177. Bhagavad Gita | Chapter 15, Verses 7-9 | Swami Sarvapriyananda

[SPEAKER_06]: Uum, Vasudeva, Suttam Devam, Kamsachanuram Ardhanam, Devaki Paramanandam, Krishnam Vanday Jagad Gurum.
[SPEAKER_06]: So in the Bhagavad-gita, can you hear me at the back, yes?
[SPEAKER_06]: The Bhagavad-gita, we are studying the 15th chapter for Shottamayoga.
[SPEAKER_06]: On the 6th verse, a beautiful verse.
[SPEAKER_06]: Nuttad Bhaseyate, Suryo, Nashashanko, Napaavaka, Yad Ghatwana, Nivatantate, Adhama, Paramamma.
[SPEAKER_06]: We were discussing this last time, I don't know when the last time was, but we anyway.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is the sixth verse of the fifteenth chapter.
[SPEAKER_06]: Very poetic verse.
[SPEAKER_06]: So the fifteenth chapter, if you recall, it starts by describing samsara.
[SPEAKER_06]: Word, our lives.
[SPEAKER_06]: And it describes it as a tree.
[SPEAKER_06]: as the great banyan tree, the great tree of samshara, and the tree is a little strange because its roots are up there, in that means they are transcendent, they are subtle, and its branches and leaves are down here, which means
[SPEAKER_06]: Our real nature down here means this physical world, where we live, our bodies, this world, we inhabit what's going on here, other people, this physical world of matter, and there are subtler and subtler layers to our existence.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the subtlest of all, it is the roots are in the air and roots are above and the branches are below of this very strange tree.
[SPEAKER_06]: The roots means the source of all this, the origin of all this, the foundation or the the reality behind all this.
[SPEAKER_06]: is, Atman, Brahman, pure consciousness, God, whatever you call it, there is a spiritual reality behind all this, and that's our real nature, but we do not know it.
[SPEAKER_06]: And then it goes on to say, what is that real nature, and what that we should investigate and find that out, this verse is very beautiful, it says, what is that spiritual nature?
[SPEAKER_06]: yet got to an inadvertentate and harm of Paramamma, very beautiful verse.
[SPEAKER_06]: It says, that reality is not illumined by the sun, nor by the moon, nor by fire.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is 6th verse.
[SPEAKER_06]: going to which attaining to which one does not come back again into this world of some it is some sort.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, this possibility that there is a spiritual existence, a spiritual reality which is our goal.
[SPEAKER_06]: Until we attain to that, we will keep coming back to this as the poet says,
[SPEAKER_06]: We will keep coming back and we will keep repeating these little dramas which we are going through.
[SPEAKER_06]: Samsara, in the judiya Christian world view, Judaism, Islam, Christianity, it is this one like, this is Samsara.
[SPEAKER_06]: In the Dharmic world views, Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism, Sikhism, it is Samsara, it is not just one like, it is multiple lives.
[SPEAKER_06]: you exist after you are dead and you will come back again but that is not good news because you repeat and repeat and repeat until we have learnt our spiritual lessons.
[SPEAKER_06]: But the point of it is that this limited existence is the veil of tears.
[SPEAKER_06]: it is subject to sorrow, unhappiness, lack of fulfillment, even when things go well, which they really do, even when they go well, they are not perfectly satisfying, ever.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is called the existential angst, the existentialists in the 20th century, they call it existential angst.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is perfect and then, then,
[SPEAKER_06]: I was in a perfect society, at least they think they are a perfect society, just a few weeks back, couple of weeks back, in Sweden, and the Scandinavian countries are they always regularly rank way up there, you know, the top 10, always in standards of living and a really wonderful society, wonderful, really great societies, but not particularly interested in the spirituality.
[SPEAKER_06]: And at least in religion, later on scripture, not particularly interested.
[SPEAKER_06]: And one of the gentlemen who hosted me a family, they said he was an Indian gentleman, he said he was asking one of his Swedish friends, why not?
[SPEAKER_06]: Why is it that generally people have lost interest in spirituality or religion in religion?
[SPEAKER_06]: And his friend told him was a Swedish gentleman, he said, because this society
[SPEAKER_06]: This is, just be all that I seek, and if one day breaks then I'll have to look for God or something.
[SPEAKER_06]: But so far it's good, now even in that society, even in Sweden, or I was in Norway and in Sweden, in Sweden, or Norway, or Denmark, in Switzerland, and even if things all things go well,
[SPEAKER_06]: Usually you're going to go old, grow old, you're going to have aches and pains, things will not go so well physically, people you know and love, they will die and go away, and you'll face illness, loneliness, emptyness, even when things are going very well, you'll still face pointlessness and those are problems there.
[SPEAKER_06]: Oh, that is why this gentleman told this person who asked a question, he said, if this society breaks, then I will look for God, so it is a great society, but even when it is not broken, these questions are still there, what is the point of it all?
[SPEAKER_06]: Very soon, because that is there for everybody, the question arises.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the Hindu or the Indian worldview, it just says, then it's the same thing.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's that wash cycle, rinse and repeat again.
[SPEAKER_06]: So even if it's one life or many lives, it's the same thing.
[SPEAKER_06]: So we come back again and again to this veil of tears.
[SPEAKER_06]: Why?
[SPEAKER_06]: Until we attain, is there any escape from this?
[SPEAKER_06]: Yes, there is.
[SPEAKER_06]: I remember seeing a cartoon when gentlemen is speaking to an American gentleman speaking to an Indian person and the American says, I'm a born-again Christian and the Indian says, I'm a born-again and again and again and again Hindu, but both are in the same problem.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's still not whether you are in India or the United States or even if you are in Sweden.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's still the veil of tears.
[SPEAKER_06]: Do you think there is no sorrow there?
[SPEAKER_06]: There is, there is sadness, emptiness, meaninglessness, even when things are well, there is a going well.
[SPEAKER_06]: What is the point of it?
[SPEAKER_06]: And is there a point?
[SPEAKER_06]: If you say there is nothing except this, that is called materialism.
[SPEAKER_06]: But all religions, all religions with one person, it is interesting.
[SPEAKER_06]: They all declare that there is something transcendent,
[SPEAKER_06]: So, this is what is being said here, that reality which is yad gattuana nivat tante tad dhama parama mamma, that is my transcendent about going to which attaining to which one does not come back into this veil of tears.
[SPEAKER_06]: until then, why way of tears?
[SPEAKER_06]: It is just a school which we pass through.
[SPEAKER_06]: We learned that delimited our, our nature, we are not satisfied by the limited.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is why there are tears.
[SPEAKER_06]: What will satisfy us only the unlimited?
[SPEAKER_06]: Because our nature is unlimited, we are infinite.
[SPEAKER_06]: Only the infinite will satisfy us.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the infinite, luckily, it is available.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the non-dualistic schools say that it is, in fact, you
[SPEAKER_06]: If you truly know yourself, you are that, ductuamasi.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, very beautifully it is said, yad gattuana nibattante tad dhama parama mamma, databod, that is by transcendent about, that is the real nature, our real nature, having attained to which one does not return.
[SPEAKER_06]: But, what is that like, Krishna says, that is, the sun does not illuminate, the moon does not illuminate, or not this mere human fire.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's a reference to a mantra found in the Kathopanishad, in the Munda Kopanishad, in the Śveta Śveta Rupaanishad, from the Upanishads.
[SPEAKER_06]: In the Dr. Suryovati, in the Nachandrata, in the Khamnayma, in the Dhyuta, Bhanti, Kutaw, Yamagni, Gameh, Babhanta, Manu Bhati, Sarvang, Thasya Bhasa, Sarvamidambhibhati.
[SPEAKER_06]: So there, Sun does not eluminate.
[SPEAKER_06]: The Nordi Moon.
[SPEAKER_06]: not the, not the stars, not even lightning or this mere motel fire.
[SPEAKER_06]: But that shining everything else shines by its light, everything here is lit up.
[SPEAKER_06]: You find it in the Upanishads, Kato Upanishad, Mondak Upanishad, Swetashvata Rupanishad.
[SPEAKER_06]: What's he talking about?
[SPEAKER_06]: What's that light?
[SPEAKER_06]: That shining everything else shines.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is awareness.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is our real nature.
[SPEAKER_06]: You shining everything else shines by your light, everything here is lit up.
[SPEAKER_06]: You means the real you, not the body you, not even the mind you, not even this little
[SPEAKER_06]: And what is the use of that, of knowing that, knowing that your Ghatwa, having gone where, going there means to know that, to know that I am that, Taktuamasi, you are that.
[SPEAKER_06]: When we realize that, here it says, Nalivat tanti, they do not come back into this veil of tears anymore.
[SPEAKER_06]: Why do they not come back?
[SPEAKER_06]: Because they have realized their limitless nature.
[SPEAKER_06]: I am the limitless.
[SPEAKER_06]: I am not a little mind or little body.
[SPEAKER_06]: The bodies are born and they perish, they die.
[SPEAKER_06]: The minds do not die, but they inhabit these mortal bodies from lifetime to lifetime.
[SPEAKER_06]: So we are born again and again and again and again.
[SPEAKER_06]: We die again and again and again.
[SPEAKER_06]: and to him the Hindu reply, I am a born again and again and again.
[SPEAKER_06]: But both are in the same bucket because they are repeating the same cycle again and again.
[SPEAKER_06]: What is our real nature?
[SPEAKER_06]: This is our real nature.
[SPEAKER_06]: Very beautifully it is said, it is that light which shining, everything is illumined.
