Brand Genius Chris Outlaw - How You Can Adapt, Evolve & Transform Your Brand & Unlock Its Potential | The Big Success Podcast

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<v Speaker 1>Being different is really crucial to branding A brand.

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<v Speaker 1>A lot of times I'd always define it as like a field of wild horses.

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<v Speaker 1>Everyone is generally on a different page when it comes to a brand.

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<v Speaker 2>How do you make your brand a personality?

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<v Speaker 2>Chris Outlaw is going to take us through everything that needs to happen for you and your brand to reach that amazing status.

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<v Speaker 1>You want to make sure you understand what the brand is, what it stands for.

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<v Speaker 2>Chris Outlaw, host of the Unified Brand Podcast, with you and me today on branding.

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<v Speaker 2>So, chris, what is your definition of success?

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I think that's a really good question.

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<v Speaker 1>I thought about it a lot and I think there's a couple of different things.

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<v Speaker 1>The first thing is you think about success.

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<v Speaker 1>You think about what everyone thinks about, which is kind of, you know, the financial success, the kind of status, part of success.

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<v Speaker 1>But I think actually, when I think about success, I think it's tied to meaning, it's tied to purpose, it's tied to achieving a level of something that you're passionate about, that you'd love to do, that provides for your family, that maybe then extends into a community or a wider part.

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<v Speaker 1>So there's a level of service to it, I think, and legacy, and I think all of that comes together and I think it's quite hard to quantify, but something on those lines from my perspective.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's often hard to quantify.

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<v Speaker 2>What about in your area of the world in branding?

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<v Speaker 2>What is success in branding?

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<v Speaker 1>So success from us, from working with clients, is to see them achieve the things, empower them to be proud of their brand and build the brand that actually is the potential it has underneath it.

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<v Speaker 1>So a lot of times you work with clients and you can see the potential they have for their brand and they find it really hard to achieve it.

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<v Speaker 1>So one of the things that is successful in that regard is helping them to uncover that potential.

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<v Speaker 1>That is successful in that regard is helping them to uncover that potential, and I think just being authentic with your brand and uncovering and being able to achieve the potential that it has is a level of success that is sustainable.

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<v Speaker 2>Got it.

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<v Speaker 2>So where do you think in life you chose success Like?

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<v Speaker 2>Was it as a young boy, was it?

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<v Speaker 2>You know?

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<v Speaker 2>Where did success become your choice?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so I think there's a couple of okay.

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<v Speaker 1>I think I've always had a passion to achieve, a passion to succeed.

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<v Speaker 1>I've always been driven to compete, but generally not compete with others, but more with myself.

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<v Speaker 1>Even in sports, it's always been about bettering myself as opposed to you're always aware of the competition, but it's more about how can I improve on a day-to-day basis.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, there's been a few occasions.

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<v Speaker 1>One of them, though, I think the big sort of time I chose success was I lost my dad at 16 from motor neurons disease.

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<v Speaker 1>He was ill for about five years and I sort of went off the rails a bit and lost my way, and there was one day when I sort of came back to it and I was kind of like this is something I need to do, got it.

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<v Speaker 2>So is there a Chris Outlaw theory or philosophy or formula for success Like to be successful, you got to do these things or have these traits, or what's your theory?

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<v Speaker 1>on it.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I think success comes from that congruency, that authenticity.

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<v Speaker 1>I think if you can that congruency, that authenticity, I think, if you can understand what it is that you love to do, what you're good at, and if you can find a correlation between those two things, I think finding success becomes.

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<v Speaker 1>Not easier, I would say, because it's still going to be hard, but you're going to find the journey easier and more rewarding and more able to sort of keep picking yourself back up.

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<v Speaker 1>If you do reach those roadblocks and I think that's one thing to think about with success is in success.

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<v Speaker 1>There are loads of things that are going to stop you, but I think when you're on your path, you kind of you keep going.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it's something that you strive to do.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, when you look at that, then there's obviously some relationship between failure and success.

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<v Speaker 2>How do you view that?

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<v Speaker 1>I love that quote.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm not going to get it 100% right, but I love that quote.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it was Edison that said he found a thousand ways not to make the light bulb and then the one time that he did.

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<v Speaker 1>I think something like that is.

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<v Speaker 1>I think failure is part of success and I think failure has got a bad rep in terms of people see it as something that is a stumbling block, a stopping place.

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<v Speaker 1>Failure is a place where you stop, but I think it's not.

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<v Speaker 1>It's just one more step on the road to success.

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<v Speaker 1>It's another way, how not to do something, or it's a way to shift what you're doing or to pivot, or something like that.

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<v Speaker 1>So I think failure and success go hand in hand doing or to pivot or something like that.

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<v Speaker 2>So I think failure and success go hand in hand.

