3. Brihadaranyaka Upanishad - Yajnavalkya and Maitreyi Samvada: Mantras 2.4.1 to 2.4.5

[SPEAKER_01]: Om pur nama daftur nami dampur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur nama daftur n
[SPEAKER_01]: from that prudonum, which is the Saguna Brahman, this prudonum, which is the Jiva and the Jagat has a reason.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, that is prudonum, Saguna Brahman is prudonum, this this world manifested world is also prudonum.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this manifested world has a reason from that Saguna Brahman.
[SPEAKER_01]: And in this manifested Jiva, in ourselves, when we discover the prudonatwam, the infinite
[SPEAKER_01]: Then the pool number alone remains, the infinite alone remains.
[SPEAKER_01]: Ohm, peace, peace, peace.
[SPEAKER_01]: Namaste, and welcome back to the class.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is the Brezaniak Upanishad class.
[SPEAKER_01]: The Yagyevalkya might read some words.
[SPEAKER_01]: The dialogue between Yagyevalkya and my three.
[SPEAKER_01]: In the first two classes, we studied the peace chant, Purnamada, Purnamidam.
[SPEAKER_01]: That is infinite, this is infinite, et cetera.
[SPEAKER_01]: Somebody commented that, is this class about the Jaggyavalkya, my three dialogue, or is it about Purnamada?
[SPEAKER_01]: Why are you going on and on about that?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, he has because it is the peace chant for the Breodernic Upanishad and also because it is so extraordinarily profound, you know, sense all of Vedanta is packed into Purnamada Purnamida.
[SPEAKER_01]: Also because this mantra actually
[SPEAKER_01]: The peace chant, not only will you chant it at the beginning of the Upanishad, but it actually occurs in the Upanishad itself.
[SPEAKER_01]: In the 5th chapter, the beginning of the 5th chapter, the first verse, is Purnamada Purnamidham, and Shankaracharya writes an extensive commentary upon it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So for all of these reasons, we spent a little bit of time.
[SPEAKER_01]: Two whole classes devoted to taking a look at Purnamada Purnamidham.
[SPEAKER_01]: But yes, our subject is the dialogue between Yagya Valkya and May 3.
[SPEAKER_01]: Jaggiavalkya is the hero of the Brezarni Kupanishad.
[SPEAKER_01]: In fact, the Brezarni Kupanishad has three parts.
[SPEAKER_01]: These parts are called Kanda.
[SPEAKER_01]: First Kanda, then the second, first Kanda is called the Madhu Kanda, the Hanikanda, the Hanikanda.
[SPEAKER_01]: The second Kanda is called the Jaggiavalka, the Munikanda.
[SPEAKER_01]: Munikanda means the part of the sage, of the sage they refers to Jaggiavalkya.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the third part is called the killer calendar, which means the miscellaneous, killer basically is a heap or a gathering of many things together.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Vedanta is scattered across the whole open nation, which is specially the first and the second parts, and in chapter 2 in the fourth section, we find this dialogue between
[SPEAKER_01]: very profound, the sort of the building blocks of Vedanta, many of the things which we read about in Vedanta, they have their sources here, there are extraordinary statements here which later were used as the foundation for Vedanta, building blocks of Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, we are going to take a look at this.
[SPEAKER_01]: just by the way it's a peculiarity of this open issue that in the fifth section of the fourth chapter this entire dialogue is again repeated almost verbative.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, the dialogue between Jaggiavalki and May 3 occurs here in chapter 2, section 4, but again in chapter 4 and section 5 the same thing is repeated slight change, minor change.
[SPEAKER_01]: So why that is it's not very clear, but definitely that shows its importance.
[SPEAKER_01]: Ayagyevalkya is a Vedic sage, a Rishi, also a Muni.
[SPEAKER_01]: These are different terms, they are different meanings.
[SPEAKER_01]: Rishi means the one who has directly experienced the mantras of the Vedas.
[SPEAKER_01]: Rishaya Mantra, Darshtara, Sanskrit meaning.
[SPEAKER_01]: The Rishis are those who saw the mantras.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's interesting.
[SPEAKER_01]: They didn't compose the mantras.
[SPEAKER_01]: They didn't read about the mantras or they didn't even hear it.
[SPEAKER_01]: They saw it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, that's a rishi.
[SPEAKER_01]: Those who directly perceive these truths they are called rishis.
[SPEAKER_01]: Muni is Mananath, the one closest we have to a phylousifer.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, Muni is a phylousifer.
[SPEAKER_01]: Different interpretations are there anyway.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, Jagyavalky is the hero, but this section is not named after Jagyavalky.
[SPEAKER_01]: The section is named after his wife, my thread, it is called my thread,
[SPEAKER_01]: So Jagievalkiah had two wives, Maithri and Kathiaini, and this section starts with Jagievalkiah, and it's two wives.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a dialogue between husband and wife, and it's a dialogue about marriage and separation and monasticism and love and happiness, and the oneness of all existence Vedanta, about knowledge, about the practice of knowledge,
[SPEAKER_01]: how does one become enlightened, what is the purpose of life, all of these things, purpose of renunciation, all of these things are involved here, a very profound world, it's very rich
[SPEAKER_01]: Remember, the Breodernic Upanishad is part of the Vedas, and the Vedas are mostly about Vedic ritualism, the fire rituals which are called Jaggyam, even the name Jaggyamalkya comes from that, one derivation of his name, one meaning of the name is, his father was a great ritualist, a performer, a Brahmin, a performer of Vedic rituals, Jaggyam, Jaggyam is the Vedic ritual, and it's almost as if his cloth, he was clothed in Vedic ritualism.
[SPEAKER_01]: is the cloak.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, his son is called Yagya Valkyya.
[SPEAKER_01]: But Yagya Valkyya was not only a no-or-of-a-edic ritualism, but he is a master of Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_01]: He can say that he is the earliest hero of Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he is there throughout this Upanishad.
[SPEAKER_01]: He is certainly the main character of this Upanishad.
[SPEAKER_01]: And here, he once again makes an appearance in this chapter along with his wives.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and this chapter is very important for monasticism.
[SPEAKER_01]: What is monasticism, why should one become of one, what is the importance of renunciation?
[SPEAKER_01]: In the Vedic ritualistic context, the question will immediately arise.
[SPEAKER_01]: The bulk of the Vedas is about Vedic ritualism, but performing these rituals.
[SPEAKER_01]: And one of the conditions of performing these rituals is you have to be married.
[SPEAKER_01]: It has to be a husband and a wife, and it requires a sufficient amount of wealth, which is only possible.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can earn it in the householder life.
[SPEAKER_01]: So in a traditional structure of ancient Indian society, you have the student, the Brahmachari, then you have the householder, Krihasta, then you have the retired person, the forest dweller, the Wana Prasta, and then you have the monk Sanyasi.
[SPEAKER_01]: So these are the four, these are called Ashramas, stations of life, stages of life.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we will see soon that it was already well understood by that time, in the way ancient Vedic times itself.
[SPEAKER_01]: The these are the four stages of progression in life.
[SPEAKER_01]: And among these, it is the household who really earned money, who did productive work, and it is on the basis of the householders earned wealth that the others, the student, the retired person on, what is it, Medicaid or Medicare?
[SPEAKER_01]: I keep confusing the two.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that person, that wealth is earned by the rest of the people in the society.
[SPEAKER_01]: And of course, your own earned wealth.
[SPEAKER_01]: and even the monks, so all of them, they are provided for and taken care of by the household who is the foundation of society.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the householder is supposed to perform most of these very
[SPEAKER_01]: ritualistically there is a Vedic ritual for becoming a monk and becoming a monk in the Vedic paradigm means giving up the Vedic rituals that you no longer perform this Vedic rituals.
[SPEAKER_01]: You graduate to the path of knowledge the Upanishads.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now your texts are the Upanishads.
