2. Brihadaranyaka Upanishad - Yajnavalkya and Maitreyi Samvada: Introduction continued...

[SPEAKER_00]: Umpur nama dhaf pur nama dhaf pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dhaff pur nama dha
[SPEAKER_00]: form that Brahman is infinite, and this universe is infinite.
[SPEAKER_00]: The infinite proceeds from the infinite.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then taking the infinite shield of the infinite, it remains as the infinite Brahman alone.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ohm, peace, peace, peace.
[SPEAKER_00]: Peace.
[SPEAKER_00]: Namaste, and welcome back to the Grazardnika class.
[SPEAKER_00]: At the beginning of this Upanishad, we have the customary Shanti Mantra, the peace invocation.
[SPEAKER_00]: And for this Upanishad, it is the Purnamada Purnamidam.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now we have come across this peace invocation earlier also.
[SPEAKER_00]: The last Upanishad which we were doing, the Isha Upanishad, also has the same Purnamada Purnamidam.
[SPEAKER_00]: The reason being that this Purnamada Purnamidam is the Shanti Mantra associated with the Shukla Yajurveda.
[SPEAKER_00]: So all the Upanishads which come in the Shukla Yajurveda, like the Brhadhar Nika, like the Ishavasya Upanishad, they will all have Purnamada Purnamidam as their Shanti Mantra.
[SPEAKER_00]: As I said, that I will dwell a little bit more on this mantra.
[SPEAKER_00]: Last time what we did was that we looked at the traditional adwaitik interpretation of this mantra.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava dha-purnava d
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnamada, Purnamidam.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is infinite.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is infinite.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnamada, Purnamada, Chatey.
[SPEAKER_00]: From that infinite, this infinity has come.
[SPEAKER_00]: And, one second.
[SPEAKER_00]: From that infinity, this infinity has come.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnasya, Purnamada, Ayya.
[SPEAKER_00]: Discovering the infinity of this infinity,
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnam Ava Vashis Shetty, only Infinity Remains or Infinity Alone Remains, expanding it a little bit, what does it mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: That Infinity means Brahman of Saganabram and religious language God, Ishvara Bhagawan.
[SPEAKER_00]: And this means the Jiva and Jagat, us and the world which we inhabit.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that is Infinity, and this is Infinity.
[SPEAKER_00]: From Sarguna Brahmann, from that infinity, this infinity has come, from Sarguna Brahmann, this G1 Jagatth have come.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then, in this Giva, when we discover the infinitude of this Giva, Purnasya Purnamadaya, here, Purnamines, Aay the Giva, when I discover my infinitude, then what happens?
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnamiva washishshyati, infinite Brahmann alone remains.
[SPEAKER_00]: putting it in Sanskrit terms, more in traditional format.
[SPEAKER_00]: Saganabramman is infinite, at so is the Jiva.
[SPEAKER_00]: From the Saganabramman, the Jiva and Jagat have come.
[SPEAKER_00]: Saganabramman is the cause, Jiva, Jagat are the effect.
[SPEAKER_00]: When the Jeeva discovers its own infinite food, Purnan Nature, then that infinite Brahman alone remains.
[SPEAKER_00]: Need Guna Brahman alone remains.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the meaning of the mantra from the traditional Advaithic Perspective.
[SPEAKER_00]: That means Purnan Malone is real.
[SPEAKER_00]: The non-dual Atman or non-dual Brahman alone is real.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is that which appears as the three, Jeeva Jagat ishwar, Jeeva Jagat ishwar, ishwar as the cause, Jeevan Jagat are the effect.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ishwar is that infinite?
[SPEAKER_00]: Jeevan Jagat are this infinite, this one.
[SPEAKER_00]: From that infinite, this infinitesh has come, these two, the Jeevan Jagat have come.
[SPEAKER_00]: When this infinitesh, the Jeeva discovers its infinite nature, the infinitesh alone, Brahman remains, nirguna Brahman alone remains.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, this is the traditional meaning, that means, what is reality, reality is food them, reality is non-dual brum and reality is nidguna brum brum.
[SPEAKER_00]: the rest of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sermonabramman, G1 jugat are appearances of that reality, so and appearances of two categories, cause and effect, cause is Sermonabramman, effect is G1 jugat, effect means cause means car owner and effect means carier in Sanskrit, car owner and carier.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is the traditional interpretation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now last time I had said that there is a portion of Shankaracharya's commentary which I will touch upon in this session.
[SPEAKER_00]: See, this portion is a long portion and it is a debate.
[SPEAKER_00]: Who is it a debate with?
[SPEAKER_00]: It is a debate with an ancient, even more ancient Vedantin called Bhattri Prapancya.
[SPEAKER_00]: Bhattri propanche is a Vedantin, the one who accepts the Upanishads as the foundation of Vedantad, Upanishads as the source and interprets the Upanishads.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the interpretation of Bhattri propanche is not not dualistic.
[SPEAKER_00]: Shankaracharya differs strongly with Bhattri Prapanchya and that debate which we find here.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is Bhattri Prapanchya's take on this mantra?
[SPEAKER_00]: What is Shankaracharya's take on this mantra?
[SPEAKER_00]: What is Bhattri Prapanchya's criticism or probable criticism?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because Bhattri Prapanchya preceded Shankaracharya, we didn't actually engage in debate with Shankaracharya.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, all we know of his position and his attacks on this present interpretation, the non-dual interpretation is through the refutations of Shankaracharya, which Shankaracharya offers.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, what would be Bhattri-propanches, criticism of Shankaracharya?
[SPEAKER_00]: And what would be Shankaracharya's response to that?
[SPEAKER_00]: What is Bhattri-propanches, counter response to Shankaracharya's response?
[SPEAKER_00]: And what is Shankaracharya's counter counter response to that?
[SPEAKER_00]: That is basically the theme of the is a long debate.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you go into the Sanskrit commentary of Shankaracharya Charyan Purnamada Purnamidam in the Brevarnya Kupanishad, 5.1, 5 chapter 1 verse, and there you will find this long commentary.
[SPEAKER_00]: Only a part of it is explanation of Purnamada Purnamidam.
[SPEAKER_00]: The rest of it is this ancient ancient debate.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why are we interested?
[SPEAKER_00]: We will see how important it is to refine first of all, to refine our understanding of non-duality, to clear up some misconceptions about non-duality.
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, what three propanches like the Grandfather for many of the dualistic schools and monistic schools today of Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: So for example, the long debate between Bishishta, Dwaitana, Dwaita Vedanta, the post-Shrankaracharya, post-Ramanujacharya.
[SPEAKER_00]: But that has its roots here.
[SPEAKER_00]: We will see very soon what Rahman Ujah Charya, and in fact many of the dualistic schools of Vedanta, what they were saying was already anticipated by Bhattri Prabhupada and the issues that Bhattri Prabhupada and the answers given by Shankaracharya, they will only be reflected later on in the long debate between Advaitans on one side and the Vishishtat, Advaita, Advaita all of them on the other side.
[SPEAKER_00]: These very arguments, which we will see just now in its basic outline, these just became much more sophisticated of in the succeeding centuries on both sides, all right.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is Bhattri Prabhan's criticism of this non-duelistic interpretation of Purnamada Purnamada?
[SPEAKER_00]: Bhattri Prabhan's thoroughly disagrees or would disagree with Shankaracharya's non-duelistic interpretation of Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why?
[SPEAKER_00]: on multiple counts.
[SPEAKER_00]: First of all, but the property would say, what Shankar is saying is, is very damaging to the Vedas, is Vedavirotha.
[SPEAKER_00]: Most of the Vedas is karma kind, is the ritualistic portion of the Vedas, where the devout person performs fire rituals, for getting results in this life or the next life.
[SPEAKER_00]: For getting something they want in this life, or to go to heaven after death and so on and so forth.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, this presupposes that dualism is true, the presupposes that there is somebody who will perform the rituals, their rituals are activities different from that person and the results are to be something different from that person so that that person wants to go to heaven, heaven and that person are not one and the same, this is not non-duality, it is theraguing duality, every action assumes duality.