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<v Speaker 2>If you go back to when you were a young fella and you made that choice and said, okay, I've now got to focus on success, were there certain things you did that said, okay, this is what.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm going to do now that I've focused on success.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so I think all change happens outside of comfort zone.

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<v Speaker 1>So I think one of the biggest things pushing myself outside of a comfort zone in every area so doing some things that are hard, maybe, things other people wouldn't do, essentially like reaching out to at the time, reaching out to agencies in my local area or even further afield, and kind of just doing that door knocking, essentially just continued door knocking until I actually got that initial breakthrough in the industry to be able to start start my journey when you think about that starting of success and that momentum and the level of energy it takes in the beginning versus today, how would you work or talk to a young person and say, hey, this is what it takes to get started, type thing?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well, there is a lot.

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<v Speaker 1>I think there is a lot of work initially to.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it goes into putting the time in.

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<v Speaker 1>I think there is a big part of that.

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<v Speaker 1>I think there's also a lot of work that goes into understanding who you are and defining yourself along the way and finding out the things that shape you as an individual, shape you as what motivates you, what drives you, and I think the work and the time that you put in in the beginning allows you later on to have a smoother ride in terms of understanding what's right for you, what isn't right for you, making those decisions and just having that almost that compound effect over time.

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<v Speaker 1>I think the work at the beginning adds later on to that sort of compound effect.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Someone once said to me it's kind of like in the beginning of life you've got to put the four corners of the jigsaw out and then you just keep working how to fill it in, type thing.

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<v Speaker 2>When you started to fill in the jigsaw for you, it led you down the path of marketing and branding and all that sort of stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>Why did you choose that?

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<v Speaker 2>What was the reason for choosing that area for you?

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<v Speaker 1>As a kid I was always interested in drawings, art and design, but I was also interested in design from a functionality perspective.

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<v Speaker 1>My dad was a little bit of a.

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<v Speaker 1>He was great at like DIY, great at building things, problem solving, but he was also a bit of an inventor so he invented a a few different things.

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<v Speaker 1>So I always had this sort of problem solving design aspect that I loved.

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<v Speaker 1>I also, from growing up, used to really be interested in storytelling and creating stories and writing stories and I used to love stories and and massive Star Wars geek and so from that, those things plus just sort of helping people to define themselves, I think one of the things we did with the clients early on was helping to understand themselves.

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<v Speaker 1>But it was those things really design, problem solving and storytelling.

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<v Speaker 1>That kind of led me to marketing.

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<v Speaker 2>Got it.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, it's really interesting when you look at those skills you get.

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<v Speaker 2>It's crazy how, when people are towards the end of their life and they're famous for something, rarely is anyone famous for what they did at school.

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<v Speaker 2>It's like taking those skills and turning them into something that is a saleable thing.

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<v Speaker 2>When you talk about helping people find and define who they are, what are some of the things we can do?

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<v Speaker 2>Forget the branding of the business.

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<v Speaker 2>We'll get to that in a minute.

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<v Speaker 2>But if I'm thinking about me as a person, how do I think about my branding?

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<v Speaker 1>So that's a really good question.

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<v Speaker 1>I think one thing to think about is what?

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<v Speaker 1>What are your non-negotiables?

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<v Speaker 1>I think is a big thing.

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<v Speaker 1>Think about the things that you have that are kind of core beliefs, core values that are intrinsic to you, and these things are stuff that go quite deep.

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<v Speaker 1>They go quite deep, and I think those things are a good place to start.

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<v Speaker 1>What do you believe in?

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<v Speaker 1>What do you value?

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<v Speaker 1>What are your non-negotiables?

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<v Speaker 1>What's your ultimate vision?

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<v Speaker 1>You know, what do you have that you want to achieve?

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<v Speaker 1>These kind of things are good questions to ask and also sort of think about your personality.

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<v Speaker 1>A good way to do this, maybe, is to ask some people who are close to you how would they define you, because it's really interesting when you ask people who are close to you how they would define you, because it's very rarely how you see yourself.

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<v Speaker 1>They tend to see you slightly differently or they have you positioned slightly differently in their minds.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a good place to start, because you kind of start to see, okay, so actually to these people I provide this, or they see me as this individual.

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<v Speaker 1>So that's a good place to start.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, chris, when I first started asking myself that question, I really struggled with coming up with an answer immediately.

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<v Speaker 2>Is it something usually that takes time, or how does that fit?

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<v Speaker 1>I think it's something that continues over a long period of time and it changes and evolves, and I think that's okay.

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<v Speaker 1>I think things add on, things develop from who you are, from an identity perspective.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it's something that you're continually shaping and that things will shape you along the way.

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<v Speaker 1>So you, and that things will shape you along the way.

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<v Speaker 1>So you know, life will shape you along the way, your interactions with people will shape you along the way.

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<v Speaker 1>I think opportunities will shape you, so all these things shape you.