[SPEAKER_01]: Before that your texts where the ritualistic portions of the Vedas, now you are in the you are seeking enlightenment and freedom and so you are set free from the Vedic
[SPEAKER_01]: So a question will be asked, Shankaracharya often enters into this debate.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why?
[SPEAKER_01]: Why would one give up Vedic ritualism?
[SPEAKER_01]: What is the point?
[SPEAKER_01]: What is the conflict of interest as the saying goes?
[SPEAKER_01]: So he gives multiple arguments.
[SPEAKER_01]: Three of these arguments would be, one is
[SPEAKER_01]: At no point in the Upanishads, is it said that the Vedic rituals are parts, accessories or supplements to Brahma-Gyana, the knowledge of Brahma-Gyana.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not that they are necessary for the knowledge of Raman.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, where is it prescribed?
[SPEAKER_01]: That's one.
[SPEAKER_01]: Just the opposite, there are texts which say that they are not necessary.
[SPEAKER_01]: The renunciation of Vedic ritualism is actually necessary for enlightenment, or moksha, the knowledge of Raman, that requires the renunciation of Vedic ritualism.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, these are the two textual arguments, what is one textual argument, nowhere there is a text, there is an open issue of the text which says you have to perform very rituals for becoming enlightened.
[SPEAKER_01]: No.
[SPEAKER_01]: Second, there are texts which say that you have to go beyond the Vedic ritualism in order to become enlightened.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, these are two textual text-based arguments.
[SPEAKER_01]: Third, logic-based argument.
[SPEAKER_01]: What is called cause, nature and result.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hethu suru pa pala.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why do you engage in Vedic ritualism?
[SPEAKER_01]: And why would you seek the knowledge of Brahman?
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's the cause.
[SPEAKER_01]: What is the nature of Vedic ritual?
[SPEAKER_01]: What is the nature of seeking the knowledge of Brahman?
[SPEAKER_01]: That is the nature of these two paths.
[SPEAKER_01]: Third, what are the results of Vedic ritualism and the result of knowledge of Brahman?
[SPEAKER_01]: And the argument shows they are so different in each of these.
[SPEAKER_01]: The cause is the very nature of these two and the results.
[SPEAKER_01]: They are so different that they cannot be combined.
[SPEAKER_01]: So first, what is the cause?
[SPEAKER_01]: very rituals are those for those who have desires.
[SPEAKER_01]: I want something in this world.
[SPEAKER_01]: I want wealth, typical things, you know?
[SPEAKER_01]: We want wealth, you want children, you want diseases to be cured.
[SPEAKER_01]: You want a good rainfall and a plenty full harvest.
[SPEAKER_01]: You want plenty of cows, you want to say, why would you want plenty of cows?
[SPEAKER_01]: Remember, cows were a source, we'll see in a symbol of wealth, not symbol.
[SPEAKER_01]: They were actually wealth in ancient India.
[SPEAKER_01]: and in the in the wild west too of course the accounts where the source of where were wealth.
[SPEAKER_01]: So for all of this for prosperity, worldly prosperity or if you were a king to conquer enemies and expand your empire.
[SPEAKER_01]: So these are all worldly desires and where the rituals promise to help you there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Perform these Vedic rituals and the result will be your
[SPEAKER_01]: or the other world it desires, after death I would like to go to heaven and there is a whole range of heavens to choose from.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you can go to various levels of heavens depending upon your Vedic credit, how much good karma you have got stored up, how much and that depends on how much Vedic rituals have you performed.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's the cause of Vedic ritualism.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why?
[SPEAKER_01]: Why would you do that?
[SPEAKER_01]: Desire is instinctive in all of us.
[SPEAKER_01]: What Vedic ritualism does is it takes the instinctive desire, which is automatic, which is for we are born with desire and society.
[SPEAKER_01]: But what it does in common with all religion is that it tries to bring it under the limits of certain ethics, discipline so that it doesn't damage us, it doesn't damage society, slowly we grow out of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, a certain discipline, a certain mental purity, all of these are imposed upon us in order to fulfill our desires and so that we slowly rise above the animal nature.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what the Vedic ritualism does, gives us this worldly desires, fulfillment of this worldly desires and other worldly desires, whereas
[SPEAKER_01]: these seeking of Brahman, seeking of knowledge of Brahman is possible nishkāma when we rise above all worldly desires.
[SPEAKER_01]: If we do not have these worldly desires, and that's the condition for seeking Brahman.
[SPEAKER_01]: If we do not have these worldly desires, why would you perform Vedic rituals, worldly or other worldly desires?
[SPEAKER_01]: I do not want anything in this world.
[SPEAKER_01]: I do not want anything beyond this world also, heaven and you know, that I do not want in this world or in other worlds, none of it I want.
[SPEAKER_01]: with desire and without desire.
[SPEAKER_01]: Polar opposite, they cannot become bind.
[SPEAKER_01]: Therefore, Vedic ritualism and the seeking of the knowledge of Brahman and Lightenmit cannot become bind.
[SPEAKER_01]: One, second, the very nature, the nature of Vedic ritualism is called
[SPEAKER_01]: You earn wealth and you hire these Brahmin priests and you set up the fire altar, you have certain goals to be attained and then there are methods, the rituals to be performed, elaborate rituals to be performed, it's all activity.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's called Pravitti.
[SPEAKER_01]: to do these rituals in actual performance of them, and the capacity to perform these rituals, it's all worldly activities involved there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Whereas the nature of the seeking of Brahman is nivritty, where one turns inwards, and withdraws from worldly engagement.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the two cannot become mind.
[SPEAKER_01]: Private nivritty cannot become mind.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think we can call it circling outwards and circling inwards.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the two cannot become mind.
[SPEAKER_01]: These are stated in terms of Vedic ritualism and Vedic sannyasa, monasticism, but you can see these are the core ideas of any kind of spirituality, anywhere, the basic ideas, and then they are of course, interpretations are there and they are sophisticated understanding will be there.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is more internal than external.
[SPEAKER_01]: So a person who's seeking Brahman may be
[SPEAKER_01]: one might think that, but aren't you supposed to withdraw from activities, but withdraw from activities which activities, the desire prompted activities, the selfish activities, all activities designed for this person.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, if your activities are designed for you to transcend this personality, where you are pouring out your life, your energy, your time, your skill for the welfare of others, that actually transcends the human limitation and karma yoga.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, karma yoga will not be taken as part of these Vedic ritualism.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, it is higher than that.
[SPEAKER_01]: It becomes a spiritual practice.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, there are these, what I am saying, there are these subtleties involved.
[SPEAKER_01]: just because you say that Vedic ritualism is property activity, engagement and the seeking of Brahman or enlightenment is neverty, withdrawal does not it may not actually translate into physical engagement of physical withdrawal from the world.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then third, the result.
[SPEAKER_01]: The result is in Vedic ritualism is the fulfillment of desires in this life or the next life and the perpetuation of the cycle of birth and death, gentleman to chakra, the samsara.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, samsara is perpetuated, we do karma, yes, good karma.
[SPEAKER_01]: But the enlightenment, the result of enlightenment is freedom from the cycle of birth and it, freedom from the cycle of limited existences one after another birth after birth, after birth, freedom from that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, again the results are utterly different.
[SPEAKER_01]: because the causes are different because the nature is different because the results are different therefore Vedic ritualism and the search for enlightenment cannot become bind or they should not become bind and search for enlightenment requires us to give up Vedic ritualism with equal to giving up worldly desire and that is equivalent to monasticism.
[SPEAKER_01]: about formal monasticism and internally giving up the desires, those distinctions will be taken up soon.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, this is the background.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, Jaggyavalki comes to his two wives and says to them, he is actually speaking to my three first.
[SPEAKER_01]: In fact, in this section, Maetree alone makes an appearance, and his other wife Katyaen is mentioned, in the repetition of this section, in the next time it comes around, in chapter 4, section 5, their Katyaen is also mentioned there, these are small differences.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, the first mantra.