[SPEAKER_00]: So karma-kanda Vedas are teaching duality.
[SPEAKER_00]: Karma-kanda is the entire ritualistic portion, which is the bulk of the Vedas by the Vedas, but the pre-preferencing would argue.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is entirely based on dualism.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Shankaracharya is simply denying that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you are going against your very foundation, which are the Vedas.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's one.
[SPEAKER_00]: Second.
[SPEAKER_00]: You are going against the testimony of your own senses.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just open your eyes and look around.
[SPEAKER_00]: what do our senses reveal?
[SPEAKER_00]: They reveal duality.
[SPEAKER_00]: They reveal difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: They reveal variety.
[SPEAKER_00]: They reveal plurality.
[SPEAKER_00]: How many things are there in this world?
[SPEAKER_00]: There is time, space, object, so much.
[SPEAKER_00]: This world is a world of difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: Our senses show it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Protection.
[SPEAKER_00]: You see it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Here it's valid.
[SPEAKER_00]: Taste it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Touch it.
[SPEAKER_00]: All of it is different.
[SPEAKER_00]: and then based on this perception, there is inference and other sources of knowledge.
[SPEAKER_00]: The technical name for these sources of knowledge is Pramana.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the Pramana's, all our Pramana's reveal difference, Bay the difference, Dwight the duality, not a Dwight the non-duality, not a Bay the oneness, no, no, no.
[SPEAKER_00]: So again, on second count Shankaracharya, not only goes against the Vedas,
[SPEAKER_00]: but also goes against the low-key cramarnas, our day-to-day sources of knowledge, like perception, like inference, all of these reveal duality, Shankara says duality is false and non-duality is true.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, is going against the testimony of our senses, of our, the well-known cramarnas sources of knowledge, protection, anumana, opamana, all of these, then.
[SPEAKER_00]: all right, then what is your interpretation?
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, he says there is no doubt that there are non-dualistic texts in the definitions, but the propensious is.
[SPEAKER_00]: But there are also dualistic texts.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, it is there that I come over with a one without a second.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it is also there, dual supernasa, you are there, two birds sitting, so it's two birds.
[SPEAKER_00]: So like this, he says that there are many dualistic texts in the open issue.
[SPEAKER_00]: And many non-dualistic texts.
[SPEAKER_00]: To open issue, it's teach, beather and abheda.
[SPEAKER_00]: Difference and non-difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the real nature, the nature of reality is beather, abheda.
[SPEAKER_00]: Difference and non-difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: So.
[SPEAKER_00]: From the original Brahman which was non-different has come this world of difference, actually it has come.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that Brahman is non-different, pulled no mother is non-dwell, is one.
[SPEAKER_00]: But Purnam, this difference, world of difference of human beings and animals and worlds, life and death, all of this is also real, that has come from that, from that non-dual Brahman, this world of dualism has come, from that Abheda, this Bheda has come, and it is the same Brahman.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, Purnat, Purnam of the Chatee, the cause is Brahman, God, real, and the effect
[SPEAKER_00]: So, and one day we will all go back to Dhamman, Purnasya Purnamada, Purnamayama, Vashishya.
[SPEAKER_00]: It will go back to Brahman and become one with Purnamada.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, something like this, this interpretation, he has not given the tip of the penchant, but this is what would follow from the tip of the penchant, Vedavada, Vedavada.
[SPEAKER_00]: the doctrine of difference and non-difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: Bremen is non-difference, correct, non-dual, correct, but also equally, Bremen can does become multiple and various according to this very mantra, because from Purna this Purna has come.
[SPEAKER_00]: So take that seriously.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't deny the, you can't take the cause and deny the effect.
[SPEAKER_00]: If the cause is real, in the effect must be real.
[SPEAKER_00]: And clearly the cause is non-dewal, clearly effect is dualistic.
[SPEAKER_00]: So both non-dewal and dualism both are correct.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the nature of reality of the reality of Brahman is dual and non-dewal.
[SPEAKER_00]: Difference and non-difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what does Shankaracharya say, the counter to this?
[SPEAKER_00]: Shankaracharya says, this is utterly illogical.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is impossible.
[SPEAKER_00]: You cannot affirm contradictory characteristics of the same object of the same entity at the same time.
[SPEAKER_00]: So a thing cannot have contradictory characteristics.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you can say some, I think cannot be a person can be tall and plump, but a person cannot be tall and short.
[SPEAKER_00]: that is no meaning at all, a flower can be, you can have these characteristics or it can be red, it can be large, it can be fragrant.
[SPEAKER_00]: But you can't see the flower is fragrant and non-fragment.
[SPEAKER_00]: The flower is large and small at the same time.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is impossible, you cannot affirm the two contradictory qualities characteristics A and not A of the same entity at
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, this is Shankaracharya's preliminary counter, but the propensia comes back with, so I am just summarizing the arguments provided in Shankaracharya's commentary, but the propensia then would come back to all this with his counter argument.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says, it is quite possible for an entity to be vayther than a vayther at the same time.
[SPEAKER_00]: depending on the Avastadhi, the state or the status.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, for example, a seed is homogeneous.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is small and homogeneous.
[SPEAKER_00]: Inside it looks all the same, but when it sprouts into a plant and a tree, you know, seedling and a plant and then becomes a tree, it is immediately variegated into roots and trunk.
[SPEAKER_00]: and branches and leaves and flowers and fruits.
[SPEAKER_00]: There is so much division difference within the tree, so much variety.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can't say that the seed is real and the tree is false.
[SPEAKER_00]: The seed is real, equally the tree with all its differences is true, it is real, as real as the seed was.
[SPEAKER_00]: In fact, it is that seed alone, which has become this tree, poor, not poor, no mother chate.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, this is birth tree propensures, response, yes, the same thing can be non-dual homogenous and one in one state and it can be variegated and full of difference in another state, but it is the same reality.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, the same raman.
[SPEAKER_00]: can be one non-dual suchi down in the and then it can become this world of tremendous difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: G or jarlat and all of these tremendous differences can be there and you should take this as real.
[SPEAKER_00]: Should not say this is an appearance.
[SPEAKER_00]: Another example which actually Shankaracharya gives, I mean, birthday propensha gives, according to Shankaracharya is the ocean example.
[SPEAKER_00]: The same thing can be non-dual and dualistic, depending upon your perspective.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the ocean, it is one vast mass of water.
[SPEAKER_00]: But yes, the same ocean is thousands and thousands of waves rising and falling.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is foe and surf and so much activity.
[SPEAKER_00]: And here at the same time, you can see the seed was seed and then it became a tree, no longer a seed.
[SPEAKER_00]: but the ocean continues to be one vast mass, one vast mass of water and yet full of here it's calm, there it is tsunami wave, here it is bubbles and foam, there it is huge waves, it is continuously like that it's so both are really, you cannot say ocean vast mass of water that is the reality waves are not real, waves are only appearances, not true
[SPEAKER_00]: so you must accept that Brahman can indeed be one Brahman and at the same time not appear actually also become this entire world just like the ocean being one it appears not appears it actually becomes so many waves and so much activity you can't honestly deny these things now Shankara's counter counter answer here he gives an exhaustive critique of the Bharati
[SPEAKER_00]: This ocean example, and waves, ocean and waves example, the seed and tree example, none of them apply to Brahman.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is true that Advaitha Vedanta uses ocean and wave example.
[SPEAKER_00]: Advaitha Vedanta uses seed and tree example, but in a different sense, not in this sense of actual transformation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why will it not apply?
[SPEAKER_00]: So no example is perfect.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, so it's an example.
[SPEAKER_00]: It will be applicable in some ways only.
[SPEAKER_00]: water.
[SPEAKER_00]: The way the way the answer wants to say is, the reality of this ocean is water.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the reality of each wave is just water.
[SPEAKER_00]: Water is the underlying reality other than that, no wave exists and no ocean exists.
[SPEAKER_00]: However, that does not make the waves a part of the water.
