Harder Than Life with Kelly Siegel

 What's up? Welcome to the latest edition of the Radcast. They say if it's radical, we cover it. What's definitely radical today, folks? We're in studio with my friend, Kelly Siegel CEO.
 Of National Technology Management author of Harder than Life. Kelly, brother is great to have you, man. It's been an honor enjoying every minute being here. You got a hack of a staff. Amazing operation here. You're brilliant. So thank you for your time.
 I felt very welcome. Thank you. I'm glad you're here, man. It's been good. I know we connected. I've been on your show. I can't. I wanted you on our show. We've been collaborating. And I don't know. I think we only come up with 12 business ideas today. I'm sure a dinner will come up with 30 more.
 I think we're opening a pizza place now. We're going to take over. Yeah. We're a franchise social housing Detroit. Yes. I'm surprised there hasn't been any bad stuff like strippers or anything like that.
 Hey, it's early. It's early. It's all good. No, man. I'm really thankful that you're here. Glad that our audience can be able to hear your story. I've got your book here.
 Looking forward to digging more than just into the cliffs notes. I appreciate it. I got to get your autograph. Your John Hancock on this baby before it's all said and done. Hold this up for anybody watching.
 You know what you're looking for when you go to Amazon. We'll talk more about that harder than life. Kelly, let's start where we always start at the beginning or as far back as you want to take us.
 But let's give everybody a little taste of Kelly Segal.
 Put me on a spot, but I tell you that I've been a salesman my whole life. So you're a marketing genius. I'm a sales genius. I started a paper. I went door to door sales selling candy long, long time ago, and I was good at it.
 I could sell candy to people that couldn't have sweets.
 I used to ask a mose, a diabetes candy candy. I can remember what it did. I'd say to them, you could put these out for your guests, kind of like me without call. I just supply everything for everybody.
 And everything I've touched, I've grown. And as we're trying to build the heart of the life brand for charity, we're growing leaps and bounds. And you said it best on the ride from the airport is.
 Maybe your authentic and genuine self and it's going to sell and it's going to do well. And I don't know any other way.
 Honesty integrity is national technology manager, which is paying the bills. It's the IT company that I've owned for years. That's one of our core values. It's actually a personal core value.
 I am going to say what I mean if it's kind. And I'm going to pull any punches just out to make a dent in the world. I've lived a very tumultuous childhood, which I was telling you about.
 Your childhood and your family being amazing and makes me very envious. My mother and my stepfather, you can read about it in the hard and life book. We're very physically and emotionally abusive.
 That's why I built this physique to protect myself and that you so quickly make me look small. But I'm going to get you in the gym tomorrow.
 I'm already sore, figuratively sore in my head and I'll be your real sore in the morning.
 You know, it's great about life. There are no coincidences. And I said that to it's I just found you on social media. We've connected. We've made it. We've got a brotherhood. We're going to do business together. I've already sent you some business.
 Yeah. And that's what the world is all about. So you make your own weather in this world. I could sit back and be a victim and say, what was me? Why didn't my parents love me?
 And I'm not enough and all these things and drink and do drugs and just waste my life away. But instead I use as a chip on my shoulder and making something of it. And now I've done so much therapy. I don't know that chip anymore.
 And I was telling you this morning, I'm playing right here. It's like the first time in my life, I really feel like I am where I'm supposed to be.
 And it's I walk in this building and feel like family. You've been wonderful. And it's just a start of a very long good business friendship and relationship.
 Yeah. I loved it. And I've I do want people though to read your book to really understand. We've talked about it in depth today.
 And obviously we could talk for three hours on a show about it. But I don't think people some people take for granted things that they have me talking to you today talking about my parents, my childhood and all that.
 I didn't grow with money either, but I did grow up with loving family and that in a way is greater than money and having that support. And so it's
 we can't take for granted the loved ones and the support that they give whether it's you don't talk to them every day, but knowing that they're there.
 Because that's it's kind of if you live in a warm area, but it gets cold sometimes you got a blanket in the closet.
 You can get out and put it on you when it gets cold. There's comfort in that even when you're not using it. There's comfort. I know that I can call my dad about anything.
 And you didn't have that. And I think I don't know. It's it's eye opening for me while also being appreciative of what I have. But I think it's also molded you into who you are.
 You wouldn't be telling that you are today without that. You know what I'm saying? So there's a blessing behind every negative in a way.
 If you take it that way, yes, everything happens for you, not to you. But most people don't realize that. And yeah, I haven't in the book and it's going to be gross. And I'm sorry Grace, but one of my first jobs was I had an empty a jar of piss.
 Literally, my stepdad would go hide from my crazy mother because they were drunk. And he had a high from her because she stabbed him once and tried to kill him several times.
 Let the house on fire. This is all in the book. So my job was to make his bed. Do clean his room and make sure he had work clothes and empty this jar of piss.