[SPEAKER_01]: May 3th, yag yaval, yag yaval, yag yaval, yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag yag y
[SPEAKER_01]: My three, my dear, said, Yarkyavalkyya, I am going to renounce this life, allow me to finish between you and Karkyaya.
[SPEAKER_01]: So Yarkyavalkyya goes to my three and says that I am going to become a monk, I am going to take up monastic life.
[SPEAKER_01]: And now, first thing to notice here is, he takes permission from his wife.
[SPEAKER_01]: And second, is that the word that is used, an old, old word for monasticism, odiasyan.
[SPEAKER_01]: It means to become a monk, but the literal meaning is very important.
[SPEAKER_01]: The technical literal meaning there is to rise above.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, this is what one must understand here.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not a question of your married and now I want to be separate or I want to devote you, maybe I want to be single or I want to get married to somebody else.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not that at all.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's your moving on from one stage of life to another.
[SPEAKER_01]: Just as you had moved on from the your single, your student, I mean a youth and then you move on to your married life.
[SPEAKER_01]: a relationship raise a family had you know have a career job earn money all of that
[SPEAKER_01]: and engagement with society and the world.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you rise to the next stage, which they were already there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Actually, they were all, they means Jaggivalke and his wife, they were all forest dwellers.
[SPEAKER_01]: That means the Wana Prostas.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and then you move beyond this householder life or the forest dweller life to monastic life, where you are alone, you are by yourself.
[SPEAKER_01]: And your entirely the whole point is to be dedicated to the pursuit of enlightenment.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is only one point.
[SPEAKER_01]: You give up all the Vedic rituals.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the technical side of it, the Vedic side of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: What does all this mean from the Vedic perspective?
[SPEAKER_01]: The Vedic perspective, we are together, okay, saying I am no longer in that stage of life where we perform Vedic rituals.
[SPEAKER_01]: I am now one, I want to be in that stage of life where my text, my worldview, is the Upanishadic worldview, is the Vedantic worldview.
[SPEAKER_01]: And my goal is realization of Brahman.
[SPEAKER_01]: that I am from and my goal is to be free of the psychological burden death.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, all of that is implied when he says, I wish to rise above this udyasyan, basically becoming a monk.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the importance of this is, it's an entirely different life.
[SPEAKER_01]: the spiritual life, a life completely dedicated to God-realization, to spirituality, that it is possible, not only possible, it is normal.
[SPEAKER_01]: not only normal, it's something open to everybody in society.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is one of the great things about the Hindu world view, or not just Hindu, but this James also have that, that it is possible, that spirituality is real and normal and available to everybody, that we can all come to it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Not only we can come to it, we must come to it at some point or the other.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not something weird, it's not something suspect, something outdated
[SPEAKER_01]: So, I mean Ashokanji says, he was the head of our pedant to society in northern California decades ago.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, 1950s, 60s, those were the years of the Cold War, USSR and USA.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, there he says, look, before us are these two ideals.
[SPEAKER_01]: the free market capitalists society where we are in San Francisco in those days in California.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the communists, the Russians, the Soviet Union.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now either one of them will then thank God the free market, the free world, one that particular cold war, that's struggling.
[SPEAKER_01]: But one of them will win, but then what then?
[SPEAKER_01]: Both of them are very this world, both of these systems, they assure you of some kind of ideal society and economy and politics in this world.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then very soon, each of us individually, what about us?
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to get old and die one day very soon.
[SPEAKER_01]: What's our destiny?
[SPEAKER_01]: Whether it's a communist country or a capitalist country, all that's very good, but what's our, what's the point of it on individually for us?
[SPEAKER_01]: And there he says, it's wonderful that a society should have a transcendent ideal before it, for everybody, that there is something beyond death, that we are not the body, we are not the mind.
[SPEAKER_01]: In fact, we are one with God and the purpose of all of this, in fact, life and the relationships and society and politics and nation, all of this philosophy religion, the point of all of this
[SPEAKER_01]: And one day you can all come to it to have to have that as a reality in a society.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think he says, it's a psychological, it's such a great thing to have in society.
[SPEAKER_01]: To have it at the back of your mind.
[SPEAKER_01]: So today for example, the India has the largest population in the world, well over a billion people.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now not that a billion people are thinking about becoming monks eventually.
[SPEAKER_01]: But in general, it is in the air that spirituality is possible.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a normal thing that people can pursue different forms of spirit, not just Vedanta, different forms of spirituality are certainly possible, very real, very respected.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a Ashokanji says, it's psychologically a great thing to have in society, at the back of your mind.
[SPEAKER_01]: On the shelf maybe, right now I may be interested in
[SPEAKER_01]: ultimately, that's there.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, this udyasyon, Agyagya Valkyases, now I rise from this, from where we are, I rise up from this.
[SPEAKER_01]: And for that, I'm moving out of married life.
[SPEAKER_01]: I will make it, it's also phrase very interestingly.
[SPEAKER_01]: I will make an end to this relationship between
[SPEAKER_01]: I am not cutting down the relationship between you and me.
[SPEAKER_01]: He says, I am ending the relationship between you and Kati Aayani.
[SPEAKER_01]: These two ladies, they were not related to each other except through Yagyevalky.
[SPEAKER_01]: They are co-wives, they married to Yagyevalky.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, in this indirect way he is saying and devolving the marriage.
[SPEAKER_01]: And therefore, he says, how will I do this?
[SPEAKER_01]: I will do this by offering you my property, I will let me offer you my property, all of this it belongs.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now I have no further need of it, I shall give it to you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now my tree, so basically I give the teacher here, but my tree is very central here because of multiple reasons you will see very soon and that is why this section is called my
[SPEAKER_01]: Saho, this is the second one, the second mantra.
[SPEAKER_01]: My tree says, Sir, if indeed this whole earth full of wealth be mine, shall I be immortal through that?
[SPEAKER_01]: No, replied, Yaggavalkya, your life will be just like that of people who have plenty of things, but there is no hope of immortality through wealth.
[SPEAKER_01]: Crucial question, this is what makes my tree extraordinary.
[SPEAKER_01]: More details are given in this repetition, which we will find later in the open issue, where Kathya and Yawksa comes in.
[SPEAKER_01]: So when Yawksa proposes this, I will now leave, but I will divide my property among the two of you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Methray says, the question, she asks, will this help me to attain enlightenment?
[SPEAKER_01]: Will this help me to attain immortality?
[SPEAKER_01]: Will this help me to set me free from the cycle of birth and death?
[SPEAKER_01]: Brahma Bhadini is the one who she who discourses on Brahma.
[SPEAKER_01]: So she who is very interested in seriously interested in spiritual life, a spiritual genuine spiritual seeker, a seeker of Brahma Bhadini, one who is seeking immortality and lightenment.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Katya is described as just the opposite.
[SPEAKER_01]: So she is pretty happy with worldly stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: She has no problems with that and in fact, she's happy if she gets the whole share.
[SPEAKER_01]: Everything else also, what is my trace share also, if she gets, gets that she's happy.
[SPEAKER_01]: She is in fact, Shankarajarya comments there.
[SPEAKER_01]: She's of the nature who satisfied with this word.
[SPEAKER_01]: She might three wants to know if this will give me fulfilment, happiness, fulfilment, enlightenment, freedom from suffering.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is not even a question which comes to Katya any.
[SPEAKER_01]: She's happy.
[SPEAKER_01]: She wants that wealth.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so she is of the nature who is interested in the daily stuff of worldly life.
[SPEAKER_01]: Trunkeracharya actually hints at that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So she is interested in, okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: So what's on the menu?
[SPEAKER_01]: What shall we cook tomorrow and what shall I wear tomorrow?
[SPEAKER_01]: And what's the gossip here?
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'll take a few selfies and post it online.