[SPEAKER_06]: That shining, all else shines after it, consciousness shining, the mind is revealed.
[SPEAKER_06]: The mind shining our bodies and this world is revealed, and this we move about this world as limited, sentient beings as these individuals.
[SPEAKER_06]: But our real nature is not the body, our real nature is not even the mind, our real nature is this limitless consciousness which we are.
[SPEAKER_06]: So this is what we had done this last time, we had read them to this.
[SPEAKER_06]: becomes to this G1 nature.
[SPEAKER_06]: The absolute pure consciousness, Brahman, the infinite fine.
[SPEAKER_06]: But what about us?
[SPEAKER_06]: What are we right now?
[SPEAKER_06]: Number seven, verse number seven.
[SPEAKER_06]: Mahmai Vang Shodji Valoka, Mahmai Vang Shodji Valoka, Jibabhuta Sanatana, Jibabhuta Sanatana, Manashashtan Indriyani, Manashashtan Indriyani,
[SPEAKER_06]: Brakrit is thanikarshati, brakrit is thanikarshati, veryly a part of myself having become this eternal embodied soul, draws to this world of beings, the senses with the mind as the sixth, which rests in nature of prakriti.
[SPEAKER_06]: Now it explains what's going on here.
[SPEAKER_06]: If I am that infinite consciousness Brahman,
[SPEAKER_06]: Why am I here?
[SPEAKER_06]: In some sort whether it's in India or Sweden or in New York, wherever I am, why am I here?
[SPEAKER_06]: What's going on here?
[SPEAKER_06]: And he, this verse, he starts, this is a sequence of verses starting here, explains our human destiny, what we are right now, why are we like this now, right now and where are we going or where should we go, how do we attain to liberation and freedom from this human condition, what is this human condition and how do you attain to freedom from it.
[SPEAKER_06]: He says, Mamay Ivanka, veryly a part of me.
[SPEAKER_06]: I respect of me, a part of me, in this world of sentient beings, having become a sentient being, I roam about in this world, all right, so this is an important verse, it tells us what we are right now, it's a description of what exactly we are right now, yes, we are infinite consciousness, Atman, Brahman, Jidhan and the Rupa, Shivoham, that's our real spiritual nature, but what explains this?
[SPEAKER_06]: What are we supposed to do here?
[SPEAKER_06]: Why are we like this?
[SPEAKER_06]: Here is a, I am quoting from one of the commentaries on the Gita.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is this commentary is called Shredha-recoming tree, one Shredha Swami was there.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, in his commentary he introduces this verse, verse number seven, as in Sanskrit he writes,
[SPEAKER_06]: Sushipti, Pralayya, Samaith, Prapti, Sarvesha, Mastiti, Konaama, Samsari, Siyat, he says, that you are saying that when you attain to your nature, or Krishna, you are talking about your transcendent nature, when we attain to your nature, when we lose our human nature, that attain to your nature, we never come back again.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is the end, that we you realize, you remain as this infinite
[SPEAKER_06]: Then he says here, he raises a question, the commentator raises a question, 3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-
[SPEAKER_06]: We have to think about the cycle of creation, existence and destruction, Srishti-sthiti-pralaya, which the Hindus, Buddhists, and so the Indian idea of the cosmos is created.
[SPEAKER_06]: The world exists for some time, then it's destroyed, then comes back again.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's a cycle of creation, existence and destruction in Sanskrit, Srishti-sthiti-pralaya.
[SPEAKER_06]: This cycle goes on.
[SPEAKER_06]: When this world is finally dissolved, destroyed,
[SPEAKER_06]: Then there are no more words, there are no more societies, no living beings, no bodies.
[SPEAKER_06]: We then will become absorbed in that one pure consciousness is a source of the entire universe.
[SPEAKER_06]: Where do we come from in that case?
[SPEAKER_06]: Why did we ever come back again here?
[SPEAKER_06]: Why are we here at all?
[SPEAKER_06]: And not only the end of the universe, who knows what will happen then?
[SPEAKER_06]: Every night, when we fall asleep, the world is gone.
[SPEAKER_06]: We have no experience of our bodies.
[SPEAKER_06]: We do not even experience the world of dreams.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, basically the physical external world is gone.
[SPEAKER_06]: The world of mind and thought and dream and imagination.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is also gone.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, we are gone.
[SPEAKER_06]: Why do I ever even wake up again?
[SPEAKER_06]: Why do I come back from?
[SPEAKER_06]: He says, Konaama Samsar is here.
[SPEAKER_06]: Where does this samsari come from, samsari means this person, this sentient being caught in the cycle of samsari, of lifetime, of lifetime, of lifetime.
[SPEAKER_06]: And he says, why lifetime, of lifetime?
[SPEAKER_06]: Why day after day, every night I fall asleep, I should be gone, should not come back.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, the answer here basically the question is what I understand that ultimate reality existence consciousness is sort of get it, but what are we right now this G ever, this centi and B, what are we right now and then this explanation of this centi and B, very nice and important description.
[SPEAKER_06]: He says, mamayvang shoshiva, okay, an aspect of me, a part of me, in this world of samsara, in the world of javas, I project myself forth as the javas.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, what are we right now?
[SPEAKER_06]: What are we?
[SPEAKER_06]: And Krishna's answer is, you are I, you know, you know, the joke about I and me, you know,
[SPEAKER_06]: You are, so this person, saying Peter at the gates of heaven, people are coming for entry into the gates of heaven and somebody knocks and saying Peter asks, who is it?
[SPEAKER_06]: It is I, in the same period says, oh, another English teacher.
[SPEAKER_06]: Because it is I, it's correct, it's not it's me, it's I, we always say it's me.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, seriousness is, it is I who I project myself forth into this samsara as you, so this is one something tremendous, it says mama a bangshar, it is an aspect of me or it is I, it is I therefore we are not this physical body in that case.
[SPEAKER_06]: We are not even this subtle body, the mind in that case.
[SPEAKER_06]: We are none other than God, we are one with God.
[SPEAKER_06]: Because God is saying that I come forth as a sentient being in the world.
[SPEAKER_06]: What you are is me, it is I who am you, what you think of yourself, you are wrong in your real nature, it is I.
[SPEAKER_06]: So our is a very important thing here, our real nature,
[SPEAKER_06]: is divine is one with God already, a hum Brahma's, me, I am Brahma's, that's Brahma's, you are that, this is the meaning of it, Mamayi Vangshaw, an aspect of me or part of me, he says.
[SPEAKER_06]: And, G.Valoky, in this world of beings, this world of beings, I embody myself,
[SPEAKER_06]: how are we that one reality?
[SPEAKER_06]: It's because we do not know ourselves, not knowing ourselves we think we are this body.
[SPEAKER_06]: And more than this, this subtle body which the mind and intellect and all that, we don't know anything beyond that.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you were asked to describe ourselves
[SPEAKER_06]: If we think we are just this body, then we are born with the birth of the body and we dive with the death of the body.
[SPEAKER_06]: But we are not just this body, even right now without any Vedanta without its spirituality, we can see there is another aspect to us.
[SPEAKER_06]: There is a subtle inner existence, we all have an inner experience.
[SPEAKER_06]: I am thinking, I am experiencing, I am seeing hearing, smelling, tasting, touching, I enjoy pleasure and I suffer from pain, I have memories, all these inner experiences are going on in each one of us and that are arguably more important to us than these physical bodies.
[SPEAKER_06]: Now, the materialist here will say, oh, that is just the body.
[SPEAKER_06]: The brain is projecting all that, it brain is generating what you call this inner experience, the brain is generating it, then you will run into what is called the hard problem of consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: How is the brain generate, the brain is certainly doing lots of things.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you scan the brain,
[SPEAKER_06]: What will you get?
[SPEAKER_06]: You will get a lot of little brain-like activities.
[SPEAKER_06]: You will get little electrical activities in the neurons.
[SPEAKER_06]: You will get some electrochemical activities in the brain itself.
[SPEAKER_06]: They are all physical.
[SPEAKER_06]: Can you catch a thought?
[SPEAKER_06]: Can you catch a feeling, a burst of joy?
[SPEAKER_06]: So, you will track the FMRI scans, but you are tracking my new electrical activity in the brain.
[SPEAKER_06]: Where is the joy?
[SPEAKER_06]: Where is the pain?
[SPEAKER_06]: Where is the memory?
[SPEAKER_06]: So, it is no it is that electrical activity how we are missing a question here we are missing a big step here I always remember that this is a cartoon I refer to this earlier somebody is doing a mathematical derivation step 1 step 2 step 3 step 4 step 1 match step 2 complicated match step 4 complicated match but step 3 it is written a miracle
[SPEAKER_06]: And the professor is telling the student, you need to work on step 3.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yes, we have step 1, 2, it's going on, the activities in the brain can be tracked.
[SPEAKER_06]: And we also have, we can also experience our own experience of the world.
[SPEAKER_06]: In between what happens, if you say that the brain alone is generating you, the conscious
[SPEAKER_06]: There is a jump there, this jump is what is called the hard problem of consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: There is so-called easy problem, so-called quote unquote easy problems, this categorization is by our Neocuniversity is their David Chamas.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, so-called easy problems are problems of correlation.
[SPEAKER_06]: If I am having a particular experience, what kind of brain activity is going on in my brain, if I am seeing this color, what brain activity is going on in the visual cortex, then it will correlate.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is a science of correlations, but the harder problem is, how is that electrical activity
[SPEAKER_06]: So, that is the big question.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, we have a physical existence in this world, we have a mental inner existence in this world, but neither of them explains the sentient being that we are.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, here he says, G Volok in this world.