 And if I didn't do it, he would take it and throw it on my bed so it had created more work for me. So what did I, what am I sick and twisted mine?
 I didn't think that I think it was gross, but I think if I didn't do my job, the right, the first time it made it harder because then I had to fix it, I had to clean my bed.
 Disgusting, I know, but hey, to this day, I do things right the first time every time. So I want to go back to what you said about your parents, I would trade every dollar I have for a loving, supporting mother.
 I just did and I can feel how much you love your mother and it's just I've had thousands and thousands of dollars in therapy and hours in therapy that when and I'm real close, I just coming out of EMDR therapy, I'm grinding it myself and I'm harder than life.
 And it's not easy. I make it look easy, but it's not there's certain I was in therapy this week doing it and I was crying my eyes out for 30 minutes, but afterwards it was like a good workout.
 So I feel good. I'm grinding through it. It just took a little later than most people, but I'm also very fortunate that I'm not like some of my high school friends that are dead or in jail.
 So I you I leverage it and I've only just begun my life, maybe half over, but it's just beginning. It's not halfway. I'm not halfway through with where what I'm going to accomplish. That's why I'm here with you.
 He said we.
 Everything happens for a reason. And I think, but what fascinates me the more I'm getting to know you.
 You're so damn successful though, like most people can't make that transition. Yeah, they may be here. They're the victim or whatever or they're not smart enough for their not play.
 But there's a drive in you that got you to this point, even through some of the trials and tribulations and addictions, everything that you're transparent about in the book.
 What where did that come from?
 I was joke Ryan and I haven't said it to you yet that I'm the chosen one. I'm Jewish. Jesus was a Jew.
 I just think that there's certain times that I should be dead. And I've been shot at. I've been stabbed.
 I've been run over by cars. I'm still here. There's got to be a reason for it. So now I've figured it out that I'm going to do good.
 And we're going to donate to charity. We're going to I do a lot of work on my mind. And I read a lot just constantly trying to make a bigger shadow to help more people.
 I can't really explain it. That's also why I'm probably not a good coach.
 Those I just I can't explain to you that desire to succeed. I wake up in the morning and my eyes pop open and I want to win.
 I want to win and winning is more fun than fun is fun to me.
 And I just whatever I have to do that's what that's honest integrity within moral reason.
 I'm going to do so I'm an unstoppable force. I'm going to get to where we want to get.
 And there's no reason why anything's going to stop me.
 So talk about national technology management or maybe even leading up to that like as far as your career goes.
 So you've been driven bad childhood, overcame you upbringing, always driven though, made the most of your opportunities worked hard for those opportunities.
 But what's been that business journey?
 That's a great question. And it's just perfect because it came right off of saying, man, you're so successful and you're so driven.
 There are no coincidences. These things just keep lining up. I put a real up that talked about how I started the national technology management.
 It was just dumb luck. I was on a golf course one day and my partner phone just kept ringing and ringing and ringing and I what do you do?
 And he said he was a consultant in the technology business.
 And I was like, how much do you make? And he tells me and I was like, you make that I could double that and I was right.
 So I just, and I started the business on a credit card and a dream literally I was making six figures as a number one salesman at a company.
 And I quit cold turkey at 22 or 23 and started what now is called national technology management at that time was called Kelly communications.
 And the logo was a bulldog. So that doesn't surprise you. And I used to go.
 I used to go door to door beating on doors and selling phone systems phone service.
 And I just my big mantra was I couldn't take no for an answer. It was just the consistency and the discipline.
 And people like that story. And I just no matter what I felt like I got up every day.
 And I made a hundred touches of people, whether it was a phone call, whether it was knocking on doors, whether it was an email.
 And you got to remember, I sold the internet to people. This is I'm going to date myself.
 I've sold the internet to people their first ever internet connection.
 So when I started selling internet, we were doing dialogue, but AOL.
 I would tell people that you're going to need this more than air on day and where we are.
 Can you hear me now, baby? Can you hear me now? I use my cell.
 Oh, that's right. That's the sprint. The sprint one.
 Oh, Verizon. Verizon.
 That was my first campaign that we're done.
 I remember blackberries. We had to integrate blackberries to the network.
 Yeah. And it was just crazy. How crazy does things just overnight gone?
 So you asked me how it's consistency, discipline, doing the right thing day in and day out over and over despite how you feel.
 What the world is against you and whatever's going on in life.
 And what's interesting though is, and again, I keep referencing the book, but you can read deeper into these stories.
 You did all of this and built a multi-million dollar company through a lot of addictions and demons and everything else, right?
 Our life, baby.
 So you think it's hard to do these things anyway, folks.
 It's a lot harder to do them when you're lining up obstacles for yourself and you still did it.
 Right. That's a great map for our own worst enemies.