[SPEAKER_01]: Stuff like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean she's basically he's quite happy.
[SPEAKER_01]: What about Brahman Enlightenment and what the ultimate purpose or the value of wealth?
[SPEAKER_01]: She has no questions on that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So she's either she's content with Welled and this life.
[SPEAKER_01]: She feels this is what we are meant to be.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is this is life.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is real What about Brahman?
[SPEAKER_01]: What about the cycle of love to a life and death?
[SPEAKER_01]: What about some sorrow?
[SPEAKER_01]: What about enlightenment?
[SPEAKER_01]: Her attitude could be one of the two where people are agnostic or atheistic, you know that I really don't believe all that is possible.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just thinking aloud here, but arguments people give.
[SPEAKER_01]: I really don't think such things are possible or real.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it just deluded and those things are not real.
[SPEAKER_01]: God doesn't exist or enlightenment doesn't exist all of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: or maybe it does, but probably it's not for me or I am not really genuinely interested in those things.
[SPEAKER_01]: I am not pulled towards it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It could be.
[SPEAKER_01]: So she was very clear.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you are not interested in these things, and so she is happy to take the wealth.
[SPEAKER_01]: Whereas, Metri asks,
[SPEAKER_01]: What to speak of this wealth?
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, what wealth was it?
[SPEAKER_01]: It is not mentioned.
[SPEAKER_01]: Jaggiavalki was Rishi.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, he was not a multi-millionaire or a billionaire.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, he probably didn't have that much wealth.
[SPEAKER_01]: May 3 asks,
[SPEAKER_01]: What to speak of this wealth?
[SPEAKER_01]: If you cover the world with wealth, all the wealth in the world.
[SPEAKER_01]: If that is made available to me, if you give me that, would that still lead to fulfilment, would it lead to overcoming sorrow and suffering, would it lead to enlightenment, would it lead to freedom from some sorrow?
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's a question.
[SPEAKER_01]: not that Yagyevalki was poor because if you see the other sections of the Brezarni Kupanishad, he was a pretty smart cookie.
[SPEAKER_01]: So for example, there are discussions of there are debates which are described in the other sections of the Brezarni Kupanishad.
[SPEAKER_01]: Great debates, debates among the great masters who are the noers of Brahman.
[SPEAKER_01]: In the debates in the court of the emperor, sometimes it's jannaka sometimes somebody else and the prize is always cows.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's a great debate where in order to determine who is the best knower of Brahman, the greatest supreme knower of Brahman, the most enlightened of everybody.
[SPEAKER_01]: So and the great masters all come, the learned stages, they all come to debate.
[SPEAKER_01]: And what's the price?
[SPEAKER_01]: A thousand cows and the horns of the cows are actually tipped with gold.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the horns are covered with gold, tipped horns of the cows and a thousand cows.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Jaggiavalka is one of the debaters.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is so much humor and fun in this open issue, the mystery also.
[SPEAKER_01]: So Yandia Valkyre comes with his student, and he tells his disciple that, go ahead, take those cows and drive them to our ashram.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll join you later.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll see you later.
[SPEAKER_01]: Even before the debater started, even before he has engaged even one opponent or defeated anybody else.
[SPEAKER_01]: Even before the proceedings have started, Jaggiavalkya says, take the stuff, take the prize home.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll join you a little later coming, and then everybody is so affronted, they're furious, they challenge him and they say, what is this behavior?
[SPEAKER_01]: You think you are the greatest knower of Pramun among all of us?
[SPEAKER_01]: And Yagya Valkyre's answer is so humorous, you know, she says, oh, no, I bow down to all of you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Great masters, the noards of Pramman.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just want the cows.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why I'm taking.
[SPEAKER_01]: He said literally, I just wanted the cows.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why I'm taking the first order of business to take the cows away.
[SPEAKER_01]: So clearly, Yagya Valkyre had a lot of property who's pretty sharp there.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, this is a well-known story in the Upanishads.
[SPEAKER_01]: In fact, there is a funny segue to this.
[SPEAKER_01]: One of our swamis in India.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, one of the asthms is received government grants for the college.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so, with every government there is a bureaucracy.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so the Swami who's duty, it is to run the college on a regular basis.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have to run to the government office and ask them that you release these grants.
[SPEAKER_01]: And here are the applications.
[SPEAKER_01]: Here are the documents in duplicated or triplicated.
[SPEAKER_01]: What not?
[SPEAKER_01]: And the documents will always be the slow.
[SPEAKER_01]: Or in every time you go, the documents are lost.
[SPEAKER_01]: Once Swami was very humorous.
[SPEAKER_01]: He said, I always make four copies of the documents.
[SPEAKER_01]: for the government offices.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why for copies?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, one copy is for the government office.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's our application for the grant.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the second copy is a copy that I hold on to for my records.
[SPEAKER_01]: A third copy will be in the office.
[SPEAKER_01]: What's the fourth copy for?
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, he says that's the last and found copy.
[SPEAKER_01]: When you lose the document, I will give you that copy.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, the story goes and one of these visits to the government offices, one of our Swami's goes and the government officer who is going to meet, that officer says, well Swami, have you come for discussions about Brahman or for cows, referring to the Jagdhyavalkiastauri.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, cows means the government grant.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Jaguvelk is answered, the impact in one of the debates, the emperor sees Jaguvelk has turned up and Jaguvelk is always asking for money, money means cows.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the emperor says, well, Jaguvelk, have you come for discussion about Brahman about Vedantic discussions or do you want cows?
[SPEAKER_01]: And Jaguvelk is answered is both sir, both are hyenas.
[SPEAKER_01]: I won't cause, and I will talk about Vedanta also.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this Swami also said the same thing to the government officer.
[SPEAKER_01]: Both, I'm here for both, and we'll talk about philosophy, and we'll also talk about the government grants.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, my three asks, Sarava, Pritivi, Vittayna, Pudna, Siyath, even if Yagyevilka does have lots and lots of cows, still.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you offered all of this to me, and all of the world filled with wealth to me, would it give me immortality?
[SPEAKER_01]: Would it take me beyond death?
[SPEAKER_01]: Or am I still going to die?
[SPEAKER_01]: Would it take me beyond unhappiness?
[SPEAKER_01]: Or would I still be unhappy?
[SPEAKER_01]: Would it give me limitless fulfillment?
[SPEAKER_01]: Or would I still have wants even after getting all that wealth?
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the question.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Yagyevalki's answer is so well considered.
[SPEAKER_01]: He says, no.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, that is not so did, or did Yagyevalka win the debate, yes, he always won the debates.
[SPEAKER_01]: Everywhere.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why he is the hero.
[SPEAKER_01]: And those debates, what he said, and what the opponents said, that becomes the teaching of the Upanishad.
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, Yagyevalka says not so, Yateva, Uppakarana Batam, Jivitam, Tateva, Jivitam,
[SPEAKER_01]: you will live the life of the wealthy.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, look at the very reasonable answer that you are going to be able to get.
[SPEAKER_01]: Often Vedanta is seen as world denying, life denying.
[SPEAKER_01]: No.
[SPEAKER_01]: Vedanta does not say that wealth is useless or money is useless.
[SPEAKER_01]: You say yes, it has its use.
[SPEAKER_01]: You will
[SPEAKER_01]: So people uppercorn about them literally means those who have all the gadgets, let us put it.
[SPEAKER_01]: All the stuff that is necessary for a comfortable life in this world.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you'll have a house and a car maybe one more than one and you'll have the latest iPhone and the best kitchen and living room and all the branded stuff and the latest in fashion and you'll go to nice vacations, all of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you will live a life of the life that rich people are prosperous people live, but he is uncompromising here, he says, Amritat was Yatunashah stivitena.
[SPEAKER_01]: There is no hope at all.