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<v Speaker 1>I think at your core, though, you have a defined place.

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<v Speaker 1>You have a core place that is almost intrinsically you, that doesn't change, and if you can get to that, that's kind of a good place to understand.

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<v Speaker 2>You're on the big success podcast, hit that subscribe button.

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<v Speaker 2>We'll be back in a moment with Chris Outlaw and we're going to dive deep into branding for business.

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<v Speaker 2>So, Chris, I'm wanting to brand my business.

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<v Speaker 2>Where do I start?

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<v Speaker 2>How do I begin the whole process of coming up with a brand other than hey, this is my name?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So the first thing is always we always take a strategy first approach.

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<v Speaker 1>It's important to understand and define A brand.

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<v Speaker 1>A lot of times I'd always define it as like a field of wild horses a lot of times, especially if you've got a corporation and there's multiple stakeholders, you're in a boardroom.

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<v Speaker 1>Everyone is generally on a different page when it comes to a brand.

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<v Speaker 1>So it's kind of an abstract concept initially.

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<v Speaker 1>When you try and almost grab hold of it it sort of slips through your fingers.

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<v Speaker 1>So the first place is to kind of create a foundation and define it.

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<v Speaker 1>You want to make sure you understand what the brand is, what it stands for and also who you're trying to reach really sort of core things, what the personality of the brand is.

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<v Speaker 1>So, starting with strategy and defining and almost codifying, a lot of what we do is really drawing out basically the brand from either an individual business founder or multiple founders or a team, a leadership team or a marketing team.

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<v Speaker 1>Drawing out what the brand is through exercises that we use that allow it to do that.

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<v Speaker 1>So essentially, branding is almost putting a fence around those wild horses essentially.

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<v Speaker 1>Not that you want to do that in real life, but that's the kind of thing.

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<v Speaker 2>What are some of the questions that I should be asking myself if I want to define my brand?

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<v Speaker 1>One of the first things to ask yourself is what makes you different.

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<v Speaker 1>And that sounds really simple and it's used a lot, but it's not that simple.

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<v Speaker 1>But making a list of all the things that actually makes you different.

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<v Speaker 1>And that can be everything from even down to your location in some regards.

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<v Speaker 1>So location, it could be your processes, the way that you use systems, it could be your personality, it could be a particular framework you have.

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<v Speaker 1>It could be a product that's different from the rest of the market or a particular feature.

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<v Speaker 1>It could be a way that you work with your customers or clients.

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<v Speaker 1>All these different things could be a unique value proposition.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's trying to find that uniqueness initially, to kind of it's the spark of everything you do.

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<v Speaker 1>It sets off your differentiation and your positioning, but it also starts to build.

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<v Speaker 1>Your marketing can be built around that position.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, chris, you've thrown out two words that I think we need to make sure people really understand uniqueness and differentiation.

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<v Speaker 2>Why is that part of branding, and how do we get more depth into understanding our uniqueness or even using our uniqueness?

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<v Speaker 1>So branding itself is kind of if you think of any sort of market itself, you kind of you have your competitors in it, so you're competing against the market itself.

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<v Speaker 1>So one of the things you want to do is you want to be able to stand out and be different, and the reason for that is because if you can be different, if you can position yourself as different in the mind of the audience, then you stand a chance of being remembered for the things that you do.

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<v Speaker 1>So uniqueness and difference are really crucial to branding and there are multiple different ways you can do that.

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<v Speaker 1>You can be different through the way that you turn up visually.

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<v Speaker 1>You can be different through the way that you use messaging.

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<v Speaker 1>You can be different through the way you position yourself.

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<v Speaker 1>That might be a category or a subcategory of a particular market, but there also might be a chance to create a new category for certain tech products.

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<v Speaker 1>So being different is really crucial to branding and it's kind of what you want to do really, because the closer you get to your competition and you see it, a lot companies will copy their competition, and this is a massive no-no, because what happens is you just blend in with them.

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<v Speaker 1>Essentially.

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<v Speaker 2>So you use the word remember there.

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<v Speaker 2>How is remembering and branding go together?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so I mean there's an old adage and branding go together.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so I mean there's an old adage I think it's seven to eight touch points it takes to almost metabolize a brand or take it on board.

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<v Speaker 1>So in order to do that, you need this consistency, you need some way of doing that, so you need to be consistent.

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<v Speaker 1>In order to be consistent, you need some kind of framework for it, so almost like a process or a methodology for marketing and that kind of thing.

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<v Speaker 1>So branding helps to do that.

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<v Speaker 1>It gives you guidelines from a visual perspective.

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<v Speaker 1>It allows you to understand how you're positioned so you can see how you're different from the competition and continually use that in your marketing to stand out.

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<v Speaker 1>But branding is an exercise in memory.