[SPEAKER_06]: I am appearing to you in the physical body in the subtle body.
[SPEAKER_06]: Physical body is not the end of our existence, birth of the physical body, then the death of the physical body, we think that is what we are.
[SPEAKER_06]: But no, that is not who we are, because we all of us have an inner experience going on.
[SPEAKER_06]: Each of us right now, we have thoughts, we have feelings, we have memories, this inner experience
[SPEAKER_06]: is a full description of it in Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_06]: What is this inner being?
[SPEAKER_06]: It's called a subtle body.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, we have a physical body and a subtle body.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the subtle body is not a theological, not something imagined or spoken about in religion which cannot be verified.
[SPEAKER_06]: No, it's directly a matter of our experience.
[SPEAKER_06]: Very interesting, it's a matter of everybody's experience, but science cannot be in it down.
[SPEAKER_06]: We are all experiencing it right now.
[SPEAKER_06]: Who doesn't have thoughts?
[SPEAKER_06]: Who doesn't have feelings?
[SPEAKER_06]: Who doesn't have memories?
[SPEAKER_06]: And science can see the, with our tracking brain activity, we can see the physical correlates of that.
[SPEAKER_06]: But how the brain activity is producing those inner experiences which all of us are having, what we call mind, memory, sensory experience, pain, pleasure, that we are unable to explain.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is the so called hard problem of consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: We are having this first person experiences, but here also, Belante will say, notice there are, we have a first person experience of the physical world, we have first person experience of the physical body, we also have a first person experience of our inner world of thoughts and feelings and so, that inner world of thoughts and feelings and experiences, that and
[SPEAKER_06]: So, Vedanta will say that the inner world of thoughts, feelings, ideas, memories, ego, that is not literally the body.
[SPEAKER_06]: It was not bored with the birth of this body, even this brain, nor will it die with the death of this body.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is what is called in English, the soul, in Vedanta, the subtle body, Sukshmasheri here.
[SPEAKER_06]: that existed before the creation of this body and that will continue after the death of this body.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is what we are as this individual so we will call it Jiva, Centian being, the Centian being.
[SPEAKER_06]: We inhabit this body now, we have inhabited bodies earlier and we will continue to inhabit other bodies after the death of this body.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is why multiple lifetimes and all of that comes into that is what we are beyond this physical body.
[SPEAKER_06]: But even that is a subtle body, that is still not who we really are.
[SPEAKER_06]: How will you use, when Vedant, if you see whatever is an object, you are not that, you are the subject.
[SPEAKER_06]: Clearly this is an object is stable and I am not that I am very clear about it, it is I am not the table, I am this, but this one is also an object, I can see it, I can touch it, it means the body, I can touch it, smell it, taste it, here the movement sounds in the body, so the body is an object also, body is not the real subject.
[SPEAKER_06]: When I go further, I see that the mind, the subtle body, thoughts, feelings, emotions, ideas, memories, they are also objects.
[SPEAKER_06]: Only thing is, I am directly aware of it, you can't objectify, brain studies can pinpoint the activities in the brain, but they can't actually catch a thought or a memory, and they can catch the neural correlates of that, but not the actual thought or memory, that is a subtle object, when on the recall it is a subtle object, still an object, and when on the will say it is still material, just our modern material sense is not gone far enough to catch it, we can catch up to the body.
[SPEAKER_06]: but not the subtle body, but the subtle body is also a body.
[SPEAKER_06]: That's not who we are.
[SPEAKER_06]: Beyond that is us, the conscious being.
[SPEAKER_06]: And that conscious being is in its real nature, none other than pure consciousness, Atman, Bramhan, God.
[SPEAKER_06]: That's what he says, Mamevang Shaji, Valuke, a part of me projected into this world.
[SPEAKER_06]: world of what, mind and body, subtle body and physical body, this is a physical body which is born and but which will die is aging and will die soon.
[SPEAKER_06]: I have a subtle body which was there before this body and which will continue through this body and will continue after the death of the body.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is what is called a ghost in all cultures, but it is interesting
[SPEAKER_06]: You can be body-centered or ghost-centered, Indian culture is the ghost-centered, the subtle body-centered.
[SPEAKER_06]: In the Indian languages, we say, gave up the body, death is giving up the body.
[SPEAKER_06]: And in English, we say, gave up the ghost.
[SPEAKER_06]: That means the ghost left the body and they are literally true.
[SPEAKER_06]: But what Krishna is saying, you are neither the body nor the ghost.
[SPEAKER_06]: you are not the physical body, you are not even the subtle body.
[SPEAKER_06]: As long as we are identified by the physical body and subtle body, we will continue in this cycle of birth and death.
[SPEAKER_06]: We are being propelled by our ignorance of our real nature.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, he says, mamayva angshah.
[SPEAKER_06]: I remember sitting in one's in Amsterdam and there are canals there.
[SPEAKER_06]: the real canals are the ones you see in Venice.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, lucky enough to visit Venice also, but in Amsterdam this experience I had I am sitting by the canal and I saw a cat on the other side of the canal walking by and then I looked at the canal, luckily no boat was passing at that time.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, the water was absolutely still.
[SPEAKER_06]: And in the canal you could see inverted the houses on the bank, the sky, the clouds, the trees, all inverted in the canal.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the cat was looking down, maybe it is at his own reflection.
[SPEAKER_06]: You could see the cat there also.
[SPEAKER_06]: You can see a cat.
[SPEAKER_06]: You can see clouds.
[SPEAKER_06]: You can see houses.
[SPEAKER_06]: You can see the sky.
[SPEAKER_06]: But what is it actually?
[SPEAKER_06]: Water.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's water.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, when Krishna says a part of me becomes this G or sentient being, it is like the cannell saying a part of me becomes the cat and the tree and the houses.
[SPEAKER_06]: Actually, a part of the water does not become a cat or the tree or the house, it just appears there.
[SPEAKER_06]: Now, forget the Amsterdam, just look at the canal itself, forget that there is something outside.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is an example.
[SPEAKER_06]: Look at the canal itself, in that you will find reflected the house, so forget the original, just look at the reflections, look at the water and the reflection, what is there actually water?
[SPEAKER_06]: It is just water through and through.
[SPEAKER_06]: But there is, you can see there, discard, you can see the tree, exactly like that.
[SPEAKER_06]: Our real nature, Krishna says, Mamayi Bansha, our real nature is this one limitless consciousness, which Krishna says, I am.
[SPEAKER_06]: And many say, it's part of me, one must understand it carefully, in a way that the part of me does not mean that it's a part of God or part of consciousness, there's no parts of consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: it is like the reflection in the water.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is like the water in the canal saying, a part of me is the cat and the house and the tree.
[SPEAKER_06]: No, a part of the water is just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: There is nothing else there except water.
[SPEAKER_06]: But all of these appear, their appearances in water, similarly in one limitless consciousness what appears a subtle body, mind, intellect, prana and all of that, and a physical body and a physical world, a subtle world and a physical world, they appear.
[SPEAKER_06]: What are they actually in pure consciousness?
[SPEAKER_06]: Atman or Brahman, just like everything in the canal is just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: There are no houses there, no cats there, unless it's a dead cat.
[SPEAKER_06]: There are no cats there, there are no clouds there.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's all, you know, they were telling, they found, in the canal, they found bicycles, lots of beer bottles, and they found bicycles also, because they people use bicycles, sometimes bicycles fall into it.
[SPEAKER_06]: And they showed me some of the houses because it settles the ground, it's settling.
[SPEAKER_06]: So the houses are sort of leaning, they are not exactly, it's a very old and they showed me there are ins, but the ins are sort of leaning into each other.
[SPEAKER_06]: And they say on the top floors, the beds all have like not seed beds, bed beds, bed beds because if you, because they all are inclined, it go to sleep, you are going to slide up the bed and fall on the floor.
[SPEAKER_06]: So the top floors are all like this and we are leaning against each other because it is settling.
[SPEAKER_06]: And they showed an in, there is a sign, we are going past it in a boat on the camera.
[SPEAKER_06]: The sign on the in, it says,
[SPEAKER_06]: If the floor looks straight to you, it's time to go home.
[SPEAKER_06]: That means you are drunk.
[SPEAKER_06]: The floor of the in is inclined, actually.
[SPEAKER_06]: But if it looks straight to you, then you are drunk.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, it is just water through and through.
[SPEAKER_06]: It appears to be a physical body, it appears to be a mind, but it is just consciousness through and through.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, when you see a part of myself, it does not mean really a part, it is an appearance in one limitless pure consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is the appearance theory, not the way the Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_06]: Otherwise, what will happen is if you take it literally, a part of God, when God has parts, anything that has parts is liable to composition and decomposition and destruction and so on.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, there will be a lot of logical problems there.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is an appearance in consciousness, it is an appearance in the absolute.
[SPEAKER_06]: that will become the system, that will become the system, that will become the system.
[SPEAKER_06]: In the adwaita Vedanta, the world, sentient beings and jiva sentient beings like us.
[SPEAKER_06]: We are all appearances in one limitless conscious limitless, very carefully it did mean it literally that consciousness cannot be limited.
[SPEAKER_06]: It only appears to be limited.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, if you look at the canal,
[SPEAKER_06]: And you see trees and the houses and windows and doors in the houses and a cat walking along and clouds floating in the sky.
[SPEAKER_06]: You can clearly see the differences.
[SPEAKER_06]: Here is the house.