[SPEAKER_01]: There is no hope at all of immortality, a freedom from suffering, of attainment, of fulfillment through wealth, is simply no hope.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then she replies and this is what makes her immortal really, I mean technically of course she became enlightened, became immortal but for us immortal through the ages that is why we remember her and that is why this section is named after her.
[SPEAKER_01]: Stunning reply from my three and her demand, she changes the whole gain.
[SPEAKER_01]: Saho wa chamitri, Yenaham namritasyaam kimahamteenakuryaam yadeva bhagavan beda tadevim tadeva me bruhiti, then my three said, what shall I do with that which will not make me immortal?
[SPEAKER_01]: Tell me sir of that alone which you know to be the only means of immortality.
[SPEAKER_01]: Amazing, thrilling statement, here she says, then I don't want it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I do want something.
[SPEAKER_01]: I want that for which you are giving this up.
[SPEAKER_01]: So give me a share in that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to share in something that you're throwing away.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not here to accept that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I want what you want.
[SPEAKER_01]: I want that which you know.
[SPEAKER_01]: I want that which you value.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I want my share in that.
[SPEAKER_01]: But an amazing thing, he says, by which I shall not attain immortality, by which I shall not attain to freedom from the cycle of life and death, by which I shall not be able to cross over the ocean of some sorrow, what will I do with that, I do not need it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And there is something that I need, that thing for which you are giving all of it up, you are giving up your relationship with me and all of that wealth, for that thing, I want that one.
[SPEAKER_01]: So amazing.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is what transforms my three from a worldly person into a spiritual seeker.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is the turning point.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm going to go back and say, renunciation is the turning point in all the yoga's.
[SPEAKER_01]: The yoga's all become activated, various meditation on knowledge or devotion, whatever all spiritual practices become genuinely spiritual.
[SPEAKER_01]: If there is this decisive turning away from worldliness.
[SPEAKER_01]: As long as my, I'm invested in worldliness, no matter what sophisticated spiritual path I follow, it's not of much use.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm still tethered to the world.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like those drunkers, who don't Christian the parable of the drunkers, three friends who are drunken, they at night dishtumble to the boat, which they want to cross over.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, symbol for crossing over the river or ocean of Samsara.
[SPEAKER_01]: and then they row and row all through the night.
[SPEAKER_01]: The next morning they find there exactly where they started because they had forgotten to untie the boat.
[SPEAKER_01]: The boat was still tied to the pier, to the dock.
[SPEAKER_01]: Similarly, those who do not renounce wordings as they
[SPEAKER_01]: They are not yet genuinely ready for spirituality.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a good, they have an interest, a curiosity, but if the whole investment is still is in wealth, in health, in name and fame, that's my primary concern, in family, that's my primary concern, is my primary concern, God or the world.
[SPEAKER_01]: in biblical terms, where your treasure is there, your heart will be.
[SPEAKER_01]: So if my treasure is in Brahman, in enlightenment, in freedom, then my heart will be there.
[SPEAKER_01]: If my treasure is here, in property, in Facebook likes, in my physical appearance or health and all of, then my heart will be here.
[SPEAKER_01]: crucial point here.
[SPEAKER_01]: This makes my tray qualified to be a spiritual seeker.
[SPEAKER_01]: She says, I want that for which you are renouncing all this.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, first of all, she has shown why ragge, a dispassion for worldliness.
[SPEAKER_01]: Second, she has shown Viveka, the distinction between the knowledge of Brahman and the pursuit of worldliness.
[SPEAKER_01]: between the ritualistic life which they have led till now, and the pursuit of self-realization.
[SPEAKER_01]: This distinction she knows, there is an ultimate reality which has to be realized, enlightenment is possible, that's what I want, and dispassion for worldly pursuits, which they have been pursuing for so many years now.
[SPEAKER_01]: This makes us her a secret of
[SPEAKER_01]: So, she is qualified to ask this question, you know, who am I, how do I become enlightened, tell me about that, give me that teaching and here there is a subtle undertone here.
[SPEAKER_01]: Look, Jaggyavalki is going to become a monk.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's leaving it all that a formal monasticism is clearly indicated here.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you are in married life, you come out of married life.
[SPEAKER_01]: You become alone and you dedicate all your life.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you give up property, you give up your relationship to your spouse, to your children, to everything in this world, and your one-pointed quest for God Realization.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what you dedicate yourself to.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, my tree is not, there's no mention that she becomes a monk or a nun.
[SPEAKER_01]: And yet, that's the interesting subtext in the open issue.
[SPEAKER_01]: She is fully qualified for enlightenment, because now Yagyevalki teaches her.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you teach a person who's qualified for Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, she has qualified, she has become qualified for Vedanta, because she has shown renunciation.
[SPEAKER_01]: She has given up worldliness and chosen spirituality.
[SPEAKER_01]: For a world view,
[SPEAKER_01]: at the right world view.
[SPEAKER_01]: In the terms of the Buddhist, the first step in the Buddhist eightfold path is some near Christianity, is the right world view, is here is the right world view, that
[SPEAKER_01]: pursuits in this world are limited by karma, worldly karma or ritualistic karma, I can only attain to limited ends.
[SPEAKER_01]: Even if I go to heaven, that'll also come to an end, one day I'll be back here again.
[SPEAKER_01]: The unlimited end, infinite result is possible only through knowledge, only through the realization of Brahman.
[SPEAKER_01]: This clarity she has got and she has renounced
[SPEAKER_01]: That means the nature, the renunciation is crucial and indispensable without that no genuine spirituality is possible.
[SPEAKER_01]: But that renunciation can be of two forms.
[SPEAKER_01]: One it can be a formal renunciation, a sannyasi, who is formally taken to the life of renunciation like the Jagdhyavalkya, or it could be like a matri.
[SPEAKER_01]: where she is still there, she is not becoming formally becoming a non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-non-
[SPEAKER_01]: My whole hearted pursuit is of permanent, not of samsara, my whole hearted pursuit is now god realization enlightenment, moksha, not of dharma at takama, wealth and pleasure and going to heaven and things like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, this internal switch is crucial.
[SPEAKER_01]: After that, you can add on the formal renunciation.
[SPEAKER_01]: We can actually become a monk like this or like Yagyevalkyya.
[SPEAKER_01]: or you might not like my three, but then you are qualified for enlightenment.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's the very important thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: This question she asks, if it is not, it will, these things will not lead to enlightenment, then I do not want them.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I do want enlightenment, I do want Vedanta, I want to share of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: this is the beginning of spiritual life, this is, I mean, this is unconditional, that there is no other way, you must walk down the path shown by my three.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sri Ramakrishna's demonstration, if famous stories there, how you would sit on the bank of the Ganga and take handfuls of coins and handful of clay and throw into the river, Taka Mati Mati Taka, this money and clay,
[SPEAKER_01]: are the same.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is dirt, this is money and both are the same.
[SPEAKER_01]: I would throw it into the Ganga.
[SPEAKER_01]: This, this is what my three demonstrates and she makes Jagievalkia extremely happy.
[SPEAKER_01]: See Jagievalkia says,
[SPEAKER_01]: Sahova chayagya valkyaha Priya Batari Nasati Priyambha Shasai Ehi Asva Bhakya Siamite Bya Chaksharna Siyatumi Nididdya Saita Nididdya Saita Saita Saita Saita
[SPEAKER_01]: Jaggiavalkya said, my dear, you have been my beloved even before and you say, what is after my heart?
[SPEAKER_01]: Come take your seat.
[SPEAKER_01]: I will explain it to you.
[SPEAKER_01]: As I explain it, meditate on its meaning.
[SPEAKER_01]: Very simple and beautiful reply from Jaggiavalkya.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's so happy.
[SPEAKER_01]: He says,
[SPEAKER_01]: by dear, you were beloved of me.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if he is saying that you were my favorite that would make Shakti any mad.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hopefully, she was not around at that time.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you are beloved, you are already my beloved.