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<v Speaker 1>Really, it's trying to get your audience to remember the brand, to choose it above the others in the category and essentially see you as something that stands above.

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<v Speaker 1>And if you can do that with all the different sort of assets at your disposal, then that's a great place to be.

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<v Speaker 2>What's one brand that you look at and go?

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<v Speaker 2>They're doing a great job of being remembered out there in the marketplace so that we can get a bit of an idea.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, there's always the cliche ones or the ones that everyone talks about.

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<v Speaker 1>So Apple is a fantastic example, you know.

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<v Speaker 1>Nike's a great example, but some that I really enjoy that I think.

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<v Speaker 1>You know they're big brands, but Harley-Davidson's a good one.

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<v Speaker 1>Harley-davidson has it to the point where they've built up such brand advocacy within that brand that people will tattoo it on their body.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a level of success that is unbelievable.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, they've sort of they've created a culture around it, a community around it, a global community around a brand which is, it's unbelievable really.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I had their director of communication on the podcast one time.

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<v Speaker 2>I think you'd enjoy that one as much as everyone else did around how he helped them do that sort of thing.

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<v Speaker 2>So let's think about an effective brand.

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<v Speaker 2>And how does our competition fit within our decision-making of where we brand, how we brand that sort of thing?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so that's a good question.

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<v Speaker 1>So we do brand audits that look at a particular market.

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<v Speaker 1>So, for example, we did a brand audit on a market that was to do with vacuum cleaners and that kind of thing.

00:15:44.004 --> 00:15:47.312
<v Speaker 1>That industry audit on a market that was to do with vacuum cleaners and that kind of thing.

00:15:47.312 --> 00:15:50.399
<v Speaker 1>That industry and there is a big leader in that one which is Dyson, and they're huge.

00:15:50.399 --> 00:15:55.976
<v Speaker 1>And essentially, when we do brand audits, we'll look at the competition and we look at how they're positioned.

00:15:56.197 --> 00:16:07.682
<v Speaker 1>So we'll look at what they're staking claim to in the market, how they're positioned, what their personality is, and with Dyson you get a real feel of I don't know if you're into Back to the Future, but they are from an archetype perspective.

00:16:07.682 --> 00:16:08.823
<v Speaker 1>They're a creator archetype.

00:16:08.823 --> 00:16:16.341
<v Speaker 1>They're kind of like the Apple of that industry and they're almost like a Doc Brown character or a Tony Stark Iron man, if you were to put that on it.

00:16:16.341 --> 00:16:21.116
<v Speaker 1>They're very sort of patent led, they're techie, they're kind of innovative, cutting edge.

00:16:26.830 --> 00:16:52.465
<v Speaker 1>So when we look at the audits, we look at competitors, we look at how they turn up and how they show up, and the client we're working with in that industry actually had a story on their website that talks about when they developed the company it was from the founder working with to create a product for his mom, essentially so she could hoover certain areas of the house, and so we sort of advised them that the best thing to do in order to position themselves differently from this competition, where the rest of the market was like a moth to a flame towards Dyson, was to double down on this.

00:16:52.465 --> 00:17:08.733
<v Speaker 1>So, rather than being stuffy white coats that kind of thing, patent led which is really important and there is a market for it be more down to earth, be more homely, be more sort of that supportive role, that caring role that they were in the beginning.

00:17:08.733 --> 00:17:12.332
<v Speaker 1>So uncovering that authentic self allows them to position themselves differently.

00:17:12.332 --> 00:17:16.631
<v Speaker 1>So the competition allows you to see what's out there and what the market's looking like.

00:17:16.932 --> 00:17:17.776
<v Speaker 2>Hey, just a quick one.

00:17:17.776 --> 00:17:29.173
<v Speaker 2>When I look in the back end of this something that's quite surprising to me I noticed that it says that 82% of you who watch the channel regularly haven't hit the subscribe button yet.

00:17:29.173 --> 00:17:33.079
<v Speaker 2>So one favor, click that button.

00:17:33.079 --> 00:17:45.415
<v Speaker 2>If you've watched this show before and enjoyed it, just please click that button to subscribe, hit the notifications bell and make sure you're part of it, because as the show gets better, your success gets better.

00:17:45.415 --> 00:17:51.846
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so if I'm to think about my business and look at it, they traditionally talk of a SWOT analysis.

00:17:51.846 --> 00:17:56.099
<v Speaker 2>How is a brand audit different to a SWOT analysis type thing and how?

00:17:56.099 --> 00:17:57.502
<v Speaker 2>It's the same, I guess as well.

00:17:58.410 --> 00:17:59.417
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there's a lot of similarities.

00:17:59.417 --> 00:18:10.769
<v Speaker 1>To be fair, there is a lot of similarities, it's just it's slightly different in terms of you still have all the sort of the, the traditional stuff from a SWOT analysis, but what you do is you go a bit deeper with regards to the brand side of things.