[SPEAKER_00]: The water, if you take it away, it will not be a wave.
[SPEAKER_00]: At no point did the water become a wave.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a name and a form and activity imposed upon water, but the water continues to be the water regardless.
[SPEAKER_00]: And without that water, you can't see water is real and wave is real, no.
[SPEAKER_00]: Without the water, the wave is not real.
[SPEAKER_00]: Whereas the way Bhattri Prabhantya uses, the example Shankaracharya's objection is twofold, one, you are showing the ocean as changeful.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is coming up and disappearing, the waves are coming and really coming up and disappearing, which means you are saying Brahman is changing.
[SPEAKER_00]: The changes in Brahman according to you are not appearances, they are real.
[SPEAKER_00]: If they are, and then second, so this is called Saviqar, you are saying Brahman is Saviqar, if there is change in Brahman, there is modification in Brahman, second problem.
[SPEAKER_00]: This example, the way you are using it, the ocean and wave example, the seed and tree example, you are saying that Brahman as parts, however, as parts, you are saying the ocean is here, in waves, they are not in waves, here tsunami wave is there, there it is come, so it as parts.
[SPEAKER_00]: and you are accepting that.
[SPEAKER_00]: You are seeing the seed now transforms into the tree which is real parts, roots and leaves and fruits and flowers, the parts of the tree.
[SPEAKER_00]: Similarly this world with G1 jugat are parts of Raman according to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now you see direct line to be
[SPEAKER_00]: The simple logic, core idea and Advaita Vedanta is anything that has parts, anything that is subject to modification and notice only things which have parts, avayava, can be modified.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is the modification?
[SPEAKER_00]: A change, a change in some of the parts, some a re-adjustment, some one part is lost or another part comes or re-adjustment repositioning a reconfiguration of the parts that is what we call change, that is how an ocean is formed, that is how in some form how a seed becomes
[SPEAKER_00]: a change with an internal change because there are parts which can interact and change.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, if it is changeful one, if it is with components and parts, it will become impermanent, it will be subject to all the problems with change as.
[SPEAKER_00]: It will have growth, it will diminish, it will be affected by, you know, problems in the world.
[SPEAKER_00]: It will be affected by karma, good karma, bad karma, sinful karma, it will be affected.
[SPEAKER_00]: And ultimately it can decay, maybe it can die.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Brahman will be destructible, Anikkim and that will lead to the further consequence.
[SPEAKER_00]: If a Brahman is really sprouted from seed to a tree, then a seed is sprouted into a tree.
[SPEAKER_00]: Brahman is sprouted into this world, G and Jagat.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you attain to such a Brahman, as you are saying, from that Brahman, this G has come, an ultimate, this G will go back to that Brahman, and the only Brahman will remain.
[SPEAKER_00]: But again, that Brahman will sprout and G will come out from it.
[SPEAKER_00]: How do you know that the Moxia which you will get will be permanent if the Brahman itself is not permanent?
[SPEAKER_00]: If it is again going to change, if it is continuously changing, attainment of that Brahman does not save you from change, does not save you from causality, does not save you from Papapunya, then what kind of Moxia would that be?
[SPEAKER_00]: So on all logical grounds, this formulation falls flat.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now back to your charges that we are against, the Advaita is going against the Vedas.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, no, you are going against the Vedas, because the Vedas see the way, he says to Bhattipropancha, the way you are formulated from them, this can only be Saganabraman.
[SPEAKER_00]: the Guru Nabraman is Brahman with the power of Maya which creates preserves, destroys, etc.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that is the only real Brahman which you can accept.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the Guru Nabraman you cannot accept.
[SPEAKER_00]: In that case, you are going against the Shruti Varkyas, the statements of the Upanishads, which clearly talk about the Guru Nabraman.
[SPEAKER_00]: an e-commerce with e-m, ahm, ramhashmi, nish kalam, it says one of the openings should say is partless, undivided, partless, none of them you can justify on the basis of.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you all the non-dulistic texts cannot be justified from the buttri-propensia perspective.
[SPEAKER_00]: Second, this is second.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then, back to your
[SPEAKER_00]: original charges.
[SPEAKER_00]: What about karma conduct?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's based on dualism and clearly the Vedas teach karma conduct.
[SPEAKER_00]: What about our day-to-day experiences of multiplicity?
[SPEAKER_00]: The answers are straightforward.
[SPEAKER_00]: What has become standard of the Vedic answers?
[SPEAKER_00]: First of all, Shankarajarya says, the Vedas do not teach dualism because they need not.
[SPEAKER_00]: dualism is instinctive.
[SPEAKER_00]: Shankaracharya says in his adhyasavhashya, his introduction to Advaita Vyatavyaranth and Brahma Sutras, Naisar Gikawam, Lokapyavahara.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is instinctive.
[SPEAKER_00]: Inborn, it comes with our ignorance.
[SPEAKER_00]: We are born with ignorance of a real nature and therefore we behave in these ways.
[SPEAKER_00]: So dualism is something that we don't have to be taught by the Vedas or by any spiritual system.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is, that's how we operate, that's how the world appears to us and that's why we take it to be.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we operate accordingly.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the karma can't, I simply are teaching in accordance with how we look at the world, how people in general look at the world, people see the world, see themselves as a poor, numb, limited and they want something in this world.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the karma can't
[SPEAKER_00]: in a religious way so that they rise from immorality to morality.
[SPEAKER_00]: They learn some restraint and discipline which will help them ultimately towards spirituality.
[SPEAKER_00]: Karma Kanda will take you to Yana Kanda.
[SPEAKER_00]: The ritualistic portion of the Vedas will take you to the spiritual portion of the Vedas, the knowledge portion of the Vedas.
[SPEAKER_00]: From the Karma Kanda to the Upanishads or to Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is just in Sanskrit, this is called Anuva, not translation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Anuva, that means as these are our experience of the word, the Vedas is all right.
[SPEAKER_00]: granted that you are just this limited living being granted that you want pleasure.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now let me tell you about the existence of heaven where everything that you could possibly want you will get and you live in this pious way, disciplined and moral way, perform these religious actions and so your desires will be fulfilled.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, this is the nature of the Karmakanda, this is not the primary teaching of the Vedas, the primary teaching of the Vedas when we are ready for it, we come to the Upanishads, which negates all this and says non-duality is the reality.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you realize it, you will truly be free of suffering and attain fulfillment.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, Karmakanda is not the teaching dualism, it is not the teaching of the Vedas, Vedas is not the teaching of the Vedas.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, when we talk about Abheda or non-duality, we are not contradicting the teaching of the Vedas.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then the matter of the our primanas,
[SPEAKER_00]: Shankaracharya says, all parameters are, they have free operation in this transactional relative realm.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is called Babaharika?
[SPEAKER_00]: Indeed, even Vedanta depends on the fact that you have eyes and there is a book of Vedanta Kupanishad, which you will come and read, come to class, all this is dualistic, it is fully accepted in Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: So in the realm of appearance, in the realm, in the movie, in the realm of the transactional
[SPEAKER_00]: all the sense organs, the operate and the knowledge gained by the sense organs, I, ears and not are all fully accepted by Advaita Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why not?
[SPEAKER_00]: Alright, just like we would see stuff in the dreams.
[SPEAKER_00]: We would hear stuff and we do stuff in the dreams.
[SPEAKER_00]: All of those things are experienced.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, when we wake up, we realize none of that was ultimately real.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, this
[SPEAKER_00]: And these arguments have continued down the centuries.
[SPEAKER_00]: Later on, the Vishestadwaita school came up and Ramana Jagay, a very sophisticated attacks on Adwaita Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the post Shankaradwaitans replied to those, and Dwaita Vedanta came up, and Dwaita Vedas, and then they should adopt the Adwaita, then the Achintya Vedava, all of them, you will find in principle the arguments as similar to what Bhattri Pavancheva was offering.
[SPEAKER_00]: just that they became more involved, more sophisticated as the centuries went by.
[SPEAKER_00]: Done.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is what Shankaras Bhashya commentary does.