[SPEAKER_06]: Here is the next house.
[SPEAKER_06]: Here is the tree.
[SPEAKER_06]: And here is the cat and that's the cloud.
[SPEAKER_06]: But what's it really?
[SPEAKER_06]: Just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is just water and the cloud and the cat and the house are the parts of the water.
[SPEAKER_06]: does water have a house and the cat and the cloud?
[SPEAKER_06]: No, there are appearances in water.
[SPEAKER_06]: Similarly, that one absolute, one pure consciousness appears as mind and body and the world.
[SPEAKER_06]: In that one consciousness appears as senses and sense objects like sight and sound and smell, all the sense experiences.
[SPEAKER_06]: But then death of the body, transmigration from one lifetime to another, of the mind and various sensory experiences, mental experiences, pleasure and pain, all of those are like the reflections you see in that canal in Amsterdam.
[SPEAKER_06]: But what is it actually, water through and through, there is nothing else there.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, when I say when Krishna, all of this to explain, Krishna says, the G was a sentient being is a part of me, not really, not in the sense we think of a part, the legs of the table are parts of the table.
[SPEAKER_06]: The top of the table is a part of the table, but if I ask you, the wood, the top, the legs, are the parts of the wood, the table is made of wood, right?
[SPEAKER_06]: The table is made of wood, the top of the table, the top is a part of the table, the legs of the table are parts of the table.
[SPEAKER_06]: But if you consider the wood itself, the top, the legs are the parts of the wood, no, not really.
[SPEAKER_06]: The wood is just wood, these are shapes imposed on the wood.
[SPEAKER_06]: We have carved it out, carpenter has done the job.
[SPEAKER_06]: The shape is not really a part of the wood.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's a shade given to the world, similarly, as we are pure consciousness, bodies, minds, senses, all of these, the world are not parts of us, just as in the canal in Amsterdam.
[SPEAKER_06]: When I saw the house, the house, the trees, the sky, the clouds, the cat, are the parts of the water?
[SPEAKER_06]: No, that would be a very wet cat indeed, if it was a part of the water.
[SPEAKER_06]: No, it is not.
[SPEAKER_06]: They are all appearances.
[SPEAKER_06]: What are they?
[SPEAKER_06]: It is just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you went wet to touch and pet the cat, you would get just watered there, nothing but water.
[SPEAKER_06]: So in ignorance of Atman or Brahman, our real nature, we see this world of appearances and take this to be the reality, this is it.
[SPEAKER_06]: You see people, you see your own body, you interact with people, speak with them, you do stuff and you walk around, you can see the sky and the earth, all of that which we see in the dream.
[SPEAKER_06]: What is it?
[SPEAKER_06]: It's the dreaming mind, it's the dreamer, it's you.
[SPEAKER_06]: But in the dream it would be very strange to say, you are that other person, you are this rock, you are the sky, you are the bridge, you are the water in the park, you are the trees.
[SPEAKER_06]: It would seem very poetic and mystical, no, actually it is a fact.
[SPEAKER_06]: In Advaita Vedanta, now remember, in the dream, when you see in the dream, or imagine the canal example, Amsterdam canal example and the dream example, both will make it clear.
[SPEAKER_06]: First the canal example.
[SPEAKER_06]: What you see in the canal in the water, it is not that there is water, plus there are buildings and there is a cat, unless it is a dead cat, it is a cat and a couple of clouds and the sky and water.
[SPEAKER_06]: Is that what you are seeing?
[SPEAKER_06]: No, no, no, no.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is water and only water, everything that you touch there will see just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: are we here on this?
[SPEAKER_06]: Now, making the example a little more sophisticated dream example.
[SPEAKER_06]: In the dream, we are taking a walk in the part and you are seeing the lake, you are seeing the sky, you are seeing people, you are seeing the bridge and the bow bridge and all of that you are seeing and lots of other people and the ducks and the ducks in the lake and you can see yourself too, your own body, you can see it.
[SPEAKER_06]: But what is this actually?
[SPEAKER_06]: All of it is just the dreaming mind.
[SPEAKER_06]: You there in the dream, the body which you see, and the thoughts which you're having, you're feeling of being a person there's watching all the part.
[SPEAKER_06]: You are the mind, the dreaming mind.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the bridge in the park is the dreaming mind, and the sky, and the lake, and the ducks, and other people.
[SPEAKER_06]: They're all the dreaming mind only.
[SPEAKER_06]: But if you dig there and try to find out where is the mind, you'll never find it.
[SPEAKER_06]: the bridge and the people, your own body, your own thoughts, they are not parts of the dreaming mind, they are the dreaming mind appearing in that way.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, this whole world, he says, when he says it's, it's an, I am appearing as the Jeeva here.
[SPEAKER_06]: Krishna says, I, pure consciousness, Brahman, or Atman, am appearing as the Jeeva.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's an appearance.
[SPEAKER_06]: Mahmai Vansho, Jeevalo, Jeeva Bhuta Sanatana.
[SPEAKER_06]: The commentator here, this particular commentary, see, why is it appearing like this?
[SPEAKER_06]: Mamay Vangshaya, yoayam, avidyaya ji babhuta, because of ignorance.
[SPEAKER_06]: I do not know myself as this limitless pure consciousness, so I think of myself as what?
[SPEAKER_06]: A ji was sentient being.
[SPEAKER_06]: What's a sentient being?
[SPEAKER_06]: I am a mind and an intellect.
[SPEAKER_06]: And yes, I admit, I am consciousness too.
[SPEAKER_06]: Consciousness, mind, intellect, body altogether.
[SPEAKER_06]: I am this person.
[SPEAKER_06]: That's what I think I am.
[SPEAKER_06]: In reality, what am I?
[SPEAKER_06]: I am pure consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's like somebody looking at the lake and not knowing it's a lake.
[SPEAKER_06]: Or the cat, if you'd ask the cat in the lake suppose, so with the cat can speak.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, yeah, I'm a cat.
[SPEAKER_06]: I'm walking on the ground and there's a tree behind me and there are these houses and there's a pretty cloud-scroating above.
[SPEAKER_06]: And this is my life,
[SPEAKER_06]: But what is it all?
[SPEAKER_06]: All of it is just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you actually would touch the cat or the lake or the house or whatever, it is just touch water.
[SPEAKER_06]: Similarly, it is pure consciousness appearing as that, avid diya by ignorance, by not knowing its real nature.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you would know its real nature, what would happen?
[SPEAKER_06]: If I know that it is water, it is the canal in Amsterdam, it is water.
[SPEAKER_05]: What will happen?
[SPEAKER_05]: Nothing?
[SPEAKER_06]: It's not that the cat will disappear, the reflection of the cat.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's not that the reflection will disappear, the sky will disappear, the buildings will disappear.
[SPEAKER_06]: The reflection will continue to appear exactly like that.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you know that this is one consciousness, what will happen?
[SPEAKER_06]: Nothing.
[SPEAKER_06]: All of this will continue to appear.
[SPEAKER_06]: But you will know that I am that one consciousness in which the world, the body, the mind, the senses and every other person is appearing and we are all that one consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: The difference is not in the part or hole, the hole of it is one Brahman and parts of it are living beings and cats and buildings and no, no, no, no.
[SPEAKER_06]: The difference is between ignorance and knowledge by not seeing the, not seeing it for what it is.
[SPEAKER_06]: What is it?
[SPEAKER_06]: What is it in the dream, where you are seeing all these people and central park and everything?
[SPEAKER_06]: It is just a mind, it is just a dreamer appearing in all those ways, including the person walking around in the park, you are yourself there in the park, walking around, all of it
[SPEAKER_06]: sonathana, eternally eternally means, some all the time, Sansaritweena Prasitha, the commentator yesterday that Swami says, it is what is known as the Sansarit, the sentient being subject to transmigration.
[SPEAKER_06]: The mind body, the body dying, I come back again, in another body and then die again, I come back again, I am born again and again and again, because instead I am born again in question and behind you say I am born again and again and again and again, I come back again, that is what I know, but both are they do not know themselves as they what they truly are, they think of themselves as body mind.
[SPEAKER_06]: and the commentator says, a source to shoot the pralayao, prakrita u lina tayas, tithani, manap, sastra.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, the mind and the five senses along with that, the powers of the, the, you know, speech and memory and the activities of these, the organs of action, all of that, they remain absorbed in prakrithi in nature.
[SPEAKER_06]: And when you are born again, they are again given to you.
[SPEAKER_06]: And we go through these cycles.
[SPEAKER_06]: Satyam, Sushupti Pralayu, Rappi, Madhang Shattva, Sarvasya, Pijeeva, Mathrasya, Mai, Lyad, Asteeva, Makhpratthi, Krishna's as if Krishna is saying, the commentator is explaining here.
[SPEAKER_06]: You are right, when you say that, in deep sleep or at the end of the universe, you become a job, you are absorbed into the eternal reality.
[SPEAKER_06]: Why would you ever come back again?
[SPEAKER_06]: He says, yes, you do become absorbed in me, as Krishna says, as the ultimate reality has got, at the end of the universe, or every night when you go to sleep.
[SPEAKER_06]: However, he says, Toshapy, even so, avidyaya, avidyaya, avidyaya, he says, Subrachritika, mailya, layo, natu, should be.
[SPEAKER_06]: Because you are, you are cocooned in ignorance, you do not know your real nature.