00:18:10.769 --> 00:18:11.834
<v Speaker 1>You look at their marketing.

00:18:11.834 --> 00:18:23.661
<v Speaker 1>A really quick and easy way to do this to see how someone's positioned or how they see themselves is if you look at all their social profiles generally in the bios you only have 140 characters or 200 characters.

00:18:23.661 --> 00:18:31.541
<v Speaker 1>So if you can see how they're describing themselves generally, they'll put in there a sort of a mini, kind of positioning statement, essentially.

00:18:31.541 --> 00:18:35.960
<v Speaker 1>So you can start to see how they position themselves and then you can start.

00:18:35.960 --> 00:18:41.851
<v Speaker 1>And if it's different as well on different platforms, that's a bonus, because they're obviously not consistent along that side of things.

00:18:41.851 --> 00:18:43.894
<v Speaker 1>But it is similar to a SWOT analysis.

00:18:43.894 --> 00:18:46.577
<v Speaker 1>It just goes into a bit more detail with regards to the brand.

00:18:46.678 --> 00:18:46.939
<v Speaker 2>Got it.

00:18:46.939 --> 00:18:51.384
<v Speaker 2>Let's talk about that consistency of branding, even down to your socials.

00:18:51.384 --> 00:18:54.819
<v Speaker 2>How important is that level of consistency?

00:18:55.150 --> 00:19:03.029
<v Speaker 1>So I had a really interesting conversation actually on my podcast the other day and it was someone was asking that question about whether or not there's an importance of consistency.

00:19:03.029 --> 00:19:11.842
<v Speaker 1>But there's also this new wave of this organic nature to things and being able to change and develop, and I think there is a flex between the two.

00:19:11.842 --> 00:19:20.577
<v Speaker 1>But I think the consistency comes from having an understanding of who you are, so understanding that identity, but also having the guidelines in place to follow it.

00:19:20.577 --> 00:19:29.766
<v Speaker 1>I talk about guidelines as a way to systemize your marketing from a perspective of you understand the visuals and the way that you can utilize the brand from that perspective.

00:19:29.766 --> 00:19:46.615
<v Speaker 1>You might have some supportive messages that you use continually, but I think you also need the ability to be able to be a bit organic and change and be flexible to a point Not destroying the brand and what it stands for, but being able to grow from it.

00:19:46.615 --> 00:19:49.355
<v Speaker 1>I think is important, especially the different platforms we have today.

00:19:50.117 --> 00:19:50.920
<v Speaker 2>Got it, got it.

00:19:50.920 --> 00:19:53.920
<v Speaker 2>We'll be back in just a moment here on the Big Success Podcast.

00:19:53.920 --> 00:19:59.280
<v Speaker 2>Chris Outlaw is going to teach us how to go from building a good brand to building a great brand.

00:19:59.849 --> 00:20:11.759
<v Speaker 4>Chris Outlaw is a founder of Elements Brand Management, a brand strategy design and marketing agency that help businesses to adapt, evolve and transform their brand so they can unlock their full potential.

00:20:11.759 --> 00:20:18.118
<v Speaker 4>To learn more about Chris Outlaw, please visit elementsbrandmanagementcouk.

00:20:18.118 --> 00:20:20.423
<v Speaker 4>And we're back Big success.

00:20:20.804 --> 00:20:29.097
<v Speaker 2>Chris, what's the difference between a good brand and a phenomenal brand, something that blows up and gets known?

00:20:29.097 --> 00:20:34.462
<v Speaker 2>You mentioned, like Dyson before, like everyone else, sort of seemed to fade away.

00:20:34.462 --> 00:20:39.521
<v Speaker 2>There were some other massive brands in that space and then they just sort of died off.

00:20:39.521 --> 00:20:44.690
<v Speaker 2>What is in your mind that takes a brand to be that amazing level?

00:20:45.191 --> 00:20:46.633
<v Speaker 1>I think it's a combination of.

00:20:46.633 --> 00:20:52.580
<v Speaker 1>There's a unique nature to it, there's an authenticity to it.

00:20:52.580 --> 00:20:55.444
<v Speaker 1>I think it needs to be authentic in itself.

00:20:55.444 --> 00:21:01.803
<v Speaker 1>If it starts to break its own conventions, I think you run the risk of alienating the audience.

00:21:01.803 --> 00:21:06.077
<v Speaker 1>I think there's a big thing with regards to not being confused.

00:21:06.077 --> 00:21:10.056
<v Speaker 1>So I always say a confused brand is a confused audience.

00:21:10.056 --> 00:21:14.308
<v Speaker 1>So the more you can be sort of, you have this unified approach.

00:21:14.390 --> 00:21:20.230
<v Speaker 1>I mean we talk about our unified brand framework, but having a unified brand, I think there's a lot of that.

