
01:38:41,920 --> 01:38:43,279
and maybe I want to play one

3552
01:38:43,279 --> 01:38:44,199
round of golf a year.

3553
01:38:44,479 --> 01:38:45,279
But

3554
01:38:45,199 --> 01:38:46,579
I also want to keep working with

3555
01:38:46,579 --> 01:38:48,520
my with my family, keep working

3556
01:38:48,520 --> 01:38:49,520
with that next gen.

3557
01:38:50,369 --> 01:38:51,270
Those are exciting

3558
01:38:51,270 --> 01:38:52,850
possibilities. And that's an

3559
01:38:52,850 --> 01:38:54,369
exciting hope for agriculture.

3560
01:38:55,649 --> 01:38:56,449
Those are necessary

3561
01:38:56,369 --> 01:38:57,569
possibilities as well.

3562
01:38:58,069 --> 01:38:58,869
Yeah.

3563
01:38:58,949 --> 01:39:00,289
Glenn, this has been an

3564
01:39:00,289 --> 01:39:01,350
incredible conversation.

3565
01:39:01,529 --> 01:39:02,869
I've immensely enjoyed myself.

3566
01:39:03,350 --> 01:39:04,729
Thank you very much for all that

3567
01:39:04,729 --> 01:39:05,770
you do and for sharing your

3568
01:39:05,770 --> 01:39:06,710
wisdom and experience.

3569
01:39:06,789 --> 01:39:08,229
And I look forward to more

3570
01:39:08,229 --> 01:39:09,029
conversations.

3571
01:39:09,529 --> 01:39:10,909
Well, me too. This has been

3572
01:39:10,909 --> 01:39:11,729
fantastic, John.

3573
01:39:11,810 --> 01:39:12,890
You asked really good questions,

3574
01:39:13,029 --> 01:39:14,210
some of which I couldn't answer

3575
01:39:14,210 --> 01:39:17,470
well, but it's been fantastic.

3576
01:39:18,010 --> 01:39:19,029
And I

3577
01:39:19,500 --> 01:39:20,739
always learn a lot in this

3578
01:39:20,739 --> 01:39:21,619
exchange of ideas.

3579
01:39:21,920 --> 01:39:22,899
So thank you very much.