[SPEAKER_01]: And now by saying this, you've truly become very dear to me.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have said something that's very close to my heart.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so very affectionately, he says, A, he come here.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is an affectionate way of summoning somebody.
[SPEAKER_01]: A, he come here, ask, that is, sit here, sit by me, come here, my dear, sit by me.
[SPEAKER_01]: We are Kya Siyamite, I shall teach you.
[SPEAKER_01]: I shall expound Vedanta to you.
[SPEAKER_01]: And as I speak to you, meditate upon it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So this is the teaching here.
[SPEAKER_01]: So many things are said here.
[SPEAKER_01]: he argue well care acknowledges that she is fit for Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_01]: She is a genuine seeker of spirituality of Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he says, I shall teach, so showing that what is necessary here in spiritual life is knowledge.
[SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't say, I will show you how to meditate or this is how you breathe or this is how you perform the Vedic sacrifices.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, no, no, no.
[SPEAKER_01]: Come here and sit and listen.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, that sit and listen, the importance of the teacher and student, that is what is spiritual life in Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a transmission of this knowledge from teacher to student.
[SPEAKER_01]: It could be something else.
[SPEAKER_01]: This simple but crucial distinction to understand the nature of Vedanta, contrast it with
[SPEAKER_01]: the regular performance of elaborate, varied sacrifices.
[SPEAKER_01]: There is no skum here, sit and listen, no, there it is rituals to be observed, vows to be taken, various performances, chanting of mantras or the right lighting, the sacred fire, all of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: He says, no, he is talking about an entirely different kind of spirituality here.
[SPEAKER_01]: is come, sit, listen.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, teacher student, that is the first thing to be noted here, and the subtext here no longer are the husband and wife, that is dissolved.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now he is the guru and she is the student, second.
[SPEAKER_01]: what is the spirituality here?
[SPEAKER_01]: What does it comprise of?
[SPEAKER_01]: He will speak the teaching will be given and she has to listen.
[SPEAKER_01]: Shavana, that is, listening is the first component and then he says, he emphasizes, listen attentively and meditate upon it, attend to it.
[SPEAKER_01]: The word needed diaspora is used here, that is later on it becomes the needed diasana, the Vedantic non-dual meditation.
[SPEAKER_01]: But here it comprises both Manana and needed diasana, reasoning,
[SPEAKER_01]: and meditating.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, in a seed form, listening, reasoning, meditating, which will come very so neatly come.
[SPEAKER_01]: What does it comprise of?
[SPEAKER_01]: This is important to note also, because if you ask about spiritual practice, it could be many things.
[SPEAKER_01]: It could be how do you sit and how do you breathe and what do you visualize, what are the things you have to believe
[SPEAKER_01]: By listening, you will get the knowledge.
[SPEAKER_01]: By reasoning, you will understand it, you will gain clarity.
[SPEAKER_01]: By meditating upon it, the clarity will become a living reality, it will become assimilated.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that knowledge will remove the ignorance about your real nature, which you already are.
[SPEAKER_01]: See, by this, already is implied that you are already Brahman.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because if knowledge will help you, this listening, reasoning and meditation can only give you knowledge.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't do anything else.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, if knowledge can help you in that case, what you will get by knowledge is what you already wear.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, that means, you are already growing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, this listening, reasoning and meditation are implied here, the method of Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_01]: Even the word, the term batha, here is syndicated of affection, of love, of tenderness.
[SPEAKER_01]: So this is a very affection, it will be of calling her and asking her to sit nearby.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, even that is another thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Come and sit near me.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's literally the meaning of the word, Upanishad.
[SPEAKER_01]: Come and sit near the teacher.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you literally mean, if you say the Upanishad, So Upam means to come and sit near the teacher.
[SPEAKER_01]: And here is literally doing that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Come and sit near me and listen.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, this is the background.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, the teaching will start.
[SPEAKER_01]: I will just read the teaching, the first paragraph of the teaching and the translation and we will stop there.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then with a lot to be unpacked, which we will do at our leisure in the next class.
[SPEAKER_01]: The fifth, the fifth mantra.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, Hoba-chan nava-are-patyukama-yapati-pri-obhavati-at-manas-tukama-yapati-pri-obhavati,
[SPEAKER_01]: Nava are e jaya yay kama yaya jaya priyabhavati atmanas tukama yaya jaya priyabhavati Nava are e puttranam kama yaya puttraf priyabhavanti Atmanas tukama yaya puttraf priyabhavanti Nava are e bitas yakama yavittam priyabhavati Atmanas tukama yavittam priyabhavati
[SPEAKER_01]: Atmanasthukama yabramhapriam bhavati Navaa rikshatrasyakama yakshatramkriam bhavati Atmanasthukama yakshatramkriam bhavati Navaa rilokanam kama yak Lokafriabhavanti Atmanasthukama yalokafriabhavanti
[SPEAKER_01]: Navarri, Devanam, Kamaya, Devaf, Priya, Bhuvanti, Atmanastu, Kamaya, Devapriya, Bhavanti, Navarri, Bhutanam, Kamaya, Bhutanipriyani, Bhavanti, Atmanastu, Kamaya, Bhutanipriyani, Bhavanti,
[SPEAKER_01]: Navarri, Sarvasya Kama, Sarvampriyam Bhavati, Atmanastukama, Sarvampriyam Bhavati, Atma Vahari, Dreshtabdiya, Shrutabdiya, Mantabdiya, Nidhidhya, Siddabdiya, Maithriy, Atmanovahari, Darshanina, Shabhanina, Muttya, Bikyanina, Idamsarvambi Ditham,
[SPEAKER_01]: He said, it is not for the sake of the husband, my dear, that he is loved, but for the say, one's own sake that he's loved.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not for the sake of the wife, my dear, that she's loved, but for once, own sake that she's loved.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is not for the sake of the sons, my dear, that they are loved, but for once, own sake that they are loved.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is not for the sake of wealth, my dear, that it is loved, but for one's own sake, that it is loved.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is not for the sake of the Brahman, my dear, that he is loved, but for the one's own sake, that he is loved.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is not for the sake of the Kshatriya, my dear, that he is loved, but for one's own sake, that he is loved.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is not for the sake of the words, my dear, that they are loved, but for one's own sake, that they are loved.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is not for the sake of the gods, my dear, that they are loved, but for once, own sake, that they are loved, it is not for the sake of beings, my dear, that they are loved, but for once, own sake, that they are loved, it is not for the sake of all my dear, that all is loved, but for once, own sake, that it is loved, the self-media, my three, should be realized, should be heard of, reflected on and meditated upon.
[SPEAKER_01]: by the realization of the self-media through hearing, reflection and meditation, all this is known.
[SPEAKER_01]: A lot there.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, he starts with love.
[SPEAKER_01]: Whatever we love,
[SPEAKER_01]: You love me.
[SPEAKER_01]: He says to her husband, but the husband is love not to the sake of the husband.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's love for one's own sake, for the sake of the self.
[SPEAKER_01]: The wife is love not for the sake of the wife, but for the sake of the self, similarly children.
[SPEAKER_01]: So he goes from those who are closest to you, further and further and further and further.
[SPEAKER_01]: And all you are worth.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, love for one's own sake and the people in the community, the Brahmin, the Kshatriya, they love for not for their sake, but for one's own sake.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, the words we live in, the lives we have built, they are not love for their sake, but it's love for us.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, the, um, living beings, the creatures all around other human beings and all other creatures, not love for their sake, but it's love for yours, your own sake.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um,
[SPEAKER_01]: So, all in this world is not allowed for the sake of the all, but it is loved for the sake of the self.
[SPEAKER_01]: And, at minus 2 comma, yes, sir, one pream, however, it is loved for the sake of the self.
[SPEAKER_01]: Atma, where either step here, and this self should be heard about.
[SPEAKER_01]: First up, you say, this self should be realized.
[SPEAKER_01]: It should be literally seen.
[SPEAKER_01]: What is this self?