 We do things that are counterproductive that sabotage our own self.
 And sometimes we do it because of limiting beliefs. Sometimes we do it just because we're just young.
 That was a badge of honor for me to go out parting with my customers until we hours of the morning,
 get up, go hit the gym, and then get to the office.
 And as long as I hit the gym and showed up to work every day, I rationalize and justified my own BS to party all night.
 And then what happens just kept going and kept going and it never really got on a hand or maybe it did, I don't know.
 We're standing, but it got boring and it got real fast.
 And then life began when I said, I'm just, I'm going to take, I didn't hit rock bottom.
 I just said, I'm done with the naughty water.
 And now life got really good.
 And again, I'm sitting here at the red cast with you having a blast living a dream.
 So yeah, for the young people, I got a lot of young followers.
 Don't fight against yourself. Don't work against yourself.
 It's silly.
 If you just do certain disciplines day in and day out, and you could pick up any book.
 Nobody has any kind of a, it's, you know, work out, physically move your body.
 Even if it's just to walk around outside in nature, do some sort of meditation.
 Read, take some, do some journaling, just these things, winning habits day in and day out,
 and then go forward with something that makes you passionate and can make you some money.
 You are brilliant at marketing and you went off into the car business.
 Who knows? That's working against yourself.
 That's right. There are no freaking tricks to success.
 There's no tips. There's no elevator to success. There's no escalator.
 Work works. The harder you work, the luckier you get. You know that.
 Yeah. It's true. Talking with Kelly Siegel, author of harder than life.
 Kelly, I've always said there's like these parallels with work and life and the gym.
 And obviously physical fitness is important to you.
 I'm sitting here in studio looking in jealousy at that Kelly's biceps.
 I don't know if I've anything to hit those harder.
 I'm going to go to the gym later for the second time today.
 But it's obviously important to you.
 It's obviously prioritized it.
 But maybe talk about how in good bad and now at a great point in your life,
 how the gym has been so important in that evolution.
 I just realized you saw me at the epiphany.
 The smokers came out of my ears.
 That I didn't prioritize it as much as I necessitated.
 If that's a word, I didn't needed it.
 It was protection against the beatings from my stepfather.
 He was a big boy, 250, 260, 62.
 I was five foot nothing.
 As you just showed, we just took the picture together.
 I'm vertically challenged, but not horizontally challenged.
 I have a tree trunk.
 You dwarf me.
 But at the end of the day, you just asked me how I did it.
 It was survival, man.
 Everything I've done is to not die.
 And working out.
 So my stepdad wouldn't kick my hind parts.
 Because there was a couple of times where I put that in the book where he drowned me.
 I almost died.
 I've had a couple of near-death experiences from my parents.
 Working out is just, it's an necessity like breathing for me.
 I would say I prioritize it, but if I don't do it,
 I wouldn't be here calm and cool and collected.
 He transitioned from, at a certain point, you crossed over from,
 he's scared of you and you weren't scared of him probably.
 So obviously that passed in your 20s, 30s, now 40s like me.
 It's obviously stuck with you, the passion, the desire to look good,
 feel good, all those things.
 Don't you think that people ask me, I always work out.
 Like you said, it's an necessity, it's my oxygen.
 So I don't have to motivate myself, but certainly some days I'm more motivated than others.
 But what is it all the same drive, like everything else,
 like you're driven, did you get in business?
 You're driven to work hard.
 The gym, once you got out of, okay, your stepdad wasn't longer behind your back.
 What kept the motivation there?
 Here's making me think today.
 How you do anything is how you do everything.
 And if you've, in the little time that we know each other,
 I do everything the right way.
 I don't get cheated.
 I'm coming in with all the evil intent you can do.
 So when I go to the gym, you're going to see it tomorrow, bro.
 So sleep tonight, my friend.
 We're going to lift some heavy weights.
 And we're going to move, we're going to shake the building up.
 And when I, when national technology management comes to assist you with your IT needs,
 we shake the building up.
 When I wrote the book, we shake the building up.
 So if we're going to do something, we're going to do it right.
 And my four agreements book I just gave you was always do your best.
 It's my best. I'm going to bring it every single time.
 To give you the dad story, I don't think it's in the book.
 Because a matter of fact, so what finally got me thrown out of the house,
 and I didn't realize that this was as easy as I called my stepfather out.
 I started lifting heavy.
 I had to get confidence.
 And you're like, okay, I can.
 I was like five foot nothing.
 He's six foot, two to 60.
 And I came home five minutes late.
 And I had a full-time job and was an A student.
 I was a good kid.
 And they treated me like dirt.
 And yeah, you just see me just getting angry with that.
 And I was five minutes late for my curfew.
 I'm going to keep you up.
 And I had to work at seven a.m.
 And he's, I'm going to keep you up and teach you a lesson.