00:21:20.230 --> 00:21:24.862
<v Speaker 1>I think also there is there is something about people buy from people, is the old adage.

00:21:24.862 --> 00:21:33.951
<v Speaker 1>But actually the brands that we remember there's been some studies into this that subconsciously we see them as people not consciously, but subconsciously.

00:21:33.951 --> 00:21:35.355
<v Speaker 1>We see brands like Apple.

00:21:35.355 --> 00:21:45.142
<v Speaker 1>We see brands like Nike or Harley Davidson as actually as people as opposed to things, and the way they do that is by developing a sort of what we'd call a human brand or a personality.

00:21:45.142 --> 00:21:47.297
<v Speaker 1>It's like a 360 approach.

00:21:47.297 --> 00:22:06.034
<v Speaker 1>They have values, they have beliefs, they have things they stand for, they talk in a certain way, they have a tone of voice, they have a depth to them that a lot of brands don't, and it's that level of detail that actually causes us to connect with them on a deeper level, and I think that's what takes a good brand to a great brand.

00:22:06.836 --> 00:22:09.441
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, when you just said Harley Davidson, I pictured in my head.

00:22:09.441 --> 00:22:18.953
<v Speaker 2>When you said it's a person, I pictured some guy with a beard and tattoos and a vest leather vest sitting on a Harley with a skull cap thing on.

00:22:18.953 --> 00:22:27.134
<v Speaker 2>So let's talk in depth about that then, about creating a personality for the brand.

00:22:27.134 --> 00:22:34.362
<v Speaker 2>So a brand is good, but to extend it into that personality, what are some of the steps I need to take to make that a reality?

00:22:34.710 --> 00:22:40.612
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so I mean, one of the things that we use a lot is brand archetypes, and some people don't like using them.

00:22:40.612 --> 00:22:42.858
<v Speaker 1>We like using them a lot and a lot of what we do is built on it.

00:22:42.858 --> 00:22:51.289
<v Speaker 1>And one of the things that people get wrong a lot of times with brand archetypes is they think it's who they are as a brand, and it can be, but most of the time it's.

00:22:51.289 --> 00:22:54.464
<v Speaker 1>The initial part of archetypes is where your audience are.

00:22:54.464 --> 00:23:11.737
<v Speaker 1>So, if I use the Harley Davidson example, if you imagine somebody who's been clocking in, clocking out at the finance district for 30 years same cubicle, same routine, day in, day out they get to a point where they start craving liberation, they start craving rebellion, they start craving freedom.

00:23:12.840 --> 00:23:18.894
<v Speaker 1>If you can show up as a brand that fills that void, then you're going to talk to that individual.

00:23:18.894 --> 00:23:23.551
<v Speaker 1>So in that case, the brand archetype, or the primary one, is going to be the outlaw, the rebel.

00:23:23.551 --> 00:23:35.209
<v Speaker 1>So if you can speak to the rebel and Harley Davidson do this with their brand by having images of open roads, which is freedom, liberation, independence, it's also they use icons that have wings on them.

00:23:35.209 --> 00:23:38.642
<v Speaker 1>They use slogans like the only rules are rules are meant to be broken.

00:23:38.642 --> 00:23:46.748
<v Speaker 1>This directly speaks to that audience, but it creates a personality that is engaging and they back it up with a few other archetypes.

00:23:46.748 --> 00:23:58.955
<v Speaker 1>You generally have a mix, and one of them is the every person, which is all about community, which is why you see a lot of Harley Davidson sort of adverts is about community, it's about bringing people together, it's about a counterculture and that kind of thing.

00:23:58.955 --> 00:24:03.849
<v Speaker 1>So you can create rich personalities by using archetypes to develop your personality for your brand.

00:24:04.201 --> 00:24:04.421
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

00:24:04.421 --> 00:24:15.092
<v Speaker 2>So if I'm thinking about, you know, if I've got my brand that's strong right now and I want to make it into a brand that is great, I want to go from good to great.

00:24:15.092 --> 00:24:21.026
<v Speaker 2>What would be some of the first things I should do to move my brand to that level?

00:24:21.527 --> 00:24:30.325
<v Speaker 1>Well, I'd definitely do a brand audit and have a look at the competition, but I'd also look at your brand itself and kind of look at where you're strong, where you're weak and where you could improve.

00:24:30.325 --> 00:24:32.411
<v Speaker 1>Look at the competition, do a brand audit.

00:24:32.411 --> 00:24:37.592
<v Speaker 1>But then I would look at things like your, your personality it's so the personality of brands.

00:24:37.592 --> 00:24:39.967
<v Speaker 1>So I'd look at the things like the archetypes and the tone of voice.

00:24:39.967 --> 00:24:42.584
<v Speaker 1>Is that coming through with every message that you're putting out there?