[SPEAKER_00]: It explains the Purnamada Purnam with him from an Advaiti perspective and then counters other interpretation, but three propane
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, I have also said in the remaining time, I will make some general observations about this.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is a very beautiful mantra of all the shanty mantras.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is my favorite, so I will make some interesting observations for earlier class.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the up to now I was restricted by Shankaracharya's interpretation and the commentary basha.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, I will just speak freely.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnamadha, Purnamidam.
[SPEAKER_00]: Saganabramman is Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: The GY is Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnamadha, Purnamadha.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnamadha, Purnamadha.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnasya, Purnamadha.
[SPEAKER_00]: When the GY realizes, I am Purnamad.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then what will remain?
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnamayva was his Shetty.
[SPEAKER_00]: Nilp, Purnamadha, Purnamadha, Purnamidam.
[SPEAKER_00]: Put it in another language.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnamadha, Purnamidam.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: That means subunabramar, Ishwar, Bhagawan, in technical language that is Brahman with Upadhi.
[SPEAKER_00]: This means the Jeeva, technical language that's also Brahman with Upadhi.
[SPEAKER_00]: The difference is that Brahman is with the Upadhi of Maya.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not explaining once again what the Upadhi is.
[SPEAKER_00]: Remember the crystal and the colored cloth and all that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the Upadhi of Maya.
[SPEAKER_00]: And with the Upadhi of Maya, Brahman or Purnam will appear as Saganabhramman, Ishwarabhagavan, the god of religion, and with the Upadhi of this body mind, or more specifically, individual ignorance, Agyara, Karana Sharira.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then that's the same Purnam or Brahman will appear as us, each one of us.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnat, Purnam of the Chetty, from that to that, that Saganabhramman, this Jeeva Jagatas
[SPEAKER_00]: is the caronum, is the material cause of this universe, and this jiva jagat is the carium is the effect.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is the relationship?
[SPEAKER_00]: The carium emerges from the caronum and remains in the caronum and emerges back into the caronum, material cause.
[SPEAKER_00]: the effect emerges from the material cause remains in the mid is sustained by the material cause emerges back into the material cause this is the idea of creation and destruction in in Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, a pot the material cause is the clay.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, the pot is made from the material cause clay.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, the basically the pot emerges from the clay emerges means, with the pot will make it from the clay and where does the new thing this pot?
[SPEAKER_00]: Where does it exist?
[SPEAKER_00]: instead of saying that clay is there in the pot rather the pot is basically in the clay.
[SPEAKER_00]: The pot is a name and a form and an activity imposed on the clay and if the pot is broken, what remains clay?
[SPEAKER_00]: So the emergence of the effect from the cause, the pot from the clay is what is called creation in Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: The part remaining with the help of the clay, the basis is clay, without clay, the part wouldn't remain, that is called existence, srishti sthiti, tithi, mintenance, existence in Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the destruction of the part where only the clay remains, where the effect goes back to the cause, that is called destruction, srishti sthiti lay out, disallusion of destruction.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, this is the Vedantic idea of creation, existence and destruction.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is creation?
[SPEAKER_00]: Effect emerging from the cause, the effect emerging from material cause, part emerging from clay.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is existence?
[SPEAKER_00]: Thiti?
[SPEAKER_00]: What is going on right now?
[SPEAKER_00]: This is existence of the universe, that is the effect existing in the material cause.
[SPEAKER_00]: The clay, the part existing in the clay, the cloth existing in the threads.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then what is destruction according to Vedanta?
[SPEAKER_00]: Destruction is the effect going back to the cause, merging back in the cause, the wave merging back into the water, and the part being broken, giving up its part name, form and use and just remaining as broken part or clay.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, effect going back to cause is called destruction.
[SPEAKER_00]: Remember, in that case, the cause remains throughout.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was there before the effect came, it is there when the effect is there,
[SPEAKER_00]: Before our existence, it was god alone.
[SPEAKER_00]: During our existence, it is god alone.
[SPEAKER_00]: When we die, we go back to god alone.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the idea of creation, existence and destruction in Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: Urna Aapurna Madhachati.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then,
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnasya Purnamagaya, this Jiva, which is Purnam with the Opaadhi of Body Mind, when it realizes its Purnam nature, its Purnam nature.
[SPEAKER_00]: What remains?
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnam eva vashishya, the Brahman alone remains, Purnam alone remains, that is interesting.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you take
[SPEAKER_00]: Jeeva with the body mind, with the, with the, with the Upadhi of, you know, causal body, subtle body, physical body, stool, a suksma, karana, shari, you know, the three Upadhis, and consciousness alone.
[SPEAKER_00]: If it realises that I am consciousness alone, if it realises, I am poor numb, if it realises that I am Brahman, then what remains?
[SPEAKER_00]: It remains as Brahman, and he would expect,
[SPEAKER_00]: That it remains as Brahman, then the Upadhi is also will remain separately.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am not the Upadhi.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am not the body, not the mind, not the causal body, not the subtle body, not the physical body.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am Chidaan and the Rupa Shiva.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is Purnasya Purnamada.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then what will remain?
[SPEAKER_00]: You would expect that, yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Satsya Dhan and the will remain.
[SPEAKER_00]: Upman, Brahman will remain.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnam will remain.
[SPEAKER_00]: And separately, now you have separated the Upadhi's body, mind, all of these will remain separately.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, it says they don't remain anymore.
[SPEAKER_00]: only the infinite remains, which means those Upadis are not real, important point, the Upadis are not real, they are not second realities apart from the prudam.
[SPEAKER_00]: They cannot be prudam has to be one only, so the Upadis are not real is important point, this is the meaning of Jagatmithya, Jagatmithya, the word is false, it means these Upadis are false, these Upadis
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, let me give a little strange example.
[SPEAKER_00]: In our dreams, we fall asleep and we forget that we are sleeping on this bed.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we have the dream up a world of our dreams.
[SPEAKER_00]: And in that world of our dreams, we have a body.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have a personality in that, we are there in our own dreams.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that body in the world of dreams.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that mind, in that world of dreams, that's my dream of body.
[SPEAKER_00]: because that's what the one I'm identified with when I'm navigating the virtual world of dreams.
[SPEAKER_00]: In the virtual world of dreams, I don't feel I am all this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't have a god's eye point of view.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am one character only in that dream world.
[SPEAKER_00]: That character's body mind is my body mind.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's my body.
[SPEAKER_00]: What happens when I wake up?
[SPEAKER_00]: I realize I am not that at all.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I was dreaming and here we dismiss the whole thing and we say I am this one.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, interestingly, if I realize that I am not that body, I am not that mind.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am this person who is dreaming on the bed.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then shouldn't it be that I wake up and that body and mind now remain separately like a suit of clothes which I have taken up?
[SPEAKER_00]: No, not at all.
[SPEAKER_00]: They will disappear.
[SPEAKER_00]: I, the mind dreamer, I had become, I had appeared at that body mind.
[SPEAKER_00]: The moment I realized what I am, those body mind also disappears, the dreamer alone remains at the, or the waker alone remains.
[SPEAKER_00]: Similarly, that's all the remains of the dream world.
[SPEAKER_00]: Similarly, when we realize we are Brahman, Atman, Limitless Consciousness, Pudnam, then the Pudnam alone remains, Atman, Brahman alone remains, you remain as the Pudnam,
[SPEAKER_00]: Dupati is a realized to be false appearances, nothing but you.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this whole Purnam of the Purnam with them is also another way it can be stated as it was later on Brahmasa Thim, here it means Purnam Suttam, Jagat Mithya, in Upadis Armithya.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then what am I, Purnasya Purnam Aadaya, you are none other than the Purnam, none other than Brahmam.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, this is moksha.
[SPEAKER_00]: We do not know this, this is avidya or ignorance, Vedanta, this Purnama, the Purnama with them teaches us this, when we realize it, this knowledge makes us realize it, points it out, we realize this is moksha, theta.
[SPEAKER_00]: How is it freedom?