 And I think I've got to about two o'clock in the morning.
 You got two choices.
 Option A, you let me go to sleep.
 Option B, I make you.
 And he goes, get out of my house.
 I go, come on, let's go outside.
 You and me.
 And he's always challenged me like that.
 And I called him out.
 And he wouldn't, because he had to be, he had to be my spotter.
 And he was spotting me with the weight.
 And part of me would like to go back and pop him one.
 But he's old man now.
 And yeah, the violence doesn't solve anything.
 It sounds fun though.
 It's a challenge building your business.
 I would guess.
 Let me guess.
 And you tell me what it is.
 You're going to nail it.
 So it's usually a control thing.
 It starts there.
 But then it's also the expectations that everyone's like you.
 Or driven like you are going to do it.
 Maybe not exactly.
 You're worried about them doing it exactly like you.
 But they have that exact firecracker fire inside them.
 Growing up with an abuse of family,
 I didn't trust anybody.
 I didn't trust myself.
 I was scared.
 I was nervous.
 So you always feel like the rug is going to be pulled out from underneath you.
 So it was as much of a motivator as it was a detractor.
 How I started the full blown IT company was the same way.
 I was sitting, I was a consultant for the telecom business.
 And I was sitting on my boat in the middle of the lake.
 And I said, who can beat me?
 And I said, it's going to be somebody that can do the integration.
 So I sat out and did that.
 So a lot of what I did was out of fear.
 And so you take those two things that you just said and you add in fear.
 That you don't know that exists because you think that you're tougher.
 Yeah.
 And you start thinking things are personal when they're not.
 So if an employee or a customer takes a shot at you that isn't a shot at you,
 it feels like a shot.
 That was when I said to you today at lunch about vulnerability realizing that, hey,
 that felt like it was a shot.
 And they have an uncomfortable conversation because I wasn't taught emotional intelligence.
 We weren't taught anything. I was taught survival.
 How did not get your ass kicked?
 This was my survival.
 And sneak around so you didn't get beat.
 I hope that answers your question.
 But it was long.
 But those two things plus there was a lot of fear.
 And then when you give up that fear and you lose that chip on your feet,
 you think that you've lost your edge.
 So that.
 So being comfortable.
 It's being comfortable being comfortable, Ryan.
 Yeah.
 Not being uncomfortable.
 Because my whole life has been uncomfortable.
 Kelly, I wanted to maybe think this other really interesting.
 And I think both having these epiphanies that we're talking.
 It's just the beauty of the podcasting.
 But like I hear you say that.
 People like you.
 I am starting to be enlightened that like.
 You've been looking behind and over your shoulder so long and having no support.
 That like when it's actually there, you don't know how to handle it.
 Like it's, you know, I'm saying and like the end so it's kind of like the
 the boogie man that's in the room that's no longer in the room.
 But you still think he's there, but he's not.
 Do you know how uncomfortable it is sitting in there with you helping me?
 Do you see how I kept pivoting back to going?
 What can I do for you?
 What can I do for you?
 You pick that up right away.
 It's just it's got to be even Steven.
 I'm a big win guy.
 It has to be a win for the customer.
 Win for you.
 What is very uncomfortable to this day?
 I'm always looking over my shoulder.
 When I told you, I just told you in my neighborhood in Michigan, I walk around.
 I'm not supposed to be here.
 Being comfortable, being comfortable.
 We didn't have any food in the house.
 When I get hungry, look out.
 I start looking around like survival.
 Even though you went to Whole Foods the day before it's been $400 probably.
 Who am I going to fight for these men?
 It's just me.
 We were packing me good and that's why we're brothers, man.
 There's going to be time for you.
 Really squirm me.
 But I'm going to sit in my shit and I'm going to freaking go right through it.
 I may be afraid, but I know on the other side of that fear is what is our dreams.
 I do think that's for people listening.
 I think a lot of people have had trauma.
 There's no comparison of trauma.
 It's difficult.
 I've had trauma, but not the level of trauma that we're talking about.
 We actually get the way it's supposed to be.
 It's not being thankful, but it's not about being thankful, but it's about dropping your guard.
 That vulnerability and the things that allow you to enjoy the moment, I would imagine.
 I think people listening probably relate to that a lot.
 Enjoying the moment.
 That's where I said being comfortable, being comfortable, because I've never enjoyed a moment.
 I've done some crazy things.
 I've done some fabulous things.
 I've never been present because I always feel like the rug's going to be pulled out of my underneath you.
 And some of that drives you.
 And some of that makes you who you are.
 It's great.
 There's this thing called, it's a Latin name.
 Momento Mori.
 We're all going to die, Ryan.
 And I don't mean to be gruesome, but we got it.
 There's so many people that never live.
 I don't live a day in their life.
 I'm going to tell you right now, I'm going to live.