00:24:42.584 --> 00:24:43.787
<v Speaker 1>Does it come through your marketing?

00:24:43.787 --> 00:24:51.722
<v Speaker 1>Um, I'd look at, re-look at, your kind of target audience, audience segments, and dive into things like what are the key problems of that audience?

00:24:51.722 --> 00:24:55.740
<v Speaker 1>Um, how do you solve those problems and how can you exceed their expectations?

00:24:55.740 --> 00:24:57.125
<v Speaker 1>How can you take it to the next level?

00:24:57.125 --> 00:25:05.571
<v Speaker 1>How could you improve that brand experience, just even by small margins, so that it gives a bit more of a sort of a better customer journey?

00:25:05.941 --> 00:25:07.400
<v Speaker 1>So take people like Disney, for example.

00:25:07.400 --> 00:25:11.705
<v Speaker 1>The amount of attention to detail they put into their brand experiences is really amazing.

00:25:11.705 --> 00:25:13.806
<v Speaker 1>So, adding little things in like that.

00:25:13.806 --> 00:25:16.287
<v Speaker 1>I'd also then look at the visual identity.

00:25:16.287 --> 00:25:17.401
<v Speaker 1>Is it impactful enough?

00:25:17.401 --> 00:25:18.582
<v Speaker 1>Is it doing what you want it to do?

00:25:18.582 --> 00:25:23.546
<v Speaker 1>And just having a look at marketing across all your different channels and seeing if it supports the pillars.

00:25:23.546 --> 00:25:26.768
<v Speaker 1>So one of the things we do with archetypes actually is we develop.

00:25:26.768 --> 00:25:29.470
<v Speaker 1>It was based on the every person.

00:25:29.470 --> 00:25:44.545
<v Speaker 1>You might have a pillar that is community, and then you create content from these pillars that reinforce that brand continually through those channels.

00:25:45.359 --> 00:25:48.345
<v Speaker 2>Chris, you touched on two things there that I wanted to ask you about.

00:25:48.345 --> 00:25:50.286
<v Speaker 2>One is brand experience.

00:25:50.286 --> 00:25:56.907
<v Speaker 2>Talk to give people an understanding of what is brand experience and how can we elevate it in our businesses.

00:25:58.161 --> 00:26:03.622
<v Speaker 1>So if you think of the example of the personality side of things and engaging with a brand, like it is a human.

00:26:03.622 --> 00:26:09.721
<v Speaker 1>If you think about your brand, it kind of lives in an ecosystem with different individuals.

00:26:09.721 --> 00:26:18.602
<v Speaker 1>Whether that is your, it lives with your competition, your audience, the wider market, but then your audience interacts with it at multiple places, multiple touch points.

00:26:18.602 --> 00:26:33.411
<v Speaker 1>So across the journey everything from packaging to email newsletters to website interactions to even like heuristics on mobile phone apps little things that happen when you click buttons all of these are part of the experience you're trying to create.

00:26:33.411 --> 00:26:42.561
<v Speaker 1>So if your personality is all about being sort of optimistic and fun, then these kind of the experience wants to give that and there's little things you can do that people don't even think about.

00:26:42.622 --> 00:26:50.184
<v Speaker 1>So things like scent branding is that the scent through your nose is the quickest way to create a memory.

00:26:50.184 --> 00:26:56.529
<v Speaker 1>That's why people remember freshly cut grass or the smell of petrol, those kinds of things, and it's a quick way to create a memory.

00:26:56.529 --> 00:27:04.227
<v Speaker 1>So you can actually do stuff where you use scent branding for things Like if you've got a subscription box and you send it out, you can add a particular scent into that box.

00:27:04.227 --> 00:27:08.746
<v Speaker 1>That then is part of your branded kind of identity, part of your identity side of things.

00:27:08.746 --> 00:27:21.890
<v Speaker 1>So creating an experience that creates these sort of magical moments at every step of the way, or tiny, tiny touches that elevate everything you do, is a really good way to improve that brand experience.

00:27:21.890 --> 00:27:31.672
<v Speaker 1>So if you look at the customer journey and think where can I elevate this to a point and how can I inject some more of who we are as a brand into it, then you can sort of elevate your experience from that.

00:27:31.880 --> 00:27:36.230
<v Speaker 2>Dang, I hadn't even thought about the scent thing until now you mention it.

00:27:36.230 --> 00:27:37.833
<v Speaker 2>It's like I live here in Vegas.

00:27:37.833 --> 00:27:40.147
<v Speaker 2>Every casino has its own scent.

00:27:40.147 --> 00:27:42.426
<v Speaker 2>They literally have them built.

00:27:42.426 --> 00:27:51.031
<v Speaker 2>I mean it's crazy how much that is, and I guess that down to that level of detail is the difference between good and great.