[SPEAKER_00]: What does it actually do?
[SPEAKER_00]: What happens when we are a Purnam?
[SPEAKER_00]: We are not Purnam, what happens?
[SPEAKER_00]: Look at our lights right, the way we look at our lights.
[SPEAKER_00]: We don't know we are poor now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Even when we chant it, the thousand times, we still don't feel that we are poor now.
[SPEAKER_00]: We feel we are very dependent.
[SPEAKER_00]: As bodies, we are very dependent.
[SPEAKER_00]: As persons, we are dependent.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm dependent on the air, I breathe.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm dependent on the food that I eat.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have to eat multiple times in a day otherwise we can help list.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am dependent on shelter, otherwise I will freeze to death outside.
[SPEAKER_00]: In New York, I am dependent on a nice society around me, which only in which I can exist, survive and flourish.
[SPEAKER_00]: Without this society around me, people were providing all these institutions of society.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, the police, the hospitals, the libraries and colleges and schools and shopping malls, all of these things.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm entirely dependent on the material world, on our society, on this body.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is called Sapaksha, dependent.
[SPEAKER_00]: And with this dependence comes next, I notice another thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: All of everything here is impermanent, and everything here keeps on changing and disappearing.
[SPEAKER_00]: All our effects, they're arising and going back to the cause again.
[SPEAKER_00]: So these are changing.
[SPEAKER_00]: And third, I notice, I have desire.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel unfulfilled because I feel unlimited.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I feel unfulfilled.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel hungry, thirsty, I want this and that thing, I want objects, I want sustenance, I want people, I want, I want limits, my desires are endless, economics, first lesson.
[SPEAKER_00]: that human desires are unlimited.
[SPEAKER_00]: The resources to satisfy those desires are limited.
[SPEAKER_00]: How to use limited resources to satisfy unlimited desires is called economics.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I have unlimited desires, calm, upward numb leads to calm, calm means desire.
[SPEAKER_00]: The moment I'm limited will always be in fear because I'm dependent on so many things and everything is changing, my body is aging and problems are getting worse and worse.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, it becomes worse and worse.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have fear.
[SPEAKER_00]: Upanishads says, yes, you're the Ramakuru Tatesya Bhayam Bhavati, whoever sees even the slightest difference here that one has fear.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're infected with fear.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then finally all of this culminates in Dukha suffering.
[SPEAKER_00]: It can be mild disappointment, it can be mild existential angst, even if things are going very nicely for me, or it can be extremely cruel deprivation and terrible suffering, deep deep anguish and sorrow.
[SPEAKER_00]: But generally there is it is infected with suffering, pervaded by unhappiness, sorrow, dissatisfaction, suffering.
[SPEAKER_00]: Desire, endless desires come, because of our lack of fulfillment, then I have got fear, and suffering.
[SPEAKER_00]: Whereas, what is Purnam?
[SPEAKER_00]: If I realize myself as Purnam, the result will be, I am near a picture.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am not dependent on anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnam exists by itself.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then I will be, Nithyam, eternal, beyond time basically.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then I will have up the cover, all desires will be fulfilled, there is nothing left to desire.
[SPEAKER_00]: I will be always fulfilled by my own nature, not depending on anything outside my nature.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then, I will have, I will be nearby, fearless, there will be nothing to be afraid of.
[SPEAKER_00]: One sadhu put it so beautifully, kahi koi ritu na hi maat maaji kahi koi jadata na hi kahi koi dukh kane hi maat maaji.
[SPEAKER_00]: But, I will see from the pool dump perspective, there is no death, there is no possibility of death.
[SPEAKER_00]: But, this one shining mass of existence consciousness, what death can there be?
[SPEAKER_00]: The death of the bodies like Vivekantha say like the falling of a hair from our body as in consequential as that to the prudna.
[SPEAKER_00]: And there is no non-consciousness anywhere because it's all a mass of consciousness.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what you are.
[SPEAKER_00]: And there can be no suffering or no limitation, there are no deprivation there because you are the infinite.
[SPEAKER_00]: There is nothing that is excluded from you.
[SPEAKER_00]: You are not just rhetoric, you, the enlightened one actually feels this.
[SPEAKER_00]: So nearby a fearless, that what becomes fearless and Dukka, no Dukka will be there, Sukha only, Anand only will be there.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is the difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: is feeling and living as if opponent and then feeling and realizing that I am poor and living like that, huge difference, huge difference.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the practical result of Vedanta of realizing our poor and nature.
[SPEAKER_00]: A few observations on the etymology of the word Purnam, I have been translating it as infinite as limitless, as complete or whole and so on.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, there are these multiple words, each of these words in Vedanta, they express the entire teaching of the Vedanta.
[SPEAKER_00]: One word is Purnam, which means whole or complete.
[SPEAKER_00]: Shankaracharya in the commentary he says, now we have written Tumkotashchit, which is not different from anything else.
[SPEAKER_00]: There is nothing in the universe different from this Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: The definition of Purnam is where there is no existence apart from it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Apart from Brahman and Atman, apart from you, there's the definition of Purnam, that which or the root poor, it means that which swells to envelop everything, that which becomes the whole.
[SPEAKER_00]: Very interestingly, the word Brahman comes from the root, we are doing little bit of etymology here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Brahman comes from the root, Breher, the Breher, the Hathu, the root.
[SPEAKER_00]: It means exactly the same thing to swell without limit, to expand without limit.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have to bring Hanatwath, Atma, Ramayati, Giyati, Bhajya's Patimashra says because it is vast because it expands without limit.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Atma is said to be Brahman.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Brahman, another word means exactly the same, etymologically, grammatically, it means the same as Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, interesting, the word Anantam, limitless.
[SPEAKER_00]: It means the same thing as Purnam or Brahman, that which
[SPEAKER_00]: then the word Vishnu, which is the word for God, you second abrahman, Vishnu means that which is not limited in time space and object, that which is Vappi, which pervades all time space and object.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again the same meaning as Purnam or Brahm, Purnam is equal to Brahmman is equal to Anantam is equal to Vishnu and most surprising all of all, Shundhya.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was surprised to discover, I was in the my latest trip to India last, I think a couple of months back, in one of our colleges in India run by our order, we have a huge institution called in Narendrapur, complex of educational institutions, there's a beautiful college there, I was taken on a tour of what they call the zero gallery.
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's a gallery set up by the mathematics department or educational purposes for the kids and the whole gallery is about zero.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know the ancient Hindus invented the zero.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, the history of the zero and the history of the zero in the Mayan civilization, the history of the zero in the Aztecs and the ancient Egyptians and Babylon in civilization and the present form or understanding of the zero which comes from the ancient Indians.
[SPEAKER_00]: ancient Hindus.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's all depicted in nice slides and you know art and informative panels.
[SPEAKER_00]: One of the panels introduces the Sanskrit word for zero, shunnyam, which is of course huge philosophical connotations for Buddhism and also for Vedanta, shunnyam.
[SPEAKER_00]: But what was interesting was one of the panels depicted the
[SPEAKER_00]: etymology of chondium.
[SPEAKER_00]: It comes from the root sweet, which means to swell without limit.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is original etymological thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: So chondium means nothing, zero.
[SPEAKER_00]: With the original etymological thing is that its sweet is to swell.
[SPEAKER_00]: Notice the similarity between the English swell and the Sanskrit sweet.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's literally the same sound, you know, and it's not any accident.
[SPEAKER_00]: The comparative philosophy, which started in the 18th century, when the British started turning Sanskrit, they found this amazing similarity between Sanskrit and ancient European languages, especially Greek, and then,
[SPEAKER_00]: They realized that they must have been a proto-language beyond the modern Sanskrit and Greek, which was the source of all of these Indo-Aryan languages.
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, so there is a reason why Sri in Sanskrit sounds a lot like Swell in English, but they mean the same thing at the biologically.
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, in the Shunya derivation, it technically means zero.