 And I'm living today.
 Today's been great.
 And we're going to go to dinner.
 And we're going to open 30 more businesses.
 And I'm excited.
 And I'm glad to be here.
 Carpe Diem.
 That sees today.
 And that's what that is.
 I don't know.
 I wake up and be miserable.
 You make your own weather.
 Life is so good.
 If you just get out of your own way and let it happen.
 Now listen, I can be mad at my parents all I want.
 They did the best they could.
 They did.
 And they weren't capable of doing any better.
 I've forgiven them.
 Do I have them in my life? No.
 And they never will be.
 I'll see them at their funeral.
 Some people say that that's the harsh.
 This is how I cope.
 When did the social media light bulb go off for you?
 I like asking people this.
 Did I now know it's gone off?
 Because and we'll give Kelly's
 all his plugs on Instagram and all this stuff.
 So you can go follow them.
 But it's obviously that light bulb went off at some point.
 But what was the light bulb moment for you
 of the power of social media?
 I'm not probably right now.
 I'm sitting in the red cast
 from social media.
 I think some parts of social media
 have a 14 year old daughter are bad.
 I think a lot of people,
 I think it's one of the toxins of the world
 with alcohol and drugs.
 If it's the use of everything in moderation,
 including moderation is good.
 There's people that scroll all day.
 If you can't sit alone with your thoughts and feelings,
 you got a problem.
 And address that.
 And on the other side, that's good.
 So when did it...
 I've never been asked that question.
 At some point, and it was before the
 us sitting here because
 unless you got 90,000 followers,
 100,000, whatever you've gotten a day,
 I know you haven't.
 But at some point you went,
 I got to get it on that.
 Because you knew that it could help your business
 and we're going to talk about the podcast and all that.
 But at some point, the light bulb went off.
 Yeah, I would say in the last couple weeks,
 we added 20,000 followers
 and the last few weeks from releasing
 good solid, consistent content
 that people want to consume.
 It doesn't come without a lot of detractors.
 And that's why I'm here talking with you
 because this is what you guys do
 in that radicals.
 Where it went off in the last month or so.
 And you know what, when I really
 had two reels go hit a million.
 That's when you're like,
 whoa, maybe I do know what I'm talking about.
 Now, growing up again,
 and I'm not trying to make excuses,
 but growing up the way that I did,
 it's hard to have confidence.
 There's cockies, arrogant,
 or whatever I am.
 There's still some limiting beliefs.
 And I would have fought you up until
 I did the EMDR this week.
 And so I think I broke loose so many things
 that I just went back as a man.
 I am enough.
 So in the last month, Ryan.
 Because you got somebody
 encourage you to do it.
 You started doing it.
 Then you're like, oh, shit.
 This actually has.
 You think, you know what happened?
 I started these videos,
 these morning videos,
 seagull things,
 that were motivational during the pandemic.
 And I was getting
 brutalized by my friends.
 They're like, that is stupid.
 You don't know what you're talking about.
 You know,
 that I knew I was out of something.
 You're bothering somebody.
 You're doing something right?
 I'm that kind of agitator.
 When I was, what do you say that?
 You said a word.
 You said a buzzword.
 So I got to stop you.
 For anyone listening,
 agitational content breaks through.
 Grace, my system's over here nodding
 because that's one of my buzzwords.
 But agitation.
 You're striking a nerve.
 You're doing it right.
 I haven't even started to agitate yet.
 Because I will tell you,
 I just put a post that I feel
 and have it a smile on my face doing it.
 That's when you know I'm not true
 about that itself.
 So if I'm thinking,
 that means I'm trying to be politically correct.
 And I'm trying to spin it nice.
 But when I just rip it,
 which is most of the reels that are coming out right now,
 we're just throwing at each other
 and something that I'm happy.
 And I'm really happy.
 And I like to stir the pot a little bit.
 You know what?
 Stirring the pot is so simple to do right now
 because they say one percent of the people control everything.
 If you're a one percenter,
 that means you're going to upset 99 percent of the people
 and it's pretty easy by just saying what I do.
 I just post that I work out every day
 and that agitates people.
 Really?
 Oh wow, you prioritize that.
 Wow, there you go.
 I haven't forbid.
 And I post every day.
 And I do these videos with my shirt off.
 And I'm stupid.
 The road less traveled is pretty lonely.
 If it were easy,
 everybody would be doing it.
 So if somebody starts knocking you,
 I call it crabs in the bucket, man.
 They want to pull you down to them.
 They don't want to see you achieve.
 And that's sad because I do.
 Together we rise.
 So we're sitting on the podcast.
 We're going to get meta here for a moment.
 I had the blessing of going on the harder than life podcasts.
 So at certain point,
 the social media light came on.
 So I'm on told you, hey, Kelly,
 you got a great personality.