[SPEAKER_01]: Who am I?
[SPEAKER_01]: This should be seen.
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you mean seeing how, how do you see the self?
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't see it physically.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you have to hear about it, the way that I'm teaching.
[SPEAKER_01]: Month of your, you have to reason about it.
[SPEAKER_01]: and then need it deasitably, you have to meditate upon it, and this self being heard about reasoned about and meditated upon is seeing or realized, you realize, oh, I am this, and once you realize what you are, then all this is known, everything in the universe, whatever it was mentioned has been vife, children, wealth, the world, all beings, everything is known, what they truly are once you realize, what the self is.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, a lot of big questions here.
[SPEAKER_01]: What is the nature of love?
[SPEAKER_01]: Why do we love?
[SPEAKER_01]: What is the nature of happiness?
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll see next time.
[SPEAKER_01]: How is the self-concerned with all of these?
[SPEAKER_01]: How is the self-connected with all of these?
[SPEAKER_01]: And then the importance of the self for which everything is loved and desired, we do not know this self.
[SPEAKER_01]: we know it only partially, I mean we know it partially, we know who we are, but because we know it in this way then why is you know love always connected with pain and suffering, why is happiness so fleeting and limited, it's because our knowledge of the self is also limited, we do not know what we truly are.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he says, in that that is why, because of this, in order to attain true love and true happiness, one must realize what one is, this self, what is it?
[SPEAKER_01]: It's for the sake of the self that everything else that we do in this world.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, this self was pereolite, but we are seeing, he's literally seeing, see it, seeing how
[SPEAKER_01]: by hearing, by reasoning and by meditating upon it.
[SPEAKER_01]: By that, it will realize who you are meaning implying thereby you did not realize till now.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he's also showing the extreme importance of realizing who you are, because he says, everything that we do in life, every pursuit that we have in life, but sort of all our happiness, all love, everything is related to this self, and yet we do not know what this self is.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have to realize this in order to attain full filament, and the teaching will come later.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he adds one interesting thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, if when you hear, the husband is not loved for the sake of the husband, the husband is loved for my own sake.
[SPEAKER_01]: The wife is not loved for the sake of the wife, but life is loved for my own sake.
[SPEAKER_01]: Children are loved for my own sake.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, this is love for my own sake.
[SPEAKER_01]: People are loved for my own sake.
[SPEAKER_01]: My life, my occupation, all of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: The stuff is loved for my own sake.
[SPEAKER_01]: The words are loved, even God is loved for my own sake.
[SPEAKER_01]: It sounds like an utterly selfish philosophy.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it would be, that's why we are selfish, actually, because we identify the self with this limited self which we know ourselves to be.
[SPEAKER_01]: But then you say, if you truly knew what you were, then you would know that the self is everything.
[SPEAKER_01]: In that case, you go immediately go out of that the small cage of selfishness.
[SPEAKER_01]: You become one with the whole universe.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not selfish, it's not selfish, it's just the opposite.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you realize this, you would truly truly for the first time love all.
[SPEAKER_01]: By the little sacred little interesting footnote, my name,
[SPEAKER_01]: Navarri, Sarvastya Karmaya, Sarvam Priyam Bhavati, Atman is to Karmaya, Sarvam Priyam Bhavati.
[SPEAKER_01]: All becomes beloved because of the self within all of us.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yes, Rodrigo has said, Taktuamasi, yes, that is what he is actually saying.
[SPEAKER_01]: The self of all, you will find.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right now, the self which we are worshiping through every activity of our lives, we are trying to worship this self to make this self happy by what, by husband, by wife, by children, by people in the community, by our lives, you know, the worlds we build around ourselves.
[SPEAKER_01]: by wealth, by fame, by all of this.
[SPEAKER_01]: This little self we are trying to make happy and unsuccessfully so, we will realize this little self is not just myself.
[SPEAKER_01]: This same self is the self of the universe.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the meaning of Sarva, all.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is the self of the universe.
[SPEAKER_01]: And therefore, the universe becomes dear to you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sarva and Priyambhavati, because it is the one reality, you are the one reality of everything that you see.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is a lot to be unpacked here, there is a lot there and Yagyevalkya will continue the teaching good.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let me just see the comments here, Anir Bhaan, this dialogue, there is not so much dialogue between Nachiket and Yamaktru.
[SPEAKER_01]: Navigator rejects all the wealth offered by Yamaraj, through, and that's the first condition.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yamaraj actually gives a lot of puts, Navigator through a strong, difficult test, tempts him in many ways.
[SPEAKER_01]: Navigator says no.
[SPEAKER_01]: Nila Vora says, Pinsanya Asashram is at the later period of life.
[SPEAKER_01]: I find that later stage of life is often no energy to pursue the goals and often not adequate health.
[SPEAKER_01]: One should not be waiting till the later period of life.
[SPEAKER_01]: Correct?
[SPEAKER_01]: So, in another part of this Upanishad, it says, when should one become a monk, if one to formally become a monk, or in formally oxy, you want to take up one pointed spiritual
[SPEAKER_01]: either formally become a man or internally make the switch that my goal of life is God realization.
[SPEAKER_01]: There is a it will come in the open ish at later on that the other a a viraget, tadareva
[SPEAKER_01]: Brahmacharyaadva, Griyatva, Banathva.
[SPEAKER_01]: When does one become a Sanyasi, a monk?
[SPEAKER_01]: Just like Yakjiya Valkyya, you can become a Sanyasi after your Wana Prastasham, the forest dwellers state, in advanced state.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's one.
[SPEAKER_01]: But then the Upanishad says, you can become a Sanyasi from Griyatva from your household estate, from a married life.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it says, you can become a Sunniasi from Bremmajaria, from your student life, from youth.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, from youth, from middle age and from advanced age at any point, the point, dimension there is the other area of the Rajat, the other area of the Rajat, the day you have renunciation that.
[SPEAKER_01]: being there, done that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want any more of this, but and I'm genuinely convinced of a spiritual goal, then you're ready for renunciation, whether it is formal or informal, and you should go ahead.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a great, great opportunity.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the whole point of life itself.
[SPEAKER_01]: did Jagiva Rick says did Jagiva will come in the debate in which took the cows before hand if so.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then he was the greatest neuroprominent enlightened.
[SPEAKER_01]: If he was, why did he need to renounce the world?
[SPEAKER_01]: The purpose of doing so is to become enlightened.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: He won the debate and he was the greatest neuroprominent.
[SPEAKER_01]: He was enlightened, no doubt, all of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: But there is something called Gyan Anishta.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, being centered in your spiritual knowledge, now one becomes a monk, there is a lot of discussion about this in Vedantic text, why does one formally become a monk, but two purposes, two alternate purposes, one is, one wants to become enlightened.
[SPEAKER_01]: and one wants to wholeheartedly dedicate one's remaining life to this pursuit of self-realization.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why you become a monk.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is called Vividesha Sanyasa.
[SPEAKER_01]: Vividesha means desire for enlightenment, desire for knowledge, that prompts your renunciation for the desire for enlightenment.
[SPEAKER_01]: You might say, what else could there be?
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a second one, rare, very rare with words Sanyasa, which means the renunciation of the enlightened ones.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe the enlightened ones find it much more continual to be a monastic state of life to the what they do after enlightenment is a manifestation of what they have realized.
[SPEAKER_01]: What they have become enlightened, they have realized I am Brahman, their life reflects that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the life which reflects it may be the closest they can find in worldly terms is a monastic life.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes they may do.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not that every enlightened person will become a monk.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, one may not.
[SPEAKER_01]: You did a study of Nisar Gadaptam Maharaj who came back to Mumbai and stayed exactly how he was before in Lightenman for the rest of his life.
[SPEAKER_01]: He is fully enlightened or there is also the story of Ramana Marshi who goes away and stays at the foothills of a mountain for the rest practically a monastic life for the rest of his life.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there are those who Ramakrishna Paramhamsa, he becomes a monk, he is Vidwatsa Nasa.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that is also possible.