[SPEAKER_06]: What you get absorbed in is in in that ignorance in that not knowingness and that describes our deep sleep you get absorbed that is how it feels like I do not know anything in dreams I know the dream in waking I know all this in deep sleep nothing I just do not know anything that not knowingness of deep sleep that is called ignorance.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, usually we get absorbed in that and we come back, we hear the commentator says that you get absorbed in primal nature, not in my pure nature that is pure consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: He says,
[SPEAKER_06]: Puna asam saaraaaya, nirgha chati, nirgha chan, avidhuan, pakrita uli natayasthitani, sopadi bhutan, indriyaani akarshati.
[SPEAKER_06]: He says, after waking up.
[SPEAKER_06]: Unless you know who you are, you will come back again, you will identify with this appear, you will still see yourself as this body and this mind and this sense of and engage with an external world or fall asleep and engage with a dream world at no time will you see yourself as pure awareness of pure consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is because of ignorance that you do not know what you are.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is what happens.
[SPEAKER_06]: But then what about the enlightened ones?
[SPEAKER_06]: commentator says, Vidusham, Tushudha, Swarupa, Praptar, Anavritati, for the enlightened one because they attain to the real nature as pure consciousness, that's me, Krishna says, Anavritati, they don't come back again.
[SPEAKER_06]: They are not projected back forth into this world as a limited being at the death of this particular body.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, he starts a description of the G of the sentient being.
[SPEAKER_06]: You have a question with please come.
[SPEAKER_06]: Next few verses you will describe the sentient being.
[SPEAKER_06]: Till now you have been describing pure consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: Where is your hand?
[SPEAKER_01]: So, until now, I always used to think about Jeeva Bhuddhya Tvadam Chakaavan whenever I would read Mama Yavancho Jeeva, and you have always explained Hanumanji statements as
[SPEAKER_01]: representing three different paradigms, but after listening to this, it seems that, I mean, I want to understand exactly how is then Jiva Buddha Dhamunshaka, how do you explain that in the light of this?
[SPEAKER_06]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, there is a story which says, where Hanuman asks Sri Rama Chandra.
[SPEAKER_06]: actually it's Sri Ram Chitra, the other way around.
[SPEAKER_06]: What do you think of me?
[SPEAKER_06]: Sri Ram Chandra asked Sanuman, what do you think about our relationship?
[SPEAKER_06]: And Hanuman gives three answers, apparently.
[SPEAKER_06]: He says,
[SPEAKER_06]: As a sentient being, I am a part of you.
[SPEAKER_06]: You are the whole and you are part.
[SPEAKER_06]: Atma Bhudya Tomevaham, iti me Nishchita Amati.
[SPEAKER_06]: As pure consciousness, you and I are one.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is my conviction.
[SPEAKER_06]: Now you see three approaches, dualistic, qualified monistic and non-dualistic.
[SPEAKER_06]: As this body, there is no doubt, I am Hanuman in this body.
[SPEAKER_06]: I am your servant, you are the Lord of this universe, you are God, I am your servant.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is the relationship that I set up with you.
[SPEAKER_06]: But this body is limited, one day our bodies will die, but we are not, we did, we were not born with the birth of this body and we will not die with the death of this body.
[SPEAKER_06]: because we have a subtle body, a succesma cereira which was born in this life, in this body, when this body ages and dies we will go on to other bodies.
[SPEAKER_06]: Even that is also a body that is not the real eye, bodies that which we inhabit.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, as the subtle body, I am part of your, this cosmic subtle body, so I am part of you, literally I am part of you, even if physical body also I am part of you, but here he sets up a physical relationship that I am the servant, you are the master.
[SPEAKER_06]: The subtle body I continue to be a part of you, a part of, as he says, your projections as causal body, subtle body and all that.
[SPEAKER_06]: And as pure consciousness, I am one with you, as the Atman or Brahman, I am that and there I, you and I are one.
[SPEAKER_06]: And you see the three different approaches, dualistic, qualified monistic and non-duelistic are all shown here.
[SPEAKER_06]: Dualistic means, Dwighta, dualistic that
[SPEAKER_06]: You are the Lord, I am your servant, you are the father, in a Christian idea, you are the father, I am the son, I am the child, I am a mortal being, you are our heavenly father, in that sense.
[SPEAKER_06]: I am the son will make some other sense, then only Jesus can say that I am the son.
[SPEAKER_06]: Or in all the Hindu dualistic traditions, you are the Lord, I am your servant, or in some other relationship, I am a sentient being, I am your servant.
[SPEAKER_06]: But the sentient being survives the death of the physical body.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, the sentient being in itself is a part of you of the cosmic mind, our subtle bodies are part of the cosmic mind.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, he says, Jeva Buddha, this Jeva which he is saying, from that perspective as the sentient being, I exist before being born as Hanuman.
[SPEAKER_06]: And one day the Hanuman identity goes, I will still continue to exist as that such a subtle body, as a subtle being, and that subtle body is a part of the total cosmic subtle body of Herodniagarbar.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, I am part of you, you are the whole and part of you, this is called Vishish tabdwaita, qualified non-dualism, qualified monism, as pure consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: pure existence consciousness, such it, you and I are one.
[SPEAKER_06]: There is no distinction there anymore, you and I are one.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is like if Hanuman and Rama were appearing in that cannell in Amsterdam as reflections.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, as Hanuman I am your servant Rama, you are my Lord.
[SPEAKER_06]: as particles of water which constitute our bodies, we are I am part of you, you are the whole lake I am part of you.
[SPEAKER_06]: But just as water itself, not forget the lake as water, we are a higher you are one reality, you are just one reality in that sense.
[SPEAKER_06]: it is the same thing.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, you have this dualism, qualified monism, non-dwellism, doitabishishta, doitabishishta, doitabishta and doitabishta.
[SPEAKER_06]: Let me just read through these verses and come back to you.
[SPEAKER_06]: Don't forget the question.
[SPEAKER_06]: Because 8, 9 and 8 and 9 will they will go to 8, 9, 10 and 11 will go together.
[SPEAKER_06]: Shari Ram Yadavap Noti, Shari Ram Yadavap Noti, Yachap Yutkramati Shwaram, Yachap Yutkramati Shwaram, Gritwaita Nisan Yati, Gritwaita Nisan Yati, Vaayur Gandhani Vaashayat,
[SPEAKER_06]: Vaya, Gandhani, Vashaya, when the soul acquires a body, it takes these, the six referred to above, from the one he leaves and even as the breeze carries orders from their seats attains the new body.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, he is talking about reincarnation here.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, what happens?
[SPEAKER_06]: When a particular physical body dies, the subtle body, we are talked about subtle body, it leaves the dead physical body, the ghost, we say, we gave up the ghost in English and the Indians would say the ghost gave up the body, we gave up India, we say we gave up the body, what gave up the body, the subtle body gave up the physical body.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, the physical body dies, but the subtle body carries on.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the subtle body is compares it with a breeze which carries fragrance from a flower.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, the subtle body carries with itself the tendency is accumulated in multiple lifestimes and the organs, the capacities, the sense organs, the organs of action, the capacity of the physical body, physical body is dead, it is going to be buried or burned or whatever.
[SPEAKER_06]: And it goes into a new physical body.
[SPEAKER_06]: to settle bodies transferred.
[SPEAKER_06]: Now, this we have put much better examples.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you laptop dies, if you are backed up.
[SPEAKER_06]: When you get a new laptop, your data can be downloaded into the new laptop.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, the data continues, even if the machine is broken, you get a new machine, but all your data is then downloaded into the new machine.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is a lot like that, much better example, then all of the flowers and orders and all of fragrances are nice poetic examples.
[SPEAKER_06]: But, more to the point is our modern lab, because it is an information technology, it is very close to mind and consciousness, so this, when the physical machine is destroyed, laptop or iPad or whatever, if you are backed up.
[SPEAKER_06]: And we may or may not back up, but the law is very meticulous.
[SPEAKER_06]: So we are always back up, we are always back up on the cosmic computer here in Nagarva.
[SPEAKER_06]: So when this physical body dies, you, the sentient being, reflected in that mind that mind will, will travel, will be downloaded into another physical body.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is something like that.
[SPEAKER_06]: Then what happens?
[SPEAKER_06]: Number nine.
[SPEAKER_06]: But here it is a poetic, it does not give a laptop example, this is like the breeze carrying fragrances.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, you are carried along our memories, our tendencies are carried along to the and downloaded into a new body.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is what is called rebirth, the cycle of birth.
[SPEAKER_06]: But the advantages is what died was a body, what is carried from one body to another is another body, is a settler body, it is still not you, you are the sentience, the consciousness behind it all.
[SPEAKER_06]: No.
[SPEAKER_06]: 9.
[SPEAKER_06]: Shotram jakshus parshanam jakshus parshanam jakshus parshanam jakshus parshanam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam jakshunam
[SPEAKER_06]: Arishthaya, Manashchaya, Visayaanupase, Bhate, Visayaanupase, Bhate, Visayaanupase, Bhate, presiding over the ears, the eyes, the organs of touch, taste and smell and also the mind, he enjoys the sense of objects.
[SPEAKER_06]: So it's describing us now.
[SPEAKER_06]: What's going on here?
[SPEAKER_06]: You the consciousness, you the spirit, the consciousness, the real nature, reflected,
[SPEAKER_06]: You have the mind, the intellect, the memory, the ego, sense of ego.
[SPEAKER_06]: That's all part of the software.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's still not you.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's all part of the equipment, the subtle equipment.
[SPEAKER_06]: And it is connected to the powers of the senses, the power of seeing, smelling, tasting, touching.