 You need to have your own podcast to check
 so the box is there.
 Talk about podcasts.
 How's that been going?
 What's been that evolution?
 The podcast,
 I wrote the book during the pandemic.
 And then when the publisher was doing the edits,
 what else can I do in here?
 And I said nothing.
 I'm just going to hand this to my customers
 at National Technology Management.
 I'm going to do a chat to self-awareness.
 It's a memoir slash business book
 because I talk about how we built the National Technology Management
 until a multimillion dollar company.
 And then how everything that you would think
 that was happening bad to you was happening for me.
 And I put it all of the habits and everything I do.
 And I bear it at all.
 I put some stuff in there that when I wrote it,
 when I read it the first time after it was a real book,
 I took hours for me to read.
 I just stopped and go work out
 because it activated and triggered me fairly.
 And the podcast is where I feel at home.
 And it works.
 I've gotten customers for National Technology Management on it.
 You got a customer from being on it.
 This works.
 And it's fun.
 I'd rather listen to a podcast
 than listen to music or watch TV all day long
 because you can learn.
 Somebody's watching this right now is going to
 is going to call you up and get content from you
 or call you up from marketing
 or call us up for IT
 or reach out to me for supplements.
 I want that pill you take.
 They make sure it picks the hard.
 Yeah.
 Or my workout routines.
 And you know what?
 We're going to give it to them.
 We're just going to keep pouring back into things.
 So the podcast is called Harder than Life.
 I'm really a marketer.
 So everything's called Harder than Life.
 We're keeping it going.
 That's better than some people.
 A noodle or something.
 Yeah.
 How do you know how to go to it?
 Yeah.
 So I get behind that mic and it's just fun.
 I love rapping with people like this
 and just learning.
 I love people.
 I'm curious as can be.
 And I'm going to learn it all.
 And you can learn from everybody.
 Especially people that aren't exactly like you.
 I learned more from you in this after.
 Yeah, I feel bad because I heard you say
 I'm going to take care of you, baby.
 I'm good.
 It's all good.
 So the other podcast comes out every week on Tuesdays.
 We're going to double them up in July
 and do them on Thursdays too.
 Because we've got a heck of a demand.
 And we're going to get bigger and bigger guests
 that are coming on.
 And it's we're four months into this thing.
 And it feels like it's been forever.
 And I love it.
 I love it.
 It's fun.
 When you really get into it and you have natural conversations.
 It's funny. Like we've done here.
 When I'm having a really good one, like it opened.
 I'll take notes or grace now taking them for me.
 I'll go back and you'll have an idea.
 Or something sparse for me.
 Because when you're having an authentic conversation,
 you really like just having a purposeful.
 Because think about how crazy this is.
 Now I'm going to get real meta.
 Now you and I have done this today.
 Because I think you can vouch for me here.
 How many times have I pulled my phone out
 in the entire day?
 Once? Maybe my wife texted me.
 So like we've been in conversation.
 But think how rare it is today.
 To have unabated, uninterrupted listening and talking to one another.
 It's pretty fucking rare.
 Like it doesn't happen as much as it should.
 It's going off in my pocket.
 I know, but I'm saying.
 Like it doesn't happen that often anymore.
 We're all distracted and all doing these things.
 And that's the great thing because it brings out
 these kind of dialogues and these conversations.
 And that's what I love about it.
 Like it forces me.
 But it schedules for me those interactions.
 I think phones are necessary evil, but they are evil.
 So I've been at dinners with friends where we've taken our phones
 and put them in the center.
 And the first person to grab their phone has to pay for dinner.
 It's like that.
 It's a matter of fact.
 This is how I like we already just realized.
 When I did, I had my phone out and I was making notes.
 I said, I'm making notes.
 Because I think that I want to be present.
 You've taken the day out to spend with me.
 I've flown here.
 Why would I spend it on my phone?
 And I appreciate it.
 And I really, if there's a way to do what we need to do for work
 without having a phone, I would.
 I can't stand this thing sometimes.
 I was walking through the airport and every single person's on their phone.
 You look over at dinner and a whole family's on their phone.
 I have a rule of my daughter, no phone at the dinner table.
 And we do, we're old school since I didn't have food.
 We have breakfast together, sit down.
 We have dinner together, sit down.
 That's why I like to go to the lake because my kids,
 I don't have to tell them to put it down.
 They don't want it.
 We're fishing. We're riding the boat.
 We're swimming.
 So we don't, I look at my device as long as,
 especially as the weekend.
 And I know there's not something major going on with work.
 I don't even, I look at it at least there.
 And the kids do too because like it's just getting away from it a little bit.
 But you said that because I'm going to start doing a device holidays more often.
 Because when I find it with the less I look at my phone, the happier I am.
 Because you're just, where are I going to be for this email?
 What are we going to do for that?