00:27:51.031 --> 00:28:00.334
<v Speaker 2>In many ways, when someone thinks through their brand to that level, I guess there's no stopping taking it to great.

00:28:00.334 --> 00:28:05.553
<v Speaker 2>One last area then on that the brand experience and the customer experience.

00:28:05.553 --> 00:28:06.776
<v Speaker 2>Are they the same thing?

00:28:06.776 --> 00:28:07.577
<v Speaker 2>Are they different?

00:28:07.577 --> 00:28:08.380
<v Speaker 2>How do they relate?

00:28:08.820 --> 00:28:16.134
<v Speaker 1>So the brand experience is kind of the if you take every part of the brand and put it together, the experience is kind of that output.

00:28:16.134 --> 00:28:21.166
<v Speaker 1>The customer experience and the brand experience are pretty much interrelated.

00:28:21.166 --> 00:28:30.549
<v Speaker 1>There might be some slight differences with the customer experience because they might experience some things that are outside of that kind of that customer journey maybe.

00:28:30.549 --> 00:28:32.276
<v Speaker 1>But essentially they're the same thing.

00:28:32.276 --> 00:28:38.782
<v Speaker 1>But the brand experience is the culmination of everything you do as a brand, experientially, so going forward.

00:28:38.782 --> 00:28:47.910
<v Speaker 1>So it could be customer service, it could be the tactile nature of the packaging that you send out, it could be the scent, like we talked about the visual side of things.

00:28:47.910 --> 00:28:49.164
<v Speaker 1>All these things are part of it.

00:28:49.164 --> 00:28:59.777
<v Speaker 1>So a really good example with Disney is they go to such levels of attention to detail that if you go to one of the parks they won't have a stormtrooper walking through the magic kingdom because it breaks the sense of reality.

00:28:59.777 --> 00:29:05.957
<v Speaker 1>So they have like hidden doorways and passages so that you don't ever get that suspension of reality.

00:29:05.957 --> 00:29:07.442
<v Speaker 1>It doesn't get broken, if that makes sense.

00:29:07.823 --> 00:29:08.163
<v Speaker 2>Got it.

00:29:08.163 --> 00:29:09.287
<v Speaker 2>Got it, Chris.

00:29:09.287 --> 00:29:10.549
<v Speaker 2>I've got you on my podcast.

00:29:10.549 --> 00:29:13.704
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to get some free consulting Brad Sugar's brand.

00:29:13.704 --> 00:29:19.346
<v Speaker 2>What does it mean to you and where should I fix it or add to it, or how can I go to great?

00:29:20.060 --> 00:29:21.866
<v Speaker 1>Well, I think the brand's pretty strong.

00:29:21.866 --> 00:29:24.448
<v Speaker 1>To be honest, I mean, yeah, very well known.

00:29:24.448 --> 00:29:27.467
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think you're pretty good to go.

00:29:27.467 --> 00:29:35.068
<v Speaker 1>I think, yeah, the only thing would be just doubling down on that personality, because I think you've got an awesome personality and I think, yeah, just imbuing that in everything would be great.

00:29:38.221 --> 00:29:40.288
<v Speaker 2>Double and I think, yeah, just imbuing that in everything would be great.

00:29:40.288 --> 00:29:41.290
<v Speaker 2>Double down on my personality.

00:29:41.290 --> 00:29:44.319
<v Speaker 2>I bet my marketing manager is not going to be excited to hear that news from you.

00:29:44.319 --> 00:29:54.051
<v Speaker 2>So, chris, last question, I always finish off the podcast this way what's the best advice or the best quote you ever got on the subject of success?

00:29:54.799 --> 00:30:06.788
<v Speaker 1>Okay, so I've got two that I love, and one of them, I think, is the road to success is always under construction, which is kind of one that's touted a lot, and I believe that is the case.

00:30:06.788 --> 00:30:14.983
<v Speaker 1>I think, yeah, I love that one, and the other one is success is more permanent when you achieve it without destroying your principles, which I think is a good message from a brand perspective.

00:30:15.685 --> 00:30:19.442
<v Speaker 2>Dang love that one Very powerful, chris Outlaw.

00:30:19.442 --> 00:30:21.308
<v Speaker 2>Go learn from him, go study him.

00:30:21.308 --> 00:30:23.105
<v Speaker 2>This is the Big Success Podcast.

00:30:23.105 --> 00:30:24.190
<v Speaker 2>Subscribe away.

00:30:24.190 --> 00:30:26.748
<v Speaker 2>See you next week with more for your success.

00:30:28.422 --> 00:30:34.050
<v Speaker 5>You've been listening to the Big Success Podcast with the number one business coach in the world, Brad Sugars.

00:30:34.050 --> 00:30:43.612
<v Speaker 5>To learn more about how to achieve business and personal success, as well as how to level up or listen to past episodes, visit wwwbradsugarscom.