[SPEAKER_00]: So even Shunya in that sense, and if you bring in Tibetan Buddhism,
[SPEAKER_00]: then the shunni of madhyamaka Buddhism, as that which is different from existing entities, that which is different from non-existing entities, different from both existing and non-existent and the negation of both, chatushkoti, bineer mukthatatva, which begins to sound eerily like Brahman then.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we have all these terms.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Braha from which Brahman
[SPEAKER_00]: they pull from which Purnam has come, Anantam, limitlessness, Vishnu, Shonyam, all of them contain in them in a seed form, the entire teaching of Vedanta, the entire teaching of Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: In fact, one way of saying with all of Vedanta in one word would be Purnaktha, completeness or wholeness or limitlessness.
[SPEAKER_00]: What does it mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: What do all these things mean technically?
[SPEAKER_00]: It means limitless means.
[SPEAKER_00]: There are three kinds of limit possible in this world.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is this world?
[SPEAKER_00]: Remember when you say this world already put a number of the phenomena was defined it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Edom, this one, the one which we are living in which we are experiencing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Here, everything is limited in time, space, and object.
[SPEAKER_00]: Everything is beginning and end.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the time limitation.
[SPEAKER_00]: We are born and we die.
[SPEAKER_00]: Everything is produced and destroyed.
[SPEAKER_00]: So everything is changing here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Whatever we experience, moment to moment changing.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is called time limitation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then space limitation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Everything is located in space.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am here, you are there, somebody is a New York, somebody is on the best coast, somebody is an India, we are located in space, if you are here you are not there, if you are there you are not here.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we have this space limitation, we are not everywhere, we cannot be, no object is everywhere.
[SPEAKER_00]: even even space is everywhere not necessarily physical space is only physical space what about your dream space is physical space in the dream space or the dream space in physical space no what about a mathematical space is that in physical space or is physical space in mathematical what about a fictional space so you can have multiple spaces which are actually different from each other nothing is limitless here everything is limited in time limited in space
[SPEAKER_00]: and object limitation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Every entity is only itself.
[SPEAKER_00]: The box is only a box.
[SPEAKER_00]: The table is only a table.
[SPEAKER_00]: The man is only this man.
[SPEAKER_00]: The dog or the cat is only the dog or the cat.
[SPEAKER_00]: Each entity is itself and different from everything else.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am different from the chair in which I am
[SPEAKER_00]: and the chair is different from the floor on which it is standing.
[SPEAKER_00]: There are different from each other.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is called object limitation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Each object is only itself and separate from every other object.
[SPEAKER_00]: The limitation is a smallness, it's a poverty, it's a deprivation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, Anantam means Purnam means that which has no limitation in space and therefore it must be there in all space, that which has no limitation in time, that means it was always there, no creation and destruction for it, always there, it is there and it will always be there.
[SPEAKER_00]: No limitation in object, there is no object in the universe which is separate from
[SPEAKER_00]: Since there is no second reality apart from Purnam, Purnam will always be adwaitam, non-dual.
[SPEAKER_00]: No second adwaitam.
[SPEAKER_00]: Since there is Purnam is there is no time when Purnam was not, so Purnam will always be nithyam eternal.
[SPEAKER_00]: Since there is no space where Purnam is not, Purnam will always be serve up the api or Shankaracharya says, Vapi that means pervasive will be no space where Purnam is not.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Purnam means all pervading, eternal.
[SPEAKER_00]: non-dual, sir what the api?
[SPEAKER_00]: Nithya adwaita.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the meaning of prudna.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the meaning of Brahman.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the meaning of Atman.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the meaning of Pishnu.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the meaning of Anantam.
[SPEAKER_00]: Shurnya may even in on an adwaita interpretation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, moving on.
[SPEAKER_00]: Next, I will make
[SPEAKER_00]: We are understanding the meaning of the word and seeing how profound that word is, wonderful.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's just a word, it's just a etymology, does such a thing exist?
[SPEAKER_00]: Does Purnam exist?
[SPEAKER_00]: This rock, it's not only a concept, it's a real rock.
[SPEAKER_00]: By the way, this was a gift from one of our ashrams, this rock.
[SPEAKER_00]: I saw it in my room in that ashram and I asked them, can I take it back to my room in New York.
[SPEAKER_00]: See what this rock says.
[SPEAKER_00]: It says the most important thing ever.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you can see, it says here, the main thing is to keep the main thing, the main thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: The main thing, this is the essence of Raju Yoga, of concentration, of meditation, of focus.
[SPEAKER_00]: The main thing is to keep the main thing, the main thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the sheer fire method to success in anything that you want.
[SPEAKER_00]: First, we got out what is, that's the most important thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is it that we want?
[SPEAKER_00]: Make it the main thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then just keep the main thing as the main thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: The main thing is to keep the main thing as the main thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this rock, it actually exists, it's not just the thought or a concept, not a word, not for etymology only.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is actually very much so, you know, like that prunam does it exist or is it just a word?
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnam idam purna madaha, now what it does is, the mantra does is, all right, the word prunam, now what does it say?
[SPEAKER_00]: That is prunam, this is prunam, but this we know for sure it exists.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is this, this world and us, this world and us, this is the meaning of Adam, this.
[SPEAKER_00]: This world, it exists because it is revealed by our senses.
[SPEAKER_00]: I see it.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is the most sheer fire guarantee of existence in our common sense and in science also.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is available to sources of the instruments of knowledge, epistemic instruments, establish the existence of this world.
[SPEAKER_00]: I see it, I hear it, I smell it, I taste it, I touch it.
[SPEAKER_00]: all our senses revealed existence of this world, it does exist.
[SPEAKER_00]: So,
[SPEAKER_00]: But then the mantra says, this is Purnam, you are asking does Purnam exist, this is Purnam, we will see later how, but don't think that Purnam is a concept, this world is not a concept, is this a concept, it's a rock, very hard and solid, it's real, and Upanishad is saying, this is Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it exists, Purnam exists, revealed by every sense, Purnatua is not revealed, but
[SPEAKER_00]: Upanishads says that which you are seeing as indobitably existing, revealed by all your sense organs.
[SPEAKER_00]: Our language operates on this, linguistically, we operate on this reality.
[SPEAKER_00]: Our sense says our language, our thoughts and emotions are continuously concerned with this world and this body.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it exists.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the existence of the Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: We will see how this one is Purnam, but first of all existence, to prove the existence of Purnam,
[SPEAKER_00]: And more than this existence, we are even more sure about what, about our own existence.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have mentioned this many times, that which Descartes could not deny, cause he told us so.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am, I exist.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, very interestingly, someone might object, that Eidam, Eidam is meant for only this.
[SPEAKER_00]: It does not mean a hum, I.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the eye, let me make some interesting point, the eye, which I am talking about now is actually covered under the item, this eye which we are experiencing right now, apparent on the surface, it is under the item, just by the way, if you are interested, many of these points which I am sharing is just the part of material, I have borrowed from one
[SPEAKER_00]: who has offered a retreat on Purnama, the Purnamidam, if you see on YouTube, he has given eight lectures on this mantra.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have just taken a few insights which I am sharing in this session, but many more insights are there.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, one point he makes, here is that existence, yes this existence and the point he makes is we often think
[SPEAKER_00]: the way Vedantic analysis we do.
[SPEAKER_00]: This means object and I am the subject.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am separate from this.
[SPEAKER_00]: But practically speaking, when we start off right now at the level at which we are starting of the I is also part of this.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is why this I it feels it does not exist in deep sleep.
[SPEAKER_00]: The I which disappears in this deep sleep is this, it is not the real I.
[SPEAKER_00]: Shankaracharya and the adhya sabhashya, he makes this subtle view play of words there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ahamidam, mamayidam, I am this and this is mine.
[SPEAKER_00]: Notice he says, I am this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why do I say I am this?
[SPEAKER_00]: Real I can never be designated as this, but the bodily I, the bodily subjectivity, this personality I, it can certainly be designated as this.
[SPEAKER_00]: This I, I, this fellow, who is there now?