 And I tried sometimes to shut it off for a day at a time.
 It's running several companies.
 And it enables us to do things.
 I don't want to, I'm like a great business out of people using their phones for marketing otherwise.
 But I do think there's like this balance.
 And I think we've long since gone over it.
 So it's just, let me be a little cheesy for just a second.
 And I'm going to, I'm going to throw out on you for a second.
 I'm going to tell you that I think it's because of our relationship already.
 And there's mutual respect.
 There was, it was an engaging vulnerable conversation.
 It was very interesting.
 It was pretty easy not to grab your phone.
 Exactly.
 Yeah.
 Thank you for having me and keeping interesting.
 I'm going to start opening my phone.
 That's all you're going to have to like, Ryan, your boring way.
 Where do you want it?
 Where do you, what's, when you set your sights on two years from now with the podcast.
 So no, that's a big goal for you.
 Companies doing great.
 Still growing that.
 But the podcast vision.
 I can see it going.
 I can see myself with by the end of the year, only doing the podcast.
 I'll still own national technology management, but I have an amazing team.
 And you can read about it how we use an operating system that allows me to be away from it a lot.
 So by 2024, I could see me doing nothing but the podcast and it being self-sufficient, paying for itself,
 and then donating.
 It's a high six figures to charity.
 That's what this is for.
 I'm going to be geeky again for a second or a bro.
 I hope to be half as successful as the right cast in half as much time.
 Yeah, I do things.
 How I've built most companies and most things.
 I do it in record breakneck speed.
 And if you ask my team, they always say he wants it done in half the time.
 And I think if you work twice as hard and you're half as smart, you've got to work twice as hard.
 So I just tell people success low speed.
 Success low speed.
 I like that.
 And if you want to be successful, even because some people will get lost in the sauce of it takes iteration to be successful
 because it doesn't happen the first time.
 So thus you're better to fail quickly so that you could big grass up and iterate again because you're not going to get it.
 I'm sorry.
 You're not going to get right the first time anyway.
 So we had it released and then we pulled it back the night before.
 So this is our second one.
 You know, it's funny because what does most people say slow and steady wins the race?
 I think there's a few things for that still applies.
 But I think in general though, it's and don't mistake that great things come over time.
 Like the impact of our relationship, the greatness of those outputs and things that we could do together will only grow over time.
 That's a different statement than the 20 things we talked about today.
 Let's start them now and go fast.
 You know what I mean?
 Yeah.
 There's a difference.
 So moving quicker with acts action.
 What do they say?
 Some people can be busy at life doing nothing.
 Yeah.
 So I know a lot of people.
 But I have to make progress.
 I just have to be moving forward.
 And that's part of feeling like if I stand still, I'm going to die.
 So I'm going to move forward.
 And when you got great people like you and or making great contacts,
 maybe that's just something to do with just being authentic and genuine and just very loyal too.
 You've got a friend and me and you call me millenite.
 You need me to come hide the bodies.
 But I don't have to do that.
 I don't know if Grace is going to pick up for that one.
 Great.
 We'll keep Grace out of this.
 Just bring a bleach in the chlorophyll.
 What's the future hole for Kelly as a whole?
 Like you got boats in Florida and Detroit.
 You're on the water all the time.
 Go look.
 Go into home now.
 We're going to follow Kelly Siegel on Instagram.
 Because that's where you're always at.
 What's the handle there?
 It's Kelly dot Siegel.
 And it's spelled K-E-O-I dot S-I-E-G-E-L dot 71.
 So I'm going to just reach out to me the other day and says,
 Hey, I got the Kelly dot Siegel one.
 I was like, good.
 Enjoy it.
 Yeah.
 I was like 300 bucks.
 I'm like, uh-huh.
 Sure.
 I'll just give you my log in and just give you Kelly dot.
 Oh, yeah.
 Yeah.
 How are you going to pay for it?
 Yeah.
 Exactly.
 But the, but all seriousness, if you go to follow Kelly,
 you'll see the boats and everything.
 I thought you were in Florida last night.
 You're in, I guess, Evan Michigan.
 But I was in, I'm like saying Claire on a boat up there having fun.
 I like to have my hair blowing in the wind.
 That's when I'm relaxed.
 A lot of times when I'm at the gym now, I'm listening to a podcast
 and I'm growing my muscles and growing my mind.
 So when I'm on a boat, I've been a captain of a boat for years.
 And I just want to make sure that everyone's safe.
 My crew's safe.
 We're safe.
 I don't drink.
 So I'm always a designated driver.
 And I like to go fast.
 I go fast on my Harley.
 I go fast on my boat.
 And it just, it relaxes me.
 Years and years ago when I was in therapy,
 you guys said, when do you ever relax?
 I said, when am I my boat?
 I said, go there.
 You know what it is?