[SPEAKER_06]: The power of doing, he says here, the organs of touch, taste, and smell, et cetera.
[SPEAKER_06]: And also the powers of speaking and powers of action.
[SPEAKER_06]: all of that you illumine as consciousness embody it in that and you attain to a new body and there you continue with your spiritual evolution.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is what is going on.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, description of what we we are right now.
[SPEAKER_06]: In our example, what are we?
[SPEAKER_06]: We are the water of that canal, but in us what is appearing, the house and the cat and the clouds and we have forgotten that we are the water.
[SPEAKER_06]: We think we are the cat and we are exploding stuff around.
[SPEAKER_06]: No, the body of the cat is also that one that water.
[SPEAKER_06]: the activities of the cat, the so-called other stuff here, the buildings and the tree and the sky.
[SPEAKER_06]: They are all that one water roadie.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is that one consciousness alone appearing in all these ways.
[SPEAKER_06]: The problem is ignorance, not knowing what we are, we keep moving around in that world of appearance, we don't know the background reality.
[SPEAKER_06]: If we knew the background reality, it would be perfectly fine.
[SPEAKER_06]: If it's a cat, if it's a human being, if it's a boat, if it's a building or a tree or a puff of cloud, we don't know because all of it is actually what?
[SPEAKER_06]: Water.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you touch it there, this is a canal example, in Amsterdam, we are there.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, I am going there next week, that is why it is on top of my eyes.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you touch it, what would you happen?
[SPEAKER_06]: If you touch the cat or the buddhist scratch you, if you touch the house or the tree, would it feel hard?
[SPEAKER_06]: No, all of it would hang the hands would come up with, because it is just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: no matter what it looks like, it's just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: Similarly, whatever we are experiencing here is just one limitless consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: It appears as a mind, as a body, as a world of sight and smell and taste and touch and other sentient beings, but it's one limitless existence.
[SPEAKER_06]: When it appears as sentient beings, then what happens?
[SPEAKER_06]: We feel as if we have been downloaded into
[SPEAKER_06]: and we are interacting with other physical bodies.
[SPEAKER_06]: And we are going through a process of birth and death.
[SPEAKER_06]: The body will die, it is aging, body will die, and I will now go on to another life.
[SPEAKER_06]: All of this is part of the reflection in the canal.
[SPEAKER_06]: All of this is part of the dream.
[SPEAKER_06]: The reality is the water of the canal.
[SPEAKER_06]: The reality is the dreamers and in these those are examples, dream example and can a example.
[SPEAKER_06]: The reality here is that one consciousness limitless consciousness which appears as this world.
[SPEAKER_06]: What is that?
[SPEAKER_06]: That is God, that is you, that is I, that is all of us.
[SPEAKER_06]: interesting question I will be asked yes if this is so why do not be see it I do not be know it and Krishna will answer it is a question of knowledge and ignorance we are seeing it we do not see it no we are seeing when you are looking when I was sitting there looking at the cat in the water the reflection the cat the house the sky the cloud the tree
[SPEAKER_06]: I was, it is just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: If I were to touch the cat, pet the cat in the can, what would it?
[SPEAKER_06]: I just touch water.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, we are seeing Brahman, we are seeing Atman, we are seeing, we are experiencing the absolute here.
[SPEAKER_06]: We do not recognize it.
[SPEAKER_06]: There is a great tradition in Hinduism called Kashmirishivism, Kashmirishiva philosophy and the technical name for
[SPEAKER_06]: that all of this is actually Shiva, but we do not recognize it.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is, it is a, it is Shiva's artistic display.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is, it is a drama performed by Shiva, but it is all Shiva.
[SPEAKER_06]: Shiva is the actor.
[SPEAKER_06]: Shiva is all the actors, and Shiva is the stage, all of that is drama.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, the gentleman here, the microphone.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I'm sorry, that you know, everything is the purishan, the prakitriya.
[SPEAKER_06]: Forget the question, one more thing, sorry, I was interested in the, I was very happy to read this out today.
[SPEAKER_06]: Just today, I had some visitors from Dubai.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the question they asked me was, I beginning to understand that I am pure consciousness optimal or Brahmin.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, when we die, why do we come back at all, why do we have multiple lifetimes?
[SPEAKER_06]: You are missing a big chunk of the picture, a big link in the picture.
[SPEAKER_06]: I am Atman Brahman, that is Advaita Vedanta, that is a finer conclusion, but what is common to all Indian schools, all Indian systems of thought is that we have these two kinds of existence, a physical existence, a body which is public everybody can see, but also I inert first person life, inner life and that inner life is that subtle body, the mind and the senses and all that and that does not die with the death of the physical body.
[SPEAKER_06]: and that continues and that is a limiting factor that means it will be born again it will be downloaded into another physical body.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, that explains why after death of the physical body we do not become one with Brahman of it is not that we are pure consciousness, upman Brahman and a physical body no no very important what is in between.
[SPEAKER_06]: What is in between is the subtle body, it is also a body, subtle body, that is what makes us a sentient being which journeys across lifetimes, travels across lifetimes, is embodied like this.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yes, please go.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, I think from what you explained is that there is an illusion, right, it is Maya.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_02]: Where does Maya come from?
[SPEAKER_02]: Is it part of the Purusha or it is part of the prakithri and if there is a prakithri
[SPEAKER_06]: So, where does Maya come from?
[SPEAKER_06]: The Advaiti Cancer is, it does it.
[SPEAKER_06]: You will never find the source of Maya.
[SPEAKER_06]: They say here that there is a saying about this that, Agyanko Siddhumat Kizhiya Mahatmaji, Agyanko Katiya.
[SPEAKER_06]: Don't try to establish the source and the reality of ignorance of Maya.
[SPEAKER_06]: Rather try to overcome Maya.
[SPEAKER_06]: in the middle of Maya, in the middle of ignorance, if you try to investigate ignorance, you never get a clear answer.
[SPEAKER_06]: Why?
[SPEAKER_06]: The reason you will never get a clear answer is, it's good that you will not get a clear answer because it doesn't really exist.
[SPEAKER_06]: You're chasing a phantom.
[SPEAKER_06]: Those who are within ignorance, within Maya, they will never find out what is the real nature of Maya.
[SPEAKER_06]: Those who have gone beyond Maya, realized I am Brahman, they
[SPEAKER_06]: On this side of Maya, we have the question, we don't have the answer.
[SPEAKER_06]: On that side of Maya, they have the answer, but they don't have the question.
[SPEAKER_06]: For them it's not a problem.
[SPEAKER_06]: Again, so what should we do?
[SPEAKER_06]: Instead of trying to find out the nature of Maya, we should cut down Maya.
[SPEAKER_06]: And what will cut down Maya knowledge?
[SPEAKER_06]: The problem in the way the way down the sets of the problem, it's a problem of ignorance and knowledge.
[SPEAKER_06]: of not realizing and realizing.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is why this is called a method, this is the way of knowledge of Ghana.
[SPEAKER_06]: If ignorance is the problem, knowledge will be the solution.
[SPEAKER_06]: If the problem is not ignorance, if some other problem is there, then knowledge will not will not help.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, does
[SPEAKER_03]: So, just a clarification on this example of the city appearing in the water.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, here you are trying to explain ignorance and the reality.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: But in the other examples you talk about like the wave and the water or pot and clay and gold and ornaments.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, that is trying to explain how we are one within it.
[SPEAKER_03]: What is the difference between these?
[SPEAKER_06]: So, the wave and the water and the ocean they are just water that is all you are not you know the wave is not really a part of the water think about it is this table in the table has many parts it has legs it has a top it has a bottom it has many parts when you look at it would look at it as wood this one when you touch it what do you say touch wood so
[SPEAKER_06]: But this top, the four legs are the parts of the wood, the parts of the table I understand.
[SPEAKER_06]: But are the parts of the wood, does wood have four legs in the top and the bottom?
[SPEAKER_06]: No, wood by itself is what, it's just wood.
[SPEAKER_06]: whether it is a table or a chair or just plinters of wood, it is just wood.
[SPEAKER_06]: Now, this is something, similarly, the idea is in the way, when the ocean example, the way we can compare to a G, the ocean you can compare to Ishwarah, God.
[SPEAKER_06]: But the water is from our real nature, in that sense.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, yes.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, there are different things being proved.
[SPEAKER_06]: There are different point is being proved there.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, there we are not showing that the city is a part of the water.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is not there, it appears there.
[SPEAKER_06]: And all the distinctions appear there, but whatever the distinctions are, they are just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you would see the reality behind it.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, these examples,
[SPEAKER_06]: This is saying in Sanskrit, Uperma Ekadashi, that means an example or an analogy is meant to prove when you want point, don't extend it beyond, that's why the skill of the teacher is important in using these analogies.
[SPEAKER_06]: So when you say, as brave as a lion, as brave as a lion, that does not mean that this person will walk around on all force and growl and pounce on you and eat you up.
[SPEAKER_06]: not, don't extend it beyond that.
[SPEAKER_06]: Upoma equation means the example or metaphor is meant to be applied in only one way.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is a teaching tool, don't extend it beyond, so it depends on the skill of the teacher.
[SPEAKER_06]: Does it answer your question?
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yes, please go to the person next.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yes.
[UNKNOWN]: How?
[SPEAKER_06]: Then you can.
[SPEAKER_05]: The first course, obviously.