[SPEAKER_00]: who is in some other ghostly form in dreams, and who disappears into deep sleep also.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is certainly a this.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, Adam Purnam, what is that Purnam, you are talking about all that Brahman, Vishnu, Anantam, Shunnam, Purnam, what is that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Adam and his Adam has two parts, objects and the the relative subject, the empirical subject, this fellow, this fellow and this fellow's
[SPEAKER_00]: the that one God that is also in the way in a sense we know it exists by faith, by scripture, by there are proofs of the existence of God.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you will in Christian theology 5 proofs, the 5 proofs of Aquinas, if you search 5 proofs of Aquinas, the design proof of the first mover proof, the original cause proof, gradation proof, the 5 proofs of the existence of God.
[SPEAKER_00]: Nayaika, Udayanaacharya, centuries before Akhenas gives nine proofs of the existence of God in his debate against the Buddhists, he wrote a book.
[SPEAKER_00]: One is Atmatatua Viveka, and other one the more famous one, he gives Udayanaacharya.
[SPEAKER_00]: He gives his proofs of the existence of God.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Rick has given some information here, Udayanaacharya.
[SPEAKER_00]: Nayaakusamanjali, yes, Nayaakus, very famous book, Nayaakusamanjali.
[SPEAKER_00]: The point is, by logic and by scripture and by faith, even that God be understand as existing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, what this mantra is doing, that purnam, that absolute, that Brahman, it connects the existence of Brahman to the existence of this God and this world and the subject.
[SPEAKER_00]: Whatever we consider as existing, Ishwara ji vachagat, purnam,
[SPEAKER_00]: one more subtle point and all this I am borrowing from our penetrated near Maharaj.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says very subtle point.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says here, when I say that is Purnam and this is Purnam, a certain subconsciously we feel there are two Purnams.
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, there are not two Purnams, but when I say this and that, it feels like there is a Purnam here and there is a Purnam there.
[SPEAKER_00]: This duality is created by the words, this and that, but there is no duality in Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this and that does not mean there are two.
[SPEAKER_00]: The same Purnam appears as this because of the Upadeya body mind and the world.
[SPEAKER_00]: The same Purnam appears to us as that because of the Upadeya Maya as that God in heaven, distant.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the Purnam is one.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, what he has done here is that that and this are not two different things.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is that one pulnamalone and this I have said earlier, this is the Mahabhakya.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I am saying I stress once again here, pulnamada, pulnamidam, the first quarter of this mantra is the Mahabhakya, taktuamasi, aham Ramhasmi, it is saying this.
[SPEAKER_00]: If that God is pulnam and I am pulnam and it is the same pulnam, then I am that
[SPEAKER_00]: I am Brahman then, that too I am a sea, you are that, that is what it is saying.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, this is a very profound consequence of Purnamada, Purnam with them.
[SPEAKER_00]: One final point I will make, there is no more time, also a tremendous consequence, philosophy called consequence is the next part, Purnamada, Purnamada, Cherey, what is the primary
[SPEAKER_00]: from Brahman, from God, universe has come.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is the old old saying of all these declarations.
[SPEAKER_00]: The common understanding in shaiwism, bhajnabism, shaktaism, Christianity, Islam, Judaism is that there is a cause of this universe which is God, Allah, Jauh, Vishnu, Narayan, or Devi, and there is an effect, this world, all beings here, cause and effect.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, this is the first thing, and this is very important, all of religion is packed into a thirsty religion.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the mantra, so profound, it subverts it almost immediately by saying that cause is boredom, the effect is boredom.
[SPEAKER_00]: If the cause is boredom, and the same boredom, if the cause is boredom and the effect is boredom, then what happened in causality?
[SPEAKER_00]: You cannot say the seed is poordum and the tree is poordum, no, the seed actually became the tree.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a change.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not the same thing, but if you say it is the same thing, it means nothing has happened.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is after presenting causality as a way pointing back to the poordum, it says by saying the cause is poordum and the effect is poordum, it denies causality.
[SPEAKER_00]: is ultimately there is no causality, where I can't put it very simply, one alone exists, it appears as nature's soul.
[SPEAKER_00]: It translated directly into Purnama, the Purnama with them, one alone exists, what alone exists, Purnama?
[SPEAKER_00]: It appears as nature and soul, not that it becomes nature and soul.
[SPEAKER_00]: Nature, Purnama, Daha, that one.
[SPEAKER_00]: God, property, nature, whatever you call it.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you are a son, can you call it nature?
[SPEAKER_00]: If you are a scientist, you will call it nature.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you are a believing person, believing in religion, you will call it God.
[SPEAKER_00]: Poorn, that is what Upanishads is, Poornamada.
[SPEAKER_00]: And this one, I, soul, individual being, the subject, the sentient being, the Jiva.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the Upanishad says, Purnam, Idam, this is Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: The cause is Purnam, the effect is Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: The same Purnam appears as cause, appears as effect, appears as nature, appears as the product of nature.
[SPEAKER_00]: Therefore, causality is in the world of nature, in the relative world, in the universe, but ultimate reality, causality is not ultimately real.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because causality is not ultimately real,
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnum is free of causality.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnum is free of karma.
[SPEAKER_00]: No karma touches Purnum and you are Purnum.
[SPEAKER_00]: You are free of karma.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is Moxia.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the philosophical understanding of Moxia.
[SPEAKER_00]: By realizing your Purnum nature, you will realize that I am free of karma.
[SPEAKER_00]: All past karma.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was never born.
[SPEAKER_00]: I will never die.
[SPEAKER_00]: And therefore, what about my past karma will it be burnt?
[SPEAKER_00]: No past karma actually.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is the meaning of past karma being burnt up by knowledge.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is the meaning of being freed from the cycle of birth and death.
[SPEAKER_00]: You will realize there is no cycle of birth and death for you, per purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is all at the relatively level, a relatively level, very true, harsh truth.
[SPEAKER_00]: But when you realize you are that purnam,
[SPEAKER_00]: What will happen?
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnasya Purnamada.
[SPEAKER_00]: And how will you realize?
[SPEAKER_00]: Dhrigdhrishya Vivaika Pancho Korsha Vivaika Vastatra Vivaika Vastatra Vivaika Vivaika Vastatra Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika Vivaika
[SPEAKER_00]: All of this right here in this life, it becomes boredom or you realize it has boredom.
[SPEAKER_00]: One unbroken, unmistakable mass of radiance, mass of existence of awareness.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you will continue to exist in this particular form, the Jeeva which is Upādhīs will continue to appear, but you know it is just one radiance.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then it will be fine that yes, I am the body also.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnam is the body, Purnam is the crown, Purnam is the mind and intellect and everything and the world and all the creatures, it's all Purnam, but it's all as Vivekananda said, all is not Purnam alone is and you are that Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, this is the one more very nice insight.
[SPEAKER_00]: that this denies causality, it explains, it shows what causality is, it shows us what is God, it shows us what is the universe, it shows us the nature of our bondage, how we are whirling around causality for us is love karma, each of us, that's where we attract and it shows us the way out of it also, the how the purnam is free of all of that already and you just have to realize that you are this purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is why all Sadhana is there.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Mukhya Sadhana, main Sadhana is this insight.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's where Vedanta comes in.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's where Upanishad comes in.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's where Purnam and the Purnam with them comes in.
[SPEAKER_00]: Associated Sadhana, meditation, focus, very important.
[SPEAKER_00]: Main thing is to keep the main thing, the main thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Very important Sadhana, most important.
[SPEAKER_00]: But, associated.
[SPEAKER_00]: knowledge is primary and if you to get that knowledge, focus is the most important thing, devotion, love, another extremely important thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Karma, service is, you see, so I have come this more and more, we begin to see what a tremendously powerful loss of it that is.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Vedantic, the philosophy of service, Shiva, Shiva, Ganesh, Shiva, Shiva, that,
[SPEAKER_00]: what is the practical effect of this boredom?
[SPEAKER_00]: You see the vastness here and you are this vastness, everyone and everything is one with you.
[SPEAKER_00]: How will you respond?
[SPEAKER_00]: You will respond with love and service.