 You crack a beer on the boat.
 I crack a non-alcoholic beer.
 It's just the same.
 And it's just, Evan, all the hard work that you did,
 you put to get that boat, it's just, it's relaxing.
 And I'm finally able to be present and enjoy it.
 Where we're headed, we're going to continue to grow.
 And we're going to try to, I'm going to use the Ricky Bobby quote,
 I want to live to 130, 140.
 With the advanced state, medical and himself,
 we can maybe we're going to, I want to live to 100.
 And to do that, I'm going to be healthy.
 I'm going to align with some brands to keep myself healthy.
 Good mind and body continue to work.
 And I believe the body is going to start to give out.
 So we're going to try to fight that as hard as we can,
 harder than life.
 And I'm going to keep putting out vulnerable, truthful content.
 We're going to make an impact.
 Hopefully in the next several years, we'll be able to say,
 we're at the seven figures for donations per year.
 And hopefully we'll help some kids not go through what I went through.
 And then we'll just see where the universe takes us at.
 I'm watching a lot of my daughters, 14, your kids, 14, 12.
 I'm noticing a lot of the kids gravitating to me.
 Maybe I can catch them a little sooner and get them with real good habits
 of what I do.
 And then also, I said this to somebody that asked me about this is,
 I want them to know that there's people out there that care.
 If you're in a situation where I, like I was, were abusive,
 it's not okay.
 And you won't get in trouble.
 So I want to make sure there's awareness of that.
 I lied to the social worker that showed up and said,
 everything's fine, even though it wasn't.
 Because I thought I would get in trouble.
 You're not going to get in trouble.
 So if there are kids listening to this,
 and I'm getting involved in a lot of charities
 and the podcast is allowing me access to areas where I couldn't
 previously do, who then we're going to continue to take this up
 and go higher and higher.
 And the sky's the limit.
 So maybe, hey, maybe we'll go on Rogan's podcast.
 That's, that's the, that's the, that's the Don Mecca of them.
 All right.
 I love it, man.
 We're going to keep hope of everything.
 We're going to find the book.
 We give them all the plugs.
 We have harder than life.com is the easiest one.
 IT services, which we keep IT simple.
 We make it simple and easy to do business with us.
 And you just gave us an idea to make it even more simple,
 which I can't believe I didn't think of.
 But it's trust NTM is a national technology management.com.
 We are available anywhere in the country.
 And it's predictable, repeatable, simple and easy.
 And it comes with cyber security, which we're all worried about.
 We don't know what even that means.
 But NTM will show you.
 I will show you.
 And our standard package includes all of the insurance compliance
 that you need for cyber security.
 So this isn't someone that's doing it out of the trunk of their car.
 Or I got a guy.
 We do it right.
 We do it the same way every single time.
 And it's compliant all the time.
 So trust NTM.com, heart of the life.com,
 Kelly that's Siegel at 71 at Instagram.
 Kelly Siegel at Facebook.
 I don't even know what my.
 What's the one that you talked to?
 I don't know what to talk is that my daughter follows on that stuff.
 But we're on that.
 I'm sure it's just Kelly Siegel.
 Yeah.
 But to come give us a shout.
 And I answer all my DMs right now.
 I try.
 It's hard.
 A lot of people get really deep.
 Oh, yeah.
 And I try and especially.
 So Brian, he's very important to me because it was such a big influence
 in my life.
 So if somebody reaches out to me, like,
 I need help not drinking or not drugging,
 or I need help with some talk to behavior.
 I stop what I'm doing and try to help.
 Now I'm not a doctor.
 And I'm not a therapist.
 And you're probably getting some tough love.
 And if you're suicidal, which happens,
 please go to the emergency room.
 But you matter.
 And if you're in that situation, your life means something.
 And I have talked a few people off the ledge via the ends.
 Stop.
 I did want a new year's eve.
 So I'm going to reach out to me.
 And I don't know.
 And I let I checked on him.
 I was walk.
 I was sitting in Birmingham.
 She was smoking a cigar.
 And a guy walked by me and stopped.
 And he goes, are you Kelly Siegel?
 I said, yes.
 A little nervous.
 I don't know what he's coming.
 And while I was in Florida, I had.
 I'd helped him stop drinking.
 And he invited me to his house and he's so indicted.
 And that feels good.
 So that's what we're going to keep given back to the universe and doing good things.
 And I know good things will keep happening for you.
 Appreciate you going on, brother.
 Man, I love you.
 Thank you.
 It's been fun.
 Hey guys, refined us the radcast.com.
 Search for harder than life.
 You'll find all the highlights clips from today.
 Search for Kelly Siegel.
 You'll find him on Instagram.
 You'll see his physique on the boat looking good.
 And given lots of practical advice.
 You can find me at Ryan Allford on all the platforms.
 We'll see you next time on the radcast.