[SPEAKER_05]: So earlier, you know, in 13 chapter also, a lot says that, you know, you need to understand the field and the knower of the field.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_05]: And here in this today's discussion also, you know, you know, kind of alluded to how we need to be the knower of the field and not get restricted to the field.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, in this you know you just said that in this life as a body you may still understand that you are one consciousness, but your subtle mind has to also transcend that yes.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, how does the subtle mind then get over the ignorance?
[SPEAKER_06]: subtle mind means mind is subtle, the physical body this is gross or physical and compared to that the mind is subtle and we can we can experience it in our own way there is a clear distinction between the body and the mind body for example is public you cannot experience all this table is a public thing which can be experienced so is this body it is accessible to the senses.
[SPEAKER_06]: But our minds we all have minds, we have thoughts, memories, they are that is not accessible to the senses, but each one of us internally can access it.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, the mind is the first person private experience, but we all have it.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the body is public, it's, you can experience it.
[SPEAKER_06]: But these two sides are both appearing to us.
[SPEAKER_06]: What was your question there?
[SPEAKER_05]: So therefore, if, say, Mama I want to, I believe that I am Krishna, I am really the one consciousness.
[SPEAKER_05]: But then, you know, if I die, I would again be reborn, given the subtle mind is still ignorant.
[SPEAKER_06]: So how am I, again, mind, mind, subtle body, huh, mind?
[SPEAKER_05]: So, how do you kind of get transcend that, I mean practical knowledge, through knowledge?
[SPEAKER_06]: Until we know ourselves as truly what we are, we will still consider ourselves to be this is the body and this is a physical universe and I have a mind, I have a whole mental universe of thoughts, memories, ideas, projects, likes, dislikes, and this is entirely all I know.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, there is some consciousness there that I don't distinguish it, but when I realize what
[SPEAKER_06]: Then I will realize, I am this limitless existence consciousness in which mind and body are appearing.
[SPEAKER_06]: This mind and body are also nothing but that one consciousness only appearing in this way.
[SPEAKER_06]: If I did not know what water was and I looked into that canal there, but would I have described though there is a cat and it is sitting below a tree and behind the tree are two buildings and above them there are clouds and there is a blue sky.
[SPEAKER_06]: But what is the truth there?
[SPEAKER_06]: There is no cat there, there is no tree there, there is no building, the truth is it is all water and they are all appearances in water.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is the truth.
[SPEAKER_06]: The difference was between knowledge and ignorance, not knowing I took the appearances to be the reality.
[SPEAKER_06]: knowing the reality, the appearance still kept on appearing, but I know what it is, each one of it.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is all one homogenous, acreous of this, homogenous water, one reality only and so only by knowledge and knowledge is attained by Vedantic enquiry into who am I, what am I?
[SPEAKER_06]: When I come to the appreciation of what pure consciousness is, then I will realize this world objects, our sense experiences, our mind, even our individual being, sentient being, they are all appearances in one limitless consciousness.
[SPEAKER_06]: It will become clear.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is already there right now.
[SPEAKER_06]: Just like the water is there.
[SPEAKER_06]: When you see the catty, we try to pet the cat in the water, you will just get little real bit.
[SPEAKER_06]: There is nothing there.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is just water.
[SPEAKER_06]: Once I was said, so Mahatma ji, dicta hai, Mahatma ji hai, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi, nahi nahi, nahi
[SPEAKER_04]: Namaste Swami G.M.
[SPEAKER_04]: Vapav, a lot of religions talk about suffering and say life is suffering, we should get rid of our lives, we should end this cycle of suffering and we touched upon it today right.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's a core principle of Buddhism as well, but this confuses me several times like
[SPEAKER_04]: We see a lot of people are happy and not necessarily look at suffering as the only thing that's there in life a lot of times we give the argument that okay in the end you are going to get old you'll have disease you'll lose your loved ones but
[SPEAKER_04]: Positive people might look at okay.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, I also had my youth.
[SPEAKER_04]: I also found my loved ones I loved them.
[SPEAKER_04]: I had the feeling of love, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: So why am I being a pessimistic person and saying that life is also spring and even like if we look at people when they are dying
[SPEAKER_04]: A lot of people will say that I still want to cut.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think most of the people would say I would like to continue the life right instead of saying that no this was a piece of crap and I want to get done with it.
[SPEAKER_04]: So this part confuses me a lot of times I thought that okay it could be the feeling of incompleteness as well.
[SPEAKER_04]: Otherwise one would be satisfied where they are so maybe we are saying that being not satisfied is suffering
[SPEAKER_04]: But then people would say that I am striving for something and I am having the joy in the journey itself instead of looking at it from the perspective that I'm unsatisfied that so I am doing something I get your point.
[SPEAKER_06]: Right.
[SPEAKER_06]: So the answer from Vedanta would be Vedanta Buddhism.
[SPEAKER_06]: And these are especially Buddhism, somebody who was it, Buddhism is a very serious religion.
[SPEAKER_06]: It starts with all this suffering, sarvam-dukh-kamp.
[SPEAKER_06]: The answer there would be, not just yourself out, go right ahead.
[SPEAKER_06]: As long as you think
[SPEAKER_06]: It's fine, there is suffering, there is pain, but there is also hope and joy and let me look at the sunshine, why look at the rain only and go ahead, go right ahead, then has religion anything to say to me, yes there is give us certain guardrails which make our experience of life a little more safe.
[SPEAKER_06]: that all right, go on as you are, there is no need to come into Buddhism or Vedanta and go on as you are and here is a way to improve the quality of your experience.
[SPEAKER_06]: So ethics and ethical life are the law of karma, good karma will generate good results and it will give you a better quality of life, bad karma will generate you know suffering and will give you more misery in life.
[SPEAKER_06]: a happiness and suffering, happiness and misery, misery by being misery nobody wants it and happiness being happiness we all want it.
[SPEAKER_06]: Nobody will ask there that let me have a little bit of misery and let me have a little bit.
[SPEAKER_06]: If possible I will like to eliminate the misery as much as possible and I would like to maximize my suffering as much as my happiness as much as possible.
[SPEAKER_06]: The whole economics is based on that, maximization of utility.
[SPEAKER_06]: So that is conventional religion.
[SPEAKER_06]: conventional leisure.
[SPEAKER_06]: In Vedas, it is called the Karmakanda.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is all based on causality, put good causes into motion, it will give rise to good effects.
[SPEAKER_06]: Put evil causes into motion, it will give rise to suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: Good karma leads to happiness, bad karma will lead to unhappiness.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is the advice that religion will give us.
[SPEAKER_06]: Now, you are ok with this.
[SPEAKER_06]: But the problem is that it still oldages there, disease is there, death is there, uncertain is there.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the sufferings of our clothes and near and dear ones are there.
[SPEAKER_06]: One gentleman said to me that his teenage daughter said,
[SPEAKER_06]: No, there is happiness in life in this side, if we accept the happiness, it is also accept the sadness.
[SPEAKER_06]: Why makes such a good grade deal about eliminating sorrow and suffering?
[SPEAKER_06]: We will accept both, my answer was, there is a teenager, she is a child, she has not seen suffering, tell it to somebody who has lost their child, tell that
[SPEAKER_06]: Why do we work so hard day and night to eliminate suffering?
[SPEAKER_06]: Will any doctor tell the doctor who it treats physical problems or mental issues will just say, no, it is happiness, you have happiness, it is misery, you take it also.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is not such a big deal, no, we try to eliminate pain.
[SPEAKER_06]: We try to maximize happiness, whole economics, maximization of marginal utility, first thing we would like.
[SPEAKER_06]: What is the goal of life according to economics, maximization of utility or marginal utility.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, maximization of happiness and minimization of pain, it is our urge, it is inbuilt, we cannot stop it.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you say, no, let take both, when you give it that advice to others, doesn't work with yourself.
[SPEAKER_06]: We want to minimize pain as much as possible, we will strive, we will not say okay, pain has come, okay, let it be, happiness also okay, let it be, no, we try to maximize happiness, we try to minimize pain, yes and then this is number one, number two we also begin to see a great deal of life, in fact most of life is much more sorrow and misery than happiness,
[SPEAKER_06]: lives in conditions of poverty and struggle.
[SPEAKER_06]: A good part of our lives as we get older and older is gets more and more difficult.
[SPEAKER_06]: There is a lot of struggle in life, misery in life.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, we are designed that way, values also tell you why, because we need to fight pain, we need to fight problems.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is why our whole sensory system is designed to immediately
[SPEAKER_06]: Everything is going well in the body, all is fine.
[SPEAKER_06]: One to take, whole the day is point, whole attention will go there.
[SPEAKER_06]: Transcendental meditation there.
[UNKNOWN]: Ha!
[SPEAKER_06]: Ha!
[UNKNOWN]: Ha!
[SPEAKER_00]: Ha!
[UNKNOWN]: Ha!
[SPEAKER_06]: Ha!
[SPEAKER_06]: Ha
[SPEAKER_06]: So, at one point this question will come up.
[SPEAKER_06]: What is the point of all of this?
[SPEAKER_06]: It seems like a fruitless struggle.
[SPEAKER_06]: Talk to somebody who is lost their child.
[SPEAKER_06]: I meet all sorts of people throughout the burden of pain is enormous in this world.
[SPEAKER_06]: and the happiness and the prices to be one are fickle and passing.
[SPEAKER_06]: So at one point, a question will arise, what is the true nature of life that I am living?
[SPEAKER_06]: And this comes to an old soul at some point some experience in this lifetime or next lifetime.
[SPEAKER_06]: We sit back and contemplate what's going on here.
[SPEAKER_06]: There's an enormous amount of pain in the world and we are very susceptible to suffering and pain.