[SPEAKER_01]: In the case of Yadhyavalki, it is Vidwatsa Nasa, the renunciation of the enlightened one,
[SPEAKER_01]: Was he a knower of Brahman or became Brahman himself?
[SPEAKER_01]: The knower of Brahman, Brahman, Brahman with Brahma, Bhavati, the knower of Brahman, is Brahman.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you ask a knower of Brahman, are you a knower of Brahman, you would say, no, I am Brahman.
[SPEAKER_01]: But we will call them the knower of Brahman.
[SPEAKER_01]: It makes it easier for us.
[SPEAKER_01]: Bhagavad-gavati just says, Upanishad Ganga, Discussion on this.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you serve on this discussion.
[SPEAKER_01]: Priyanka says, Rumi, ask yourself, what are the three things you want most in life?
[SPEAKER_01]: If any of them are different, then you are in trouble.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, three things you want most in life should be one thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Raj, thank you, Maharaj Jagyavalk is already from the Gang.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is a significant decision to explicit renunciation of the world.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, this is the significance.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's with Dwarth Sanyasa.
[SPEAKER_01]: But this gives the open issue to discuss monasticism, what is monasticism for the benefit of the rest of us.
[SPEAKER_01]: We are not enlightened and we would like to become enlightened and we see it is a powerful extremely powerful aid to becoming enlightened.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sankeeth says, in the current age household, it does not transition to one upruster to sunnias after leaving a secret hostel.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, physical renunciation hardly takes place in greater life, but there is the desire to enjoy retired life and with one's hard and savings.
[SPEAKER_01]: Will this be an hindrance to spiritual path?
[SPEAKER_01]: Was mental renunciation sufficient?
[SPEAKER_01]: Or it goes should I plan for retirement or not?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, plan for retirement as long as you are there in this householder life.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you can just enough to get by and then at the point when you are ready, you can take early retirement and dedicate your life to spiritual practice to remember to do that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's spiritual practice Vedantic study, meditation, japa, devotion,
[SPEAKER_01]: All of those should start now.
[SPEAKER_01]: The four yogis should continue now.
[SPEAKER_01]: One can't suddenly switch off the household life and switch on a full spiritual life.
[SPEAKER_01]: And nobody is yet to be dedicated to Vedanta even before this decision.
[SPEAKER_01]: So was my three.
[SPEAKER_01]: She was already known as Brahma Vadini.
[SPEAKER_01]: So she was clearly interested in Vedanta all throughout Abhijith.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for the explanations.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, mantras is similar to Nakarnmananaprajaya adhaneena, teagreena, ikyamritaktva maanashu, not by Vedic rituals, not by progeny, not by wealth, which only by renunciation that immortality is attained.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is exactly what is embodied by my three, she does not want any of that and she wants immortality.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why we chant it for Sunniasi.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, that is the characteristic of the Sunniasi.
[SPEAKER_01]: Enlightenment is not the characteristic of Sunniasi.
[SPEAKER_01]: Enlightenment, householder can be enlightened.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sunniasi can be enlightened or they may not be enlightened.
[SPEAKER_01]: But Sunniasi is not a Sunniasi unless the Sunniasi, the monk, has renounced.
[SPEAKER_01]: The characteristic, the central characteristic of the monk is renunciation of worldiness.
[SPEAKER_01]: Lisa.
[SPEAKER_01]: Mythry's refusal of the initial offer is reminiscent of a conversation between Yamaha and Nachiket, the character immediately reminds you of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Nachiket was very firm and refusing all the detail.
[SPEAKER_01]: He was tempted even more than mythry because he was a kid and he ever asked a game before him wealth, kingdoms, children.
[SPEAKER_01]: He says up to grandchildren and the domain of heavenly environments, all of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and he refused.
[SPEAKER_01]: It turned it down in no uncertain terms.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the same spirit.
[SPEAKER_01]: Very good.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, I am free.
[SPEAKER_01]: It will unmute yourself.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't mind.
[SPEAKER_00]: For example, a few questions.
[SPEAKER_00]: The first question is now that we are in a body mind complex.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am able to express the idea that I am aware.
[SPEAKER_00]: my ability to to be aware says that I'm something beyond body and mind.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now if the body and mind the existence of body and mind sees it sees it's down then what happens to consciousness does can we say that for consciousness depends on body and mind to be expressed.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, so this question will come up.
[SPEAKER_01]: does consciousness depend on body mind in any way, without body mind, I can't see or hear of smell or taste, I can't study Vedanta, I can't think about Vedanta, without the mind, I can't study Vedanta, without a body, all of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't even attend a YouTube class without a Zoom class without the body.
[SPEAKER_01]: So isn't consciousness dependent on the body?
[SPEAKER_01]: No, it's the other way around.
[SPEAKER_01]: Body mind is dependent upon consciousness.
[SPEAKER_01]: Without body mind, there is no possibility, without the consciousness, body mind by itself cannot do anything.
[SPEAKER_01]: It will not be a Vedantic student, it will not enjoy the world, it will not renounce the world.
[SPEAKER_01]: Nothing, there is no life left in it, no awareness, no life left in it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, this consciousness is also existence.
[SPEAKER_01]: is such a chit ananda.
[SPEAKER_01]: All existence, all consciousness and all happiness or value depends upon you the Atman.
[SPEAKER_01]: even the existence of the body depends on the Atman, even the existence of the mind depends on the Atman, the consciousness of the light in this body mind depends on the Atman and the value that is in the body mind or in the world which we see is actually the value derived from the Atman that is what the Jaggi Valki is trying to tell my three, all love is because of the Atman, not because of things outside.
[SPEAKER_01]: So then does body mind have nothing to do, it only has this role that it will manifest
[SPEAKER_01]: And what does consciousness do for the body mind?
[SPEAKER_01]: What does Atman do for the body mind?
[SPEAKER_01]: It gives it existence, awareness and value.
[SPEAKER_01]: Such it unend.
[SPEAKER_01]: So all of that comes from Atma.
[SPEAKER_01]: Body mind depends entirely on the Atma.
[SPEAKER_01]: Without the body mind also, Atma exists, and it will shine in consciousness, and it is the source of all value or joy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Manavya.
[SPEAKER_00]: So who is renouncing what like what is the renunciation then if atmosphere free already then who will the one renouncing and what is the one that is being what is the thing that it's renounced.
[SPEAKER_01]: For Atman use the word I.
[SPEAKER_01]: I.
[SPEAKER_01]: What is the open?
[SPEAKER_01]: It's you.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just you.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not some other thing inside you.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's my open is free, but then who am I?
[SPEAKER_01]: No, no, you are the open.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I am, if I am free, then who I should have announced, you need not, unless you are a bit enlightened, one doing renunciation of the enlightenment one.
[SPEAKER_01]: But if you say, I am free, well, I am told I am free, but I don't feel free right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: So who does not feel free?
[SPEAKER_01]: Atman.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then the
[SPEAKER_01]: Why does the admin not feel free because of ignorance?
[SPEAKER_01]: And therefore the admin should try to gain that knowledge which will remove that ignorance, which Jack Gable case is going to teach my trainer.
[SPEAKER_01]: But the footnote there should be implication there is, if you are claiming knowledge will free you, the knowledge will remove the ignorance.
[SPEAKER_01]: then knowledge can only remove ignorance.
[SPEAKER_01]: Knowledge cannot make any actual change in the reality.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, if ignorance is removed by knowledge and that is enough to free you that means you are already free.
[SPEAKER_01]: That is the implication.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right now you might say, I don't feel free.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't see how I am free.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't feel it also.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I am not getting the benefit of that freedom also.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, definitely I need that knowledge.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, shanti shanti shanti hari hiyom tatsat Sri Ramakrishna Arpana Mastu.