[SPEAKER_00]: So why not make it already, make it your philosophy of life?
[SPEAKER_00]: Leave like that already.
[SPEAKER_00]: Good.
[SPEAKER_00]: O, shanti shanti, shanti hari hiyom tatsat Sri Ramakrishna Rupanamastu Sri Ramen Rikha
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, I mean, we come to offer these thoughts regarding debate between dualists and non-duals.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, certainly there is a comprehensive view that actually offers guidance to non-academic experience.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, you find it in Sri Ramakrishna's approach.
[SPEAKER_00]: What we just said, Purnama, the Purnamidam.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you combine it with the consequences of Sri Ramakrishna's approach, like service, Shiva, Ganesh, Shiva, Shiva, like harmony of religions.
[SPEAKER_00]: So these are the consequences.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then you will have a very comprehensive approach.
[SPEAKER_00]: And all of those can be based on this poor Nama, the poor Nama Adam.
[SPEAKER_00]: Comprehensive Sanskrit would be poor Nama, the poor Nama approach.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is comprehensive, you see, the result of this philosophy when you see in general Hinduism if you see, look at the conception of the divine Hinduism, how Purnam it is, does God exist?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes and no, we can become enlightened with God and without God, does and you can understand it through Purnam and the Purnam with them, is God with form, yes and no, God is without form also.
[SPEAKER_00]: God is female also, God does God have to have human form.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and no, God can have animal form also, God can have the form of the elements, fire, space, water, all of those.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you say God, you have to believe in God, then your idea of spirituality is not put no.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you say yes you have to believe in God, but only in God without form, God cannot have form, then your idea spirituality is not put no.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you say God can only have form, cannot be formless, then your idea of spirituality is not prudna.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you say God can only be mailed, not female, then you are not prudna.
[SPEAKER_00]: God can only be female and not male, not prudna.
[SPEAKER_00]: God can only be worshipped in human form, not animal or other non-human forms, then you are not prudna.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, this poor nomad has it, now you begin to compare it with actually what Hinduism has become over the centuries.
[SPEAKER_00]: You see, it is like a development of the poor nomad in religion, this vastness, on Irban,
[SPEAKER_00]: Nanda Rūdhvanaśodhpakti.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is the negative side of the Purnamadhapurnamidham.
[SPEAKER_00]: Purnamadhapurnamidham is a positive way of saying this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Shuvadha says, since the enlightened people say that they see one this and everything, they are the same as Brahman, agreeing to non-dewal teachings.
[SPEAKER_00]: Can we safely say, none of the dualists who existed were enlightened?
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, not at all.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then again, you will not be pulled down.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not that you have to come to this view to be enlightened.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you touch the divine in any form, in any way, you don't have to come through it to Purnama the Purnama with them.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can come through it through the worship of Gopala.
[SPEAKER_00]: When the Gopala's mother, Gopala in the story of Sri Ram Krishna, when she sees the baby Gopala in all beings, how is it different from this Purnama the Purnama with them?
[SPEAKER_00]: So the dualists,
[SPEAKER_00]: who have the spiritual experience, whether they are Vaishnava, Sharkta's Christians, Muslims, without any particular religion, once they come in touch with that reality, and they are enlightened.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you don't have to say that they have to be enlightened in the way which perfectly matches my sophisticated non-divalistic philosophy.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, Vivekanda would say here, it would be practical.
[SPEAKER_00]: Rama, you said that when we realize of a true nature, that alone remains and the Upādhi is disappear.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, disappear means, you realize those Upādhi's are also that put them.
[SPEAKER_00]: The body and mind will still appear to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Upādhi will appear to you, but they will not limit you anymore.
[SPEAKER_00]: You will not feel, I am limited to this and everything else is outside me and separate from, never.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then Priyanka says, how does this Rishty Dishty Vada of Advaita for good dualism?
[SPEAKER_00]: It has to consider some ground there, certainly.
[SPEAKER_00]: Rishty Rishty and possibly, only Ajatha Vada was subscribed to pure Advaita.
[SPEAKER_00]: So these are approaches.
[SPEAKER_00]: Think of them as runways.
[SPEAKER_00]: Rishty Dishty Vada is a longer runway.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Rishty Rishty Vada is a shorter runway.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Ajatha Vada is like a helicopter to take, you have to go straight up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sistitisti Vada has gives the maximum concession to dualism, and Sistitisti Vada gives very little concession to dualism and Ajyata Vada gives no conception at all, straight away into Purnam.
[SPEAKER_00]: Abhisit says, in the first part of the Mantra Purnam, other writers, other that denotes Saganabhramar and not Nidhgunabhramar.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, think about it, if that is Nidhgunabhramar, then what is this?
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you talk about Nirguna Brahman, that is also Nirguna Brahman, this is also Nirguna Brahman, or neither that nor this is Nirguna Brahman.
[SPEAKER_00]: Nirguna Brahman alone is moment to bring in that.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is that actually?
[SPEAKER_00]: That means with the Upādhīs, which are paroksha, distant.
[SPEAKER_00]: God is in heaven.
[SPEAKER_00]: God is a matter of faith.
[SPEAKER_00]: God is not something perceptible to the senses.
[SPEAKER_00]: Clearly, some Upādhīs are play here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Distinctions are being made here.
[SPEAKER_00]: is this denoted in Shankar's commentary on the mantra.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, you can find it there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Logically also you will see.
[SPEAKER_00]: The moment you say Purnam, other, Purnam, Idam, a distinguishing other from Idam.
[SPEAKER_00]: There is some opathy.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is the opathy for that?
[SPEAKER_00]: And what is the opathy for this?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why would you say that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why do I feel I am this?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because of location in this body mind.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is my upper body.
[SPEAKER_00]: If I remove this body mind location notice how my sense of what I am and where I am change is when the body mind is changed like dreams.
[SPEAKER_00]: Suddenly you will feel I am in a different place in a different body and entirely different.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, the upper is have changed.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now the upaadhi, kasmikopadhi is maya.
[SPEAKER_00]: Consciousness associated with the kasmikopadhi becomes the kasmik creator, preserver, destroyer, the cause of everything.
[SPEAKER_00]: The language implies it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And further you will say, why that other means second abramman?
[SPEAKER_00]: You will see the next part of the mantra.
[SPEAKER_00]: See what it says, purna purna mada chate.
[SPEAKER_00]: So from that purna, this purna has come.
[SPEAKER_00]: If something has come from something, then that's something is the cause and this something is an effect.
[SPEAKER_00]: The moment you say cause and effect, it means God and the world.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, other will mean Saguna Brahman.
[SPEAKER_00]: If it meant did Guna Brahman, there would be no question of anything coming from anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: The culture has pointed out, the books, thanks for this quick research, Nyai Kusumanjali, wonderful, wonderful book.
[SPEAKER_00]: which is an attack, which is dualistic, fully dualistic book, an attack on the Buddhist denial of God.
[SPEAKER_00]: Buddhist says there is no ishwara, and Rudhana Acharya defends the Hindu conception of God.
[SPEAKER_00]: a professor in Harvard University, Parimal, Partialis, written a book against a Hindu god.
[SPEAKER_00]: The name of the book is against a Hindu god.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, he summarizes the attacks of the Buddhists on the concept of god and the efforts of the Nayayaka's, the Nayayaka's, the Nayayaka's, the Nayayaka's, the Nayayaka's, the Nayayaka philosophers to defend the conception of god, which is a very dense book,
[SPEAKER_00]: is Udayana Acharya's, another book not as famous as Nyaku Sumanjali but it defends the idea of the self, permanent self, not the other way to itself, the dualistic self, body, mind, self, separate self, Atma, defends that conception.
[SPEAKER_00]: Punitas is a judge, a cunning, as he is mad, said, whatever is here is here, it's a true Purnam, this is Purnam, correct?
[SPEAKER_00]: Shonali has said, God invinsertless, center everyone circumference, no, right, right, right, correct, correct, well put, and it didn't think of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Take care, and the next time we will actually start the,