[SPEAKER_06]: What is the solution to this?
[SPEAKER_06]: Is it continuously trying to keep myself amused and ignored the suffering and explain it away?
[SPEAKER_06]: So, hoping it will go well for some lucky people it might for most people it does not.
[SPEAKER_06]: But, and if you investigate deeply, that was Buddha's discovery, if you actually think and contemplate life and our experience in life, Sarvam Dukkam, all is suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: Momentary, momentary, all is momentary, trunicum, trunicum, sarvam, trunicum.
[SPEAKER_06]: Dukkam, dukkam, sarvam, emptiness, shunnyam, shunnyam, sarvam, shunnyam, empty, empty,
[SPEAKER_06]: all the good things that you achieve also.
[SPEAKER_06]: Once you have achieved, you find it is come, it is empty.
[SPEAKER_06]: And therefore, come, come, come, serve them, come, the Buddhism is very pessimistic that way.
[SPEAKER_06]: There it is all pervaded by suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: Pleasure is just an island in an ocean of suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: It is an interruption in the obvious.
[SPEAKER_06]: Pleasure is below it is suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: and it will come up a little while later again.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, Buddha's insight, it is all pervaded by suffering, old age is suffering, illness is suffering, death is suffering and there are many associated loneliness, lack of fulfillment, all of that.
[SPEAKER_06]: And therefore, he says, but is also suffering, but starts this entire chain.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is also about a lack of full flow due to that an intrinsic aspect that is also suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: Nothing will fill us, when we say Buddhism talks about suffering, it is not that there is deep pain all the time, not that there is deep pain, but it is just existential angst and things go well also nothing is very perfect.
[SPEAKER_06]: You ask the richest person, the winner of the Nobel Prize, the most brilliant intellectual, all of them will admit to unhappiness in their life.
[SPEAKER_06]: I met this one, I won't name him last year, I met one of the most brilliant neuroscientists of all, everybody, people generally know him.
[SPEAKER_06]: And he was saying how, you know something called sudden infant death, so his eldest child, she died, little girl.
[SPEAKER_06]: And this long ago, and he says that he had another daughter also, and he says, night time after night time, I remember how many times I would get up suddenly from in terror from my sleep and go and stand near a bedroom and listen to her breath.
[SPEAKER_06]: And this man, something had experienced 50 years ago, the little girl died.
[SPEAKER_06]: In front of me, sat and wept and wept and wept.
[SPEAKER_06]: sorrow, it is pervaded by sorrow.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, the question then arises, is there no deep answer to this or no deep solution to this?
[SPEAKER_06]: What is the solution to this?
[SPEAKER_06]: This was the Buddha's quest.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, I am in Tapasya Anjith said, Buddhism is a serious religion.
[SPEAKER_06]: Hinduism we talk about Sukha Dukka, but this is the start with Sarabam Dukka, all is suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is for the sensitive, all is suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is saying, I forgot in the original Sanskrit, to the eyeball, to the eyeball, even the touch of a spider web is suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: If your mind is sensitive, you will see how much suffering permeates this world.
[SPEAKER_06]: And it is by design.
[SPEAKER_06]: And by biological design, by evolution, psychological design, we are predisposed to what suffering and there is a point to it, it is not, if you just stop here you will become pessimistic and suicidal.
[SPEAKER_06]: Heinrich Zimmer was here in New York.
[SPEAKER_06]: He says the religions of India are not pessimistic.
[SPEAKER_06]: They are actually optimistic because they all offer a deep solution.
[SPEAKER_06]: They call it Moxia, Nirvana, Mukti, Upper Varga.
[SPEAKER_06]: Many names are there.
[SPEAKER_06]: So that's the thing.
[SPEAKER_06]: We must look for it.
[SPEAKER_06]: If we do not, so you look at the Vedic religion, very interesting, what you ask, if we do not see a big problem here, good continuous as you are continuing and try to keep to an ethical life so that your suffering is minimized and good karma is there, so your life is sort of within guardrails, it does not go off the rails.
[SPEAKER_06]: Even then we cannot escape suffering, we cannot escape old age, we cannot escape disease,
[SPEAKER_06]: suffering suffering all is pervaded by suffering and hence comes a question what is the solution to this?
[SPEAKER_06]: Before this, what was the solution, the teaching of religion?
[SPEAKER_06]: Karma.
[SPEAKER_06]: Good karma leads to happiness, bad karma leads to misery, maximized good karma, minimize bad karma, you will have a better life.
[SPEAKER_06]: Is this a permanent solution, no, even then you cannot escape old age, even then you cannot escape disease, even then you cannot escape death.
[SPEAKER_06]: Even then you cannot escape separation from loved ones, you cannot.
[SPEAKER_06]: Even the most intellectual sharpest who understands everything, 50 years later this sitting in weeping for the loss of an infant daughter long ago.
[SPEAKER_06]: For the sensitive all is suffering, the eyeball is very sensitive, the touch of a spider web is suffering for it.
[SPEAKER_06]: There is an apple got into original Sanskrit, so we must come to that sensitivity at some point.
[SPEAKER_06]: And the Buddha, he was not motivated by his own suffering, he was a prince, everything was going really well for him.
[SPEAKER_06]: But he saw a diseased person, an old person, and a dead person, and that great heart it wept seeing, he saw through that immediately into the all-pervading suffering all around in the world.
[SPEAKER_06]: And he wanted a solution to that.
[SPEAKER_06]: Is there a deep solution to this problem of human suffering?
[SPEAKER_06]: It is not that.
[SPEAKER_06]: And there is some suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: There is some happiness.
[SPEAKER_06]: Take both little bit of about carry on, that's a childish answer.
[SPEAKER_06]: This area carry on, be happy and something some problems will come, a person who has lost their child.
[SPEAKER_06]: Can you say, well you had the child for 15, 16 years and now it is dead fine, you take both.
[SPEAKER_06]: You cannot, there will be monstrous to say that.
[SPEAKER_06]: And that is not rare.
[SPEAKER_06]: Our life is pervaded through and through by this.
[SPEAKER_06]: And it ends with, it doesn't end with the peak of health and celebration and fine.
[SPEAKER_06]: I had a wonderful life and at the peak of physical perfection.
[SPEAKER_06]: Now I will ascend to heaven.
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
[SPEAKER_06]: Those who think that are below 40, above 40.
[SPEAKER_06]: Beyond 40, you know, it's all downhill.
[SPEAKER_06]: If we do it well, it is a managed downhill, if we do not do it well, it is a precipitous crash downhill.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_06]: All right, we will stop here.
[SPEAKER_06]: In Hinduism you will find two kinds of religion.
[SPEAKER_06]: There is what is called the Karmakanda and the Gyanakanda.
[SPEAKER_06]: The Karmakanda is the ritualistic portion of the religion which you might call conventional religion.
[SPEAKER_06]: how to be happy in this life as we are, can religion help me.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, religion will say yes be ethical, be truthful, be caring, these values will maximize your happiness in this life, do good karma, good karma will lead to good experiences in life.
[SPEAKER_06]: But for those who are more sensitive like the eyeball.
[SPEAKER_06]: Those who are more sensitive, more mature, they will begin to see that after all that even in the best of life some rainfall will come, some suffering is inevitable and old age disease death are there for everybody as they both are said.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, is there any deep solution for this?
[SPEAKER_06]: And of course, unfortunately there are much bigger tragedy sometimes.
[SPEAKER_06]: as I said, they are going to create shocks in life.
[SPEAKER_06]: So what is the deep solution for it?
[SPEAKER_06]: Then comes the other side of religion, the higher side, which is called Gyanakanda, the path of spirituality knowledge.
[SPEAKER_06]: path of spirituality on knowledge.
[SPEAKER_06]: That's where we are.
[SPEAKER_06]: Vedanta is there.
[SPEAKER_06]: It's for serious people.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, I mean, tapasayanji would say that Buddhism is religion for serious people, because you must start with all this suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you say no, no, no, it's mostly fun, child.
[SPEAKER_06]: be happy, hopefully nothing bad will happen to you, but no, it is a child life will teach.
[SPEAKER_06]: So, this investigation into what we are and what this world is, it is an investigation actually for overcoming suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: the one of the text servodation of sangra.
[SPEAKER_06]: I say what is this all the spirituality?
[SPEAKER_06]: It says it is like doctors.
[SPEAKER_06]: It says servodation of sangra.
[SPEAKER_06]: He says jikitsakaanam, he was just like written 700 years ago, like doctors, what is the source of suffering?
[SPEAKER_06]: is there a cure for that suffering?
[SPEAKER_06]: Is there a cause of that suffering?
[SPEAKER_06]: And that cause can it be removed?
[SPEAKER_06]: Is there a cure?
[SPEAKER_06]: And what is the cure?
[SPEAKER_06]: Four steps.
[SPEAKER_06]: If you look at the four noble truths of the Buddha, first noble truth, there is suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: Second noble truth, there is a cause of that suffering.
[SPEAKER_06]: Third noble truth, there is a cure that cause can be removed.
[SPEAKER_06]: Nirvana is possible.
[SPEAKER_06]: And fourth novel truth, the eight fold
[SPEAKER_06]: And the server version of Sangras, 700 years ago it says, in fact all spirituality is like this, the higher spirituality, Vedanta yoga, all of them, all the bhakti also, all of them, the first of all acknowledge the truth of the seriousness of it all.
[SPEAKER_06]: We are caught up in wearing trouble and second then investigate what can we do about it.
[SPEAKER_06]: That is spirituality.